Are there any? What's the point of learning anything if you're gonna die, might as well do things that are actually fun.
Why is hard work a virtue? Why should you spend your life being productive and contribute to society? Please, recommend me some lit on this, I'm having a bit of a crisis.
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Just talk to a hedonist. They are usually terribly unhappy people
You are an insectbrain. You can be NEET and not give a fuck about society while still being a non hedonist. Figure out your own value system cuck
What country you from? In most you can't fake being a retard to get NEETbux or whatever. Unless you want to live in the wild, you're forced to care about society one way or another
This picture is retarded. Hedonism is constant seeking of pleasure in any form. You can moderately engage in most of these activities and still not be a hedonist, and you don’t need to have a child to be productive. Being a “biological failure” means nothing if you die content and happy.
The issue with hedonism is that constant pleasure releases huge amounts of dopamine, which causes your brain to produce less dopamine of its own. This makes all activities less enjoyable and causes you to delve deeper and deeper into an abyss of pleasure that only leaves you unfulfilled. “If one oversteps the bounds of moderations, the greatest pleasures cease to please.”
Read books on stoicism. Seneca’s Letters From A Stoic are a good starting point, as are Meditations.
This. Spiritual NEEThood is the best
Not him but just taking part time work like 3 days a week to stay afloat is worth it for me
>People only think of themselves
>wwooooah major redpill my fellow kekistanians! Le narwhal bacons at midnight! I would have never been able to comprehend this basic fact of life without you spoonfeeding it to me!
People have kids because they are lonely. People refuse to have kids because they are lazy. It's not so deep.
it's just preferences you fucking retard. a hedonist knows that what he is doing is "wrong" but he doesn't care because his pleasure is the most important thing for him. it's literally impossible to refute.
btw hedonism is one of three (or two) ways a person departing from nihilism may take
This.
Knew this one hedonist druggie before I finally cut him off. Would go on and on: sex this, drug that. Didn't make him happy. He was depressed and liked to take his shitty self esteem out on me.
Meanwhile I'm trying to build a life and find a girl who's family oriented.
>girl
>family oriented
Yeah, family oriented. But not with your kid, of course.
>incel doesn’t realize most people who partake in sex use condoms
Enjoy eternal loneliness
>muh incel card.
Hey, if the glove fits
Unless you have had sex?
Not him but I’m a virgin and I don’t hate women or blame them. Not all sexless troglodytes care so much
So any actual arguments or are we just roasting op for asking for info?
Oh don’t get me wrong, not all virgins are petty, awful people who blame their lack of connections on others rather than their poor social skills. Just the very vocal ones on online circles.
Isn’t everyone a hedonist? Are people who consciously abstain from stereotypical hedonistic pleasures also trying to maximize their own happiness through the vague diffused pleasure they get from „abstaining sin because it’s the right thing to do“?
Or Christians who abstain from sin so they can get more pleasure in heaven? Or at least minimize pain by avoiding hell? Isn’t that all the same thing as hedonism?
Hedonists don’t know moderation of pleasures. Most do.
Hedonism leads directly to nihilism though so thats not actually an exit.
Well my only "argument" is that I used to be a hedonist and it led to the realization that the pursuit of pleasure only makes it harder and harder to be satisfied and that you will reach a point that nothing you do actually sates your cravings anymore and then you either fall into nihilism or kys.
Basically pleasure is empty and hedonists are addicted to being satisfied but sooner or later that becomes a dragonchase they can no longer win and if/when the realization hits them they experience an existential crisis which more often then not, tosses them into depression and nihilism.
Hedonism is dumb because it aims to satisfy eternally reoccuring desires that can't be sated permanently, and become harder and harder to sate as time goes on.
Buddhistic argument: Craving and attachment lead to suffering, hedonism is the attempt to seek permanence of the self in impermanent experiences, a contradictory affair, which will lead to continuous failure. Equanimity is the ideal state of being and can only be achieved by overcoming hedonistic indulgence.
>everyone is just out for their own good
Except there are different ways of doing that, some of them self destructive, some ofvthem altruistic.
Saying that everyone wants to feel good isnjust a fact of life and not really a piece of wisdom.
What if you die before achieving that state and suffer the plagues of self-denial? Why should you repress your urges for some chinq belief?
Depression and nihilism is inevitable, as everyone will be confronted with their mortality one day. You're just delaying the process
its a retarded western concept because happiness is deeper than the obvious PLEASING OF THE SENSES.
You don’t have to react to your mortality with depression or nihilism, that’s just your choice.
Hedonism is activities for pleasure's sake.
It’s 2019 and people are still projecting their beliefs onto everybody out of sheer intellectual insecurity. No, nihilism is not some final truth, you only think that because you consider yourself someone, who for whatever reason, has attained absolute truth, and so whatever your opinions are must be it. Extremely egoistic and short sighted
>Depression and nihilism is inevitable, as everyone will be confronted with their mortality one day. You're just delaying the process
You make it sound like there are no options even though there are numerous.
Dying content and happy means nothing if you are a biological failure. The only true death is in not having descendants.
it's cringe
Most hedonists these days are people who don’t want kids. Unless you go around sowing your wild oats hedonism and raising children don’t mix
The selfish Gene it's a must read. An objective point of view.
>Are there any?
You can take the Nietzschean pill and say that seeing things in matters of pleasure vs pain is simply a very shallow way of choosing things.
You can also read the pleasure machine article:
en.wikipedia.org
>Why is hard work a virtue?
Virtue is everything you work hard on and overcome.
>Why should you spend your life being productive and contribute to society?
You shouldnt, thats the slave's way of thinking, you should make life better and productive for you and your interests. Even if those interests are around helping others or your community.
>Please, recommend me some lit on this, I'm having a bit of a crisis.
Read Stirner or Nietzsche and kill the hedonist moral fag dumb dumbs.
But Nietzsche works more on this side of things tho
If you believe you were not related to anyone else on the planet, this might be true. But if you are some form of racialist, you could at least acknowledge that the overwhelmingy majority of people in your race share the same genes. If you think a person who dies defending his extended family, but who has no children is a biological failure then you are misguided.
I think that hedonists miss out on the full range of what it means to be alive. It's a ying and yang. Pleasure and pain go together.
Read Siddhartha if you haven't. Life is shit and will never be completely without pain.
Only a sadist would willingly bring people into this sinful word.
>your own value system
Yeah figure out your own physics while you're at it, kek.
OP pic is dumb
>If you think a person who dies defending his extended family, but who has no children is a biological failure then you are misguided.
He's socially useful, but biologically gone.
Except it's ideas that started a conversation that's been going on for decades now and some of it has been criticized pretty heavily. It's been shown to have been picked up by the usual suspects (corporatists, Randian apologists) as yet another license to be a douche.
most people are only biologically "successful" anyone overly concerned about not leaving a genetic legacy never made a meaningful contribution to society
Who cares if you’re biologically there or not? Won’t matter once you’re dead
Better to live happy without children than to die unhappy with them (though happy with children is most preferable)
Read Brave New World by Huxley
Based.
Contraceptives are morally unjustifiable.
>he thinks learning isn't fun.
The argument is that if you eat 5 big macs the 2nd 3rd 4tg and 5th become less enjoyable. You need a mixture of lots of things to maximise your enjoyment of life. Hedonist are, unironically, not true hedonist. Any true hedonist has a large mixture of enjoyment from literature to art to giving back to society, to sex, to a long term fulfilling partnership with someone they love.
Hedonism as it stands is the idea that you can maximise your enjoyment by extracting pleasure only from a handful of very easily accessible things which, when you analyse it, isn't true and doesn't meet their endgame.
Elaborate. No living being is harmed so I fail to see any moral issue
this, abortions are morally superior as the meat can at least be used for something
This; fuck corpses.
>Drinking alcohol
>To get high
Yeah okay there, bud.
Although i agree that there is nothing wrong with contraceptives 'No living being is harmed so I fail to see any moral issue' was an incredibly low IQ thing to say in a thread about hedonism
Hannibal Lecter, is that you?
Honestly if more hedonists in the world means more people dying sooner and not breeding I'm all for it
Please eat and drink yourself into a coma and then go off some dangerous motorcycle jumps then get an STI hey don't let me stop you
That one guy who responded to you is a real idiot.
Funnily enough saying fuck this transient life was the mode of Western thought before Aquinas.
Read Plato or the Stoics (mostly Epictetus). They have many arguments on why hedonism is a bad idea.
If philosophy is not something that interests you, you could look for neuroscience books that deal with hedonism.
"The Hacking of the American Mind" by Robert Lustig deals with this.
hedonism aka slave of own desires aka subhuman or animal
I don't do any of those things and I still do not give a fuck about contributing to a society that is self cannabilizing and on its way out. Anyone with half a brain and an ounce of self respect should not want to spend the rest of their days slaving away for this shitstain of a society whose end goal is extinction.
I don't see how reproduction is the end-all to life when we're already an overwhelming biological success as a species.
>hedonists use condoms
lmao
Yup. Know this severely hedonistic guy. Thinks only about going out, playing music, hooking up with girls and doind drugs and alcohol.
He's severely depressed and constantly complains about unhappiness. He's also a commie and an atheist.
Now, I'm not wholly happy. I have my problems. But hey, at least my life has meaning.
>my life has meaning
lmao that's what you think fucko
The best argument against hedonism is pretty simple. ‘Hedonism’ can’t exist because pursuing pleasure IN ISOLATION doesn’t yield pleasure. Rather, pleasure is derived from the pursuit of other things (money, love, etc). Thus, hedonism is really just an infinite catalogue of things that could, potentially, give pleasure, but it isn’t defined by any unifying trait.
This is a semantic argument that, while unsatisfying, stops the argument at the axiom—namely, that ‘hedonism’, as philosophy, exists or can be practiced as defined.
you actually enjoy life more if you make some long term goals
>unironically twelve rules for life
Making money and fucking bitches is all the hedonism you need.
Money is necessary to survive, and the more you have it, the better it is. Sex is the only non-necessary pleasure that really matters; avoid alcohol and drugs.
>What's the point of learning anything if you're gonna die, might as well do things that are actually fun
For some people learning is actually more fun than getting hammered with your friends every night. It's really just a matter of taste.
I don't get the concept of "biological failure", what separates humans from animals is that we know we're going to die, and it's going to erase the past and the future, it's not like you're going to watch your descendants from heaven.
Hedonism makes you a slave to your desires.
You might think a hedonist is free to do whatever he wants and he chooses to do the things that bring him the most pleasure, but you're wrong.
A hedonist is enslaved by his desires, he might want to do something else, but his craving for desires keeps him from achieving it. He has no freedom, he's a slave.
Also, take away the things that cause a hedonist pleasure and his world will fall apart. A person whose life-purpose doesn't rely on short-term stimulation won't have an existential crisis when the world collapses, since he has occupied himself with his mind instead of distracting his brain with dopamine rushes.
hedonism is maximizing your pleasure in life. if you do heroin everyday and end up destroying your life, losing your money and friends and having to endure grueling withdrawals, you're not being a good hedonist
Cat posters are always retards
hedonists don't look into the future much. they want as much pleasure as possible as soon as possible.
T. Literal cuck
FUCK YOU GRANDPA IT WAS A DIFFERENT TIME WOMEN HAVE TOO MUCH LIBERTY NOW
>Well my only "argument" is that I used to be a hedonist and it led to the realization that the pursuit of pleasure only makes it harder and harder to be satisfied and that you will reach a point that nothing you do actually sates your cravings anymore and then you either fall into nihilism or kys.
>Hedonism is dumb because it aims to satisfy eternally reoccuring desires that can't be sated permanently, and become harder and harder to sate as time goes on.
I realized this when I was playing wow a lot after some years of hiatus and self improvement. The person I had become with a focus on fitness, career and other real life things was not happy, so I restarted playing wow. It made me feel good , but it also slowly made me. More depressed and redpilled about entertainment..youre only happy as long as you're entertained. When it stops, you either crave more or become miserable through its lack. Shit it retarded. Now I abstain from some forms of pleasures, because I realized their only end is getting more and more.
This.
We are doing pretty much strawmanning here; maybe arguments against living like a person would help
if you're wasting your life on Yea Forums there's a good chance you're actually just a hedonist in denial t b h
Camus' entire point was making your own meaning. If this guy believes his life has meaning then to him it does.
Read the author. Camus’ absurdism is unique in that Camus says we find meaning in rebellion—namely, the rebellion against absurdity. Like Sisyphus, we have a duty to strive for meaning in an absurd world. It is the spirit of this rebellion that generates, as this user says, individual meaning.
Was reading the book Courtesans and Fishcakes about Athenian hedonism towards food (Fish) and women/boys and their views of what was moral and immoral. An extensive metaphor various Athenians used is that the hedonistic man is a leaking vessel, constantly seeking to satiate itself and fill it but finding themselves perpetually empty. The satisfactions are ephemeral because it's as we think of a drug or a high being chased - you will always need more and more.
Personally, as hedonistic as I am I find greater joy in a productive activity that produces something rather than a consumptive activity that produces nothing but memories or sensations of tongue, nose and stomach. I enjoy getting someone off more than I do getting off myself, I enjoy research and learning things for the sake of research and learning things. Thinking of the pleasure of food vs the pleasure of fitness (I am not fit), the former exemplifies the Athenian's empty vessel while the latter unless you become /fit/ obsessed about constantly getting bigger exemplifies the full and whole vessel. So long as you maintain it, your pleasure is constant and not exponential. You won't get tired of being fit and muscular. You will get tired of filet mignon if you had it every day.
STDs still exist and are even becoming more resistant to antibiotic medication.
>but muh condoms
Several bacterial and viral infections are transmitted even with the use of condoms. Condoms generally prevent nastier diseases like AIDS, Syphilis and Hepatitis, but are useless against viruses like Herpes and HPV, or bacteries like mycoplasma genitalium.
I phrased that poorly. Your pleasure is constant and not ephemeral. Food pleasure is not exponential, rather it's a constantly dripping or emptying vessel. You have to chase the next big high with food, you don't have to chase the next big high with fitness. Again, if you don't become obsessed with getting bigger and bigger
>What's the point of learning anything if you're gonna die, might as well do things that are actually fun
what's they point of having fun if you are gonna die
Just have sex with one committed partner and you’re all good
>Depression and nihilism is inevitable, as everyone will be confronted with their mortality one day
major projection here, try and deflate your faggot ego a bit