There are too many Christians and religioustards on this board - so this general is where we're gonna be discussing books about science and basic reasoning. Here is some recommended reading:
Christopher Hitchens - God is Not Great
Charles Darwin's Theory of evolution
The Big Bang Theory
insulting people out of bigotry isnt very appropriate regardless of your beliefs
>Christopher Hitchens - God is Not Great
hitchens is a poor choice of reading material, he goes out of his area of expertise and is marred by his subjective feelings on subject of religion, considered more of a pop culture hit than an actual intellectual
>The Big Bang Theory
author of which is a catholic priest
Evolution is a fact
Get out of my stinkin general brainlet
Based
The Lord Jesus loves you, my friend
>Evolution is a fact
its a theory
The best edition available.
this is a literature board, as in the art form.
either discuss atheist literature, frankly all that comes to mind is Hitchhiker's Guide which is generally dismissed around here as being overly smug, gimmicky, and too close to genre fiction. Things Fall Apart could be construed as anti-Christian, which seems to be more your aim than actual atheism. maybe you have some other reccs.
if you want to talk science, take it to
we are posting books
not all printed matter constitutes as literature.
this isn't /books/. this is Yea Forums.
you want to talk about books go to r/books
Darwin wasnt an athiest though
Atheism is just a belief system too like other religions, nothing has disproved God's existence.
lol we post philosophy all the time gtfo newfag
>too many
...for what? Your judgment on reality is but one ape with its opinions, in the event that you are correct about your cosmology.
Pointless world views can be safely ignored.
So is gravity, jump of a building fag.
Have you disproven Vishnu, reincarnation, fairies, chtulu, the dao?
no, dao is a philosophical concept, ctulhu is a literary character and vishnu is overglorification of natural processes
fairies are real btw, you are just a fuddy duddy
>So is gravity, jump of a building fag.
Why don't you just point him to other obvious phenomena? To most people gravity is just the science explanation for things falling.
Hence to prove evolution, point their attention at niggers, jews, aboriginals and lower classes.
>ctulhu is a literary character
Just like Jesus and Yahweh
>what is the difference between religion and fiction
are all atheists this uneducated or is this an american only thing?
>fairies are real btw
very bigbrained take. surprised to see such sensibility on Yea Forums
>Hence to prove evolution, point their attention at niggers, jews, aboriginals and lower classes
He could believe that niggers were the product of a curse.
Does it make you sad that America dominates your country in every way?
All religions are fiction.
atheism is like crippling yourself from a leverage. dont really understand it, but people seem to take analogy for actuality
>Does it make you sad that America dominates your country in every way?
thats a rather funny way to spell China
umm, they are not sweety, didnt they teach you the difference between them or are you yet to reach that class in school
Why not both?
>Have you disproven Vishnu, reincarnation, fairies, chtulu, the dao?
That doesn't follow at all, what I said.
Atheism is a belief system since, "God/Spirit" Cannot or have ever been disproven. Period.
Assuming that were true, it would only mean that fiction > rest of reality. Truth would just be pointless flatulence, an obstacle before fiction.
Gravity is still a theory and treated as such. That shit breaks down at very inconvenient time.
So tell us about that difference
teacher will explain eventually
non sequitur reply is non sequitur
>God/Spirit
You can't even define it
Lmao there is no difference, exept for the fact that a bunch of retards took some magic wu wu books seriously
Whatever it is dude, my point still stands. Atheism is a belief, based on unproved shit.
>physical theory
>biological theory
Do I need to spell this out for you
Necessary ground of Being, not a being amongst beings.
Want to watch me do it again?
No one has seen macro-evolution on the scale proposed by Darwin. No one has seen God perform macro-feats that would prove his existence. Both theories use circumstantial evidence from our world to cope with their beliefs. There is no answer.
Lmao, how can i disprove something that isn't even defined
Define being
You can't disprove it because no one has ever done, you are just an annonymous moron pretending to be smart.
Ehh, but we see speciation pretty regularly. Yeah if you need 10M years to see the immune system develop our 50 years of being passable scientists isn't enough, but we'll get there. Hell the long term e. coli project is merely 20 years old and they've seen stuff like the rise of citrate metabolism that could qualify as macroevolution.
Tell me what you actually mean with the word "god" you fucking sissy and i will disprove such silly idea.
Now I get it why people just use the fedora memes and katana meme for people like you.
Atheism has never proved the inexistence of a "God".
I'm not even religious and all you are trying to do is put me in the generic position to say "Oh yeah god is the creator of all things and thats it xd".
All of that while totally avoiding and deflecting the Fact that Atheism is a Belief in on itself. Because it has never Disproven with Evidence the possibility of God.
I think you belong over here:
Get this--i am religious and I believe in evolution.
Look at it from the perspective of some who lived and was born in a non religious society such as my self.
You come to me with some magic view of the world and you ask me to disprove it in order to justify what i consider observable reality.
I think the burden of definition and proof should be on your part, you are making the argument for something that isn't observable.
And the worst part is that you can't even define what you are talking about.
I'm agnostic, you dumb fucking Moron. Now you are just putting shit on my mouth.
Remember, Atheism is just as much of a Religion and Belief system as all organized Religions in the world are. You are the living proof of it. Moron.
+Btw you can't disprove God, Period. Atheism has never done that.
How is it a religion?
It isn't making any claim about the existence of supernatural beings or metaphysics.
Your thread is cringe
Darwin’s theory has nothing to do with religion. Most religious people accept evolution by natural selection as true, it does not preclude the existence of a god in any way. A god who created the fundamental laws that govern life and evolution and give those things beautiful adaptability and plasticity would be a far more impressive god than one who just made everything in it’s set form.
The big bang theory (which is a really shitty name for how the theory actually works, it was an expansion of space/reality, not an explosion) is also near universally accepted by religious people.
The only reason you see people here deny either is because you get retards that think contrarianism makes them smart, these people used to be edgy atheists when they were teenagers and now that’s too mainstream so they have to find a different way to act retarded. Probably also all the Americans, it’s the only country I’ve ever met an actual creationist in.
I also don't believe in UFOs because there isn't any evidence for their existence, is that a religious view?
Neither i believe in voodoo, do i need to prove that it is bullshit, otherwise my disbelief is a religious view?
Any atheist who criticizes Pascal has not read Pascal
Is having a Belief that everything came out of nothing and that magically a particle exploded because no reason at all, somehow the same particle which we can't even fully observe to the point of its explotion(because why not lol.) through waves and vibration.
If everything was so fucking easy as Atheism is then a Theory of everything would have already been created long ago with no issue at all, Everything is much more Complex than you can even come to think of, or perhaps do you feel capable of achieving that and get the Nobel. I'm sure as hell would root for you if you did so, wouldn't even doubt it for a second.
created the universe through waves and vibration.*
>A god who created the fundamental laws that govern life and evolution and give those things beautiful adaptability and plasticity
Why would god give rise to a process that took billions of years to create humans if he wanted to create humans?
Why are there 100's of billions of stars in this galaxy and 100's of thousands of galaxies in the observable universe if they are inhabited by human, it seems like a waste.
If god the point was human existence then the universe as we know it is pointless.
What's the point of God anyway?
Read Job. Humans aren't the only thing that matters to the transcendent creator of all existence. God is glorified by this wonderful universe with all its complexity and contrast and meaning. To restrict creation locally to humans would be quite limiting to God's omnipotence
Non-fiction literature is still literature.
Ufos/greys are really fairies!
based ignorant-of-philosophy retard
i'll grant that hitchens is fun to listen to, except when he talks about religion. then he's a brainlet of the highest order.
But God isn't an explanation of anything since it means nothing.
And we don't believe such things in the way you think we do, it is an explanation of the world to the best of our knowledge.
But what's the point of God?
>it is an explanation of the world to the best of our knowledge.
God is an explanation of the world to the best of our knowledge.
God is Truth. He exists necessarily. All is the maximization of truth. God is not above logic, or else his existence would be illogical, even to himself. And if God were below logic, then logic would be the cause of God. God IS logic, or truth.
Hm, indeed. Quite.
Meow :3
You can't define the word God thus it means nothing.
And it offers no explanation.
God is the uncaused cause of all existence, the source of all. I believe God's main goal is to understand himself. That is achieved through creation. God isn't God without creation.
God would be more abstract than is generally perceived, the point of god would be as a set of governing principles for the universe, god is effectively the function of mathematics
Start by disproving god
>But God isn't an explanation
I know it isn't. But neither is Atheism. It doesn't solve the Actual questions, provides little to nothing to dig deeper and just keeps you in rigid skepticism mindset.
Christianity is an explanation and a great way of life user. You are on the right path already :)
This doesn't explain why there is god.
Logic are the rules by which we establish what is true, truth is a correct explanation of reality.
I don't see what any of this has to do with this magic being.
I haven’t heard a good argument for atheism besides the problem of evil which only serves to validate Christianity even more. I recommend using a few philosophical razors and seeing that Christianity is truly the simplest and most satisfying explanation for the universe both philosophically and emotionally. Don’t dwell in the misery that is atheism, embrace truth user.
yes its totally christianity and not islam or being a jew or the other 9000 religions
There are two problems, we don't know whether there needs to be a first cause, nothing precludes infinite regression, and there is no reason as to why even if there was a first cause it would be a conscious being.
Christianity is the only religion that says we are saved by faith. Jesus says the truth: no one is good. Sow can works save us? And what other religion is as prophesied like Christianity? DO you actually think any religion is more probable than it?
Yeah we don't KNOW anything, so why bother?
Christianity is the current religion God would have you follow, everything else is either an offshoot of early Judaism or Christianity or demonstrably false. Eastern religions do not assert nearly as much about the universe and therefore might seem like religions on the surface but do not provide a coherent or complete belief system. If you trace the lineage of Christianity you can see how the first religion of early civilization has been nurtured by God to be Christianity that you see today
Which kind of Christianity would that be?
There is only one kind of Christianity and that is your relationship with god and your fellow man
What the Bible says clearly. Do what it says to do, and don't do what it says not to do.
The problem with religion is that religions people tend to fuck with laws.
Anyway of course atheism doesn't offer any final explanation of reality, though this doesn't justify in the slightest any supernatural being.
I don't think that religion has ever helped answering any questions. The only thing that we have is the scientific method and a bunch of hypothesis.
You should just do that regardless of your beliefs.
I mean, as Adam Smith says, acting as a utilitarian is essentially acting from the same moral principles as acting under the impression of God's existence and being grateful to be alive. Your moral 'propriety' is derived from not being too excessive or lacking in any moral virtue such as self-approbation, benevolence, or justice. :3
But it contradicts itself several times
where?
It honestly does not, and you are being a little child about it. :3
Because i can clearly see that people use religion as a way to control people.
It really does not, you are referring to shitty Protestant translations that have eschewed meaning to either support a king or Lutheran theology. This is why priests and the magisterium of the Catholic Church exist. So people don’t fuck with the word of God
The same can be said for science. I don't see devout Christians bemoaning their faith and desiring to be atheists. So why would it matter if they are being "controlled" ?
I worship Azathoth
but lutheranism is the highest iq branch of christianity
Luther was good for the Church in that he motivated the Council of Trent but beyond that it started the Protestant meme snowball effect into I can now morph Christianity to support whatever lifestyle I feel like living
nope lutheranism is better than catholicism
>Eastern religions do not assert nearly as much about the universe
There are many religions with creation myths, and you trying to associate the gods creation of the world myth with the big bang doesn't fit much
Is Rigid Scientism the problem here, being basically a religion and belief itself. I hate religions as much as you do. In fact, I want the destruction of all religions, but that's just me.
>let there be light
Sounds like the Big Bang to me user
>why is there God
>magic being
I honestly don't know how to answer you within your frame of thinking. foremost it isn't a "why" query, either God is or is not. What do you mean by "why".
and then the "magic man" is just icing on the cake. everything you think you know about theology you learned from pop atheists. the anthropomorphic presumption, the "why", the trademark arrogance. there's a reason why everytime Jesus Christ would tell a parable he would end by saying "he who has ears, let him hear." you don't even have an honest, rudimentary understanding of what it is you're refuting
In the beginning (time)
God created the heaven (space)
and the earth (matter)
I’m not here to validate my reasons for being Catholic, I’m just happy to see another Christian in this shitty thread. God be with you Lutheran user
I don't see how the scientific community tries to control people.
People are mind fucked by religion since their childhood ut is expected that a small portion of those who exit it have some attachments to it. There are no kids who were raised atheists who become believers or crave religion.
But there was no light during the big bang
>scientific
>makes unsupported generalizations
>or crave religion
way to completely destroy your credibility
source
Are you fucking retarded? You are the first person I’ve ever seen to have claimed there was no light during the Big Bang.
You seem to require a reason for the existence of the world, but god doesn't need a reason?
Inb4 muh first cause
You could make it simpler by having the universe as the first cause if you want to believe in a first cause
Time always existed, so did space, matter started to aggregate in a much later stage.
how is that simpler? just because there is one less link in the immense causal chain?
It was pretty hot during the big bang though.
And what spontaneously caused this matter to move?
>The universe was continuing to expand, and finally, just a few hundred thousand years after the Big Bang, the universe was finally cool enough for these atoms of hydrogen and helium to attract free electrons, turning them into neutral atoms.
>This was the moment of first light in the universe, between 240,000 and 300,000 years after the Big Bang, known as the Era of Recombination. The first time that photons could rest for a second, attached as electrons to atoms. It was at this point that the universe went from being totally opaque, to transparent.
>There are no kids who were raised atheists who become believers or crave religion.
you gotta know when not to say something in discussions, you chose to advertise your complete lack of world experience instead of saying something substantial about your previous jab at religion, weak as it was. personal beliefs aside you have a lot of growing to do. We all do, but you're wielding convictions that demand more from you than you can give. I've been blessed genuinely by atheists, and I respect any open hearted person who reaches for something true regardless of whether or not we share in our conclusions, but this is just cheap tribalism galvanized by pop-science
Because you would have to explain a being that if he existed would be much more complex than the universe itself as the reason of why the universe exists.
Still corresponds with Genesis. The Bible doesnt say God created light along with the creation (fattening, if you read the original hebrew) of space and matter.
There are various logical proofs for God. Though they may not be adequate, where are the proofs that this universe should exist?
You seem like a non-bigoted user, what is your take on atheism? I’m a firmly held Christian and was previously atheist
I'm sure that if we somehow proved that the theory of multiple universes is correct you would find some pseudo explanation as to why it fits your Bible.
is that supposed to be an argument? Or do you just concede that you are wrong?
Proving Infinity proves God by definition. If we can prove that there is infinite anything there is now empirical evidence for Gods existence
You aren't really making a point and you know it.
Eh the original point was that religions tend to make laws to influence the behavior of non religious people according to their magic beliefs.
Holy shit
How and why does infinity prove the existence of a supernatural conscious being?
backtracking. pathetic
>strong evidence for Gods existence during Roman Empire (God came to earth as the man Jesus and was documented by Roman historians within 30 years of his death)
>Word got out about it
>Society patterned after what God himself said
>user in 2019 calls it oppression because reeee not good enough for meeee
Good grief
it's a fair stance to take. my only beef is when atheists presume that atheism is the default setting and theism is introduced extraneously. I had an atheist phase, I actually believe that there is nothing more helpful to spiritual growth than rejecting it entirely, then revisiting it with maturity and fresh perspective.
everyone is wrestling with their own angel, it isnt helpful to us to be so adversarial with one another. there are atheists who are more morally sound than you and there are Christians more among the most intelligent in the sciences.
>those shitty examples of atheistic principles
>the big bang theory randomly
Fucker.
It's obvious you're the one shitting up the board.
Lmao you faggot some retard in a Muslim country could say the same
The bible is some annoying horseshit part of society.
Most people are normalfaggots and Yea Forums has always hated normalfaggots. Christfaggots are told by preachers they'll go to hell if they don't literally harass and beat jesus (literally beat) into people. Maybe you don't live the South of the USA but it's shitty to be around.
>haha I call man faggot checkmate lmao
Muslims would have a better claim if they had more witnesses besides one guy. You ignore the fact that thousands witnessed Jesus and worshipped him when it was in their better interest not to rebel against the Jewish tradition that would execute them. Try harder next time
Any arguments here or are you just going to cry out emotionally like a child because you don’t like something?
>Christfaggots are told by preachers they'll go to hell if they don't literally harass and beat jesus (literally beat) into people. Maybe you don't live the South of the USA but it's shitty to be around.
>criticizing Christians for acting unchristian
sloppy logic
>Most people are normalfaggots and Yea Forums has always hated normalfaggots.
You have to be 18 to post here.
Now that All of the Atheists are gone I now proclaim this a Christian Thread. What are your favorite works of Christian literature Anons?
Kierkegaard and Simone Weil, based celibate power couple
based, what work of Simone Weil do you recommend I start with?
Gravity and Grace. She can be a bit difficult to read but more than worth it.
Richard Dawkins had three wives and no children, and claims to believe in evolution.
Pastor Anderson has one wife and 10 children, and doesn't care about the nuances of why there were dinosaurs and now there are people.
Will evolution survive?