European black metal

Counterpoints: Mayhem and Havohej

>black metal
underageb8

I'm not on the Ulver hype train, they suck. WITTR and Panopticon are very different and arguably a lot better. Also I don't think they are left leaning, why would you say something like that?

>doesn't like Ulver
wtf

I like Ulver a lot, definitely more than WITTR, though I do like WitTR. My favorite of the three is definitely Panopticon, but I know I'm in the minority with that.

WitTR are apolitical, but the Cascadian scene has a lot of leftist bands (with one notable NS exception), and because WitTR denounce racism and are closely associated with some leftist bands, they sometimes get thrown in with that group, though that isn't necessarily fair.

However, Panopticon is an explicitly leftist band. Their album Kentucky is a lot about labor unionism and leftism, and one of their songs is even about Emma Goldman, a Jewish feminist social anarchist who led some of the IWW's activities. They've played vocally leftist, anti-racist, anti-fascist festivals with bands like Dawn Ray'd.

Panopticon is definitely left wing. Lunn is an anarcho-communist. I don't know what Wolves are aside from being ecologically minded.

All three bands are garbage examples of black metal in their respective countries.

Skagos is awesome though

nope

I actually prefer Panopticon as well. Unions are a right wing thing as well so I never bothered more about that. I'll take left eco/atavists over right pagans/lolberterians anyways, when it comes to Wittr

Of course they are. Canadian bm is on par with most of Europe.

>Weakling
>Based

Weakling did more with one record than the vast majority of other BM bands, American or European

Generally fair enough, but labor unions are as leftist as it gets. The ideology anarcho-syndicalism is literally about having democratic labor unions run civil society. The IWW is a communist/anarchist labor union that got American workers many rights. I don't really know how you could think labor unions are right wing.

Attached: 1566142133345.gif (680x315, 118K)

>
However, if you're weak-minded enough to care about the fact that American black metal tends to lean left, while European black metal tends to lean right, you should probably note that the most vocally antifa black metal band, Dawn Ray'd, is British, and the first loudly leftist black metal band, Summoning, is Austrian.

This is an unsurprisingly distorted, as Summoning only became loud and proud in their 2014 statement, as taken from the Vice piece you no doubt were citing. Meanwhile, Panopticon was profiled as being leftis by popmatters in 2012. And who gives a fuck about Dawn Ray'd?

>unions are a right wing thing as well

Attached: 1552165102756.jpg (264x249, 11K)

Agreed. It set the template for trashy USBM for a generation.

Nothing trashy about Weakling pal.
Whatever their imitators did is another story

>he thinks all USBM is bad
ok tourist

Attached: USBM by IQ.jpg (860x1524, 385K)

Nothing you just said negates anything in my post.

Yes, Summoning became vocal about their political beliefs years later, but even when they were young they were playing leftist punk venues because they identified more with those politics, despite being a fantasy-oriented metal band. Their politics were no secret to the people involved in that scene. Keep in mind that at the same time the second wave of black metal was happening, the Scandinavian crust punk scene, with bands like Anti Cimex, was running parallel. That era of crust punk is musically pretty similar to black metal, and the main division there is social and political.

Don't be such an asshat.

Not based

Summoning has never played live retard.

"Later, when I started to get into the metal scene, I was in those punk pubs rather than in typical metal pubs. With my first metal band Marligom, we played in anarchist occupied houses and where I felt most comfortable, surrounded by a left-wing audience. For me, metal music (as well as generally underground music) mean being brave with your head up, not kneeling in front of any leader. It meant for me standing up against the commercial system, the rich elites, not spitting down on people who are defenseless." - Protector of Summoning

Excuse me for not distinguishing between the band and the people in the band, retard.

> he doesn't know about NatSoc

Attached: 540FantasticPlanet3_medium.jpg (540x300, 38K)

based as fuck

Attached: 1566826933211.jpg (564x707, 100K)

I like Black Witchery

youtube.com/watch?v=EofWfuYhirk

The nationalism is national socialism is what makes it right wing, not the socialism. The nationalism places concern for the nation above other groups, which is hierarchical.

learn2ideology

Weakling are incredibly important as a band

0/8 b8

Oh and Massive Conspiracy Against All Life is one of the best black metal albums unironically and OBJECTIVELY.

And dont get me started on Jef Whitehead in general; he's a genius.

Lurker of Chalice is nothing short of kino music

this is such a tiresome argument, what does that even mean. What has socialism to do with hierarchies? Even full communism has hierarchies. What you were thinking of is called "anarchism". But be careful, some weird forms of anarchism also accept some forms of hierarchies

sure is

Attached: il etait.jpg (1000x1000, 885K)

Lmao the Nazis busted up unions, imprisoned labor leaders, and neutered union power by integrating them into the state. "Pro-labor" Nazis are the biggest cucks on the planet.

It's not an argument, it's a definition. You can argue that there will always be hierarchy in society, but leftism by definition pushes for equality, and the right wing by definition pushes for hierarchy. Words have meaning. Labor unions are absolutely fundamental to the socialist labor movement, which is the historical left wing movement, at least in the US. The fact you can't understand this is baffling. Fascism and National Socialism had rather collectivistic economic systems. That's not what made them right wing, and other right wing ideologies pushed for capitalism. The left wing, by definition, pushes for worker's rights. That's what makes it left wing.

Yes, the Soviets were hierarchical. The Bolsheviks are obviously left wing, but they're politically to the right of anarcho-communists and syndicalists. It's a spectrum.

Jesus fucking Christ, kid

Oh fuck I thought you said Canadian

I think what you're trying to say is that fascists promote class collaboration which is antithetical to labor power while class war is a foundational concept within socialism.

What a shit thread. I'd expect this kind of discussion two weeks into nbbmn.

this

Attached: Untitled.png (510x571, 52K)

Not quite.

"I can't listen to music unless the musicians have clown makeup"

> neuter union power by integrating them into the state
no shit how retarded are you? Why don't the US Democrats just neuter Trump's power by integrating him into the state? Why has nobody thought of that?!

It's somewhat of a circular argument that a definition proves that it's correct by being it's definition. We can also discuss what people where sitting where in parliaments to get a bit closer to some consent and then maybe consider some primary literature with respect of the most prominent examples of the respective ideologies. I'm rather stoned right now and this is really getting tiresome, but please look into some real sources, preferably primary ones. Socialism is, regardless whether left or right, the concept of a collectivistic economic system, as you call it. That's the primary characterization of socialism. It is plain disinformation to claim the historic right did not car e about worker's rights, where did you get these ideas? Do you know how Fascism started?

I would not consider class war a foundational concept within socialism, but I am mostly a fan of the GDR as my role model for full socialism. Nonetheless, point taken. I'd still consider the primary idea of socialism the concept of ensuring there is no exploitation of people (you can say labor but I'm not that cynical) and that it shares with many concepts in fascism and natsoc

>no shit how retarded are you?
Clearly not as retarded as you.
>Why don't the US Democrats just neuter Trump's power by integrating him into the state?
Because he's already the head of the state so that would make no sense.
>Socialism is, regardless whether left or right, the concept of a collectivistic economic system, as you call it. That's the primary characterization of socialism.
That's a vacuous definition of socialism promoted by liberals and fascists. Socialism is primarily a mode of production characterized by the elimination of the commodity form, wage labor, and class hierarchy
>It is plain disinformation to claim the historic right did not car e about worker's rights, where did you get these ideas?
Oh I dunno maybe all the strike breaking, union busting, class collaboration, wage suppression, slave labor, and privatization.

You literally don't know the most basic definitions of these political ideologies, and you keep describing everything as tiresome, without saying anything of substance. I think you're full of hot air, and I get the sense you're trying to promote right wing ideologies by being evasive about what they really mean. And yes, I know Mussolini started out a socialist, since that's obviously what you're going to bring up. I recommend you look up someone named Giovanni Gentile, and I also recommend you stop smoking pot and go to college or something.

justin bieber is american