So I fell for the Buddhism meme and I started reading the Digha-Nikaya. I'm at the third sutta and the Buddha is already using his psychic powers to show his penis to another man. I'm not making this shit up.
"Then the Buddha used his psychic power to will that Ambaṭṭha would see his retracted private parts. And he stuck out his tongue and stroked back and forth on his ear holes and nostrils, and covered his entire forehead with his tongue."
What the actual fuck?
Other urls found in this thread:
discourse.suttacentral.net
dhammawheel.com
sujato.wordpress.com
dhammawiki.com
dhammatalks.org
buddhismuskunde.uni-hamburg.de
youtube.com
obo.genaud.net
seeingthroughthenet.net
twitter.com
Dude you get weird shit in anything that's worthwhile.
Yeah but why do people take everything in here so seriously if it also contains shit like this. :'D I'm laughing my ass off though, I'm not complaining.
surprise! the idea of Buddha as an empiricist psychologist was an Anglo orientalist meme, wait till you get to the elaborate descriptions of hell
Well thank God I decided to read the original texts and not spend 20 years reading all the meditation books out there.
Someone please explain this.
WHAT THE FUCK
>Translated by (((Bhikku Bodhi)))
I'm actually reading a Dutch translation which reads the same.
Buddhism is just as full of weird mythology and imagery as any other religion. But the meme that "it's a philosophy not a religion" trundles on in the west.
>yfw Buddha was an exhibitionist
Absolutely shameful, this is one of the most extravagent pseudo-spiritual moves I have ever read about from a supposed 'master', this sort of crap would be more at home in a 19th century Victorian occultists gathering, how this doesn't make 'The Buddha' lose all credibilty in peoples eyes is beyond me. OP, if you want to read the ideas of a REAL enlightened person who didn't have to resort to the psychic equivalent of dick pics to get people to buy into his cult like Buddha did then read the commentaries of Adi Shankara, unlike Buddha who did all sorts of questionable things Shankara rightfully states in his writings that siddhis and other paranormal abilities are a distraction from the spiritual path and potentially a dangerous trap, and that they should never be used intentionally.
>inb4 the blessed Tathagata had to psychically show the bhikku his shriveled up retracted penis to concince him that he was really enlightened so that the man would be free from suffering yadda yadda yadda
please
yea Buddhism is a religion despite what some western secularists might tell you
doesn't make it bad though
based
>Adi Shankara
Disgusting Vedantists in here, the real path is understanding the Buddhist phenomenological practices and their use of dialectical logic.
The translator is a Jew.
Lots of jews gravitate towards buddhism, get degrees in it or even become pseudo-monks.
Be careful.
So how does the phenomenology of the psychic transmission of the mental image of Buddha's penis tie into liberation and dialectics?
Buddhism is a satanic trick. Repent now!
How does this section of text harm the philosophical ideas of the entire tradition of Buddhism? Sure, if I was being a dogmatist about it and trying to provide a serious interpretation, then I could see where i'd be in trouble. However, you trying to shill and discredit the tradition because of some small portion of text is retarded and you should feel bad.
Can I be a Buddhist and still eat meat? I'm not enough of a fart sniffing faggot to go vegan.
What is the best work of philosophical Buddhism without all the magical heaven/hell bullshit?
>How does this section of text harm the philosophical ideas of the entire tradition of Buddhism?
Because it's on predicated on and ties back to Buddha being infallible when in reality he was evidently a quack and a bozo
>However, you trying to shill and discredit the tradition because of some small portion of text is retarded and you should feel bad.
No, I'm pointing out how this calls into question and debunks the entire edifice that Buddhists have built up around him, there is no reason for me to feel bad, I feel wonderful, my suspicious have been validated! You should be grateful to me for being a shining light of reason that will free you from this insidious cult
The Mountain Doctrine by Dolpopa, translated by Jeffrey Hopkins, it's on lib-gen
Many lay Buddhists do. Many even drink alcohol in moderation. I suggest you look into the Pure Land and the vow of Amida.
It isn't an appeal to authority, this isn't Christianity. There are texts and thinkers in the tradition that continually challenge other traditions and assert the basic premises of the Buddha through their own method. Some schools may be more inclined to treat the Buddha as you said, but that isn't all which is your point. Read more Buddhist lit shill
Not everything in religious texts is literal, and besides that the sutras and traditions are written and performed by man in the material world and things are lost and added in translation accidentally, innocently, or maliciously. Shakyamuni himself was infallible just the same as Christ. Just as Christ dispelled the falsehoods and lies that arose within and perverted Judaism, Buddha dispelled the falsehoods and lies that arose within and perverted the various traditions we now group together as "Hinduism." Unfortunately, time and sinful material life have caused the truth to be distorted and lost with time.
>insidious cult
Be mad that Buddhism beat you out. Pic related
>this kills the Madhyamika
OP here again, here are some Buddhists defending it
>I suggest you look into the Pure Land and the vow of Amida.
le cheap asian substitute of Christianity.
Just go for the real deal, the real God. Amida didn't create you or the universe or himself. Seek the source of all.
t. ex-Amidaist
Is he supposed to be bad or something?
Kek this
I read some of the Buddha's stuff a while ago and realized very quickly that he had been carefully defanged before being presented to the current age
Dude believed in the existence of a ton of deities and like 30-40 different realms of existence, some hell realms, some heaven realms, some in between. Nigga was certainly not a material scientist like cucks today would have you believe.
Here's another take on it:
dhammawiki.com
I'm going to continue reading but damn that hit me off guard.
Another take on it by Thanissaro Bhikkhu
> Marks of a Great Man. For a modern reader, some of the least appealing passages in the Sutta Nipāta concern the brahmanical view that there were 32 marks to look for in a great man—one who would either become a universal monarch or a Rightly Self-Awakened One—and the corresponding Buddhist assertion that the Buddha was endowed with all 32 marks. These passages, found in 3:7 and 5 Prologue, seem to be in direct contradiction to the Buddha’s own assertion in 3:9 that a person’s physical attributes are no measure of his/her worth.
All Nikayas have been revised over time and differ between the various canons we have but the DN is the least credible out of all and differs the most. The equivalent of the DN in thr Agamas is barely even the same and as a result you get weird shit like this. The most authentic EBTs are not 'empiricist psychology' but they are lacking in all the cultural, mythological and psychic baggage and what not. There are some supernatural elements to it still, but nothing fantastic. Communication with devas, the ability to read a person, stuff like that.
The 32 marks are almost certainly weird Indian baggage, because all these marks were spiriual symbolism one retroactively ascribed to the Buddha. In order to reconcile this with more authentic texts that described the Buddha as an ordinary man, not looking much different than any other monk in the sangha, one introduced the ability of the Buddha to shapeshift and to manifest the marks with his 'spiritual body'. I think if there is one lesson to be learned from Buddhism is that you better write down your teachings if you're fully enlightened, else some New Age curries 200 years down the line will start claiming you had an elephant dick and levitated above the ground or some shit, in the process poisoning your legacy.
I personally do not even believe the Buddha was particularly distinguished and was 'just' an extraordinary enlightened man who was qualified to lead and teach. Enlightened people, even fully enlightened ones, are and were not that uncommon and as far as I can tell they all possess more or less the same 'metaphysical' knowledge Gautama Buddha did too.
The reason I elevate Buddhism above other traditions is merely because the methodological approach is supreme, a radical skeptical self-inquiry coupled with the development of equanimity seems as the most straightforward path for most psychologies.
Buddhism is a meme. Meditation is the only good stuff that came from the east. Now we can improve it with science, logic and facts.
This. Read Sam Harris
>all the hindus in this thread pretending that hindu texts aren't filled with weird and abhorrent shit
Nanavira - Clearing the Path
Nagarjuna's Mulamadhyamakakarika
>This. Read Sam Harris
>buddhism meme, meditation good tho
Meditation outside of its proper context is retarded and potentially destructive. A serial rapist could do meditation to cope with his conscience pestering him about his victims, a stockmarket thief could meditate after embezzling money from gullible old people and college students, a frustrated atheist could meditate to ignore giant holes in his worldview that cause him uncertainty and confusion.
>Now we can improve it with science, logic and facts.
lol, a buddhist who meditates in the correct framework, who has the right beliefs will benefit infinitely more than a Sam harris materialist who uses it as a coping mechanism to handle stress and improve his brain functions slightly
I'm pretty sure both posts you replied to were memeing
It's just focusing on breath mate. I do jhanas to feel good, and people from pragmatic dharma do vipassana to achieve cessation from time to time to chill out. Tradfags are truly delusional
There is nothing like that in the Upanishads, Bhagavad-Gita, Shankara's writings etc
you clearly dont know what you are talking about. Sam Harris even admits that meditation sounds like the bullshit business seminar activity but he said its really more than that. Its a tool for introspection and his idea of having no free will.
I forgot how hilarious it is that sam harris interprets anatta as justification for materialist determinism
read Nanavira
It's not that far off, Harris is just a retard so he can't think a coherent thought to its inevitable consequence. Materialistic determinism is just another conceptual framework through which thought manifests craving, but the consequence of anatta is a form of spontaneous naturalism with the absence of free will, which does not make it determined ofc.
Exercise and healthy diet outside of its proper context is retarded and potentially destructive. A faggot rapist could get buff to have a bigger range of men he could rape without getting the shit beat out of him.
I'm pretty sure only atheists make mistakes.
I don’t see how this doesn’t make the buddha just seem even more based
Myth evolves from facts plus imagination. When the baby Siddhattha was born, he would have been inspected, and since he was in fact healthy and physically excellent, he would have been pronounced as such by the soothsayers. It’s possible that other ‘auspicious’ events coincided with the birth – favorable stars or the like. As the child grew into a world-renowned spiritual teacher, the tales would have grown and been retold. They would have been shaped by, and in turn shaped, the prevailing mythos. The originally human details acquired a halo, polished and embellished by countless storytellers. When they have been sufficiently removed from their historical basis, they come to serve a universal, spiritual purpose – an expression of faith and awe; and in addition they can be leveraged for doctrinal purposes, as in D30.
What moderns fail to understand about myth – and I have spoken of this in Sects & Sectarianism – is that in the ancient world myth was widely accepted as an expression of universal truth. We are empiricists, at least in theory – we start with data and infer conclusions. But mythic truth tells of things that always have been and always will be. It is not subject to mundane inconveniences like facts. The mythos tells us that great spiritual beings have special physical signs that are an external manifestation of their inner perfection. Therefore, the Buddha must have had such marks. The only question would be the manner in which the marks were expressed, which would reflect the philosophy of those telling the story; hence the marks are interpreted as cosmic, not literal, in the Mahayana texts.
>75x124
you retards coudent tell what buddhism is if it came out your ass, the buddhism all you twats refer to comes from the Hīnayāna which is the shitty retarded version of the original doctrines compared with the Mahāyāna which stays way truer to the doctrines. You all are fascinated with a buddhism that is most likely the farthest and least familiar with any eastern doctrines aka not buddhism but some shit Westerners love to praise. As a student studying Traditionalism but more so the orientals i can't help but cringe everytime I see you discuss "Buddhism" its more so some-shit the Westerners took in and adapted to their imagination. You guys read some chart and become a Eastern monk and maybe even understand Buddhism itself? gtfo, read guenon's first book so you can get rid of your western prejudices
Your angry, mindless rant has nothing to do with anything I just said. I've read a lot on Zen, I've been to Zen meditation groups, I've put in my time. I don't deserve to have you whine at me with your bullshit. In fact, I get the impression you went into this wanting to write your stupid rant without even reading what I said, since it literally took you 3 minutes to read what I said, think about it, and type all that. You're an asshat.
PRO-TIP: Buddhism's been around for a very long time, and because it mixed with Hinduism, Bon Shamanism, Shinto, Taoism, Tengriism, and Jainism, it picked up all sorts of weird things.
The old Buddhist sect is Theravada. You can think of it sort of like Catholicism, with tons of strange rites and traditions it picked up over a couple thousand years that have nothing to do with original Buddhism. However, unlike Catholicism, Theravada has lots of different versions. A really good one is actually Vipassana, which gets rid of most of the bullshit and just focuses on meditation techniques.
Then Buddhism had a sort of reformation you could compare to the Protestant reformation, which led to Mahayana. The point of Mahayana was to drop all the esoteric bullshit of Theravada, and get back to the core teachings of Buddhism. The Zen tradition is especially rigorous about this, hammering everything down to the bare essentials of basically what works. However, within other schools of Mahayana the same thing happened with Theravada, where they started soaking in esoteric bullshit. So the Tibetans brought in lots of Shamanism, the Tendai Buddhists incorporated Shinto, and the Nichiren Buddhists actually pretty much based their practices and views of Buddha on western Christianity, which is weird and cringey.
So, to recap, there are good approaches to Buddhism like Zen and Vipassana. But there are lots of bad, goofy ones. Mahayana Buddhism was ostensibly a reformation, but both Mahayana and Theravada now have weird esoteric branches, as well as good ones.
I loathe pseuds like you.
I'm not a pseud, you're just a nasty little retard.
Your post read like a Reddit FAQ, overconfident and yet misinformed. Go see where your vipassana training or layperson Zen brings you (nowhere).
this, read Guenon
If you were less retarded, you'd notice that what I said reinforces a lot of what you said. You didn't contradict a single thing I said. Again, you spent so little time that it's obvious you didn't actually bother to read my post. Kill yourself, you're incredibly full of shit.
I'm not the guy you were discussing with. There is more than person here who can immediately spot your inferiority and resulting insecurity. This is Yea Forums, pseuds are immediately obvious.
Oh, I get it. You're neoractionary, magical thinking retards, so my criticism of esotericism triggered you.
No, that's not it. You insulted me, so I responded. And I can see that comes from you being a reactionary esotericist. You're a pseudo-intellectual, kiddo.
I read it. Quality write up. I vomited immediately afterwards, but that was unrelated. Don't kill yourself worrying about the haters.
No, I'm actually just here to troll the Buddhists, they're right though it's obvious that you're a redditor, pro-tip: don't ever use the word 'asshat' on Yea Forums again and stop writing "hey guys heres a helpful TLDR of basic info that anyone who's been reading about this for multiple years would already know, please upvote! ;^)" posts
You're retarded, kid.
>Oh noes he talked about his Penis.
>That hurts my first world sensitivities woah
Grow up.
Kill yourselves, you memeing, gaslighting, reactionary esotericist fucking retards.
It's ok to be node on the Reddit hive-mind. It's a very popular website with a wide range of interesting niches like r/drama and r/coprophile.
His translations are fine, don't spread misinformation
Theravada may prioritize the oldest texts (Nikayas) but in practice many of its traditions adhere to weird revisions from the abhidhamma and commentaries.
Mahayana is newer and they probably did fabricate their sutras, but what they teach is (depending on the tradition) often valid/has basis in the EBTs.
the purest form of Buddhism after the time of the Buddha was early Madhyamaka.
modern Theravada is often tainted by Sarvastivada realism and commentarial stuff, and so they unfortunately ignore the deeper teachings on emptiness and dependent arising (the core of the Buddha's teachings).
modern Mahayana is often filled with ritualism (to a point where its at the expense of actual practice), worship and other wacky stuff.
All sects have good and bad stuff, it just depends on the teachers themselves desu
THANK YOU for giving an actual response to my post.
unrelated to anti-semitic remarks, Bodhi's translations on the deeper discourses are often a bit off/misleading. For the most part (suttas on sila, various stories...etc) though he is fine
I've never used Reddit and I've been on Yea Forums since 2009. But there's also no value to that fact, and you're a retard who's just trying to promote some esoteric bullshit writer because you're mentally ill.
I recommend reading A History of Buddhist Philosophy: Continuities and Discontinuities by David Kalupahana to get a really good overview of things/the way Buddhism developed over the centuries
Seeing threads about Eastern Philosophy turn out so badly makes me sad. It goes to show nobody learn anything from the material they read (if they read anything in the first place).
But feeling sorry wouldn't change anything so I'm using this as a reason to get off the computer and read again.
Thanks, I'll check it out!
Cool rec thanks
>So how does the phenomenology of the psychic transmission of the mental image of Buddha's penis tie into liberation and dialectics?
coming from the guy who literally worships Shiva's dingum
yes Shankara bowed down to a fucking black cock
>there's also no value to that fact
user, please, take my upvote. 07 /gif fapper here, I did not know you were one of the big dogs. Still pounding them out to this day, heh
You're literally retarded, go back to /pol/
You quite literally got everything wrong in this post.
No, I didn't. I pointed out the basic trends, which went into more depth with.
You're still a retarded esotericist just trying to gaslight because I triggered you, because you're a retard. Have fun wading through your Guenon/Evola bullshit.
Dude, you got your timeline backwards, Mahayana is the direct continuation of the early Buddhist schools, Theravada was the protestant reformation, it was literally formed when a bunch of monks decided they didn't agree with the established canon literally every other school accepted.
It can't be stressed often enough just how incredibly distorted the Buddhist scripture is relative to the original Buddha's teachings. The canon itself was only compiled after several doctrinal schisms occurred already, and we have no details of what the discussion looked like.
the nikayas and the agamas are effectively the same content-wise, only differing in style of presentation
I guess? But that isn't relevant, the Theravada schism was actually the first schism the sangha ever had, the actual cause of the schism wasn't because they rejected some teachings but because they wanted to modify them.
Says the Theravada school
>Have marginal interest in Buddhism
>See discussion about Buddhism
>Realize it's the same stupid religious denominational arguing shit as Christianity
Not surprised
This is a big reason for why Zen is popular in the West, because it doesn't give a fuck about any of this shit and just does what works
the sectarian bullshit is way too overblown. Each sect has a lot more in common than they're willing to admit. Four Noble Truths, Eightfold Path, Dependent Arising, Three Characteristics, Emptiness, Wisdom and Compassion: these are universal to all sects.
Don't make fun of him. He had health problems.
We haven't even got to the crazy religious shit yet user.
The Zen practice in the west is so divorced from actual Zen it can barely called Zen.
buddhismuskunde.uni-hamburg.de
Here's a good look at the comparison between the same book of discourses from early Buddhism (the Middle Length Discourses) as it was preserved by both Theravada and Mahayana/Vajrayana traditions.
There is much more that is the same than different.
>The Zen practice in the west is so divorced from actual Zen it can barely called Zen.
This is, ironically, a Western stereotype. Zen is as alive as never before, and it thanks due to the West, where it has been received well. The Western Zen masters are all part of lineages and have received the Dhamma transmission in the traditional fashion and most of them have either practiced in orthodox Zen temples in Japan themselves or have had Japanese teachers that moved to the West to spread Zen here.
Meanwhile in Japan Zen constitutes a rarity and severe minority within the Buddhist community, and most Zen temples are the equivalent of businesses. A few orthodox ones still exist, but they are the absolute exception, and even then they have significantly degenerated (e.g. Antaji).
You speak like the host of a travel show introducing a scene
>The Western Zen masters are all part of lineages and have received the Dhamma transmission in the traditional fashion
This is factually not true, a lot of western Zen masters are in extremely bad standing with the JBF and the validity of their ordination is doubtful.
Like 80% of the fucking Zen temples in California are from the Maezumi lineage, a guy whose only requirement for Dharma transmission was letting him fuck you in the ass.
thank you OP
You know what's fucking hilarious, you can actually track American Zen lineages easier by their resignations for gross misconduct than by teachers.
To be fair American Zen is very different from European Zen. The latter is pretty free of scandals.
has the buddha's penis a buddha nature?
Western Buddhist are fucking cringe
Don't blame Buddhism, blame Americans.
lmao, western Zen btfo!
You really notice how these are either former or current esoteric wine aunts, flocking to Buddhism because their orifices have dried up and they're looking for some sort of permanent experience or sense of meaning in their life, precisely what Buddhistic practice would advice you to let go. These women properly belong to Christianity and a church, where they can readily submit themselves to God.
This.
People saying "Western Buddhism" mean american 100% of the time.
best posts imo
Which translations do you recommend, user? I'm at the point in my backlog where I want to dig deep into the Nikayas soon.
obo.genaud.net
those by the Pali Text Society or by Thanissaro Bhikkhu are consistently good
also
this is really good for the samyutta nikaya, as are the rest of the books on this website: seeingthroughthenet.net
Lol fucking BTFO