Performance of the GOATS in the NT
Pelé: 77 goals in 92 games (avg: 0.84)
WC: 12 goals in 14 games 0.86
Fatnaldo: 62 goals in 98 games (avg: 0.63)
WC: 15 goals in 19 games 0.79
Cristiano: 85 goals in 154 games (avg: 0.55)
WC: 7 goals in 17 games 0.41
Messi: 65 goals in 128 games (0.51)
Wc: 6 goals in 19 games 0.32
Maradona: 34 goals in 91 games (0.37)
Wc: 8 goals in 21 games 0.38
post pulisic's stats kid then we talk
kek
Pulisic will be great, just wait.
I understand the bashing on messi, but what does Maradona has to do witj any of this.
Maradona was a midfielder and he never played as a striker either.
Its like putting beckenbauer or cryuff score percentages.
>midfielder
Maradona was a striker, a mediapunta. There is a whole myth about Maradona "enganche".
That's a lie. He only play some few games in the 90s as a enganche after he leaved Sevilla.
1 goal in 9 games (avg: 0,11)
WC: 0 goals in 0 games 0
I'm not even bashing anyone.
that's also in order of the number of world class teammates they've had on their NTs
These names don't look too bad
I don't get it
bear in mind higuain was played over aguero for some reason
>Romero, Campagnaro, Gago, Biglia, Rodriguez, Orion, Fernandez, Memechelis, Rojo, another Fernandez, Palacio, Alvarez, Lavezzi, Basanta
>doesn't look bad
How can Cristiano Ronaldo be so bad when he has to play the likes of Andorra, San Marino, Latvia, etc?
It just baffles me.
i get tired of saying this but:
W A T C H
P E L E ' S
O L D
G A M E S
they are a joke.
there is literally no defence.
either they were rigged or people didn't play defence back then.
don't take my word for it - go watch.
he's the most over-rated athlete ever
In pelé's time they went to break people's shit. Look at this guy going straight for his thigh
youtube.com
I don't have to watch them to know anything before the 80s was utter trash. Jules Rimet trophies shouldn't count for World Cup victories.
You people are retarded. You aren't supposed to judge different eras like that, you fucking brainlets. If it weren't for these guys we wouldn't have had the evolution of the game.
Average ranking per Messi goal: 38.2
Goals Against Top 10: 13
Goals Outside Top 50: 19
Other players for reference
R9
Average Rank: 34.4
Top 10: 12
Outside 50: 18
Neymar
Average Rank: 37.9
Top 10: 11
Top 50: 17
Ronaldinho
Average Rank: 46
Top 10: 3
Outside 50: 10
Klose
Average Rank: 53.9
Top 10: 8
Outside 50: 24
Ronaldo
Average Rank: 69.3
Top 10: 8
Outside 50: 43
it's almost like strikers score more goals than playmakers and wingers
Ronaldinho was a midfielder, dude. His role was to assist people
Then don't include Maradona
>stats to compare players
brainlet.jpg
Maradona was a midfielder though. And he won a World Cup alone. Brazil didn't even need Pele in 1962.
Maradona eliminated all the world champions too: Uruguay 1986, England 1986, Germany 1986, Brazil 1990, Italy 1990.
>Comparing strikers to wingers on goal scoring stats
I'm not shitting on Maradona. He actually has a WC as opposed to Messoy.
>im not shitting on Maradona
You compared his goals to strikers, which for an Argentinian is apparently fine but when it's golden boy Ronaldinho it's a big problem
>he won a World Cup alone
Why do Argeniggers say this? If Burruchaga or Valdano don't bail out Maradona in finals he is not the GOAT. You literally had Higuain and Palacio TRY NOT TO SCORE and cause Messi's demise while Maradona was bailed out by local team players.
>Perfomance of the GOATs
I just put him there because he is one of the greatest (the greatest by many). You interpret it as you like.
They didn't bail out Maradona. Maradona bailed out the entire team with that insane pass in the last minute, after they let Germany tie 2-2 after being 2-0 ahead. Maradona had participated in both goals too.
Obsessed
And they say ameristats are stupid for only looking at stats.
You niggers compare based on goal stats in a 7 one off game knock out competition
Compare to Pele that eliminated Wales 1958, France 1958, Sweden 1958 - none world champions at the time
Then didn't play in 1962 but Brazil won anyway
Then went out in group stages in 1966
Then eliminated Peru 1970, Uruguay 1970 and Italy 1970
Maradona eliminated 5 world champions and Pele merely 2
his team including fucking guillermo brown were delivering, you think if Valdano misses the last minute goal Maradona is considered even top 5 all time? I cannot even imagine 1 argentine forward that would've scored that after Batistuta. Messi's curse is playing in a generation that has absolutely no goalscorer that delivers, or you would've won the 2014 final by 3 goals.
If Burruchaga* misses, Maradona goes on and creates yet another play. Maradona was clutch unlike Messi.
Nobody here saw Pele play. He's a fraud
Di Stefano (argentine legend) saw Pelé, Messi and Cristiano and he said that pelé was better.
>I cannot even imagine 1 argentine forward that would've scored that after Batistuta.
AGUEROOOOOOOOOOO
Pelé might not have been the best ever but saying that he is a fraud is retarded.
Di Stefano played in Pele's era, saying Pele is the GOAT adds to the legitimacy of his own
People call him a fraud because he says he scored 1000+ goals even though officially he scored 700+, because he says he won 3 World Cups alone even though he didn't even play in 1962, and because he talks shit about all the modern players even though the modern era is clearly a far higher standard than his era, and videos show this
Saying he scored more than a 1000 goals when 400+ came in friendlies is fraudulent senpai
Pele had a terrible record against Spanish teams. He averaged about 0.5 goals per game. Messi and Ronaldo average 1 goal per game.
He played in 1962. You're outright lying. He scored against México.
People give Messi 4 CL even though he wasn't intrumental in the first one
He officially scored 757 goals in 812 games (0.93)
>the destroyers of deportivo
>the attackers of alaves
>the eliminators of eibar
>the grinders of getafe
>the lashers of levante
>the vanquishers of valladolid
Messi and Ronaldo played in the best teams in the world. The level disparity between their teams and the rest of the league is like playing farmers.
the difference is FIFA didnt recognize Pele until Maradona became too good, it was only in the 90s that FIFA awarded pele that 1962 medal because they didn't want a cocaine addict to represent the sport. Pele is quite literally a marketing machine created by FIFA to not have a degenerate image as its GOAT. If you actually think Pele was good you need a reality check.
As opposed to playing against farmers in every game like Pele
I find this funny. Pelé haters contradict themselves all the time. They argue that pelé "wasn't even the best" in his own team but then later they'll act like only pelé knew how to play in the entire world. The funny thing also is that these destroyers from his NT all played in the BR league as you can see in pic related
Messi would unironically shatter the English record so hard it would be laughable. There's a reason that league has produced nothing this decade. Imagine him against Bournemouth or some shit where the defenders move at the speed of my crusty poo sliding down my asshole after eating a full pack of Oreos. The English should feel lucky this man never transferred to England to expose that literal cow-farmer league.
the insecurity of Brazilians is very funny
is it because you haven't won anything since 2007?
So you're telling me that Pele only won the WC with a super stacked team?
Why would we be insecure with a resume like this?
That's not your resume, that's the resume of hundreds of different football players over 100 years. You're a guy defending a fraud on Yea Forums
anything in the last decade?
living in the past is pathetic
Calling him a fraud is simply ridiculous.
He wouldn't cut it in todays leagues. You can make the argument that
>with todays training and technology he would be the best
But that's conjecture. Maybe he would be the best, maybe he wouldn't. We only know how good he was back then, how good football was back then, which was simply many tiers below the level it's at today
only the gold medal in the olympics but no one rates it... We'll try our best to win copa américa and make Messi get cucked one more time
Because you got 7-1'd in the WC semifinals in your own country
Pele played 1 game and minutes in the WC 1962
Messi played 7 games and minutes in the CL 2005-06
But I don't count that CL anyway and I don't rate Messi either
>he wouldn't cut it in today's league
I can also say "Messi wouldn't cut it in England"
or in 50 years people might say that Messi wouldn't cut it in their time or another league becomes prestigious and they'll say that he wouldn't cut it there
What if they make a super euro league? "meh Messi was killing spanish farmers, Zoominho is the best"
You guys also don't take into account the guys back then were figuring out stuff. It's much easier to do things when it's already figured out
imagine being brazilian and having people litearlly skip work and pray to god for their national soccer team and then you get eliminated by Peru in copa america who cannot even afford a TV to watch the game so you have to come on a chinese imageboard to spill macaco stats from the 50's to feel better. This spaniard is correct.
>"Messi wouldn't cut it in England"
He scored 22 goals against the top 6 English sides. It's not even speculation.
>or in 50 years people might say that Messi wouldn't cut it in their time or another league becomes prestigious and they'll say that he wouldn't cut it there
That's 100% exactly what will happen. Messi and Ronaldo are going to be called frauds in the same way Pele is now, and you're just going to have to live with the fact that sports getting better with time, and not worse
that lil clip was the last 10 minutes of the 62 final. Czech were down by two so not much enthusiasm isn't too shocking. Nice cherry picking.
I watched entire games from that era and it doesn't compare to modern football. They played like people from the 5th or 6th division play today.
really? thanks I had no idea it was from the fucking FINAL that just goes to show how abhorrent the level of play was back then
a goal and an assist against Mexico which ultimately helped Brazil out of the group stage. Research is toovhard I guess.
Everyone including Pelé were on a level playing field and he outshone everyone. That's what matters.
and Messi was key against Chelsea in the Round of 16, so what? I still don't count his CL
There's no reason to believe he wouldn't be good today. He was playing and scoring in the world cup when he was 17. He was athletic and skillful all around. He could score with both legs.
Nowadays you have shitters like lukaku that has an atrocious first touch playing in the biggest league
That isn't what matters. Otherwise Wilt Chamberlain would be the GOAT instead of Michael Jordan. Or Bart Starr instead of Tom Brady.
>and Messi was key against Chelsea in the Round of 16, so what? I still don't count his CL
How many goals and assists did he have?
try playing with a ball from back along with no yellow or red cards, I'm sure modern players will still perform as they do now. With that being said, it makes Pele's achievements more impressive when you have a ball that bobbles once every inch.
You're only as good as your competition, and still images against part time tractor farmers isn't going to change anything. Every time you post that bullshit you get taken less seriously
why the 1880s video quality
I'm not talking about messi. Just that he scored the best goal in that world cup and assisted. Shame he was injured for being overpowered with 0 ref protection.
because it's from the 60s mother fucker, look at the 1966 final footage it looks like it's from the twilight zone. Color TV didn't become mainstream until 1968
>look at the 1966 final footage it looks like it's from the twilight zone
kek
He was superior than any other player for almost 20 years. If that were true I guess Messi is no better than a player from getafe.
Messi can't win when his team lets in 3-4 goals it's a team effort and they literally sabotage him
>He was superior than any other player for almost 20 years.
And when your competition is shit, that means nothing. Like the guy said before, football was still in it's early years back then. At this point, we're probably at about 90% of player potential, compared to maybe 50% back then
Haven't said shit about messi, retard. Also, being the most recognized player in a stacked team is more of a honor than being recognized in an average team. I think we can agree on this.
We are at 99.9% player potential right now
There were good players in all generations. In Pele's case nobody came close to him despite this.
No, I think we can get a bit better. There are still a lot of players who smoke and drink heavy and don't diet well; Messi said that for a long part of his career his diet was shit, which is why he always threw up. Plus steroids can always get better
based
How can I take YOU seriously when you want to make a narrative that the best in the world were all farmers? Also I didn't know that the opposition takes from your ability to jump high. I'm sorry. I guess players from other teams exert more gravity around them...
you realize that there's more footage from such events that just what was broadcast on TV back then?
20 years? You're deluded. His first title was in 1958 and his last title was in 1970. That's 12 years.
His first league was 1961 and his last league was 1968. That's 7 years.
His first Libertadores win was 1962 and his last was 1963.
They were farmers compared to the players we have today
Also, the ability to jump high has nothing to do with your ability to play football. I thought football was meant to be a technical sport, and nothing just one dominated by athletic people?
That really means nothing at all.
People didn't start playing football in 58... First World cup was in 1930. The first Copa América was in 1916
12 years then. Still very impressive and unmatched.
Yeah, and back then people were playing at 10%. 40 years later like I said they were closer to 50%. Right now we're getting close to the human potential.
Messi won his first title in 2004-05
He's about to win a 2018-19 title, surpassing Pele's longevity by far
pele would be irrelevant today if he didnt go to the US and market himself so we could include him in pop culture references
Ahh yes La liga, so hard even forlan can score 40 a season there. Not surprised the steroid infused barca lab rat will be playing longer. Longer ya, better na
Pele only won 2 Libertadores. Bochini won 5.
>Right now we're getting close to the human potential.
not with nearly 50 matches a season, that's too many
Last years La Liga had 2.69 goals per game, EPL 2.68. Right now EPL has 2.85 goals per game, La Liga only 2.55
Pele won 3 WC's ,messi none. See how easy that is?
What do you mean? I don't think that has much to do with it. I'm just talking about the training mostly.
Bochini 5 CL + 1 WC = 6
Pele 2 WC + 3 WC = 5
Bochini > Pele
Who would have guessed that the quality of a league would have changed in the last 2 years. Still doesn't mean it wasn't shit for the majority of his career.
When Messi scored 50 goals; EPL 2.81 La Liga 2.76
Maybe put aside your bias and check the stats
Mateo pls.
>3 (three) our-league players
they were doomed from the start
Just facts man. 5 Libertadores + 1 WC = 6
6 > 5
epl is shit too
I guess every league is shit and there are no good players
That's such a small margin of difference lol, not significant enough.
This has to be the most ludicrous take of all. Literally 0 people give a shit about the US when it comes to football. He's been immortalized by other players and the fact that he was the youngest to win a WC + #5 highest scorer in the WC, 3 WCs, still the highest scorer in the NT that has won the most WCs,
But that's my point, there isn't a significant difference to suggest that La Liga is significantly easier to score in, especially when the data suggests the opposite
this is actually true, not so much because he was a drug addict but because he went against FIFA's narrative and always shat on them whenever he could
All I know is that Suarez scored 40 goals in la liga.
Because a 0.06 goal difference is soooo noticeable. You really got there bud
And? He scored 31 in 33 in the EPL, and he was suspended to start the season. Plus Gerrard scored 10 penalties that season; if Suarez took those he could have hit 40 too
What is your point? My point is not that one is so different from the other moron, my different is that there ISNT a difference. You're just agreeing with me
my point is that there isn't a difference*
And for what year is that for?
For his entire career. If you take goals per game scored from La Liga and EPL from 2004-05 to now you'd find a negligence difference on either side
Has Independiente built a statue for the true GOAT yet?
>Maradona was a midfielder
Top lel. Maradona's and Messi's NT roles were almost identical, free roaming second strikers.
Forgot pic.
The EPL at least is more balanced. La Liga is like ligue 1 with the difference being that there are two "PSGs" instead of one
playing so many matches a season is just too physically demanding so players can't give it all they've got and sometimes manages ignore one competition to focus on another
