Am I the only one that thinks Kobe is highly overrated?
Just a decent, flashy shooter that was around to fill the gap between the departure of Jordan and the coming of LeBron. He was carried to success by Shaq and his surrounding cast. Nowhere near Jordan or LBJ's level of talent and certainly sholdn't be spoken of with as much reverence as he is today.
He's trash. Anyone who shot as much as he did would be the same. Dwade is better
He's better than LeBitch though
Complete nonsense
He isn't even more clutch. Its entirely made up
>carried by Shaq and surrounding cast
Bro, you act like Jordan and LeBron were just on teams with scrubs and did the work by themselves, maybe for LeBron in his first run in Cleveland and he didn’t win shit
No you're not, if he wasn't a laker he wouldn't be thought of much. Carried throughout his career
Not nonsense at all, Kobe is a tier above LeBeta.
>He isn't even more clutch.
Opinion discarded
He's not wrong, statistically proven right
Go kys
Proof? Seethe more LeCuck stan, but it's true. Statpadding in a historically Eastern conference isn't impressive
Go look it up yourself, I'm not going to spoonfeed you and I don't care what some retard thinks
LeBron and many others are/were much better than that carried chucker
Concession accepted. Kobe didn't turn chucker mode until his later years either, retard
Kobe's clutchness is made up by Lakers fanboys
>muh statistics
go look up rangz lil biznitch then YOU go kys yo sef foo
/thread
Complete nonsense. He was just a hair under Jordan.
>t.44yr old knicksfan.
Kobe was among the all time great one on one players. Fortunately basketball is a team sport, and as such Kobe is massively overrated. I’ve seen him take far too many horrible shots, a few of which he made. He’d have decent teammates wide open, and he’d still take a shot when he’s triple teamed. Shaw was the best player on that lakers team.
No. But you're a retard for asking that and your opinion on Bryant is shit
>almost all pundits and peers, all-time great/HOFers recognise kobe as a top 10 all time player
>even pundits who strongly dislike him (cowherd/nick wright) put him top 10
>anonymous users on 4channel don't
interesting take guys
>anyone who shot as much as he did
>implying creating shots isn't the defining skill of an NBA superstar
Most missed shots in NBA history.
/thread
King of the chuckers. There's never been a more selfish player in the NBA and probably the least clutch superstar ever. Only niggers and wannabes rate Kobr.
The 3 Utah shots in '97 are skewing this somewhat more
MJ, Kareem, LeBron, Wilt, Russell, Olajuwon, Shaq, Duncan, Bird and Magic. Those are the best ten basketball players of all time. Who do you remove to put Kobe in?
let's review, OP:
>you never played basketball
>you don't watch basketball regularly
>you have no knowledge of the history
>you didn't watch kobe in his prime
so why would your opinion mean anything? why would you expect your opinion to match up with the experts?
You have to add curry im not a GS fan at all but hes a legend in the makeing
>duncan
>magic
werent even the best of their era gtfoh casual
Neither was Kobr.
never said he was i dont get what youre doing here
What are any of us doing here?
Two-ring Wilt.
You can make a case that Kobe is above Hakeem and Wilt.
kek
You also have Baylor, West, Stockton, IT, Pettit, Big O, and a few others who are better than Kobr. Also,
>Lebron top 10
>You also have Baylor, West, Stockton, IT, Pettit, Big O, and a few others who are better than Kobr.
Stop.
>Am I the only one that thinks Kobe is highly overrated?
Nope. He was an inefficient chucker, a shitty playmaker, and a poor rebounder for his height. If he'd been stuck in a no-name market instead of LA, his reputation would be completely different.
What do you mean by his later years? He never had a field goal percentage over 47% for a season in his entire career, and he averaged over 20 shots per game for most of his career. He was always a chucker.
Kobe's mindset alone puts him above Lebron.
One played for passion, the other plays for a paycheck and his ego.
Kobe averaged 28-5-5 for a 13-year stretch in the regular season and the playoffs.
>Kobe's mindset alone puts him above Lebron.
Not when Kobe was worse at almost everything. I admire Kobe's competitiveness, but that also led to him taking way too many bad shots.
Any player from 2004 on is overrated
>if they didn’t happen they wouldn’t count
Top 5 is MJ, Bird, Hakeem, Shaw, Magic btw
You and every true Spurs fan. You know, the ones that didn’t defect between the first 2 titles.
Kobe was definitel better than Bron, taht is from technical point of view, he had better shot, the fade away, better clutch player, more finesse
Bron is just bulldozing to this day and Jordan made more shots, so Jorda, Kobe, Bron
Only zoomers who haven't watched Kobe play and only read some statistics say that Kobe was overrated.
Second only to Jordan
>better clutch player,
lyl
Who was better than them in their eras?
Shaw and bird
5 MVPs and 10 rings between them
Lol no you can't make that case, Wilt is arguably the GOAT
Duncan was the best player of the Kobe/Duncan/Garnett/Kidd/Dirk/LeBron/Wade era.
yep
Did you leave Shaw out because he's better?
He's good but not a GOAT contender like some people say. Imo he isn't even a top 3 shooting guards of all times
1. Jordan
2. Ginobili
3. Wade
And before you say it, pre 90s players don't count, they were almost amateur and they didn't allow foreign players
>Ginobili
pls stop
Shaq has a better prime but Duncan a better career overall. He's definitely the best post-Jordan player
4 rings
Champion in Europe
Champion with the NT (in a team when he was the only NBA player)
Top 25 all times playoffs points
Top 5 all times playoffs 3pt
Top 25 all times playoffs assists
Top 10 all times playoffs steals
That's just the numbers, then if you watch him play, Ginobili had a better IQ, never took hard shoots for the sake of personal archivements and was a 100% team player
nah
Strong arguments there lads
>implying you deserve one
kek
Kobe in his last game (against a under .5 team)
>took 50 shots to have 60 points
>more than twice as many as the rest of his team
>under .3 from outside
Come on, this nigga only cared about his personal numbers and NEVER made his team better. While Ginobili was one of the best teammates of all times. In his last NBA game he didn't even tell he was going to retire, he didn't want to attract attention from the team
Kurt Rambis....now that was a teammate.
no, you're not the only one. Kobe was an overrated chucker carried to rings by the GOAT coach and a top 3 big man of all time. If you look at Harden right now, that's what Kobe tried to be, but he wasn't good enough to do it. i don't fault him for taking all those shots when a lot of the people around him were shit, but he also was so inefficient that you still can't consider him among the greats. he's definitely not top 10 and i'd argue he's not even top 15. maybe top 20.
>that picture
WE
yes Kobe is overrated. He had all the skills you would want in a player but willingly made bad decisions while being locker room cancer. He was entirely saved by Jerry West and being a Laker
Rings never tell the full story. If it did, you'd regard Robert Horry as being better than MJ KOBE LBJ etc.
I never understood why people attribute any relevance to this crap.
Sample size is atrocious. The parameters are so fucking narrow that it's retarded. People seem to forget this was made specifically to make a prop lebron point in the peak of heatlemania. It's very disingenuous. Clutch is much more than gamewinners with 10 secs or less to go.
Also, I love how people take this pathetic onfographic seriously but not the opinion of literally every player ever that's been asked the question of who they think is more clutch between the two.
>tfw my nigga Deng blocked that shot after DRoses go ahead basket on Christmas
TYBD
Kobr is more difficult to evaluate than people think. On one hand, his obviously suspect shot selection has cost his team a bunch of games.
Then again, he does bring elite perimeter shot creation/spacing/defense at times, and the shots he does make (the ones LeBron passes up too often) are the kind of shots that you do need to take and make to win championships. Obviously, he doesn't need to take every one of them, but you also can't pass them up as often as LeBron does. It's a fine line. MJ mastered this balance in his later Bulls years, which is why he's the GOAT. Kobr also fits into a championship level offense better IMO. ie doesn't quite monopolize his team's stats like LeBron, nor is he a one-trick pony memechucker like Stephanie.
Overall, I'd say not quite on LeBron's level (but close) but definitely better than anyone on the Memeiors can ever hope to be desu
It's not fair to compare these 2, Kobe was a scoring machine and almost Jordan-tier in mid range shoots, while LeBron is more of an all around player
there was a good amount of years wear his team was bad. he was basically doing what james harden was doing but didn't get the benefit of 25 free throws and 3 step travel stepbacks. who was he gonna pass it to smush parker? vujacic?
I'm gonna say your not the only one, no.
>Anecdotal evidence is more reliable than statistical evidence
Portuguese education in SHAMBLES
He had big balls
kobe is not even top 10 desu. He is a great player, but come on man
Pretty dumb to say kobe is a scoring machine, and lebron is not. Just because he isn't jump shooting doesn't make him not a scoring machine. Just look at the stats.
Lebron is a much better all around player while also still being a scoring machine
I never understood why people attribute relevance to media narratives about a player's clutchness which are based on nothing
statistics arent random numbers put together that dont make sense in context tho like pic related
He's comfortably 13-16 all time, without question
All Time covers a ton of players who were infinitely more talented, more well-rounded, non-rapist, and known more than just chucking
Dude owns the record for most attempts and it's not even close, whoopdeefuckindoooo at his points he was inefficient as fuck, poster child for bricklaying, and miss me with that "clutch" bullshit, plenty of other players over the years were more trustworthy with the rock and less than 10 seconds to go
Kobe was not inefficient but who cares about facts.
Keep LeRefs name out of your mouth when in a Kobe thread
IN order of importance to those championship years
1. Shaq/Pau
2. Fisher
3. Kobe
He is super overrated because he is a folk hero for achieving both of the big two minority dreams - to get paid tons for nothing, and to rape the master race and get away with it
How about “Most-dominating-player-in-NBA-history Wilt”
LeBron can't even carry the Lakers to an 8 seed.
-discount jordan
That said his greatest 2 or 3 seasons were equal to a bellow average MJ year, so he's pretty fucking good. He's still basically a knock-off of Jordan.
The "most dominating player" let Bill Russell win 11 rings.
Yeah, just like he “let” Russell get 6 HoF teammates and a HoF coach
>GOAT coach
>couldn't fix the Knicks
Phil was a MJ, Shaw and Kobr babby
how many Finals MVPs does Horry have?
Thought that was obvious after he got BTFO by a geriatric Celtics team in the finals without Shaw to save him (shouldve been twice, but Stern stepped in to save his "legacy" and blatantly rigged Game 7)
>sample size that small
>statistics
naw
He's overrated and a rapist.
He was a good player, but it's mind boggling how many people see him as a GOAT candidate/top 5 player. He's nowhere close. He was a ballhog and one of the most inefficient shooters ever. His stats and game are pedestrian compared to other great players. Only reason he got so popular was because of the flashy knockoff Jordan game, and the fact that he played for LA and got rings.
Kobe was the last real assassin. He was the last of his kind. The kind that had a killer instinct. As talented as LeBron is, the dude has no edge. Kobe was a cold blooded killer and the NBA was a better place when it had him. This coming from a Celtics fan.
I'd rather watch a flash, cold blooded shooter who played with swagger than some fag like Curry who shoots meme pointers and won't dunk.
flashy*
He was a very good offensive player until he turned 34. He was never a good defender.
Kobe is unironically underrated.
That last part is horseshit, Kobr pretty much took a huge chunk of money at the end of his career, barely played, and hamstrung the Lakers til he retired.
I would be willing to put Kobe in that list over Olajuwon or LeBron.
Kobe didn't have some incredible mindset. He was just a guy that played on a allstar team and got addicted to winning. If he played for the Cavs he would have sucked and phoned it in.
>Just a decent, flashy shooter
I thought everyone in basketball was a shooter?
There's like 4 people on each team and you can throw the ball in from any place on the court
>Am I the only one that thinks Kobe is highly overrated?
no that's the majority opinion here
it's wrong but it's the majority opinion
>1. Jordan
>And before you say it, pre 90s players don't count
>Jordan
you can't make this stuff interwebs
>Shaq
easily the worst star player to watch, ever.
not saying he wasn't good, it was just hard to watch him.
inelegant, unpoetic, non-beautiful, like watching fucking Shrek or Colossus play basketball - effective but ugly
No he's not faggot he literally played against part time dentists
The absolute brainlet cope from Kobetards in this thread is killing me
>B-BUH MUH SAMPLE SIZE
Shut the fuck up. Kobe is statistically less clutch than Lebron and being 5-22 in playoff clutch situations is NOT a small sample.
I guess being 3-6 in the finals is statistically insignificant then, huh? I mean, that's only 9 finals, kind of a small sample right? Kill yourselves.
He’s underrated now, same as Iverson. People dont seem to understand he played in an era with the best defense in league history, league wide efficiency was down. Back then you had to be able to make tough shots or you were a role player. Nowadays every shot is wide open
1. Shaq showed up during the Finals against inferior competition. Kobe was assigned to Reggie Miller, prime Iverson, and prime Jason Kidd during the 2000-2001 finals. Kobe also won several important games against WC opponents. This isn't to diminish Shaq at all, but Kobe had tougher defensive assignments throughout the playoffs while contributing 21, 29, and 26 PPG in the threepeat.
2. I would put Fisher slightly above Kobe in terms of clutch performance for the 2010 Finals. However, most arguments revolve around Game 7's performance. The fact is, both PP and Kobe shot horribly, yet Kobe is the one that is shit on. The game was a defensive stalemate until Kobe and Fisher started hitting shots. Pau also came alive after being outplayed by old man Rasheed for a good portion of the game.
>ctrl+f "defen"
>2 matches, 1 is sometimes, 1 is never was
We're reaching levels of faggotry that shouldn't even be possible. Shitsucking plebbitors with their favorite combo of "bad guy+muh eff. stat". Since you're allergic to defence and actually watching bball riddle me this, closeted lebronsexuals:
Kobe in his prime & preinjury played in West with consistently good Spurs (top1 team), Mavs and time to time "contenders" Suns, Rockets, Nuggets, OKC. He got winning records against all but Spurdoras CHUCKING the shit out of ball like you're saying. Let's give you a pass and forget who Lebitch played against in mighty East. Let's take Spurs as benchmark.
>Kobe 23-29 with -1 pts difference (10-7 with 1 pts difference in playoffs)
>Lebitch vs post Duncan, post Kawhi, DemarDefrozen spuds is 19-28 with -3 pts difference and oh nonononon 5-11 with -6 pts difference in playoffs
>Wade is even worse than LeBron
Hey, where are you guys going? I though you gonna explain how playing more games vs tanking dumpsterfires of Least makes Lebitch better player?
kobe went against raja bell, shane battier, bruce bowen, tony allen (gave him huge issues in boston) , that french guy in orlando. he literally went against some crazy good defenders whose sole mission was to stop kobe. nobody in the league matches these guys capabilities on defense
also forgot prince the super lanky guy from detroit also one of the great team defense in league history
The thing is, Duncan contributed points at the same rate and he was vastly superior to Kobe on defense and rebounding. And both of them played when big men actually mattered in the NBA, as opposed to now when big men are worthless. Duncan made All-Defense teams when he was THIRTY NINE YEARS OLD, long after Kobe's offense was gone.
>best defense in league history
He didn't play in the 80s
Hornets and season = 2011 7-59 -13.91
Nets and season = 2009 12-70 -9.12
Hawks and season = 2004 13-69 -9.71
Heat and season = 2007 15-67 -8.68
Bucks and season = 2013 15-67 -8.18
Hornets and season = 2004 18-64 -5.99
Wizards and season = 2008 19-63 -7.46
Seventysixers and season = 2013 19-63 -10.45
Cavaliers and season = 2010 19-63 -9.01
Magic and season = 2012 20-62 -6.99
Hornets and season = 2012 21-61 -9.23
Raptors and season = 2010 22-60 -6.28
Wizards and season = 2010 23-59 -7.40
Magic and season = 2013 23-59 -5.44
Knicks and season = 2007 23-59 -6.61
Knicks and season = 2005 23-59 -6.40
Imagine not being perennial 1st team all defence vs this competition.
>plays against big boys from west
>losses badly and cries for more help
>gets to weakest west in years
>losses playoff race to University of Sacramento and Best Player Trading Clippers and cries for AD to come
I didn't compare them, so don't get confused. Duncan is entirely different discussion and vastly deviates from what faggOP implies.
>almost Jordan tier
>shot way worse than him despite playing most of his career with offense babby rules
K
This
ayyy
they are on their knees, right?
wait, how did he get 17 points by making only 3 fg?
no retard, only LA fags and casuals have ever rated him
45 percent is still shit
Based Misa
I have Kobe at 11 all time, simply because he never elevated his game in the playoffs compared to the 10 players i have ahead of him. Can anyone even name Kobes best playoff performances? Even people who despise Lebron can name at least 3 of his. Yet Kobe fans would be hardpressed to name even 1 defining playoff performance. His best one is probably when he got 48 and 16 against the Kings in game 4 of the 2001 semis but no one remembers that lol.
No
2010 WCF
You’ve obviously never seen his flashy passes. He was actually a good passer for a big man.
Not even God could fix those dipshits
>he had better shot
Kobe was a less accurate shooter than LeBron, even from 3, which says a lot, because it's not like LeBron is a great shooter.