10/10: Johann Sebastian Bach - Liebster Jesu, wir sind hier, BWV 633 Ludwig Van Beethoven - Symphony No. 7 in A major Sergei Rachmaninoff - Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini, Op. 43 Igor Stravinsky - The Rite of Spring (Le Sacre du Printemps) Frédéric Chopin - Piano Sonata No. 2 in B-flat minor, "Funeral March" Ludwig Van Beethoven - Piano Sonata No. 14, "Moonlight" Ludwig Van Beethoven - Symphony No. 4 in B flat major Ludwig Van Beethoven - Piano Sonata No. 23, "Appassionata" Ludwig Van Beethoven - String Quartet No. 7 in F major, Op. 59 Maurice Ravel - Piano Concerto in G major, M. 83 Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart - Symphony No. 41 in C major, "Jupiter" Ludwig Van Beethoven - String Quartet No. 10 in E-flat major, Op. 74 Antonín Dvořák - Symphony No. 5 in E minor, Op. 95 "From The New World" Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart - Piano Concerto No. 23 in A major Ludwig Van Beethoven - String Quartet No 3 in D major, Op. 18 Dmitri Shostakovich - Piano Quintet in G minor, Op. 57 Hector Berlioz - Symphonie Fantastique, Op. 14, H 48 Camille Saint-Saëns - Symphony No. 3 in C minor Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart - Piano Concerto No. 20 in D minor Franz Liszt - Piano Concerto No. 1 in E flat-major, S.124 Ludwig Van Beethoven - String Quartet No. 6 in B-flat major, Op 18 Felix Mendelssohn - Piano Trio No. 1 in D minor George Gershwin - Concerto In F Johann Sebastian Bach - Double Concerto in D minor Arthur Bliss - Piano Concerto Johannes Brahms - Symphony No. 4 in E minor Édouard Lalo - Namouna Suite No. 1 Edward Elgar - Cello Concerto Max Bruch - Violin Concerto No. 1 in G minor Joseph Haydn - Sympony No. 101 in D major, "The Clock" Johann Sebastian Bach - Brandenburg Concerto No. 1 in F major, BWV 1046
Joseph Morgan
what is this?
Oliver White
10/10: my pleb taste
Jeremiah Nguyen
A few of the compositions I think are 10/10's. I agree I'm a pleb. But is there any piece you think it's bad in there? Is there any you would put on your 10/10 list? Can you rec me some good stuff?
When doinf piano scales, should I pick a tempo (e.g. 60 bpm) and do my 2 octaves of quavers, 3 octaves of triplets, and 4 octaves of semiquavers all at that tempo? Or do each set at the max tempo I can manage smoothly? (E.g. If I can do triplets at 70 should I change the tempo each time?)
Fuck scales. What use are they anyway? Just play Bach because his music is like scales except it's actually musical and you learn actual pieces of music and you don't die of fucking boredom like with playing scales.
scales are great! if you get the right technique it may be fun for you to play scales for hours, at least it's like that for me. But don't practice them too long when it's still a chore for you! If so, I recommend to you the books on piano technique by Cortot, they have everything from beginner level to concert pianist
Pick the tempo and do them all to that tempo. Also pick a tempo for 2 note slurs and then lower it for 3, etc. Up to you.
It’s actually rather complicated as you need to do all of the above and more so to answer your questions: yes
Your slurs need to be on point. The idea behind practicing slurs is to get the technique right for each of them as they’re all different but related motions. So start with single note slur at super slow say 25 bpm or 50 with 1 note / 4 clicks. And take time to let your wrist drop and fully relax. No such thing as too slow. Remember it’s your fingers holding the arm Weight and it’s the finger muscle (lumbrical) activated from the first knuckle off the palm.
Eventually you’ll get up to 8 and 16 note slurs allowing you to go at light speed up the keyboard. At this point you need thumb over tucks, not thumb under, so might as well work on your short leaps
Don’t spend more than 10% of your daily time on scales. Maybe start with them as part of warm up and then if you’re working a lot do another session. Also intervalic scales and double notes and octaves and to an extent arpeggios all fit in the same practice with the slurs and metronome
Slap Free hand to the quarter note and count when practicing for maximum ROI. Don’t worry about HT scales for a while they’re not found in much repertoire until ballades and concertos and shit
Oh yeah and block the scales. Play each tuck as a cluster chord. Be certain u have the right fingerings. Double notes have variations and they all need work. Trills fall in here too
Godowsky has nice arpeggio prep on imslp. Remember this stuff is about where will you be in a year, not tomorrow.
Back off heathen, /classical/ is a very Mahler-loving general.
Xavier Jenkins
Posts objectively the worst version ever
Elijah Wood
>high view count inversely proportional to goodness
Ayden Clark
This, stuck with Solti or Abaddo for the 2nd
Andrew Bennett
This but unironically
Bentley Diaz
Dudameme or Maazel are also good for Mahler I like Maazel's tempi, really lets the strings shine. Otherwise, the strings are just overpowered by the brass.
Nathan Adams
God tier, my personal favorite is his 4th. Very emotionally taxing to listen to tho. His symphonies are all long af and hit all the feels.
If you want to get into Mahler, I would recommend starting with his 5th or 1st. Those are his most accessible works. You wont "get" a Mahler symphony in your first listen. The more you listen to it tho, the more it clicks.
t. Mahler autist
Aaron Bailey
>dudameme Kek
I also like maazel's 2nd, but I like solti for the big brass. Maazel's 6th 1st mvt makes me want to go to sleep tho
Noah Gray
>reddit spacing >"emotionally taxing music" >using "tier" unironically >using "feels" unironically Reddit: the post
Leo Brooks
cool
Charles Bell
There will never be any consensus on which Mahler symphony is best. The disagreement in the people is too much. I've heard people argue the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th, 9th are the best symphony. With other composers, you can tell the general consensus. Beethoven's 3rd, Mozart's 41st, Dvorak's 5th, Bruckner's 8th. But Mahler? No agreement.
Michael Reed
I think there is also no agreement on Beethoven. You could argue 5th and 9th as well, maybe even 7th and 8th if you're patrician, or 6th if you're pleb
Brandon Moore
3rd has more melodic material. 2nd and 4th movements are gems. 5th and 7th are easier to listen to. 9th is nothing special outside the 2nd movement and the part till the fugue in the 4th movement. 6th might be my favorite of them all, to listen to.
Jayden Perez
or Tennstedt
Henry Thomas
There are only two composers that matter
Hunter Hall
Post your favorite arrangement of your favorite piece. Vid related.
Awful taste in Bach, go get the Mass in B minor and BWV 21, BWV 198
Wyatt Morales
based
Tyler Foster
"reddit spacing" is not a thing, people posted like this here before r*ddit even existed. Tier and feels are exclusively Yea Forums phrases. Go fuck yourself, newfag.
Alexander Price
yes Leopold Mozart and Franz Xaver Wolfgang Mozart
Ayden Myers
that is just your personal opinion. The 5th is only easier to listen to, because every pleb knows the first movement. Saying the 9th is nothing special debunks you as turbopleb.
Nope. IIRC there are very few recordings that follow the tempi closely; Benjamin Zander's recording is especially notable because he goes into detail as to why he made those choices, especially because the first movement is fiendishly fast.
Jaxson Hughes
If you like the clarity and elegance of the classical period, very few can even come close. If you can get his sense of humor, he's easily in one of the uppermost echelons of composers ever. If that doesn't resonate with you, however, he can be very dull.
Zachary Richardson
petzold
Ian Russell
I wish I knew your address
Ryan Price
pretzel
Samuel Rogers
Guys this is what I have by Bach What other works by him should I check out next? And how do you approach the overwhelming amount of cantatas he has composed? any recomended selection of those?
>And how do you approach the overwhelming amount of cantatas he has composed? This website puts the Cantatas into tiers classical.net/music/comp.lst/works/bachjs/rateindx.php It is a decent list but you should remember that its just the taste of one person
What's some cool classical music. When I play Beethoven/Mozart/Bach etc. it's not cool. People think old lady music. What's some cool slick classical. Not like cool to the masses but the patrician type of cool that doesn't sound cheesy to the masses.
It isn't that I disagree with his tempo, I do actually quite like the 9th at that speed, but I feel like there's too much that the recording lacks by comparison to some other recordings. The winds and violas especially sound gutless in Zander's recording IMO
that's actually better and much nicer. Just read his work was labeled "degenerate" by the nazis lol
Jordan Murphy
I think Zinman has a better balance overall, but I think that Zander's recording is otherwise cut short by some poor balancing. The tempo does show a hidden beauty, though.
Owen Ross
bump
Lucas Lewis
>As pictorial as a tone poem, this documents one of the most horrifying moments in world history. ... Terror. Screams. Michael Steinberg on Krzysztof Penderecki's composition Threnody for the Victims of Hiroshima (For the Love of Music, Oxford U. Press, 2006, p.174)
Penderecki's original title was "8:37". Penderecki was advised by some music bureaucrat to change the title so as to put an ideologically more advantageous face on his extremely dissonant modernist composition. There is no way Steinberg, with his impressive music credentials, did not know about the origins of the composition's title. Which means that he simply could not resist the satisfaction of repeating a conveniently anti-American myth. I suspect that, along with many American leftist "intellectuals", his heart never bled for those hundreds of thousands of American boys killed by the Japanese in the Pacific. After all, when you pluck an 18-year old boy from a farm in Nebraska, give him all of 30 days of basic training, put an M1 rifle in his trembling hands, and ship him to the front line - well, the boy ain't a civilian no more, right? He is now a professional soldier whose death (even when multiplied by hundreds of thousands) should never budge the arrow of a firmly anti-American moral compass...
I didn't call you gay I called you a faggot, faggot.
Jacob Jenkins
How to even get into Haydn? I can't possibly listen to hundred symphonies and string quartets.
Ian Anderson
>mfw have been exploring second-raters of late Honestly quite a bit more of an interesting exercise, as none are quite so unassailable as the masters. What are some lesser-known second- or even third-raters to delve into?
>want to be a mega epic rock composer like Zappa >don't want to be poor >want a job that pays well and is related to my composing in some way or another (work with music or music equipment, able to wear headphones, etc) >don't want a job that sucks the free time out of my life Well fucking hell I've wasted two years in university already and I still don't know what I'd like to be doing. Any actual composers in here that could give an idea to a young, impressionable college student maybe?
Cooper Walker
>mega epic rock composer like Zappa you have to go
>mega epic rock composer like Zappa Hmm thats not how music works in 2019 sweetie You can still get work by being a good musician tho I have a 20 yo friend, he's a drummer in a military orchestra and he has a metal band and they do alot of touring since the metal/rock scene from my country is very strong, he makes enough money to live by himself, of course his future its still unclear even if he's making enough money now
Daniel Hernandez
his instrument people sucked cock but he picked the best singers
Leaping into the dim5 in the upper voices, having the min7 be the outer interval, the repeated cross-relation of a/a# between cello and violin and, lastly, the V7-bVI deceptive cadence. It's part spacing, but arguably even more so the preparation (leaping into a melodic apex that's harmonically dissonant and contradicts a recent a natural), with a resolution that shares no common pitches and that forms a lot of semitonal relationships with the V7.
Jonathan Ortiz
I've been playing piano for years (non-classically trained) and have no idea wtf these terms mean. What is a slur?
Is there a resource I can use to learn what more about classical piano articulation?
Brody Phillips
Mediocre to cringe in virtually all 18th and 19th century material, often very based in 20th century stuff that benefits from the kind of rhythmically understated textural polish and surface sheen he's famous for
Really, there's no conductor I like 100% of the time, usually people who excel in one repertoire fail in another. Karajan tried to record the entire mainstream canon though, so there's just a lot of obvious duds.
Jordan Cruz
Should I do some ad hoc analysis/commentary on pieces I find interesting in here, along with timestamps for a performance and score excerpts? I'm doing my first pre-concert lecture in a few months and I'd like to practice/see what amount of technical detail makes sense
Isaiah Lopez
Go for it dude
Benjamin Lee
Give me recommendations that are more interesting or I'll just do some underappreciated late Mozart chamber music like the quartets he didn't dedicate to Haydn
Caleb Davis
Brahms Horn Trio?
Adam Morales
Yea sure, I'll probably do a read/listen/comment session of it Friday afternoon east burger time
Charles Collins
I'd like to see an analysis of Webern's variations for orchestra, op.30.
There's no other tonality other than major and minor, brainlet.
Carson Williams
what about modes or atonal / serial techniques, or hybrids of tonal and serial a la Rautavaara? or bimodal ie. Bartok? Also maqams and non-western scales
Hello, classic bros. Help, cant remember name of classic composer. So I was watching this documentary on rocknroll like 6 years ago and they were talking about proto-proto-rock and stuff, like Tchaikovsky was the rockiest classical fellow etc. But there was another one composer that overused bass instruments in his performances so much that sometimes people had their eardrums ripped. Who that could be?
Daniel Ortiz
>Modes modal >Atonal/serial atonal >Hyrids of tonal neotonality >Bimodal it's fucking bimodal then >Non-western it's not fucking tonal then Learn to use proper terminology; tonality cannot be anything other than the major/minor system.
Benjamin Anderson
please not chopin
Logan Gonzalez
don't swear
Matthew Lopez
no shit, all the things I mentioned are outside of tonality. Your comment of "There's no other tonality other than major and minor" should have been the beginning and end of the retardation train, I guess I shouldn't have replied to it seeing as you're one of these very dense-yet-pedantic types.
Logan Turner
As a 'serious' lyrical concert composer of more than half a century who had to endure the dodecaphonic madness of mid 20th-century academia, and who daily rubbed shoulders with the deans of 12-tone ivory-towerism such as composer George Perle (author of "12-tone Tonality') and Luigi Dallapiccola (during year at the Conservatory of Bologna) I found immense therapeutic delight in this perceptive & clever send-up of a style which, as the superlative Maurice Ravel told Alma Mahler after she took him to a concert of Schoenberg's, ". . .That's not music - that was born in the laboratory!" Indeed. Nevertheless, aside from providing several generations of spiritually disconnected and therefore uninspired 'composers' a rational infrastructure for the self-consciously convoluted, dense and meaningless works, it did have one immensely redeeming benefit which ultimately wound up fertilizing the creative lives of all subsequent composers - it opened the Pandora's Box of infinite harmonic (or, if you are too hyper-intellectual to countenance that word, 'combinatorial' possibilities, which, in the hands of gifted, inspired composers such as Samuel Barber, resulted in music of far deeper, more expansive tonality and harmonic gravitas. Thank goodness I was too stubborn and awake to ever mistake this absurd musical version of 'The Emperor's New Clothes' to ever be taken in by the epidemic, no matter how many willing clones jumped on the bandwagon.
Indeed, I recall, one day, after one of Dr. Perle's incomprehensible harmony classes (my first harmony/theory professor!), during which we studied a romantic string quartet, how, in a rare moment of unguarded candor, he gazed almost longingly at the score upon the keyboard and mused aloud, as if to himself, ". . .sometimes I wish I could still write in that style. . ." - a mind-blowing confession from the most cerebral of musical minds (he once said, "At one point in my life, as a boy, I was at a place where I could have become either a mathematician or a musician - it all rested on a dime, when something somebody said tipped me into music.,"). . .But his candid comment had spilled the beans. . .and confirmed what I had already heard in several works I had pre-listened to in the University library, in which I could distinctly discern a submerged lyricism struggling to emerge from an engulfing maelstrom of dodecaphonic chaos - lovely parallel sixth chords whose evocative flow were effectively disguised by a fabric which less discerning ears would fail to penetrate. After the class had adjourned, I waited and asked Dr. Perle, "Why do you feel you can't write music like that anymore?" (because, of course, I suffered no such crippling paranoia about creating a pure and singable melody, just as did Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, Chopin, Puccini, Ravel and Barber. He considered me for a moment, and then, failing, I think, to realize just how extensive my own immersion in the infrastructure of musical history might be, he said, "Well. . .you'd have to understand the history of music," - meaning, of course, that he felt time and cultural tide had painted him into the corner he was trapped in.
Jeremiah Phillips
And yet, in retrospect, as with all other similarly afflicted souls, it was, in a very real sense, 'all in his head,' and not a reality in any sense of the word other than artistic or social convention. In that moment, despite my genuine respect for his astute mind and his devotion to music, I felt - and still feel - a pang of compassion, perhaps even pity, for the man. Even now, after 55 years of writing lyrical, melodic, harmonically ingenious music, I have come to see that we are never in danger of somehow falling 'back into the past' and betraying our time and place; rather, the lyricism emerges with a new and unique contemporaneity, and if we are emotionally honest, we need never fear violating the art we are so passionate about. . .but it must be approached with love, or, more precisely, deep, affectionate care, rather than hyper-intellectual cleverness.
Joshua Stewart
And I thought I was too far up my own ass about classical music
You shouldn't have replied because you asked stupid shit. Muh pedantic hurts my brain isn't an argument, there are obvious differences in these categories; learn your shit.
Joshua Gonzalez
Scelsi.
Christian Collins
>hurts my brain who are quoting
Jonathan Hughes
It hurts you to hear someone being correct about things so you just call it "pedantic". Go ahead and call modality tonality and stay a retard, it's your choice.
start with london symphonies i suppose, even though the earlier ones are also great
Charles Johnson
Classical is obsolete. Electronic music is the future. And yes I know there is electronic classical but that's not what I'm talking about. Classical has nowhere else to go, there is no boundary left to be broken down, at least not one that makes a difference in the actual music. Meanwhile there are many new electronic artists pushing boundaries in a popular music context. Inb4 popular music is shit, that's a fedora-tier opinion. Also classical before the 20th century was kinda shit. It was just "muh instruments", the revolution of electronic music is what opened the doors to actual interesting stuff.
There is a huge mistaken notion that counterpoint must be in contrary motion -- this is a later idea, not a rule. Counterpoint is independent lines working together, in stricter species definition as set in ratio of so many pitches set against so many others.
You're welcome. Someplace on TC, I gave an analysis, quite similar. The piece and question cover two of some of my pet peeves: 1.) to be counterpoint, it must look and sound somewhat like what Bach did with it. (Lol & HORRORS!) 2.) Chopin wrote pretty music of little substance. (Lol & HORRORS!)
Ryder Diaz
Mendelssohn, Wagner and Pachelbel
Lucas Jones
>tfw the Russian five >tfw the Russian soul Any recs for music that takes a you to a faraway distant land? besides Debussy and Ravel, Ives and Barber, I can't think of anyone else that has that effect on me
Studying counterpoint back from square 1. Can anyone critique my cantus firmi? I'm reading Counterpoint in Composition and these are my attempts at correcting the bad firmi in example 1-22 on page 12
Is Tchaikovsky putting cannons in his Overture the equivalent of rappers putting gunshot samples in their hip hop albums?
Tyler Smith
The "major/minor system" is not a coherent system at all, but rather a collection of musical techniques that exploit sounding materials and human perception and cognition in a rather particular way. Seriously, there is none - not one - uncontroversial theory of tonality. It doesn't exist outside of concrete, historical styles. You can't even properly delineate between "modality" - which really wasn't based on modes at all, which were but a means of classifying melodic archetypes - and "tonality". What people like to call "modality" boils down to 1) no preference for authentic root movements and thus a 2) lesser importance of dominant and quasi-dominant resolutions along with 3) less use of inversions. None of these can be derived from the concept of "mode". And they don't disappear in so-called "functional harmony" either - when Mozart wants to evoke an ancient sound, that's what he goes for. So do Bruckner or Wagner.
Benjamin Gomez
I forgot to put Scriabin in my list, but gracias
Michael Rodriguez
Self-hating jew, he wanted to go back to Auschwitz
Kevin Miller
Thinking of counterpoint as "lines" is actually already a modern definition, the original meaning is purely vertical.
The most useful, general definition of conceiving of it is as a means of conceiving harmony on a per-interval basis, i.e. as pairs of notes (usually of unequal structural significance - tenor/cantus, then tenor/contratenor, then cantus/contratenor, in many medieval idioms).
Chase Sanchez
>ouch my brain
Gavin Brown
Any sensible thinker is hurt by naive Bend Shapiro style Platonism
Wyatt Cooper
But my functional harmony derived from the harmonic series
Joshua Allen
The only thing you can reasonably derive from the overtone series is the major triad and maybe the barbershop seventh chord, but I've heard a lot of harmonic timbres and I've never heard the latter resolve into the former in any single tone.
It's almost like humans don't get their artistic means directly from nature, but rather embellish on those givens in myriad ways.
Jack Lopez
>Fuck scales. What use are they anyway? t. shit player.
>you asked stupid shit They were hardly questions, more rhetorical questions aimed at pointing out systems that are not tonality. You got pedantic about the word "Tonality" and sperged out, so I decided to back away and let you sperg alone.
His only problem was writing purely in the old style - all his pieces like this are mediocre at best.
>There is a huge mistaken notion that counterpoint must be in contrary motion This has never been a notion, not even in fux. There are many types of motion you can use even in fux-ian counterpoint. oblique, similar, contrary, parallel...
>And how do you approach the overwhelming amount of cantatas he has composed? I'm listening to all of them at the moment. Just finished the secular ones yesterday. Listening to Suzuki's recordings.
Joseph Cook
>Ludwig Van Beethoven - String Quartet No. 6 in B-flat major, Op 18 >Ludwig Van Beethoven - String Quartet No. 7 in F major, Op. 59 >Ludwig Van Beethoven - String Quartet No 3 in D major, Op. 18 >not the late string quartets >Ludwig Van Beethoven - Symphony No. 7 in A major >not the 9th
While the early Beethoven quartets aren't that special, the Op. 59 No.1 is one of the most expansive, dynamic pieces he's ever written, and the cyclical attacca nature of the whole set is unprecedented even in the late quartets.
Also, the 9th is a pretty spotty composition - the first movement and third are as good as anything he's ever written in those genres (sonata-allegeo and slow movement), but the second movement is horrendously monotonous, while the fourth movement is an awkward set of variations on a tune fit for a nursery rhyme (Wagner, Verdi and Brahms didn't agree on much - except the Ninth's spotty nature). Among the late variation finales in Beethoven, it can't hold a candle to Op. 106, 109, or 111. It's better than the Große Fuge, I'll grant you that. But overall, the Eroica is just by far the most consistently inspired one.
Dominic Nguyen
>It's better than the Große Fuge, I'll grant you that. I will beat your ass, you bastard.
t. played piano for 9 months and then quit because got bored of playing the same fucking scales up and down
Levi Taylor
>when Mozart wants to evoke an ancient sound Mozart pieces like this?
Gavin Turner
>unrelenting repetition Check >lack of invention Check >basic polyphony, like 4 true stretta over 13 minutes, only of bare, undiminuted interval patterns Check
It's basically proto-Stravinsky.
There's more fugal technique in these 3 minutes thirty than in the entire Große Fuge: youtu.be/OyOQ0QvnE3c
Oliver Garcia
It's more common in sacred music, but take this theme for a highly unusual sonata-variation hybrid: He gets to ii via plagal root movement, all rising fifths, C: I-V-ii, then he tonicizes ii with V/ii, the next rising fifth. So then we get our first dominant tonic resolution, V/ii-ii, and what beginners would consider a cadence in C: ii-V7-I in m.5, except it's not: The V7-I actually prolong the ii due to rhythmic position and the neighbor-note motion f-e-f n the top voice. I resolves to ii here, giving you that "Dorian" sound. Until ii becomes V/V in m. 7, at least. That's a way you can embed a modal sound, where the center is less determinate in spite of pure diatony (m. 5-6) in an otherwise dominant-tonic functional passage. Alluding to genres like that is a staple of Mozart. The slow movement from the E-flat major quarter dedicated to Haydn is another example, with a lot of harmony based on fauxbordon elaborations and the polyphonic treatment of the most basic motifs imaginable: The rising fifth and the alberti bass. I fucking love those movements.
Came to Yea Forums just for this thread. Wasn't sure if such a thing existed. thought I was some sort of patrician for listening to obscure diy bands and p4k core. I really need to expand my taste. I watched the force majeure and really liked the score. Anyone reading this blog post pls reply with your favorite songs. I'll be going through the op in the mean time.
Nathan Flores
>But overall, the Eroica is just by far the most consistently inspired one. agreed. i'm especially fond of that variation/fugue finale
for me it's 3>8>7>6>5>9>4>1>2
David Cruz
High quality taste, 8 is more representative of late Beethoven in many ways than the 9, in particular it's blend of nostalgia, folksy humor, and sheer obsessive violence.
Ryan Sanders
I'm a decent enough fan of Zehetmair's violin work to have found an interest in this set; lo-and-behold it's yet another period inspired traversal of Brahms' symphonies. I wrote about Venzago many months ago and much of the issues that I had with that set remain here: legato ad naseum and wrong-headed balancing decisions; gone are the farting contrabassoons - so menacing in Klemperer's set - left in favor for an excess of strings. Why make Brahms sound like this? So gutless? So lacking in punch? It's a soft dud. At least I can grant compliments to the tempi, they are as swift as they come. Though it's amazing that it manages to bore at this speed.
Skimmed Brahms 4, I because it's the hardest to get right.
I swear there was one violin left playing during the melodic apex of the coda, the rest chickened out. Also the tempo is not that unusual, especially given the tiny orchestra. The baseline is basically equivalent to Monteux, Paray and Markevitch, who are rather stable, and well short of Busch (who beats Gardiner, not just in tempo). De Sabata, Furtwängler '43, and Mengelberg are very close in timing (barely over 12 min), but obviously much faster at times and much slower elsewhere.
Point is, I don't think it's fast in that movement. It's moderate.
I forgot Weingartner, who's closer to 11 than to 12 mins, too
Connor Moore
well that's funny, I read a critic about this Brahms cycle yesterday. The critic mentioned that you barely hear the horns, violas and woodwinds and attributed them to the weakness of Zehetmair's conducting skills. The main goal was a lightweight HIP on modern instruments recording. Listening to the start of the symphony no 1, I can hear it's a legato shitfest. youtube.com/watch?v=3K-9Qyl6pZk
Christopher Garcia
Let's post good Brahms instead.
The French excel in him. Listen to those crisp, clear-cut off-beat winds, the horn counterpoints during the beginning of the transition.
>never been a notion >never been a notion >never been a notion >never been a notion >never been a notion >never been a notion >never been a notion >never been a notion >not even in fux >not even in fux >not even in fux >not even in fux >not even in fux >not even in fux >not even in fux >not even in fux >not even in fux What do you think the word notion means, something only found in books of some authority???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? Something that doesn't exist among laypeople??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? That'd be very strange!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
