Beethoven was black, prove me wrong

Beethoven was hyperbrachycephalic, a trait completely absent in negroids. If anything Beethoven was mongol and likely of hunnic heritage.

what does it matter what race he is?

Mali, Abyssinia, Carthage, Ghana empire, I guess the Muslim dynasties.

It makes /pol/ cry and that's funny.

god you retards will believe anything you read on the internet won't you?

based

any actual proof that he was black?

>If this is true

Emphasis on the word if. I wanted someone to explain the reasoning behind the statement.

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No. Negros should be happy enough that they've got Duke Ellington.

>'fro haircut
based mothafuka rocking a fro a century before his soul brothers

Maria Magdalena Keverich looks pretty white to me?

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Left is a brotha

shit Dr. 1860s here with the scientific take lol

It's true, Romans built all those public baths and used them for gay sex and jerking off in but never bathed

Alexander Pushkin, Russia's equivalent to shakespear was also a black dude often portrayed whiter in paintings

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From Beethoven to peanut butter. Blacks are Gods

got any proof?

its well known common knowledge

it is pretty known

It's the times. I'm sure Bach will soon have been a transgender too.

>it's common knowledge
if you guys don't have any proof, just say so next time

Ethiopians aren't black.

if you'd read any of his work you'd know (or if you ever read anything about russian lit). smdh here's an article about it theguardian.com/books/booksblog/2017/dec/19/pushkins-pride-how-the-russian-literary-giant-paid-tribute-to-his-african-ancestry

There's no reason to even consider this could be true, you retard.

ITT /pol/ gets BTFO

have white people ever accomplished anything? or are they just good at taking credit?

What???

octoroon

he was from cameroon you dunce

they all were the descendants of black military men that served in european mercenary armies

Enslaving people of color

Bullshit. Andre Dumas was black as fuck and he didn't need to hide it to the extent you're claiming Beethoven did.

no, his grategrandfather was kidnapped from west africa and was presented as a slave to Peter the Great

Too bad it is though.

it's not that hard to understand. europeans only nailed down realistic painting relatively recently in this time and they didnt have the exposure to black people that we have. it's possible they didnt even really notice his skin color.

A black great grandfather... That's a long shot

looks like a ginger

>mercenary armies
cool way of saying slaves

Alexandre Dumas? MOAR LIEK Alexandre Dumbass AMIRITE xD

They learnt that when they came to africa and saw that some black people were the pets of other black people.

African horners absolutely hate niggers and they wouldn't appreciate Americans trying to erase their ethnic identity.
He himself was Russian and had like 1/8 African ancestry, and his great-grandfather was a horner.

>it's possible they didnt even really notice his skin color.
This is the single thing in this thread that is the least possible

>2019
>mixed = black
i want out of this lunacy

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Gotta take your victories where you can get them. And this is where you can get them.

I'm 1/64th Cherokee

his great grandfather was a slave and he was pretty much perceived as "the african" in his society. keep in mind everyone else would have been 100% russki
the fact remains that this was the guy who fathered modern russian literature, and you would not consider him white or even a slav
idk wht youre trying to say but is cameroon part of the "horn"

1/1024th Eskimo checking in

do you remember when you first noticed black people ? (maybe only people who grew up in cities will have this experience)
i didnt realize what about them it was that was different until my parents pointed the skin color out to me (maybe age 4). just knew they were different somehow

I understand it completely, man. The thing is, I find it highly fucking unlikely. Although society in late 17th century Europe was racially segregated, it was to a lesser extent than the US, to name the obvious example. And even then, Beethoven was a fucking celebrity. Everyone would have known -and endlessly commented- about his ethnicity, and his critics would have brough it to attention right away.
Historical revisionism is dangerous, man. First Christ was white and now Beethoven was black. Fucking hell.

he would have been the only black dude many had ever seen. i think it's entirely possible they didnt think "hey he has brown skin that is a black people thing" but more like "wow he's tan"

I can't remember a time when I didn't see it. But I can certainly remember a time where I didn't know there were any cultural differences that skin color could be a pretty good predictor of, and those were sweeter times man, not having to deal with that shit

>tfw 1/32th sephardic jewish

Hand over the shekels and nobody gets hurt, goyim

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lol, black people are ridiculous

the thing is, before i found out, i did know black people. my nanny was black. i just didnt notice the skin.
i really think that if no one had pointed it out to me it might just be another thing like eye color

I grew up in a wealthy area in New Jersey and all the black families acted very white.

the literal original post holds a reason to consider this possibly true, you retard

Yakub, the founder of the white race, was black, too

no, but Ernest Hemingway might have been

this thread should also have some information on societies' development of color perception and color names.
we now are experts at discerning between dark and light skin tones, but it may not have always been the case.
Linguists have noticed that a culture will develop color names in a particular order, starting with maybe 2 colors (white and black), eventually differentiating to the rainbow we perceive now.
In some languages they dont have different words for i.e. "blue" or "green", just one word ("bleen," say). thus, blue and green objects are perceived as different shades of the same color bleen.
its entirely possible that a society not exposed to the variety of skin colors and social factors attached would not perceive a distinction between dark and light skin tones. no one would have mentioned beethoven's skin because they didnt even have a word for it. they didnt see it

no no no the default human race are the one with color. we should call white people the non colored people from now on

>the literal original post holds a reason to consider this possibly true
maybe if you have the IQ of a somalian

it's People of Light, shitskin

look at his wig, he was definitely a drag queen

see my post above yours. the patrician solution is to adjust societal perception to the point that we're all called "skin tone people"

COPE ncp

now, this is just dumb, man. Tone it down.

>tone it down
i see what you did there

srsly tho, that was really stupid of you

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explain why you think that ;)

nah, man, just take a trip outside of your post-racial fiction and see for yourself how this shit works so you can barely start to imagine what is was like back then.

no answer, cool

They were generals.

who are you even referring to here though

I mean, isn't it just like they pointed out another thing like eye colour to you though? I saw they were black, but it was insignificant at the time. The significance comes over time as you learn that there is such a thing as acting black and acting white, and it all goes downhill from there. It's just one of those things that is very easy to make worse, but making it better to any significant degree seems almost impossible

there's plenty of photos of him online
here's one

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>African features
he looks like reviewbrah

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that's not beethoven retard

weak bait

>black people are arguing over the historical race of a dog now
wew

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abram_Petrovich_Gannibal
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas-Alexandre_Dumas

This. Yes, Yakub the evil scientist was black

Jesus you guys are dumb.

The only reason cringeworthy black nationalists think they see a resemblance of certain European historical figures to themselves is that they frequently carry over 30% European admixture.

I hope this entire thread is ironic because it has extremely little connection to Yea Forumssic and more towards identity /pol/itics, fucking niggers.

also remember:
not white -> black
see:
ancient egyptians and Jesus

Abram Gannibal was a general and a distinguished engineer.

One drop rule, faggot.

How embarrassing

Why are Americans so obsessed with race? You live in the most multicultural country in the world. Either move somewhere else or stop complaining

There are no historical accounts during his lifetime that refer to the composer as black or a “moor”, and the Viennese of the 18th and 19th Centuries were well aware of persons of African descent, referred to at the time as moors and mulattos, such as George Bridgetower, who was a famous violinist and creative collaborator of Beethoven’s.

limelightmagazine.com.au/news/new-website-claims-beethoven-was-african/

Fuck racebaiters and traitors

One drop rule

>You live in the most multicultural country in the world
you mean an oligarchy founded on the institution of slavery?
the americas were former slave colonies dood

Oh wow, when you strip 300 million of cultural identity they might start looking for it themselves. I'm literally s h a k i n g

And the horrible answer was given by yourself in the very next breath

we live in a nation based almost completely on white culture, which is why the lesser races call it white supremacy to hold them to our laws and standards of behavior.

And it's a good thing, too. If we had taken black culture into consideration when founded, we'd have put slavery in the constitution, since blacks brought slavery here, and every single black empire to ever exist subsisted off the practice.

>since blacks brought slavery here,
yeah but the british, dutch, portuguese, and spanish played into the african warlords hands and bought the slaves from them. thus exacerbating the institution. if anything the europeans got the raw deal while the african warlords got guns, european fashion, and down the road, international aid and a free meal ticket.

It was Jewish ships that brought the slaves to America.

Yea Forums in a nutshell

deny all photo and video evidence, just go with your gut and how you "feel" man

hahaha pathetic

>beethoven
>photo and video evidence
oh, you mean a screencap of some black retard's facebook posts?

these are all written descriptions of him at the time:

“Wide, thick-lipped mouth, short, thick nose, and proudly arched forehead.”

“Negroid traits, dark skin, flat, thick nose.”

“ His face reveals no trace of the German… He was so dark that people dubbed him ‘The Spagnol’ [dark-skinned]”

“Coal-black hair… stood up around his head.”

“His somewhat flat, broad nose and rather wide mouth, his small, piercing eyes and swarthy [dark] complexion, pockmarked into the bargain, gave him a strong resemblance to a mulatto”

“Complexion was brownish, his hair was thick, black, and bristly”

“Short, stocky, broad shoulders, short neck, round nose, blackish-brown complexion”

It's clearly not a facebook post, it's just a tweet of a real photo, did you not try reverse image searching the photo? did you not think to even research the topic? you're just a complete moron who thinks any piece of information you haven't heard of must not be true and must just be the "black retards" trying to brainwash you? Why are you so pathetic?

I've met Beethoven, he's actually Chinese

he looks like a weird little gremlin like most germoids

reminder that benjamin franklin described the germans as swarthy and negroid-like. he was obviously not wrong.

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that could mean he's just a celt-iberian/mediterranean

germans don't have dark complexion or thick bristly hair

nah, the lombards did

None of that is the description of a black person. You can tell because of one very important piece of context you omitted: they're describing Beethoven , who was a typical European

>It's clearly not a facebook post, it's just a tweet
lol, oh my bad. It's still a picture deprived of intelligent captioning and given a fantasy narrative by a low-IQ ape-person

>Why are you so pathetic?
Wait, do you really believe beethoven was a coon? Damn son

I'm from the UK and my dad's side of the family came over from France in the Middle Ages so I'm unsure whether to check "White British" or "White European" on forms sometimes, does that count?

Kek

user this is Yea Forums, home of /pol/, not a scientific forum with a nuanced perspective on world history and the ways language directly shapes perception in different cultures

what's more kek is he's always bitching about people moving into our rural town from other parts of the country and ruining it but he moved here from London as a kid as part of a massive wave of post-war development that first began to urbanise the area + still speaks in a full cockney accent while the actual local dialect is nearly extinct, boomers are fascinating creatures

WE WUZ BEETHOVANZ N SHIET

wow it's almost like reacting to circumstances is something people do.

>prove me wrong

You've proved yourself wrong by definition with the information you have provided.

"Mother was a moor", so at BEST, he was half atypical sub-saharan negroid, providing the mother in question was pure negroid and not partly Arab, Berber or Andalusian in descent.

it's not bait. it's just a joke.

>moor
>subsaharan
lol, no. That's just more afro-revisionist fairy tales.

So a half white/black with aprox 50% african genes is black-african? Explain.

>so
>shit no one said
yikes

What I said was the view of moors as typical subsaharan blacks is fallacious

>take ancestry DNA test
>99% spanish and italian
>1% swedish
>0% black or jewish DNA
Bow down before me lineagelets

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Did anyone describe his two brothers in the same manner? If not, get out of here with this shit.

Why reply to my post then silly? Irrelevant.

Looks like my brother and he's 100% white. He has that downie nose that makes him look like he has Afro characteristics

>What I said was the view of moors as typical subsaharan blacks is fallacious
This is true, the majority of "moors" would be described today as middle eastern looking. Think Syrian.

In the 18h century?
Yeh I'm going to say your theory isn't right

Lol

Don't be so rude