Is the US bankrupt?

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The US citizens and a few major countries

ok so if one of our administrations cuts entitlement spending it would mostly alleviate the problem imo. Also if we began to pay back some of the debt that china's buying (or get the uk to buy it then pay them instead get fucked chinks) we wouldn't have any problems debt wise

then again, that's solving problems head on instead of bitching about how to do it then do absolutely nothing about it for decades so wouldn't really work for the US

>IF
they never will

Not even close to bankrupt. We're being led by one of the best businessmen ever to hold office. His negotiations with China have already profited America billions in only a few days. It's only a matter of time before China plays our game or collapses altogether.

It's a wonderful time to be American.

Trump is an idiot in most regards but the work he's done on the economy is MASTERFUL.

> Also if we began to pay back some of the debt that china's buying

The US always pays back it's debt. The U.S. auctions off a piece of paper promising to pay the holder $100 in 10 years. People (and countries) bid for the piece of paper, offering around $80). In 10 years time, you bring the paper to the Treasury, and they pay you $100.

The holder of the debt is whoever bids the highest. If china offers to pay $85, while everyone offers $80, China wins the auction. This is what they mean when foreign countries hold our debt. The U.S. can always pay you back, because it can print money, so there is no risk they will go bankrupt. If there was any risk that they won't pay you back, it would be factored into your bid. For example, you might only bid $50 instead of $80, because you think there is a high chance you won't get your money back. This is what is happening in Venezuela.

holy shit i actually learned better financial information of FUCKING /B than in my entire academic career

>fair game asking in Yea Forums so you don't get based responses as you would in /pol/ or /biz/, no sarcasm intended
no, we let private banks do most of our work to lower consumer prices by a certain percent each year instead of just having the central bank print money to lower interest rates
our interest is fine and we have a lot of foreign investors

have you seen japan's debt though? their economy is bloated out of their britches

He went bankrupt what, 8 times? How is that good business for anyone?

In theory the U.S. Government can not print money. The U.S. Congress delegated that authority to a private, non-profit corporation circa 1933. Its ability to print money is limited by the productivity of the country.

i think he's talking about bonds

trips checked btw

Yeah, so the consequences would be way worse, devaluing a major currency. Germany tried it in the post-WWI era, it ends in a dumpster fire.

It can mint coins though, which is hypothetically interesting, but really practical.

>really
not really, whoops.

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No. US has never missed a payment on its national debt.

>His negotiations with China have already profited America billions in only a few days

Gonna need a source on that, please.

A long standing subject of contention between the U.S. Treasury and the Federal Reserve System.

Fun Fact: As a non-profit the Federal Reserve donates its annual surplus revenue to the U.S. Treasury to reduce the national debt.

Here's a graph of SPY (representing American companies) and MCHI (representing Chinese companies).

It actually looks like the US was hurt by recent Trump announcements, but it's too early to see if it helps long term. The "billions" things is probably cherry picked BS.

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Trumptards are gonna trumptard. Just ignore him and his '4d chess great playboy businessman' shit.

He'll either keep falling for stupid hype like this or one day wake up and realize Trump is a fat, crooked, senile Boomer who has fulfilled none of his promises and is a shit businessman.

if Democrats would stop running up the bill that would be great...

well you've convinced me.

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Germany crashed because of the enormous debt of WW1 that was laid on them.

Once the world has an alternative to the dollar, america will be in ruins.

I think we need to give China more. We are white and have privilege and they don't. We should be sending them billions in aid and giving them the best side in every trade deal.

Republicans controlled both houses of congress from 2016 until the midterms. Why didn't they do anything about the national debt? Why did they exacerbate the problem by passing huge tax cuts?

Gotta spend money to make money.

Why should they do anything about it? Being in debt is good. If you want a giant defense budget, social security and medicare for grandma, those things cost money. Neither political party wants to raise taxes, so it's easier to take out a loan (and devalue everyone's money via inflation). It's a win for both political parties.

because complaining about national debt is just a method of smearing democrats bills to expand social programs
conservatives dont give a shit about the national debt. the evidence for that is the fact they give tax cuts everytime they get into power while expanding military budgets.

>Republicans
Ah yes, those "republican" """conservatives""" like John McBrain.

The United States make 132 quadrillion dollars in 4 months. The debt has nothing to do with how much money we have or make. Its just how many loans there are in circulation. If the United States was not reliable on paying back its loans it wouldn't have any.

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Hey, I agree. I think as long as we can keep making payments, there's nothing really wrong with the national debt. It's just you frequently hear Republicans crowing about the national debt and how it's out of control, and then turning around and supporting tax cuts.

Sorry, we're talking actual tangible actions being taken or that can be taken, not anecdotal political talking points from either wing. That graph you're seeing is projections resulting from the last budget. Which, weirdly enough, was not a Democratic budget. This isn't a "who's better" argument. Both are shit, real solutions don't have anything to do with either..

nah but we heading there fam just keep tronald bumph in the white house and you'll see mah nigga I be a broke as fuk nigga dipshit mo'fukka but even I can see dat fool be trippin on dem percosets mah nigga cause damn not even mah momma would say summa da dumbass shit dat nigga say ya herd

Bankruptcy is an inability to maintain the payments on what you owe.

The US is objectively not bankrupt and it's not a debatable question.

those damn democrats

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The evidence for that is the drunk-sailor-on-shore-leave level spending republican presidents do starting with His Holiness Ronald Wilson Reagan.

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This is the biggest lie ever

how so?

Republicans make tax cuts and democrats increase spending. They are doing the same thing.

>implement housing bill that made economy implode
>lol look mom no deficit!

It's not true.

elaborate whats false?

The numbers.

Yeah Trump sure knows how to handle overwhelming debt. Just default on it. Bancrupcy ftw. Always worked for him.

I mean we are going to move away from using money eventually

I'm just saying I don't think Republicans are really serious about reducing the national debt. I think they just use it as a political wedge issue whenever it's convenient for them.

source?

>have get out of jail free card
>use get out of jail free card
>>omg he went completely bankrupt!
2 of his businesses went under and it was cheaper to just make them go poof. Anyone with financial sense would have done the same.

Here's the proof of profit. Trump's tariffs rule.

foxbusiness.com/economy/trump-us-tariffs-revenue

democrats own the biggest welfare states

>women
>pizza
>house
>computer chip
hey stupid fat america we europeans also have those things too yah we r joost as goood yaaah

you know whos paying tariffs right?
Americans pay it not the chinese.
its a tax that Americans have to pay.

He's never been bankrupt once. Some of his businesses have failed, but the core of his empire thrives bringing in untold billions every day. He has a lot to teach the G7.

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was asking for source that these deficit/gdp numbers are wrong. since that's what your claim is.

No you don't

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Trump says that's not the case, so clearly you're wrong. He would never lie to us.

Trump is a master of money. Men at his level don't necessarily have to pay their debts. Banks are honored just to do business with him.

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forbes.com/sites/johnbrinkley/2019/08/12/trump-still-doesnt-know-who-pays-tariffs/#769df44325a2

trump doesnt know how tariffs work

How can you be bankrupt when you’re armed to the teeth?

Spent all their money on guns

Retard alert

You're speaking of profit, yet the article only mentions revenue from the tariffs. How much has the US lost?

I weep for you, friend. Being a poorfag is no way to live. Quit trying to insult successful men and get out there yourself. Be the kind of man America needs.

you stop getting loans and the whole system collapses on itself from runaway inflation

The american citizens have lost.
The american government gains because its just another form of taxation.

Yeah, bancrupcy can be a good strategy when you wanna make money fast.

You can buy companies, sell their inventory for profit, and then disestablish them, or do high risk company attempts. If the high risk works out, you benefit a lot, if not, just go bancrupt and dump the bulk of the losses on the debt owners.

It's a profitable, if callous, way to make money.

The problem lies in people thinking his business skills means he'll be good for the economy. Some of his key strategies - like bancrupcy - will just not work for a country. And I hope Trump isnt insane enough to try it.

So go get more you have guns
Use your guns to acquire more money

If American citizens lose, then the US gov't loses potential tax revenue.

The European Union is working on an international currency for trade at this very moment. It could come to fruition in under 5 years and be a wholesale disaster for the US. Pre-Trump, this was never even considered.

Pretty sure that's a crime

not with a Aaa rating.

the US gdp is 17 trillion per year
aka smaller than the debt

Like it’s ever stopped them before

Gotta grab pussy to get pussy.

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>bankrupt

Absolutely fucking not. People shitting themselves over the national debt have no clue about economics.

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American importers pay the tariff and pass it along to American consumers. The tariff is a reminder to cut back on buying Chinese goods and it's working.

I would never call anyone retarded just because they don't agree with me. What's retarded is not accepting the facts over fake news.

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>He's never been bankrupt once.
>Some of his businesses have failed
Yeah. Failed due to bankruptcy.
>bringing in untold billions
In all seriousness, does anyone aside from Trump and his lenders actually know what he brings in? Because I doubt, and many people doubt, it's billions.

I stand corrected and bemused. Revenue is the correct term for tariff income.

Americans should be discouraged from buying Chinese goods. Those jobs are coming home, boys. The Chinese are already terrified of the coming famine in their country and jobs flowing back to the US.

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You could just quit buying Chinese goods and act like a ball-on American.

It doesnt have Aaa rating everywhere. Not S&P or Scope for instance. Still good, though.

He bankrupted himself in the 90s after taking on huge amounts of debt and then transferring the money to his dad.

Then when the debts were written off his dad gave him the money back, which he no longer had to pay back.

Pretty smart move if you ask me, even if unethical.

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I doubt he can fucking spell billions,let alone earn them.

>Those jobs are coming home

Are you fucking joking? They're going to some other third-world shithole with cheap labor.

The revenue from domestic taxes is much higher though. So Trump lowered the overall revenue much more with the tax cuts than he raised them with tariffs.

>even if unethical
It's criminal.

Some of his businesses have gone bankrupt, but he hasn't. It's the miracle of incorporation. He makes untold billions worldwide. It took a vast conspiracy the likes of which this nation has never seen to close his real estate school. Everyone who passed his course made millions. The ones who failed ruined it for everyone.

With a military like ours I doubt anyone will try to collect on that debt.

Those jobs are coming back here. The mills are firing up and the machines are getting lubed. Get ready to make some shoes and underwear, boys. America is back.

The second they gave the control of their money to the federal reserve, it’s a private bank that prints money at it’s whim devaluing the dollar.

The tariffs are one way Trump plans on balancing the much needed tax breaks for the rich. Think how much more tax you'd pay if Jeff Bezos had to pay taxes. Or Bill Gates. We all need to pitch in a little more so they can continue providing jobs and low prices.

Yes user, very bankrupt.

you owe to your own banks who fund your military

Overconfidence is a bad thing

On top of that, people need to realize that the US can currently borrow money for 10 years while paying less interest than inflation.

They can literally inflate their debt away.

And the dollar is still strengthening against every other currency in the world.

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>Some of his businesses have gone bankrupt, but he hasn't.
Yeah, but why are you distancing his businesses from himself? A failure of a business is the failure of those who run it. When you file chapter 11 bankruptcy for a business, a business does the paperwork to see how they will handle the debt and someone needs to sign the dotted line. And Trump has signed many of those.
>He makes untold billions worldwide.
Maybe you and I have different understandings of this phrase. Maybe he makes dealings that are on the order of billions, but his deficits probably run just as high. His net worth is a controversy itself.

Still lower than the Euro and the British pound.

Honestly no, most of the "debt" is corporate-imposed interest thar far exceeds the borrowed amount. You could literally Mr. Robot all records of debt and it wouldn't have any lasting effects on the economy. It exists in its own bubble of IOUs, and most of the moving money happens regardless of it. China is kidding themselves if they think buying debt was ever a good idea. Get ready for it to implode in the next decade or two.

>thinking china is ever going to see that money
How exactly would that even be enforced? They're the dipshits who bought debt, it's not like they can do anything about it

like Argentina, good idea faggot

Not gonna last very long once the ECB starts printing more euros to stop the slowing economy while brits fuck over their economy with a no deal brexit.

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>With a military like ours I doubt anyone will try to collect on that debt.

That's not the right way to think about it. Countries _have_ to pay back their debt. Even countries at war with each other pay back debts because they understand the consequence of not paying.

If the US decided to not pay back, the entire economy would fuck itself instantly. The people would be scared the US won't pay back, and interest rates would skyrocket. No one would be able in invest in business because interest rates are too high. No one would be able to buy houses because the interest rate would be too high. No other countries in the world would lend us money, leaving us desperate for cash which no one would give. It would be insanely suicidal to not pay those debts back. The US would be commiting suicide; it would be worse than any nuclear attack; it would be the end of this country.

Only morally

If US starts defaulting on its bonds its credit rating will fall through the floor.

Except we didn't borrow money from china retard. They bought debt as some 3rd party.

UK cannot take on our debt when they are about to get when brexit finally happens.
> You are funny

Says who?

>printing more euros to stop the slowing economy while brits fuck over their economy with a no deal brexit
I recall a certain fatass president telling Gary Cohn, "Just run the presses—print money" to wipe away the U.S. debt.
In all seriousness, I don't doubt the Britbongs are fucking themselves over, but Trump is doing equal is not worse damage to our economy. I think the question becomes more of who will hit recession first.

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no

K, so, try learning some economics when you get to highschool and come back then sweetie.

Printing money isn't necessarily a bad thing. It's when you print too much and cause runaway inflation that it turns into a problem.

Why would any country lend them money if they were known to default on them? Would you keep lending a friend who replied "fuck you" when you asked for money back?

If that's not enough... earlier this week Argentina asked to wait a little with having to pay some of its bonds. Standard & Poor responded by lowering their credit rating to CCC-. Source: google.com/amp/s/www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2019-08-29/argentina-s-rating-cut-to-selective-default-by-s-p

You can't devalue America's currency though because America would just invade you and claim they're spreading democracy.

don't be so incredulous,
the politicians of my country said the same... now my country is on default on his debt and there is hyperinflation

Could you make it more obvious that you have no idea what you are talking about?

Trump's idea was to print enough money to wipe away the U.S. debt. That would have caused hyperinflation and likely runaway inflation.

Actually collecting that debt from us is gonna be pretty fucking difficult, we’re good for a while

The Federal Reserve intentionally targets 2% annual inflation; from printing money or QE.

Do you even know what a credit rating is?

when you have a mortgage and have debt exceeding your assets by many many times are you bankrupt? no you stupid fuck. think of the national debt like a national mortgage.

Like I said, you can print more money to speed up the economy, but do it too much and you turn your country into another Venezuela.

It's a matter of balance. Don't do too little of it and don't do too much of it.

That would destroy the buying power of most people's retirement accounts; people who vote a lot. That would never fly.

The collection has to be honored, or else no one would lend us money. And. We. Need. That. Money. See

There are people that actually believe this.

A lot of the US debt is held by US citizens and companies, though.

And just to add to my previous post in , if it wasn't too clear, what makes him a bad businessman is that he allowed these businesses to go bankrupt. Sure, he didn't bankrupt himself, but he bankrupt business which affected many people. I think what people are worried about is how he's currently running the U.S. like many of his failed businesses. Maybe not bankrupt (well, hopefully not bankrupt), but maybe into recession.

I think he's happy with his impact on the economy so far; he's been able to lower his own taxes.

I dont think he cares much about the rest of the economy as long as people he like dont yell at him too much.

A recession is coming no matter who's president. The current business cycle is already one of the longest of all time.

The numbers are off. obama took office in 08 so 08 is still Bush but 09 is Obama as his fiscal year started September of 08. The entire graph is off by 1 bar. If you search it up obama and both Bush's are the highest obama being number 1.

You're right on the bars being off by one. It even says so at the bottom of the graph.

dude, Just don't spend more than what you have, easy shit

no Argentina, no Zimbabwe, no Venezuela

Almost any country that borrows money spends more than it has though.

>A recession is coming no matter who's president.
Isn't it weird that that cycle seems to coincide during some time with republican administrations, ever since Reagan?

That's not possible. Military, Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid cost more than tax revenue. Either taxes have to go, benefits get cut, or we borrow money that future generations have to pay back. What do you think we're going to vote for?

>Actually, correction to my post in . It seems almost every recession since the great depression has been under a republican administration, except the one recession during WWII. How odd.

Countries are not people. If every country balanced their budget and started paying off all their debts the world economy would take a huge fucking shit.

Just keep your inflation and unemployment rate under control and don't let your interest payments grow too big as a % of GDP.

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Oh and make sure real GDP is always increasing.

No one is ever going to call in national debt from any country. The numbers aren't tangible wealth, just a perception of value. Everything is going to be fine

Dwayne Bankrupt?

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...

Found the Democrat

s

>Is the US bankrupt?
No. You are only bankrupt when you can no longer pay the interest on your debts.
Some countries have variations but that's the basis of bankruptcy.