Do I actually need to start with them?
I'm interested in deepening my knowledge of western canon, but wouldn't reading modern interpretations be more effective than reading dusty 2500 year old dialogues?
The Greeks
Angel James
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Jack Powell
Not if you want to form you own opinions.
Nathaniel Hill
The canon is so vast that, realistically, you will not see it all in your life time. The Greeks are a worthwhile investment as they are seen as a genesis point for western literature and philosophy, but it is a time consuming one nonetheless. There is no shame in reading summaries to get a quick grasp on their contribution. Life is short, so place your particular areas of interest ahead of a foundational approach unless your ambitions are of a scholarly variety (like my own). Also remember that the works of the canon, and art in general are not of a consume and forget variety. If you are a good reader and an astute mind every work you read will be part of a lifelong dialogue that will nourish your spirit in ways that I cannot convey with sufficient accuracy.
Evan Wood
The Greeks are not as boring as you think.
Read Homer, Herodotus, Thucydides and Plato at least
Ethan Green
>Do I actually need to start with them?
Yes
Matthew Watson
You can read the major works very quickly. You don't need to devote the next 10 years to reading and researching the entirety of what remains. Just read things like the Iliad and Odyssey, the three major tragedians, Aristophanes, some of the lyric poetry, and Thucydides.
Jason Anderson
>no xenophon
Evan Thomas
>every work you read will be part of a lifelong dialogue that will nourish your spirit in ways that I cannot convey with sufficient accuracy.
I've felt this way since learning more about mythology and the hero's journey, so I kind of get what you mean. Thanks for your input.
Easton Wilson
You at the very least need to read homer. It covers pillars of western civilization including honor, divine rights bestowed on every man, duty to ones family and king, and the treatment of guests
Liam Gomez
He would have been next on the list but I didn't want to overwhelm OP.
Aechylus, sophocles, euripides and Aristophanes would be after xenophon
Matthew Russell
yes the greeks are the best
Christopher Williams
This is now a greeks thread
Anthony Reed
did they actually meet?
Blake Collins
yea diogenes told alexander to fuck off because he was blocking the sunlight
Bentley Thomas
What about the romans?
Thomas Ross
Virgil, Ovid, and Seneca are required.
Landon Reyes
What do you mean, "actually"? There is only secondary evidence for Alexander and no evidence at all that the person named "Diogenes" described by the Stoics and Cynics ever lived. This is history, not science. If you want something to have happened, you'll find a way to make yourself believe it did.
Ryan Torres
>Greeks are not as boring as you think.
>Recommend Herodoto.
Fuck you user.
Leo Stewart
You make it sound like “yea they can be nice”.
The entire western tradition isn’t just founded on the Greeks, it is constantly in dialogue with them, and advancements passed them in most fields are slight, if at all.
You can start with fewer Greeks, or start with some Greeks and some others at the same time, but you should always start with the Greeks.
Cooper Harris
this is always good
man must re-start with the Greeks
James Edwards
Sebastian Evans
>Guide to read Greek Teather
1. To read Teather, not just Greek Teather, remember to never believe what characters say. NEVER. You must focus on what the characters DO. These actions will lead us to the theme, and there is where shit gets real.
2. Teather is harder to read than novels. Why? Because you need to imagine half of the things all the time... you musn't forget that everytime a character talks, the other characters are reacting. That's what you must imagine to understand everything.
3. Excepting Melodramas, plot isn't important. That's to say, spoilers are harmless. It's all about your reaction as a public (or lector) to the precise actions of our characters to reach some unconscious goal.
4. Aeschylus and Sophocles are God-thier. Euripides, against popular belief, didn't write any Tragedy... he wrote Serious Melodramas (Hecuba, The Troyan Woman), Happy Ending Comedies (Iphigenia in Aulis, Iphigenia among the Taurians) and Didactic Plays (Ciclops, Children of Heracles). A master, but in its own field.
5. Be sure to research and to delve about Greek Mythology to fully understand some plot points about these plays. The THEME doesn't need cultural knowledge to shine, that's why Greek Teather is a classic. These THEMES are archetypical human soul's truth. Just be honest with youself to get there.
Andrew Cox
>teather
took me a minute to figure out what the fuck you guys were saying
good post tho still
Jack Jenkins
This, OP.
The Wikipedia page for ‘The Euthyphro Dilemma’ ought to show illustrate this for you quite clearly.
Brayden Wilson
Plato is great
Wyatt James
Yes. You begin at the beginning.
Anthony Rogers
>Herodotus
>Boring
Michael Green
Oh! I forgot something important.
6. We don't have bad plays from Aeschylus or Sophocles. Thank God time erased all their bad plays. However, we have two SHIT PLAYS by Euripides: Herakles (the equivalent to a Tommy Wiseau film or a non-sense Jojo fight in Greek Teather) and The Phoenician Woman (snooze fest at its top).
Cooper Long
thanks again for your helpful pointers.
>Thank God time erased all their bad plays.
can you elaborate on this? i feel like the loss of those plays is a catastrophe! wouldn't even bad Aeschylus still be Aeschylus?
Robert Robinson
Agreed.
I mean let’s all be honest if he thought a book about leaders consulting the oracles at Delphi for political decisions, the unbelievable descriptions of giants/cyclops/wolfmen tribes and the warrior women of the Massegetai were boring, then he might as well not even get into Greek philosophy.
He’s probably the type who’d read the Tragedy of Socrates and The Republic and ignore everything else
Ethan Campbell
Your welcome. I didn't really know about Greek Philosophy... other anons could help you with that... but I surely do know about Greek Teather, and of course I love it.
>catastrophe
I believe Sophocles wrote +100 plays. We only got 7. Why the rest didn't survive? I think because it wasn't worth the effort to hand-copy those texts ("fuck it, I'll just copy the good ones, my hand is tired").
We have 19 Euripides plays... and not all of them are really that good. Just like I said, 2 of those 19 are utter shit.
Now... think about Shakespeare. We have...uhm... like 36 of his plays. Almost 1/3 of them aren't good. However, the other 2/3 are GOD-THIER... timeless classics to humans in 2000 years.
Jacob Mitchell
The only bad play by Shakespeare is Comedy of Errors.
Thomas Cox
>Henry VIII is SHIT.
>Measure for Measure is SHIT.
However, Romeo and Juliet, Julius Caesar, Tito Andronicus, Macbeth, Hamlet, Otello, King Lear and The Taming of the Shrew are CLASSICS.
Adrian Fisher
thanks for sharing your enthusiasm theater-user
Grayson Perez
>Seneca
UTTER SHIT, just like Terence.