My friend is convinced that Brave New World is utopia

My friend is convinced that Brave New World is utopia.

How do I refute him?

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it actually is but you know society and stuff.

If you can't refute him then why do you believe what you believe in the first place?

Human individualism and the hierarchy of sex and power glued to it make it impossible to create such society.
We would need to stop being humans to let such thing work.

>no war
>no hunger
>everybody is happy
>those who aren't happy can go live on an island where they can do what they want
It's a utopia but the whole theme of the book is about how we probably don't want to actually live in a utopia.

He can believe in it without knowing how to express himself.

Is not.

People are drugged, manipulated, brain-washed, enslaved, degenerate and brainless. Your argument is as pathetic and immoral as saying that someone who lives in slavery is happy when he has never known anything different.

>People are drugged, manipulated, brain-washed, enslaved, degenerate and brainless
People are like that in our society as well only they have to suffer through these things instead of using soma to make them fuck off. People want to believe that our world is better because of some some imaginary autonomy or freedom that we have never truly possessed.

>words
I might as well contend that premodern people were wretched, starving, brutish, philistine, and incorrigible. Comparing BNW to slavery doesn't stack up either, given how the majority of slaves throughout history and the present day were and are definitely not having fun.

>People
The only actual people are the Beta class and up. The rest are no different than animals, and that's fine because they weren't robbed of any potential, they were that way from birth.
> degenerate and brainless
Those who seek something greater can find it with virtually no resistance. Bernard and his buddy didn't do anything crazy. One act of inciting a riot (IIRC) was all it took for them to be offered the benefits of having access to forbidden knowledge at a relatively low cost. They transgressions were forgiven and from what I remember they were even allowed the option of going back to society, were they not?

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> People are like that in our society
A PART of our society is like that. And that is the most disgusting and nauseating, is where there are more suicides, sexual abuse, sexual diseases, promiscuity and lack of fertility.

>w the majority of slaves throughout history and the present day were and are definitely not having fun.
The simple fact that the people in the book take drugs shows that they really are not happy. They are not having "fun". It is clear that their suffering is so great that they must brainwash them and subject them to genetic engineering from birth. That's how unhappy they are.

You can't... Just embrace technology.

Unhappiness is a poor way to put it. Life in the Brave New World is full of shallow happiness granted by consumerism, sex, drug use, pretty lights, and exciting media. I find it hard to describe what truly unsettles me about the world, but I think the best way would be this: Rather than individual people acting together of their own will to uplift each other the people of the brave new world are cells in some grand tree, all of which are useful in their own way, all of which are ignorant of what the whole is doing, and none of which are necessary.

They were offered more than that, they were offered an opportunity to become world controllers and follow in Mustapha Mond's footsteps.

Point out that most of the characters, and all of the characters that were examined at any length each had some element of personal individualism that left them discontented with society that they were expected to suppress to conform to something that ultimately wasn't satisfying them.

When the world depicted in the book is better than the one you’re living in, it’s a utopia.
You can’t refute him

>They were offered more than that, they were offered an opportunity to become world controllers and follow in Mustapha Mond's footsteps.
No they weren't.

>Rather than individual people acting together of their own will to uplift each other
Our world isn't any different, at least their society provides some form of alternative.

But most of them are incapable of wanting something more, and that's fine. I wouldn't pity my cat for not being able to read with me. Those that do want something more can go to the island.

Why is the person in the OP a nigger? Weren't there no blacks in BNW?

It hurts my soul to see such hatred, you should be ashamed of yourself for not embracing the collective soul of humanity user.

Maybe they weren't, but Helmholtz was. His Mustapha directly compared his path into the WC training program to Helmholtz's path into his office, and stated Helmholtz could make the same sacrifices he did for happiness, and after Helmholtz requested to go to a harsh climate Mustapha said he did have regrets about leaving science behind.

>very nearly what's going to happen to you young men. I was on the point of being sent to an island.

Helmholz and Bernard weren't offered a choice but Mustafa Mond was.

Tell him that utilitarians are a cancer on society.

Helmhonz was, not explicitly, but he was given a choice of where to go, he chose a harsh climate and to follow his newfound sense of aesthetics. Mustapha offered Helmhonz his own past pursuits, as he offered Johnathan civilization.

>Mustapha offered Helmhonz his own past pursuits, as he offered Johnathan civilization.
No he fucking didn't. He just asked Helmholz where he wanted to retire and got a little wistful over his own decision to leave science behind.

>Write a book about the world we live in except the only difference is one guy that stubbed his toe last week in the real world instead found penny on the ground in the book
>label it a utopian fiction

Houellebecq argued that was the case somewhere in Atomized. Fairly convincing as I recall. It's worth noting that a lot of intellectuals back then were openly sceptical of democracy, and that the naive scientism of that time was even worse than today.

Tell him that hedonism is an absolute shit-tier philosophy

When will soma hit current society?