Is he as bad as everyone says, /moo/?

?
Because there were no loud guitars? kek

Yes
His lyrics were always shit they just fit when he was in his 20s in the middle of an angsty time for music. It's laughable now.

Obviously he is a great guitarist though, Pumpkins are very influential. 1979 is one of the best pop songs of the 90s too. No one can dislike that song

Na he based
Of course he’s never gonna be as good as he was in the 90s but that’s a given
There is some good stuff from nu-pumpkins like some tracks off Zeitgeist and Monuments and the whole of Oceania
His IG is pretty good, he always does fan QnA’s

>His lyrics were always shit
How so?

Because it has shit songs like appels and oranjes, the tale of dusty, daphne descends and pug.

Really? Does any other musician do that?

What's shit about them? They're great

Pug is one of the best songs you dum dum

I meant perfect. Pug is good perfect is shit.

Is all of Smashing Pumpkins slow? I've heard a few songs they seem a little boring.

They're melodramatic adolescent whining. Which is perfect for the music he made I'm not even criticizing that. They just don't age well and I feel silly listening to them when I'm not in high school anymore. I guess shit isn't the best term, they're very honest they're just too overt and not strong enough to warrant it. It comes off as whiny rather than confessional.

Not to the extent he does
Recently he did a competition on IG with the fans where they decided what were the most overlooked gems from each period of SP and the person with the most votes won a prize from him

No they have a lot of fast songs. Geek USA for one. But they change from fast to slow moments.

I've only heard Siamese Dream and Melon Collie. Most of their songs are mid to fast tempo guitar, some are even closer to punk rock but they vary a lot, especially on Mellon Collie

reminder that based billy is woke on lizard people

Reminder that Billy saw a shapeshifter
But he won't talk about it

It was just darcy

album where he jumped the shark and never looked back except briefly for machina 1/2. precursor to his solo album and overall just a garbage album when compared to the previous three.

>melodramatic
That's like any other song by Corgan, so it's not relevant
>adolescent whining
How so?
>They just don't age well
How so?
>I feel silly listening to them
That seems like your problem, not the music's
>they're very honest they're just too overt
Which is the real reason they are great
>only I say how art should be!
No

They don't age well because when Siamese Dream came out, fuzzy guitar songs where you whine about how sad you are were popular. Now they sound dated like the car rock of the 70s but not as bad. They're whiny and melodramatic (which is relevant because people other than Corgan exist) because he's not even finding good ways to phrase what he's saying, he's literally just complaining in song form and when he does attempt poetic lyrics they're very heavy handed and cliched. Nirvana for example, aged much better because they didn't do that.

It is my problem if I feel silly, like I said they fit perfectly with the time and style of the music. I've only heard their second and third records to so I suppose I'm not fairly judging his progression as a lyricist. But given that picture of him old and fat and still wearing rock and roll makeup I can't imagine he ever had much interesting to say

>judging music in terms of fad
Stop
>he's literally just complaining in song form
How are the aforementioned songs complaining? What is he complaining about?

I don't think you've listened to the album we're discussing

I'm saying it's only good in context. If you don't judge it according to fad it's pretty shit lyricism with great guitar work

And no I haven't, like I said I only heard their 2nd and 3rd

>pretty shit lyricism
Ooops, you have yet to answer why

Also
>this album is shit even though I haven't listened to it
Yikes

>music needs context to be "good"

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Nonsense, Machina I and II and Oceania are all fantastic.

>Oceania
>fantastic
Yikes

Also there was enough faults in Machina 1 and 2 to exclude it from being "fantastic"

Go to bed, Billy.

Reminder that Big Dimes Billy is saving wrestling

Na hes ok

A RAT IN A KIAYAYJA

Best thing he did was shill the Frogs

I just might be a black/doom metal pleb but does lyricism really matter in a band like Pumpkins to many people?

he's as BALD as everyone says
gotem

balder, like a baby

He was the best songwriter of the 90s though. Who cares about the rest? It's not like you would be his friend.