What are your thoughts on Alan Moore? Both his comic work and his literature

>In the modern day he fucking hates comic books
I would make this more specific and say that he hates modern superhero comics. He’s had nice things to say about some modern comics that aren’t capeshit like Saga or The Wicked and the Divine.

yes and i still find myself thinking about this book from time to time even though i didn't like it when i read it

"from hell" is a great comic, and the endnotes are full of excellent books. clued me in to ian sinclair

Morrison is a good comic book writer, Moore is simply a good writer.

Interesting. Why is that though?

Watchmen ended super heroes. Alan Moore doesn't hate super heroes btw, he just thinks they're for children.

Providence is also fantastic, very funny and creepy. Moore gives some great integration of cosmic horror and how it relates to real world horrors (lots of references to the Holocaust). Neonomicon is good as well, have not read The Courtyard.

Recently read From Hell, way better than I expected. Gull is such a good villain, a Victorian Ubermensch psychopath.

Name 1 Grant work that is superior in every way to Watchmen or From Hell.

>and also a lame writer.
>Never read his books.

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this 100%

Moore is a novelist who started with comics. That's why he's better than all the people who started with novels and are now working on comics.

care to elaborate?

They talk about it on the Struggle Session podcast episodes on Watchmen and Providence but I'll try.

Basically, there are now a few novelists or essayists, like Ta-Nehisi Coates, who are trying to 'elevate' comics (it's a cash grab by Disney) by making the plots have some commentary on current events or deep themes. The problem is that while the subject they are addressing is interesting the comics are poorly written. The dialogue is awkward, the stories are unbelievable and the whole thing feels forced.

Stripped of any deeper themes Moore's comics work because on a practical level they are competently made but it is the details that really elevate his comics. He crams in so many references, side-plots, and characterizations that blend seamlessly with the actual story. This raises the quality of the plot tremendously and is something difficult to pull off.

yes, he's great fun. would recommend.

The Invisibles

Wrong

thanks for the effort, m8. i appreciate it.

no u

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imo he's pretty good. I'm not super familiar with his books like Jerusalem but I'd put his comics like Watchmen and From Hell up there with some of the best 20th century literature. Definitely an interesting figure who will only be more appreciated with time.

Jerusalem is a boring wankfest that should never have been published. It is a blemish on an otherwise slightly remarkable career.

>Jerusalem is a boring wankfest
How so?

he hates capeshit, he likes manga and wants more western comics wth similar diverse style

Manga has really surpassed comics. The majority is pedophilia but the bits that shine are truly incredible. The best medium going right now.

Imagine all the shit particles in that gross old beard

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Reminder the Clown Pepe forced meme is discord trannies trying to kill pepe via falseflag by making him cringe-tier

I thought it came from twitter?

it's about a thousand pages too long. self-indulgent garbage.

>he likes manga and wants more western comics wth similar diverse style
Has he talked about manga in an interview or something? Mind giving me a link?

>self-indulgent
plebbit buzzword, opinion discarded

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I like his thoughts about magic and art, but almost everything else he says is retarded.
>"superheroes are white supremacy"

I like his comics, I haven't read his books.

Tbh that’s probably a more reasonable conclusion with the surrounding context. I’ve never heard Moore ever say anything crazy without backing it up with some understandable reasoning.

U got me trump 4ever hahHA altright for life baby! Memes matter!

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He is the most Yea Forums guy in comic books by far, introduced me to Pynchon, way before Yea Forums.

Not that guy but how do you back up the retarded statement that "jewish propaganda from 80 years ago being updated through a jewish media conglomerate is white supremacy" with context

I read Jerusalem 2 a few years ago and I often find myself thinking back on his ideas on the nature of time and the life after death

also it's important to remember you can't counterfeit a cow

Dislike him intensely.

overrated by the clueless.

How's his Divine Comedy translation?

>Q: WE HEAR YOU’RE NOT THAT KEEN ON TECHNOLOGY...
>A: I don’t have an internet connection, or a mobile phone, or a TV signal. I can play [digital] music on the television, or on the computer I suppose, but I don’t. I am pretty much cut off from the 21st century. It’s like culturally I’m trying to establish a kind of sensory deprivation tank for myself, whereby I am receiving no modern signals whatsoever, because I’ve heard that after a while in a sensory deprivation tank you start to hallucinate and have all sorts of strange experiences, so I’m waiting for that to happen.

>Q: HOW DO YOU MANAGE WITHOUT THE INTERNET?
>A: It seems to work. I am pretty much cut off from the majority of the 21st century, but not much escapes me. You hear about everything, because you’re talking to people, you’re absorbing a lot of this information as if by osmosis, just through the pores of your skin. I have said that by embracing the internet in the way that it has done, which was kind of inevitable, society has embarked on a massive experiment without having any idea of the various ways in which those technologies will impact upon us socially, politically and psychologically. So I so think if there’s this huge experiment going on, it’s best that I remain outside the petri dish, as a kind of control, so that we’ll be able to see how badly the rest of you have mutated, by comparing you with me as a kind of baseline.
>>>interview with Alan Moore

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Watchmen is awesome.

Fucking based.

God, I wish that were me...

It could be you. Just turn off your PC and go outside.

some of the images really got me. one that comes to mind in particular was credit cards being called something like future cards because when you used them you were spending your future time

>credit cards being called something like future cards because when you used them you were spending your future time
That shit sucks so bad LMAO

in all forms of entertainment we're getting too much commentary on current events. does no one realize you need to actually be a craftsman to do it well? just because your story has an evil dictator who literally kills trannies named Bonald Blumpf isn't enough to be a worthwhile commentary or entertaining

I'm looking at From Hell right now and it's pretty good, don't know why he had the guy draw so many penises and stuff though

>don't know why he had the guy draw so many penises and stuff though
It will make sense later. Everything in that comic is very deliberate.

Moore also has a fascination with the naked human body, especially flaccid penises. It gives the characters a sense of vulnerability and reminds you of their basic humanity.

Yes I got some of that from the male sun/ phallic symbolism in the obelisk stuff
But did ya really have to show full penetration and a close up of a cumming benis is that really necessary to get the point across

Really like his work. Don’t really like his attitude.

Considering Moore's scripts have entire pages per panel, imagine the detail given to that benis.

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come on alan just make a shitty little drawing to show what you mean just sort of for orientation's sake

How's Promethea?

Or maybe he’s telling you to never read his books, user.

The most based man alive. Period.

Here's a cool short story that Moore wrote: The Bowing Machine
glycon.livejournal.com/7602.html

He has some obscure self drawn comics but usually gets someone to draw for him.

Promethea is THE work by Moore on magic, so if you're interested into that aspect of him, look no further.

>Promethea is THE work by Moore on magic
I think Moore himself considers that to be his essay Fossil Angels.

I was told once that you had to know the context of modern comic works to get that work, any thoughts?

he's scenarist

Doom Patrol

what are some lit manga?

Watchmen is absolutely brilliant. V for Vendetta is aight. Never read Lost Girls but it sounds like a laugh. Don't know anything about his other stuff. Want to read his novel eventually.

Unbelievably based. I want to do the same. But then I wouldn't be posting here with all my best friends. Pic related

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reddit

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I wish I could slurp their feet.

It depends on what you want. What most people think is Yea Forums is not what you find in manga or even Alan Moore's work. Some stuff I like without genre restrictions:

Kokou no Hito
Innocence+Innocence Rouge
Planetes

Genre Crap:
Uzumaki, + Tomei + Hellstar Remina
Golden Kamui
Jin
Berserk
One Punch Man
Mob Psycho 100
It's Not My Fault I'm Not Popular
Hinamatsuri
Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei
Franken Fran
Suboutei Must Be Destroyed
Shishunki Renaissance David-kun

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Doom patrol has a great beginning and a great ending but its middle is an absolute waste.

>I’ve heard that after a while in a sensory deprivation tank you start to hallucinate and have all sorts of strange experiences, so I’m waiting for that to happen.
based

Based.

Not based. Nigger

Holy fucking BASED. How do I go full /MOORE/ mode bros? Seems like this is really the only true path to a peaceful existence in our time. Pretty much every good writer expresses a similar sentiment and I feel like future generations will look back at our rampant internet/media usage like we do at smoking or archaic medical practices.

Watchmen is a masterpiece.

Very few of you have mentioned Providence which is very disappointing

Would you say it's a "masterpiece" for a comic or an all encompassing masterpiece alongside the best literature/music/paintings of the era?

It’s a masterpiece of a graphic novel.

Would you say it's a "masterpiece" for a graphic novel or an all encompassing masterpiece alongside the best literature/music/paintings of the era?

Masterpiece of a graphic novel.

I liked that one Spawn comic book issue this guy wrote for. It depicted Hell. It was a breath of fresh air diverting from the underwhelming material McFarlane cooked up.

hmmmm very interesting

I think that post is clear on what you must NOT do (television, internet, etc.), but as for writing I think his computer is nothing more than a word processor in terms of its usage. I've heard some people say he even just uses Wordpad, but there's no reason not to use LibreOffice instead since the sensibilities are the same.

I've been thinking of doing something very similar as one of my favourite things is to stargaze, but I've noticed my eyesight is getting worse, and while I doubt that my computer-using is entirely responsible I doubt it's helping much.

Yeah his work on Spawn was great. Moore has a habit of writing god tier stories for characters with the depth of a pancake, it really is a gift. Unfortunately it didn't make people step up their game and instead they just started emulating the surface level stuff and just made their stuff edgier/more violent. Kinda reminds me of the DC movies trying to copy what Nolan did with the Dark Knight only it's been going on for decades now with no end in sight.

lol you idiots believe he communicates with his corporate handlers via snail mail?

uhhh, this is a blue board, sir :/

Honk Honkler

>buys anonymous mask but draws on it so people will know it’s him
>realises it’s not enough so lifts mask on tv
Faggots who wear guy faux mask are the worse

>corporate handlers
Do you even know Moore's history?

Yeah, he's a corporate whore that got pimped out so he's a jaded corporate whore now.

*holds up SPQR*

Is the Moore Pill just the Ted Pill but with magic?

Pynchon for Snyder-fags

Franzen is similar.

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It's literally the Pagliacci joke from Watchmen
>tfw Moore is fucking with the memespace again

How the fuck he hates comic books if I just pre-ordered a comic book by him.
Capes aren't the summation of comic books and frankly he doesn't even seem to hate capes as much as he hates the Big Two specifically and intellectual property as a concept.

Your measuring is a bit shit because if we truly abide by it, Uncanny X-Men by Claremont is better than Watchmen in every characteristic you pointed out.
Also, the notion that Ta-Nehisi Coates is trying to elevate comic books or that comic books are trying to elevate themselves by including current day commentary is asinine and at least 40 years too late.

It's slightly cost-prohibitive to get into sadly, all his Avatar work is.

All the people praising this fail to realize Alan Moore only avoids that shit because he has an entire team of people to do it for him.
A very similar artist to him would be Billy Childish, on many levels, and while Billy tried to maintain that posture for as long as he could, he simply doesn't have the money to keep up the illusion. Moore loves to shit on Morrison for being a poser or whatever but he's literally a man who spends a lot of other people's time to LARP as some victorian hoi polloi occultist bard.

I dont get it

I'm about to read pic related, hope I like it

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Moore wants to write pynchonesque comics but he's too hung up about what makes something pynchonesque to truly do it. This isn't speculation by the way, I'm not sure he still does this but Moore loved to namedrop the Pyncher, that's how I got into him in the first place.
The sad truth is for all the praise Moore gets for "uplifting" comics, he's too stuck on his own ways to truly be able to doo it. Very much like Snyder, who tries to provide you these deep and compelling experiences that are just ubermensch punching each other in slow-mo, Moore is just a verbose 70s writer who kinda succeeded in using some neat tricks from literature in his books, but he still relies on a good artist, a good editor and above all, someone else's work.
He's just a very angry version of a big two writer. Usually they throw a fit and drop comics altogether, but out of love, talent or finantial necessity Alan Moore didn't have / want to.

2001 nights

A lot of it is just plain autobiographical and personal struggles he had with a big comic book corporation that sabotaged or stole what he had created. He is not bitter entirely without cause.

What would this "team of people" do? Moore doesn't really ever do anything.

He has agents that deal with publishers. Will Menaker from Chapo Trap House talked about communicating with them when they were getting Jerusalem published in America. He also credits people Neil Gaiman for doing research for him to make From Hell. Not calling him a hack fraud but it's not like he's full Ted K.

Sandman is better than Watchmen, discuss.

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Agents and research partners isn't what I thought you meant. I thought you meant he had people checking e-mails for him and doing his banking.

I'm not the other guy but I imagine there are people who essentially do that for him. His agent probably handles his emails and he probably has an accountant.

I skipped a word, it should have read " a very angry version of typical angry big two writer".
He might be better than someone like Len Wein or Roy Thomas or Don McGregor but he's not THAT much better, he's just much more posh about it.

Mate from what little I know about Moore's personal life, he mostly just hang around his friends from Northampton, goes to the pub with his brother and smokes hash while thinking of fish-rape.
And yet he is a global-reaching author. Do you really think, for example, that for me to buy his indie black & white anthology on the other side of the globe, all he has to do is put his work out there and it'll reach me?
Let me talk to you about a far worse human being than Alan Moore but also a far more competent cartoonist: Dave Sim.
This man published a highly acclaimed comic book series by himself for 30 fucking years and yet I only became aware of him once the internet spread because "being a good artist" means jack shit when it comes to getting your work out there.
Alan Moore himself only pulls his eccentric stunt because shit like 2000AD and the Big Two were there to turn his name into something when he was just a hippie high-school drop out doing sub-Crumb shit in the UK.

How is Dave Sim a "worse human being".
What is it with people feeling the need to know the artist as a precursor to the art almost immediately.

But I actually like Sim's work despite his crazy opinions on females destroying males' souls and his bizarre brand of monotheism.
The man is a cunt, even outside of his crazy beliefs, his whole ordeal with Jeff Smith should show you he's not a very nice guy, not to mention how he was one of the few people in indie comics who could have done something about the Image speculation shit but he said "lol no thats ok" because he didn't have shit to lose since Cerberus already had a loyal and steady public.

Maybe it's just me but I honestly don't think a persons beliefs have any stock in the person's social capacity. Surely it's actions that would clarify that?
I would like to read up about his "females destroying males' souls". Again I honestly can't imagine it being more irksome to society than a loud voice.
>how he was one of the few people in indie comics who could have done something about the Image speculation shit

How is a man bad for not doing something? (Aside from a clear responsibility to do so, like fathering)
As far as I know, self-publishing is somewhat of an individual entrepreneurship? Surely the whole point of it is the creative control and that you have no other board members to consider.

Honestly, you shouldn't even be commenting about Dave Sim, because if you haven't read his weird gender-theory tirade you haven't read Cerberus either, since there are quite a few pages (including at least one that's just a text "being read" by Cerberus in a piece of paper) about his crazy theories.

He promoted self-publishing for the longest while, but once he had his readership, he had no problems letting the Image guys crash and burn the market. He should have done something because there were people (like Groth, who's a cunt but the right one in this situation) there supporting him. Once he got his, he burned those bridges and fucked off to his hut or whatever.
Gerhard, the man who did the background art for close to 2/3rds of Cerberus, has completely dissolved his associations with Sim, he has constantly antagonized people for the pettiest shit (Smith in particular, it's just bafling how two men with such a similar work and outlook about it can quarrell so much, it's almost like indie Moore x Morrison) and the entire industry, including people who couldn't care less about his insane views, have turned their backs on him because the man is just a cunt.
And again, if he was just a cunt, I would kinda be ok, but it definitely took it's toll on his work and it shows.

You're right in sensing that I'm popping my head around the corner and into this "drama".
What happened with Image exactly, are they like the Enron or something of comics?
A sidenote for which I don't mean to really get a point across but to note, the freedom of things.
Isn't it equally sad when people aren't allowed to make art in certain ways because they aren't appealing? I feel like we're losing something here. Who said all comics have to be about completely sane superhero narratives. I don't believe there's hope for a future in comics as an art, I want to believe there is but with the anti-freedom-of-speech shit going on, where people can't read without self-inserting constantly, I'm afraid I'm right. Consumer facing via coercion is horrible, truly.

Honestly mate it just seems like you don't really know about comics, because there are plenty of narratives about insane superheroes, insane regular heroes, insane people and sane superheroes, regular heroes and people.
It's just that the big two kinda blinds us to everything else. I gotta go pick up some weed but once I come back I will try to explain you the whole Image deal (if someone else doesn't in the meantime).

I'm an illustrator, just not in touch with this market, I'll keep the tab open nevertheless, have a good night.

>using a computer at all

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Hm, sort of, but it isn't anything you wouldn't know if you've listened to some of his interview.

Oh, don't take the out of touch with comics as an insult, it's quite frankly the norm. I devote more of my time to comics than literature and yet I still feel much more out of touch with comics than literature.
But here's the (short) story: For a number of reasons (Alan Moore's DC work being one of them, btw), comics suddenly had a boom in popularity in the mid-to-late 80s the likes of which the industry hadn't seen since the Silver age / Marvel boom.
Moore's (and others, of course) work also took capes in a much more gritty direction than previous big two work, while also trying to inject (big two) comic books with literary sensibilities and a more adult vocabulary (I should add that this had already happened in the underground), but since "literary sensibilites" and "adult vocabulary" are hard, the big two focused solely on the "gritty" aspect.
Now, this were the late 80s / early 90s, XTR3M3 ATTITUDE days, so capes begome a cringefest of huge weapons, anatomically cheese and beefcake, just splash page after splash page of peopel punching each other with little to no narrative content.
And you know what happened?
Those comics sold a fucking truckload, the champion being (I think) X-Men #1 with eight million copies being shipped. Now, I'm trying to keep concise, but big two policies made sure the creators to those comics raked in millions of dollars for a single issue, and they realized something: It's not the X-Men that's selling, it's Jim Lee's X-Men that's selling, and they demanded an even bigger paycut. The big two, being the greedy cunts that they are, laughed them off (because honestly, up to this point they could do it), which drove these guys (Jim Lee, Liefeld, McFarlane, etc.) to create their own company, where creators fully owned their shit (unlike Marvel and DC, where the companies own whatever you create) and proved a "third force" could be inserted in the market.
Now, this is the good part. The bad part is:
Those comics were only selling so much because Marvel had all sorts of gimmicks (laminated covers, multiple covers, special numberings and other shit) to suggest "these comics might be worth something in the future", which attracted a bunch of speculators dreaming to get their hands in the next Action Comics #1), and what Image did was double down on those efforts, creating a bubble that quite nearly ruined the american comic industry when it burst, and has dictated a lot of it's behaviors since.

What is Yea Forums's favorite comic?

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superman for all seasons

Oyasumi Punpun is the Infinite Jest of manga - so far.

You should also read Otoyomegatari / A Bride's Story.

If you're genuinely interested in manga, don't stop with 1001 Nights, read the rest of Tezuka's work as well.

>Favorite X
You have to ask per genre or decade

this is a gem.

Or maybe yet he's talking about how he only read his comics and not his books

>david bowie occultist
Someone, tell me more about that

>. He’s had nice things to say about some modern comics that aren’t capeshit like Saga or The Wicked and the Divine.
What comics? What did he say?
>(particularity because of its distinctly "comic"al techniques)
What do you mean? Are you talking about the comic inside the comic?

Very interesting I appreciate you writing this.
It's strange to me that people who are into these frankly lowbrow artforms treat them like highbrow Matisse's etc.
Much like the "toy collectors" who never remove the toys from the box. Sentient capital stockholm syndrome, people aren't allowed to let themselves enjoy something of value for fear of losing what value they already have.
So Image made publishing independent comics so demanding that it proved unfeasible to please the market and make a profit?

Promethea was underrated.

His comics were pretty good. For the most part. Hes a bit snootty and wankery in RL but comic wise hes okay.

His novels are straight shit.

Personally my favourite stuff is his 2000ad works and swamp thing.

Watchmen is okay, but i got into comics post watchmen so the effect wasnt the same as 90s comics changed because of it.

Big dave

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Using WordPad to write plaintext files is really nice if you have it set to wrap to margins.

>Personally my favourite stuff is his 2000ad works and swamp thing.
A fellow man of culture. Try his Lovecraft stuff, Neonomicon and Providence, but read Neonomicon after #12 of Providence if you haven't already.

Shigirui and vagabond

>did ya really have to show full penetration and a close up of a cumming benis is that really necessary to get the point across
POST THIS

>Image speculation shit
Not him what are you talking about?

Maybe read like 5 posts below

i like him. neonomicon gave me a raging bonner

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