Why aren't you playing Roguelikes, user?

Been thinking about trying out the new Cataclysm dda update, is it any good?

Brogue is my favourite. Super easy to get into, but just as brutal as any other roguelike. And the ASCII visuals are beautiful.

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Roguelike puritans are the most stuck-up, snobby and pretentious segment of the gaming market.

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Accidentally posted a screenshot with modded visuals

Why do people get so bent out of shape when you correct them about the misuse of a genre?

retard

i didnt understand how to create rooms and items in df

ive played rimworld but still had a hard time with df

Read the quickstart guide on the DF wiki. Ask on /dfg/ if you're still stuck.

Dwarf Fortress isn't a roguelike, it's a basebuilder, also ask the gregors at /dfg/ for advice or play adventure mode if fortress mode is too much for you to handle.

Roguelikes are seen as having a lot of gamer cred so telling somebody they aren't playing an actual roguelike is seen as a personal attack.

But I do
Also it's ok if you play those "lite" games as long as you can't carry increasing levels of power between runs.

I really love dwarfs and basebuilders (not dwarves) but I can't be bothered to learn df via wiki stuff, it's not that easy to learn by playing either due to the lack of visual information

adventure is RL

Watch a video tutorial then.
Just remember that you will still need to reference the wiki very regularly even after learning the basics and intermediate stuff.

>Dwarf Fortress isn't a roguelike
> what is adventure mode
pretty close

I play Dungeon Crawl SS often

Yea i like brogue a lot as well, but i dont play it as much as DCSS

Caves of Qud was fun for a few days, got boring quickly desu. Not enough shit to do

Just started Caves of Qud, it's pretty fun. Trying to find a fun build. Any suggestions?

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rogue is not a roguelike

rogue is rogue

I play enter the gungeon

I know but he clearly wasn't talking about Adventure Mode in the first place.

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i dont want to spend a month of time learning df

Play Elona+

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Df is easy to play
Only memes about it being “omg so hardcore”
You can make an utterly shite fort and still survive

i dont want a shit fort i want a proficient fort but the ui is almost nonexistent and data isn't represented very well visually

I mean. It's like rogue though.
Who's the one spreading this fucking meme about the learning curve, I learned everything you'd ever need to know about how to actually play it in like 2 hours. Don't be a bitch, it's not that hard, also learn it on ASCII because it sets you up for all kinds of other great games in the Roguelike genre. DF and the entire Roguelike genre it's (kind of) a part of is an extremely rare example of hard to learn, easy to master.
t. 19 year old zoomer

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>crypt of the necrodancer is a hack and slash

You'll have to learn it one way or another. Or just don't learn it and move on with your life.

No?

How is Elona not mainly played on a non modal screen?

Any good erotic roguelikes?

I think the point with Elona is that it's not just a straight up dungeon crawler or hack-and-slash.

It's arguably a roguelike simply because it's not entirely focused on combat or it's not a dungeon crawler. I disagree however, tileset graphics, perma death, procedural generation, and turned based combat is and would be what makes a real roguelike. Guess that's what "arguably" is there for.

Yeah, that's fair, I didn't really account for the more "life sim" elements in the game, though I'd still argue that even that is all done on the same screen so I guess it could be up for debate.

Anyone got some good roguelike recommendation charts?

Another one for consideration is Cogmind. You basically play as a robot who has to survive by strapping rapidly-decaying bits of other vanquished robots to yourself.

I hate games that go for random generated levels over hand crafter ones.

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>farmer start
>get some decent early pets and almost hit 30 gardening
>cooking pretty damn decent too
>get cocky with my massive inventory's worth of staves/scrolls and start doing random low level dungeons for loot + ores for opatos
>die because my pet wouldn't fight the boss monster and kept fucking off elsewhere
>all potentials are now shit
aaaaand I don't want to play anymore
it's easier to start over than it is to fix my potentials at this point

That explains a lot

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I keep dying on early levels to zombies
wat do

how the fuck are you dying to zombies
are you not recruiting and summoning monsters?
are you not using your skills?

I, too, want to know this
Getting your potentials up in Elona+ is far too easy, especially coming from OO or Vanilla, mostly due to all the free PP you get given and the fact everything is so cheap to train. Honestly, between that fact and your gardening and cooking skill it should be a breeze.

I do actually, maybe I just suck at using the right skills

recruit more always have a full party
never let your dudes die, recall your demons before they die
always read what enemies are capable of, you need to know the resistances and skills of everyone

Have they removed pissing mechanics yet?

New tileset... what do you think?

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Maidensnow

>playing OO
>claymore start
>grab the static medals and get Rod of Domination
>grab a couple of Bells and give them shurikens
>hop in to Yeek Cave thinking it was a Nefia
>20 kamikaze yeeks drop me to near dead before I even get to react
>master Yeek summon more kamikaze yeeks and also dooms my equip
>potentials now shit, no blessed scrolls of uncurse anywhere
>stupidly decide to go back for my stuff
aaaaand now it's time to reroll

Get E+ Custom-G. Removes pissing and fixes a lot more from recent updates.

What else did they fix?

Maybe we get mad because faggots like you shit up the threads with games that are completely different in almost every way, even though these threads are clearly made with real roguelikes in mind. But since you fags are clearly hear to say I guess we have to append roguelikes with "classic" roguelikes.

I got way more into playing my switch than pc lately and there isn't really a way to make classic roguelikes work on consoles. I mostly play pathos on my phone nowadays

Elona+ Custom G fixes a lot of the stupid choices (pissing, thirst, nerfs) in E+ while still keeping all the content, try that

Dungeon Crawl is absolutely incredible.

I hate procedurally generated games

Most look the same but I can give ya a quick list off the top of my head
>pc
Dungeon crawl stone soup
TOME
Infra arcana
Caves of qud
Nethack/any *hack
Angband/ any *band
DoomRL (yes really)
Adom
Brogue
CDDA
Sil (my personal favorite)
>mobile
You can probably find a good chunk of the top ones as ports but it's gonna be pretty ass
Pixel dungeon I think is pretty shit but people seem to like it and it's varients
Pathos is a great mobile reimagining of nethack
>Console
Kek

Also getting in Qud, played a bit of Brogue before hand, but this one is so much harder, even from the last time I played it. I just keep dying at Red Rock, a level 4 character was as far as I've gotten

this chart is stupid

>D**mRL
sequel never

>Run into the ghost of a player clearly stronger than me with a full skill loadout by floor 4
>They don't even get their uniques as a ghost

How the fuck do these people die?

To this day I haven't finished one way heroics

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What's the best one

what game?

>make a thread about third person shooters
>people post 3d platformers

look up the vrogue mod
you're on Yea Forums, it's brogue with a v, what's not to like?

your shadow render is disturbing

this

Not a big fan of the stealth focus

Caves of Qud is great.
Esper type mutant is generally seen as the 'easier' build, and if you go that route I would advise you to try out the Burgeoning mutation, it's extremely underrated/overlooked by every guide I've seen, but personally I would rate it as the best all-around mutation in the game if you use it with any forethought at all.

That's what he was saying. For some reason the chart says the game doesn't work on turns, when it does.
Also, how the fuck is top down or isometric viewpoint not 3rd person perspective?

Because Im still getting used to the controls of UNreal World but it's slow going

What the fuck do I do in this game

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Jupiter hell is supposed to come out soon but something tells me it won't be the same. Maybe I'm just nostalgic because I grew up playing doom

I like the idea of roguelikes more than I do actually playing them.

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Not really, it's just real fucking annoying to see the mislabeling perpetuated. I enjoy games that have elements roguelikes have but when you ask people for a good roguelike to just dump a dozen hours into it and they say something like Enter the Gungeon or Binding of Isaac, you look at them stupid because those games don't have what you're actually looking for at all. To see other people misuse it and continue to perpetuate being incorrect it only solidifies further that people will not actually give you a roguelike in the future when you want it.
Equate it to this:
>Damn I really love real time tactics games, you know any I could try out
>"Yeah dude, check out Mountain Blade!"
Mountain Blade is fucking amazing but it's not going to give the RTT player what he wants.

>Console/handheld
Pokemon mystery dungeon
Shiren
ZHP
Guided fate paradox
Azure tower

The developer is based but sadly every single reference to doom had to be scrubbed because Zenimax hates original ideas

Anybody play this yet? Is it any good? Heard it was too easy

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As long as the gameplay is the same and/or improved, fighting notcyberdemon and notdoomenemies should be fun. Haven't watched alpha footage yet so just waiting

It's pretty hard to be honest.

Hory shit. Is dat some Sil? The AI in that game is top tier. It's what FEAR was to first-person shooters back in the day.

My time has value.

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How the fuck do I beat the dark dragon? I can't evade his breath at all

console/handheld RLs jut dont have the same kind of feel to me, theyre definitely roguelikes but they feel gimped by console controllers

The question wasn't why Roguelike players don't like Roguelites being falsely labeled as Roguelikes, it was "why do roguelite players get mad when you correct them that they're not playing a roguelike"

>TFW Love the shit out of the concept of TOME but can't make it past character creation

No idea man, I've never even managed to reach that point.

They are immensely dull.
There are no fun turn-based games, and there never have been.

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>Love the content added by the mystery version
>It runs like complete ass

It's not fair

you haven't beaten the demonlord?
Haven't played the mystery dungeon ver, what did they add?

recommend me a good roguelike if they're so great

Oh I am OP. But now that my cabin is built and I got a good trapline. I have no idea what to do now

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Pixel art is pretty, tactics battle system has no tactics and adds on xcom rng for shits and giggles.
Events are very repetitive and most don't actually do anything.
Should be an early access game and even them I don't think that would help much since the core systems are such shit

Ive been playing NetHack on and off for over ten years. How do I win?

Because they always sound fun but then by midgame I'm already bored as fuck and by endgame I want to kill myself

I love roguelikes but i hate ASCII.

I'd suggest the binding of isaac but that probably doesn't count since it's not turn based

I've tried Nethack and I think it's neat but I could never get past Sokoban, not because of the puzzles but the monsters

>get fucked by unfair bullshit
>lose all your shit

By reading a billion spoilers

>Anolore
Ohnononononononono

Play Caves of Qud then

Pay attention. Or if you can't do that, wait for the game to force you to do so. My survival rate increased tenfold now there's an actual HP bar to look at.

This unironically, once I knew the rules of the game I was able to beat it finally.

I'm tired of it and i also didn't bought it so it's a very outdated version.

Only played DCSS and Elona and gayshit like DOD.

I have but I've never fought the dragon.

so about Nethack
which branches would you recommend?

Have they fixed CDDA yet?

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There still no FPS roguelike and the only game we got was this dogshit game.

We live in the worst timeline.

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Look at this gatekeeping.

I'm playing DCSS right now and I found this.

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Hol up I got something you might like.

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Shattered Pixel Dungeon

>affinity to dark magic and enhances stealth

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That list is fucked
>Do you control a single character? -> yes
Leads to Dwarf fortress

elona

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Okay so don't play it then, simple solution

Too many roguelikes just feel like unfair death traps than letting me think laterally a new solution. FTL literally felt unwinnable if you get a few bad first few level batch

Playing GearHead.
Got one of my starter mechs blown up.
;_;

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Normies itt seething that their casual pixelshit doesn't count as a roguelike

b-but this chart says it's not.

No it leads to DF adventure mode you fucking idiot, have you even played DF?

It says it is though.

Adom was the best in my opinion, but he really fucked it up in the later versions

cope

Thanks, user. Much appreciated.

epic buzzword

Nethack is too complicated for me, a brainlet

How is it broken? I haven't played in a while and been meaning to get back to it.

There an HP bar now????

Who made this chart? The National Association of Roguelike Video Games ?

Both not good at them and haven't found one I really like.

roguelikes are not a question of intelligence, it's just attention span to not get bored by the terrible UI and graphics

Isn't being obsessed with compartmentalization a sign of autism? Would make sense as roguelikes draw a lot of autists.

Reminds me of the metal scene.

Yes.

what the fuck do i even do in cataclysm

i'm not sure if i'm even building my characters right

There is no such thing as a Roguelike. Name a game you think is Roguelike and someone will say, "Akshully...."

So that is why I am not playing any Roguelikes. I might be playing some Roguelike-likes though.

There really needs to be porn roguelikes. I just want to fuck the sexy spider ladies I fight.

>There is no such thing as a Roguelike.
>I might be playing some Roguelike-likes though.
Why is it that people who complain about Roguelike gatekeeping also happen to be severely autistic?

You mean name a game that isn’t a roguelike and people will correct you?

There are TONS of actual roguelikes you retard

No you tard. Roguelikes are well defined genre. It's you indieshitting normalfags who had to bring your nonsense into it. Now Dead Cells and FTL share the same genre thanks to you.

Shared pool, put all your points into stats, grind survival and make a spear, raid a town, read books and hoard food, build a car, raid a lab

or maybe we are just annoyed that half the thread is devoted to telling you guys to fuck off and the other half is you guys shilling your shitty indie trash. seriously you see a thread that very clearly is about classic roguelikes and your calling us autistic when you try to post binding of isaac level bs?
just look a this and never come back

>What the fuck do I do in this game
Fish, build a home, live like a king and then die in a stupid accident.
Joking aside, if you've got basic survival down (even during winter) then you should start looking for something difficult to kill. Hunt bears, kill Njerpez, raid villages, whatever the fuck you want. Sami also added little quests (e.g. accompany someone to a distant village, stop looters, etc.) not too long ago, but I didn't really bother with them yet.

This. Why isn't there a half decent budget Roguelike?

Procedural generation is one of the biggest mechanics in a roguelike and the fact that there's no graphics of any sort means that there better be some choice writing and I'm not sure procedurally generated writing is gonna do the job.

Cogmind

Kek what a load of shit

this desu, all they really need is some kind of GUI instead of commands and hotkeys. don't even need graphics, the abstraction works to their benefit, especially for the devs. its like a singleplayer TTRPG

>tfw rng fucks you up and you get a no-ass no-tits spider lady

>no arguments

Since it "arguably is" it also arguably isn't.

So it is

Putting aside the Mystery Dungeon games and its various subseries, what are some decent games that utilize elements of roguelikes, even if the games themselves don't fully fall under the roguelike banner?

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The 8 other replies giving evidence and also calling it a load of shit are more than enough. Did you make that fucking retarded chart? Are you asspained no one agrees with it?

It's not autism either to correct someone when they tell you that CoD is an RTS
there are significant differences in terms of gameplay between say Nethack, a true roguelike and FTL, a roguelite

seeNot sure why you're even in this thread since you don't play roguelikes, you couldn't even form an argument as to why they aren't due to the fact you don't even know what the fuck it is.

>This. Why isn't there a half decent budget Roguelike?
Roguelikes stem from Free software ideals. There are no budget roguelikes because most "popular" roguelikes are free.

Uhhh, Ziggurat?

Im a roguelike snob too but this chart is retarded.
You can tell they had a group of games they disapproved of and built requirements to cut them out.

I would honestly say the mystery dungeon games could fall under the roguelike banner
especially given that several of the more difficult dungeons do reset you to baseline status at the start

>The 8 other replies giving evidence
Where is the evidence?
The most I saw of “evidence” was some user falsely thinking DF adventure mode and Fortress mode is the same thing

>roguelite fags cant even agree what is and isnt a roguelite
Top kek

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Is there any Alien roguelike kinda like Isolation?

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I really liked Baroque when I had it. Very interesting atmosphere and I loved the way it went about storytelling.
Also the items are busted, and I could tell even without using the duplication exploits. Two Vampire swords bust the game wide open.

Defend your claims

> the colloquial generally accepted definition is not correct despite language being determined by concensus.
imagine the autist who wasted several hours making this.

>I would honestly say the mystery dungeon games could fall under the roguelike banner

I didn't mean to say they don't qualify, just that they're obvious answers so I was trying to avoid long strings of replies suggesting them.

where does slay the spire fit in here

user it's okay to make something and have people not like it. It's okay. Doesn't mean it's not shit

>no arguments
As expected of roguelite shitters
Is more true than ever

That was made before Slay the Spire
Slay the Spire doesn't really fit neatly into any genre

here is the chad version

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No

Crypt of the Necrodancer and Risk of Rain are roguelikes whether you like it or not, but according to the chart they're a hack and slash (lol) and a third person shooter. You can nitpick quite literally every single game in existence like that chart does to argue a game fits your certain genre or doesn't.

Card game roguelite

That is a much more descriptive definition for a game than just calling it a roguelike

The fact that people want to lump Rogue Legacy, Binding of Issac and FTL all into the same genre boggles my mind

The Chad chart

The virgin chart

Necrodancer is, but Risk of Rain sure as fuck isn't a roguelike
Not that it isn't a good game, mind you

Been playing tome lately, brawler has taken me further than any other class in the game ever has.

Is caves of qud worth playing already or should I keep waiting for it to come off early access?

>permanent death
>procedural generation
>increasingly difficult as time goes on
>classes
What the fuck do you mean it's not a roguelike?

The only class I've won with so far is brawler, it's a very strong class both offensively and defensively

Didn't realize that rogue was a 2d play former, 3D fps and a rhythm game all in one. Crypt and RoR1/2 sure are LIKE ROGUE amirite?

get some higher quality bait boyo. I'm giving you this (you) so you can invest in that.

So roguelite?

Every game that has “rpg elements” is not a rpg

necrodancer has to much focus on the rhythm aspect to truly qualify
a key gameplay aspect of roguelikes is that the player has sufficient time to explore a vast amount of options
necrodancer values reaction over planning

I mean, there is a class that eliminates the rhythm aspect altogether

>has vehicles
>can drive them around
What the fuck do you mean Unreal Tournament 2004 isn't a racing game?
Oh, don't tell me you're one of THOSE pedantic autists who think all racing games have to have laps and finish lines. Get with the times, genres evolve.

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You're missing turn-based.

The Berlin Intereptation of roguelikes classifies both Risk of Rain and Crypt as roguelikes. The ONLY thing missing from Risk of Rain is turn based gameplay. But please continue to argue semantics in a niche genre.

MaiDenSnow is what you want

They are roguelikes, they are part of the roguelike subgenre called roguelite.

You got that backwards, roguelike is a subgenre of roguelites since roguelite encompasses roguelikes but not the reverse

Risk of Rain doesn't have randomly generated terrain, grid based gameplay or resource management, either. Don't know about the other game.

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>roguelike subgenre called roguelite.
that doesn't make any sense
Roguelite isn't even a real genre and I can prove it objectively.

>I can prove it objectively
Do it.

Necrodancer is essentially a simple roguelike with the twist being that turns are timed and you can only attack or move in time with a rhythm that plays in the background

>Decide to try Elona
>Get a little girl as a companion(?)
>A few hours later she drinks from a well and becomes infected(???)
>About 20 minutes later she violently gives birth to a parasite in the middle of the fight
>Parasite's first action is to kill it's own mother
Dude what the fuck.

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and the enemy, environment and loot variety is hilariously low even compared to the most casual roguelike in existence

Gotta be careful with those wells

That isn't really a factor to define it's genre, i could make a fighting game with only 2 character with 2 special moves each and it would still be a fighting game.

>Labyrinthine map
>Huge inventory/equipment menus full of items that must be used properly to avoid disaster
>Every enemy has a storied history/behavior pattern
>Death carries significant penalties
I will never not hate Blizzshit for casualizing dungeon crawlers with their garbage 'adaption'. Fucking retards thinking 3d graphics are worth sacrificing 90% of the content.

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No, they're un-fixing it.

yes but if we start considering necrodancer as a roguelike it is an incredibly bad game
the reason the roguelite genre exists is so that these type of games can be properly judged by their merit as games, rather than their merit as roguelikes

that's why genres as a whole exist. Same thing with say Portal: as an fps it completely fails, it only has 1 weapon, pathetic enemy variety, bullshit levels of regenerating health etc.
But as a first person puzzle game it's great

THEN FUCK OFF YOU CHIMP
PEOPLE LIKE YOU SHOULD BE BANISHED
CUNT

Slay the Spire is just Dominion with RPG elements

So Super Mario Bros. Is a roguelike? You dumb fuck.

This chart is retarded, Nethack isn't a roguelike because of that shitty like "Do you control a character from a first or third person perspective."

Like holy shit nigga, what do you think the @ represents?

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I've been playing Cataclysm: DDA for a bit now. The lab challenge is fun as fuck and gives you tons of room to dick around

Which tileset is this one??

Maybe he likes playing as Komaru from the Danganronpa series.

DDA is really fun at first, before you realize how shallow it is.
Pity that most devs are really terrible at their job so it won't improve and will get worse with time instead.

kys

anyone play Liberal Crime Squad is it good?

it falls in the 2nd category so not necessarily

The state of being a roguelite is based on an arbitrary consensus or statement by the developer rather than any actual aspect of the game.
>Games that have little to no factors in common with roguelites yet are still considered roguelites
Darkest Dungeon (has nothing in common with roguelikes other than turn based combat), Heroes of Hammerwatch (only has procedural generation), Cultist Simulator (only has permadeath)
>Games that have factors in common with roguelites but are not considered roguelites
Vermintide. Any game with a hardcore mode, e.g. Path of Exile, Diablo 2, Terraria.
>Games that are not considered roguelites, but share factors in common with games that are considered roguelites
XCOM (practically identical to Darkest Dungeon gameplay factor-wise), any RTS with combat (due to losing units permanently and having to restart from scratch if your base is destroyed), any arcade cabinet game that restarts if quarters are not inserted upon death

Roguelite as a genre is a complete mess that utterly fails its purpose because it attempts to categorize games by their secondary gameplay elements. Pick a random FPS, TPS, RTS, or CRPG, and you know exactly what kind of game you're going to get. Pick a random roguelite, and it could be anything. It could be a twin stick shooter, or a tactics game, a card game, or a turn based strategy. Maybe it will have permadeath, but maybe not. Maybe it will have procedural generation, but maybe not. There is absolutely no singular unifying element that makes every roguelite similar and this is why it's a complete joke of a ""genre"".

What are some roguelikes for /k/ommandoes?

cataclysm

youtube.com/watch?v=tjGvwvSltFQ

^this
You can go innawoods and that's fun

Cataclysm and DoomRL

I'm whatever the oposite of a tryhard is

Cataclysm DDA has steadily been heading down a path where fun is removed from the game and tedious realism is added.

The new freezing mechanic is one of those, giant cockroaches spawning everywhere another, and the removal of a couple of CBM's because they aren't "realistic" enough is yet another.

That said, it's still fun and things like the new lab layouts and mutation lines, are fun to play. Just expect more annoying features 90% of the playerbase doesnt care about and the need to enable a mod to re-add the deleted content.

>food freezes if you leave it out
>but you can't hold it over a fire or stick it in your clothes to thaw it out
fuck 1 way realism

>>permanent death
>>procedural generation
>>increasingly difficult as time goes on
>>classes
wow so hardcore diablo 2 chars are a roguelike? fucking idiot

youtube.com/watch?v=tgeWRuxWzlY

>The Most Autistic Genre gets the most autistic posters

It's like pottery

Are there any other roguelikes with combat like Dwarf Fortress Adventure Mode? I like being able to aim at certain body parts and watch them going flying.

>when you start liking the genre thanks to FFX-2 Last Mission
Fucking lol. But am not complaining.

I am the staunch defense and last bastion of the term "Rouguelike."
I am /vg/'s only hope against the unwashed masses of Yea Forums.
"My game is a roguelike," to which I say "No!"
I am RIGHT. I know I am RIGHT. I will tell them I am RIGHT. They will be REMINDED with my FLOW-CHARTS of INTELLECTUAL INTEGRITY.

Other terms under my great, protective auspice include: "literally" and "who vs. whom" and I despise the term "irregaurdless."

THE GUARDIAN HATH SPOKEN

You spelt "irregardless" wrong.

i know. it was too late :(

great post

>spelt

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>2019
>being a los goblinos
wew

have anyone here played tangledeep, its a modern roguelike. looks quite fun

I bought it but haven't playef yet because Yea Forums recommened it. Lots of people here say it's fun.

I've played it, it's good but pretty easy for a Roguelike and has some annoying bugs. Also a TON of optional metaprogression crap.

>There are no fun turn-based games, and there never have been.
In DCSS you can play a goblin Jesus and convert other goblins to your cause as you go along until it snowballs into a literal army where the whole screen is full of them, or you can play as a martial arts specialist that flips off the walls, flies around, and chucks fireballs at people like Goku, or you can play as an octopus and transmute your tentacles into knives then stealthily sneak around blendering people to death.

Pretty fun and interesting game.

>that sublime feeling of victory and security the first time you successfully trap a large animal, haul it back to your cabin, and process and preserve it into a hundred servings, knowing you'll be OK through the winter

yeah its really bad

Good and bad thing is how long most builds take to work. Magic books are way too random

Based and roguepilled

top down shooters are the best

I like roguelikes because I can pick them up and put them down whenever I like.
They don't have a bunch of fluff getting between you and the video game, and you can easily do a few turns, stop, then pick up where you left off later.

Low commitment, but the best RLs still have a ton of content and interactions. They're neat.
You can also hide them easily at work.

is risk of rain 2 a roguelike? why or why not?

can you guys recommend some zoomer rogue-likes or rogue-lites? i guess anything where its possible to fail/die

No. It's not turn based and it doesn't have any procedural generation.

20XX is a nice and fun rouge-lite that's essentially Megaman. It also has co-op play.

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orc jesus, goblins are a different thing and don't deserve a messiah

Depends on the kind of character you're playing. I'll agree that there's definitely an annoying factor where a lot of builds can end up just being "I'll work on my defenses and rely on melee/starting book/throwing/evocations until I come online" for longer than would be ideal, but it's also nice that you don't always get to play the character you set out to, and starting a character with "I'm going to level fire magic and conjurations and spam Firestorm" is kind of the wrong way to go about it. Usually a character starts to feel like they're coming together around when you're finishing lair, which is ~1/3 of the way through the game at most.
And if you really want that you can play a Sif or Vehumet character and be nearly guaranteed access to whatever spell you want eventually though.

The most patrician way to play is a Gnoll Wanderer that finds a faded altar though. You'll never know what you're going to end up using but you can always make it work.

DCSS is probably the most streamlined roguelike that doesn't give up too much of what makes the genre interesting. It's far from perfect and I disagree with a lot of the design decisions the devs make, but it's still a very solidly put together experience with relatively few "haha you didn't look this thing up on the wiki so now you die instantly" moments. Still going to take work to get into and you'll die a lot, but definitely not insurmountable for a newer player.

Demon is extremely simple for a roguelike, but is very hard to master.

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OWH+ is fun, but I always do grueling maniac mode for every run and never manage to make it to the end. Probably doesn't help that I never use saves.

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oh is that the SMT one?

so it's a roguelite? because it feels very misleading and wrong to just label it as a third person shooter

live and drink fren

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I mean if you want pew pew shooty Vehumet grants a steady feed of hurt enemy spells and Kiku will just give you the negronomicon if you want to abandon the flesh.

>third person shooter
>describes the core gameplay
>roguelite
>describes one small aspect of the game unrelated to the gameplay
I don't get how calling it a TPS is more wrong than calling it a roguelite

Reminder that the best way to play Nethack is on the PSP

Yeah, but I think it's more accurate to call it a third person shooter with roguelite elements.
Honestly, the only reason why people are angry about the term roguelike being misused is because it went from something to describe a very niche genre of games, into a meme like people calling Dark Souls the roguelike of rpgs and every indie dev calling their pixely garbage a roguelike.

i mean dark souls is rougelike and people lap that shit up