It's estimated that about 95% of the world's population believes, in some manner, shape or form...

Sounds amazing

Unironically true. We see this everywhere god has been replaced by human perversion and lust.

the kalam cosmological argument
1. that which begins is caused
2. the universe began (big bang)
3. therefore, the universe was caused to exist (by something else)
4. whatever caused the universe must have been outside of such concepts as material space and time, since both were caused at the big band
5. said cause must be incredibly powerful to inspire such a change
6. said cause must be the result of a personal decision, since no other concept or force can cause change in different ways from the same initial conditions
7. the qualities of personality, timelessness, immateriality, and incredible power are how the monotheistic god is described.
8. ta da

Youre seeing it...kids have no selfworth, shoot each other, every woman is a whore, no work ethic, no place for peaceful debate, high drug usage, high crime rate, no respect for law, no shame, high faggotry, trannies.

you might actually be autistic, that's not how the burden of proof exists. It's literally impossible to prove that anything doesn't exist that is not the basis for possibility of existence
> Prove unicorns don't exist or else they're real
> Prove dragons aren't real or else they exist

I'm an atheist, but if there was no religion that really wouldn't change much. there will always be war and fighting, but without religion the war and fighting would be over different things. by nature humans are selfish and greedy and they will always have something to fight about, and find any reason to justify the violence.
I saw a good South Park episode recently where, long story short, everybody in the world becomes atheist and in the future there are still waring factions, but instead of fighting over which religion is the right religion, they have wars over which theory to the origin of the universe is the correct one.
the the lesson of the episode is pretty much what i said earlier, if there was no more religion, people would just fine new things to over.
If you really believe that is there was no religion that the world would be a better place, then your just as dumb as you precise people who believe in religion to be.

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He forgot incest tho

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you are the most retarded of history of retard

Eh ... my sister is ugly, anyway.

I unironically don't know a single person who believes in a god. And it's not like I'm trying. None of my friends or their families (as far as I know) believe in this bs.

they weren't arguing about any theory, genius. that was a three part episode about the nintendo wii and cartman freezing himself and the only problem the future atheists had was what to CALL their group. it was all about names/acronyms. it might even have been a weird joke about the name "wii". south park is that abstract sometimes.

In the overwhelmingly vast majority of cases schools are secular, the legal system is secular, entertainment is secular, workplaces are secular, politics are secular ... apart from angry retarded atheists whining about muh religion on the internet I struggle to think of a single instance where religion even comes up anymore in day-to-day life. What are you even talking about?

>politics are secular
so thats just way off

This is a world without god, you fucking dunce

The only thing I can 100% prove is that you're a moron. Stop speaking gibberish that has no real-life application. People believe because they want to believe. It's not a rational process and it doesn't have to be.

Let me break it down so you can understand this:

1. People believe because they want to and it makes them feel better often without solid proof.

2. They make claims or they don't make claims about the existence of their deity.

3. Now you can ask them to prove it's existence and often times they won't be able to prove it because you're discussing metaphysical. It doesn't mean it doesn't exist, it just means that it can't be proven to a sufficient degree or proven at all.

4. In the end, you haven't been able to prove that it doesn't exist nor the believer was able to prove that it does exist.

You're like this 16-year old who thinks he's edgy and smarter than everybody else but we all know it's just a stupid phase and he's just being retarded. Grow up.

Can you prove that God doesn't exist?

The person who says something exists has the burden of proving it exists.

Pics or it didn’t happen, if you will.

Claims made without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

It’s pretty basic stuff

I don’t need to.

I don’t need to prove things don’t exist.
You need to prove that they do.

There’s no god u til you prove that there’s one - otherwise it’s just an artistic work of fiction and only a fool would believe it.

>so many replies
>haven't seen one deity
You all disappoint me so very, very much.

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But faith doesn't have to be proven. You're trying to apply science to faith.

I can claim that the FBI has alien technology but not be able to prove it. It doesn't mean FBI doesn't have that technology, it just means I personally believe that they do without proof to show to everybody else.

>Stop speaking gibberish
Just because you have subhuman IQ doesn't make words longer than 6 letters gibberish

>People believe because they want to
that doesn't make it true. Believe whatever horseshit you want but your belief doesn't make anything true

> It doesn't mean it doesn't exist, it just means that it can't be proven at all.
That almost sounds like it doesnt fucking exist really makes you think

> In the end, you haven't been able to prove that it doesn't exist nor the believer was able to prove that it does exist.
Only thing you said at all that was true. But the burden of proof solely rests on the side making a positive claim of existence. I dont have to prove something doesn't exist and believers do

I'm not the one proving that the "universe" "started" "with" "anything". I'm the cunt asking YOU to fucking PROVE that your bearded cunt exists, faggot. YOU'RE the one under the fucking SPOTLIGHT.

You dumb cunt.

You just claimed that God doesn't exist. I didn't claim that he does. The burden of proof is on you buddy.

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Believing stuff without evidence is called being fucking retarded.

>I can claim that the FBI has alien technology but not be able to prove it. It doesn't mean FBI doesn't have that technology,

It means anyone with a logically working brain will ignore and dismiss the FBI's claim until they procure some sort of evidence.

I was raised christian and blindly believed
I took mushrooms and became a staunch atheist
I took lsd and realized spirituality is valuable and there is a high possibility that there is some sort of deity above us
fuck religion, embrace spirituality

You indeed don't have to prove anything. Everyone else will just call you a retard is all

Did you even read what he wrote. Or did you just look at certain parts

Here's how it us, you cunts. I don't know JACK SHIT. But, NEITHER DO YOU. But I don't make claim to a fucking thing about how we've come to be, or what happens when we cease to be. YOU DO. So fucking back up that claim, you faggot CUNTS. I want to SEE that shit you so boldly tell us happens. And I want to fucking RECORD it on technological equipment.

HERE ENDETH THE FUCKING LESSON.

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Haven't you read the bible at all? God made the earth in 7 days, everyone knows how we've come to be

I read it. It’s stupid.
If we lived in a world without god, we’d have starving kids and incurable diseases and endless war.

You know, the real world.

You’re a fucking moron.

Here endeth the lesson

"their science is flawed, their answer to the great question is different from ours."
thats a quote from the 2nd part (also it was only 2 parts)
also i left out the whole Cartman and the Wii thing because it wasn't important to the point I/South Park was making, which is why i said long story short.
Even is I was wrong my point still stands.

>Just because you have subhuman IQ doesn't make words longer than 6 letters gibberish

And here comes the "I'm better than everyone else and smarter too". See this is why nobody takes you, people, seriously. If your IQ was as high as you claim it is you wouldn't miss the obvious assertion I was trying to make nor would you make so many simple spelling mistakes. It went right over your stupid fucking head because you're just a mindless drone repeating what you were taught.

>that doesn't make it true. Believe whatever horseshit you want but your belief doesn't make anything true

It doesn't make it false either. Get that through your thick skull.

>That almost sounds like it doesnt fucking exist really makes you think

And you might think that which is fine. It doesn't mean you can prove that it doesn't exist.

>Only thing you said at all that was true. But the burden of proof solely rests on the side making a positive claim of existence. I dont have to prove something doesn't exist and believers do

When you claim that something definitely doesn't exist you have the burden of proof.

Sure and they might be wrong.

Alls well I suppose. All the religions have the wrong perspective.

You are embodied by God, encapsulated.
You are but a moving spec on a single electron (earth) attached to an atom ( our solar system) in a molecule ( the milky way), combined with roughly 5 trillion other galaxies that make up our god.

This god may not even be animate and likely doesn't even know we exist in him.

His size is unfathomabley large. And i expect there to be other beings his size, encapsulating their own universe

I'm waiting. Go on. Show me your deity.

Protip: hallucinogens are for enjoying, not for learning.

That shit just fucks with your brain and makes things that aren't real, seem real.
You can trust anything you 'learn' on hallucinogens.

And the great question is how they should call themselves. The atheist alliance or the consortium of science or whatever.

It doesn’t make it false, it just happens to be false and nothing you can say will make it true, no matter how much you wish it was.

panentheism isnt unique and you aren't as mystical as you want to be

He died for you heretic!

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OP forgot to post his source.

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It might be false. You have no way of proving it to be false. There's a difference.

You don’t prove things false.

That’s not what proving is, you fucking retard.

> It doesn't mean you can prove that it doesn't exist.
I see you don't understand how basic logic works, I will never have to prove a deity doesn't exist because not only is that impossible you might want to just google "burden of proof" because im tired of parroting through one ear and out the other.

>When you claim that something definitely doesn't exist you have the burden of proof.
I never claimed a deity definitely doesn't exist because again it's impossible to prove something does not exist. I simply reject the positive assertion that one does and will never accept that belief until I am given proof

You fucking moron, the burden of proof is on the positive statement, as in 'this thing exists.' YOU CAN'T PROVE SOMETHING DOESN'T EXIST, KYS.

you got me there, I was wrong about the south park thing, but my point still stands

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hallucinogens =/= psychedelics
are you experienced in this field? because I am and I know what I've experienced and learned
when I've used psychs for fun I've ended up in hell on earth, they're absolutely tools meant to be used for gaining knowledge

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When you make the claim that something is false then you have to prove it. Otherwise, it might be false or it might be true. I'm not making the claim that it's true.

Pathetic in what way, duck? Please. By all means. You have my curiosity AND my attention.

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No. They are drugs that make you think shit that is abnormal.

all you’ve done is thought something you otherwise wouldn’t have thought.

you have no concept of logic or proofs.

To form the converse of the conditional statement, interchange the hypothesis and the conclusion.

The converse of "If it rains, then they cancel school" is "If they cancel school, then it rains."

To form the inverse of the conditional statement, take the negation of both the hypothesis and the conclusion.

The inverse of “If it rains, then they cancel school” is “If it does not rain, then they do not cancel school.”

To form the contrapositive of the conditional statement, interchange the hypothesis and the conclusion of the inverse statement.

The contrapositive of "If it rains, then they cancel school" is "If they do not cancel school, then it does not rain."

No, I can dismiss your claims as false until they are proven.

Prove that you didn’t time travel and kill Lincoln.

You can’t?
Then there’s a chance it’s true.

That’s you.
That’s what you sound like.

Actually there the majority of religious people also believe in scientific advancements.
I believe the issue you're looking for is money. Money faults progress more than anything.

to add:

sometimes, the only way to prove something is true is to prove that the opposite is false. i know, it sounds stupid but that's used in 1. math 2. philosophy 3. computer science (the first two combined)

nice job man, did you take one logic course in college? conditional logic is completely irrelevant when discussing non conditional claims such as "Prove god doesn't exist" which is a definitively impossible task

Nope.

I was just posting the duck who I believe accurately represents the tone here. These arguments are so stuck up, as if you’d ever remotely change someone’s beliefs by attempting to humiliate them.

>1. People believe because they want to and it makes them feel better often without solid proof.

You fucking idiot, that's the point; if they're so stupid that they like this god faggot that made them have pain, but they pray to have him remove the pain, and that's comforting, they're garbage. You're the one thinking you're smart, but can't even follow the simplest logical route.

halts progress* my bad.

Philosophy proves things now?

Wow!

That’s retarded.

You’re retarded.

I bet you vote republican.

>I see you don't understand how basic logic works, I will never have to prove a deity doesn't exist because not only is that impossible you might want to just google "burden of proof" because of im tired of parroting through one ear and out the other.

Follow your own advice. Yes, you're right it is impossible. But when you make the fucking claim: "God doesn't exist". The burden of proof is one you. You made the claim. You have to provide the evidence in this specific scenario.

>I never claimed a deity definitely doesn't exist because again it's impossible to prove something does not exist. I simply reject the positive assertion that one does and will never accept that belief until I am given proof

Which is fine. It doesn't mean that God doesn't exist, it just means that he can't be proven to exist therefore you don't belive him to exist.

Oh, I'm not trying to change a fucking thing. I want to see deities. More than one, if that applies. And I want to see them NOW, DUCK.

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>took drugs, now am woke af

You're a worthless idiot, kys.

Except that god doesn’t exist.

Prove me wrong

Never knew there was a name for it. All I want to seems a little more extreme than what I'm thinking I believe that there is a limit to it not so much one God encapsulates everything, everything. for instance there are 7 billion of us on this planet and each one of us encapsulate trillions of atoms in our bodies these items could potentially have life on their electrons, likely not cuz it's a rough ride, but perhaps a stationary rock that doesn't move very much at all, could potentially Harbor subatomic life

And you can be wrong in doing so. The point is you can't prove something to be 100% false especially something as ambiguous as a deity.

You're a tool without gaining anything useful, please get a vasectomy like a grown up that knows we're killing the planet.

> But when you make the fucking claim: "God doesn't exist".
I don't definitively make that claim though. It might be theoretically possible for a god to exist, I have no fucking clue. Although after millenia of human existence and hundreds of completely different religious systems none of which procured a single tiny thread of evidence, im inclined to lean towards the probably not possible side.

> It doesn't mean that God doesn't exist
Correct which is fine by me because I don't make this claim or have to prove it. That doesn't negate the fact that anyone who still believes god exists in the absence of any evidence is a fucking retard

yeah, they allow you to access parts of your brain in unison that otherwise would not be accessed together
they disrupt your normal pattern of thinking which can be hugely beneficial
and I agree, I have thought shit I never would have otherwise thought. have you? because it has hugely benefited me in my life to look at the world through a different perspective

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I've improved myself immensely through psychedelics
only tool I've used that's ever helped with depression
but dont worry I'm never having kids, I know the world is trash :)

So everyone should be a logical robot without emotions. They're garbage for wanting to believe in something which comforts them and often makes them a better human being.

Call me crazy, but the current society is getting gradually more and more Orwellian. Is made by the so-called ubermensch who have thrown away the old belief. Yet they haven't become better.

Fucking idiot. YOU MADE A TOPIC CLAIMING THAT GOD ISN'T REAL. You made the claim, you now have the burden of proof.

You claim to know the true purpose of religion. Prove it. It blows my mind you are so eager to make claims and demand others provide proof when you are the one pretending to know anything without showing evidence.

I just wanted to say that the burden of proof lies on the ones making the claim. The atheist is making a counterclaim, the religious person is the one who has to prove there is a god. I can say that there is a pink unicorn who fucks me in the ass when im alone and cant be documented in anyway. Can you prove me wrong? no, but that doesnt mean im right. I would have to prove the unicorn.

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why do they need religion to make them a better human being? if they cant volunteer/donate to poor fags and be an overall good person on their own does believing theyre going to hell if they dont actually make them a better person?

Show me. Show me everything.

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>That doesn't negate the fact that anyone who still believes god exists in the absence of any evidence is a fucking retard

Why? Because it hurts your perception of the world? Not everything is measured by logic and reason. You can be smart but still a terrible human being.

Comprehension isn't your strong suit, is it? I made a claim against people who make the claim that deities ARE real. Show me your deity, you dumb cunt.

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Imagine a world without niggers and sand niggers.

Then you're gay because I don't have irrefutable proof that you aren't.

Because humans are shitty. We need rules and regulations. And rules from God are often scarier then rules from other humans.

Humans need a box in which they can operate. That is literally the best solution.

With the removal of religion from society, things just go downhill.

>Why? Because it hurts your perception of the world? Not everything is measured by logic and reason. You can be smart but still a terrible human being.

Doesn't hurt my world view at all, I'm not really upset or bothered at all that they believe in a god. I just think it's an objectively low intelligence belief fueled by brainwashing and indoctrination.
If religious people are really pushed to objectively view their beliefs it should be painstakingly obvious the only reason they hold those beliefs is because of the family they grew up in (not universal of course.but by far for the vast majority of people)

If by experienced in this field you mean have I used them, then yes, more than my fair share.

I've also watched some of my closest friends go progressively insane, thinking they can communicate with the spirits of trees and getting sucked into crazy conspiracy theories.

One of them now genuinely believes he is a shaman capable of communicating with the spirit realm. He gave up his promising career in computer science and now sits around at home on the unemployment benefit doing drugs all day. He can barely take care of himself, and yet he would try to convince you that he has taken the righteous path.

At least my opiate and speed addicted friends know they fucked up.

logic vs. emotions?

who invented the concept that logic has no emotions? gene roddenberry? i'm sure nothing in "star trek" was even remotely original based on the plethora of sci-fi that already existed but really... the early philosophers that defined what we consider to be "logic" like descartes, leibniz, etc were quite passionate. plato reads like a "seinfeld" screenplay; there's even a bit where some guy sitting there listening to the arguments goes fucking nuts and lunges to attack someone. i had to create a "platonic dialogue" and it was based on jerry, george and kramer, and how george didn't give a bum some money, but instead the rest of his lunch and everyone was disgusted and they talked shit to each other for a while about being cheap. it was brilliant and i got a high A.

stop being a moronic idiot--just locking onto something of which, there are few things you're familiar with--and get an education.

"The first gulp from the glass of natural sciences will turn you into an atheist, but at the bottom of the glass God is waiting for you"
-Werner Heisenberg

Eastern cultures have fantastic morals that don't come from God. There's no reason God has to come in the picture.

I wish we had a planet of people with no meaning in their lives. I'm sure they will be so much happier.

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We need religion to keep the dumb fucks down, wasting massive amounts of their lives instead of competing seriously in society. Also restrains some of their dumb fuck instincts like being quick to violence and fucking their kids.

yet so high percentage of the population is theist, meaning that it's not as secular as you believe

> I'm not really upset or bothered at all that they believe in a god

Your post proves otherwise.

>If religious people are really pushed to objectively view their beliefs it should be painstakingly obvious the only reason they hold those beliefs is because of the family they grew up in

While not inherently untrue. Faith is faith. It doesn't even require a diety to function. It's an inherent part of humans to have faith. Faith and hope go hand in hand.

There is no fucking logic in your 6th argument
Why would it be a choice? Most things in our universe are pure coincidence. That is the reason diseases and shit like that exist.
Nothing happens for a reason

Young children speaking foreign languages and talking about past lives where they accurately describe what happened in their previous life, or even how they died, or where their body went missing and is discovered by the help of a child who couldn't possibly know anything about it.

Stories of people dying and seeing / hearing things often times hundreds of feet away and telling others about it after dying.

There is a lot of weird shit going on out there.

that sucks man but that's just anecdotal evidence
psychs have true value and I'm not sure if you've really reached the other side but once you do it's kinda hard to refute what you experienced
my friends who have used psychs have all benefited from the experiences so I see we're at a bit of an impasse here :)

Show me your deity. I've been waiting for quite awhile, now. Besides, I prefer the harsh truth instead of possible bullshit that people use to make themselves happier.

Show me.

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Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?

Might not be able to disprove God, but can sure disprove that he gives a shit about humanity.

Oh, I need some citations for those percentages, OP.

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>There is a lot of weird shit going on out there.
You're absolutely right. There IS a lot of weird shit going on out there. So it probably won't startle me too much when you show your so-called deity. Who knows? Maybe I WON'T die of shock.

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> While not inherently untrue. Faith is faith. It doesn't even require a diety to function. It's an inherent part of humans to have faith. Faith and hope go hand in hand.
Yes we're inherently vulnerable to believe in stupid shit as long as it promises us an eternal afterlife in heaven. Religion is a distraction and people would do best to focus on living their best life instead of a second one thats not coming

Niggers not sure, but without Sand niggers, technologically wise we would be delayed cause all the shit that was going on during the Dark and Middle ages.

>What is sarcasm

I never even implied that people who use logic have no emotions. I said that emotions play as much part in human existence as logic does. And that people who have faith often use their emotional side more, which is the opposite of people who prefer logic. There are numerous studies done on this topic.

Go read a few, educate yourself, then come back. Also, your first paragraph is a mess.

not the same user
thats great that you and your friends have benefited from psychs but thats also just anecdotal evidence. your thoughts on psychs are not any more true than sober you just trick yourself into believing them more

Agnostic master race. You are all wasting your time.

is this the "I don't know and I never will" kind of agnostic or the "I'll figure it out when I get there" kind

The problem with hedonism is that if no one wipes your ass you would drown in your own shit. So called 'negative' feelings like boredom and anger, hunger, feeling uncomfortable, sad etc drive us to better ourselves and will force us to think outside of the box. If you want to spend your life growing fat useless piece of shit with nothing to help you reach the peace of mind it's your choice.
But don't come to internet and pretend to be a great thinker when in reality you are just circlejerking your own views with others who share similar ones, when in actually they are not your thoughts but you are actually just quoting thoughts which were implemented in your head by mainstream society.
You are not a great thinker, you are a brainwashed sheep. Good day to you sir and God bless you.

>The universe came into existence for no reason

That is a positive claim aswell, buddy

>Yes we're inherently vulnerable to believe in stupid shit as long as it promises us an eternal afterlife in heaven. Religion is a distraction and people would do best to focus on living their best life instead of a second one thats not coming

Faith isn't only tied to religion.

I'm also positively sure than removing religion wouldn't create a utopia. Current society is a product of such change. It's honestly a sick dying animal that should be put down.

they're the same kind

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Komodo_dragon

I can:

If a god exists then he is an asshole for giving children bonecancer.
If you choose to pray for that god than you are an asshole too.

I think that there is proof enough for me that it seems impossible that the same god would invent leukemia and also butterflies.

Also think about why you are religious: if you were born into a Muslim family you would have been Muslim, if you were born somewhere else you would have "chosen" that religion

more like the "no one can possibly know so it is pointless to discuss"

A world without religion is Sweden. Soon to have a religion, the invader's religion.

exactly my point, you have your experiences and I have mine, each are valid
I know my mind is very malleable on psychs but I also know my mind works totally differently while on these drugs
but you have a point, it's all useless if you cant productively integrate these realizations into your life
I know it's a meme at this point but have you smoked dmt? genuinely curious what your opinion is if you've broken through

>I'm also positively sure than removing religion wouldn't create a utopia. Current society is a product of such change. It's honestly a sick dying animal that should be put down.

Most certainly religion as a whole at the moment probably does more good than bad, although its dying out and hopefully will continue to do so. Current society is so fucked and will only get worse as technology gets better

How dismal it is to see present day Americans yearning for the very orthodoxy that their country was founded to escape.

I understand the inherent physiological benefits of "being nice to others" from learning and experimentation, and I understand the dangers of personal excess from learning from the examples of others. I don't know what happens when we die and I don't claim to know - what I DO know is that others who claim to know are DUMB FUCKS.

Thank you, FUCK YOU and citation needed for "God bless you", cunt.

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never done dmt although my lsd experiences have also benefited me immensely. I was a hard atheist before but id categorize myself more as agnostic now, i can see a potential higher power, not in the traditional deity sense, possibly existing but dont think ill ever have the proof to believe in it

>thinking that being high somehow connects you to anything other than your own subconcious
Might as well believe in Hogwarts m8

we retards are not representative of modern america

You flunked history didn't you? America was founded to escape being taxed by a nation that was across an ocean. Nothing more.

It's 2 part dipshit

It's funny, because the church was actually one of the driving factors for the explosion of science in Europe. Plenty of people worked under the church. Like Copernicus. I guess they leave that part out during history class anymore.

>doing drugs has benifitted me immensly
An hero you fucking moron

I seem to think "godless constituion" being in there somewhere.

Nope

nice job taking the boomer propaganda faggot, literally the safest most non-addicting drug which is clinical trials for therapy and rehab. I pity you for missing out on such an amazing experience

I seem to recall a lot of censorship - and when finally the heliocentric model was accepted, the then pope said that they could make all catholics accept this new teaching, make it dogma. To which Copernicus said that it rather deafeated the point of open inquiry.

>Who are the puritans
>Manifest destiny
>Had nothing to do with religion
Kek'd

exactly what lsd did to me
dmt made me realize we likely are in a simulation of sorts
if it finds you give it a try
even if it is my subconscious all it shows me is that we're all god, everything is connected and we are all part of something much bigger
you cant even spell lmao try some real lsd and let me know what you think then

So why are you reeeeeing for evidence of god(s)? Live and let live. Do you think I like claims and decisions that politicians make without any burden of evidence and without any responsibility of consequences.

The constitution is secular, it keeps church and state sepperate. Hence godless constitution.

>book says there is an invisible man in the sky that created the universe and stuff
>faith is faith hurr durr

I got some magic beans for sale you guys

>Im smarter and I know more things after I got high
>I like, totally got connected to something bigger man
If doing acid opened your mind to a new idea, that was simply a coincidence. You are a fucking retard if you think that shit does anything other that literally fry your brain

i find it interesting many ppl who've done dmt often come to a similar conclusion, although thats probable just our similar neurology.
I find the simulation theory very entertaining and id love for it to be real but I just cant entertain it, seems a little too sci-fi

>I like, totally got connected to something bigger man
thats not at all what i was referring to but you tried faggot. it actively has given me a new outlook and appreciation on life and pretty much cured my mild depression long-term
> You are a fucking retard if you think that shit does anything other that literally fry your brain
again nice job taking the boomer propaganda you have absolutely no idea what youre talking about

I didn't claim the 'church' was infallible or that they didn't gate-keep a lot of information. The difference is they actually caused, funded and drove science forward. Of course, I am sure some neckbearded faggots will get angry about it.

test

> a wild retard appeared
First off dumbass, user was arguing that America was founded to escape religion. Not spread it. I refuted him because religion had nothing to do with the problems that the colonies had with Great Britian.
Second, go ahead and explain to me exactly what yhe puritans and manifest destiny had to do with the war for independence. Fucking idiot

something special about dmt, I really implore anyone with an opinion on psychedelics to try it before they speak up
I can tell I won't convince you of anything but I've had some times that have made me believe we are in a simulation. look how much VR is advancing, eventually it will be indistinguishable from reality

In our justice system its innocent untill proven guilty and the burden of proof rests on the accuser.

You're accusing 95% of the population for being blind followers of religion. The burden is on you my friend to prove that they are in fact morons.

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You are fucking permafried buddy

lol amazing how many people itt just eat this shit up but have never used these substances
take 200ug and lmk how you feel in the morning, dont worry your DARE officer wont know :)

Fair enough but that is irrelevant to what you said earlier

far from it but thanks for the concern bud!

I certainly will at some point in life, just dont want/need it rn
and god I hope we get there in our lifetime, doesnt seem farfetched; exponential growth is an absolute monster.
simulations with reality on par to this world would take computing power beyond our wildest dreams if even possible

> my mommy said drugs are bad so I can't touch them REEE

Stay ass-blasted, faggot. One of the main reasons for the pilgrims moving was the religious freedom.

LSD has an effect that i liken to "garbage collection" in a programming language. there is information you no longer need, which ends up being audio, visual, and in fact, internal higher mental concepts. usually, your mind wipes these at a quick rate. when you do LSD, it's not like "more LSD makes longer trails visually" or "more LSD makes audio crisper and sharper with more edges", it's that if you do ENOUGH LSD, you simply turn off that "garbage collection" and get what seems to 3x audio definition and everything looks liquid and you hold ideas in mind longer.

you have no idea about LSD. it's ecstacy that fries the brain. that shit makes your brain activity turn to swiss cheese. LSD makes you highly intelligent and like "smart drinks" which contain drugs like piracetum, it forces tons of synapses to grow and LEAVES you more intelligent PERMANENTLY, as well as opening up and tuning you psychically.

i know. it sounds like i read this somewhere. what if i told you... i did enough and became something you don't want to get near because i'd fucking eat your mind from a distance. that's one reason i come here. i hardly find pleasure kicking ass as a keyboard warrior. i'm here to... rape minds.

youtube.com/watch?v=Pbh8CcrbwbA

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>you cant talk about people with fried brains until you fry your own brain
Fucking kek. I pity you sorry souls

smart man. no rush for anything like that. hahah well consider that maybe we're there already, if you've been where I have you might have a little stronger of a belief

I believe because I've seen my main deity walking around. I have also been diagnosed with schizoaffective disorder but whatever. I also see giants and shadow creatures, but they're not really religious figures to me.

Here.

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>the pilgrims
My god you are fucking retarded. I literally kek'd out loud at this. You realize the pilgrims were still under british rule right? Their descendants were the ones who fought for independence. Once again, the war for independence had literally nothing to do with religion, and everything to do with British greed and tyranny.

das crazy talk man, you aint got shit

uh I'm advocating for these drugs
no more like you can't talk from a point of authority on something when you've never experienced it. you'd likely kill yourself off a few tabs

Oooo abuse!
No, science didn't move before it became a secular affair.
nope

you have to be larping. No one on Yea Forums buys into boomer anti-drug propaganda this hard, its pathetic
>take a drug once and fry your brain for life

>Kill yourself off a few tabs

did you mean
1. You will kill yourself because of a few tab trip
2. You will overdose on 2 tabs.

>2. You will overdose on 2 tabs.
KEK, you have less knowledge and experience on lsd than you do with pussy

im not even that guy

im just trying to clarify your poorly worded sentence that infers that he would overdose

learn to english you idjit

my comment still stands, its borderline near impossible to die from an lsd overdose

Try completing any basic task when you are frying and you will see that it takes you a long fucking time to do even the most simple of things. Why? because you are fucking dumber, not smarter. I don't know why you are assuming that I haven't partaken. I'm simply pointing out that your argument is a dumbass one. That's like a methhead saying "You can't say meth makes yoy stupid unless you have tried it". The effects are readily observible. You don't need to take it to see that it makes you retarded.

Lmao you're a dumb faggot

motor function is not equivalent with how smart you are fucking retard

Stellar argument man. You were on the debate team in high school, weren't you?

yes I mean you wouldnt be able to handle some real lsd because of your closed mind
never said overdose, it's essentially impossible to take enough of any psychedelic for it to be toxic :)
it's because your mind is working in a different way than usual
different sections of your brain are being activated simultaneously which has never happened naturally
certain things have been harder for me while frying but other things have become much easier
also yes you don't know how meth affects you until you've tried it, what you see is the worst example of people abusing it resulting in psychosis

your "smartness" is a compilation of your brains ability to function well

acid does NOT cause this. in a matter of fact it works in the opposite way.

instead of the brain having coherent chains of thought and logical operations, everything is firing at once and causing alot of interruption and overlap, which is why you get confused and forget what you where doing alot.

and yes as you mentioned before this does cause new synapses to grow, however unless properly trained and used correctly they likely die off rather quickly.

ahahahaha spot on

It's not an issue of motor function. It's because your brain is literally stalling. If it was an issue of motor function, you would be falling over, spilling and dripping shit, it would be hard to pick shit up and use your depth perception, etc. But that isn't the case.

you an idiot, ive done multiple doses of lsd, up to a 450ug dose,

also done multiple instances of DMT and if you think LSD is this great you honestly have no idea and sound like a child.

lsd is great so I'm not sure I see your point
and dmt is great as well, as is psilocybin. what is your point friend?

>because of your closed mind
First of all you were responding to a different user, second, the fact that you assume I am closed minded because my opinion differs from yours, proves that you are the closed minded one.

youre right, motor function wasnt it.
still, youre ability to say microwave a pizza while on acid doesnt equate to the quality/accuracy of your thoughts relating to non-practical matters

I think you are confused. Just because a substance makes you FEEL great doesn't mean that substance IS great

lsd doesnt make you feel great thats what makes it great.

ok sorry bud I meant that the faggot wouldn't be able to mentally handle two tabs

Touche.

with you being so smart and all, how come you believe that faith is based on facts and any kind of proof? try and notice the word FAITH and maybe think for a minute what it might imply.

uhhh if I want to feel good I take mdma or cocaine, or alcohol honestly
lsd is not a guaranteed experience and I've felt worse on it than I've ever felt in my entire life

youtube.com/watch?v=SVmaViBxs4o

it implies being a retard and believing/doing what other people tell you without actively thinking for yourself

I've went past my edgy teen "hur dur god doesnt exist sheep!!!!! brainwasheddd!!!!" phase, and currently I am open minded to the possibility that there is something higher than us out there, although I do not know what that is as of now.

Well I will admit that I have never taken Lsd so I can't really refute that, but I have taken psilocybin (and plenty of it) and in my personal experience, it does not make me any smarter or any deeper of a thinker whatsoever. If anything, it makes deep thinking impossible because I am already struggling to focus on what is going on right in front of me. But that's just my experience. My judgement/decision making skills go out the fucking window. But hey that's just me I guess

for fuck's sake that's not how this fucking works. that's not how fucking logic and reasoning works. that's now how the burden of proof works you fucking moron

Okay bud I'll keep that in mind

shut up faggot we are arguing about drugs now

ive never taken psilocybin so I also cant compare the 2 sadly. On acid I almost never have trouble focusing on 1 thing if I want to, I can just pretty much only focus on that 1 thing really well and not multitask at all

muslims have a god, yet your points are still ok in their religion

i dont have a god and your points are morally trash for me

yeah you need to stop focusing on the real world and drift off. close your eyes and lay down. you'll find something

>I can claim that the FBI has alien technology but not be able to prove it. It doesn't mean FBI doesn't have that technology, it just means I personally believe that they do without proof to show to everybody else.

right, and that would make you a fucking retard. why don't you understand this basic principle? are people really this dumb?

extacly my point. and yet you center your rant around there being no proof of god. so i dunno, make up your mind maybe?

Maybe OP is right, because there is no god that will be able to stop OP from sucking so many cocks

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There is a proof that a deity exists, and I can give it to you, if you'd like. But I would like it if we were to be able to argue until we agree, and I would like it if you would give the courtesy of hearing me out, just the same courtesy I have and will continue to give you.

Perhaps we can talk somewhere less temporary, so as to assure that we can come to a common conclusion.

/thread

Well actually user, you could argue that it is irrational for anything at all to exist in this physical world without supernatural/magical influence. So you are actually the one making the claim that everything exists for no reason. So, proof?
>agnostic fag btw

Bravo, humanity.
191 replies for a fucking discussion which the outcome is already visible, if you have read any of the said holy books.

because the lack of evidence is the very reason faith is retarded. If there was evidence it would be all good. The lack of any evidence is crucial to the debate

Sometimes I try that but I just get lost in my own bad memories/regrets. Just like when you try to go to sleep

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Wrong. That's a world without morals

See Either side could argue that the other side is the one making the claim and therefore needs to provide proof. The entire argument is pointless.

this thread is gay

Why would a simple animal, a mere product of merciless Nature have morals? Nature is unforgiving and doesn't care about weak.

Big bang happened because previous universe reached critical mass and collapsed in a single black hole which gave birth to our universe. Ta da no beard man in sky involved

whoops, someone is still in their edgy teen years, please continue to tell us about how different you see the world after smookinn w33d n ur mushrooms n lsd blah blah blah

no, thats just completely wrong. I am not making any claim at all, I am simply stating I have no fucking idea how to universe came to exist
You're committing the god fallacy by attributing something we haven't explained yet to be the work of a god. The same way retards in ancient Greece thought Zeus was the cause of thunder.

>Implying religion would make a difference

It seems OP exaggerated a bit, just not by much.
The non-religious population of the world is between 11% and 15%
This is heartbreaking.

yep. the key is actually facing those fears. it won't be happy but you need to deal with the things that have been holding you back. face your fears

Post pic and let us decide

No Im the brainwashed boomer

Burden of proof is on the prosecutor. You claim non proof as proof.
Your argument is weak, and is based in faith,
Faith in humanity.
faith in all the science fiction shows you watch.

oh for fuck sake youre pretty fucking dumb for acting all high and mighty. first you say faith is retarded cause there is no proof. i agree and point out that faith does not need proof, its how it was designed cause how could it work any other way. you agreed with me adding some more insults bla di bla, so i ask, if you know faith doesnt require proof how come you based your first post all based on the premise that there is no proof for god (which we already established is NOT HOW IT WORKS). basicly what happened you agree faithfags dont require proof, while at the same time shitting on them saying there is no proof. which is why i asked you to make up your fucking mind. its one or the other, cant have it both ways.

Not a christian god or even our idea of what a diety would be, Im just saying there is possibility of a higher power. Do you know what agnostic means, faggot?

? and here i thought universe had the same mass at any time, just different size

>It's estimated that about 5% of the world's population believes, in some manner, shape or form, that humanity is some sort of deity controlling reality - the masters of our own destiny. Imagine that. 5%! It's both hilarious and disheartening to think that 5%, who've never once been able to find irrefutable, unassailable evidence of the supreme deity who created us, STILL believe in the religion they've been brainwashed with from an early age - science designed to keep humanity's natural inclination to be spiritual, in check.

>Imagine that. 5% of the world's population, being utter fools.

>Now give me all your reasons why humans are capable of doing anything actually good at all.

This

are you knew here? OP left hours ago im just some user but anyways
>you agree faithfags dont require proof, while at the same time shitting on them saying there is no proof
Thats exactly right. I can have it both ways. Faithfags dont require proof which is stupid. Why would you believe in something like that without any proof? There is no proof, so why would they believe?

I gotta better question. Prove the earth is round!

Eat shit religious fags.

Lel

whatever, hes defending it, so he agrees with OP. what does it change? whos new here user?

im a strong agnostic myself you braindead retard but you said
>Either side could argue that the other side is the one making the claim and therefore needs to provide proof.
which is false because agnostics are not making a claim. We're simply saying you guys are fucktards and I wont believe what you believe until you have proof, until then I have no idea which side is right.

I mean there isn't really anything to do but relive the same horrible moments over and over and over again. I don't have a choice, it just happens whenever my mind is blank. Sorta like flashbacks I guess. So I have to stay focused on something, anything to keep from sinking back in. I'm pretty sure I've faced those memories but they aren't going to go away any time soon. I accept that Im a degenerate scum and generally a failure as a human being (so far), so I don't feel guilt anymore. I can't really think of a good word for what I feel, so i guess I would call it "cringe". Thanks for the heartfelt advice though user. That's enough feeling sorry for myself! Time to get back to calling people nigger faggots

ur a nigger faggot. Damn I feel better already

you really should learn to understand written word. i tried slow down to keep your pace, but obviously i failed. its my fault really. ive already done two riunds around the same problem and cant be bothered to do this again. so live long and prosper in your ignorance

fuck you nigger faggot. Don't cringe at yourself actively work to build yourself up into something you're proud of. I wouldn't normally shill this advice but since were on the topic of drugs, for me personally lsd actively helped/inspired me stop being a complete neet pick up some hobbies, try to be social, and take care of myself so potentially give it a try if you think youre out of options

"agnostic" is not one of the sides I'm talking about. Im referring to religious people VS athiests. They could both argue with eachother and be right. That is why the conversation is pointless. You don't seem like an agnostic to me, or else you would not be so one-sided about this. You seem like an athiest, because you are demanding proof that god exists.

thats the very basis of agnosticism though. demanding proof before subscribing to a belief. Atheists can't prove their side so what is the use in asking them for proof, its fundamentally impossible to prove something doesn't exist, I can also understand their thoughts and why they believe what they do.

Without religion this world would be utterly fucked, pure savagery. Atheism is pure savagery not religion. What use is that fucking picture if the reality is that you're going to be controlled in a world like that... your thoughts controlled, your speech controlled... your reproductive choices... a technological prison run by racial psychopaths, murderers, pedophiles, cowards. Look at modern cities today.. they don't look much different than that and they are SHITHOLES of crime, murder, financial criminality. That is nothing more than a mirage.

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Yeah I agree I need to do something with my life, that's why Im joining the army.
>inb4 bootlicker
I will be in good shape, and have an actual career. Also it's literally the only way I can get out on my own, as I an barred from owning a driver's license for a few years. Also security contracting is something to look forward to. Those guys make a fuckton of money. I probably won't get on that level but hey, it's an acheivable dream. We are on two very different life journeys, but that's ok. Some people are cut out for having a normal life, but I am not. Thanks for talking to me and I wish you good luck on your journey

good luck in the army user, it gets a lot of shit here but if youre low on options it is a legitimate pathway. You as well

Sup /b
I need your advice, i know some of you degenerates are quite smart and have experience in life choices
So i finished HS last year and been searching minimum-wage jobs ever since.I worked some time , but decided that i'm better than that, so i applied for army.But i don't know if that lifestyle suits me , you have to suck it up and obey the orders , even if it doesen't make sense.So i have few choices for my future:Enroll in army (i passed the tests required) , go to college (something usefull like mechanical engineering not some shit like gender studies) , take a course for a craft in about a month or two(welding , pipefitting ) or resort to a life of crime (drugs and all that shit).I live in eastern europe , wages suck , women are hot , i want cash and to be happy
What do?

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Are you making fun of me?

big thoughts of a small mind

none of that happens here.
what shit country are you in?

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>Eastern Cultures have fantastic morals
KEK

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you only get out what you take with you.
you can learn a lot on drugs, but the drug itself will not give you new information except how it is effecting you.

Protip: hallucinogens will not bring you any enjoyment you did not bring into it

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That isn't the Kalam, It's
1 Whatever begins to exist has a cause
2 The universe began to exist;
Therefore:
3 The universe has a cause.
`Full Stop`

Adding: 4 Therefore a fairy had sex with bigfoot creating a maximally powerful Fairyfoot who farted out existence - Is something else entirely.