What books about being more authentic with other people and with oneself ? I'm tired of being a chameleon and wandering through people. I am plastic and all defense.
I know that one's should stop caring about what other people feel or think but I've been afraid of rejection since childhood despite my introverted and private nature.
I now want to live for myself. I'm missing out on life like mad.
At first the thread was supposed to ask about Mark Manson's book about women.
I think you're being genuine, OP, because you are soliciting ideas from strangers on how to be more authentic. We can't tell you how to be authentic, except to say that, when deciding what to do with yourself on a day-to-day basis, you should reach higher in your reasoning than "how will it look?". We all fall for that trap to some extent, so I guess the goal is to minimize it. As long as you aren't a brain-dead hermit, you will have encountered things for which you have an intrinsic interest; things which stimulate your intellect and give you pleasure. These are the things you should explore. But be careful: lots of people "discover" realms or hobbies that they initially are inspired by and they go all in on the consumerist aspect of it before really recognizing the value of the pursuit. An example: say I hear a song from the 1950s and really like it. It leads me to explore more music from the genre, and then to explore more genres. Next thing I know, I'm a music snob who says at parties, unironically, "music hasn't been good since the '50s." Don't do that. Try, instead, to just explore and enjoy your interests in a modest and honest fashion.
A good exercise is to see how deep into an interest or hobby you can go before buying things related to it. That is, how much of the hobby can you explore before you feel it is NECESSARY to buy something. With the music example, with youtube and wikipedia, you can go a long, long way before having to buy something. Buying something physical serves the function of SHOWING others that this is one of your interests.
Being and Time helped me a lot
>”you should reach higher in your reasoning than "how will it look?”
You touched on a key issue here. How do I stop being so insecure w myself and become more expressive.
In the past I’ve been extremely extroverted so I know I can do it. Really popular in school and all but now I’m completely insular..
Do I have to force myself to participate? Because not participating feels somewhat awful and I feel like I’m missing out on so many experiences I could be having.
I’m just like you, OP. Sad thing for me is that I’m 32 already, and you must be what...19-22?
Steppenwolf helped me a lot with a similar struggle
In particular the way that the protag comes to realise that his sense of self is robust enough to survive proximity to others and come out unscathed
I used to think a lot about this stuff but I'm starting to wonder if it isn't just a minor form of self-obsessed neurotic narcissism. Maybe you should spend less time in your head and more time in the world to feel better. Seems like rumination about one's self almost always leads down a spiral of uncertainty.
So what reasons might be "higher" than merely making a certain impression?
-exploring or articulating truth
-curating an understanding of art
-improving society through politics
...what are some things that YOU think are higher than mere image?
The fact is that a person could, theoretically, create an entire life and personality around *appearing* cool and intelligent and successful shouldn't discourage you, because I think those people still must maintain a private existence that is built on their intrinsic interests.
It's never too late to become who you want to be. Just an FYI, if "becoming" someone relies on purchasing or wearing certain things, it's probably a hollow pursuit.
I'm in a similar situation op . Been thinking about it a lot recently. I think a lot of it comes down to just being honest. We try to get inside the other person's head to puzzle out how we can adapt our behavior to elicit a positive reaction. Being genuine is just honestly expressing what you think and feel without really trying to overanalyze your audience to create a filter for yourself.
Not OP but I'm thinking of becoming a photographer .. does buying a camera make it a hollow pursuit ?
Realize that everytime you have been popular with people is when you have been unapologetic. Don't conform to other people that have no power over you.
That's why I asked to see how far you can go before you MUST buy something. That's not to say that hobbies which require a purchase early on are to be dismissed, but rather that our inclination when initially exploring a hobby tends towards purchasing symbols and relics which might tell others of our newfound hobby, rather than facilitate the hobby itself. Photography requires equipment to pursue it, whereas enjoying a certain genre of music doesn't, at least not right away. That was the point I was making...to avoid purchasing things in order to show others what your interests are.
That makes sense. Thank you.
I suspect you won't make much progress without figuring out more about how you feel. I didn't, with somewhat similar issues. I'm a perfectionist who hates myself for not being perfect, and hence expects everyone else to hate me if they find out I'm not perfect. Which is obviously absurd on several levels, which is probably why it took me a long time (including some with a therapist) to work out.
I doubt you'll stop being afraid of rejection until you work out why you're afraid of it.
Do you own a smartphone or other device with a camera?
>which is probably why it took me a long time (including some with a therapist) to work out.
What was the hardest to realize?
That perfectionism was the "root" issue. At least so far as I've found. So for instance trying things like meditation or exercise to relax didn't help me because the reason I was getting anxious all the time was still there. And having "failed" meditation and exercise my perfectionism made me feel worse.
But I don't know if that's helpful for anyone else to know. I expect that sort of blind spot is more personal, so whatever you struggle to "get" might be different.
I think my issues are very similar to what you describe. Have you found any ways to combat your perfectionism?
I'm asking because I've figured out it might be impossible to do anything about it, so I might as well channel it 100% into my work (painter) and at least get something out of this life this way.
Neurotical perfectionist with an unwarranted superiority complex towards everything and everyone here, seconding this question.
Does this superiority complex always manifest itself in feelings of superiority?
I'm asking because I find myself swinging between feeling like the dumbest, most pathetic person in the room and the other extreme. But even then, there's lots of compassion. Do you feel compassion, or is it just 100% superiority all the time?
Not him but you just described me exactly
OP here, I have always been a somewhat creative person with all that is visual. I may not be extremely talented but drawing has been a major thing in my childhood, a practice I gave up during my teenage years and returned in my late teens/early adulthood. I am able to produce decent works, I needed to pursue that more but I am simply too lazy and cynical to be truly passionate about it. I could talk about comic art, or a piece I enjoy, but I lack heart in my practice. I don't really believe in myself I suppose, I just hide behind a wall of shit and then wonder why I'm lonely.
I have an hard time identifying my own feelings. I know when I'm angry but it will not always be a good reason to be. And when I have to emote, I simply don't want to.
I'm afraid of rejection because I'm afraid of being too flawed and undesirable.
I want to be "desired" and liked. I want women to look at me with something else than "he's a puppy" or contempt in their eyes, I want people to listen to what I have to say and to ask about me.
I want to have the luxury to pick my relationships. And maybe it's time to stop having this constantly in the back of my head and to start living.
hey OP, in case you're thinking about exploring the world and discovering yourself, here's a mindmap that could help you. I forgot to add some changes I've made since then, like adding travel to pedestrian, replace opinions with blogs & editorials to be a more effective medium, etc.
I know that if you're not careful, you can become a living meme who consumes for the sake of consumption instead of meaningfully engaging with a medium of expression. but we are defined in part by what we take an interest in, and there's nothing wrong with that. if you're in a rut, this can help.
keep in mind, hobbies are both something you consume and something that can be productive. but I don't think it's possible to make a nice mindmap for that. definitely try exploring hobbies too. maybe even doing some charity work.
having high standards doesn't mean you have a superiority complex. however, you should treat other people better, including yourself.
learn to control it. perfectionism isn't a bad thing in controlled doses. also, discomfort, a lack of flexibility, and/or an insecurity is often masked by perfectionism.
be a perfectionist when it comes to painting. feel the need to perfect every little detail. that's how you push the envelope and grow as a painter. don't feel the need to scrap something because it doesn't turn out the way you want, or that you can only paint at absolutely the best time possible. that's where neuroticism masquerades itself as "perfectionism" and begins to work against you.
>Does this superiority complex always manifest itself in feelings of superiority?
Absolutely not. In fact, since I can't live up to my incredibly high standards, it manifest itself as pathological self discontent.
>But even then, there's lots of compassion.
Yes, this too. I used to have a kind of cold hearted disdain for other people but as I grew older I began to empathize with my family first (which I had hated till that point) then with other people in general. I started emphasizing with others for every little thing, and developed a sort of feeling of kinhood with every human being because of our shared condition as fallible beings of flesh and nerves.
Maybe it would be better if you counted yourself lucky for having discovered an interest or passion that has intrinsic value for you. Most people float through life defined by the things they own and the mind-numbing work they do. They try to forge identities out of things that require no talent or creativity. If you have some degree of talent for drawing, I would put in a little effort every day towards curating that talent and improving it. That doesn't mean you start wearing a beret and grow a pencil moustache. It means you draw, read about other drawers, look at the work of other drawers, and research techniques for improving your drawing.
I think you'll be pleasantly surprised at how fulfilling it can be to pursue and slowly recognize improvements in such a craft. The rest of us who simply show up for work, toil, go home, stare at a screen, and then pass out...we don't find fulfillment in that; nor do we find fulfillment in showing people our new car or our new clothes or some expensive, material product meant to symbolize our "interests." It's all just going through the motions. In conclusion: if you're lucky enough to recognize an intrinsic interest, pursue it.
I actually fucking like the idea of this mind map. That's actually something worth pursuing.
I wanted to give myself a couple hours of drawing this evening. I tend to get tired quickly, but I will go for more. I suspect my lack of belief also come from comparing myself with others. I will never be the Chad, the extraverted popular good guy or the assertive entrepreneur. At least not in essence.
Not him but
What if my problem is that i have too many interests & not enough time, and I don't commit to one because I'm afraid of picking the "wrong" one?
>I'm afraid of picking the "wrong" one?
no such thing. the only "wrong" pursuit is the one that doesn't satisfy you. and you will never know until you give something a good, honest try.
Sorry, I fucked off for a while.
Being aware of it has helped me focus attention away and sperg about it less. But I have a long way to go before I'm a functional person rather than a shitposting NEET.
One idea I've read is to focus on redefining success. If your aspiration is painting then your goal shouldn't be "become a brilliant (perfect) painter" but "practise painting regularly". I'm trying to write every day, even if it's only a paragraph and shit.
I suspect you aren't lazy, just afraid of being bad, and painfully aware that practise involves being bad. Beating yourself up about all the work you're doing isn't a sign you lack passion, but that you care so much you're afraid to get shit wrong. Which is still counter-productive, but for a different reason.
I know exactly what you are talking about.
What's worse, picking the wrong one, or not picking anything at all, spending day upon day wondering which one should you pick?
The first option gives you a path, a certainty, even if for a little while. And when you discover that you picked wrong and start something else, you will not begin from nothing, the experience from whatever you gave up on will still be there and might help you more than you think.
>I wanted to give myself a couple hours of drawing this evening
This is your perfectionist "all or nothing" thinking. You need enough time to practise "properly". Forget that. Commit to doing something every day. Two minutes sketching something. Keep going if you feel it, but tell yourself that's a success because you're making progress.
The thing about Chads: they have the same types of problems that you have, except the things they long for tend to be less valuable and less fulfilling than the things you long for. Whereas you might resent being unfit or not swimming in pussy, the true source of your fulfillment lies elsewhere, in more valuable things. The Chads typically don't. They simply pursue pussy and popularity and that's the end of the story. No fulfillment, just lust, hedonism, status symbols, and sexual pleasures (which are by nature very tentative). If it's something you genuinely enjoy, put in the "suffering" to improve at it. The principle that always stuck out in my mind was this: We all have to suffer anyway, so it might as well be in the direction of achieving something worthwhile.
There is no "picking" one and not the other. Life, despite being short in retrospect, is not very long in reality. The way we experience it, it is drawn-out and steadily-paced, divided by hours, days, months, years, and periods of evolution in our maturity. If you start down a course that isn't right, you can change it. Exploring your youthful passion (say, poetry) and then finding that it doesn't work for you, you can pursue something completely different, having now been enriched by your pursuit of poetry in your youth. The things you decide to abandon still contribute to what you ultimately end up pursuing. Except "ultimate" is misleading, because there is no final choice that is irreversible. There is just "the path." And if you can fill it with some variety, curiosity, creativity, and human relationships, you'll be a rich person. Sounds trite, but that's been my experience.
It's just that I'm getting older , energy levels are getting lower.. and when I look at people who are notable in some area they of course have devoted tons of time into perfecting their craft . I feel like I'm running out of time and need to choose correctly... But you guys are right, choosing nothing is as bad or worse than choosing "wrong".
First of all, you do not need to look at people who are notable in some area before you even start your path, because it will only hurt and overwhelm you. Then again, there have been many notable people who started late, one example being Van Gogh, who started painting at age 28.
Reading about van Gogh is actually very inspiring. Thanks.
>I actually fucking like the idea of this mind map. That's actually something worth pursuing.
I'm glad that you found it helpful for brainstorming what to do next. Sometimes, I think people focus too much on what we could be doing to "produce" while forgetting that what we "consume", for the lack of better words, can have a tremendous impact on our mood, outlook, and identity.
Granted, defining yourself solely by what you consume is a one-way track to becoming a slave to some corporate marketing scheme, but carefully analyzing what you expose yourself to can be a major help in orienting your life in a more wholesome direction. Garbage in, garbage out, as they say.
You want to have a more conscious handle on how humans communicate shared beliefs, experiences, and ideas that reflect upon their identities? You want to escape ruts and push the limits of your thinking? I think my mindmap is a good way to start, if you rigorously investigate each category.
That being said... I can't think of a better word for "preferences". Tastes? Commodities? Maybe "aesthetics" in a general sense? Christ, all of this sounds culture industry as fuck. But it needs to be talked about!
I'm glad I could help. Also, for those mentioning drawing and art, I'm a painting student and would be glad to offer any beginner advice or provide helpful books.
Your just have to realise there's a lot to life and others are better at you in different ways. You are not great. For instance, Kylie Jenner is a billionaire and you are poor.
I 'd say what I consume is in adequation with my own person.
I don't see myself impatiently waiting for the next Star Wars movie or watching shit Anime every evening. I don't really consume uplifting things.
>the next Star Wars movie or watching shit Anime every evening
In case I wasn't clear enough, I don't mean becoming another mindless drone that watches capeshit and buys collector's edition items like a well-behaved wagecuck.
>I don't really consume uplifting things.
This is the more important point.
Also, what about things that challenge your assumptions in a meaningful, honest way? Are you trying to find new favorites? Do you even know what you like and why? If you were to have a conversation with acquaintances or good friends about what you like, what would you bring up and why? What does it say about the kind of person you are? How do they affect the way you see yourself, the way you daydream, the way you imagine the future to be?
I'm known for not enjoying things and being in the moment. I don't know what content would challenge me about that. It's related to my own truth.
I don't see the point in challenging myself in things I am already sure of. Very recently I started dwelling in old school cinema (watched a Bergman and a Bresson movie), those contemplative movies suit me. They are not bleak or depressive (except maybe Pickpocket which was basically a retelling of C&P) but I find value in it. I suppose I enjoy my own melancholy in a way.
They help me pick up more genuine patterns and serve as "lessons". I even watched Bruce Lee movies and Westerns to pick up masculine motifs. What I consume is there to bring myself to how I see myself. I am probably a self-fulfilling prophecy.
As a kid I was a big fan of Spiderman (still am, as retarded as it is) and oddly I bear similarities with the character. I don't recall relating to him as a young age, I was too young for that. I never understood why I liked the character in the first place.
This behavior is still present in my reading. Currently reading the Idiot after having read C&P and Notes from the Underground and I saw the hardships of Raskolnikov and the Underground guy as warnings. This kind of books also help me with people understanding and how some personalities have a specific role for another personality (character archetypes). I like to systemize people,in a way.
Philosophy was about challenging myself and learning what is true. Still with a hidden agenda of applying it to people. As I say to them, listen to me but don't do what I do.
I second this, but would add Nietzsche. Don't just read Wikipedia though, you have to understand that these authors are trying to write personally, a lot of that feeling can get lost in dry academic takes on Heidegger and Nietzsche