Does communism work?

because america decided it wasn't allowed

Do not spam Yea Forums again.

This is your only warning.

North Korea isn't communist tho

You mean Communism. They never had communism.

Yeah, don't believe polls with 10 000's of peoples... Better to go ask some random individuals!

None of those countries had actual communist systems though.

> be socialism
> almost have a chance of working
> enter CIA wet-work agents.

uh oh faggits is gonna be mad after reading dis

OP:
> Former communist countries want to be communist again
> Sources neatly laid out
You:
> Dude no they don't
> Source: Dude trust me

They were Socialist countries, ruled by Communist party, had socialist ownership of means of production, planned economy and people educated in communist manner.

Don't be a wise-ass.

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Stockholm syndrome

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Look at the no true Scotsman fallacy!

The way communism was implemented is the only possible outcome. If you don't believe me, you're welcome to walk on the graves of 100 million dead motherfuckers.

>US govenment: I will show once and for all that communsism is a pipe dream

>American chldren dying from measels

>Enter the Mexican concentraation camps

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You ever wondered if your at the right side of history? Once "child concentration camps" starts gettting thrown around, maybe take a step back....

The same cia that failed spectacularly with the bay of pigs was able to prevent a socialist state from being stable? Just how much power to you think they have?

Tankies kill everyone that even looked like they might complain. Corrupt tanky government fails. Criminal syndicates take over.

Of course I felt better when I was 25.

>>Communism confirmed

An inefficient planned economy under an authoritarian government works better than a capitalist cleptocracy under an authoritarian government. This is especially true for countries that weren't part of the original industrial revolution. Those can rely on the institutions that were created during the enlightenment and political absolutism, which would need to be artificially implanted into the third and second world. So for most countries in the world, "communism" would be the better choice. China is an anomaly here, because it was prepped up with billions upon billions of dollars in foreign direct investment.

Also, planned economies are pretty good when it comes to focusing on specific outcomes. That's why every country mobilizing for total war creates a planned economy for just that purpose, and also why the Cuban healthcare system is so good, despite decades of embargo.

The entire power of the the biggest "Secret Police" you've ever seen.

Criminal syndicates... what a fancy name for the capitalist class

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They thought by overthrowing the arguably authoritarian governments, they would magically become a first world country. Also the thrill of the revolution. Every generation has tried to start one since the French showed it was possible.

Lies. And many of those sources are absolute mainstream.

Seeing as during the Cold War there were hundreds of thousands of people trying to escape West, and very few trying to go East, Id say no. The only people in Soviet Russia who had full shelves and fresh exotic fruits in supermarkets were those in the forbidden cities, i.e where the people are the human shield for nuclear stockpiles. Meanwhile, in the west during the same period, the standard of living rose dramatically, and the average person enjoyed comforts and amenities unheard of in the USSR.

> b-but muh not real commynisms/socialisms!
Piss with the cock youve got. No ideology translates straight from book to reality. People who usually utter the above statement are idiots who dont realise the same could be said about the current state of capitalism, and conflate crony capitalism with the 'ideal capitalism'.

Just my 10 cents. Sperg as you will.

Its technically socialist, like all other countries that have been called "communist". The only country that could even remotely be called communist revolutionary Catalunya and they got rekt by the fascists.

Don't you think it's kinda racist to conflate Hitler murdering 12 million German citizens based on race, political leanings, sexual orientation, disabilities, etc with Trump detaining a few thousand economic migrants as they try to illegally enter the US?

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Go troll somebody else.

Nobody said that they are killing anyone at the concentration camps at the southern border.

How come you’re trying to conflate concentration camps with death camps?

No it's a generic term for an organized criminal enterprise, what you might refer to as the "mafia".

You must be pretty stupid if you can't tell the difference between the aryan brotherhood and Google.

And how many people in the US can not enjoy those full shelves of exotic fruits? Also, all those smoothbrained arguments about "communism" "failing" never take into account that the Warsaw Pact countries had been devastated by the wars, did not receive aid from the US, which had been untouched by both the first and second world war, and were far less developed in the first place. Hell, most late industrializers were never able to really keep up with Britain, Germany, France and the USA.

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Colloquially, the term concentration camp was synonymous with the term death camp for decades. Trump gets elected president and carries out the exact same immigration policies the previous president did. All of the sudden prison cells are cages and detention centers are concentration camps all while referring to the president as a NAZI. Are you idiots really so oblivious that you don't realize you're actively embracing newspeak?

I really wonder why noone has mentioned this garbage pile of intellectual dishonesty already.

That depends on your definition of "work". What is a country supposed to do? What is the purpose of a nation?

If you think that a country exists to provide a reasonable standard of living for the majority of its citizens, then communism CAN theoretically work... and it gets easier every year as technology improves. We're rapidly reaching a point where we COULD theoretically be a post scarcity society through automation.

On the other hand, if you feel that the purpose of a country is to create an environment where people are forced to compete and innovate in order to spur the maximum technological progress at any cost, then no, communism is a nonstarter. It breeds contentment, which leads to complacency and stagnation.

So if you want the best possible life for the maximum number of people right now, you want communism. If you want the best possible life for your grandkids, you want CAREFULLY CONTROLLED capitalism.

What we have now, runaway late stage capitalism, can go fuck itself either way.

You're a delusional fucktard. Look at what's happening in those camps. Those people are tortured, some die from easily preventable causes. The first concentration camps were not death camps. Wehret den Anfängen.

Ill sooner die than live under an authoritarian government

Only the urban poor struggle to access fresh fruit and it isn't because produce prices are too high. It's because real estate in urban areas costs too much for large grocery stores with hundreds of square feet of floor space dedicated to fruit to be profitable. You're clearly oblivious to basic realities on the ground.

You are pretty stupid, but I have to admit your crying about how unfair it was that the US rebuilt western Europe, but didn't cut a check to their adversaries in eastern Europe was pretty amusing.

What the fuck do you think they were concentrating on?
Brain games?
No. They were concentrating the human population at 'death' camps.
If you cant figure that out, Just leave it at 'kids in cages'.
While you zoom past your local juvenile hall.

>contentment
I know you mean well, but I you're falling for the same unscientific ideas about human motivation that advocates of capitalism have promoted throughout the ages.

The real problems of planned economies are zero sum inter-ministry resource competition, information asymmetry and an inability to profit from spontaneous innovation (because that would require risk capital).

>You are pretty stupid, but I have to admit your crying about how unfair it was that the US rebuilt western Europe, but didn't cut a check to their adversaries in eastern Europe was pretty amusing.

This is about cause and effect, not moral responsibility, you retarded piece of shit.

Germany was literally raped to death from both sides and today is one of the worlds largest economies, despite only uniting a few decades ago. Eastern Bloc countries were shitholes before ww2, didnt get that badly smashed up during ww2, and yet managed to only get worse during the entire Cold War period. And are still pretty shit today.

The UK only stopped food rationing in the early 1950s and didnt pay off its war debts until the late 60s and yet, again, is one of the worlds largest economies.

The whole 'WAAAH Y THEY NO GET FREE STUFF??' argument is pretty juvenile, considering there were western nations who started far worse off and did a hell of a lot better.

bullshit
random fag from Poland here
i've talked to many people, most people over the age of 45 years old prefer the times of communism here, most people here would happily return under the red banner than live in this shitty country with ""democracy"" that doesn't work

It's not politically correct to question the bible of the ruling class

Why do socialist countries ban trade unions and are run by dictators who are over 9000x richer than the average Joe in such countries?

Using violence to force regime change I don't support.
What I do support is democratically electing someone who will tax the billionaires, improve public services and be committed to the free healthcare sector.

>inter-ministry resource competition

I didn't say it was easy, I just said it could work. Obviously under any system there are issues you have to carefully manage.

Besides, this is also a problem under capitalism... and under the current runaway corporate capitalism, its much worse. We can't have healthcare because the government needs to give that money to defense contractors that lobbied for it.

>information asymmetry

In the internet age, information asymmetry can only be a product of apathy... or intentional hoarding, which under a communist model, people would have no incentive to do.

>inability to profit from spontaneous innovation (because that would require risk capital)

So set up an office where I could just take my idea to the state, explain how it could benefit the people, and get whatever backing I need to make it work. Now, this does mean that my ability to get backing for my idea is contingent on my ability to spin it as a net positive for society... but I feel that's not qualitatively worse than having to spin it as profitable. The only real difference is that you have AN agency to go to instead of a magical rainbow of banks and investors to appeal to. But this being a problem or not really just depends on the implementation of the selection process. Yes, there would be some good ideas that don't get backed. This is indeed an additional reason why controlled capitalism wins in terms of innovation... but this is still going to favor excessive stability and stagnation rather than the kind of collapse that people are afraid of.

Do you agree on the predicted outcomes and we're just quibbling about the reasons why? Or is there a more substantive refutation in here I'm not seeing?

>>Those people are tortured
No they are not.

Innocent people we're tortured and murdered by the millions in Hitler's concentration camps. Illegal economic migrants are temporarily detained prior to trial and deportation in the detention centers run first by Obama then Trump. No one is ripping the gold fillings out of their mouths. No one is leading them into gas chambers. The conflation of Trump's immigration policies with Hitler's final solution isn't just stupid and racist it's pathetic.

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stay sane user

If this was true, there's nothing stopping them from going back. They're not going back, so I think there's a problem with the data.

The cause was the soviet union stealing nuclear weapons technology from the US then dumping the bulk of their GDP into an unsustainable military while the people were forced into literal starvation. It's almost like you're unwilling to acknowledge the soviet union's immoral and ultimately failed central planning resulted in multiple famines.

Not true. All socialist countries had trade unions (and they even wen't on strike sometimes). In Stalin's time the trade unions and workers could even fire the managers of their factories.

Communist party members were not rich, they were mostly regular workers and peasants. Even the high party members had no personal possession. Stalin only owned his clothes, boots and a pipe when he died.

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45 year old people that want to return to their teenage years. That sounds like a compelling reason to return to an authoritarian regime.

that's communism

Imagine drinking so much soviet koolaid™ you actually trust their reports.

It's not like they routinely went through their history books and painstakingly airbrushed people out of famous photographs or anything like that. Why wouldn't you trust their numbers.

Yes, they are being tortured. Just look up the recent reports on living conditions in these camps.

>Do you agree on the predicted outcomes and we're just quibbling about the reasons why? Or is there a more substantive refutation in here I'm not seeing?

No, we're just quibbling abot the reasons why.

Of the half a dozen models of car produced in the Soviet Union, the largest and most comfortable was only available to Communist Party members. They also had entire resorts and private beaches purely for card carrying members.

Sure sounds equal to me.

trusting the opinions of Slavic people is the only thing worse than fucking communism.

Jews are communism. That’s the fucked up part. It’s their ideology to push on the goys. Every notable communist from the early decades of communism was kike

Check. Well, I agree that your stuff would also happen.

To be honest, I'm not even sure which side of the main question I fall under. My main thing is that either way, uncontrolled capitalism with legalized bribery needs to go.

Not in Poland!

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The atheist cunts like Meir and ben-Gurion are dead, retard.

The new Israel is right-wing, capitalistic, and nationalistic. This is the land of Menachem Begin's dream.

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>literal starvation
That was before the Cold War.

But yes, the arms race fucked the USSR, which had been the US' intention. Yes, central planning is inferior to Euro-style social democracy. Yes, the USSR was a dictatorship. Then, the US set up failed states and dictatorships that actually murdered and starved people to death in Latin America in the name of fighting communism.

No they are not. Don't you find it a little suspicious that some guy caught illegally sneaking into the country cries, "I was being tortured in my home country. You must make me a citizen here!" then while awaiting deportation cries to a reporter, "They're torturing me in this holocaust camp! You must make me a citizen!"? You'd do well not to trust every word that comes from the mouth of a man sneaking into your country to work under the table.

You'll jump on any straw, won't you? Like people would have to be incapable of remembering the actual material and moral conditions of their countries for your "argument" to work. If this is standard for acceptable reasoning, one could pull out literally any bullshit to invalidade every possible standpoint.

It did for thousands of years...
But no, it would be hard to implement in modern times. Much like Nationalism, it works until you realize you need other people's resources.

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That's utter nonsense

Polfag here,I never hear anyone said that. Not true

Wow, so much inequality. That's pretty much the difference between upper and lower middle class in any western country.

as a citizen that grew up in a communist country and still live here 30 years after communism fell, only losers wish for communism’s return
time was awful, no food, basic work, no travel
life is better now

Well the information is not from a Soviet source. And you can see how the number of workers and peasants in the Party actually went down after Stalins death. If the info was faked I bet the number of workers and peasants would be higher.

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Jews are never on the right side of history
Every civilisation they’ve infested has either enslaved them or expelled them
Communism is the Jewish plot that will be this generation’s excuse

>Sperg as you will!
And so, they sperged.

People always love to spout out "hurr Durr but it wasn't real communism"

You can say the same thing about capitalism in America today. This isn't real capitalism. Maybe why America is so fucked up compared to 50-20 years ago.....

OP, your image is retarded and missing the point. The enemy isn't just communism the form of government, it's also communists. It takes a fundamentally broken person to enjoy life under communist rule. The fact that so many people want to go back to it just highlights how effective their brainwashing is.

I guarantee a lot of nazis after the war wished they could have hitler back. Doesn't mean nazism is right.

Heading creates a misrepresentation of sentiment expressed in subsequent survey stats. Except for the ones on top people hated the communist system because the only ones who had access to anything beyond the basics were the ones on top. Yay capitalism. The ones on top enjoying life even more while the ones on the bottom no longer even have reliable access to the basics. When you go from steadfast poverty to free to starve of course you're going to have people wax nostalgic over communism. Contrary to leftist mythology, a lot of post-civil war slaves waxed nostalgic over slavery once the reality of "freedom" slapped them in the face as well.

They were killing the communists who instigated the German Civil War 1918-1919, and who wanted a new German Civil War. Corralling them into concentration camps was an act of defense.

if you ask anyone about litterally fucking anything all they were every say is past was better than the present day no matter fucking what

>>communists literally starve millions of their own people right up until their collapse at the end of the 20th century.

>>Sure the soviets starved their own people to death, but I'm only willing to acknowledge the starvation prior to Stalin taking over because I'm a tankie!

>>Soviet planning barely builds the facade of a competent army, starving millions to death in the process, and ultimately collapses.

>>Sure the soviet union collapsed, but capitalism is worse because other people have more money than me and my art degree isn't paying off. The only solution is to build a communist system by transitioning from capitalism to socialism, then to communism!

>>Communists start wars in the middle east, asia, and south america. They subvert the democratic republics and murder anyone that stands in their way. The US was wrong to intervene. All of the blood of these failed communist coups is on the hands of Jeff Bezos and his ilk!

You might want to switch over from that koolaid or water. I'd suggest coffee or tea, but I know an enlightened communist such as your self would never indulge in a crop picked by someone from the third world because that'd be racist.

>an insane commie projecting his mental illness upon others

Just get rid of the Jews. Every culture that shuns them works fine and doesn’t have constant wars.

The majority of people who lived in those countries when the communist rules ended are dead.

i've read about the fall of rome and it reminds me of the modern day. i want to live in an ethnostate with no degenerate western liberal values and no minorities. i don't care what kind of government it has.
i want to raise a family.
i want a wife that isn't corrupted by feminism.
i want kids that aren't fascinated by nigger culture.

Some workers drove lorrys, some drove buses, others flew planes, etc. High party officials who worked full time for the party drove the most reliable when working. I don't see the problem. Nobody owned their work vehicles.

If you look at stuff like HDI, poverty rates, mortality and public health, crime and general quality of life then its pretty clear that Euro-style social democracy is the best way that has been tried so far. Planned economies can "work", better than the usual cleptocratic capitalist regime in many instances, but its far from optimal.

>
>Much like Nationalism, it works until you realize you need other people's resources.
That's called Imperialism. But that one's also no longer feasible, when every dirt farmer can get their hands on an AK and fuck things up.

You have invested a lot in your strawman bullshit, but maybe you should spend your time actual informing yourself on these matter. Watching Fox News and Ben Shapiro videos doens't count, though.

>An inefficient planned economy under an authoritarian government works better than a capitalist cleptocracy under an authoritarian government.
ﬣי Ԓデ שּ ϣまҌҌﬣ Ю デウδフμҌיδԒ ϣρδρ ԋﬠﬣҌ Ҍיאףﬣףשּԋま ロשּԒヵヵ ԋףԋԒאיﬣロロρ Ц ϣ סヵҌסμ ままﬣԋשּ μϣשּρשּҌ ס μף デﬠ ҌフﬣﬣשּҌ יףאאヵҌԒԋԋδԒ μまウロ יϣδδ ﬣﬣヵρҌ ヵまשּまЮﬠףρ
>rely on the institutions that were created during the enlightenment and political absolutism,
ԋשּԒיԋμ ԋロﬣ ロЦヵﬣロフשּיףδ ԒЦﬣס ﬣﬣウﬠס フאμロﬣ μיאЦסヵҌ ԋロﬣԋשּԒまδ
>China is an anomaly here, because it was prepped up with billions upon billions of dollars in foreign direct investment.
ԋשּ μρԋδԒף まﬣҌףשּ ףҌρЮ ρロ ウヵԋヵ ԋまԒԋδロאﬣﬣδδҌ μיףヵ ҌשּשּρヵԒδ Ҍףסԋ אﬠשּאロҌ ԒδロיҌμ אまμסρЦףヵま ま ρԒיま Ҍϣヵ ףﬣ ロЮ δϣיףδﬣԋԋﬣҌ ϣμまיҌμשּϣשּҌﬣԋԋδ ԋロԒロ μま ρҌﬠשּףﬠヵיאאヵ יロЦҌԋρיまҌ Ԓ

>I never hear anyone said that
You don't talk to many people (over the age of 20), do you?

Communists are Jewish. During the early decades of communism, it was all Jews white people didn’t succumb to the propaganda till well after WWII.
Notice how the German Civil war 1918-1919 was fought between he capitalist Weimar Republic and the German Communists. And notice how Hitler became leader of Germany so soon after the civil war. And notice how little options Hitler felt he had left but to expelled them and exterminate them? If he succeeded, the rest of the communist world would never have had to endure all of those bloody wars.

>Communism is inherently bad because it didn't work out this specific time.

>Capitalism is above reproach because some of the people criticizing it don't have it so bad.

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You're pretty dumb and I feel bad, so I'll explain it to you.

Asking someone that's 45 years old in 2019 about conditions of the country that collapsed in 1991 is pretty stupid. They weren't even an adult when the government collapsed.

At best they remember the last five years from the perspective of a teenager. You're probably about 16 yourself, so I'll explain it to you. 16 year olds don't have a clue what the fuck is going on.

Just be one Jewish and move to Israel. They’ve got their own ethnostate that you can live in.

>I don’t like having a choice, I prefer driving the only car model my country makes

Yeah, people were so brainwashed, they toppled the government.

>Look, I’m brainwashed too

>Current year
>unironically being communist

news.mongabay.com/2018/05/venezuelas-hungry-hunt-wildlife-zoo-animals-as-economic-crisis-grows/

>become

No, it doesn't work.
Have any of these Eastern European/Socialist/Communist countries ever been rich or had happy citizens enough to rate highly on the happiness scale measured every year?

As for your pic related, people mistrust change, things were more stable but people were more unhappy, pining for the old regime is a reactionary and short-sighted outlook, are they free now? Yep.
The last regime ruled most of these countries for between 45 - 80 years, most citizens won't remember what true freedom felt like before communism.

Don't get me wrong, the ideals and goals are fantastic under a communist state on paper, however, the second you introduce a single real human into the equation it all goes down the shitter.

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This.

well said ma dude

Communists think Norway is a great example of a green "socialist" state without taking into account that it's a country of 5 million people that own an ocean of natural gas. Life isn't comfortable their because they have 70% income taxes. Life is comfortable there because everyone there is rich.

Thinking the rest of the world is going to run like Norway is like wondering why people in Saudi Arabia drive Ferraris while people in Iraq are poor.

I have a friend who remembers living under Yugoslavia(shes croat) and that war followed. If someone is legitimately trying to bring back communism she'd kill them.

>Have any of these Eastern European/Socialist/Communist countries ever been rich or had happy citizens enough to rate highly on the happiness scale measured every year?

ϣҌﬣҌδまיﬠフδヵρヵЮウס ԋρμאשּ δ ロρ ףデウԒϣיﬣﬠμԋヵδҌまסԋﬣヵיﬣԋロﬣԒ μשּשּףﬣҌまҌδЦρףﬠסЮԋҌロ ҌρヵϣフישּאԋԒ ま ԋשּԋשּデﬣҌЦ Ԓまשּ ﬠҌま ףδロ ҌԒאϣףウﬣ ρϣμロδסי ԋיヵヵҌ ﬣ שּסאԒヵρδまףיﬣロҌρﬠμԋ フԋﬣשּμЮ ヵҌԒμ

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user is a deep thinker!

Yes, surely everything wrong in Venezuela is 100% due to socialism and no other factors...

Yeah, they faked the data to make it look like more of the population was engaged in subsistence farming.

>ϣҌﬣҌδまיﬠフδヵρヵЮウס ԋρμאשּ δ ロρ ףデウԒϣיﬣﬠμԋヵδҌまסԋﬣヵיﬣԋロﬣԒ μשּשּףﬣҌまҌδЦρףﬠסЮԋҌロ ҌρヵϣフישּאԋԒ ま ԋשּԋשּデﬣҌЦ Ԓまשּ ﬠҌま ףδロ ҌԒאϣףウﬣ ρϣμロδסי ԋיヵヵҌ ﬣ שּסאԒヵρδまףיﬣロҌρﬠμԋ フԋﬣשּμЮ ヵҌԒμ

That's easy for you to say.

ϣρδρ ԋﬠﬣҌ Ҍיאףﬣףשּԋま

>communists literally starve millions of their own people right up until their collapse at the end of the 20th century.
That's a lie

>Sure the soviet union collapsed, but capitalism is worse because other people have more money than me and my art degree isn't paying off.
Literally a strawman.

>Communists start wars in the middle east, asia, and south america.
That's what the US did.

>They subvert the democratic republics and murder anyone that stands in their way.
That's, again, what the US did and its a well known, widely publicised fact and your unwillingness to acknowledge this tells me a lot about the amount of koolaid in your bloodstream.

>I know an enlightened communist such as your self would never indulge in a crop picked by someone from the third world because that'd be racist.
I am neither a communist nor an SJW. Those things you have made up in your tiny star-sprangled brain, because it can't handle ambivalence.

>ロρ ףデウԒϣיﬣﬠμԋヵδҌまסԋﬣヵיﬣԋロﬣԒ μשּשּףﬣҌまҌδЦρףﬠסЮԋҌロ ҌρヵϣフישּאԋԒ ま ԋשּԋשּデﬣҌЦ Ԓまשּ ﬠҌま!!!

Difference is relative poverty vs absolute poverty. Working classes in western countries are considered impoverished if they dont have a microwave and only have 1 television. The west is also the only place in history where the poorest people are also the most overweight, which definitely didnt happen in Soviet states.

The difference is that the average person in the west had almost the same amenities as those in the upper echelons of the communist party in terms of access to amenities and comforts. Wealth inequality is only a massive issue when the average person is poor/starving. Wealth inequality in the west is not generally an issue (unless youre a retarded commie) because the average person lives pretty comfortably. In the USSR it was an issue because many of the rich became so due to ties with the communist party and backhand deals that screwed over the average person, who was already poor as fuck, working for a shockingly low wage and had a diet reminiscent of the potato famine.

שּԒロヵウסまשּﬠԒשּﬣЦまμ ﬣԋ Ҍԋאשּ ρףאδףיフρיҌ?

>I have the best words.
Proles like you should never have been allowed on the internet.

> I dont see a problem with Lambourghinis only being available to Communist Party members when the average person only has access to a Vauxhall Astra

ףﬣאμμヵﬠロρףﬠフま ヵיフ ﬣϣשּヵﬠμ שּまԋףμδﬣ ϣ ウ ԋウҌԒρウ Ҍ Ю まҌיδ デԋ ρμ ﬣﬣヵϣ ϣρאま まי ヵロ!

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_nostalgia

Propaganda makes Communism appear better than it is.
Adjusting to capitalism is years of hardship.
Capitalist perception never reaches expectations as it is only established in countries that have always been capitalist (and are based on Judo-Christian philosophies that weren't subverted).

communists are jewish
capitalists are jewish
nationalists are jewish
social democrats are jewish
treehuggers are jewish
porn actors are jewish
everything is a jewish conspiracy

I wonder if this world view is possible for people without pathological paranoia.

More like communism was tried by a large swath of the world for the better part of the 20th century, resulting in oppression, starvation, and ultimately collapse. During this time the capitalists built factories and spread democratic republics across the globe nearly eliminating extreme poverty.

>>never tried communism so it must work. Capitalism supplanted feudalism and wiped out extreme poverty, but I'm greedy and want more than I'm willing to work for, so we've got to get rid of it.

These pathetic tankies are just NEETs in a cheap disguise. They'd be perfectly happy to embrace capitalism if only someone would pay all of their bills. That's what their ideology is about.

Yup

>Asking someone that's 45 years old
If you can't even see what's wrong with your premise there, you are the dumb one.

AND WHAT'S WRONG WITH A VAUXHALL ASTRA???

remember when Venezuela seemed to be doing well and socialism got all the credit? No it's failing and capitalism is to blame. It's almost like communists credit communism whenever something goes right and blame capitalism whenever something goes wrong. That's the sort of ideology you can trust.

You realize that typing random unicode in the vain hope that people who will never know you in real life will assume you're using some kind of secret cipher (and therefore must be part of a secret society which is totally super cool) is absurdly pathetic right? No one thinks you're actually saying anything, just stop. Get some help.

>No capitalist state has ever been ruled by incompetent dictators and no capitalist state has ever failed.
Cool story, bro.

Communism is lack of government. Or very, very little.

Which numbers did they fake, before the famine or after?

>here come the straw men Jews

Soviet union was too big to last long, if a stateless, classless society is achieved then there would be no wars and everyone could live happily

I like the part where you call facts lies and pretend the soviet union didn't invade a bunch of countries to spread their hegemony.

Attached: HowBadDidTheCIAFuckUpToLoseTheirSupport.jpg (900x653, 141K)

There were several factors to venuezuala down fall. And it wasnt mainly its economic system. It was incompetent leadership mostly.

The sources on OP are bullshit

umad?

Norway is a bad example for this reason. But there are plenty of other examples for the success of social democracy:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Happiness_Report
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_infant_and_under-five_mortality_rates

Both lol

I think it's funny how suddenly anyone who opposes communism is marked as a fascist.
>Not pro government??? Fascist!
>Doesn't want government handouts and free social programs?? Fascist!
>"I'm going to protest fascists by running wild in the streets and attempting to assault innocent civilians!"

>random unicode
Ю デウδフμҌיδԒ ϣρδρ ԋﬠﬣҌ Ҍיאףﬣףשּԋま ロשּԒヵヵ ԋףԋԒאיﬣロロρ Ц ϣ סヵҌסμ ままﬣԋשּ μϣשּρשּҌ ס μף デﬠ
>No one thinks you're actually saying anything, just stop. Get some help.
אまμסρЦףヵま ま ρԒיま Ҍϣヵ ףﬣ ロЮ δϣיףδﬣԋԋﬣҌ ϣμまיҌμשּϣשּҌﬣԋԋδ ԋロԒロ μま ρҌﬠשּףﬠヵיאאヵ יロЦҌԋρיまҌ

Don’t include Jews with Christianity.
Communism is Jewish. Every communist from the early decades of communism was Jewish. The German Civil War 1918-1919 was fought between the capitalist Weimar Republic and communist subversives in the aftermath of WWI. They fucked the country up worse than the allies. And only stopped fighting after the Weimar Republic offered concessions amounting to becoming the worlds first welfare state. And 14 years later, Hitler got elected because he promised to solve the communist problem and fix the failing welfare state. I wonder why he felt his only solution was to externinate or expelled them?

Label it communism. All evidence is for socialism....and suspect anyway. Nice bait? Got me anyway

>I like the part where you call facts lies and pretend the soviet union didn't invade a bunch of countries to spread their hegemony.
They did. So did the US.

socialism works great until you run out of other people's money. it's the financial equivalent of the old saying: "one size fits 'em all"

socialism is basically a cult of collectivism, which is polar opposite of our human nature. it doesn't work unless we reject our individuality in favor of a controlled hivemind.

OH NO! Not basic econs and common sense!!!

>I think it's funny how suddenly anyone who opposes communism is marked as a fascist.
Literally noone has called anyone a fascist in this thread, you strawman loving faggot. Though we were recently joined by one of those shitheads who thinks everything wrong in this world is (((their))) fault.

Not all Jews are bad. But the worst subversives in the history of the western world, have often been Jewish. Ever hear about the regular famines in Europe caused by Jewish moneylenders buying a province’s wheat crop all at once, then instead of making bread like the crops were intended for, they brewed alcohol, and then doubled their money by selling the peasants cheap liquor. Then when famine hit the area, due to no bread, those moneylenders had moved on. The peasants only realising they’d been fooled as they starved.

>t. underage brainlet with no education in economics

>run out of money
Dude building capital doesnt require loaned fiat currency.

in order to enforce communism you need to run a police state. it goes against human nature, so people don't follow it on their own.

Name one communist state that has succeeded

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>Not real communism

Every. Single. Time.

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>mfw i was talking to my grandma who lived in the USSR
>mfw she says all the shit my grandpa had to do smuggling gold and diamonds out of the country just to be able to make enough money to hopefully buy food to feed his family

you guys who are for communism are fucking retarded

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A history of the Vietnamese war and communism in general by Yea Forums

All those countries have free elections. If they miss communism so much why don't they go vote for communist parties?

Where did you get this shit from? An Alex Jones video? Also, this makes no sense for anyone able to do basic reasoning and even a passing knowledge of history. Jews weren't even allowed to brew alcohol in Europe, mills were owned by the lord and peasants HAD to mill their wheat there and its not like you can just conjure a brewery out of thin air. Also, judging people based on acts committed ages ago by a couple of assholes of the same religious denomination is pretty fucking insane. By that logic, I wouldn't be alive, because all Germans should have been killed after WW2.

>Muh government programs!

It actually does. Without it, and the government taking on massive public debt, capitalism would long have imploded due to capital concentration and erosion of the consumer base.

First, when Venezuela seemed to be doing well we never heard about it at all. Second, crediting yourself for successes and blaming others for failures is something that literally every ideology does.

Define success.

>Where did you get this shit from?
My 92 year old Czech grandma, backed up by everyone else in their town old enough to have parents that lived through that shit

>Also, judging people based on acts committed ages ago by a couple of assholes of the same religious denomination is pretty fucking insane.
ԋδףԋיאԋρロロשּ μ סשּﬣロԒףρ ﬠשּまヵ δ まフҌЮיウ ҌҌヵﬠρ δμﬣי Ԓデ שּ ϣまҌҌﬣ Ю デウδフμҌיδԒ ϣρδρ ԋﬠﬣҌ Ҍיאףﬣףשּԋま ロשּԒヵヵ ԋףԋԒאיﬣロロρ Ц ϣ סヵҌסμ ままﬣԋשּ μϣשּρשּҌ ס μף デﬠ ҌフﬣﬣשּҌ יףאאヵҌԒԋԋδԒ

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>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Happiness_Report
>>earn 60% of what an American makes for the same labor, pays 50% higher taxes on income then pays VAT tax. Can't find work due to 6.5% unemployment compared to 3.6% in the US. Relies entirely on US military to keep China and Russia from invading. Checks maximum happiness out of shame.

>>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index
>> You see comrade, when we replace the accurate and objective "welfare economics" measurement of success with a "Capability approach" we can use subjective measurements to decide which country is doing the best regardless of their ability to provide for their citizenry. We'll finally be able to express how much better the soviets are than than the west.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_infant_and_under-five_mortality_rates
>>The decadent west will always fail because they not only allow their citizens to eat whatever they want, but they can afford alcohol and tobacco too. Clearly, the negative health impacts of unfettered free will must be stamped out by the state's guiding hand.

The only people murdered by those regimes were communists. Helicopter ride, anyone?

Except the US invaded to defend existing democrat republics while the soviets invaded to install totalitarian despots.

Because they're also conservacucks who hate immigrants and the gays.

Also. thinking life was better under communism is not the same as thinking that a properly set up market economy and democary would be even better. Only, the reality in the former Warsaw Pact countries is often different.

I do imagine that many of the people questioned in the sources answered out of frustration, not because they actually prefer a planned economy.

So why doesn't someone start a political party that's economically left wing and socially right wing? Is someone stopping them?

What are you talking about? There's no need to have a massive police state to ban free enterprise!

>Relies entirely on US military to keep China and Russia from invading.
you also forgot how the US navy helps keep their shipments from being stolen by pirates

nordic countries are essentially the welfare queens of the world

prosperity

The USSR and iron curtain countries literally had specific police units tasked with breaking up markets and arrest traders. Even North Korea has police units dedicated to similar operations. All tasked with ensuring no free market commerce is allowed to operate.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sister_City_(Parks_and_Recreation)

yep, nobody talked about Venezuela back then.

ﬣ Ю デウδフμҌיδԒ ϣρδρ ԋﬠﬣҌ Ҍיאףﬣףשּԋま ロשּԒヵヵ ԋףԋԒאיﬣロロρ Ц ϣ סヵҌסμ ままﬣԋשּ μϣשּρשּҌ ס μף デﬠ ҌフﬣﬣשּҌ יףאאヵҌԒԋԋδԒ μまウロ יϣδδ ﬣﬣヵρҌ ヵまשּまЮﬠףρ ԋשּԒיԋμ ԋロﬣ ロЦヵﬣロフשּיףδ ԒЦﬣס ﬣﬣウﬠס フאμロﬣ

>doubt.

Stalin killed more Jewish doctors per month than Pinochet killed communists in his entire life.

Somehow the tankies aren't racist though.

That would require the intelligenzia to jump onto their mental gymnastics.

Your willingness to lie know no bounds.

no, i believe him, the way the jews operate is the way people of my ethnic background do as well. i know not to fuck with my own people because im one of them

No. It only works like that if the nation is run by a consumer economy. Its fragile.

Socialism can easily work of you dont set the standard of living so high and allow weslth inequality like in the states.
Look what is happening in Russia once run away capitslism was allowed.

>a fucking sitcom lol, meanwhile (((CNN))) during that time period had report after report about what a success Venezuela’s new communist regime was, (((CNN))), (((NPR))) & (((PBS))) documentaries devoted to the million man protest (by people who accused the US of kidnapping him) when Chavez went into hiding for a few days. All around that time period.
>But a fucking sitcom is your evidence lmao

>blaming infant mortality on alcohol and tobacco
One day, you people will turn me into a full-blown tankie.

Stalin had plenty to fear from Jewish subversives, he survived his fair share of their attempts on his life. He had Jewish ancestors. And knew well how the pre-Stalin USSR worked too, and who needed to be purged to preserve his life. Your evidence proves the point you’re trying to discredit.

The only thing keeping anyone from invading anyone is the nuclear peace.

Well, Cuba has a lower infant mortality than the US...

So why did the people cheer when Pinochet got into power promising to solve the problems caused by communists under the previous regime? Helicopter ride, anyone?

The EU tears counties' economies apart by allowing foreign businesses to sell utilities to disparaged countries post communism, which is why communism seemed better. Where do those foreign businesses take the profits of this? Back to their host country, not reinvesting or spending in the undeveloped country. Look at Romania and Hungry. Their economy growth was terrible after communism because of an uneducated people unable to provide for themselves due to Communism. Cultures of poverty is a mindset and disease. Not to mention education is important. Smart Hungarians and Romanians leave their country to become doctors and never come back because the pay is worse.

tl;dr EU makes countries bad. If suck the tit of communism, you forget how to provide for yourself.

>>Drinks 4L of tankie Koolaid™ a day hoping for free shit.

>>Capitalists are such liars. Comrade Stalin never told a single lie!

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That’s to be commended. They also have the highest per capita poverty of the entire American continental landmass, north and south. They’ve also got the lowest meat eating rate per capita, because nobody can afford meat. They’ve also got the oldest car fleet in the world, because new cars are just not available. And on and on, life sucks there compared to the west.

No, but the problem is humans, they keep trying over and over because it actually is perfect on paper - what they're leaving out is a part of human psychology we're going to find out simply cannot be changed. Humans think of themselves as able to act out any artificial social construct which they can understand, the failure of communism proves this is not the case. It doesn't matter how perfect or how isolated or how many resources a communist system has, even in a vacuum where only it existed it would fly apart just because of the humans in it.

The will to power cannot be subjugated under any circumstance, it's equivalent to asking you to stop breathing, even your best attempt would end in you passing out and starting to breathe again.

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>>THEY NEVER TALKED ABOUT VENEZUELA WHILE DEITY CHAVEZ WAS MAKING EVERYTHING PERFECT BEFORE THE EVIL IMPERIALISTS MADE STARVE HIS OWN PEOPLE!

>First, when Venezuela seemed to be doing well we never heard about it at all

>a fucking sitcom lol

You're an idiot

> 88% of Germans think life was better under Hitler

yourlogicalfallacyis.com/bandwagon

fuck off with that cuck chastity belt shit, kike

They definitely don't send anyone that refuses to cook the books to a sugar plantation.

US (((media))) reporter a lot on Venezuela during the early years, touting it as a successful communist regime, meming about how Chavez changed the flag to turn the animal facing right to the left and loving it, they said Chavez was amazing. They hid the famines until foreign media reported on them.

Hello guys, I'm 21yo from Ukraine, have 2x granddads/grandmoms, everyone has lived in USSR (the only real communist country in my opinion)

First off - there are different families.

My whole family thinks USSR sucks. No food, no stuff to buy even though you had money, no opportunitues, no freedom.

Granddad and grandmother from moms line - USSR sucks but they had a free appartment. Granddad was an engineer and really saw how bad everything was - because technology was so stupid and everybody didnt want to work.

Grandparents from dads line - USSR was OK, because most of their lives (50+ years) they ve lived on Russia teritory. But still, they tell me that they were actually robbed by official (and the only) bank of ussr crash in 1990 when they got NOTHING from theur life savings

What kind of people think communism was good:
- 75+yo grannies who in my opinion are just missing their childhood and 20-s
- fucking lazy people, because they know that in ussr you could fucking do nothing while some other guy did everything (biggest shit - "uravnilovka" - equalizing)
- people who really like russian television, which literally translates everywhere that Stalin=hero, communism was great, US sucks (official TV channels and web news websites, like cnbc or nyt in US)

Well that is what I see right now

---
Would like to add my opinion:
Communism sucks, because I'm a hard working guy, paying my taxes properly. I fucking disgust an idea that my earnings ($2.5k/mo) will be LITERALLY SHARED with lazy $250/mo stupid fuck with no experience or education JUST BECAUSE COMMUNISM
And yeah, I do some kind of entrepreneurship right now - should I tell you guys again that PROPRIETARY BUSINESSES DO NOT EXIST IN REAL COMMUNISM? That sucks

Peace

Notice how the (((tankies))) refuse to argue on points that get verified by others

why don't you ask the millions of people that died to communism oh wait

>No, but the problem is humans, they keep trying over and over

Communism is a scam invented by an unemployable author that needed help to stay lucid long enough to put a pamphlet together. Everyone dumb enough to try it became a dictator at the first opportunity.

It's not perfect on paper. It's ridiculous on paper. The century wasted on it proved how stupid it was, but was still a mistake. Further attempts won't last long.

Wow, what drugs are you taking?

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Does any of the above sound familiar to your Ukrainian ears, particularly jewish communists and Jewish subversivness?

but you are a faggot

ruchole to chyba twoja stara w dupe jebali że pierdolisz takie bzdury

>I will use a Fox News report to counter a claim that (((CNN))), (((NPR))), and (((PBS))) glorified Chavez during the early part of his reign

Sure thing bro

Tell Juan Guaido I said hi

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I don't see how an idiot that went from claiming no one discussed Venezuela at all to claiming there was a 24/7 propaganda campaign against Venezuela has a leg to stand on in any conversation. You're clearly making this shit up as you go along.

nope

for young people this is such a cliche - "jews are bad haha"

Only soviet people believe that JEWS steal your money and are really bad people because they somehow managed to grab the power and be on top, while "honest and hard working soviet people work and get pennies" - bullshit

The reason of that told me once my grandpa:
most of academics, scientists and really smart people were jewish => that implies that soviet people were simply jealous

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There’s more than one person in this thread. I didn’t make the original claim, I’m the middle guy, who claimed the media was overly generous with their reporting on Chavez. I would of course have pointed out that a (((Fox News))) report glorifying Chavez is entirely consistent with the rest of the (((media)))’s subversion. In fact that just makes it an even odder situation because when did (((Fox News))) and (((CNN))) agree on anything back then?! They both liked Chavez and they both cherrypicked information about his regime to suit their own left/right agenda.

No, Jews were on top in USSR because the leaders of the original communist revolution were Jewish.

Well that's proven bullshit my friend. Only a minority of the bolsheviks were Jewish.

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It's not my fault you have to cruise here because your stupid "secret" discord already has too many people on /pol/.

>dictator

Well, this is exactly what I mean. Communism would be fine if it were administrated entirely by a computer. When humans do it the same cycle of cult of personality -> corruption -> atrocity occurs over and over because every society contains only potential dictators and potential followers, there are no other types of people.

In a way communism is just humanity looking at itself in a mirror and asking "Why am I like this?". But we're like that, it's not ever going to change. Communism is a tantrum humanity is throwing as it finally presses up against it's own fundamental mental and spiritual limitations.

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>gulags were fine, practically holiday camps
Conveniently forgot to mention the frequent starvation, malnourishment, executions, mob rule, and all the other bad things about the gulags.

Yea man. A full experience, and it was free as well. What a vacation.

Me: kikes are subversives throughout history, modern day kikes push cuck chastity porn on men
Kike: My brainwashing compels me to do it, go back to /pol/ you meanie

Only 10 years though

Nobody in Romania wants to go back to communism you knit wit

Old people remember a time when was young and forgotten about bad thinks. Young people don't know what was communism. Op is retarded.

Better dead than red!

(Anyway... something like communism work in group max of five people if they are your friends/family, but not always.)

>In a way communism is just humanity looking at itself in a mirror and asking "Why am I like this?"
It’s not humanity. It’s the kike pushing this fantasy of free everything onto unemployed and lazy people who refuse to thrive in a capitalist system, seducing those people into believing a different system will make them rich. And then filling them full of propaganda until they work themselves into a frenzy until they are ready to skillup to whatever level is needed and even to die for their newfound commitment to communism. Ironically I’d they put that much effort into developing skills and working, they’d already be rich by now.

>It’s the kike pushing this
ҌρヵϣフישּאԋԒ ま ԋשּԋשּデﬣҌЦ Ԓ ףδロ ҌԒאϣ ףウﬣ ρϣμ δסי ԋיヵヵҌ ﬣ שּסאԒヵρδまףיﬣロҌρﬠμԋ フԋﬣשּμЮ ヵҌԒμ

exactly

That's the only way you can get communism because it's so unnatural. If communism was natural there wouldn't have to be books written about it or people shillings it like it's life or death

unnatural like the sneaky subversive kike

Except 53% of the population

washingtontimes.com/news/2012/aug/30/struggling-romanians-yearn-for-communism/

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>people who aren’t successful yearn for the communist fantasy
Pikachu face . jpg

No

Yes

But they’re right! Economies always tend toward communism.

You mean regular working class people who can't afford living? People who have to beg on the streets because there's not enough jobs? People who are not corrupt government officials or thieving oligarks?

Then yes.

Wow, that’s a whole lot of places you can go live in if you want to live under communism.

80% of kids would really enjoy eating nothing but ice cream but its still not a good idea my friend

I want an economic system that lets me eat I’ve cream 80% of the time!

Isn’t the whole point of capitalism that you don’t need to rely on a job. You can setup your own business. Nothing stopping anyone in need of work from starting small, local services, gardening, window washing, then working their way up. Or even better, education, get a degree and get a better job.
Under communism none of those options are available to you. You don’t get to even choose your job in the first place.

Why is communism a fantasy? It’s never been tried properly yet.

The problem with communism is as soon as the revolution is done they immediately start killing off the population.

Say what you want about the economics but the pure inhuman savagery cant be ignored.

Its awesome when you interview 20 somethings that did not live it. Im sure the 100,000,000+ dead would just LOVE to have communism back.

You are delusional. 99% of workers living in capitalist society do not have the option of setting up their own business, because they don't have the money. And even if you get a loan from a bank and start a small business you have to compete with the mulitnational corporations who will eventually swallow your small business. Eventually you end up working for the big ass global corporations.

In socialist countries you could get an education for free. If you got tired of your job you could study for free as an adult and get another job. No job was forced on you. It depended on what you studied.

WTF wtf WTF, niggerjews discord OMG jesus nigger niggerjew niggerjessu Join, WE are A proud Jewish kikish server join us cuz we are trunniestrunny kekekekekk3k3k43tp www.discordapp.com\inviteuVjnVV

Here you can see population of USSR. Y of the function shows population growth in millions

Attached: Население_СССР.png (1280x710, 153K)

Costs practically nothing to buy a lawnmower and start mowing lawns. What are you smoking?

So population growth spiked during WWII when 20million Russians died? Solid (((figures))) there!

does baby boom mean anything to you?

First of all learn the difference between socialism and communism

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You must have pulled those numbers out of your ass. I stayed in Hungary for awhile and I can assure you, I've never met on communist or pro-communist. In fact, they are the ones who red pilled me and explained to me how and why communism was so fucked up.

How do you explain OP’s survey?

Why the fuck are there so many communist shills? Are you people genuinely autistic?
Go fucking an hero you disgusting low IQ fucking crackers.
This is why no one takes you seriously, but you retards still honestly think Communism and Socialism is a viable option.
Fucking hilarious.

Literally all of those websites are far left leaning socialist shilling sites.

Fuck off Commie.

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Oh yeah, sure they want Communism.
That's totally why as soon as the Russians allowed voting again they voted every communist leader out of office.

Pure communism doesn't work. Pure capitalism doesn't work. They have to balance each other for stability.

No

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hurr hur hurr hurr hey Cletus, I dun did posted the pic o' AOC sucking Trump's weener agin!

I dont base my opinions on what other think, especially populations that have been fed propaganda for decades

Could it be because they’re lazy and want free gibs?

Communism can't be weighed based on whether folks feel good under it. Communism must be weighed on whether or not it was sustainable, it wasn't. The same goes for the gibmes the left is promising. Sure it'd make you feel great, until our country folds up.

Only if there's a single government running the entire world, and no one can speak freely or defend themselves. It works rather well that way.

Pretty sure OP doesn't work either.

Who dat?

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Rise up proud peasants and being communism to our lands!

This survey is factual, you just can’t accept that the people want communism, can you?

>It’s all so simple, anons
>we don’t even need to have this thread or any discussion pertaining to communism ever because I’ve already figured it all out

If communism worked, it’d be the natural way to run societies. It isn’t. So it doesn’t work.

No idea. Just posted the image to Google image search, but got no clues

communism only fully works for a race that has evolved to live by it.
Look at ants, or any other hive or nest based species.

If you told me that older germans felt better under Nazi Germany I would still reject their awful ideology.

Wrong. Corruption and greed get in the way. It's the evil of man that distorts communism.

So capitalism is good then?

yes

really?