In the future, will Virtual Novels be considered to have the same literary value as classic fiction?

Maybe OP can't do it but I can. I just need to convince one of my artist friends to do the art for me and one of my music friends to do the music and it's free. I think this medium has a fuckton of potential and no one has capitalized on it. You fucks should try too.

I'd honestly like to try writing one, but I don't know anyone that could help me with it. I am a musician and could create the music but I couldn't create the art for it.

Soukou Akki Muramasa, this visual novel is a masterpiece.

It's always the untranslated games that are "masterpieces." I remember people used to say the same shit about Subahibi and Dies Irae and whatever else. And once they get translated and you can actually read them, they're really good, but they aren't these incredible masterpieces that they're hyped up to be.

Of course the prose is horrible, unless you read it in Japanese. English translation are shit, because they're fan translation by people who barely speak Japanese and never wrote a book in their life.

You can always try to learn user. I'm guessing you're not a child so you'll probably never be a god tier artist, but you don't have to be. If you can make interesting art, even if not perfect or even "good" in any technical sense, then you can still create something great. Think of stuff like "It's Such a Beautiful Day" by Don Herzfeldt.

This is the other thing people say. The games are masterpieces, but you just can't see it because you're reading it in English. This is bullshit. There are plenty of VNs that have decent translations. And if the work is truly a *literary masterpiece*, this should shine through even with a mediocre translation. But it doesn't. Even with games that actually have subpar translations, you can still get enough of the substance of the work to understand its quality, e.g. Cross Channel.
>and never wrote a book in their life.
And most VN writers have? Most are amateurs that have only written video game scenarios. What a joke.

All the prose is lost, translation are always by fan who can't write correctly. And Soukou Akki Muramasa is different, it has a very different prose from what I usually read, abd even the display is completely different.
Subahibi is nice, but yes unless there is a real translator for visual novels, the translation will always make the game not bad but not excellent.

>All the prose is lost, translation are always by fan who can't write correctly.
You're simply wrong. There are translations that are perfectly fine. A small error here or there doesn't ruin it and you get the same thing in professional translations of novels.
>And Soukou Akki Muramasa is different, it has a very different prose from what I usually read, abd even the display is completely different.
Wow the text box is vertical! It's a masterpiece!!!
>Subahibi is nice, but yes unless there is a real translator for visual novels, the translation will always make the game not bad but not excellent.
There are no substantial problems with the translation of Subahibi. I'd like to know what it is in the translation that you think renders me unable to discern the quality of the work.

By the way, since we're talking about Muramasa, I'll point out a game that has a good translation: Hanachirasu, which is written by the same writer as Muramasa. And it's a really good VN. Is it a masterpiece? No, but I'd recommend it to anybody. It's one of my favorite short VNs.

The games considered as "masterpiece" are not written by amateurs, and I don't know what you call a decent translation but Subahibi's translation isn't decent, at least not compared to the original work.

I must have somehow dodged all of them

>The games considered as "masterpiece" are not written by amateurs,
We're talking about Muramasa, so let's look there. The writer is Narahara Ittetsu, whose only known writing credits are Muramasa and Hanachirasu. How is he a professional literary writer?
>and I don't know what you call a decent translation but Subahibi's translation isn't decent, at least not compared to the original work.
Tell me what's wrong with it then. I want to know what's wrong with it to the extent that I cannot accurately judge how good of a VN it is.

Arguably it's sequel too but recycles a lot of tracks. Haven't played ZTD

Attached: play it and find out what a funyarinpa is .png (1289x1382, 1.7M)

It's hard to provide examples because I don't know exactly what standard you are using, but here are some BGM tracks I liked recently:
youtube.com/watch?v=Fgzh0syXhWI
youtube.com/watch?v=R7Gox_Q3i0Q
youtube.com/watch?v=2jwsOhMsv0Q
youtube.com/watch?v=DXY1GfGWw_4
youtube.com/watch?v=rEXATrKzt9M
My favorite song from a VN will always be this, though:
youtube.com/watch?v=hNrXDrs352g

Just learn Japanese and read it you'll know

>Just spend several years learning a difficult language so that you can play video games and then you'll know
I'll get right on it, chief.

I think I could get to an adequate enough level if I put a serious effort into learning. I mean, people read Higurashi and Umineko with their original art, right? But you're right, I'm an adult and I work full-time. It's hard to fit in something like that.

No ofc, you'll still be shitting on everybody that tells you that Japanese is fundamentally different and translating from Japanese can't be easily done (symbolism of names are lost, kanji puns, double/triple negation/ different ways of speaking (formal/polite/honorific/humble))

Shit like that is always lost in translation. I'm not convinced that a failure to completely replicate it is so tremendous that it occludes the quality of the work in any significant way. For example I read Donald Keene's translation of No Longer Human recently, and for most instances of things like this, he simply omits it. And his translation was wonderful. It doesn't matter as much as you think it does. And I've asked you to provide actual examples that support your claims, but you can't. No one can because it's bullshit.

>Donald Keen
>Fucking weeby amators
Yes user, translations of VN are wonderful

My point was to provide an example of a professional, who just throws all of that shit out, and it doesn't affect the quality of the work in any significant way.

The writing isn't amazing but in many cases the translators don't speak Japanese OR English as a first language.

Umineko is a masterpiece of literature. It's a shame people are too prejudiced to admit that here.

Also I'll add something. From my experience reading Japanese translations, an in some cases more than one translation of the same work, I think that the most important thing when rendering the text into English is to create sentences in English that reflect the appropriate feelings of the text, in English. That is, the approach of trying to translate the Japanese literally will often create a translation that is bland. I think with Japanese it's important to take artistic liberties in trying to communicate the feelings that are being expressed in Japanese, and to translate the text "incorrectly" if necessary. There are cases where I have preferred fan translations over official translations because of this.

These are pretty minor and happens with many languages, but the biggest reason Japanese is particularly untranslatable is the inherent ambiguity of the language (every part of the sentence can be dropped) so translators are forced to interpret things better left implied

I think the optimum level of literal/not n-literal translation also depends on the ability and experience of the translator. A professional literary translator with writing experience and formal study of the language is much better equipped to rewrite passages to flow better in English while the best possible translation an inexperienced but passionate fan translator is that probably a more literal one, keeping well-known but hard to translate aspects (such as honorifics) in the original language.

Seconding this. The prose isn’t the greatest (though the author improved his prose in his following works) but it uses postmodern ideas in a unique way and covers family breakdown particularly effectively due to the author’s background as a social worker.

I’d say an example of a VN with good prose both in Japanese and in translation would be Narcissu. The beige prose works really well with the minimalist style of presentation. The plot isn’t that unique, however.

I think they are on the level of pulp magazines personally. Disdained entertainment. But possibly some hidden gems.

The western "interactive fiction" has a lot more literary pretensions and is - naturally - totally fucking cancerous as a result. Full of gender politics and crazies.

Stick with the anime titties, boys.

Saya No Uta

I think this is on the same level as one of Lovecraft's better stories, honestly.

>Maybe you, op, could stop being a consumercuck and make your own VN with literary value, that will btfo everyone's expectation of what a VN

I'm not OP, but thats what I tried doing last year. I even finished two drafts that are around 60k+ words (it was 149 pages on my word document single spaced, with double spacing for dialogue). The real difficulty that has stunted my continuation with the project, is all the things outside of writing I have to do. I've pretty much finished the story (just need to polish the writing some more), but I don't have money to hire people to do art and music for me. One of my close relatives was willing to do the art for free, but the moment the project got more serious she started flaking and sending lots of late work. Then there is the issue of music and programming. Programming I can learn and take care of, but I need somebody to do music. Then there is the whole issue of marketing which frankly, disgusts me even though I know its necessary.

My aim was to write a Visual Novel that was basically just a novel (meaning a story that was completely detached from all the stereotypes of anime and VN bullshit). Even with the art style, I wanted it to have a bit of an anime aesthetic, but not overwhelmingly so.

Picrelated is some concept art for it. The setting and background art is highly inspired by the backgrounds in the film The Cabinet of Dr. Caligari. If people are interested I can post more concept art.

Attached: Concept Art 1.png (595x839, 788K)

For a project for my advance level Japanese class in Uni, I've been translating bits of No Longer human, and then after words comparing my translation to Donald Keene's. I always thought his translation was good, but it was only through trying to translate some of the novel myself that I realized how brilliant of a job he does.

that concept art is bad, but I like your goal user and I wish you glory and success

It’s actually pretty good

Thanks! Also, the art is super rough in this draft just to have something to work with. If I do manage to get this project off the ground, the art will definitely be polished up.

These posts make me lost faith in this sub.

>sub
ok retard

Only SCA-JI and Romeo ones can be considered art.

>Misato
Funny way of spelling "Kaworu"

Embarrassing taste

Attached: 00AA6EAF-5730-49BE-857E-88CE7325941C.jpg (453x400, 42K)

>Nobody mentioning Silver Case, Remember11, or I/O

The Housw in Fata Morgana is a masterpiece.

Attached: download (1).jpg (1024x768, 188K)

It's not. It's a very mediocre game compared to better Japanese VNs.

no, but they will be on the same level as women's trashy romance novels.

>Virtual novels
Why has no one pointed this out yet?

enjoy your used up hag

Someone post Jamal's chart from /djt/