Ever since getting into this genre I have notice one thing, that it seems to be a battle of authenticity and what supposedly is and isn't industrial.
I can imagine this is a huge issue with something like punk or worse, rock music purism, but it's especially awful in the Industrial.
I remember in the early days of my exposure to the genre I would have to weed my way through ignorant gen-x elitists on various forums and social networking sites, the types with green hair and who don't actually enjoy anything other than EBM and electro-industrial, but then you have the even more obnoxious elitists ... the ones that mostly lurk forums like this (and RYM) who assume that just because Mr. X hung out with Genesis P-Orridge and Peter Christopherson and they happen to make funny sounding noise music that they're "Industrial".
Nobody can give a concrete and clear answer on what is Industrial and the issue here is that the people that are credited for inventing the genre never even gave a clear explanation of what their sound was, in fact from all the interviews I have read I don't think that Throbbing Gristle even sought out to create a genre, rather they wanted to explore music and performance art itself.
So then, how should we define Industrial as a genre and specific sound.
Industrial music - the most misunderstood genre?
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Nothing after 1983 is industrial and most stuff before 1983 isn't either.
They're label was called Industrial Records. It literally comes from that. Plus it was made with machine equipment and a sense of a cold and removed sensibility, akin to the industrialisation of society, especially in early 1970s British society.
why yes I like industrial music
Yes, we all know about Industrial Records.
That isn't the point and the vagueness of your post is literally the cause of the issue and what I was talking about in the OP.
The JWO globohomos trying to indoctrinate the youth by leading them to Genesis P-Orridge.
I can see it now, 10 years from now there will be a biopic.
Stop being a literal genre autist and enjoy the music for whatever fucking reason you like. Being beholden to these terms is just idiocy.
bump
>ignores metal
this is a fair post
this happens a lot, as one enters into something and learns about the nooks and corners...you assume someone know something and thence a name. but its just as often not trure as true. Like ive always though neubaten as 'industrial' - using the bits and pieces of the modern world to make music that's clanky as a factory and as noisy as a city street. but then theres shit like skinny puppy....does anyone even actually like skinny puppy?
and why do people think neubaten is avante is any fashion really? its all 4/4 clanking with an occasional gem (like that pop song with the light bulbs).
so, there is no specific sounds, just people who tried their hand at something, with more of less success.
don't be a racist cunt
Industrial was always meant to evolve into a big spectrum of genres. At least that's what Sleazy, Chris and Cosey intended, and Gen probably too, seeing where he went with PTV. Industrial nowadays means pretty much everything with dirty, processed, noisy sounds reminiscent of okdschool industrial and noise scenes. Being elitist one way or the other is retarded.
the answer is that industrial isn't really a very defined genre, so the only thing people have to work off of is "abrasive electronic music."
Later Neubauten go more into avant and then flip into full goth.
I fucking love Skinny Puppy before Too Dark Park
How can you like Einsturzende Neubauten but not Skinny Puppy?
Go listen to Vivisectvi and Last Rights.
But yeah, it always really pissed me off how people would say "Skinny puppy and NIN aren't Industrial!" but would then go on to claim bands like Swans or Einsturzende Neubauten are ... as if they have anything at all in common with Throbbing Gristle or that sound.
It's not enough to just define Industrial music as "non-organic sounding electronic music that reflects a cold and dehumanizing society", there needs to be an actual sound you can point to if it is to be a genre.
What was Throbbing Gristle trying to achieve sonically, what are their characteristics that can be associated with a genre called "Industrial".
There seems to be a philosophy, but no direct conscious effort to create a musical genre called "Industrial".
I would say bands like Atrax Morgue or Genocide Organ could be considered Industrial, they certainly have sonic similarities with Throbbing Gristle, they also have a similar philosophical approach.
Neubauten's association is because whenever anyone thinks of Industrial the first thing that would come to mind is machinery and construction sounds.
TG was literally "let's do random shit and troll people" and then it stuck. There's no philosophy.
sure guy
id put shit like cabaret Voltaire closer to TG than most 'industrial' stuff lol
but I suppose dance music was a part of things the whole time...?
Show me where TG ever said they were about anything. Give me the quote. None of them knew how to fucking play the instrument, they all only started raking music more seriously after 3rd annual and really after they all went their separate ways. That's why they liked pissnf off the punks so much back in the mid 70s.
theyre artists - they built lives around art - its a bit more than 'trolling' don't you think?
I get where that user is coming from.
See that's the thing about Industrial and what needs to be fixed.
We need clarity.
all these jazz chorus in the same picture
confusion is sex, bb
But they weren't thinking of themselves as artists. Do you even know anything about classic TG? They considered themselves transgressive performance artists, not musician. And transgressive art is basically trolling. What else would you call Cosey swinging above you on a swing, pissing down on your head and laughing about it?
It's like with Metal and Punk, after 3 or more years listening to it and looking it up you'll know it when you hear it, and you can't really ignore it either.
It's like that for any genre, some years ago I was trying to get into Jazz, and I pretty much enjoyed everything I was hearing, I wouldn't be able to tell you what constitutes good jazz or bad jazz, but with time I was picking up stuff here and there and making out my taste.
It's almost like you guys care about the newcomers as if you want to make money by diluting a genre's personality and musicality in favor of wide appeal or something.
None of what you said applies to this thread
Goddamn I love Skinny Puppy
I wish they would go back to their mid 80s sound.
Fucking dumbass ogre was acting like he couldn't understand what fans mean by this and was trying to push Weapon as reflecting their older sound ...
It sounds like a goddamn chiptune album.
At best that could be described as IDM
"Tricks" is a gr8 song thou (the rest of the album was too samey). I dont think we will be getting new SP for a loong time. Since cev decided to stay in japan selling toys and Ogre is touring and probably going for some acting roles.
But yeah, "weapon" wasn't good, specially coming after "handover" that was their best post-reunion album
It's just that fag that only read The Industrial Handbook (published in 1984) and thinks it's the bible of the whole genre. He pops up in every industrial thread and is still butthurt bcs he probably got bullied by SP fans in high school for wearing a NIN shirt or something
>handover
>best post-reunion album
LMAO FUCK NO
Go get your ears cleaned out and re-listen to Mythmaker.
That guy is a clueless idiot like everyone else and the book is not a reliable source for understanding what Industrial music is
I've completely written off any post-Dwyane Skinny Puppy, and just stick to Cevin's solo stuff and projects like Download.
I own all of their albums and Mythmaker wasn't nearly as good, sounded to "basic", like a mix of Ohgr solo and outtakes from TGWOTR. It's alright, but a 6/10 at best. Also "ugli" is the dumbest song SP ever put out (first track is killer thou, even if it's Downsizer 2.0).
Handover really sounds like an upgraded and less dark Last Rights/TDP era album. It has that chaotic feel with a more "pop?" aproach, took me several listens to finally "get it" but it's srsly good, even "Mr. Brownstone" makes sense once you get the overall feel they where going for. And at least it sounds 100% like SP, can't say the same about Weapon or TGWOTR (althou it has some gr8 moments and aged better than expected)
But Dwayne wasn't around when they released some of their best stuff.
Back & Forth is their most TG influenced album and "Sore in a masterpiece" is one of their GOAT
And Remission and Bites are solid 9/10s.
Yeah, he brought in the more experimental side and expanded their sound, but I see it more of a phase. Ogre and Cevin ARE Skinny Puppy
At least he's got a tripcode now so it will be easier to filter him.
I remember when one of the dudes fro Cyanotic visited one of these threads. He seemed like a ultra-chill dude, telling stories about touring with KMFDM amongst others stuff like recording in Ministry's studio and cracking up about the storiea the engineer told him about Al.
Too bad this fag invaded all industrial threads with the same "hurr durr, the genre peaked in 76 and died in 82" bullshit. They used to be cozy