I wonder how many more people need to die before you American fucktards realise you need better gun control

I like you.

No shootings since the 90s you say?

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wrong, he killed 7. and a sawed off is still a gun, subhuman

No Im a sandnigger Aussie. Do you Yanks not know that other cultures/races can live in another country peacefully or is that word foreign to you guys ?

Well no mass shootings yeah

Too late you have already unleashed the scooby doom

Do you know how easily he could have stabbed more people, as they ineptly chased him down the busy street, like a loose dog? He needed a bullet, as soon as he didn't comply with dropping the weapon. Next guy would be more hesitant to try to pull the same shit.

Im not american, so apparantly my opinion is valid right?

Okay, so I find it funny. You are AGAINST guns, right? Because it kills people is your argument.

But, why are you importing muslims in the masses? You absolute delusional DOLT. Look at europe and all of the terrorist attacks, more people have died from these terrorist attacks than school shooters/all other crazy nutjob shooters in all of america

Look at my country, Sweden, arguably the worst case in history of mass immigration by these cultural treasures we call muslims...

We have NO guns in sweden, basically only hunting rifles and they are hard as shit to get licenses for, (our police doesnt want us to have them). Yet the criminals have AK47s and handgrenades, wow! That gun control really worked man!! Thats what you get when liberals get to decide!

We have had 96 bombings in the last 6 months. This is SWEDEN, not IRAN. You think this was the case 20 years ago before mass immigration? Protip, it wasnt.

Guns are a means of killing people, just like a hammer, or a tank. The most deadly killer in the USA used fertelizer.... Its a means, nothing else. My point is, guns or no guns, it makes no difference. It only makes a difference in a positive way when it comes to shitheads like the nigger in australia. If the men there had concealed carry, a 9mm glock that nigger would have been dead on the streets.

What is more important is culture and what values people have. And since you degenerates are importing basically niggers with a mentality of an rabbid dog, you wont have a good time. Just like Sweden wont have a good time. Because people kill people, not guns.

To all amerifats of this board. Do not give up your right to weapons, any of them. Because the fact that the government wants them back, is reason enough to keep them.

They should fucking die for wanting that. We know what happens when they take the weapons. Do not do the same mistake.

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Fuck mohammed im an atheist lol idgaf about Jesus the cunt or mohammed the pedo

i guess most of the world must be a dictatorship as it isn't such a shithole as the states. I'm waiting anxiously for the end of your lame country, the rest of the world basically laughs at you

As an America, I just don’t care.
The gun lobby is too strong. We can’t do anything, the left simply lacks the political power to change a thing. You would have to repeal or alter the 2nd amendment, which would be incredibly hard, to have any real impact. Besides, 60% of gun deaths here are suicides, no assault weapon ban or background check is gonna stop any of those. It’s an overblown issue and I’m sick of hearing it.

That's a straight up lie, we've had mass shootings, the Chinese student at Monash University showed us that in 2002, there have been plenty of others too. How about the shooting we had the other day in Sunbury Victoria? Where police officers were shot at.

The interesting thing is that while gun crime went down, all other weapon related crime went through the roof, and there are statistics to show this.

The problem with gun control laws in Australia is not the gun control in my opinion, it's that we have given up our right to self defense along with our guns.

And that is the truly scary fact, when the Victorian and NSW police, even the commissioners, all say that you shouldn't try to defend yourself, your family or your property and just submit to being a victim the problem is the people who say this stuff all live in their nice gated communities and they don't know about the crackheads who roam at night yelling up and down the street, breaking windows, threatening to murder people.

Assuming any American gives a fuck that the rest of the world doesn't like us.

You don’t have nearly the amount of niggers and illegal spics roaming around breaking into shit. I killed one breaking into my house a while back and will do it again to protect my family.

Ausfag here. Ignore the faggot OP, btw Port Arthur is a deadset conspiracy that that had people turn a retard into a patsy. The evidence of said shooting is also not available for over 70 years and archived in archaic ways, they probably hope it gets lost in time.

Also this.

When it stops being Israels favourite puppet/centre of power.

What the fuck do you care? You constantly talk shit so its clear youre just trying to feel superior. You dont actually. Hey i think i hear a dingo eating your baby.

And you haven't invented shit in forever.... We have total freedom here to invent shit or kill people.... That's freedom....

BASED

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Thats the biggest crock of shit ive heard in a long time. You Yea Forums tards think everything is a conspiracy. Amerifags obsess over 9/11 and area 51, now ausfags over port arthur and pine gap. Are those white trails in the sky also fucking chemicals to control the population? Pull your head out faggot.

kys ASIO faggot

Probably be easier to do that in your country superfuck.

they dont have black people

Another Ausfag here, first time I've ever seen Port Arthur referred to as a conspiracy. Don't worry about him hes just "special". Probably a gun nut who has the sads he doesnt have his toys anymore. I went to Port Arthur only a couple months after the massacre and the place still looked like a warzone.

>actually believing Martin Bryant did it

I actually physically cringed hard at this

Yawn

gb2 reddit or your normalfag social media sites you drooling retard

You're just a salty little bitch who supports white supremacist ideologies. Let me guess you have a portrait of Brenton hanging in your room?

Ok then Genius who did it. A different nut? The gubment as an excuse to get rid of guns or hide something else?

Canada has as many guns as the US, but very very little gun violence.
The problem is not guns, and thinking otherwise is just wishful naivete.

Where did that come from? Nice strawman.
>everybody I don't like is Hitler
Possibly another nut or gubbermint.

You dont take canadian hospitality into account. Canada is exempt from gun laws because theyre already proper humans, unlike amerifucks.

'possibly', your claims are completely baseless. So Martin was framed ??

By Aussie standards USA had 6 mass shooting events last year. Aus had 3. Fuck off fag

The only reason u aussies have no shootings is cuz everyone is too pussy to do it

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No, its because the only thing people have access to is a bot action rifle therefore deterring them from going on a spree due to low KDR.

Nice trips

"by aus standards" huh? that statement makes no sense. A mass shooting is multiple people being shot in one act. Are you changing the definition of mass shooting to "going to to the shops" or "washing the car" or some shit?

Pretty much
>actually believing this
Jewgle search Firearm raid Australia. Or don't even bother doing that, do you have any Idea how many illegal firearms would exist? If you aren't a pussy you can easily gain access to proper weapons.

No you cant. An ak-47 will easily cost $25k to get from bikies or whatever. Probably a shitty worn out jamming piece of shit too. What does being a pussy have to do with it ?

If you're going to do a shooting you recognise you yourself could die and it will be the end of your life outside of prison. So what would you care about sinking that much money if not even more into procuring illegal firearms.

Who has 25k in the first place saved up?? This goes back to gun control in aus. If an ak was only a grand or whatever it is in the us, then a lot more people who were willing hut unable to afford would commit more gun crime. E.g. homeless, ice junkies, fuckwits etc.

man i lost my shit seeing that guy being constrained with that shit kek

>>Who has 25k in the first place saved up??
Get a loan or go to a loan shark if you can't do it legally, rob people, etc.

by what standard does canada have as many guns as the U.S.? Is a bit of a curious statement, and doesn't seem to be substantiated by any quick data i can find. We do have a cultural problem though, certainly.

>more people have died from these terrorist attacks than school shooters/all other crazy nutjob shooters in all of america
I mean you're 1000% wrong but you do you I guess

You're clutching at straws.. These kinds of people rob others of petty shit and will never amount to 25k, if they got close theyd blow it on drugs or other crime related debts. Just admit aus has good gun control.

Im so fucking glad I don't live in America total cesspool

You get mass shootings where homelessness, mental health problems and lack of affordable health care are huge problems but people will fight tooth and nail for their RIGHT to own assault rifles. Holy shit the US has its priorities in the wrong order. Anyone trying to fight the system gets labelled a socialist or communist as if there's nothing in between extremes.

user that is a little wrong. Some farmer faggot shot 10 people in his family in WA.

While it is tight and vastly superior to the US, we are getting slack with gun control and need to tighten the reigns.

>Anyone trying to fight the system gets labelled a socialist or communist
lol no

>first world country
Just been there. San Francisco and New York are like Third World Countries. Rather take my chances being stabbed in London than go back.

Honestly, as an Aussie, we just don't have the same kind of gun culture you guys do. We don't need them here, the same way you guys seem to need them. Guns work for the US. You're never (in the forseeable future, anyway) going to have the same kind of gun control and gun culture we have.
You're a country born of terrorism and violent rebellion. We're not. We both developed our own ways.
Horses for courses.

Didn't that guy shoot up a mosque a few months ago?

I know but it pales in comparison to the US

>mosque shooting
Was an aussie, but the shooting happened in NZ. NZ have (had) different, looser gun controls

>Amerifags obsess over 9/11 and area 51
we don't
actually most dont give a shit about either
stop watching mainstream media news
it is bad for your health
read news

Who's that on your $5 bill?

America threw off the shackles of our oppressors, you kissed the ring. Just like Cucknada. We understand how quickly a government can turn on its people. We realize that Switzerland was only able to remain neutral in WWII because their populace was armed. Otherwise, they would have been eaten alive by the nazis as well.

The violence we experience pales in comparison to the tragedy that could befall us if the authorities were the only ones armed.

Banning guns straya style here in the US would cause a nationwide insurgency.
Roughly one quarter of americans own guns. Say 80 million people.

Even if one tenth of one percent of all gun owners refused and the other 99.9% turned them in no questions asked, youd still have 80,000 people nationally who would most likely be willing to:
>kill
>die
>get into gunfights with law enforcement
>more than likely kill bystanders
>some my snap and go on sprees because fuckit, they're gonna kill me anyway
Divided evenly across all 50 states, that's 1600 people in each state in that group.
Again, one tenth of one percent of gun owners. Try 5%. That's roughly 4 million pissed off gun owners. Law enforcement cant handle that. Which would usher in military forces. Which would mean every citizen would have a curfew, special ID to say you dont have guns (or are crazy), warrentless home checks for weapons/no-knock raids, unjust arrests, etc... sound like anything familiar? Maybe early 40's Europe familiar?

Ausfag here. Dont makw our country sound like a utopia. There is plenty of racism and favourism especially in employment sectors such as emergency services and military. Ever seen an arab in the army? Its always a Darren O'Callagah or some shit like that. Gun control is fine, but our country is a shit hole in other regards.

In NZ but he was australian

Hmmm I wonder what the main source of daily gun violence in the US is

how was he wrong you retard.
people don't get shot in Europe.
they get stabbed, their heads chopped off, run over by trucks and cars, blown the fuck up with bombs and throwables,
white women are being raped on a daily basis.
not to mention the 10s of thousands of girls rapped by 80% Pakistani men.

TELL ME AGAIN HOW EUROPE IS BETTER.

its, because there is no incentive to commit a mass shooting AUS, is a very good place to live and it hasn't been ruined by the wild coons and migrants yet.

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You actually do, there is so much material on 9/11 veing an inside job. All published by americans.

>people don't get shot in Europe.
Except the Bataclan, Charlie Hedbo, Munich Olympics
People so quickly forget how badly France/Belgium copped it only a few years ago

You should stop getting your 'facts' from Fox News, Breitbart and the Drudge Report

>daily gun violence

More like ALL gun violence. Even mass shooters are rarely whites.

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It's entertaining how you lot think the ability to name a small number of mass shootings committed over a long number of years is the same as daily mass shootings in the US

Re; The abos just drink goon and keep to themselves they ain't like then aggressive wild criminal Amerian coons.
thank god we live on an island in the middle of nowhere so fucking niggers can't just walk across the border.
Now fuck off were full

Because nobody cares about blacks murdering each other in a ghetto lmao

Were actually not full, your forefathers are dirty british criminals.

>Who's that on your $5 bill?
The queen of Australia.
It's legally an entirely different role than the UK Monarch, despite the fact that it happens to be the same person.
Additionally, the Queen has essentially no actual power in our constitution - it's all held by the Governor General, a position appointed by the elected legislature.

The UK is not oppressing us. Sure, they learnt from their mistakes in the Americas, so in that sense we have you guys to thank, but we never needed to rebel. There's nothing to rebel against. We're doing okay, and have been for a century. Our governments and institutions are, if anything, more stable and more linked to our population than yours.
You guys can have your guns. I don't begrudge you them. We're mostly okay with what we have here ourselves. You do you, we'll do us.

> Dont makw our country sound like a utopia
Oh, agreed, it's not. We definitely don't have the average person's need for a gun that same person in the US would have though.
Yes, we have a lot of problems, every country has, and every country always will have.

The mass shooters who just go off and kill random people are pretty much always pathetic white male teenagers. I'd wager most of your pic there are gang violence killings

What does that have to do with anything? I'm saying you say "lol, what about Charlie Hebdo", comparing an event which happened years ago to mass shootings happening constantly in the US

No, Denmark and Japan just 2 examples trouble free, wholesome democratic living.

Agreed. The problem is, when the media inflates the "horrific levels of gun violence", they choose to include all those gang shootings. If we subtract those, our gun violence isn't anywhere near what the media claims.

>You do you, we'll do us.
Fair dinkum

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yes

There's no corelation between gun control laws and gun violence.
Places like Australia (tiny population, not a melting pot the way the US is) never had a big gun crime problem in the first place, the laws didn't do anything.
A lot of our states (the ones with less ghetto), which are more comparable population wise to the typical countries people like to hold up as examples of gun control success, have very loose to non-existent gun control and levels of gun crime on par with your average European country.
Guns are used over a million times a year in the US in self defense situations, usually without even having to fire a shot.
You're taking that away from the average law abiding citizen and leaving them at the mercy of the people who don't give a shit about what ever laws you create all because a bunch of drug dealers are shooting each other and making our homicide stats really bad.

>Denmark and Japan just 2 examples trouble free, wholesome democratic living.
They have their own internal social and political issues, that to the Danes and Japanese would seem significant.

People that say “gun control worked in Australia” really need to look at the numbers, there wasn’t a huge amount of shootings before the firearm legislation and buyback anyway, and there have still been mass shootings on a consistent basis since port Arthur. People will spin whatever they can to suit an agenda. Also Bryant’s kill ratio is extremely suspicious for someone with the IQ he has, it’s even considered high by special forces standards. I have firearms training from my brief time in the RAN and it does make me think. Although I’m not really into conspiracy theories.

Not significant enough for a non-native like yourself to tell me what they are. Therefore, my point still stands, 2 of the best countries to live in and indeed 2 which are basically strife and trouble free

Your comparing gun crime in the whole of the European continent to the USA? and found 3 examples

if we open boarders we will be having daily stabbing sand acid attacks and then someone will go shoot up something ? you want that . No fuck off

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I'm not going to sidetrack a thread comparing US and Australian gun laws and culture with irrelevancies about Denmark and Japan, it's not that I can't, but I won't. Start another thread if you want to make the claim they're so great.

lol even in the case of the mass shooter being "white" they're usually actual mutts or jews.
You are either non-white, jewish, or brainwashed. Pick any of those.

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Its called an amendment ffs...youve amended them before...and they can be again...you're all just obsessed with your fucking guns

Arabfag here....

Fuck your Guns and gun control debate which will keep dividing your country evermore. Abrogate 1st & 2nd amendment. Fuck those who oppose and support gun control. Fuck everyone. Fuck your nonsensical partisan media.

Anyway, I'm getting laid tonight Yohoooo!! See you Virgins.

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We hate you religious fags

Cop out. Thats all youre doing, copping out.

Not anymore...we shut that down real quick

If your borders werent open, I wouldnt be here to shitpost on Yea Forums, and you dont see me attacking anybody. Also, you would be eating sausage roll and meat pies for brekky lunch and dinner. So be thankful that you can get a greasy fuckoff kebab at 2am.

I like pies and sausage rolls...what's your point

Hence the
> (had)
Though I think the current laws might still be a tad more lax than in AU, at least in some areas...? Haven't gone over yours in that much detail

Not to be a xenophobe.

Yeah. Good thing the bystanders were not allowed to carry anything that could be reasonably used as a weapon. Such as knife or pepper spray.

Australia sure did protect that attacker's rights not to be harmed.

But who are we kidding. There's probably already a proposal to outlaw crates as we speak. A civilized society has no place for such dangerous assault weapons.

I mean, just look at it. It's so black and with sharp angles. It is clearly a tactical crate created for the sole purpose of killing innocents.

We're only to amend the constitution when it fails to enshrine people's rights. For instance, the 3/5ths compromise. Although it was initially a solution to combat slavery, after an amendment was made abolishing slavery altogether, it became obsolete, and was removed.

The second amendment still enshrines our right to self defense though the ownership and use of weapons, thus it shouldn't be removed or amended.

I love how everyone outside of the US thinks they know our system of governance better than we do.

Top kek

Yeah I don't care what laws are, I have a gun at my home for self protection. I'm probably never going to need to use it, but if someone comes into my home and tries harming me, they gon die, not me!

Over 400 million guns in america it really is out of control. Right to bear arms for when muskets were around.

>actually giving a shit about Americans
Let them kill themselves

We banned assualt assault rifles two weeks after the massacre...the govt has had an amnesty for gun owners to give their guns to police and paid for them...10000 guns in about two weeks...that may sound like a little but for a population of 4.5 million its a good start

Yeah, nah, that's not how it goes here. Our population acts before it thinks. It always has and probably always will. It spurs both innovation and starvation.

You deprive the law abiding citizens of guns, and you will watch as a nation of law abiding citizens turn into thieves. With nothing to hold anyone back, this country would eat itself.

Alcohol...you amended that one

June 2019 Darwin Shooting June 4, 2019 Darwin, Northern Territory 4 1 Four people were killed and one person was critically injured in the leg in a mass shooting allegedly carried out with a prohibited pump-action (Category C) shotgun. The alleged shooter, 45-year-old Benjamin Glenn Hoffman, has been charged with four counts of murder. The alleged shooter had been released from prison on parole in January 2019 and was wearing a GPS-tracked electronic monitoring bracelet as a condition of his parole.

And tell me the original intention of the 2nd ammendment

why do you care so much about another country's gun crime?
We don't bring up that you assholes lost a war against flightless birds and that we protected you from the tojos in WW2

The 18th amendment was an example when the legislature failed in its job to protect the rights of the people. A failure which was corrected with amendment 21.

You sound underaged. If you're an adult I feel sorry for you.

The odds of dying to gun violence are so slim. The US has a population over 350 million. Merica's should be worried about making cars safer

And eating healthier

Yeah, what a tool, he totally forgot how the rest of your country is abbos who are somehow actually dumber than niggers... you never see Jamal drinking fucking gasoline to get high or taking a nap in the highway

How's that family tree looking? You people start burning the coal like good little goy cucks yet?

The original intention was to ensure the right of the people to bear arms so that they are prepared to participate in the militia. Based on local laws, as well as the writings of several founding fathers, the militia was considered to be every single fighting age male. The exact age range varied from state to state. And although not expressly mentioned in the laws, women were often included in the militia.

Because the USA was once the beacon of the world...other countries looked up to you as the good guys...but thats way gone now...you have a corrupt government...a racist homophobic bigot in charge with the iq of a five your old...as a nation...youre fucked unless you get that orange fuckhead out and get back what you used to have...which was respect as the greatest nation on earth...currently...youre the laughing stock of the world...and Trump is to blame

Either a shill or a sheep. Dont engage.

Correct...it doesnt mean any fucking retard can but a semi automatic machine gun for a grand from Walmart and go shooting because god told him to kill

the rest of the world doesn't know ANYTHING about us and don't care about any of those things. they simply worship us and all the movies and music we produce, as well as the technology we create. that's all.

no one in europe ever heard of "occupy wall street" and they don't know anything or care about trump.

>semi-automatic machine gun

kek you know literally nothing about firearms. I can teach you some things so you don't sound quite so stupid in the future. If you want.

Also, did you miss the part about
>every fighting age male

Yes, literally everyone was allowed to own whatever guns they could, and most places required you to own them by law. The goal being defending ourselves from internal and external threats.

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah orange man bad!!!

Let me know when your insignificant dung heap of a homeland is capable of it's own national defense, let alone worldwide influence and dominance through culture and economy alone.

Lies

How?

lol we can't even keep out heroin, what makes you think we can keep out guns? would just be a new thing for the cartels to sell us. build the fucking wall.

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What makes you think the wall will solve the smuggling problem?
The only real way to fix that shit is to get the military out of whatever sandy shithole they're in and invade south america.

Who cares about yankoids? Their shithole will collapse anyways.

>sandnigger
>peaceful
pick one ali agca

I don't care what's being discussed here. If ya'll care, I'm gonna fuck a hot brunette and she's a MILF. Going to have the best sex of my life. See you later Virgins.

You are a hero sir

Canada doesn't have black people or mexicans.

It'll increase the cost of smuggling goods, they'll be affected not by impossibility of ingress but by their own bottom line. As for migrants Israel's border wall demonstrates an immigration prevention effectiveness of 99% and saw an 80% decrease in suicide bombings. Walls definitely do quite a bit.

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this is objectively incorrect

You can be both. Its religion which causes sandniggers to explode. I have no religion. I believe in reason and science, but am also of sandnigger appearance.

>believe in reason and science
>atheist
pick one you sandnigger

*laughs in high suicide rates*

'believe' is used loosely. Atheism has no doctrine or book. Atheism is the absent belief in the supernatural. Now stop splitting hair fuckhead.

Your abbos are nothing compared to Murican shit skins of niggers and spics. You'd need guns too. On a sidw note all you niggers are prisoner decendents, no weapons for you fucks.

Kek triggered

It takes a lot of faith to be an atheist. More so than being a theist.
I'll split your head from your body in the name of the almighty allah! mashallah may the prophet pierce your heart with a thousand arrows, may your dog heart suffer a sevenfold strokes, may the sword of islam strike your nose off! imram al kari'im bar al'quaa!

Not at all. Atheism doesn't say much about what you DO believe, just what you DON'T believe.

>Guns are a big issue
Kek, more people die from any of these every year: Disease, Cancer, Strokes, Diabetes, Influenza, Drugs, Illegal Drugs, Blunt Objects and Self Harm.

More children drown each year than guns kill. Maybe we should ban all swimming pools too. Neck yourself.

You clearly lack the capacity to understand that atheism is not a system, like religion is. You cant have faith in something that does not claim to be founded in the supernatural.

Good try though.

>Implying mass shootings aren't orchestrated by the government to get you to give up your guns. Making you easy to subdue

Atheists believe that there are no gods or any supernatural forces, because there is no proof to confirm or deny their existence. So atheists usually take the "scientific" approach, they generally believe that the universe began from nothing and then "something happened". Takes a lot of faith to believe something like that.

Jim Jefferies is that you?!

nobody worships the US. we just laugh while you call yourselves the leaders of the free world and shit. you're a joke

Let me give you the biblical narrative and see which is easier to believe, despite the fact that your description on the atheist narrative sucked massive donkey dick:

"some Jewish zombie cunt rose from the dead, ascended to himself to forgive the very humans he created. He routinely gets the shits with his creations and routinely floods them (while also adding insult to injury since he apparently flooded the world previously killing millions)."

Oh before all of that happened, God had really bad Indian food, farted and the world came into exitence only 6k years ago. Fuck off you and your bullshit archaic book of fables.

>So atheists usually take the "scientific" approach, they generally believe that the universe began from nothing and then "something happened". Takes a lot of faith to believe something like that.
>usually

Meaning atheist doesn't necessitate the beliefs you described, and thus doesn't require any faith. Thank you for proving me right.

Also, the scientific worldview doesn't require that the universe began from nothing. That's not at all what the big bang implies. All that the big bang implies is that the universe was once in a much smaller, much hotter, and denser state than it is currently. It says nothing about what happened before that.

>because there is no proof to confirm or deny their existence.
That's called Agnosticism you fucktard. Not Atheism. Also, not believing in dumb organised religions is something else. Fuck Mohammedfags and Christfags.

>ome Jewish zombie
stopped reading right there. cope harder. atheists are the most delusional freaks. even mudshits and hindu poos know more about life and the universe than you can ever hope to learn. kek

So, as an atheist what do you think started the universe?

He is a zombie and xtianity is a fucking cult. You celebrate a dead cunts birthday every year and eat his body and blood. Cult.

Exactly, atheists are agnostics. Ugh, organised religion is obviously a jewish psyop to control the masses. I don't subscribe to the church nonsense.

As a theist, what started God? You believe he is eternal, right? If you accept that something can exist eternally, why can't I apply that property to the universe itself?

Imagine living in Australia and saying "fuck the whites" you're literally a nigger faggot with low T and sub human IQ

I wonder how many more people need to die before you American fucktards realise you need better gun control.

All of them

>You celebrate a dead cunts birthday every year and eat his body and blood
>implying im a cathol
wrong. try again sunshine.
also, zombie: a corpse said to be revived by witchcraft, especially in certain African and Caribbean religions. Jesus wasn't revived by witchcraft, he came back to life the same way doctors would bring someone back to life. an atheist being wrong as always? why am I not surprised?
That doesn't answer my question, what do YOU believe started the universe?

Pretty edgey, user. Pretty damn edgey.

I don't believe the universe "started" in the same way you don't believe God "started"

The universe is eternal, and cyclical.

Malaria causes more needless deaths than US guns. You're cherry picking this fight for a reason

Look at the xtian trying to give a rationale about something that has never been medically approved. Your religion is insane amd so are you. Get your brain check and try to be a productive member of society would you?

Please elaborate, you believe that the universe had no start, that it always existed? Well, it would take a lot of energy for all these starts, planets and other celestial bodies to form, you don't believe they just puffed into existence do you?

Not the person you were talking with, but another atheist.
If by "started the universe" you mean what caused the existence of the universe - I don't know what started the universe. That may not be a question that even makes sense to ask, and even if it does the answer may be literally impossible to know.
The start of the universe doesn't have anything to do with atheism as such, however.

Lol there was a spree killer in Darwin, who killed 4 injured 3 others only a couple weeks back.
Don't forget the Monash Uni mass shooting, the family wiped out in a gun spree in Margaret River last year etc

>Your religion is insane amd so are you
says the man who thinks nothing created everything. Funny how atheists subscribe to "science" and "proven facts" while blatantly denying the fact approved by the historian community that jesus was a real person who was still active after his execution, seen on numerous occassions by hundreds if not thousands of people.
>inb4 mass hallucination
kek

Atheist don't believe. Disbelief is not the same as belief. You put forward a claim. I do not agree that claim is true. I am without God. A-theist.

It is like rejecting a magical health drink that will give you sixpack and lose 20 lbs in a month.

Yeah, nah. Your claims are outrageous, and I'm not falling for them.

Historians are not scientists and should not be treated as such. Kys

Atheists have to have faith that there is no creator, you can't know that for a fact so you must have faith and belief that you're right.

> People don't get shot in Europe
In the last two weeks there have been mass shootings in Zagreb 6 dead, downtown Helsinki- 3 shot, southern France 3 killed including 2 tourists.

It's just we never hear about these event in English language media.

kek denying uncomfortable facts. your ass is going to hell sunshine

>People shouldnt be dying so needlessly, esp in a first world country. Japan has probably the lowest gun violence in the world

1) we DO have mass shootings in australia
2) we have had a rising rate of knife crimes since we banned guns
3) murder/manslaughter/disappearances as a whole didn't go down following the ban

>puffed into existence

No I don't. I believe the energy of which they're comprised is a fundamental element of the universe, and has existed eternally along with it.

I should mention, I'm a moral absolutist, and not a nihilist. So I'm not your typical FSM atheist.

Shill

The whole idea that you have to have faith in something is wrong.

I don't believe there is a God. I don't believe there is no God.

I just don't care. I am not convinced. You failed to convince me. Just like a sales person fails to convince you buying that Ferrari will fix your life.

> the fact approved by the historian community that jesus was a real person who was still active after his execution
The historicity of Jesus is debated outside of theological "historians"
Most will accept that there was an individual called Jesus (with significant mythos built around the person) because it's a decent working assumption, but there are credible theories that the biblical character was a synthesis of several real persons, or a mostly fictional adaptation of existing cult focuses. Paul features heavily in several of those theories as a significant factor in "creating" the Jesus character.
The primary near-contemporary source is Josephus, whose comments on Jesus are strongly suspected to be later forgeries, even within the theological community.

As for "after his execution" - that's very very suspect and poorly supported.

Except the darwin mass just a few short months ago ya dumbfuck

Oh and the monash uni shootings, and the hunt family shooting and the wedderburn shooting etc etc etc

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_in_Australia

You're thinking of antitheists.

>Theist: Believes
>Atheist: Doesn't Believe
>Antitheist: Disbelieves

Read your Bible, most Xtians are goimg there too. See you there, idiot. Maybe if you spent more time reading your book of fables youd know that.

So these stars and planets always existed? How is that possible? Massive amounts of energy had to be concentrated and focused on forming these bodies, right? You don't believe that these formed by pure chance right?
Let's take a book for example, you know that the book had a creator because a book cannot write itself right? You're not going to have letters write themselves on the paper and then those pages coming together to form a book, someone had to create that book, right? Same with the universe, planets and stars couldn't just always exist, we don't know how stars form but we do know that they have a lifespan.
Where does your morality come from?

Look, when you have a stab wound and say that you don't have a stab wouldn't doesn't change the fact that you still have a stab wound. Say what you like but it won't change the fact that you do have faith in your view, no matter how hard you try to deny it.

"gun control" means using both hands in my land.

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Well, saying that there is a stab wound, you can't really feel or see it, but it is right there. You just have to believe, so please buy this magic healing water. That is just dumb.

This is not about believing. This is about rejecting a proposal based on insufficient evidence.

>these stars and planets always existed

That's not what I said. I said the energy from which they're formed has always existed. And they didn't form by pure chance, they formed according to the distribution and natural behaviors of the universe as dictated by the fundamental forces of the universe. The four we know of are the strong and weak nuclear force, electromagnetism, and gravity. There may be more, however.

The morality is a far more interesting question. I think morality comes from objective reason. For instance, let's say our goal is to boil water. Adding ice to that water won't boil it. Leaving it alone won't boil it. Setting a fire underneath it will boil it. Therefore, there is an objectively superior way to boil that water.

In the same way, moral behavior is one that causes minimal harm. This is self-evident as anyone with a healthy mind doesn't enjoy or desire to be harmed. Therefore, with that goal in mind, we can construct objective ways to pursue it.

It's more complex than that, obviously, but that's the super basic version.

the distribution of the energy*

Not really, many secular historians also agree that Jesus existed. Josephus isn't the only source, but he is the main one. Tacitus comes straight to mind.

If you're going to hell you're not a Christian. Simple as. You don't know what you're on about, but you'll continue to spew your nonsense, please go on.

And that's what you're doing, you believe that there is no creator.

Now you're just talking in circles. This discussion is over.

Ahh, the ol' "Not a true christian" argument. Just like the bad actors of any denomination aren't "true whatevers"

Sorry, I can't quite hear you over that cock in your mouth

Disregard the OP.
Australia has had at least 10 mass shootings since 1996. The most recent saw 4 people killed in June. By per capita basis states like Idaho, Maine, Utah, Iowa are actually safer.

Most of the world is a Dictatorship.
Sad you failed to realize this.
No one has managed to defeat America with armed force.
The sad fact far too many WITHIN America are striving to dismantle the Country and the principles it was Founded on?
That's another topic.

Truth has that effect on the spineless.

Try to avoid Truth, if it affects you so harshly.

>laughs

You faggots weren't laughing when Trump put the screws to you over NATO. You cucks coughed that money up reaaaal quick. No more weaseling out of it. We protect all of you, and your heads got a little too big from not being in danger of Vlad coming in and dominating your bitch asses.

We're your daddy, never forget that.

There havent beed a mass shooting in Switzerland either, but there have been in Germany.
Germany has way less guns and stricter control btw.
So maybe, just maybe its because of the disgusting system we live in?

Did you not hear about the Kyoto Animation Studio attack recently? Dude didn’t even have a gun, killed 35 people. Guess we better make butter knives and lighter fluid illegal too, then people won’t hurt each other a hurr durr

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Hahaha
> U.S.
>first world country

Pick one.

You wish you could be us so fucking badly it’s pathetic

You have no idea what first world means, dipshit.

Look, Australia wasn't brought into the modern world, with the same intent as America was Founded.
Deal with it already.
If mass prohibition against firearm ownership for the Australian Citizenry works for you?
Congrats.
America is not, and never has been, a firearm-less society.

I'd suggest you do more research into this topic, and then realize the in EVERY instance, the mass of gun violence/murder (NOT suicides or justifiable gun homicide(s)), occurs in areas where the 2nd Amendment is SEVERELY RESTRICTED.

That, is simple fact.

Enjoy yer Vegemite an' kippers.

Guys
Wait
I just had a great idea
Guys
Seriously you guys
What if
Listen
What if we made murder illegal?
That way, people won’t kill each other!?!?
WHY HASNT ANYONE THOUGHT OF THIS!?!?

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Better yet, let's make dying illegal.

2001 about 11 people were killed in a mass shooting Zug. (The town, not a train btw) also last year 3 were killed in an Albanian restaurant in Basel.

Yes, because Government has proven itself so VERY ADEPT at protecting the Citizenry against armed murderers.

Try harder.

this coming from the country that continually boosts about having no mass shootings, but in fact has had several and they are escalating in frequency. two in the last 13 months.

"world class gun laws"

MOTHERFUCKER THAT’S BRILLIANT!!1!

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Higher taxes folks jailed for speech,
Thanks my upside down user but sticking with the Constitution,

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these are 2
in Germany in 2017 or 18 some fag killed 9 in Munich
Let me look up more

Ausfag here

My cousin was imprisoned for 18 months because a guy with a rifle was shooting at his caravan (he wasn't in it at the time) and he got the rifle off him and shot him. All self-defense, was charged with firearm offences.

There are a small % of awake ausfags who are desperate for your 2nd amendment right, please don't mistake us all for boot licking cucks like OP

npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2019/08/05/743579605/how-the-u-s-compares-to-other-countries-in-deaths-from-gun-violence?t=1565783104769

Basically, the US is killing as if they were a third world country

I think the saddest part about this is the misinformation campaign that the Aussie government is propagating to cover this up. I’ve tried looking up crime stats in Australia, they’re so fucking vague and basic they look like they were made by a 4th grader saying “See? Look! Things are doing just fine!”

That's true. Germany has had a number of school shootings as well. Erfurt comes to mind.
Finland aslo had a run of school shootings, 3 major ones in about 2007-2009.

>>npr
Imagine unironically being this gullible

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And yet, when ANYTHING in the world happens, the ENTIRE world looks to the US for its reaction. The US can unilaterally sanction any nation on earth and destroy its economy. Every dictatorship and strongman blames the US for its internal problems. Its politics make headlines worldwide. Its media is consumed worldwide and has been for almost 100 years. Its military can swing its dick in any part of the world freely. People on Yea Forums spend all their time seething over US politics and demographics, don't really see this with other countries.

What a Joke the US is.

And when you subtract gang violence and crimes committed by blacks, that chart evens out massively.

fuck off yabbo.

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Really? Did the MSM report on it? If not, then it didn’t happen.

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crimestats.aic.gov.au/

These stats are very specific, they even have their own categories

Isn't it weird how the countries with the lowest gun crime are all mostly homogenous? 30% of Iceland's population owns guns, yet there is almost no crime

Probably because the U.S. government gets it's dirty, war mongering pig hooves all over the whole world like a virus or infection. Why no rattle on about AOC some more, like she's not one of 450 representatives in the house.

>NPR
These numbers include suicides. Actual violent gun crime is incredibly rare, and has been decreasing steadily for quite some time. Remove gang-related gun violence and our instances of gun deaths end up being on par with nations that have similar gun ownership rates (per person).

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Why don't you try to find a more reliable sauce, that's from a non political biased website

i know this is Yea Forums, so feel free not to believe me. But i have had two siblings (older) one male, one female in Australian police forces, for over 5 years each

Both will tell you the same thing. Crime doesn't change. What happens here is, our police are used as tools for politicians to get reelected or to get new laws introduced.

both my siblings were on general patrol, both frequently were asked flat out record certain crimes as different crimes or not record certain crimes AT ALL if the objectives from their bosses were to "reduce" a certain type of crime stat.

On the other end, if a piece of legalisation was before parliament that was to tackle a certain form of crime and needed the numbers to support, they were told to go out and charge/arrest people for that particular crime, regardless of whether or not it was genuine and would see a court room, all to make it seem like that crime was a problem and needed new legislation passed.

Australia is nation of corruption, and all the people at the helm have the public 100% subdued, australians are simple and dull, and they've been engineered this way.

>thinks having categories is a special feature
That’s cute. And the graphs are still vague as shit, probably because they’re fucking made up. Have you ever taken a minute to consider this possibility in between your shifts at McDonalds?

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Sweden auch

Case in point numbnuts. Good luck!

Ok I found this
google.com/amp/s/www.augsburger-allgemeine.de/panorama/Uebersicht-Diese-Amoklaeufe-erschuetterten-Deutschland-id38580022-amp.html

in case you speak german. Most of these are shootings, 1 was a molotov cocktail.

Couldnt find comparable stuff for Switzerland.
You literally need about 1.5 years to get a gun for sporting purposes and a little less then a year for hunting.
Semiauto is about 2 years realiaticly.

>feel free not to believe me
I don’t, and I also took the liberty of not reading all that other bullshit you took the time to write. Sorry m8

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During last year's world cup there was a mass shooting in a Malmö bar when people we're watching a game. I think 3 killed, 4 injured.
Also the previous year at the market in Trelleborg, a new Swede opened fire wounding 7.

Don't let the media ever try tell you places like Australia, Europe don't have mass shootings.

"All charts exclude deaths in armed conflict and from accidents or self-harm."
Be honest, you guys are too lazy to read

This. They lump in suicides and gang violence that is largely concentrated in big liberal cities into these statistics. If you look at other statistics that aren't organized in a sneaky matter you will find that the united states isn't even in the top 20 most violent countries. Also Japan has more suicide despite having no gunz.

>armed conflict
What the fuck does that even mean? Are there people out there counting gun battles in Afghanistan towards gun violence data among Americans?

so u r saying uve got a country full of niggers u brought over yourselves and instead of changing the law in time to regulate guns, u flooded the place with guns, let every1 have them and now u r complaining, that a) u cant fix the weapons problem and b) u cant fix the nigger problem?
Is that right?

i wouldn't have expected anything less from an Australian but complete and utter ignorance

Back to MAFS and another 30 pack of tinnies, your government approved lobotomy is complete

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I read it just fine. I didn't mention suicides or any of that. Gang violence and black crime isn't considered armed conflict or self-harm, dingus.

Still accounts for a massively disproportionate amount of gun violence. Those charts would look completely different if you exclude crimes by blacks and gang members. And I'm not even racist, that's just a fact.

Vielen dank

was not there a school shooting in Sweden as well in the past few years?

lylawyers.com.au/2019-crime-statistics-australia/

>we need to cover up that shitstain on out whire wall
>LOL, LOOK AT THEM TRYING TO COVER IT UP
>yelled the country whos walls r covered in shit completely

And the Muslims in New Zealand are getting shot up instead of Muslims in Straya. If anything the lack of Muslims being killed demonstrates the need for the repeal of gun control in Australia.

There are millions of guns in America. You can't put that genie back in the bottle. Even if you could, gun violence is a symptom - not a problem. America's real issue is how it treats it's criminals and how it approaches mental health.

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Strange place to post this considering most of the people who will eventually become mass shooters lurk this board.

yes, u can. The sooner u start, the better

You are being racist , you're blaming a black person for gun violence, even tho most mass shootings are done by white men. I don't know what your point is really, you're saying if you take out some records of gun violence it will show less numbers on the statistics, that's dumb, you're trying to cheat the numbers.

Stop trying to be fucking edgy degenerate

Kys faggot. Go worship make-believe.

>Most reported and sensationalized mass shootings are done by white men.

Fixed that for you.

Wow, brilliant plan. I'm sure this will be effective at buying back/confiscating the 390+ million firearms in the United States, plus all the ones that are being imported or manufactured as we speak. If only we realized it was this easy.

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>most mass shootings done by white men

How did I know that one was coming? It's not even close. It's almost entirely black men.

And the point is, if most of the gun violence is being committed by a tiny portion of the community, taking guns away from the rest of them isn't going to help things.

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i didnt say its easy. U made it hard and u have to fix it

Not the same user but if I'm going to exert Herculean effort for a political cause I'd rather exert it trying to fix the spic problem or roll back feminism and lbgtwtfbbq.

band of brothers is so based

We need another war.

what movie was that? was that the first Sacario?

feminism didnt kill any1

There's one problem though. I lost all my guns in a tragic boating accident.

>create massive tensions between law-abiding citizens and the government
>confiscate all legally-owned guns, leaving only criminals armed
>leave the citizenry open to abuses by a dictatorial government/invasion by foreign military

And all so a few less gang members can die, and terrorists have to find more creative ways to kill people like bombs or running them over with a truck. What a grand idea.

Shit. Is this true? I knew the recent one in that Virginia office building was a black guy but that's all I could think off. Afaik they've all been white guys.

none of this is true

google.com/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/why-are-white-men-more-likely-to-carry-out-mass-shootings-11252808

>feminism didnt kill any1
Whats the abortion kill count now sitting at?
Estimated 60 million or so since the 1960s.

Those are just the most widely reported ones. Mostly because of the victims who are targeted. but also to push a certain narrative. You can check on Snopes, the image is accurate, and based on FBI statistics.

Superb argument. You lose.

so this is what? Irrelevant thesis fallacy, or argument from analogy fallacy?

oh, u mean unlike yours, which had every premise unsubstantiated?

Its just killing western birthrates, morals and civilization. Things with far greater value than the lives of a few shitskins.

Why don't you offer to host unwanted test tube embryos as a surrogate and save some lives?
Oh, right. Because you have no capacity for it and are arguing about what other people should do, rather than anything that affects you.
You're probably the sort that has a nice set of arguments on why paying child support is just the most unfair thing ever, right?

its not killing morals, nor civilisation
so what if its killing birthrates? The birthrates that wouldnt be there to begin with, if they didnt have sex or used contraceptions, or the birthrates that wouldve turned into u complaining why r there so many poor ppl?

Please have a cookie on me, friend.

>sky news

And sure, tweak the definition very slightly to fit your argument. Three KILLED as opposed to four SHOT.

So because the white guys have slightly better aim, they're clearly the most violent people in the world. Brilliant.

A majority of Americans don't support a gun ban. You can fact check that yourself.

The second point is self-evident. Criminals will not turn in guns they own illegally. If only law-abiding citizens with registered firearms are disarmed, it will leave only criminals with guns.

The third point is also true. Switzerland was able to remain neutral in WWII. Why? Because their populace was armed. If they were disarmed, they would have been ransacked like all of their neighbors.

Holy fuck this thread is a prime example of the rampant autism and absolute retardation that embodies this stupid fucking board. All you assholes ever do is argue with each other and call each other names. Christ, you're all a bunch of whiny niggers, and I hope you all die violently.

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OP here, this was posted as a troll 5 or 6 hours ago. You guys suck for falling for it and it shows how easily Amerifucks can be triggered if you hurdur take away their right to bear arms.

You couldn't dispute the evidence, so you accuse the article of manipulating, great job, outstanding.

Oh stop it user. That's why you come here. You love us.

Because my dear idiot, replacing functional white citizens with mestizo and negro shitskin animals is not a good strategy for maintaining a civilization in the long term. But thank you for bringing up contraceptives, access to those should be severely limited at least.

And as for morals if you can't see the obvious moral decay around you or think that promiscuity or sodomy are a-okay then there really is no hope for you.

No, I just explained how slightly changing a definition can produce different results. According to the definition set forward in the image I posted, the results are accurate. According to the definition given in the article, the results are accurate. I'm just saying the article chose a definition arbitrarily based on the agenda it's trying to push.

Way to misrepresent my argument.

argument from popularity fallacy. Also majority of Americns want a health care system. Wheres that?
so the criminals will be caught. Thats what uve got police and fbi for.
u were armed and u participated in ww2

so dont replace them, nigger
theres no moral decay. Go back to praying your child gets miraculously cured of measles, instead of vaccinating it. Thatll boost your precious birth rate, right? 3x the birth, 5x the infant mortality

It's not an argument from popularity, you dense cunt. The point I was defending is that would cause tensions between the people and the government because most of them don't support a gun ban and wouldn't want to give up their firearms.

The criminals will also run amok in the meantime, and obtain more guns later on. It's not a solution.

And we weren't invaded. The Japanese made one attack on US soil out of sheer desperation, after we voluntarily involved ourselves by cutting off their oil supply. Besides, the nazis never attacked at all, and neither of them put boots on the ground in the US. For a reason. They would have been blown to smithereens by the locals who were armed to the teeth.

no, it wouldnt, retarded autist. And what would the "tension" do, exactly? Hows your tension about lack of health care, or war in middle east? Or net neutrality? U toothless, spineless, snivelling twat
and the police will run after them, catching them
japan bombed u and u went to war. How did u having a colt stop the japanese bombing? U think there was no country with guns in hands of the civilians, that did get attacked anyway? On scale from 10 to 11, how delusional r u?
And when r u planning to address the issue u brought this on yourself and u need to fix it, not let it be?

It's not good. There's already plenty of tension. No need to introduce more.

Not a solution

That's right, they bombed out of desperation. They didn't invade. And no, armed countries weren't invaded. Disarmed ones were conquered.

And the only issue is people wanting to give up their right to self preservation to feel comfort. It's cowardly. I'm sure that's why you support it.

u keep introducing more tension with everything else. U r piling up problems to have an excuse u cant fix anything, cuz some1s gonna be upset. Theres no tension. Theres a problem to fix. Fix the fucking problem. If theres "thension", theres never not gonna be tension, u faggot. Do it now.
Having cops to top criminals isnt a solution? R u ok, retard?
so how did not being invaded stop being a part of the war, then? They still got attacked, drafted and died. Not an argument
false equivocation. Theres an actual world outside of US borders, where theres a right to bare arms, where firearms r regulated and they still not only survive, but also thrive. How do u explain that? Do we go back to blaming niggers u brought in, therefore its still your problem and yours to solve?

that awkward moment when Australia's gun crime rate was going down the same rate even before they banned guns

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Reprobates and criminals have 1000% less mass murders than the USA. Wow.
Imagine being a brainlet and defending a third world country like the USA hahahaha

I agree, gun violence is a problem. Banning guns isn't the solution.

1) When I travel abroad, I see the media you see about America and can verify it’s not accurate / really bias. It’s not as bad here as the media makes it. CNN is somehow the American standard abroad which is fucking laughable to us.

2) worry less about our problems and more about yours.

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You guys do have mass stabbings though, and your police kinda just ran after that one guy shouting "put down the noif". Looks like all you need is a knife and decent sprinting speed over there, good thing our populations arent similar sizes otherwise you guys would be boned

Third world country that is the single largest destination for immigrants around the world

I guess people want that sweet sweet gun violence.

banning isnt. Regulating it better to stop new firearms from entering the market and systematically reducing the existing numbers is

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all your mass shooters go to nz

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Cos we don’t let em have guns u dumb fuck

Kek

Fuckin retart

>CNN

According to their most recent bout of brilliance, "Fredo" is a racist term for Italians. Even my leftist mother knows CNN is trash.

That’s cos we took their toys away mate, maybe u dumb cunt burgers should try that sometime hey

I disagree.

I will always not read a post with 'u' instead of 'you' and 'r' instead of 'are' etc. and no capitals.

what will decrease your gun violence?

thats your excuse?

why should anyone take gun advice from a country that lost a war to birds

Imagine having a girlfriend who talks like that.

And also imagine that she's actually pretty intelligent, and well written for university and stuff like that, but she's also a lazy fuck and texts like a nigger

Kek the stabber was literally stopped with a milk crate. Height two ppl by taking em by surprise, the rest told him to Fuckoff and took him on. Aussie cops don’t like shooting anyone unless they have to and obviously didn’t have to shoot this dumb cunt. In murica this faggot would have killed 40 school kids before getting desiccated by a trigger happy copper. Also never seen a single burger ever try to stop a shooter, even Texas where every fat white fuck is armed

fuck mate u must not read three quarters of b u autistic fuck

Mate just be thankful we made peace with the spiders.

A more universally armed and trained populace. Statistically, the places with the least gun crime are the most heavily armed. Turns out, people don't want to take chances robbing homes in areas where the home owners are strapped.

Yet ironically you are statistically more likely to be shot by friendly fire in your own home. Nice try guntard shill

burgerland really can’t talk about losing wars kekkek

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Kek rekt

Cuz the government cucked you and took away your weapons you fucking pussies

Anyone who wants a 12guage for hunting wild pigs can get one mate. You need anything ore than that to hunt with then u are a faggt hunter.

[Citation Needed]

so even more guns will cause less shooting?

Research published in the New England Journal of Medicine found that living in a home where there are guns increased risk of homicide by 40 to 170% and the risk of suicide by 90 to 460%.4

The risk of dying from an unintentional gunshot injury is 3.7 times higher for adults living in homes with guns, with handguns in the home posing a particular threat.5

On a state-wide level, states with higher rates of household firearm ownership have been shown to have significantly higher homicide victimization rates.6

5
Garen J. Wintemute, Guns, Fear, the Constitution, and the Public’s Health, 358 New England J. Med. 1421-1424 (April 3, 2008), at content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/NEJMp0800859.)) Another study in the Annals of Emergency Medicine similarly found that people who keep a gun in their home are almost twice as likely to die in a gun-related homicide and 16 times more likely to use a gun to commit suicide than people without a gun in their home. ((Douglas Wiebe, Homicide and Suicide Risks Associated with Firearms in the Home: A National Case-control Study, 41 Annals of Emergency Medicine 771 (June 2003).

5
Douglas J. Wiebe, Firearms in U.S. Homes as a Risk Factor for Unintentional Gunshot Fatality, 35 Accident Analysis & Prevention 711, 713-14 (2003).

6
Matthew Miller, David Hemenway, and Deborah Azrael, State-level Homicide Victimization Rates in the U.S. in Relation to Survey Measures of Household Firearm Ownership, 2001 -2003, 64 Soc. Sci. & Med. 656, 660 (2007).

wheres the citation about more guns making less shooting?

Oops sorry the first ‘5’ should be a ‘4’ in the references
Damn these stupid fingers!

>literally didn’t even read it
Fuckoff im not here to argue with an NRA shill faggot. How much they pay you for this shit?

I know that might seem counter-intuitive, but guns save far more lives than they end. Defensive usage of firearms, whether it's simply brandishing one, or actually firing it, saves significantly more lives than are taken by gun violence.

The lowest estimate is roughly 500,000 lives per year. The high end is 3,000,000. That's according to the FBI and the CDC respectively.

so wheres the citation?

Oops sorry meant for

and how is it estimated?
And how does that relate to other countries without any of those problems?

And by the in your shitty country there is 1.2 mass shooting per day

Perhaps I misunderstood you. Yes, owning a gun statistically makes it more likely that you'll be shot. Just like owning a dog makes it more likely that you'll be bitten by a dog. I thought you mean that gun owners are more likely to be shot than to defend themselves. Which is patently false.

so - citation

And by the time in your shitty country there were 1.2 mass shooting per day

It's based on surveys and crime reports. So when people report being attacked or an attempted robbery, etc. And stop it by either brandishing or otherwise using a firearm, it's added to the count.

I should mention the 3,000,000 is an extrapolation based on the idea of those crimes going unreported. It's unlikely that it's actually that high. The 300,000 are confirmed reports.

I'm not sure how defensive firearm use compares in other countries.

how many of those crimes involve an active use of firearms? That is to say a person points the gun at others, as opposed to a guy got into fistfight and afterwards he was found also having a gun in his holster.
How many of the crimes wouldntve happened at all without a gun, is what im saying.
Its like saying "every1 has a red button. Look how effective the atomic arsenal is in keeping others from using the atom bombs. Thats better in not having a nuclear war than if no1 had an atom bomb"

All 300,000 involve actually using the firearm. That was the goal of the study. It's the use of the firearm. Not necessarily pointing it. In fact, good firearm discipline means not pointing it at anyone until you're actually ready to kill them.

Very often, just showing it, or removing it from its holster is enough to get a would-be criminal to think twice. Alas this thread is almost dead, so this will probably go unresponded

Good talk though user

so u r saying all of them couldve been avoided, if they didnt have guns?
Yeah, good talk