>A French high court this week delivered a blow to Valve, ruling that European consumers are legally free to resell digital games
I hope you didnt actually like buying and owning games user desu. I hope you like streaming your subscription games senpai. Why does europe want to ruin everything?
Other urls found in this thread:
giantbomb.com
youtube.com
youtube.com
en.yna.co.kr
theverge.com
pcworld.com
knowyourmeme.com
twitter.com
Digital goods should always have been resealable.
how have you been selling your used digital games until now?
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO YOU SHOULDNT BE ABLE TO SELL THINGS YOU OWN I THINK OF THE CORPORATIONS AND THEIR PROFIT
>I hope you didnt actually like buying and owning games user desu.
Good job getting it completely backwards, retard.
You DON'T own them right now, because you can't sell them. With that decision you DO own them because you can sell them.
fuck valve and fuck steam
Then every company will stop selling games and make you pay a subscription and stream everything.
>the French are too retarded to understand the difference between ownership liscensing
This is unironically what happens when you put women and minorities in charge.
Valve and gaming in general is just tip of an iceberg. I'm not sure if this will be beneficial for consumer in the long run.
wtf why arent cars subscription based then???
Real Talk: French court always makes retarded laws and fines anyone it could when the EU is running out of money. And I believe France is bleeding money since 2 years ago when they made retarded laws that resulted in yellow jacket riots
Reselling game keys would destroy game storefronts as they exist.
This is correct.
I think OP is implying that this rule will push services like Steam further from the ideal situation, in which you can buy and own games which just happen to be digital, and towards an even more subscription-like model which is worse than what Steam offers now -- the extreme case (not that I think Steam would ever reach it) being something like Stadia in which there isn't even the weakest illusion of ownership. In other words, the implication is that Steam would change their business model to circumvent the ruling, and this would be worse for consumers, because the way to circumvent the ruling is to become less of a retailer and more of a subscription service.
Anyway, I can't imagine caring this much about the ability to resell a game. I never resold my games, even when I used consoles. The ability to resell my Steam games is quite possibly the least important thing in the world to me. But maybe that's because I wait until things are on sale. I guess I can see why someone who spends $60 on an 8-hour game every month would want to get some of that money back when they realize how retarded they were for spending hundreds of dollars on AAA garbage.
>selling used games is worse than piracy
If piracy didn't pushed publisher to subscription model, what makes you think this will?
Valve can still appeal, you know.
Because they're physical goods retard. You don't buy a license to use a car.
Yes, G2A is single handedly destroyed steam...
>t. is illiterate
Woah, I know. God knows what will happen if physical game copies can be resold.
absolutely retarded idea, as expected of politcians
No they won't. They will adjust prizes to the actual value or people will pirate even more. Stop sucking Valve's dick.
>You don't buy a license to use a car.
There's actually a small fee to get a driver's license where I live, but I do realize I'm being completely pedantic.
But you can sell your photoshop, antivirus accounts
>t.corporate dicksucker
G2A doesn't allow you to sell a game after you play it, chucklefuck.
Wasn't this the purpose of Robotcache? what happened to that store?
you dont understand how this works
if they wanted to fuck over coperations this isnt the way to do it
You are retarded mate
Reminder that the fine for not complying is 540K euros over the course of six months which Valve can easily afford to pay.
>politicians
They're not politicians though, they're appointed Judges.
>retarded idea
It's not an idea. They have a case brought against them and the judges rule based on current French law. Current French law dictates that since you are buying a licence and not a subscription, you own the game and thus have legal right to sell it.
What about their investors?
still its a key reselling site, whether you played it or not is irrelevant.
>consumers given a secure platform to purchase video games without fear of loss from theft, damage, or degradation
>get sued for not being pro-consumer
then french laws are outdated and backwards, because this doesnt work in a digital sense. and your judges are retarded, or, more likely, bribed to pretend to be retarded
This would mean estores have to host the resales, and is a massive loss for developers
Especially indie developers will feel this
Valve is a privately-owned company, they have no investors.
wow could you imagine a world in which you could sell a game after you played it? fucking crazy
Who sets up the prices for ''used'' digital goods?
If I wanted to I could sell my copy of kller7 for GC for 1000 eurodollars /just saying, I know doesn't sell for that much...yet) wherever I wanted to but I've got the feeling Steam and the like wouldn't let me sell my digital copy of killer 7 remaster for the same amount of money.
Piracy is illegal, even if you're unlikely to be taken to court over it, and you miss out on a bunch of conveniences like automatic updates, reliable downloads, cloud saves, and so on. Also game streaming is only just now becoming a serious, viable alternative.
Physical goods deteriorate, can be broken, get lost, stolen, and can be more bothersome to sell unlike digital goods.
But you can if you want to.
This will affect every gaming storefront. Yes, including your favorite one.
t. brainlet that doesn't understand how this will affect us still, fuck jews
Paying that implies France deserves 540k for what they're doing.
>whether you played it or not is irrelevant
Not only is it relevant, it is the entire point of the thread.
>I hope you like streaming your subscription games senpai.
I can't believe France created Stadia and Xbox Game Pass. Fuck off and dilate.
>without fear of loss from theft
Banned for saying bad words.
>damage
Dark Souls Remastered
>or degradation
TF2
I only heard of it because of a shill thread in this very board.
>French court
>ruling for all of europe
Retarded amerimutt.
Why not price the games fairly? Why would someone sell a game below the store's price unless it's clear that the game is not worth that much?
>French laws outdated and backwards, doesn't work in a digital sense
Why doesn't it? Key sellers like g2a exist. Why not a system where you can resell a steam game with Gaben taking a small service fee?
>your judges
Not French, my dude.
>bribed
Right, supreme court judges were bribed by the small consumer activist group, rather than multi-billion dollar company valve. Not everyone is bribed when you don't get your own way.
>massive loss for developers
>muh poor indies
Both of which sell physical copies of games. If I'm not wrong, reselling physical copies of games hasn't been an issue since the 1970s, what's stopping them from producing physical copies for PC again?
>shouldn't be allowed to resell something that deteriorate
And why does that matter?
It's based in a European Union ruling of 2012.
>what's stopping them from producing physical copies for PC again?
Their boss wouldn't get as many people in Steam's ecosystem.
>>without fear of loss from theft
>Banned for saying bad words.
You get banned for saying nigger in just about every MMO, that isn't new
>>damage
>Dark Souls Remastered
Didn't play so no comment
>>or degradation
>TF2
Need a hug, tradie?
The whole idea of purchasing digital goods is that the intellectual property itself is of monetary value. Otherwise, data is essentially intangible.
You can't "use" data. Its quality does not deteriorate over time. Thus, as far as the consumer is concerned, the value of a used digital game is exactly the same as that of a new copy, and it would never behoove the consumer to buy new.
This is going to basically turn digital game storefronts into a real life MMO auction house, where you just want to undercut the market and no one ever buys from vendors.
But you own the game when you buy it online.
>Both of which sell physical copies of games
are you serious?
how many indie games even get a physical release these days
Physical release costs MONEY and requires more money to be worth it, you need stores willing to accept your games, you need to stock those stores, its a complicated process that an indie dev is not going to be able to or want to undertake
Indie devs have been able to exist in the past years because theyre able to make a game and let people down load it. in the 90s you had to find a publisher or org and get aligned with them, with all the shit required to do that.
>>bribed
>Right,
Think about who else benefits from this. Hint: its not the activist groups
yeah sure, that worked fine for stadia.
And how is this bad for the consumer?
How many threads about this are we gonna have?
>delivered a blow
You mean at worst for valve they'll have to remove a paragraph from their ToS and can no longer ban your account if you sell it. And that's before you consider the ruling is getting appealed.
Why are people flipping out over this like it's a sign of the end times?
Then that's their problem.
They could even introduce first copy bonuses like those online passes from the early 2010s. They'd get over it and find plenty of ways to continue making money.
Reading this thread you'd think some of the posters are corporate strategists.
>Its quality does not deteriorate over time.
Why do older digital games cost less than new ones?
>shouldn't be allowed to resell something that deteriorate
Huh?
>but indie devs can't publish then
Boohoo. Not only does g2a and steam steal or their money, but they can't even publish a limited physical release!
>store need to take them
Amazon and eBay will sell anything. You could ship from your garage if you wanted.
>who benefits
I'd say the consumer, but I'd like to hear what you think.
>Why are people flipping out over this like it's a sign of the end times?
Because they either like GabeN's cum or they are paid to defend him. Pick one.
I dont mind countries stepping up regulate the gaming industry the problem is that so far theyve shown to be very incompetent at addressing them and they miss the point everytime, like with tis
It'll be really good for like a year or two until devs either go out of business or start doing subscription/f2p shit to compensate for the fact that they're making no money
>you need stores willing to accept your games
Unless you're targeted by the ADL, Amazon.com will literally sell anything. Hell, they even sell AO-rated games. And in the shareware era, all publishers sold from their very houses.
>>store need to take them
>Amazon and eBay will sell anything. You could ship from your garage if you wanted.
that complicates the process which proves my point, and it requires a large investment from the indie dev which they dont have or they wouldnt be an indie dev
youve shown to be willingly retarded and ignorant of any problem this poses because you cant even admit that
Good shilling
>having a favorite site where you love to spend your money
imagine being this cucked
This never happened in the retail era when you could resell games and it isn't happening with console exclusives right now. Fuck off.
Its great for the consumer. The problem is that devs/pubs won't just twiddle their thumbs while they get bent over.
For whatever reason only steam is affected, and epic is the new home of indie devs so who cares
You own a LISCENSE you fuckwit. You think your dumb ass government can transform your digital goods into physical disks when steam servers go down? European countries are fucking retarded and it's going to be hilarious to see more companies offer lesser service there.
Developers and publishers depend on the public, not the other way around. Let them try...
Because corporations are under no obligation to simply bend over and take it, so when this results in a noticeable decrease in profits every new game will in the long run be released as a streaming exclusive, which has the additional benefit of making the game unpirateable.
>still its a key reselling site, whether you played it or not is irrelevant.
Are you legitimately retarded?
Taking a side in this argument aside. It's a key reseller, not a game reseller, the repercussions of each have a huge difference.
If you can't see the vast difference between having to physically go to several stores to possibly find a used copy of the game you're looking for (which might be damaged), and being able to purchase any game you want for a lower price at any time with just a click of a button, you're too blind to bother with.
>This is going to basically turn digital game storefronts into a real life MMO auction house, where you just want to undercut the market and no one ever buys from vendors.
Basically.
Actually implementing game reselling would be easy on Steam, as there's already a market. But we see how that market goes. Anything that isn't rare perpetually has thousands of $0.03 copies waiting to be sold. If you don't undercut everyone then no one buys your shit so prices hit rock bottom very quickly.
If the ruling isn't overturned, I see this going one of four ways:
1. Valve removes the time limitations in their refund policy, but perhaps decreases the money you get back depending on how long the game was owned (e.g. half-refund after one year). This technically allows users to "sell" their games (back to Valve who then sells them again to other users).
2. Valve allows users to resell their games on the Steam market, but there's a minimum price which is close to retail price, or there's some other disadvantage which still encourages new sales.
3. Valve allow users to transfer games just by sending each other keys, but Steam doesn't provide an actual trading mechanism, so it's up to users to figure out the monetary transactions. People get scammed by Russian and Chinese criminals, and the second-hand Steam game market is distrusted enough for Valve to continue selling games.
4. Valve just says "lol fuck u" and the French government doesn't care enough to enforce the ruling strongly enough to hurt Valve, so nothing changes. European gamers remain butthurt forever and spend all their time shitposting about it on Yea Forums.
If none of these are valid options then Steam will change its business model to circumvent the ruling, and that change to their business model will be anti-consumer, because making Steam more of a subscription service is the only way to escape the ruling, as noted in .
>noooo France, if I cant buy asset flip #8484829 digitally, I'll never get it!!!
Maybe we'll have it so good indie games get published, rather than the endless amounts of trash being flogged on steam.
>offer less service
Yeah, because steam would refuse to operate in a market with over a billion people and some of the richest countries in the world.
Why can't I buy something online and then own it
Why are licenses 'the norm'?
They are the norm because these companies want the freedom to tell you whether you can or can't play your game, even years after the initial purchase.
>You own a LISCENSE
Same as if you buy physical. If you buy software on a disk you don't own the software. You own a license to use it.
>Maybe we'll have it so good indie games get published, rather than the endless amounts of trash being flogged on steam.
yeah like with the triple A gaming industry.. oh wait!
>oh no corporations will push games as a service now!
you are all saying that like they aren't already doing that, just don't bend over and stop supporting greedy kikes.
The MMO reference just gave me the dumbest possible solution to this problem. Instead of selling used games, when you're done with a game you can "dismantle" it for Steam Party Gems. Collect enough gems and you can purchase a Party Box which contains a randomly selected game from the entire Steam library. Maybe you'll get a copy of the latest Tomb Raider game. Maybe you'll get some Polish shovelware. Who knows?!
>3000 euros each fine.
>Only in France.
I think Valve will survive. They can afford paying the frogs all that cheese.
>Let them try...
Straight out of a gangweed meme pic.
>lol don't worry this law will only apply to valve and everyone else be exempt
retard
>pay for steam game
>transfer it to my physical disk
your move
>You can't resell or do whatever you want with somethibg you legitimately bought.
That ironically is communist bullshit.
Are you deliberately being retarded? His argument is that the quality of a digital game does not degrade over time as a result of being "owned" by someone. A digital game isn't going to get scratched or worn out. A used disc is cheaper than a new disc even if both discs contain the same game released in the same year. Unused copies of a game from 2015 being cheaper than a game from 2019 is an entirely unrelated matter.
Yeah, because you can't buy on Amazon with shipping to your house.
>release good game for 60 currency
>timeskip of arbitrary length
>most early buyers don't want to sell at all
>the few sellers know that it's well received game and will sell very close to the store price
>buyers will outnumber sellers, not even considering those who want to support the developers of a good game anyway
>everyone is happy
>release bad game for 60 currency
>timeskip of arbitrary length
>lots of sellers, few buyers
>price adjusts to the actual value, maybe something like 20 currency
>should have just released it for 20 currency or improved the game so you get scenario A
Seems to me like you are only against this if you are in favor of developers tricking people into buying games above their value.
Sorry, your right. It's not like indie games such as Minecraft, Shovel Knight, Terraria and others ever got physical releases.
Oh no they did. Look how stupid you look now with that le epic reaction meme!
Because lower prices increases the number of interested customers who are willing to purchase your product. It's basic economics.
>Me make game
>me see only one game sold many people play
>me make people subscribe and stream game
>me laugh
they didnt get a physical release till their digital release had proven succesful and they had the money/assurance to get and work with the investment of a physical release
Damn youre so smart user
>key=\=game
How is it different? you have a key to a game you don't want so you sell it. I have a game in my steam library that I don't want, I want sell it, what is the differences? The point is reselling your digital items.
>retail era
>Amazon
Online shopping was shit back then, and even now shipping is expensive enough to make any savings from purchasing used minimal. And you STILL risk getting a damaged product.
None of those things are an issue with digital goods.
>Terraria
Terraria on PC just got a Steam key.
Isn't it funny how they only seem to be attacking steam?
In MMO there is an infinite amount of items since they can be farmed (often by bots).
In this situation, instead, each single game that'd go to the secondary market had to be bought at some point.
You are the one who is retarded. Looks up the word "obsolescence".
Does FIFA 2015 have the same value nowadays than when it was released?
me not play that game
1999:
>No restriction to resell
>No restriction to borrow
>Golden age of PC games
2019:
>Can't resell games
>Can't borrow games
>Nothing but console ports and shovelware
France just saved PC gaming
>All of the industry follows because money
Guess you won't play any games.
You said "hurr durr it's not the same because with digital you can buy with a few clicks."
>shipping is expensive enough to make any savings from purchasing used minimal
Charge for shipping?
Your definition of a good game precludes anything with little to no replay value
>me make people subscribe and stream game
Yeah, because an indie dev will afford to make a permanent ecosystem just for one game. Dilate.
You're legitimately too stupid to have this conversation with.
>privately owned means you have no investors
Once again that bootlicking ameritard shows just how retarded he really is.
>1999
No way of stopping you because limitations of technology
>2019
Technology caught up. I can make every pay me directly for the game I made buy my games as service pay pig
yeah
>all platforms move to sub and stream model
>indie can't make own platform or distribute by themaelves
>Indie pay fine to join platform. Iknow this is 4 Chan and pretending to be retarded is fun and all but I think you may actually be retarded.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO STOP
THINK OF VALVE'S PROFIT
>buy a license
read
>we created this bullshit narrative that the book you have on your shelf isn't yours because we wrote it, so you have to "license" it from us
now you're doubling down on your bullshit and expecting us not to notice?
It would be one thing if we were making prints of the fucking thing and selling them. We're literally trading off shit we already own.
For anyone who actually likes games, and thinks of games as a useful pasttime, this is a great opportunity.
Not only can old games get new play, but new games can follow trends from old markets.
This market will be an game-designers dream, AND it offers chances to continue to sell older content. Only lawyers and other fucktastic "business" people think this is bad.
You forgot to add a Wojak.
Sorry for the stupid question, but how do you resell a digital game?
Of all the issues inherent to digitial downloads of video games, this is the hill these guys wanted to die on? Not the fact that your license to a game can be revoked at literally any time because 'lol fuck you'? Or that this practice has bled into physical games as some anons have noted?
>You are the one who is retarded. Looks up the word "obsolescence".
>Does FIFA 2015 have the same value nowadays than when it was released?
You've completely missed the point of my post. I acknowledged obsolescence already, and explained that it's a completely different concept which has nothing to do with used copies being cheaper as a result of being used.
Let me break it down for you. A game can get cheaper for at least two separate reasons:
1) It's an old game, released many years ago.
2) It's used and thus its quality is degraded by the previous owner having used it, e.g., scratches on the disc.
#1 applies to digital games and physical games.
#2 applies only to physical games.
The point of my post is that #1 and #2 are not the same thing.
>but how do you resell a digital game?
Easy, you exchange your right to download X game for money. You get money, but can't download the game anymore.
not sure if ESL, or just a fucking retard
You'd essentially be reselling keys.
>gets proven wrong at every point
>admits that he's too dumb to understand that
Kek, thanks for the laugh I guess.
they haven't died on it though, they've won. one battle at a time, retard.
>In MMO there is an infinite amount of items since they can be farmed (often by bots).
>In this situation, instead, each single game that'd go to the secondary market had to be bought at some point.
Well, you're not wrong, but you're not proving me wrong either. So, yeah. Cool.
time to sell hitman2
You know that streaming is expensive as fuck, right?
>This technically allows users to "sell" their games (back to Valve who then sells them again to other users).
It doesn't work like that. The right to sale means to sell it to anyone, otherwise companies would ban sales of everything to third parties and implement a buyback system where they will give you 1 cent for whatever you want to sell back to them so that technically you have your right to sale. For similar reasons they can't set a minimum price. I think Valve would sooner ban France from Steam than letting people freely trade their games off like that.
Fair point. I just don't see how this helps anyone.
You sell it on ebay or similar and then click the "Transfer Game" button in Steam that doesn't exist yet. Some retard said ITT said that Valve has to offer a marketplace. They don't. You just have to be able to transfer licenses between accounts.
Way to pull out a subscription from your ass, op
this
Damn it Gabe, it's really fucking simple.
Set up a Used Game Market on Steam, charge a penny per trade, track by game type, sell to publishers.
Get money.
>France
The European Union made this ruling in 2012.
They would have to ban almost all of Europe.
easiest way is to provide the user with a key to be sold on 3rd party site. Once the key is activated on another steam account, you lose the right to download or launch that game
Can't they just pay the fine and move on instead?
then is not France's fault
you should blame greedy publishers
You're right. I only play old games anyway, This doesn't affect me
It would be easier to just stop banning resold accounts.
Blame San Fran and Seattle?
>But they're the future, and they're "good!"
The coast has no idea how fucking greedy their industry, these faggots live in bubbles.
>In this situation, instead, each single game that'd go to the secondary market had to be bought at some point.
You can resell something that's already been resold, user
>It doesn't work like that. The right to sale means to sell it to anyone,
I don't disagree, but I don't know the details of the French/EU law. I'm saying Valve might find a loophole.
>otherwise companies would ban sales of everything to third parties and implement a buyback system where they will give you 1 cent for whatever you want to sell back to them so that technically you have your right to sale.
Sellers of most physical goods have no way to enforce such a ban. So no, I don't think they would implement such a ban, and it wouldn't matter if they did.
List of changes in the industry for the coming years, all thanks to the frenchies
>Subscriptions fucking everywhere
>DLC up the yahoo
>incomplete games will become the norm
>prices will increase for all games to accommodate for this loss of income
>indie games will get hit by a truck and most indie developers will disappear
>the entire industry as a whole will crash and burn
On the other hand, you will be able to:
>sell your games
thanks, euros
Stop giving them ideas, retard.
>sudden urge to play old game
>remember I sold it
>don't want to buy it again like a jackass so pirate it instead
No. While they could drag out the whole pay the $3000 a day for as long as possible, the French courts won't let it slide if there's no sign of Valve changing to adhere to the law. They would likely either land even bigger fines on valve, huge taxes on products sold by valve or ban them all together.
What France an the EU like to do is hit companies with massive fines until they change. They got Google for almost a billion last year.
>literally names everything already happening and blames canada.
>subscription
game is different than fucking movies, peoples tried this before with Phantom and Onlive. Streaming video games will never work
>>Subscriptions fucking everywhere
>>DLC up the yahoo
>>incomplete games will become the norm
>implying that isn't happening right now
>>the entire industry as a whole will crash and burn
wtf I love France now.
Ferraris already are, to be fair.
Yeah I remember when I bought Sekiro and had to wait for the DLC to finish it.
Fucking retard
>people could be criminal, so nobody can have a car!
the fuck are you smoking.
what the fuck why don't you want to pay 40€ for a 10 year old game?
do you want todd and gabe to starve?
The perceived value of a game crash already after the first week or so.
The bulk of buyers want to play a game as soon as it release because the majority of gamers are impulse buying retarded. People who wait for sales or so are pretty much irrelevant.
The secondary market won't be that big of a deal for the sole reason that to play a game you need time. By the time you'll be done the value of the game had have already crashed.
A compromise to the situation would be to forbid the secondary market for the first week after the game release.
Epic Games Store won't be safe either.
I see. For some reason I was thinking the fine was a one time thing. That's actually not a bad way to get companies to change their practices, assuming they aren't massive like Google.
yea but the EU is imposing their will on me bro :^)
Everything this entire fucking board talks about when it's not shitposting like a fucking autist is doomsaying and shit about how we should all be dead in the next 15-20 years and how nothing we do matters. Fucking christ you guys are somehow more cynical than I expect every single time I think the bottom has been hit. At this point you guys might as well form suicide pacts or some shit and be done with this world if you hate everything that exists so fucking much.
Reminder that Japs have a big second hand market and they still had an indie scene and didn't had DLC and shit. Kill yourself.
>the entire industry as a whole will crash and burn
Good.
i would say "good" but this probably means that games would cost more.
Well, I'm glad your mother let you use her computer, but I think you have to be 18 to post on Chan. The number of games that were clearly not finished when published exploded when Steam and Apple store opened. You not knowing that shows me you have no real experience.
>muh one game though
this is called misleading vividness.
>but everything digital is fairies and good people!
I know that in practical effects is the same thing, but I don't think they will increase in price. Just that sales will be less frequent.
Meh. Fuck steam. And piracy still exists so its all good
Great, that will increase the barrier for entry into this hobby. The less poorfags and third worlders the better.
Obligatory
youtube.com
inifinitychan is ahead of you on that. but its less suicide pacts and more "lone wolf" gunmen
Once they key is used it's consumed, the good is perishable. That creates demand for more of that good, albeit there may be some impact on the demand rate.
The game on the other hand makes the good non-perishable as it is digital and reselling it will quickly remove extremely significant demand for the product shortly after launch and may even cause long term game design decisions based around initial sales. The problem with a resale marketplace on Steam is creating a market where the resale goods are the exact same quality as the brand new goods and are just as easily bought, if not more so. There's a lot of negative impacts this could have on the consumer such as terrible design decisions based around pre-order rewards containing extreme amounts of the game's content to try and stifle resales to create long term profit.
The logical answer to this on the development end is to try and heavily focus on "games as a service". Meaning tying mechanics into subscriptions, mobile levels of in-game microtransactions and gacha shit, etc. in games that otherwise with the current model could have been quality products.
Resales while sounding great in theory are going to add long term volatility to the games market that might seriously damage the quality of the industry or create a bunch of negative impacts on the consumer.
No one can possibly predict it, maybe I'm wrong, but it's something to consider.
Based frogs.
I can see two simple ways for digital stores to comply with that:
1. Allow customer to convert their digital good into a new key that can be resold or added back to the customer's account.
2. Allow customer to strip all DRM from the digital good while removing the item from the customer's account so that they could resell DRM-free copy and any further distribution or usage after the sell would be a civil matter between the author and the customer.
But guess what, these greedy cunts will find a way to screw us over instead. Hopefully, it will at least bring the industry closer to collapse, it's long overdue for the copyright law to be rewritten.
lmao, Eat shit. You are clearly a dev worried he is going to lose his profit, And rightfully so.
Literally no one wants PS4 games. PS4 owners are just desperate to get any value from their games at all.
How would that even work?
Did your mom teach you that?
Based. If climate change is going to get is in a few years anyway, at least let me sell DayZ to some unsuspecting fool for a few bucks.
the japs use steam just like you and me, they don't resell shit. we aren't living in the 90s
>projection ad adhominem everywhere
Stopped reading your post around the 10th word. If you had an argument around there, it got lost in your shitposting.
Try to type like an actual human being next time.
>release yearly rehashed AAA mp game for 60 currency
>timeskip of arbitrary length
>everyone offloading their copy because the game has zero value now that sequel n+1 is out
>few buyers because nobody plays the old game anymore now that the new one is out
>corporation happy
>release good single player game for 60 currency
>timeskip of arbitrary length
>lots of early adopters selling it off to buy the hot new trending soulslike
>everyone who doesn't care to play the latest fad game will wait to buy it used for peanuts
>developers now focus entirely on attracting the kind of audience that plays whatever is trendy right now because they're the only ones who buy new
>lots of salty posts on Yea Forums bitching about how every game is now youtuber bait, full of "meme-worthy" moments in attempt to become trending on twitter, etc. and shouting to the top of their lungs THIS IS WHY I PIRATE as if anyone cares
Or you could just:
>be Russian
>buy 20000 keys for a game that costs $12 due to regional pricing
>Resell 20000 keys for $24 which is still less than half the store price for people not living in the 3rd world.
>Use profit to buy a week's supply of vodka
The ones that fail to understand this shit are typically old, out of touch white males
3. All digital stores stop serving the European Union and now all games will be sold as retail copies.
>it's long overdue for the copyright law to be rewritten.
I'm voting for the following text "14 years after publishing, it enters the public domain. If never was published in the 14 years lapse, it enters 28 years after creation even if it was published after the first 14 years."
>lol the the industry crash!
Remember Phil Fish and what you lost with the Refund policy.
So games will have to be full and complete before they publish, or offer a system by which they offer regular updates that keep people interesting in keeping the game?
Sounds like a win for players. Not even sure this changes anything for publishers.
It will make game quality more important, since a shitty game will have a high resale out of the gate.
>the japs use steam just like you and me, they don't resell shit.
Holy fuck.
EU market is comparable to US, no sane company would ever drop it.
What? What's the link between Phil Fish and the refund policy?
>stop serving the European Union
Is this from an unused script for the Twilight Zone?
As a consumer, The ball has been out of my court for years now. Tell me why i should give a shit about the industry? I'm not the target demographic anymore. If i can resell all the shite games i bought over the years i would, Gladly.
>games are allowed to be sold through Steam Market
>money only goes to your Steam Wallet, same as anything else on Market
>Steam/devs/publishers make a percentage/minimum amount off of every resale
Easy.
Pirates win again!
They basically are if you're retarded and lease one
Why are you buying shite games in the first place?
where did he fucking say game streaming you moron
>So games will have to be full and complete before they publish, or offer a system by which they offer regular updates that keep people interesting in keeping the game?
Not necessarily, they may just add some sort of trivial online mechanic that is mandatory to get the game to even run then require a subscription to the developers general service.
There's a lot of ways for them to cut their losses and most of them are bad.
>Tell me why i should give a shit about the industry?
Because Gabe is the good guy and saved PC gaming.
Enough time and money to spend, Shame they wont see anymore of it, Huh?
This is like reselling a movie ticket after you've seen the movie. Absolutely absurd.
but its data.. it does not age. who would you even sell it? thats might as well be pirating hahaha
pic related, to a guy who started his exchange by calling me fucktard, the use of the word projection is a giggle inducing trigger. please, give me moar.
>because the books in the library should be able to be recalled by the publisher at will.
sorry your greed business model got exploded and shit. but not really.
No, this is like reselling a book in pristine condition after reading it once.
Funny how LITERALLY nobody cared about this until France brought it up, and now all these “muh OWNERSHIP” niggers started popping up. Nobody on this board, or on Reddit, or Gamefaqs, ever went “We deserve to resell our used games”, because it’s genuinely not a system people want.
>So games will have to be full and complete before they publish
No, the complete opposite.
Games will be fragmented to death like Total War Warhammer, but on steroids. Instead of getting a complete game, you will only get a part of it, and depending on the initial sales the devs will be adding more content.
This way if you resell the game, you will only be reselling 20% of the game as oppose to a complete one, and the person you resold it to now has to buy all the DLC to get a complete game.
It's over, this industry is finished.
>fine is only 3000 euros per day for up to six months
wow it's fucking nothing
I mean I've bought my fair share of kusoge, so I see what you mean.
>European consumers are legally free to resell digital games
Yes, but technically they are not capable of doing so. Massive fake news story.
Steam refunds to PayPal, only allowing you to resell and get steambucks wouldn't be allowed.
>t. fucked over consumer
The answer is you shouldn't care. Valve has been happy to take your money for years and until now (in France) they gave you no actual right to own the games you bought.
You shouldn't care nor worry about any big industry, since they'll always find a happy middle ground between getting money from the consumer and getting the consumer to continue buying.
>Why does the french have to ruin everything?
ftfy
NOOOOOO DO NOT EXPOSE OUR INFLATED PRICES
STOP
DO NOT LOOK AT EBAY'S CONSOLE SECTION
WE'LL DO ANOTHER SUMMER SALE, YOU LIKE THOSE 5% OFF, RIGHT? RIGHT?
That's already what is happening tho.
If anything, this puts more pressure on the front end, because a bad review set and low market price means less ability to charge more later.
NOOOOOO PLEASE DON'T RESELL YOUR GAME, THE CORPORATION OWN THEM, THEY ALSO OWN ME, I AM ONLY A NUMBER
Physical copies on consoles has been resold for ages and people were angry when publishers started to move to digital only.
The courts will destroy you if you try to eat fines and ignore their decisions.
I think it's less that people don't want the system and more that it's just not that big of an issue for most people. It certainly isn't for me, but I see why it is for some.
>LITERALLY nobody
40%.
>We deserve to resell our used games
WTF are you talking about, people have been reselling games for decades now.
Thanks to this i can buy all the ps4 exclusives for 10$ each after paying 100$ for a barely used PS4 Pro
I love consoletards that dont know the value of their shit.
Learn to read nigger, this "exchange" was started by you, not me. I'm the one that made the original statement, you're the one trying to refute it by acting like a complete fool.
Go back to school and pay attention in the debate assignments, because you can't form proper arguments at all.
300%
yeah because subscription imply you bought a game and install it in your hard drive
Cool, I can't wait to see subscriptions, loot boxes, and excessive dlc everywhere. As if it wasn't bad enough already.
You realize what a lease is, right?
>The courts will destroy you if you try to eat fines and ignore their decisions.
How exactly does that work?
>"The penalty is X."
>"Okay, I'll pay X."
>"NOOOOOOOOO, YOU CAN'T"
Vehicle stickers, license cost and plate stickers, you do have to pay to use a car otherwise you get constant tickets for not paying the yearly sticker taxes
No small to medium sized dev will want to make anything for PC if this became an industry standard. It would pretty much kill the PC market.
What a retarded statement.
Why would anyone want to "fuck over" corporations?
These laws are instated to protect the consumer.
Maybe if you hadn't actively tried to fuck your own audience with your anti-consumer business practices, they wouldn't now be leading you towards the guillotine.
The industry has shown that it can't regulate itself. It's high time for the government to bring it to heel.
If you don't understand the difference in forcing an entire industry to change its business model to one only the shittiest companies today do, then there is no point talking to you.
You're too low IQ to understand the implications of this.
By the way, giving more power to reviews and review bombers is not something make light of, and it's not a good thing.
>close the storefronts and dont sell anything to the french
lmao get fucked nigger importers
>no one ever buys from vendors
To obtain a used copy someone must first buy it as a new one.
I also cant believe how many of you are defending Valve on this one.
Just because you grew up while being made to think digital goods shouldn't be tradable, doesn't mean that they can't or shouldn't be.
>how
1. Ask them to pay a bigger fine
2. Place huge taxes on their products
3. Prevent them from doing business in the EU, which rivals the US in size
Wait, why is Epic not getting sued for the same thing, or GOG, or other minor platforms?
>OUR INFLATED PRICES
A dollar in 1990 is about two today.
>be dumb cunt
>Decide to buy some bread
>Decide to sell it for cheap
>people are buying my bread
>Use profit to buy more bread
>Repeat
>Other cunts do the same, no big deal
>Store raises prices then lowers it below production value to keep store open
>Quality of bread goes to shit
>Store eventually closes
>Can't get anymore Bread
>Too stupid to understand what caused this
>Just call the store owners cunts while they clean out empty store
>Go to milk shop and repeat what I did before
>Wonder why Americans our so rich but shrug it off
>If you don't understand the difference in forcing an entire industry to change its business model to one only the shittiest companies today do, then there is no point talking to you.
Even indie games have DLC now. It was only matter of time until they added lootboxes.
>By the way, giving more power to reviews and review bombers is not something make light of, and it's not a good thing.
Peak neoliberalism.
It will apply to them as well, specially GOG.com, as they're based in Europe.
ORANGE MAN BAD
ops,
I MEAN GABE/STEAM BAD, EGS GOOD
There won't even be licenses
Good and epic are not large platforms
Actually, it is:
>The penalty is X and you must cease breaking the law
>Okay, I'll pay X
>You are still breaking the law, the new penalty is Y and your executive is now in jail
>"The penalty is X."
>"Okay, I'll pay X."
>"Cool, did you fix it?"
>"No."
>"The penalty is a million X."
>I read a book on how to win arguments, and it said never remember what you said yourself, and always attack.
Your argument was bullshit, your attitude is garbage, your humanity is forfeit, and Steam is going to lose some money. Did you invest in steam, you pile of puss? Are you Gabe, you chair-breaking tub of wasted human flesh? Go to the bathroom, get the razor, see how deep you can cut. Lengthwise.
This is not a harmful event to Steam, this is a benefit since they're already set up with a full market to track item and ownership.
Are you implying there is wear and tear on a digital game?
Is Steam a fucking arm of the voted government? Am I to expect to apply to court of Steam to protest the Steam invasion of Microsoft?
>Valve tells France to go fuck itself, shuts the entire market down
>French filesharing sites pop up like STDs
>French government is so mad with the entire game industry that they just allow it
Probably not, but I can dream.
Okay then. Why can't I transfer the license of something I no longer want for a market rate?
because they are irrelevant
>penalty doesn't increase
>it's the exact same each month
wow
>buy high, sell low apparently now it's a viable way to do bussiness
Based Steamtard.
Because Steam is the biggest fish and they are testing the waters. Now either every big player will start to comply in some way or they'll go after them too.
Isn't this law going to increase microtransactions and live services while creating a grey market for resale games but several times worse?
>France is a prominent member of the EU
>Steam refuses to sell to the French
>French complain that a company is trying to exert itself over a sovereign state
>EU brings bureaucracy incarnate on Valve, destroying its European market
Yeah it wouldn't.
The same law will apply for them. Steam is simply the biggest.
How are you making profit if you are buying high and selling low?
It will just kill all singleplayer games
The model we are returning to. You may forget, at one point there was an actual physical copy that accompanied the purchase, and you could sell it any time you wanted, because the point was TO MAKE GAMES.
Don't come to me talking about industry, you greed stanky faggot.
As for culture shift, you'll get over it, you always do.
And again, if you dumb faggots work for steam, you should be setting up the market, instead of bitching. But then, most of you women and faggots who work in these places don't even code, let alone work.
>Isn't this law going to increase microtransactions and live services
They were going to increase them anyways, it has been known since 2012.
GabeN's cum does that to your brain.
Yes, the first penalty does not increase, they'll just add more. You can't win against government, if the justice system orders you something they'll make you do that.
>steam
>owning games
lmao
>Are you implying there is wear and tear on a digital game?
No I wasn't but that reply was to someone saying why cars aren't subscription based. Many lease business models are based on a fixed monthly cost on the use of the vehicle.
>Tell me why i should give a shit about the industry?
Because without the industry you have nothing to buy.
>If i can resell all the shite games i bought over the years i would
Why are you buying "shite?" If you don't like a game, there's already a refund system in place for you.
>moves money to offshore account and bankrupts himself so he can't be charged since he has no money
wow, thanks america
No, but many devs will stop selling on PC. Particularly jap devs.
Why bother winning against some obscure platform that can't afford a proper defense, only to go against some juggernaut to get the whole thing turned over.
A few indie games are not all indie games.
Crawl didnt' have DLC. Slay the Spire didn't have DLC.
Again, you don't understand the implications of this change. It's like you're just going "but that happens right now to some!" as if that's a proper fucking argument. Today the devs have a choice, tomorrow they won't.
>artsy fartsy pixelshit will die in your lifetime
based frogs
It's really funny, the court basically said that just because you call something a "license" doesn't mean that the customer doesn't own the thing.
>Decide to buy some bread
Fair enough
>Decide to sell it for cheap
With you so far
>Use profit to buy more bread
Uh
cause whales have such amazing taste in vidya right, user? can't wait for every single AAA title to be a gacha with multiple waifu collecting systems
The monthly fine is only for now.
If Valve does nothing and decides to try tank the fine, France would increase the fine massively and potentially curb how much business Valve can do in France.
France doesn't mess about and recently took Google for hundreds of millions of euros for its search engine bullshit.
Read the fucking thread, it's been said a million times they can't just pay some tiny fine and all is good.
>Your argument was bullshit, your attitude is garbage,
Oh, the fucking irony. Stopped reading there, refer to my first reply to you. Behave like an actual human being or fuck off.
If there is a market for games then there will be games.
>I also cant believe how many of you are defending Valve on this one.
"I don't want video games to start sucking dick" =/= defending Valve
It's gonna kill a shit load of things we are happy today about. But most of these eurocucks won't care.
Epic Games, id Software and Apogee could live selling physical copies from their own houses in the 90s and never had DLC shit or anything like that.
Wake up, video games has already been sucking dick for years.
It's a really good point, because it's more or less been established that someone can 'own' digital goods.
Streaming service subscription. As in, you never get to have access to the game's binary and you're only paying for your right to access the servers and stream the content, not for the content itself.
>buying and owning games
>owning games
>can't resell them
lol nice try gabe
And were bought in 00s
>more waifus in every game
This keeps getting better.
>inb4 what are you even doing here?
>believe some fuckhead in a random thread about law
Yeah, sure. They'll skirt their way around this one as well, they still constantly drag their feet with refunds.
>I don't want video games to start sucking dick
>start sucking dick
>start
wat
>the model we are returning to
PC games nearly died in the 00s, every developer moved to consoles.
The model we are returning to, is death. We are changing the car for a cart.
Thing that worked in the 80s and 90s doesn't work after the internet became mainstream. Imagine that.
You know that streaming will never took off because it's extremely expensive and the vast majority of the world has shit Internet.
How would you even buy used product keys when ownership of old PC games was entirely knowledge based? If I sell a key to someone for $20 I still know the key and can constantly rip it away from the buyer or sell one key to multiple people and let them deal with it.
Shareware literally depended on giving away the first part for free all over the Internet.
Guys we can't let Valve etc lose this fight, these poor, helpless billionaires need our support, so spread the word; consumer rights are BAD!
>Being this autistic
Recurring payments, dipshit
hey congratulations on making the most retarded post in this incredibly retarded thread
Based.
Buy high sell low? Works every market where socialists are in charge.
I could literally spend the next 50 years in 2nd life. Or I could go back and play PvP on dozens of LAN and Online games. If no new titles ever come out, I'll be just fine.
I did, your argument was trash, is trash, and will be trash, but considering the source it would be like expecting a monkey to produce Linux.
The current title market is already full of:
>Subscriptions fucking everywhere
>DLC up the yahoo
>incomplete games
>prices increase for all games
>indie developers getting eaten or not opening
You're about 2 decades too fucking late to make this argument being caused by France. In fact, it's reasonable to argue that EA and Steam combined to make exactly this circumstance set.
So, you dumb faggot, find a killer whale and fight her, our combined efforts into keeping your otherwise useless faggot hands alive will do some good keeping Orca populations healthy.
Yeah, it was too costly to effectively invest in the streaming service.
But, OH SHIT, now it's worth for the companies to invest in them. Now it's worth the cost to expand in this area and have localized serves in each country/region. You forced this, Frenchcuck
Shareware is something that could totally work nowadays, but we're lucky to get single level demos in current year.
Thanks
Most people buy cars on finance these days so they effectively are.
Did you forget your games on steam are subscriptions? It doesnt count on those newboy.
The market would set its own price.
>I don't like video games!
>You should care about my opinion on video games!
>I don't know how Internet providers work: The post
Didn't read, it was too long, sorry.
Steam already does this with "you dont buy games you only rent them from us". They've been trying to con everyone since the start and is only now being punished for it.
The vast majority of the world represents a minuscule profit for the industry as it is right now, and most of that profit comes from the sale of an ancient PS2 version of FIFA but with an updated roster.
>I hope you didnt actually like buying and owning games user desu
I don't understand. I'll still buy and own games? The difference would be I can choose to sell them. Where's the problem? It's optional.
gas the zoomers
>I could literally spend the next 50 years in 2nd life. Or I could go back and play PvP on dozens of LAN and Online games. If no new titles ever come out, I'll be just fine.
Then go do that and stop wasting real people's time with your inane yammering.
Yeah, that's your post in a nutshell.
>But, OH SHIT, now it's worth for the companies to invest in them
It doesn't work then, it doesn't work now. It not about money, its the service, one word: Latency
FUCK VALVE
Why is America such an anti consumer shithole? Imagine defending corporations.
>can't handle complexity which is why I suck at arguments despite reading that book they promised would help me win friends...
the post.
>belive some fuckhead...
Oh fuck off you mouth breathing, bootlicking anime posting retard. about law.
If you had an iq above room temperature, you'd know that you can't either
1. Pay some small fine indefinitely while continuing to do something ruled illegal
2. Drag your feet forever
They'll get a couple of years most to try win their appeal, which they have no chance of winning since its against a ruling by the French supreme court.
Your corporate overlords are fucked, get over yourself.
>france: pay up gaymurrz
>EPIC: miss me with that shit fag
>steam: n-nooooo my as whole can't stretch that wide it hurts it huuuuurts!!!
This is going to hurt devs way more than it will hurt Valve
Yes, there are people who want the industry to stop sucking dick and you should listen to them, is there something wrong with that?
>buy game once
>complete it, sell it to the next guy for $5
>when they complete it they sell it to the next guy for $5
>eventually everyone in the world has completed the game without pirating it and the devs only made $5 off the first purchase
Used games hurt the gay men industry worse than pirates ever could wish for.
Not him but you make a good argument with the whale, every game will be aimed at whales. Enjoy the gacha-future.
>all these people buttmad about a good thing
Fuck communists. My right to own a game and sell it should not be halted by some fag company telling me I don't really own it.
>B-But they'll make everything subscription based!!! ;_;
I doubt it, but if they do, just buy physical media and watch real capitalism take it's natural course. No fucking business ever died because people sold their used goods. That's fucking retarded and proves that you know nothing about money and how business works.
>Latency
Don't be so bad with him, licking Valve's boots screwed his brain.
Do we have tachyons yet?
Oh no think of the smaller corporations
dumb commie
Those people haven't played a game since Baldur's Gate 2 came out
>this naive fuck thinks EA will let him get away with this
>he thinks any developer will let him get away with it
lmao
>actually believing this will do anything
nice trolling dude, the french are anal and push a bunch of shit, even if this passes it won't affect stuff in the way you think, they always find ways around it ;)
>eventually everyone in the world has completed the game without pirating it and the devs only made $5 off the first purchase
Yeah, because we all know that people are completely patient.
>No fucking business ever died because people sold their used goods.
This.
So how would this apply to in-game purchases? It'd be pretty stupid if I sold a game but still had a bunch of costumes I can't use tied to my account.
>how to be sure your game has the right attitude toward customers is be thinking opposite of this post.
well, I didn't tell you to deal with bankers and get rich scam artists. you guys chose that shit on your own. enjoy trying to sell that $1.5 million dollar 1 bedroom cottage.
I didn't know communists were pro-corporation. Also what physical media will you buy when there's none?
>3 dudes in an apartment start an LLC
>FUCK YOU CORPORATE SCUM YOU WON'T TAKE ANY OF MY MONEY
one word: localized servers
South Korea has your back.
>Last month, South Korea's top court ruled that unlike online gambling -- games of luck that are banned by law in Korea -- acquiring game items takes time, effort and skill. Therefore, selling them is legal, as long as the real money that backs the trade goes through legal channels.
en.yna.co.kr
Asked Dr.Manhattan
They will just have to start making games with replay value instead of linear scripted corridor shooters
Consumers always win baby
Nice implications there you corporate cock huffer
Found the illiterate yokel shareblue member. How about you go back to pleddit you fucking pinko?
If one million people want to play the game for an hour each then a large number of them will die from old age before their turn to play.
>EA BAD
>EPIC BAD
dude, these are the people making games, you hurt them, then there are no games to play
do you just hate videogames or something?
What's it like living in a damp hole you dug in the ground under a pile of money that you have to nothing to do with?
Digital goods don't deteriorate, retard. If a game is listed cheaper anywhere else, there are ZERO reasons to ever buy the game from the developer, unless you actually want to support them. For further evidence of this, look no further than G2A and other sites like it, where developers have been absolutely livid that they're getting fucked out of money because people are reselling digital keys. Turn this into something more legitimate, and even the moraltards won't have any arguments agaisnt it. I'll be nothing but people playing then selling games they're done with, but with none of the downsides of physical media.
Valve won, they have to be laughing up their sleeve, since they're already set up for this.
$0.1 has been deposited into your Steam Wallet
If 3 dudes make a game it’s probably shit and nobody will play it anyways
This
>muh traditions
Fuck off
Communists want to be oppressed by any boot that will step on them. Corporate or government it doesn't matter to them as long as they think they'll all be high ranking officers who sit in cushy flats eating caviar.
VIDF can't understand mathematics.
>they'll find a way around it
Keep telling yourself that Gaben. Google did a good job getting around that billion euro fine that had to pay.
Oh wait.
Yes, these people all hate video games. There is no sense in arguing with them. They are soulless husks.
But EA and Epic are bad
>indies think they can get away with making 1-hour long pixelshit
serves them right
I'm down for the idea of selling my games for cash, it'll be like the old days of selling old copies of games I disliked as credit for new games.
I have one issue with this:
I hack in a game for 3 days and ruin everyone's experience, I hear rumours that battleye has detected the latest cheat and is wave banning.
What's to stop me just sending my key/game to another account?
Or worse if the devs banned keys that were used for aimbitting/walls, I could end up buying a key on a time limit till it's banned.
Undertale was made by one guy and its easily the game of the decade, dude
How do people STILL not get this?
PIRACY DOESN'T EQUAL A LOST SALE!
Most people pirating a game were never gonna buy it in the first place. Meanwhile buying a used copy is 100% a lost sale as it shows they were willing to fork over cash for it. In a digital space where there is ZERO difference between a used copy and a new copy there is absolutely NO REASON to ever buy from retail.
How it does work on consoles? There you can re-sell copies of GaaS shit.
Icing on the cake will be the inevitable forcing of valve to convert their steam coins into real money
This is radical. These companies really thought they could jew it up with digital sales. They thought they could have eradicated the idea of owning what you paid for. A concept practiced since Man was smart enough to trade shiny rocks or clubs for mammoth meat and hides. They thought they could just end that using their kikery and legal documents written by limp wristed lackeys.
>game of the decade
no it's not, fuck off, yikes.
Hear me out: wouldn't this be circumvented by making games really fun and replayable? I mean, who wants to sell off a game they want to go back to? In an ideal world, this would mean better games. I know it'll push alot of devs to subscription based garbage, but a man can hope.
Then kill digital distribution.
People actually believe that downloading a game for free doesn't effect sales, but being able to get the get the game cheaper will destroy the industry
LMAO, some serious mental gymnastics from steamcucks
>it'll be like the old days of selling old copies of gam
No, it won't.
Jesus you kids are one naïve bunch.
No but you my man will cope
Can't wait for "economical backfire" to see gamers seeth.
>Undertale
go back to tumblr
Does this mean no more DRM? Please say yes I'm fucking sick of Denuvo melting my CPU.
Will anyone’s lives be negatively affected by valve not raking in billions of Jew bucks?
...
Well, developer just need to made a good game then, problem solved
One party is minority other party is everything. Kill yourself.
One is strictly illegal and often impossible until months after initial release
The other is a click of a button to save $5 and deny the devs any income
>wouldn't this be circumvented by making games really fun and replayable?
No, do you live in fairy land or something? how dumb can you be.
>in the future, i'll be able to sell all of the albums that i've purchased on bandcamp
feels good man, i'm sitting on a gold mine
Good fuck corporations
Not sure why you brought up DRM because it isn't a piracy issues
>Does this mean no more DRM?
In possible retail copies for PC for the European market? Absolutely or at least the dissaparence of DRM with accounts.
>having this much hate for indie devs
Why?
You're going to pay for that, not corporations. I can assure you.
Prove it. Your claim is hollow and I declare you an ignorant buffoon.
better shut down gamestop then (ignoring the fact that reports say they are already on their way out)
I'd buy it used if I have the craving, chances are it's gonna be even cheaper than when I sold it since more time has passed.
Or better yet, I pirate it since I'm not a game-buying chimp.
If your game is readily available on the second hand market right after release then you shouldn't be making games
You're considering the pre-teen market, glad you're here. I honestly can't speak for that type of faggot, breaking games for giggles has never been in my personality set. the point of the game is to challenge, and cheating isn't a challenge. how about recognizing the account that owned it when the ban was applied? Buy-Sell dates tied to ban dates. Should be pretty simple. Does this mean you're going to get another chance to hack the same game? I guess so. And that could develop into a serious problem if you're dealing with a hostile network.
At that point, IP bans become semi-useful, but not entirely. One option is to make tier servers based on first purchase of key, etc. etc. This would also serve to reduce the resale value, since buying a used game may put you in with people trying to hack, but it would also deter the networked black hats, since they would either buy new keys to have the same effect, or settle for ruining the resale.
maybe if europe would stop worrying about dumb shit and fix their fucking conty maybe the eu would be in a better spot than it is now
>The other is a click of a button to save $5 and deny the devs any income
Nobody forces Valve to provide a marketplace for used games, you retard.
How? I’ll be buying cheap games from the steam market at a discount
this but unironically
>muh Steam curation
>muh Steam doesn't promotes my game enough
>muh Steam doesn't has enough curation
>muh people distribute Steam keys from bundles without giving money first
yes, all of our lives
a worse steam means a worse service for all of us
Stopping shilling, zhang, your epic game store is going to be forced by the EU to allow resale. Get rekted insectoid.
How does making a good game stop people buying the game from the used market when they are the exact same quality?
Is there any line od thinking more oblivious, short-sighted, and hypocritical than this? I think not.
Does that mean we're also free to resell iOS/Android apps, digital music and such?
No, Valve will probably be forced to reduce their cut into to promote a healthy, well funded industry, they might even have to start competing with Epic.
Based Epic
How? I ain't gonna pay for streaming nor subscription services.
That or Epic Games Store leaves Europe.
Yes.
Why hasn't this happened with console games?
Well, I'm not really sure what they're asserting here, are they asserting I should be allowed to sell the files that are on my PC? Or the license to download the game? One of those means no more DRM, one doesn't.
>That or Epic Games Store leaves Europe
LOL
Do you seriously think they're going to make you file paperwork? It's going to be a click of a button no matter what browser you do it through.
Strong consumer protection laws are good in long-term because corporations will always try to fuck over consumers.
What about devs who make actual good games? Do you want them to get fucked too?
Based
I want you to think. If I tell you, you won't think. Think what could stop your dream from coming true. Think.
>Thus, as far as the consumer is concerned, the value of a used digital game is exactly the same as that of a new copy, and it would never behoove the consumer to buy new.
Actually a valid point. Why would I ever buy new digital shit again?
French court isnt EU court. Besides steam would just let you sell your games on steam market, with a cut and then making even more money.
Good hope they lose the appeal. Can't wait for the kick in the dick this will give the industry once MS/Sony/EA/Ubisoft/etc. have to follow suit.
>Buy high
>Sell low
>???
>PROFIT
Hey /biz/
Why are consolefags this retarded? Do you faggots seriously not understand why we call it THE CONSOLE TAX
Because peoples will less likely sell the game that they wanted to play.
You'll have to go to third party sites unless Valve is willingly makes a marketplace on their own platform.
People had the same cheating complaint when tf2 went f2p, but the rate of cheaters barely went up
And consumers will always try to fuck over corporations
All this will do is destroy the smaller corporations and make the bigger ones employ shittier tactics
Because console "gamers" are subhumans. Most of them only buy FIFA and they refuse to pirate their console for no reason.
That's government over reach. You shouldn't need a driver's license to drive a car
I think, to play Age of Empires 2, Bill Gates should get another $40 for Age of Empires 2 Digital Platinum Edition, where I get never-before seen footage of behind-the-scenes development included with...
>EU Court of Justice rules selling 'used' licenses for downloaded software is legal
theverge.com
It was based on the old EU court's decision.
>pixelshit
>good
kill yourself retarded chink
Valve will just say "sure you can resell, after 365 days have passed after the purchase"
BOOM, problems solved. We won't get cucked by DLC up the ass. We won't get cucked out of completed games. We won't get cucked with gacha or forced multiplayer shit.
With this simple obstacle, I have saved videogames.
>Oh no I had to type a web address into my URL bar
>how
That's how economics work. Cheap games for everyone and market losing money? Very funny.
Big corporations are already doing their best at destroying the smaller corporations, you aren't thinking far enough into the future.
You might also notice the console, even with inflation, costs like a 3rd of what it is today. Most of a cartridges cost was shipping, store fees, the plastic itself, etc. Now even with a 30% cut to valve, companies are making back at least 50% of a sale vs maybe 10-20% back then.
>We won't get cucked by DLC up the ass. We won't get cucked out of completed games. We won't get cucked with gacha or forced multiplayer shit.
Did I hit a time machine and is this 1998?
Excuse me, I need to buy a gun and get to work.
I mean, they already have a marketplace on their own platform. They can just add games from your library to that market.
When does this ever get better for smaller corporations then? Enlighten me.
Terraria is good. And there's also good non-pixel games like Hollow Knight, Slay the Spire, and Spelunky.
If there were no indies you would literally just have the mounds of soulless AAA trash that ruined the industry.
>You can wait X amount of time to sell this game or you can pay a fee of $10 to sell now.
Need to type a web address into the URL bar will cut off 99% of the potential sellers.
Go back to /biz/
For some reason you think we will buy streaming or subscription shit. Die.
found the zoomer
people that think steam will go subscription or that individual publishers will go subscription to get around it are delusional, or think all publishers are EA megakikes who have the funds and infrastructure to launch their own systems
to resell a copy you need to have bought a full-price copy in the first place (or have bought a cheaper key or similar), the publisher and/or developer already have boatloads of money. if the game is in low demand there will be few or no people reselling it, if it's cheap there'll be little point in reselling it, attempting to flip it during humble bundle or deep sales won't be profitable in the short or long term
people are freaking the fuck out over muh consumer rights for a system that has very little practical difference from key reselling, if you think anybody will lose huge quantities of money over this you're a rube
>We won't get cucked by DLC up the ass. We won't get cucked out of completed games
That's already happened user, you didn't saved anything
Yeah, that won't work because that is claiming Valve owns the game, which is contrary to the court ruling.
Honestly, a clever developer could use this all day long. There are some serious pluses in such a market existing. People who are complaining are clearly incompetent and if anyone knows these people are working with them, should see they are fired.
>we
Kill yourself cringelord.
He saved corporations' profits.
damn, that's smart as fuck
Valve can rake millions with this.
Never? It will always be big corporations vs consumers. Lax laws can only result in a dystopian future where big corporations do literally whatever they want.
>I'm so smart I don't have to explain it. Get Galaxy brain like me and you'll find the answer.
You are a charlatan and a fool. You know nothing and gave experienced as much.
Yeah just like people refuse to download new launchers
They don't
For some reason people aren't looking at the other side either. Digital games usually stay around for purchase far longer than retail. Like you can still buy half life 2 15 years later. This can help stop resale kikes who think a 20 year old game is worth $100.
I suppose a time/ban system could work but we are talking about modern day developers who have the shittiest Customer support.
>Buy game 2nd hand.
>Enjoying it for 22hrs
>"You have been banned for the following reason: Cheating. Code jutscjccnrdc678edc3"
>Ok I'll contact E fucking A.....
"Hi I bought a copy of your game on steam and I've just been told I'm banned in game, what gives?"
>Pajeet replies "Ohhhh but but but I very sorry sir, but I am unable to do anything regarding this ban, sir. Have you tried emailing the anti cheat team? Maybe they can help? Do you need anything else?"
>"No that's fine"
>"Ok sir you have a lovely day, you've been talking to ganesh". *click*
>Email Battleye
>Hi I was banned... blah blah blah
>2 weeks later
>"Hi we can see that this key was used to exploit, unfortunately as IP addresses can change and steam have key sharing, we have no way to contain cheating, so we are forced to lock keys from accessing multiplayer, but enjoy your 6 hour campaign:^)"
>Nice.jpg
Sounds good in theory. Could ultimately be harmful, but the industry is already garbage anyway, so I don't really care.
Is it difficult only being able to process color infromation as black or white?
>he can't think
LMAO
You just told me valve has another service they can sell.
>worse minecraft and a bunch of uninspired retro platformers
Indies are somehow jsut as soulless as AAA and they often try to shove political agendas down my throat too.
>I fucking hate video games but let me tell you ALLLLL about what video games should be like!
You're worse than SJWs and ResetEra
France is the most retarded country in the EU. It baffles me that they manage to still be one of most well regarded countries here while also being the greatest fuckwits God ever shat on this earth.
that too, steam is its own deterrent against price gouging
The harder a given industry screams and cries over regulations and legislation, the better reason for it to exist. And fucking hell are the corpo drones out in force on this one.
>slay the spire
>platformer
what the fuck are you blabbing about
And nothing can be worse than fucking minecratt
are you even trying to make an argument or are you just here to shitpost the most retarded garbage you can think of?
>they often try to shove political agendas down my throat too.
And AAA games do that too.
This was a ruling of the European Union. And Germany did the same.
>SAP can't restrict software resales, German court rules - Oct 28, 2013
pcworld.com
>t.
It called a lease. Car companies make big bucks when cars break down cause they hide the manual and way to fix a car.
>say it is 2 hours of labour, only using their super secret speciality tool, a holesaw.
>mechanic buys part doesn't pah expensive specialty art >labour is 12 hours
>stop fixing it
>dealer now fixes it in lease time and high mark up.
>tfw having consumer rights
I love video games though, just not the state of the industry. What are you even trying to say?
If you don't want Valve ruling over PC gaming in all of its forms and the destruction of physical media, you hate gaming.
Can't wait for cheatergate.
A torrent of cheaters getting banned and then selling game copies for £40 and poor saps are fucked over.
If they were to unban the keys due to account changing, you'll just have cheats making 10 accounts and juggling the key around.
I suppose steam will add a £5 charge to move the key within 60 days, the kikes.
I remember that world , it was shit games prices where high didn't get lower price till 2 year, reseller literally sold the game for like only 5 bucks less, bought off you for like 10 percent of msrp cost.
>tfw your consumer rights fuck over every consumer globally
I can't WAIT for everything to be subscription based now, thanks baguetteniggers!
>maybe we should just lie down and eat shit force fed to us instead of trying to add regulation!
neck yourself
What does this mean for us Amerimutts??
Are you dumb? Idiot
imagine being low iq
>le CORPO DRONES XDDD
This is you.
Meanwhile, an intellectual, like me
>Great, I can sell games! But what are the effects of this on the industry? Let's see:
>create policy to steal money from developers
>developers won't like this policy, will take a dent in profit
>"If I was a developer, would I really just gladly take this policy up the ass? No, I wouldn't. I would work around it."
>developers all over the world design some weird shit to earn more profits
>"But what it mean that they earn more profits? Where does that money would come from?"
>"Oh...me. Right, I'm the consumer"
>"So basically this entire policy will just hurt my pocket instead of help me out."
And then you stop celebrating like the fucking ape you are because you realize Activision, Microsoft, and EA will never let you get away with this without them having a safeguard for it.
People thinking we live in My Little Pony are the dumbest of the bunch. You just don't take shekels from the jews without them fighting back.
Some of us are old enough to remember the Patriot Act and thinking "Yeah, that's a good thing it will stop the terrorists" and then suffering the repercussion of NSA.
Imagine blaming the consumer for this instead of the publisher.
or you know, just block french to resell their games only for french so they can suck their own black dicks and also stop releasing new games in france
>This kills Deltarune.
Based.
Based.
Are you retarded or just stupid? Asshole piece o crap
>And then you stop celebrating like the fucking ape you are because you realize Activision, Microsoft, and EA will never let you get away with this without them having a safeguard for it.
I don't buy their games and Microsoft and Electronic Arts already pushed hard by subscription shit (Microsoft in particular by offering brand new games in it), so there's no difference for me nor for the industry in general.
The EU is always doing shit like this because they have no tech industry to protect.
Regulation works when you're regulating something that doesn't work, but the market right now for digital purchases is perfectly fine. Refund laws, great regulation, resale laws of intellectual property, completely fucking broken. What the ACTUAL solution for this should be is that if content is blocked due to online features being revoked or an update blocking features selectively from certain players for monetary gain of the devs, then a full refund of the entire price paid should be given. All this resale bullshit needs to stop.
Idiot
Fu k off with that slippery slope
>Meanwhile, an intellectual, like me
>an intellectual, like me
I'm using the devil as an example because if I told you "I doubt Nintendo will let you get away with it" you may not believe me.
Truth be told, everyone or are the very least most of them, will try to fight back this law. It's their fucking livehood, and whatever shit they come up with will hurt the consumer.
Fuck off. Imbecile
>Only corporations make games.
Haha.
It's a Twitter meme.
knowyourmeme.com
Steamtards are addicts to faggy social networks.
corporations are people too user don't be so discriminatory
Based retard
more like they do it because they can. why don't google and facebook just tell the EU to fuck off considering they get sued by them basically nonstop and the EU makes laws specifically to punish american tech companies
They didn't in 2012, they won't do it now.
>I doubt Nintendo will let you get away with it
I don't buy Nintendo shit either.
Well Germany wasn't that great in my eyes either but for Christ's sake they prove to be more and more retarded every single day.
EU is a fucking mess right now.
>comparing Valve having to allow key resales to Bush doing more to harm American freedoms than the British
False equivalent AND a slippery slope argument. Great.
Nice to see you're so high IQ you can predict how this will all play out.
its a meme you dip
Because they still make money and even if they didn't they wouldn't want to risk a competitor taking over the EU market.
It's you who is retarded. You don't get the OP is implying (rightfully) that valve and other publishers can just decide to no longer sell games and only offer subscriptions. Hence the decision of the court is hurtful to consumers.
>Owning games
>steam
pick one and only one.
Now now there is no need to be a contrarian, we all own a switch here.
>france and germany are europe
Off yourself you uneducated burgerclap.
They unironically believe "buy high, sell low" makes sense.
You will never own games you stupid manchildren.
I played Super Mario Bros. and Super Mario Bros. 2 (Japan) in a PC emulator.
That's all I ever played of Nintendo, honest.
>download 12kb crack
wooow that was so hard, glad i buy every game on console so i can sell games because i only buy shit i hate
The glovebox is hardly "hidden"
How so? I can make back ups, I can crack them and I can re-sell them. If you meant the IP, you're an autistic retard.
>muh physical
A physical disk is no different from having the data on your personal hard drive.
Both are essentially useless without the authentication servers.
Except with a physical disc it might not even let you install the game if it can't verify your key with the servers while with an already installed game you can just download a crack and apply it.
>Except with a physical disc it might not even let you install the game if it can't verify your key with the servers
At least in PC online verifications always were done after installing the game.
no you can't
I can and I did it. Dilate.
>always
Not true. In the mid and late 2000s certain EA releases required online verification of the CD key in an attempt to stop keygens or just looking up a valid key online.
This was done before the install process. No valid key would mean no install.
Fair enough.
I believe Activision did it too. This was in a time where always online was simply impractical but they still wanted an online activation check.
And then in 2009 Ubisoft hit hard with Assassin's Creed 2 basically being always online with server-side assets and calculations for some very specific things. Took months for a crack and it was a really shitty server emulator that ran in the background and ate your CPU.
I can rob your house tomorrow night too. No one cares that you're illegally doing something.
>No one cares that you're illegally doing something.
Jesus Christ, someone should close eBay with all the illegal shit they've been doing.
Who on Ebay is selling CD cracks?
