>most anglos go their entire lives without realizing that translations are mere approximations of the original
and this is when we're talking about languages who are in the same family. translations from japanese -> english are "impossible". the end result is so different from the original that it's almost pointless.
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They’re just words bro
oh god just fuck off with this tedious shit, nobody cares
there, that should translate easily enough
Original what?
Most monolingual speakers of any language are never even slightly bothered by the idea that foreign TV series dubs might not be all that accurate with respect to the original script, let alone with translations of poetry or religious texts.
original texts
prose is the least important aspect of literature, ideas and structure matter most
So, translated novels by Japanese authors are just made up from nothing?
Not really true at all
If anything it's much more difficult to translate things from English to another language because English is a bloated language with too many words
The issue of English is in fact that it is too good at translating and co-opting other languages which creates a muddy "nothing" culture in English speakers
>translations of poetry
translating prose is pushing it but this shit gets a nah from me dawg no matter what
>translations are mere approximations of the original
Yes, and?
>"But it means that you will never read Tolstoy's Aннa Кapeнинa, only Wettlin's Anna Karenina"
Don't care.
delusional
>thing, japan
Fuck off, weebshit.
this post is embarrassing lmao
>most anglos go their entire lives without realizing that the written language are mere approximations of the original thoughts
>most anglos go their entire lives without realizing that thoughts are mere approximations of the original feelings
You could never know two languages with the required amount of nuance + cultural understanding to read serious literature. Its not even enough to know it fluently in a surface level
objectively false
Man I don't even know my native language with the required amount of nuance + cultural understanding to read serious literature in it.
Nah
Let me guess you don't actually know more than one language.
I can tell you with absolute certainty that any concept or idea I want to express can be done by far the most easily, most detailed, and most clearly in English over any other language because English has all of the tools and more to do it. Put simply English is designed for writing and most other languages are designed for speaking. Speech in English is often confusing even when it is good, but in writing there is no clearer way to express an idea. English simply has by far the most freeform diction and style possible. When you learn a new language you will realize they use the same stock phrases over and over whereas in English people will put the same thing a million different ways. But the reason you can't understand or accurately translate that same stock phrase no matter how many times it's written is a cultural lack not an insufficiency in language.
>Let me guess you don't actually know more than one language.
Don’t you get tired of being wrong? Didn’t read the rest lmao
Get the rope angloid
Polylingualism leads to inefficiencies in metacognition. It makes sense. The brain is limited and you chose to bog it down with additional languages. You've reduced it to a translation machine. At the end of the day, you're a worse thinker and writer because of it. Anyone, even 75 IQ border hoppers, can learn another language. It's not an accomplishment.
Yeah you’re right. It’s the cultural concepts that are difficult to translate, its not that anything is lost in the translation.
I thought that that wasn't true
Non-anglos that learned English formally typically understand English better than real anglos
The average American or Brit are practically illiterate
>Let me guess you don't actually know more than one language.
wrong
>I can tell you with absolute certainty that any concept or idea I want to express can be done by far the most easily, most detailed, and most clearly in English over any other language because English has all of the tools and more to do it. Put simply English is designed for writing and most other languages are designed for speaking.
冗談にも程がある
Stop saying dumb shit like that. The most intelligent anglo of all time wrote his magnum opus in Latin.
Lol sry idiot your 3 years of German in college won't help you read Broth. Stick to translations little guy its better than nothing
strawman
This is a sad polyglot cope. I'm fluent in three languages and half the time I prefer the translation to the original.
>intelligent
>believed in absolute space and time
lol
This isn't even remotely true. A lot of them can't even understand articles after several years of speaking English.
If I read Ulysses in Spanish I haven't missed anything, right?
The translation forwards always mention this though.
Alright how do you losers cope with the fact that functionally all scientific papers and computer programs i.e. the most necessarily technical and complex writing in the world, is done in English. A Chinese genius will learn English just to laugh at you in your own language and you think learning Russian is gonna help a brainlet like you understand Anna Karenina better?
If the translator is any good you haven't missed anything important. In my experience books that defy translation aren't worth reading.
>If the translator is any good you haven't missed anything important.
you're a philistine
>In my experience books that defy translation aren't worth reading.
>冗談にも程がある
You proved him right by making use of a Japanese verbal cliché.
>You proved him right by making use of a Japanese verbal cliché.
no way jose
Latin is one of the few languages on par with English in information density.
I read japanese and chinese literature both in english and in finnish.
Mathematical writing doesn't use imagery, idioms, metaphor, or poetical language. Mathematical writing doesn't contain double meaning or allow for a wide range of interpretation.
I think you're retarded.
I don't care every fucking thing subjectivly understandable to a human being is 'a gist' anyway. If I'm getting 'the gist' then I'm practically getting the original anyway.
>NO NO IT'S NOT THE SAAAAAME
I can talk with someone else who's read 'The Gambler' and not EVER run into some plot point or idea that one received and the other did not.
that's not the point, dude.
it's about the aesthetics of the prose and how languages work differently
consider the following: imagine translating ebonics to chinese
>information density.
bugman meme
Okay sure but compared to the actual ideas and plot of the book that stuff seems quite secondary.
Also you *could* do that (you'd just have to be creative)
>what is nuance?
>translate ebonics to anything
just dumb down the grammar and use low class and criminal slang and there you have it
but you'll have something else not ebonics (and every associated to it) anymore. don't you get it? it's just an approximation with a different feel.
*everything
just create the slangs with similar gists yourself then
>it's almost pointless
It's not if you like the translation. People always say that poetry for example is impossible to translate, but for me one of the most important aspects of poetry is the very specific images described, and the equally specific sequence of the images and concepts. The sequence especially is integral; it's somewhat like the importance of the sequence of notes in a melody: the context alters the feeling of the image or note considerably. Both the images and the sequence can be faithfully translated, which gives a lot of the original feeling of the poem. The musical quality of the poem will be lost, but this doesnt make it worthless or pointless. It can even give you a new sort of appreciation for the meaning of the poem by isolating and focusing on a specific aspect. I sometimes translate little poems I write into other languages just to see what they come out as, what my instinct considers essential or something.
You cant learn every language that has literature worth reading, and it is just dumb to deny yourself what you can get through a translation. It may end up being some of your favorite stuff you ever read.
This guy get it and he's not obnoxious/arrogant about it.
>mfw my enjoyment of the Divine Comedy has been greatly reduced for having read Shakespeare, Keats, and Milton beforehand
What is the best Oblmov translation? I hear some say it's Magarshack (penguin edition) and others say it's Stephen Pearl.
i don’t read women
literally never read translations. learn the language and then read it yourself. not even trolling, I 100% agree with OP
I do at this very moment and there's nothing you can do about it.