Can Yea Forums confirm or deny this?

only first ten matter

>Country
>Jazz
>Pop
>Samba
>Reggaeton
>Bachata
>House
Those are objectively wrong.

>Dubstep
This one mostly involved both blacks and whites.
The rest is accurate.

why do you care about the opinion of a random individual on twitter?

with an avatar like that they're hardly non-biased, I don't understand why people wake up so angry and say BLACK PEOPLE ACTUALLY INVENTED THIS HERE'S AN UNCITED OPINION. where do they get their energy to be so angry?

the only people that 'invent' genres are music journalists

>where do they get their energy to be so angry?
mainstream media mostly

>thinks reGAYton wasn’t made by blacks
>probably thinks it was made in Puerto Rico and not panama by blacks

what black dude invented ska?

>Dubstep
>This one mostly involved both blacks and whites.
this

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DJ Nelson, who coined the term, is hispanic, which is not black.

>coining a term means you made a genre
It started as dancehall in Spanish anyways

It's literally just WUZing, who gives a shit? Blacks haven't made any rock since the 60s and blues influence in rock was dieing out by the 80s.

ska is a jamaican genre older than reggae

how does that end in Reel Big Fish and Goldfinger?

actually now you say it I can hear the Jamaican vibes, fucking weird

/thread
maybe if she said "inspired by" and I'd agree with probably most of those, not that it matters at all in a modern context

can you confirm or deny whether you were searching 'black people' and 'genres' into twitter to find bait?

Thing invented by WHITE PEOPLE:

1. the internet
2. cell phones
3. the automobile
4. the aeroplane
5. glasses
6. the polio vaccine
7. light bulbs
8. the concepts of art, physics, and philosophy
9. science
10. classical music

and more

Attached: human accomplishment.png (918x543, 413K)

Let's break this down. 99% of the time, all blacks contributed to a genre was a more advanced rhythm section compared to european contemporaries, who had them beat in every other aspect of music.

>Gospel
Christianity was invented by whites, choirs were invented by whites, churches were invented by whites.

>Blues
All instruments involved were invented by whites, but sure, I'll give this one, it's a pretty black genre

>Country
Literally white Appalachians making white music using white instruments

>Pop
Not a genre

>Jazz
Sure, still white instruments, but a lot of great foundational black jazz is out there

>r&b
Ehhh

>rock
Insofar as early rock was basically electric blues, sure. But the farther you go into rock the farther is leaves the blues behind. The pinnacle of rock, prog, has almost no black influence (and what it does have comes from jazz)

>Soul
Blacks do not have a soul

>Funk, ska, reggae, house, dubstep, rap
Excuse me, I thought we were talking about music

>EDM
"Electronic" and "African" are almost mutually exclusive. There are multiple generations of white technological development the negro claims as his own here.

>dancehall
lol good luck building a dancehall out of mud bricks and straw

>trap
Not music

>soul
Nigger you listed this twice

>Samba
Literally Spanish

>etc etc
Go pick cotton

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All stolen from Irish folk music that they shared the cotton fields with.

Things invented by her, the people who liked her tweet, the people who didn't like her tweet, and the people who are discussing the tweet:

>

Jazz did originate from African American people though.
I’m not gonna claim this creating genre bs, because so many factors and influences go into that, but jazz largely originated from black people, and genres black people were prevalent in like blues

20k likes means here message is spreading. Democracy was a mistake

>no prog, metal, post rock, or psych rock
Ok, so nothing that mattered

The silly part of blacks trying to claim genres as their own is that every piece of black music is recorded on instruments invented by whites, notated in white music notation, using the white 12 tone equal temperament system, and only ever borrows certain rhythmic patterns from actual black tribal music. They stand so far on the shoulders of giants they forget where they'd be without.

>prog
>pinnacle of rock
Lmao

Bump

While it was obviously influenced by blues, the very first jass dixieland bands were mostly white.

Genres created by white people

>choral
>opera
>waltz
>romanticism
>folk
>metal
>post rock
>emo
>cerebral music
>Schumann resonance
>alternative
>punk
>vaporwave
>noise
>musique concrete
>drone
>minimalism
>serialism
>ambient
>trance
>techno
>hard bass
>industrial
>pop
>math
>deconstructed club
>marches
>witchhouse
>post-punk
>serenades
>tuvan throat singing
>country
>blastwave
>sound collage
>glitch
>garage
>breakbeat
>dnb
>medieval club
>world music

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Dungeon synth is the whitest genre

>Jazz did originate from African American people though.
Jazz originated from mixed race sons and daughters of French people and the slaves they fucked. Jazz, musically, is derived from European harmony and melody just as much as it is derived from Africa spiritually and rhythmically. Dixieland saw just as many white musicians as it saw mixed African musicians. Some of the most prominent, influential, and respected figures in jazz are white, and worked alongside figures of African descent.
It's the most inclusive, beautiful genre of music known to man. It wasn't like rock music, sourced in the wholly African American blues and co-opted by white people, it was organically born from a beautiful fusion of two different cultures.
I don't even like jazz that much but it's the perfect genre of music.

Hahahaha imagine being proud of this like good job nigger someone who's the same color as you did something hahahaha

black people will rule the world stay scared whiteys

Does She Do Porn

Drone is Asian

Lol

>Some of the most prominent, influential, and respected figures in jazz are white
Such as?

Is this a serious question? Stan Getz, Chet Baker, Glen Miller, Benny Goodman, Tommy Dorsey, Bill Evans, Dave Brubeck, Bix fucking Beiderbecke? Fuck, dude, at least try to think before posting.

>no punk
Good.

Yeah and Django wasn't white but pretty much proves Jazz isn't even an American thing.

Country is white as fuck
Everything else is influenced by blacks not created

>negro spirituals
>gospel
>blues
>jazz
>r&b
>rock and roll
>soul
>funk
>ska
>reggae
>house
>hip hop
>rap
>dancehall
>trap
>soul
>samba
>bachata
Created by black people.

>country
>dubstep
Created by white people.

>reggaeton
Created by mestizo people.

>merengue
Unconfirmed, but probably mestizo.

>pop
>edm
Not genres.

They literally are in some cases (Zeuhl, Hi-NRG, progressive rock, etc). And in some others all early examples of the genre are made by one ethnicity, so her post makes sense.

Electronic dance is not a genre.

No, she's right. Most of those were created by black people.

>What I can say with confidence is that she's full of shit that jazz is a black genre.
It was born out of black people at first. It wasn't until later that white people started to play jazz as well.

House is definitely black you moron. The rest is obviously wrong too with the exception of country.

>the only people that 'invent' genres are music journalists
Musicologists will make research on music genres from before music journalism was a thing, so you are objectively wrong.

They are not ska, just ska influenced punk. That's why.

>10. classical music
Wrong. Indian classical music predates European classical music. I'm pretty sure the same goes for East Asian classical music as well.

>8. the concepts of art, physics, and philosophy
This is obviously bullshit.

lol

>the very first jass dixieland bands were mostly white
This is wrong. Buddy Bolden was black and making jazz during the early 1900s before any other white bands.

Jazz is better than all of those, pleb.

>Genres created by white people
>world music
hmmmmmmmmmmmm

based Avant-Math God laying down the fucking law.

>It wasn't like rock music, sourced in the wholly African American blues
Rock music (rock & roll) was actually rooted in jazz, specifically jump-blues, a sub-genre of swing.

>Everything else is influenced by blacks not created
They literally invented those genres, not just influence them.

Rap/hip hop was invented by Lou Reed.

/thread

>hurrrr durrr grug tribe better
>no! ugg tribe better!

can americans fuck off forever please

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yea but Classical and Mariachi are the best genres so?

Influenced != created

Prove her wrong then.

done

Thank you, American public school system.

Reminder that niggers and tripfags are both sub-human in every way possible

>me better cause other people with th same skin colour as me made innovative music.
Literally caveman worldview.

Just because really talented people from a specific race made some new, incredible types of music doesn't mean that any random person from that ethnic group is a musical genius compared to other groups of people. The people who defined these genres are exceptionally skilled and creative individuals and dumbasses on twitter want to use that to say that they automatically are as well, even though they probably will never do anything of note in any artform.

No one likes you

Retard

Whites invented rock. Bill Halley was white.

>gospel
>the thing rooted in Christian church music
yeah ill ask u to fuck off m8

All wrong except negro spirituals.

Jackie Brenston was black and was playing rock & roll before Bill Halley. Blacks invented rock.

Gospel is rooted in negro spirituals, themselves rooted in afro-american work songs. They did have influences from hymns, but that influence was secondary, the genre was still invented by black people.

>says soul twice
Embarrassing

Because white people invented autistically sorting out art into categories with nice little labels, I think it's safe to say that white people invented those genres.
Black people definitely created most of the music that those genres describe though.

Jazz was created by early 20th century italian immigrants.

Rock and roll was made by westerm artists in the 40s, like the Delmore brothers and Hank Williams.

>Jazz was created by early 20th century italian immigrants
Source?

>Rock and roll was made by westerm artists in the 40s, like the Delmore brothers and Hank Williams
They are not rock & roll.

>They are not rock and roll
Source? Their work was more close to actual rock and roll than any blues.

>Source?
The original dixieland jazz band.

>dubstep
>black
>skream

>Source?
You were the one who made the claim they were rock, so you have to post your source first.

>Their work was more close to actual rock and roll than any blues.
So what? It's still not rock. And rock and roll is closer to swing than blues anyways.

>The original dixieland jazz band.
They only started to play jazz music a decade after jazz was being played, and testimonies from the era claim that their style was similar to Buddy Bolden (black), from which they even copied the way he would make "farm animal noises" with his instrument.

>black people don't care about genres because they're not autistic
where to even begin lmao

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>Rap
Vikings literally did it 1000 years ago. It's called skaldekvad

most of these necessitated their enslavement to be created
makes you think

>opera
Crackers do not have a monopoly on Opera music
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_opera#History

>folk
"Folk" is just a word used for communal or traditional music

>musique concrete
Sample-heavy Hip Hop is just musique concrete with beats. So crackers do not have a monopoly on musique concrete. J Dilla makes musique concrete too.

>drone
Crackers do not have a monopoly on drones. You find drones in Abbo music, Poo-In-the-Loo music, Chink music, and Japanese music

>tuvan throat singing
Mongolians aren't crackers, they are closer to Chinks. Why do Crackers want to be Mongoloids so bad?

>country
White trashes aren't crackers.

>sound collage
Afrika Bambaataa isn't a Cracker. Madlib isn't a cracker. 9th Wonder isn't a cracker. DJ Premier isn't a cracker. Grandmaster Flash isn't a cracker. J Dilla isn't a cracker.

I will just give you DJ Shadow, even though he is mentally not a cracker.

>world music
Crackers do not have a monopoly on the world.

fuck off and suck a dong

yes blacks make shitty popular music meanwhile avant garde and experimental music aka art music is white

>Sample-heavy Hip Hop is just musique concrete with beats. So crackers do not have a monopoly on musique concrete. J Dilla makes musique concrete too.
...

>Crackers do not have a monopoly on the world.

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>genres improved and or dominated by white people
See, at least 1/3 of the above

The following are incorrect:

Country:
Country has partial roots in blues, but was developed by white people and also has roots in explicitly white folk music

Pop:
'Pop' the simplistic genre is expressly white and was invented by composers of small tunes like Irving Berlin back in the day

Jazz:
This is a tough one, for though it is a black genre a lot of the earliest jazz bands were white. Not as clear cut as blues is

Dubstep:
This is mostly white Brits and has origins in other white electronic music

House/EDM:

House has black origins in Chicago though was influenced by pre-house electronic music of Europeans. EDM is mostly EUropean

Reggeaton:

This is spics of Amerindian and European descent

the rest are right but mostly trash and were only good when whites appropriated them

>Sample-heavy Hip Hop is just musique concrete with beats. So crackers do not have a monopoly on musique concrete. J Dilla makes musique concrete too.

you are one retarded darkie

how does someone manage to be so consistently and uniformly awful in everything they post

>t. never listened Donuts

no I know what you're talking

thats what makes what you said so cringe

go back to jerking off to anime twinks on rym dude

>blacks do not have a soul

I nearly pissed myself

friends why must we fight and not realize that the synthesis of nigger and cracker music is what makes american music what it is and what we all know and love

if anything we should be hating on some third race that has provided not much of note to music. I vote for polynesians, fucking useless islandniggers

because despite being 13% of the population

>pop
>not a genre
ok buddy, Popular Music isn't a genre but the genre of 'pop' has evolved since the 60s into its own thing. Most Popular music is Pop but not all pop music is popular.

>a lot of the earliest jazz bands were white
This isn't true. The earliest jazz recording band was ODJB, but there were many jazz bands predating ODJB for over a decade (like Buddy Bolden's band), they were just not recorded, so jazz is a genre invented by black people (even though white people did make some contributions to the genre later on, they just didn't invent it).

>House has black origins in Chicago though was influenced by pre-house electronic music of Europeans. EDM is mostly EUropean
This is wrong as well. The earliest house is actually rooted in disco music, and the first house music was played exclusively by black people. House used electronic instrumentation, but wasn't influenced by European electronic music. In fact, it can be argued the first house music wasn't even electronic if you think Larry Levan is house (who would later influence Knuckles).

>the genre of 'pop' has evolved since the 60s into its own thing
That's not a genre either. There is pop rock (rock), pop soul (soul), pop rap (hip hop), etc. "Pure" pop is not a real genre.

>buddy bolden, etc.

Like I said, it is a tough one to make a judgement on. It isn't as clear cut as you are suggesting either. It's important to delineate when Jazz as a genre actually came into existence and separated from its ragtime and blues influences. The work of Bolden isn't quite fully formed jazz and it lacks a lot of the characteristics found in later jazz, including the ODJB. It can be considered transitional, that is, jazz birthing itself from its prior influences. That is not to say that whites invented it, but the process of its creation is ambiguous and a lack of documentation hinders a proper judgement from being made.

>The earliest house, etc.

"Various disco songs incorporated sounds produced with synthesizers and electronic drum machines, and some compositions were entirely electronic; examples include Italian composer Giorgio Moroder's late 1970s productions such as Donna Summer's hit single "I Feel Love" from 1977, Cerrone's "Supernature" (1977), Yellow Magic Orchestra's synth-disco-pop productions from Yellow Magic Orchestra (1978), Solid State Survivor (1979), and several early 1980s productions by the Hi-NRG groups Lime and Trans-X." - Wikipedia on house music's direct influences

Italo disco and electronic pop had massive impacts on house and were seminal in the separation of that genre from disco. The characteristics that define house music as distinct from disco variants are almost congruent with those embedded into the genre directly from electronic European music.

>pop isn't a genre

This goes against the literature and current thought in modern musicology, which identifies pop music as a distinct genre based on a number of common characteristics, including repetition and simplistic format. This is a common characterization of the meaning of "pop" music by laymen such as yourself.

It's kinda true. You needed blacks and whites to make it happen.

>It's important to delineate when Jazz as a genre actually came into existence and separated from its ragtime and blues influences.
That's right, and testimonies of the time tell us that he was neither. The instrumentation from the band also suggest they were playing jazz, not blues nor ragtime. And I said this before, but not as a direct response to you, but ODJB were said to copy Buddy Bolden's style, including the "animal farm noises" Buddy Bolden would make with his instrument. It wasn't transitional jazz, it was the jazz all the dixieland artists were playing. We have similar stories of Freddy Keppard who was offered to record around 1910 but refused because "he didn't want jazz to sell out", and later when the jazz craze began he recorded anyways, and that was still jazz.

>the process of its creation is ambiguous and a lack of documentation hinders a proper judgement from being made
There is literally no proof whites were the first people to play jazz. Jazz is said to have started with Bolden, with Armstrong, Keppard, Olivier, and many others claiming him as an influence. IF you want transitional jazz then there are some (black) bands from 1860 who were said to play jazz, but that's much more ambiguous.
Even then, the point is black people were the ones who invented jazz, and ALL evidence suggests this.

Regarding electro-disco you are right, but house didn't evolve out of electro-disco, it evolved out of regular disco. Check out Larry Levan's at Paradise Garage from 1979 to listen to what early house sounded like. It was barely electronic. It was only until later that some people incorporated more electronic influences. So again, house did not evolve out of "electronic music". Even if it did (again, it did not) the genre itself was played exclusively by black people, therefore the genre was literally invented by black people.

>This goes against the literature and current thought in modern musicology, which identifies pop music as a distinct genre based on a number of common characteristics, including repetition and simplistic format.
That's "popular music" (together with "art/classical music" and "folk music"), which is not what I was talking about with the user who replied to me. That "genre" of "pop" does exist, but it's not the kind of "pop" I was talking about with the other user.

>ODBJ copied Bolden's style...

The ODJB were certainly influenced by Bolden and 'jass' but they brought with them their own influences, notably the influences of Sicilian music from LaRocca and Sbarbaro's immigrant upbringings. Given their impact on the very earliest of jazz (with a zz) musicians and the 'jazz age', as well as the general influence of white musicians on ragtime, jazz's racial origins are not as clear cut as, say, hip-hop music. What I believe, and what most sources tend to agree on, is that while jazz had largely African-American origins, it also had considerable immediate European influences through march music, creole/French music popular in New Orleans at the time, and white musicians who were seminal to the genre's development, like the ODJB. If you'll look at my original post I made no claims of white origins for jazz, but rather simply that the facts are more nuanced than "this is a genre that was made by black people".

>Regarding electro-disco...

It's precisely why Frankie Knuckles' late 70s work is considered post-disco and not house. The earliest definitively house records were in the early 80s and had those electronic influences. Conflating the two is akin to saying blues rock and blues are the same thing; they're not, blues rock may have the rhythmic structure of blues, but its instrumentation and performance style are what makes it a distinct genre.

>Even if it did (again, it did not) the genre itself was played exclusively by black people, therefore the genre was literally invented by black people.

I will grant you this, though this is in accordance with my original claim - I explicitly stated that house has black origins. I just spoke to its immediate influences in the interest of nuance.

>popular music

I think you have the nomenclature reversed. POP is the genre, POPULAR MUSIC is the descriptor.

>they brought with them their own influences, notably the influences of Sicilian music from LaRocca and Sbarbaro's immigrant upbringings
Got any sources of that? Because from what I remember reading about them is that they just copied Buddy Bolden's style of music. Even then, ODJB are not relevant when it comes to determining who invented jazz, since jazz was already a genre a decade before they formed.

>jazz's racial origins are not as clear cut as, say, hip-hop music
We know with certainty that the people who first played jazz were all black. What we don't know with certainty are the influences this jazz had (which is when ragtime, blues, marches, creole, spanish, cuban, etc music comes in).

>If you'll look at my original post I made no claims of white origins for jazz, but rather simply that the facts are more nuanced than "this is a genre that was made by black people".
That's fine, in my previous post I assumed you were arguing that black people didn't invent jazz (I had to argue with someone who actually believed that once). Now, again, "racial" origins in terms of who played this music? There is no doubt it was black people. "racial" origins in terms of influence? It was a melting pot of styles, bust mostly european classical (through marches), ragtime and blues.

>It's precisely why Frankie Knuckles' late 70s work is considered post-disco and not house.
According to whom? As far as I'm aware Knuckles doesn't have any music dating back to the 70s, only Levan does, and he's considered to be house and disco (not electro-disco nor post-disco).

>The earliest definitively house records were in the early 80s and had those electronic influences.
That's right, but those were rooted in the music that Knuckles brought from Levan (which was disco/house).

>Conflating the two is akin to saying blues rock and blues are the same thing
I'm not conflating them, I'm just saying the earliest house that was being played was simply disco, and only later did the "electronic" influences come in.

>I just spoke to its immediate influences in the interest of nuance.
That's fine, and those influences are there, they just were not part of the direct birth of house music.

>I think you have the nomenclature reversed. POP is the genre, POPULAR MUSIC is the descriptor.
Well, people use both interchangeably, so there is room for confusion. In that case, what do you think counts as "pure pop" then?

>Crackers do not have a monopoly on the world.

that's where you're wrong bucko

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>sources

Sure, italoamericano.org/story/2017-3-10/jazz-history-sicilian-roots

>According to whom

I actually meant to say Levan in that sentence - my bad. I just had Knuckles on my mind because of the topic.

> only Levan does, and he's considered to be house and disco (not electro-disco nor post-disco).

He is explicitly considered post-disco.

allmusic.com/style/post-disco-ma0000012124

>That's right, but those were rooted in the music that Knuckles brought from Levan and >they just were not part of the direct birth of house music

This is debatable. The direct origin of house music is obviously from a confluence of disco and post-disco (primarily black) and electronic (primarily white) influences. The individuals who put them together were mostly black at the start. The question is to which extent both influenced the burgeoning genre, and it is subjective. My personal opinion is that electronic music played a very important role in the house sound, and it is for that reason that house and its descendants are more readily identified as electronic music than as a linear continuation of disco and its subgenres.

>what do you think counts as "pure pop" then

Nothing can be pure 'pop' because pop as a genre is defined by compositional parameters rather than any stylistic origins. It is from there that the confusion arises, because pop is unlike other genres in that respect. Though it is still recognized as a genre since the commonalities tying together 'pop' works are sufficient to enable classification.

BUT... this is pretty close: youtube.com/watch?v=G333Is7VPOg

>Sure, italoamericano.org/story/2017-3-10/jazz-history-sicilian-roots
The article doesn't mention any of the influences Sicilian music had on jazz. T

>He is explicitly considered post-disco.
Considering the fact that Cerrone (disco) is included in that list as well, I don't think what Allmusic has to say regarding this topic is relevant. Larry Levan played disco just like Cerrone. Not post-disco (which is a pretty different thing from what both were doing, see: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-disco#Non-exhaustive_list_of_artists).
Even then, allmusic still lists him as "disco, garage and house" under styles, and in his biography they claim he's a DISCO (not post-disco) musician.

>The direct origin of house music is obviously from a confluence of disco and post-disco (primarily black) and electronic (primarily white) influences.
But there are no post-disco influences in house music. Post-disco isn't even a specific style on the first place.
And while yes, it did had some electronic influences (later on), claiming the style was influenced by white music is a different thing. The instrumentation was white, but there was no style of white music from which this electronic music got into house (with techno this was actually the case thanks to the kraftwerk synthpop influence on detroit techno).

>My personal opinion is that electronic music played a very important role in the house sound
Sure, but house music was already a thing when it wasn't electronic.

>and it is for that reason that house and its descendants are more readily identified as electronic music
Yeah, but that's because categorizing things as "electronic" is stupid. Why not call rock and flamenco "guitar music" while we are at it?

>than as a linear continuation of disco and its subgenres.
But it's literally a linear continuation from disco.

>Nothing can be pure 'pop' because pop as a genre is defined by compositional parameters rather than any stylistic origins. It is from there that the confusion arises, because pop is unlike other genres in that respect.
Alright, I agree with you here. But it's exactly because "pop is a genre unlike any other" that I believe it's not a genre. It's just a descriptor. It's like calling "hardcore" a genre that would include both hardcore techno and hardcore punk. Sure, it's a valid categorization scheme, but its not a genre, and pop is the same case. Genres are trends, styles, who have an origin and evolve. Pop isn't this (and neither is hardcore).

>BUT... this is pretty close
That's just slower dance-pop with some sophistipop influences. Even some disco influences of dance-pop can be heard on that song. It's not pure pop.

"Therefore, it was a foregone conclusion that, as documented by Claudio Lo Cascio, such a substantial presence of Sicilians had a crucial impact on the evolution of jazz, not only for the forced integration between immigrants and African-Americans (deemed on a par by the US middle class), but also and above all for Italians’ - remarkably southerners’ - instrumental artistry, sense of rhythm, bent for improvisation, open sounds, inclination to dance, taste for form (quality often deriving from the marching bands’ legacy), which we all find in the new musical language."

Either way It's primarily the influence on ODJB that I mentioned, not on jazz in general. Though one could imply the other. Not my call to make.

>More re: Levan

Well, he is most emphatically a house (and specifically, garage house) artist and disco artist. I bring up post-disco as that descriptor is used with regards to Levan only sparingly and in reference to a brief body of recordings available from the late 1970s - this, I believe, would include the 1979 recording you initially mentioned. The conclusion I am trying to make is that that work is not considered part of the house canon, so to speak.

>wasting more than 5 seconds on a tripfaggot
I pity those who unironically read all of that and (you)'d you

That quote still doesn't imply ODJB had Sicilian music influences, it's just saying Sicilian people had influences in jazz (and why they would have been inclined to play jazz). Musicologists can cite examples of creole, spanish, cuban, ragtime, and blues influences in jazzby citing specific rhythms, melodies, harmonies, etc, but the article doesn't mention any of that. The ODJB doesn't have music influences from Sicilian music.

>The conclusion I am trying to make is that that work is not considered part of the house canon, so to speak.
But he literally is. His entire discography isn't very diverse as it stays on the same line this recording from 1979 is on, which is garage house mixes by using disco tracks and some occasional funk and soul tracks.
And if we go by "popular vote", the majority of RYM users are in agreement that this 1979 recording by Levan is a house recording as well. It's with Levan that house music starts, with Levan's disco mixes.

You anons always talk about "how the lack of music discussion is ruining Yea Forums", but once the discussion finally arrives you all start to shit on it. You guys get what you deserve.

World music, if a genre at all is 100% created by white people. World music isn't folk music, it's a manufactured fascination with fake exotic music incorporated into a pop format. Stuff like Paul Simon or exotica (where the fake performers may have been people of color but they were being manufactured by white people).

>post disco isn't a style

Yeah, I understand that. But it is a convenient term to describe works that were departing from disco conventions but not explicitly house or other styles derived from disco. This is, again, a point of when to delineate house's independence from its predecessors, though for this one in particular I believe that the early 1980s and explicitly electronic works are more commonly recognized as the starting point of house music.

>Sure, but house music was already a thing when it wasn't electronic.

House music is expressly electronic. Garage house (and hence Levan and his direct musical descendants) could be what you are referring to here, in which case everything you've said is basically right - but for garage house, not house. The distinction is important because when we refer to house, we talk about it in terms of the parent genre for many other electronic music genres and it is not exactly accurate to conflate the more disco-derived garage house with the electronic Chicago house.

>Yeah, but that's because categorizing things as "electronic" is stupid.

Well, defining things in terms of their instrumentation is pretty important. Genre is not purely defined by rhythm. In fact, I'd argue that the typical conceptions of genre are more readily identified by instrumentation than rhythmic structure. Why are prog and blues rock the same genre? Why does post-rock even have 'rock' in the name? That's just how we've come to commonly define genres.

>But it's literally a linear continuation from disco.

Garage house, Chicago house, etc. see above

>Genres are trends, styles, who have an origin and evolve. Pop isn't this (and neither is hardcore).

That's just like, your opinion man. Your pet definition similarly creates inconsistencies. They're just defined as what they're commonly defined as. It's truth by consensus.

>It's not pure pop.

Is anything pure anything, friend?

i love it when you blow tf out of these white boys

>x always do y but then z
No

Sure then.

:3

While this is obviously true and the only response any intelligent person has to the OP, it is a problem on both sides. The majority of people who get upset by posts talking about good things black people did are the same people who think they are responsible for Western civilization because they have white skin. No individual deserves any level of credit for the accomplishments of others.

>

Attached: tenor.gif?itemid=9900289.gif (498x498, 1.68M)

>re: Italians

lavocedinewyork.com/en/arts/2018/05/19/jazz-the-sicily-new-orleans-connection-and-the-art-of-encounter-par-excellence/

>Levan

See the other post.

rateyourmusic.com/release/album/larry_levan/live_at_the_paradise_garage/

Disco first! And not a good sample size.

Anyway, I have to go finish an essay. Good talk.

Somewhat true, though a number of legitimate artists from non-English speaking countries have been successfully sold under the world label. Consider Fanfare Ciocărlia.

>let's beat up on white people on the internet

You guys suck and this is why you have no friends

black metal artists black people

>lavocedinewyork.com/en/arts/2018/05/19/jazz-the-sicily-new-orleans-connection-and-the-art-of-encounter-par-excellence/
Again, that article says nothing about the influence of Sicilian music on the ODJB.

>Disco first! And not a good sample size.
It's both disco and house. And the sample size isn't really relevant here, what matters is that its considered to be both disco and house, and that that was the starting point of house.

>Anyway, I have to go finish an essay. Good talk.
Same. Have fun.

>let's beat up on white people on the internet
Hey, don't get me wrong lol, I'm just trying to give credit to the people who deserve it here. White people do have their own contributions, obviously, they just can't be credited with inventing the genres I mentioned above.

Yes, and? Last time I checked, black people are still free to make music in all of those genres (and any other musical genre too). Just because people with your approximate skin tone pioneered something doesn't give you complete control over it. You can't dictate what other musicians and listeners are or aren't allowed to do, and you can't deny that white and brown people haven't also heavily influenced the course many of those genres took as well.

Black people definitely did not make rock and roll, neither did they do rock.
What black person was playing rock and roll when it was getting in?

Give us the black people that 'created these genres' every single one of them. Its influenced. and all of it is mostly from Blues

>What black person was playing rock and roll when it was getting in?
Wynonie Harris, Roy Brown, Jackie Brenston, Jimmy Preston and Stick McGhee were all playing rock & roll before any other white person did.

Most of it actually comes from jazz, not blues.

opera

Stop giving tripfaggots attention please

I fucking hate you so much

kys avant samefag god

>negros

Attached: 1377873158977.gif (300x200, 2.35M)

I 'd agree that Jazz is one of the most inclusive genres of music there is, but it's definitely derived from black folk music sensibility... uptown blacks in new Orleans meshing with the educated coloreds is what really sparked it.

EL-B created dubstep, but he's also white though

>but it's definitely derived from black folk music sensibility
It is literally derived from french impressionist music and marching band music

she's angry that some people can only connect to rap when it's not MO BUFGF FUG NUGGUH KANGZ shit

is there anything more neoliberal/late capitalist than this 'woke black royalty' attitude "good looking" black women have?

killing civilians for oil via drone bombinbs, perhaps?

in a less identity politics driven culture, he'd probably be accepting enough of how ambiguous and complex art can be to agree with you, but right now this is a "home team" thing. pure tribalism. it's kinda disgusting.

history is inconvenient for identitarians, unfortunately

t. butthurt Chilean mestizo

>country
>pop
>rock and roll
>house
>edm
>dubstep
roflmao

no it's not

not much of an identitarian, Jazz like you say IS impressionistic in the same way Debussy is for the same reasons, the instruments are western , plenty of the greats were not black like django, bill evans, jobim, bix , tin pan alley etc..

I don't understand the presumptuousness coming my way. While genre's like Jazz who have reached the world over and become ingrained into the world's understanding of music cannot be called "black genres" or "white genres" , they definitely START from some a place and time from a group of people with some shared circumstance.

what made Jazz was the injection of blues, improvisation, gospel, etc.. INTO European musical framework. Essentially the "Style" that W.C. Handy documented from poor blacks, derived from the slave songs, featuring those pentatonic scales, polyrhythms, syncopation, etc.. is the catalyst for what becomes Jazz.

So you could say that while Jazz is not intrinsically black, in the same way that no music is, it was, however, "discovered" by black Americans.

Most people would agree that the innovation of jazz is the invocation of style over substance, not necessarily that you're at first playing a head Sousa composed but that you had Buddy Bolden playing "by ear", or that Manuel Perez who was a mestizo colored creole played the cornet better than anyone but couldn't play the hot confrontational bluesy improvs of the black musicians, and subsequently was forced out of the scene.

the blacks are not my home team. I cited a bunch of history for you too, which conveniently works in my favor even if it goes against your perspective.

this

Probably played, recorded and mixed by instruments and audio workstations made by white people :)

>hip hop
>not rap
it's the same fucking thing, fucking retard

fucking based

This post right here needs to be mentioned.

Literally all categories or "genres" are vague terms used ot broadly describe an impossible to determine amount of factual events.

There is literally no reason to support that a race invented any genre, since its all just a mixture of past musical manifestations. In historical terms, you could always trace back the basic elements that supposedly "constitute" a genre and find them in previous music forms, it just depends on how you prefer to define a certain genre.

You could argue electronic music was "invented" when computers came to exist, but again, by any definition, the first guy moving a finger to the sounds of a loading computer "invented" electronic music.

Fuck her, fuck her superiority attitude and fuck black racists.

>It is literally derived from french impressionist music
Source? It's true that some impressionist composers hinted at some jazz ideas, but early jazz had no direct influences from impressionism. Marching music is alright however.

I'm not butthurt nor mestizo though.

House and rock and roll were invented by black people you moron. Read the thread.
Also, pop and edm are not genres. Read the thread again as well.

Not really. You can have hip hop without rapping (DJ Shadow), and rapping without hip hop (Rage Against the Machine).

Genres describe trends, not just a bunch different musical elements. And yes, a race can invent a genre if they are the only ones who played it in its beginning, even if they were influenced by music from other races.

Also, "electronic music" is not a genre, just like how "acoustic music" or "guitar music" are not genres either.

/thread

>Thread about niggers
>Full of tripfaggots
Not surprised desu senpai

>Genres describe trends, not just a bunch different musical elements. And yes, a race can invent a genre if they are the only ones who played it in its beginning, even if they were influenced by music from other races.

No, genres are tags trying to encompass different factual phenomenons (the music they are trying to describe with the label/tag attachde to them).

>And yes, a race can invent a genre if they are the only ones who played it in its beginning,
You did not understand shit of what I wrote you illiterate tripfag. Read the whole post, its a matter of definition.

>Also, "electronic music" is not a genre, just like how "acoustic music" or "guitar music" are not genres either.
Thats why I said invented as a phenomenon and didnt refer ot it as a particular case of an ambiguous tag called "genre".

God you are stupid.

>No, genres are tags trying to encompass different factual phenomenons (the music they are trying to describe with the label/tag attachde to them).
This isn't true, as genres like rock and jazz can't be defined that way, but can be defined if we use the trends approach instead.

>You did not understand shit of what I wrote you illiterate tripfag. Read the whole post, its a matter of definition.
I did read it, and I addressed its points. There is a difference between the people who invented the genre (black people for jazz) and the music of the people who influenced the genre (white people for European classical).

>Thats why I said invented as a phenomenon and didnt refer ot it as a particular case of an ambiguous tag called "genre".
Fine, but we were talking about genres, so there was no need to point that out.

>but can be defined if we use the trends approach instead.
Please go ahead and define jazz and rock (and any other "genre") through this "trends approach¨" or whichever approach you prefer.

>There is a difference between the people who invented the genre (black people for jazz) and the music of the people who influenced the genre (white people for European classical).
Nobody in particular invented any genre because it is impossible to actually state clear demarcation lines between "genres" (see above) as to be able to state "this is rock music" and therefore it was invented by X who was the first person to play [whatever you believe it is that constitutes, i.e. defines, rock music]. As a token of example, a lot of people claim Bathory or Venom are black metal, when, as a matter of fact, those bands sound nothing like other more rapidly recongizable "black metal" bands such as Emperor or Darkthrone, but closer to thrash metal bands like Slayer. Whether they are "really" black metal or not is a byzantine discussion, because it is a matter of definition, and well, your understanding, i.e. definition, of black metal or rock is different to mine or others'.

This whole debate is asinine, the post of that dumb racist bitch is incendiary and this discussion is all about retribution and nothing about actual music.

And even if we could arrive at a generally accepted definition of a genre which means something and is not just vague terms (it says something about reality that can be apprehended and useful), then the onus probandi is on you to show how X person was the first to actually play that.

>country
how fucking stupid can you be

Who specifically invented all these genres, you must know specifically considering you’re so knowledgeable

Or will it be the same answer as it has been for years, and is the right answer - that genres aren’t inventions (what you’re referring to are either sub genres or scenes rather than full blown genres we just conflate the term to save time) but if you’re going for accuracy you have to be more specific mate

I'm going to assume that your refusal to define genres like rock and jazz under your own criteria of what genres are proves that your criteria for defining genres is inconsistent. My own criteria being consistent or not is independent of your own criteria being inconsistent by the way.

Some specific people invented specific genres, like James Brown inventing funk (and therefore black people inventing funk). Some genres don't have any specific inventor, but can still be attributed to a specific ethnicity, like black metal being invented by white people (doesn't matter if it was Venom, Bathory or Darkthrone, as they were all white). Some cases can be more controversial, sure, but not the cases I mentioned in my original post. Some genres could also have no specific ethnicity inventing a genre by the way (breakbeat hardcore?).

Sure.

James Brown invented funk. That's enough to prove some genres are invented.

>Some specific people invented specific genres, like James Brown inventing funk
Define funk please, then prove it was James Brown (this part I dont care so much about, as it is secondary to the impossibility of defining genres.

>your refusal to define genres like rock and jazz under your own criteria of what genres are proves that your criteria for defining genres is inconsistent.

I refuse to because it is impossible, its a futile endeavor, if you wish, you can say any definiton I could draft would be inconsistent, I wouldnt object that because I dont think it is possible to do.

And funk was originally a mixture of three different genres, everything is simply an amalgam or continuation of something else

There are no complete originators, you have to get the idea from somewhere

You cannot create something that does not already have the means to exist

If you don't believe genres exist, that's fine, but if that's the case there is no point arguing with you about genres other than whether or not they exist.

So what if it was a combination of genres (it wasn't, it was just a subgenre of soul at first)? James Brown still invented it. Nobody else can claim they invented funk. Therefore funk was invented by black people.
The means to exist were there, he was just the one who actually made it exist. The Chinese had the means to invent fireguns, but they didn't, so they didn't invent fireguns.

>If you don't believe genres exist, that's fine, but if that's the case there is no point arguing with you about genres other than whether or not they exist.

Still, I want to read your definition of Funk. In this case, I am directly asking for a definition because you explicitly defend that any such definition is possible, Therefore, is should be very easy for you to just give me one of rock or funk.

I

Also, I am not even though I agree to a certain degree (not the part of "three different genres").

>country
Implying Blacks invented redneck music
>gospel
Maybe black gospel, it would be more accurate to say it was invented by Christians
>Pop
It's a marketing strategy not a genre, probably invented by record label execs
EDM
>Implying kraftwerk were black
>Implying such a broad genre was invented in such a way that it's genealogy can be traced back to a specific group

The rest cannot really be argued. But you also cannot deny that non-blacks CREATE music original in those genres.

Funk is the music that follows the style of James Brown's Papa's Got a Brand New Bag (and the music that follows the style of those followers and so on).

EDM is not a genre.
Fine on the rest, except that blacks played a style called gospel first.

you're braver than any marine

>Funk is the music that follows the style of James Brown's Papa's Got a Brand New Bag

You are defining a genre of music by merely referencing the sound you are being asked to define.

There are no amounts of 360 degrees to show how circular and stupid your logic is. Fuckign tripfags, I swear.

But nonetheless, I will help you since you seem to be the slow kid of the class. What are the constitutive elements of that James Brown music which you referred to that makes it fall under the label of "Funk" and not, say, "prog rock"?

Well, yes, definitions are arbitrary, so it's fine, and it's the best way to define genres.
Every definition is circular logic according to your logic.
There are no constitutive elements to what makes funk (or any genre) a genre, as they are just trends and the people who follow those trends. You might define rock based on electric guitars, but you can still have rock without guitars, and the same goes to any criteria you might use to define rock.
James Brown is not progressive rock because he doesn't follow the style of progressive rock artists.

>no trance or techno
Looks like black people are even less important to me than I thought

>this many responses to a fucking screentshot of a tweet
Holy fuck we're doomed

Ya FUCK WHITE PEOPLE

Trance was invented by white people, but techno was invented by black people (more specifically Juan Atkins and his two other black friends).

>Black people invented jazz
>Black people say white people have no rhythm
What

>shittiest "latin" genres
wew lad

What a reductive statement

Would you say that Rock'n'roll(with all its influences from Blues and Jazz) was invented by Blacks but Rock as a different genre and most of it sub-genres were created by Whites?

Rock and roll is rock though, so they are not different genres (one is a subset of the other), therefore black people invented rock. Now, are most rock sub-genres invented by white people? Sure.

, perhaps...? hm?