Why don’t German autists realise that the Nibelungenlied was critiquing power and identity in the feudal system and...

why don’t German autists realise that the Nibelungenlied was critiquing power and identity in the feudal system and that Siegfried was not truly a hero? I know this seems random, but the Nibelungenlied is a poem that is the exact opposite of nationalistic - it seems retarded that Hitler used it desu~

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Because medieval feudalism would be so vastly superior to service- oriented techno capitalism that we cannot even comprehend that such critique existing.

Could you elaborate OP? I'm interested. I've never read the Nibelungenlied, but I am familiar with Wagners Operas.
I interpreted the Operas as saying that the Gods/spirits were not morally fit to rule, and doomed to fade away as their own corruption brought their demise (Wotan going back on his deal with the Giants, the river nymphs teasing poor Alberich just because they think they are hot shit, Fafner overcome with greed, the Walküre betraying Wotan).
And there is the passing of the torch to a new generation, Mankind, as the Gods time ends.

Of course, The Ring Cycle is Wagners personal adaptation, and reflects his views as a 19th century intellectual. And the original Nibelungenlied is really more of folk stories, no?

How do they compare/contrast?

If only they knew how bad things would become.

>t. A retard who doesn't understand romanticism and its influence on fascist politics

This board honestly full of brainlets who think they're geniuses.

I am a bit tired but i’ll try.

First of all there is the aspect of identity that runs throughout the poem, and this touches upon feudal identity, racial identity and gender. Siegfried in the poem is a highly representative of this theme, he both is an outsider as a prince from a foreign kingdom but also someone who is in a position of power and who is intrinsically part of the political who of the Burgundians; he is torn between being the King of the world of the Nibelungens, and being a servant in the world of the Burgundians - thus the concept of power and hierarchy which is so prevelant in the medieval world becomes uncertain. You could see the theme of the foriegn outsiders and how they fit in the medieval feudal hierarchy with the line that describes kriemhilde fitting him with Arabic clothing, it is interesting that Siegfried is the protagonist for the first half of the poem yet he is also the outsider in the setting and the perspective of the narration moves from a Nibelungen prince who has been accepted in a new society to a Burgundian princess (who became Nibelungen queen) who has been exiled from her one and becomes the queen of a pagan kingdom. You can see a lot of playing between religious and feudal (and in a certain way national) identity in the poem.

This moves to the idea of the difference between ethnicity and morals between cultures, and their relationship with women. Siegfried has a ring that makes him invisible, but this also represents his status of power and his status as an international figure - he is both weak and powerful because he is an outsider that gives him the ability to become invisible. Brunhilde is a foreign queen, in a world of a matriarchy in which she has power as a women (though her virginity gives her this power, her virginity separates her identity from that of other women, her virginity is her ring). Foreigners, with a different cultural view of women travel to Iceland to marry her to Hagen and make her become a part of their culture. She is in a position of power, she demands to make them fight for her hand marriage because in fighting she expresses her power and she knows she will win. The interesting thing is that Siegfried uses the ring to win against her, he cheats because he doesn’t have the cultural standards that she does and that gives him a certain level of power as well as his weakness in being in a foreign nation. When married Brunhild refuses to have sex with Hagen, to retain her virginity and power - so Siegfried uses the ring to rape her. Having lost her virginity she loses her integrity and power, and thus becomes a woman who is a product of the culture and the men around her. This is why when the fact that Siegfried raped her got out, she needed to be revenged not because of her own sake but the Burgundian kingdom could not have a queen who was a ‘slut’. This feud with the death of Siegfried causes a massacre between four kingdoms split into two sides.

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It still goes against everything in the poem, it goes against all the poem’s themes. It like if someone used the Divine Comedy to promote atheism, it’s retarded.
I could go on and on.

Please keep in mind that this isn’t even me looking deep into it, you can read the poem and find these themes in the surface level. It’s ironic that the Nazis used this out of all the poems, especially since it goes against all of the Nazi’s ideals. Siegfried literally rapes a woman and causes a massacre out of blindly following orders for the sake of power for fuck sake. The poem is extremely advanced for its time, definitely worth a read, it’s even relevant today imo.

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>why don’t German autists realise that the Nibelungenlied was critiquing power and identity in the feudal system and that Siegfried was not truly a hero?
Well, Wagner seemed to have realized this. From his incestuous inception, Siegfried is the rebel character tasked with creating a new world order, ending the old reign of the gods. Breaking Wotan's spear (the symbol of the old world, and old contracts) and only managing to kill Fafner and wake Brünnhilde because he's quite literally too stupid to feel fear. He is not courageous because of his virtue but because of his stupidity. At least in Siegfried (the opera) he's a very unlikeable character. Obnoxious, ungrateful, impulsive.
Wagner started writing The Ring while still very much in his anarchist revolutionary phase - he hadn't read Schopenhauer yet. The Ring was to symbolize (and kickstart) his convictions of a new world order based on love (Brünnhilde's sacrifice), not force (Wotan's contracts).

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Is it weird that I started to respect and even like Hagen by the end? Kriemhild seemed like a total ravenous psycho bitch by the finale that even Attila couldn’t handle her shit anymore.

Interesting, I got to see Siegfried in the Royal Opera house and I enjoyed it deeply. I haven’t yet watched gotterdammerung, so I wanted to focus on the poem’s appropriation than the Opera which I also feel is misjudged by the public. All the alt-right types that claim to ‘love Wagner’ would completely sperg out if they watched Das Rheingold.

It’s also far more light-hearted then what people give it credit for.
Kriemhild did become a bitch, but I still fucking hated Hagen’s guts throughout- that fucker deserved to die the most painful death possible.

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