RECAPS EDITION >Thoughts on the trend of authors including a recap/the-story-so-far section at the beginning of their books in a series? >Do you prefer it or would you rather they worked the important bits from previous books directly into the story narration? >Also, what are you currently reading and how do you feel about it?
Monthly Reading for May: There Are Doors by Gene Wolfe
There has been this thing bothering me lately bros. I know that most fantasy works are considered low culture and non-literature but is that always true? Is there really no merit, no deeper meaning to most fantasy works? I haven't read much fantasy, but I enjoyed Tolkiens work and some of GRRM older books and I think that they are not low culture.
Joshua Gutierrez
Still looking for more fantasy short story collections recs if anyone knows any good ones.
Jayden Sanders
>he needs validation from the snotty faggots on Yea Forums I have bad news for you bro
Christian Allen
3 days left, get hype!
Here's a long ass analysis by some nerd that user posted a couple of threads ago: pastebin.com/cPiyiLHD
Anyone read Doris Lessings: Canopus in Argos series? How is it?
Nicholas Perez
Poul Anderson
Owen Mitchell
>Poul Anderson He looks promising enough but I suppose I'm looking for something with a range of authors to get some different styles and such
Cameron Green
What's some good fantasy and scifi books with unusual or otherwise interesting premises?
Jack Edwards
I doubt GRRM will ever be considered high culture, and I don't think he deserve the label either. While some anti-genre fundamentalists might consider Tolkien low-brow he's generally praised for his prose and style and is considered one of the most accomplished writers of his time. If you're looking for more 'literary' fantasy I'd recommend Mervyn Peake's Gormenghast, The King of Elfland's Daughter by Lord Dunsany and Little, Big by John Crowley. Ignore the retard trying to push the idea that SF&F can't be good and should only be enjoyed for what it is.
Dylan Davis
Why can't you inbred shitstains just read what you like without caring about the literary merit of it? Fucking women.
David Martin
I gotta tell you boys, the Chandrian are the best villains I've read in any fantasy story ever. God I can't wait to see Kvothe take on all seven of them! Book 3 is gonna shake the world's foundations!
Gavin Hall
I agree, this board is full of contrarians and i doubt there are many things people on here actually enjoy. I have a job where i can listen to audiobooks all day and lately im plowing through Abercrombies books. Im loving it, it felt fresh, highly recommended. also try the Ea-cycle by David Zindell, it's the only writer who succesfully brings me Tolkien-vibes. Call it shit-taste or maybe im just easy to please, but i prefer it that way.
>thinking its wrong to do indulgent things Do you cry sex too user. If you want to be more "cultured" or "intellectual" then push yourself to read challenging material Theres nothing wrong with reading for fun, just make sure you do something productive when your not reading
Angel Parker
>Why have the Chandrians in the story at all when you can instead have 1 ENTIRE BOOK OF WILD ELF SEX
That series wasn't okay-ish though, it was horrible and no I'm not bashing it blindly, I've read the books. >The author's ONLY real purpose for setting the story in a post apocalyptic mediaeval world is because he is a hack and he likes to put the MC in impossible situations and bail him out at the last second with ancient technology that miraculously appear at the right time. >For example, nobody knows anything about modern technology in the world but the MC somehow manages to discover the exact location of a hidden nuclear bunker from a fucking book, "convinces" the secure door panel to give him access and arms a fucking nuclear bomb and runs away to just the right distance to watch the explosion. >In another instance when he's about to get his clock cleaned by an invading army, he calls for a parley, pulls out fucking gun that he dug up and shoots the enemy commander in the face and of course the enemy commanders troops all agree to follow him after that. I wish somebody shot me in the face before I had read this shit. >The MC starts off as an evil edgelord teenager that rapes and kills babies, whatever it was cringy at times but at least it's not another do gooder coming off age story, or that's what I thought. Until the author pussies out, haha j/k the MC isn't actually evil he was only acting that way because some wizard fucked with his head, he's actually just edgy and has a heart of gold underneath. It's one of the worst books I've ever read and I would be suspicious of any chart that recommends it.
>What about the rest of the books? Of the ones I'v read and not mentioned previously.. >Emperor's Blades Book 1 was okay but devolved into a convoluted and boring mess in book 2, dropped it after that. I liked the spin off novel though, Skullsworn >Thousand Names Thousand pages of troops moving from point A to point B. Nothing happens till the end. >Shadow of what was lost Shit version of WoT. The original cover was fire though, dunno why used the shit cover on the chart. >Urban Fantasy Urban Fantasy >Ryria Juvenile, convenient-idiot plot trash.
Get rid of these and all the authors I mentioned in my previous post and then the chart wouldn't be so shit albeit it would be a 60% lighter and better for it.
What's shit taste about it? I read books for fun, not because I want to come off as some high brow man of taste. I'll fucking deck anyone who talks shit about reading books for fun.
Cooper Ward
Yeah that made me mad, the second half of book 2 was full of useless shit like hunting common bandits and sucking Felurian's cock. It was a total, absolute waste. Stupid Fatfuss
Ryan Lewis
I liked the first two books in the Red Queen's War, by the Thorn-guy >Not-Norseman and Cowardly MC both get fucked by magic >Norseman ends up with a Norse-themed demon in his head that urges him to be a dickhole (which he handily resists, being a chill guy), while the MC gets a modern Christian angel >book two has them swapping head-mates, and it isn't as good as the first but yeah, it went to shit after that
Charles Thompson
Crap I'm not gonna make it for the monthly reading even though I love Gene Wolfe. Fuck work. Fuck these horrible hours.
Evan Howard
We agree then. There's a time for "high-brow" stuff, i've read my classics and like that too. Just seems like every little thread on here is beset by psueds who can't take pleasure in simple reads. These threads seems nicer though. I remember lurking Yea Forums and seeing a guy ask for fantasy recs, only to be bashed and the only rec he got was for stuff like Homer and Dante. oooh Yea Forums
Reading as a way of self improvement is wasted when you talk about it because it proves what you took away from the experience was self satisfaction and nothing else If your truly reading challenging material to be more cultured keep your mouth shut about it
Ethan Ramirez
I enjoyed the gri in the warded man series. Especially daddy telling daughter dearest that she has to contribute.
Juan Long
>listening to my first audiobook
Why don't they higher multiple narrators this is ridiculous.
Carson Cooper
Typically audiobooks are done by a single guy and submitted to a sort of publisher Theres dedicated groups where they have all the nice doo dads like multiple people voicing and sound effects but generally its just some guy
Brody Green
typically good narrators regardless of genders can voice multiple characters, do different inflecitons and accents. some are fancy and do multiple people for different characters but usually its just one person. most narrators are actually good enough to do multiple genders and you wont notice it. podium for example has a lot of very talented people on their payroll. theres also a lot of solo narrators that actually livestream their recording sessions on twitch or youtube for behind the scenes looks.
Brayden Cooper
I usually give bad recommendations (Homer as babys first book) to people asking for fantasy or sci-fi in outer Yea Forums. It's bad form to post without at least having looked in the catalogue and if they had done that they would have asked in this thread.
Seeing the Kingkiller subreddit just infuriates me, everyone's jerking off to Fatfuss' health and acting like his garbage side projects matter more than his main books. Fucking wankers the whole lot of them, useless sods.
Alexander Hernandez
Jeff Hayes (litrpg only) and Graphic audio uses different people and sound effects.
Mason Hall
Sffg was only around since 2013/2014. Before that you had to ask in outer lit and get shat upon. This general was a god send.
Nathaniel Campbell
Agreed, I spend almost all of my time on Yea Forums in this thread.
Tyler Turner
I sked in the dying thread, and I'll ask in the new: what the hell is gri?
Andrew Clark
>muh shit taste Abercrombie, Sanderson, Butcher, Jordan, Rothfuss, Erikson, Weeks, Gemmell and others that often get shit around here are kinda like McDonald's. Most people that are not pretentious assholes have nothing against enjoying it occasionally but if you spend all your time there and insult everyone who enjoy more elaborate food you will look like a retard.
Cameron Ortiz
GRI (especially R) are the interests of the thinking Man.
Adrian Ramirez
I feel like I missed the age where I could write shitty fiction Is there a wattpad for under performing adults. I dont want to feel like a clown among kids
Wyatt Cooper
It's a seal of approval.
Jaxon Rogers
Royal Road.
Jonathan Cook
The seal of approval used on only the highest of quality works.
How can these two be so based? >Niven and Pournelle advised Ronald Reagan on the creation of the Strategic Defense Initiative antimissile policy, as part of the Citizens' Advisory Council on National Space Policy – as covered in the BBC documentary Pandora's Box by Adam Curtis.[17] The council also convinced Vice President Dan Quayle to support the single-stage-to-orbit concept for a reusable space ship that led to the building of the DC-X.
>In 2007, Niven, in conjunction with a group of science fiction writers known as SIGMA, led by Pournelle, began advising the U.S. Department of Homeland Security as to future trends affecting terror policy and other topics.[18] Among those topics was financial losses for hospitals, which Niven proposed to solve by spreading rumors in Latino communities that organs were being harvested illegally in hospitals.
i've never read any sci-fi and i've got Dune and Foundation, which do i start with?
Aiden Ward
>rumors in Latino communities that organs were being harvested illegally in hospitals. fucking genius
Ethan Mitchell
take erikson off that list
>foundation
don't bother, most scifi published before 1980 is trash, all scifi pre 1960 is
Julian Jackson
Dune obviously. Skip Foundation, the only people who praise that piece of shit series are the ones who have't read it and think it's like Asimov's short stories.
Jayden Morales
Is the Malazan series really worth it ? I've heard that it is a fantasy "masterpiece" but the fact that it is ten books (all of which are 500-700) pages long is kinda overwhelming. The main appeal for me would be the characterisation of the individuals in it. Apparently their meant to have some very introspective moments in them, which is the shit I love in books. Any anons who read them, are they really that good ?
Erikson spent so much time on worldbuilding that he forgot characterization. The worldbuilding is quite impressive however so if you like that you should read the series.
Eli Scott
Read through the first one and then either quit or continue, if you are unsure read the second one and decide after that.
There is no magic rule that you have to read 10 book of a series you don't like, just because you started the first one.
>(all of which are 500-700) pages user, I ...
Adam Bailey
Fuck you faggot, Gemmell isn't McDonald's he's Chick-fil-A at the very least.
Anyone can tell me how FR books are now? I've ended on the Salvatore's The Hunter's Blades Trilogy. Wonder how my fav nyga-elf story ended.
Justin Moore
When you read fantasy how do you rank the following components in terms of relevance to your enjoyment?
Plot World Building Characterization Dialogue Thematic Allegory Page Count Readability
Carson Miller
>There is no magic rule that you have to read 10 book of a series you don't like, just because you started the first one. I know, but I don't want to miss out if the first novel is just world building and the rest have the stuff I want in a series. See, the people telling me its good all stressed how human the characters were. Thanks for the additional insight.
>I know, but I don't want to miss out if the first novel is just world building and the rest have the stuff I want in a series. Then read to the middle (or end) of the second, if that doesn't have what you are looking for, the rest won't either. The first one is already quite representative of the rest though.
Jayden Collins
I read fantasy for fun so Readability Plot Characterization Dialogue World Building
>Thematic Allegory If its not the purpose of the story why should it be rated. Seems out of place with your other categories
Ethan Howard
Dialogue Plot Characters Word building Readability Page count Thematic
Jackson Nguyen
Characterization and dialogue are the only relevant ones for me. I can enjoy pretty much anything as long as i like the characters and how they interact with each other.
Noah Cox
I feel that page count and readability should be least important. Arguably the characters, plot and world building should be the most key aspects to nail. Thematic overtones are nice but you can get them from lots of other genre's outside of fantasy so they aren't really critical either.
Nicholas Scott
plot characterisation world building dialogue thematic allegory readability page count
Sebastian Young
>everyone rating readability low If you trying to convey a certain tone and atmosphere readability is super important, you wouldn't want your readers to feel like reading your book was chore would you? You do write, dont you user?
Carter Reyes
Characterization Dialogue Plot World Building Readability Thematic Allegory Page Count
Asher Lewis
Okay, thanks for the advice.
Isaiah Gomez
Frankly, all the things listed are crucial to a good fantasy novel (perhaps barring thematic allegory) but some like good dialogue are just a product of other aspects such as thought out characterization.
Jason Fisher
>Thoughts on the trend of authors including a recap/the-story-so-far section at the beginning of their books in a series? i love it. extremely helpful when it takes a couple of years or more to bring a book out, because i've usually forgotten what's going on in minor storylines by that point
Jason Davis
they're pretty good but the thing with malazan is that for some reason it draws the most rabid of fanboys who do proclaim it to be a 10/10 masterpiece. it's really highly flawed and badly in need of an editor, but there are some really good parts, usually in the last 100-200 pages.
Carter Torres
1. characters 2. dialogue 3. plot 4. prose 5. world building 6. themes 7. page count
Aiden Thomas
>Thoughts on the trend of authors including a recap/the-story-so-far section at the beginning Waste of paper. Recaps can (almost) always be found online.
Alexander Sullivan
>Children of Earth and Sky I liked it, despite it being a meme. Why am I the worst thing since Stephanie Meyer, /sffg/?
Matthew Gonzalez
Any high fantasy based on pre-medieval societies? Like classical, early civ or even prehistoric
I've been reading a bit of Irish mythology lately and I really love the idea of the Stone of Destiny. A man who is chosen to be king must lay his hand upon it and the stone will roar declaring you king. Just a cool concept desu
Jack Williams
The “Hyborian Age” setting of Conan of Cimmeria is what you might be looking for, user. There’s medieval-ish aspects in the stories that involve Aquilonia, but I like to see it as an Antedeluvian Iron Age. You’ll know when Howard is kowtowing to the editor of Weird Tales with certain stories, because he needs the money that a cover story got.
Hudson Perez
Bumping this, nobody read them?
Aaron Reyes
>new and improved >still the same amount of useless bloat as every other stagnated general ever
>Yea Forums-worthy outer Yea Forums is full of pretentious faggots that dont even read any books. its an incessant circlejerk of holier than thou retards who spout group mentality nonsense all the damn time.
Aiden Lewis
We agree then.
Jace Wilson
To be fair, when I said improved I meant and hoped that you'd left the general and we could finally have a thread without you whinging and moaning about god knows what. But here we are, guess it wasn't improvement after all.
John Miller
Anyone has read leviathan? Any good?
Carson Turner
>Jorg has a heart of gold You are either retarded or we both read different books.
Ayden Walker
pretty excited to discuss this one
Gabriel Brown
Who are the Greeks of fantasy and sci-fi respectively? Who should I read first?
Mervyn Peake and Jack Vance. Ignore the brainlet who said Tolkien.
Angel Morris
>Anyone can tell me how FR books are now? Half dead,Wizards of the Coast only publishes like 2 novels every few years. As for the Drizzt books they have an okay happy ending.but salvatore is already writing a new trilogy. also Zaknafein is brought back to life by jarlaxe
Readability Plot Tgematic Allegory Characterization World Building Page Count Dialogue
You forgot to add descriptive prowess but oh well
Nicholas Jackson
add Prose to this
Landon Evans
What do you guys think of Terry Goodkind?
Dominic Brooks
overall great author. sword of truth was weird with all the bdsm nun bullshit. i think hes a closed masochist or something and projected that into the series. non-the-less a great author, pretty much one of the greats at this point.
Zachary Hill
There's also Imaro by Charles R. Saunders, which is basically sword and sorcery in pre-colonial Africa. It's pretty good for S&S.
Somebody on here was shilling some Egyptian and ancient Greek stuff a while back too but I can't remember the titles. David Drake wrote a fantasy series based off of Sumerian mythology, and co-authored a series where the Romans and Persians team up against evil time traveling cyborgs that've taken over India, but I haven't read either of them.
Thanks for the suggestion user, I’ll look into that.
Brandon Gray
is the wheel of time worth reading?
Gavin Bailey
Pretty good. However his books seemed very formulaic the more of them I read. Also lots of wierd fetish shit.
Jackson Thompson
Lol. You made a thread in outer lit expecting help from people who don't even read? LOL
Jordan Howard
yes
Xavier Turner
I just want some thoughts but nobody seems to have read the damn thing. Going to end up just buying the first one.
Wyatt Lopez
>buying
Evan Richardson
fuck books
Connor Smith
Why the fucks are these threads still allowed? Do the mods do their fucking job? This is a literature board and this thread is not literature, not hard.
Eli Williams
>close down the only place on lit where literature is actually discussed
Logan Cooper
What do you guys think on mark lawrence?
I think he is pretty good, he can make a lot of stuff happen really fast and it doesnt seem that much asspulley or that it came out of nowhere, the build up is good enough and he spares you endless pages of aftermaths.
Though his secondary characters could use some work, they lack agency. Also his endings are meh at best.
Lucas Cox
No
Anthony Rogers
Enjoy the ban pseud, you can come back to the board after a week of not reading to not discuss any literature.
Christopher Fisher
Yeah fucking right, let's have some more thinly veiled /pol/ threads and circlejerk a bit more about some meme books no one actually is stupid enough to read.
Oliver Gonzalez
I've never read any myself but I'm curious; is there a reason why I've never seen Elric or just Moorcock in general recommended?
Jaxon Roberts
Rent-free
Alexander Taylor
No, in fact not. I haven't even thought about outer Yea Forums in a couple of days until you mentioned it.
Dominic Barnes
Should I read Malazan in my own language (portuguese), or am I missing too much?
Kayden Nguyen
I read the first couple of books in German and that translation had some, translation inherent, problems, specifically with character names and such which literally didn't make any sense. In general I try to avoid translations, bit that is just my personal preference. But on the other hand I don't think there is much risk on actually missing out on the actual plot.
Asher Butler
Did any of you read Morwenna by Jo Walton? I saw that people were really divided about this book and I wanted to know Yea Forums's opinion
honestly I liked it
Isaac Evans
Well, I know the plot would be fine. I was asking about the writing or prose, sometimes it loses some of the essence during translation. That might not be a problem if there's nothing to lose in the first place
Adam Gomez
seems like every fantasy book i read has the same cliche plot of a lowly peasant who doesn't know his identity that slowly becomes something huge and crucially important
Noah Carter
I would consider sampling the first few pages and looking how well the translation holds up. Personally, the German translation lost a bit of writing quality, but I have no clue about how well the Portuguese translation holds up.
Samuel Russell
I often attempt to read books in their original languages like i read Malazan in English. The problem with Malazan and my own language however is, that it has never been translated to Finnish and frankly i don't think it can be done. For example, there is no conceivable way to translate the words "ascendant" and "warren" to finnish without them sounding clumsy and stupid.
Michael Reyes
>turning a hoe into housewife Sluts never make good partner / waifu material.
Austin Hall
We should never have made the poors literate
Landon Williams
This, sanderson is a mass market hack who drank the leftist koolaid recently. You can’t watch any of his newer lectures without getting preached to about diversity
That's actually a surprise considering he's Mormon. Reminder that Sanderson removed anything remotely sexual in The Wheel of Time. Interestingly enough, the people that praise Sanderson also like to routinely shit on ASOIAF and Malazan. Which in my opinion are two of the very few series that get Worldbuilding and Characterization right.
Dominic Price
What did you expect from a morm*n
Camden Baker
This is the same Sanderson that doesn't think gays should get married, right? I guess it's possible, in modern society you have to either have to lie or omit any political opinion that isn't far left or white picket conservative if you don't want to be socially executed.
Juan Smith
>who drank the leftist koolaid recently He is being forced by his publishers (the ones who holds his purse strings) to include faggots, disables and queers. If he doesn't comply he could be dropped.
Isaiah Russell
He's already a known name now though which is the biggest part of marketing genre fiction; so what's stopping him from self publishing if that's the case.
Matthew Walker
You seem infinitely butthurt. Maybe you should be less of a whiny little bitch and write something better
Liam Campbell
I'm reading Gardens of the Moon, but the poems at the start of chapters make zero sense to me. Am I just too much of a brainlet?
William Kelly
No. GotM is garbage.
Nathan Brown
Just wait, they’ll start making sense eventually
Parker Powell
I need a break from swords and fantasy, should I read Dune, Hyperion, or The Forever War? Have never read any of them, am pleb
Xavier Martinez
Read all three.
Nathaniel Collins
low iq post
Brody Hernandez
FW but skip the squeals but read starship troopers. also read rendezvous with rama, lucifers hammer, mote in god's eye & moon is a harsh mistress. only read dune if you're also going to read up to and through God emperor
Anthony Williams
Book of the new sun is a great way to shift from fantasy to scifi imo.
Luke Garcia
Retarded and plebshit
Oliver White
I guess the mods did do their jobs.
Elijah Lee
>so what's stopping him from self publishing if that's the case. Breaking a contract and having to give back the millions that he earned.
Henry Moore
Yeah I think I'm going to do FW first since it'll be quick. Thanks for the recs. Thanks lad I'll add it to my list.
Kayden Rodriguez
What are some tolerable/borderline-decent litRPG?
Julian Green
Followed by most of a decade of social media posturing and not writing.
Ascend Online Awaken Online The Divine Dungeon The Gam3 The Stork Tower
All examples of litrpg if you want RPG elements with not completely shit writing and decent stories. There's countless terrible examples if all you want is smut and harems.
Otherland - It's borderline but certainly has many elements of what is now classed as litrpg
Logan Hill
I've looked at some of these before and I have a question, primarily regarding Divine Dungeon. Someone becoming a "dungeon core"... what exactly does that signify in litRPG terminology?
Luis Edwards
Peak autism
John Martin
Read Niven's take on Dante's Inferno, he makes sure to shittalk everyone he disagrees with
Josiah White
A dungeon core is the "mind" of the dungeon that controls how it grows, its design, the creatures and traps inside etc. Usually it's some magic stone that gains partial sentience or comes from the soul of some animal. It's a common litrtg trope and there are several series where some human gets trapped inside a core for "plot reasons" and levels up as a dungeon rather than as a character.
Parker Davis
>levels up as a dungeon rather than as a character That's about what I was looking for. Sounds pretty fuckin' gay.
Cooper Russell
hows forever fantasy online ?
Charles Reyes
No idea, never read it. I haven't read any litRPG for a while as the vast majority was utterly terrible self-publishing at it's worst, it's put me off the whole genre for a while. Those I mentioned are some of the rare exceptions.
Mason Reed
Ringworld had interesting concepts but I thought it was poorly written.
Lucas Brown
>whining about people telling you as a writer what they would like to read
it's important you read them as they often give very important information, like one of the very first poems reveals shit about shadowthrone and cotillion
Henry Stewart
How would you like people telling you how to do your job?
Matthew Perry
>writing the opening chapter for one of my characters >he and a bunch of other priest bros gotta run naked through an ice field carrying palisades >they gotta do holy flexing waist deep in a frozen lake BRUH
In all seriousness, while one should be open to criticism one should never compromise their vision. Readers are swine and publishers are rats. Write your vision at all costs.
Aiden Rogers
He has a point; he's just not getting it across very well. Yes you should write what you, the author, want to write and fans who think you should write what THEY want you to write are the absolute worst, BUT at the end of the day you if your intention is to actually have people read your work then of course you HAVE to write something they'll want to read. He's also completely correct on retarded readers who want more world-building.
Aaron Hernandez
If your goal as a writer is to write for others you are truly a disgusting creature.
Nicholas Butler
Look up Stanislaw Lem's essay "Science Fiction: A hopeless case - with exceptions", it (and PKD thinking that Lem was actually a committee of Polish communists) got him kicked out of the SFWA.
>in the same way as in high society women do not permit themselves to be called 'prostitutes' although they indulge in open promiscuity... Sad to relate, the authors of science-fiction are quite similar in behavior to those 'ladies'
Connor Russell
You are very retarded and should probably die soon.
Josiah Torres
Good post
Isaac Richardson
Is Paradise Lost fantasy? Are the Homer epics fantasy?
Josiah Bailey
No. Historical, fantasy-like, works are generally meant to be at least in part believed, unlike present-day fantasy that is entirely fictitious. For the modern reader the difference is negligible however.
Kayden Russell
Is that red thing negative upvotes?
Hunter Barnes
that user has downvoted MarkLawrence 24 times, so you can tell they are easily ass blasted
Joseph Ortiz
Yes, but not for that post. It's the screenshot user's personal score for up or down voting Mark Lawrence in general.
David Barnes
God, is there a single series out there that doesn't have a shit ending? I swear to god, it's so hard to find anything that even ends DECENTLY. At best you'll have stuff that peaks at the 2nd or 3rd book and it's all downhill from there. Just today I was remembering how I waited for years to read Bakker's shitty Aspect-Emperor and what a fucking ABYSMAL ending that was. Truly A B Y S M AL. I'm starting to wonder if this is just a problem with current writing culture. Like, I was at this workshop the other week, and the guy there was asking me about this fantasy series I'm working on, and why I've stopped. And I tell him I'm not quite sure what the ending will be, so it's impossible to continue without figuring that out first. And his IMMEDIATE kneejerk response was something along the line of "Well, you know, the ending will come to you, just write something, an ending is still an ending." LIKE WHAT THE FUCK? WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT? And apparently this is a super common thing if I go by what I've heard from others and even books on writing. They just give zero fucks about how it ends compared to how it begins, because by then you've already bought the book so fuck you.
Jayden Gonzalez
what crawled up your ass?
Jacob Roberts
Its the journey, not the destination that makes a book.
Jaxson Torres
This is the dumbest fucking thing I've ever heard. Most people's "vision" amounts to nothing but the lamest piece of shit fan service with different names. Essentially a bootleg of a different story with a different ending or character, at best. Like, 0,001% of writers should follow their "vision." You are retarded.
Josiah Sanders
>I write for myself XD Is Reddit down?
Michael White
>because by then you've already bought the book so fuck you. This applies to the beginning and the middle too user, you sound like you're on your period.
Seriously though, just write something. Sure it won't be perfect the first time you write it but what is? You can stew for years thinking about that perfect ending or you can write some crap and tweak and tweak till it resembles something you're comfortable with. Writing a bad ending won't stop you thinking about a better one, if anything it'll give you a head start on the problem.
Zachary Young
Literally not true. It's both. Look at Game of Thrones. Or fucking Dexter. Or the Second-Apocalypse. How many examples do you want? Endings do matter. And if you can't do a good ending - fuck, don't do any ending AT ALL. I would rather the story just STOP than to get some shitty ending that spoils the rest of the story.
Brody Rodriguez
The bad parts dont invalidate the good parts.
Nathaniel Hernandez
>Seriously though, just write something First of all, I've written many things, which is why I know this advice is retarded. I could've followed what others have said and just written "an ending" instead of waiting to figure out the right one, which completed the work. >You can stew for years thinking about that perfect ending or you can write some crap and tweak and tweak till it resembles something you're comfortable with. Except it doesn't take years. Maybe a couple of weeks, but certainly not years, and that's just a shitty hyperbole meant to excuse bad writing. Do you know how many Stephen King books could go from 1/10 garbage to 5/10 decent if he at least GAVE HALF AN HOUR'S THOUGHT to the fucking ending? >Writing a bad ending won't stop you thinking about a better one Just not true either, and I speak from experience here. Writing a bad ending can get you thinking about ways to fix it, until you feel completely bogged down and aren't even sure how far back you want to go and cut back. It's better to just stop, work on something else, and go back once you've figured it out. My problem isn't to do with my writing, my problem is the attitude that endings are somehow the least important part of the novel. Sure, that might be true for getting a new reader, since they'll read the prologue and go on HOPING you aren't going to deliver some poop like Name of the Wind's ending or whatever. But in terms of actual storytelling and the salt of the author, of course the ending is important.
Brandon Ramirez
It's an issue with serial fiction, and has been forever. If none of it is published yet you're better off writing a shit ending you can revise rather than just having nothing.
Lucas Price
Depends. I can pick out a scene from Lost and show you how well done it was. But is everything else invalidated by the bad ending? Yes, it is, because it means they are useless parts. To be honest, there's a reason so many of the most popular stories in history come from an oral tradition. It means they passed through many people before they arrived at the ultimate version, which is exactly what should happen to something like Song of Ice and Fire, but unfortunately copyright laws ruin that.
you have five seconds to name ONE fantasy series with a good ending
Chase Harris
Isn't this the retard that just wrote trite garbage but filled it up with his fetishes? He shouldn't even be allowed to publish on Kindle.
Tyler Foster
A Song of Ice and Fire
Jeremiah Sanders
>palisades I don't think that means what you think it means.
Adam Mitchell
yeah thats what we need, more distilled fantasy that has passed through so many authors that it does nothing original
Brayden Cox
So he mad Lawrence doesn't want to write about the builders?
Carson Ward
>yeah thats what we need, more distilled fantasy that has passed through so many authors that it does nothing original What does this have to do with originality you braindead fucking loser? If the idea isn't original and good to begin with, people won't pick up on it. This is literally a bigger problem in fantasy RIGHT NOW since everyone is writing the same anime tier trash and presenting it as the next big thing even though they're all the same. Kids are being trained to read people like Sanderson and Rothfuss and think it's good. Yeah, I've seen fucking /tg/ greentexts more compelling than anything I've read of either - I think I'll stick to the masses.
Oliver Richardson
Nobody has a better story than Bran the Broken.
Julian Jones
Probably but you can't downvote one post 24 times, you can only do it once. He's downvoted other posts by made by ML in the past, for a net of 24 times, likely he just has a hate boner for him.
Levi Taylor
Authors these days are masochists. They want to deny happy endings as much as possible. They will rub you down with the intro, stroke you with the middle, and walk away before the end. This leaves you hard and thinking of nothing but cumming. Now that you are thinking of nothing but release, they hope that you will go rushing back when their next session of massages (book) comes around, and blueballed, you will give them the benefit of the doubt that they will not leave you climax starved again.
Charles Sanchez
go have sex, youre embarrassing yourself
Blake Collins
Oh. So Tom Doherty owns TOR.
Tyler Cruz
I already did yesterday. This is my sex satisfied brain.
Dominic Morris
Yep, under Macmillan Publishers.
Jose Gutierrez
>rendezvous with rama Absolute kino.
Jacob Lee
(you)
Jeremiah Anderson
I doubt "must contain gays" is included in the contract. If he stops doing t and they don't like it, they're the ones who have to break it off.
Mason Flores
anybody able to run down all these books?
Ryder Kelly
The self-published ones? >Scourge of the Betrayer Decent, nerd thrown into a merc group to write shit about them.
Ryder Nelson
Currently reading Dangerous Visions. Would highly recommend.
Liam Long
I'm sure it's worded under diverse characters. Don't you see all mainstream books recently has at least one literal faggot in the story? A lot of them are female protags who want to carpet munch. When it's lesbian you don't really register, but when it's ass water buggering gays it stands out.
Dominic Murphy
>I'm sure it's worded under diverse characters. No, i can't really imagine a company making a point of including a "diverse characters" clause.
Zachary Rodriguez
Don't listen to He's deep in denial and keeps repeating this unsubstantiated bullshit that Sanderson is only writing fags and trannies into his stories because he's being "forced" to. No single individual possibly with the exception of grum has as much pull as Sanderson does in today's fantasy market, it's laughable to imagine that he's being forced to do anything he doesn't want to. user just can't live with the fact that his favorite anime writer is a fag lover so he keeps creating elaborate theories to explain it away.
Gabriel Scott
What is the Cowboy Bebop of sci fi/fantasy books?
>Group of loner drifters who don't get along with most people >Overall pessimistic view of the world but try to stay upbeat and busy >Go on lots of adventures and meet tons of weirdo's through their line of work
Julian Allen
sanderson doesn't even have fags and trannies in his stories.
In stormlight there is people of different races but that's standard in fantasy, there's one guy who has kind of epileptic fits but that's hardly a nigga in a wheelchair or forced diversity.
I don't think there are any gays or trannies in it either, if there are they are so minor I've managed to miss them all
Isaac Brooks
Black Company probably, although I don't really like it (Cowboy Bebop is GOAT).
Ian Long
Have you gotten to PKD's story yet?
Jaxson Lee
Reading Wheel of Time makes me hate women
Blake Rivera
What a coincidence, reading Wheel of Time made me hate being alive.
Elijah Thompson
Black Company
Brandon Rivera
name one (1) gay character in any sanderson book. And I mean really gay, not just "expresses some feelings to a male friend" gay. The guy is literally against gay mariage bro
Julian Campbell
What a coincidence, i want to die.
John Sanchez
Why do you non readers always open your mouths and out yourselves? Sanderson do not write anime, that's Will Wight. Also if you weren't such a newfag you would have seen the piece from a few years ago where Sanderson got pressure from the queers to be "more inclusive", and ic you actually read you would see that publishers are forcing their authors to put in gay shit, or use a female protag.
Aiden Russell
Looking for SFF recommendations featuring slavery that doesn't feature the slaves revolting or modern views on slavery.
Adrian Rodriguez
If you want fags read Bakker. Basically everyone's a fag, and the only one that isn't is a cuck.
Christopher Lopez
I wish I could experience just how bad WoT really is. All I've heard from people is that it becomes unbearable and it's always used as an example of shitty female characters and purple prose. At the same time, everyone says the first book is great, but I found it pathetic and only got 20% in or so. Is there any epic greentext of WoT I can read?
Just because the MC has superpowers doesn't make it anime you halfwit. Read some sanderson and watch some anime and you'll see how glaring the difference in writing style is.
Connor Miller
The first book isn't very illustrative of the whole thing, much less the starting one fifth, it's just fellowship of the ring lite.
But most people who passionately complain about specific things (like the female characters) actually like the series. The ones who actually think WoT is shit are mostly indifferent.
Seriously though Jordan's widow must be a fucking harpy to have inspired him to come up with most of these bitches.
Tyler Gutierrez
Pretty sure he didn't mean it has anime tropes, you retarded weeb. He just meant it's shallow garbage, which it is. Call it anime or even video game writing (though there are better games and anime than anything Sanderson has written), the point is, it's irredeemable trash and people that read it should be gassed. Though I'd read Mistborn 50 times before I read Name of the Wind again.
Aiden Reyes
Can you please give me some WoT tales? Just awful characters or whatever. And, well, I am not sure I agree with the assessment but I get what you mean. Fellowship started really enjoyably, though, as did A Game of Thrones, or even stuff like Thomas Covenant. WoT was just boring and generic as fuck. Made me feel like it was the book version of one of those Wheel of the Worst movies RLM looks at.
Carter Lewis
Pretty sure he does mean anime tropes and themes. And not writing style like the guy you're replying to suggesting.
Joshua Green
He doesn't have a positive depiction of anything, except maybe rape. Bakker's prose is great, but he's fucking incapable of thinking like a human being or making characters likable. I am pretty sure he has autism. Literal autism.
Isaiah Garcia
>is on Yea Forums >uses words with no clear meaning, just the intention of shitting on stuff just so he can be part of the bandwagon You should rewatch some episodes of Richard and Mortimer instead of posting here.
Eli Thomas
What meaning is unclear to you, you troglodytic cunt? I'm pretty sure when one says VIDEO GAME WRITING the meaning is pretty fucking clear. Maybe you should go kill yourself but kill your retarded mother first for birthing you, dumb kulak.
Jayden James
Akka is a good boy. He just had a hard life. Sorweel did nothing wrong either.
Levi Rodriguez
Yes because obviously the writing in Europa Universalis is exactly the same as in Hellblade which is exactly the same as in Battlefield hang yourself posthaste please. If not for yourself, for the world.
Blake Campbell
>Akka is a good boy How is he a good boy? He betrayed his people because he went full homo for Kellhus. Also >spends his life in solitude instead of trying to do anything >fucks a child he helped raise Nah, bro, he definitely deserved it. Literally the only good person in these books is Proyas, and that's because Proyas is too stupid to know what's what. I kinda liked Maithanet but then Bakker realized he had no idea what to do with him, so, RIP. Not sure why he spends so much time building when he's incapable of spinning any kind of narrative that isn't THEY LEAVE AND GO TO B AND MAYBE STOP AT C ON THE WAY. It's all that he can do. Those chapters in the capital in Aspect-Emperor were fucking PAINFUL.
Matthew Jenkins
>Yes because obviously the writing in Europa Universalis is exactly the same as in Hellblade which is exactly the same as in Battlefield hang yourself posthaste please No, but if you weren't autistic you'd know what it refers to. Unfortunately, you are 100% an autistic nigger. Die.
I don't know about this particular work, but he's probably the most boring person I've ever read otherwise. Though I'm sure he prides himself on that, just like Erikson does on being unable to hold a narrative together, or give the reader the most basic spatial awareness. Good luck.
Jackson Ramirez
No, wait, never mind, this is the wrong guy.
Aiden Edwards
>I'm gonna use vague words and then flee with my tail tucked between my legs when asked to provide some clarifications because I'm a robot incapable of tought Nice conversation we had here lad, glad you widened my horizons.
Jeremiah Stewart
I didn't flee, but yes, you are a retarded nigger that doesn't know what video game and anime writing means. Kys.
Christopher Foster
Because they are buzzwords devoid of meaning. Which coincidentally is exactly why, even were you several times more intelligent than you are, would be unable to define them in the framework you provided. Because you're a retarded cunt interested only in regurgitating pre-fabricated opinion about a popular author because you must hate what is popular as that is the only way you know how to fashion yourself an apparence of personality.
Jayden Hughes
How much money has Sarah Maas made off the back of this image being posted in every /SFFG/ thread?
Owen Brown
>proyas >sold his teacher to the scarlet spires and caused every fuckup Proyas got everything he deserved.
And Akka made the same mistake the unibomber made. He thought if he could just tell the truth in his book, people would rise up against Kellhus. So he spread that shit everywhere. Just people didn’t care.
Camden Ross
World Building Thematic Allegory Plot Characterization Dialogue Readability Page Count
Dominic Thompson
have sex
Dominic Gray
Currently stuck into Philip José Farmer’s story. I’m looking forward to it though
Wyatt Murphy
Literally the whole Scifi New Wave
Christian Ortiz
I probably posted this order because I'm reading the Silmarillion. Does anyone have any other recommendations that fit this preference? I don't know of any other fantasy work that rises to that level of worldbuilding and mythic storytelling. And even though there are plenty of imitations and ripoffs of The Lord of the Rings, I don't know if I can name any that do the same with the Silmarillion.
John Butler
Looking for SFF recommendations featuring slavery that doesn't feature the slaves revolting or modern views on slavery.
Parker Gomez
I only post in this general and a few others on Yea Forums. Rarely does a good banter thread catch my attention.
Thomas Morales
Character Readability Plot World Building Page Count Too much of a STEMfag to appreciate thematic allegory.
Josiah Mitchell
honestly, i dont think he's wrong, at least not entirely. writing is a massive personal undertaking, you do need to know why you're writing and be honest with yourself or you'll waste months or years on something you feel bad about.
for personal reasons, a lot of why im writing is to win some approval so compared to someone who's making a statement im focusing more on story and characters than metaphor
I'm reading it in Spanish and it has some obvious translation mistakes and weird choices (I'm not sure if this is part of Erikson's style but it tends to start sentences with the verb, which is clumsy as hell in Spanish). Still, it is pretty readable if you are not too picky.
Brody Kelly
>slavery that doesn't feature the slaves revolting or modern views on slavery Doesn't exist outside of porn.
Mason Long
Characterization World Building Dialogue Plot Page Count Readability
Thematic allegory i'd rather not have.
Aaron Foster
More like this? Does not have to be Scifi. I like Alan Black's writing style. Basically its humorous adventures with a bit of romance. Especially liked Metal Boxes and Larry Goes to Space.
>there's a head on a pole behind you I'm an actual, real brainlet and this flew right over me. What did Bakker mean by this? Not memeing, I genuinely have no idea what he implied there.
Jeremiah Lopez
its kellhus’s soul backup, tucked away from the Outside, before he merged with Ajokli. Possibly the other head on his belt.
Christopher White
I just unironically heard someone saying how he quit halfway through A Game of Thrones because he didn't like it as much as the show then picked up The Wheel of Time and loved it.
Charles Cruz
make me
Jason Gomez
Drehy and Ranette. Check and mate. I dare you to respond you bitch. I'll fuck you till you love me faggot.
Hunter Walker
I'm reading Tailchaser's Song, lads.
Alexander Ramirez
Good luck.
Jason Fisher
Why do shit writers like Tad Williams always find the best cover artists?
That reminds me, we need a cover thread next, been too long. Get your covers ready boys.
Liam Kelly
no
Noah Russell
Cover art is expensive. Good cover art even more so. So you are more likely find it with the major publishers on authors they want to sell.
John Murphy
Anyone recommend some good sci-fi with benevolent/good A.I.? A bit tired of reading about how evil they always are.
Connor Hughes
What is with this place's hateboner with Neal Stephenson? Snow Crash is better than what i've been led to believe.
Liam Sullivan
I wish to join the celestial sect of wonders
Nicholas Edwards
Snow crash is less than a novel but less than a essay
Thomas Allen
I just finished Hyperion & Fall of Hyperion. I have heard that the next two books of The Cantos are dogshit and that I should avoid them. Is this true?
Snow Crash is a long-form rant against cyberpunk cliche but it never really decides whether to take itself seriously or not so it has a lot of moments of whiplash wherein the emotional impact of something is undermined by the fact that it's just not clear if it's supposed to be an elaborate joke or not. Cryptonomicon is probably the best Stephenson novel.
say what you want about Gibson but at least he knew the philosophical questions he was exploring when he wrote. His short stories are miles better though.
Jack Butler
I'm reading it more like an homage that pokes fun and celebrates at once. Like an admittance of a goofy concept that can still be important and meaningful.
Mason Jackson
The idea that cyberpunk is a 'goofy concept' is something you'd get from watching bad movies and reading derivative shit from after the 90s. The core of the genre is too varied to connect to the cliches that Stephenson is mocking.
Samuel Russell
Not technically fantasy but Arthur Conan Doyle's White Company needs to be recommended here and added to some sort of chart.
Dominic Ward
Characterization Dialogue Readability World Building Plot Page Count Allegory
Christian White
I apparently have no idea what makes for good readability, books that i have found engrossing and interesting are considered by most others to be too dull to read.
Be serious. You know that's not the way /sffg/ works.
Julian Cook
Every concept of genre fiction suspends disbelief and likewise has believable elements. Cyberpunk is no exception.
Logan Carter
Cyberpunk's particular niche is in writing about the time in which it was written, rather than making predictions or hypotheticals about what could be true later on. Believability is more or less irrelevant to its impact.
Charles Sullivan
Yes, they're shit. Imagine the level of quality of the last few pages of Fall of Hyperion but filled out into two books.
Brody Price
Dying Earth
Jeremiah Young
What was the first SF and/or F book you read?
Joshua Wood
Can't find any books by that title.
Anthony Murphy
That's an author
Julian Flores
I know. I was making fun of him.
Nolan Williams
youre so clever
Daniel King
Pic related Read it back when I was around 10 or 11. God tier writing and it has some awesome illustrations and shit too. I'm pretty firm on the stance that this is one of the best gifts to give any child.
If mythology doesn't count then my first strict SF/F book would be Harry Potter.
