President Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez

This

Her niece is hot tho !!

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that is communism, democratic socialism benefits from capitalism and market competition but also guarantees it's citizens social safety nets

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President of what though?

morans

How?

muh dick

raising taxes on the most wealthy

Definitely not, she's cute though.

And when the most wealthy become less wealthy, do we still tax them more?

What happens when the most wealthy leave the country to avoid paying obscene taxes?

Name?

LIBTARDDDDDDD

You retards do realize she cant even run for POTUS until 2028 right? By then she'll be a washed up porn star after being derailed from congress.
Pic related

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It's never gonna happen, idiot.

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I thought this lard choked to death on a pork fat sandwich.

Dont try and explain economics to them. It'll give them a migraine.

Minimum age to be president is 35. She is 19 mentally and 29 physically.

>raising taxes on the most wealthy
>most wealthy leave the country
now what?

Everyone is guaranteed substandard everything in a democratic socialist society. Everyone becomes equally poor and dependent.

President of the local bartenders union

but only if we double her salary

She's no where close in age. She's what, 28? She won't be able to run in the next two elections.

Sexiest home owners association president ever.

unless a business was already global, it's hard for them to just uproot, start over in a new country, hire employees, market to new buyers, make connections, etc. In most cases it would be cheaper to stay than leave

the most wealthy already do massive tax evasion and fuck up the entire country due to lobbying, good riddance

LUL, where are they gonna go? Sudan? Everywhere makes you pay taxes stupid.

>most wealthy leave the country
this didn't happen when the top tax rate was 70% and up in the USA so give an example.

Besides, their companies will still be here. They'll still be making money here, so they'll still be getting taxed here.

Good. Im all for equal.opportunity and no discrimination and its about time we had a mentally handicapped person as president.

>democratic socialism
>capitalism/market competition
pick one, retard

I'll move to Putin's Russia if she ever becomes President.

Yup. And the tax rates are comparable.
If the US increases their tax rates to a higher percentage than the cost would be to move, corporations move.

President COW FARTS.
Hold on to that dream.

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You are also forced to pay 90% of your income in taxes.

you're completely fucking retarded if you think corporations would move to sudan. They've spent all this time corrupting the US governent and learning how to avoid taxes anyhow, the wealthy literally cannot lose under this system, there's no reason to leave

no that's the whole fucking point, guarentee what people need to survive, the rest is up to the market. Look at european countries right now that guarantee healthcare

Any other fakes?

Their companies will import there, which will raise the cost, which will make it less affordable, which is why people wont get to have it.

If you don’t understand how those two can coexist you’re the retard. Learn about what you’re talking about.

>of your income
user it's not your money when in socialism

Except what actually happens is the middle class will be the ones who are taxed out of existence because the super rich have enough money to relocate or game the tax code. These democratic socialists are not on your side just cause they promise you free shit. They are not acting in your best interests and trying to gain power out of some sense of helping their fellow man. They are out for themselves same as any other politician, 3 houses Bernie is a perfect example.

You both are dumbshits who don’t know what you’re talking about.

Oh please. Coca-Cola isn't going to stop selling to the USA because of high taxes. Most places have taxes WAY higher than the US currently and they still get sold to as well. If the big corporations leave people are still going to be making money, people are still going to be selling things. The US is still one of the largest markets in the fucking world. If the top 1% are taxed more heavily they're not going to pull up their roots and move the whole fucking business overseas because that will be hugely more expensive to the bottom line of the company than their top brass paying 70% taxes.

>Look at european countries right now that guarantee healthcare

They ain't doing so well.

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Unless the system changes.
Clearly meant yup to everywhere makes you pay taxes you dumb fuck.

Source?

Which will make local smaller businesses more attractive options revitalizing local economies once the Mega-Corps like Walmart fuck off to China, that sounds like win win to me.

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comin for our gibs WYPEEPO

>They ain't doing so well.
care to back that up trumptard?

>or game the tax code.
That is why tax reform is a fucking thing. Change the code so it can't be so easily gamed. Just because someone fucks off to Switzerland or some such doesn't mean their income can't still be taxed if its being generated in the US.

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Stop thinking about how it is, and start thinking about how it would be.
Theres no reason to leave now because tax rates arent ridiculous.
If tax rates become ridiculous, there will be reason to leave.

problem is those countries need to cooperate, and the swiss and caymans say fuck off to all that - you can't make them - why do you think people use them?

Wow would you look at that, an image presenting unsourced information. How persuasive. Let me guess, I can just go "look it up on google" right?

Until the mega corporations fuck off, everyone that works there loses their jobs, and small business owners become the most wealthy and are taxed out of business.

The global businesses are the ones making the huge money so they can (and already do) move headquarters or operations when it makes sense to with regards to taxation or business environment. Also, rich individuals can easily up and leave.

Trickle down economics has clearly been proven to be bullshit but implementing socialist tax regimes and thinking it'll magically solve our problems is an equally big fallacy.

you can very easily check their net worth - are you actually claiming they're poor? are you dumb or a shill?

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You can actually

So then let them leave. If they're here taking all our money while giving nothing back then they are a parasite draining funds from our country. If they try to skip out on all their bills, then you freeze their assets until they pay up. Stop making excuses for the ultra rich to be worthless fucking Ticks.

The money is MADE here. The items are sold here. The employees are paid here. In USD. We don't need to petition the Swiss.

Giving nothing back except low cost products and wages to citizens, as well as the majority of tax revenue.

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It's not "whoever has the top 1% of income in the country gets this tax" Its "whoever is making more than a billion dollars a year pays this tax".

I agree, change the code. Abolish the IRS and abolish taxes. If you want a gov't funded program then there should be a go fund me type deal and anyone who wishes can contribute (or not).

Taxation is theft.

CALLED IT

With businesses it's easier to track, I'm talking individuals that hide money overseas.

But I do know what I'm talking about:
>Democratic socialism: a political philosophy that advocates political democracy alongside a socially owned economy
>socially owned economy = state/public ownership of the means of production
>which means democratic socialism is just standard shit-tier socialism with a democratic facade
>socialism and capitalism are mutually exclusive:
>capitalism is privately owned production with free market competition
>which cannot be accomplished if all production is publicly owned

You might be talking about Bernie-tier socialism:
>Social democracy
>a regulated capitalist system, with democratic political philosophy and a strong welfare state
>the name sounds similar
>but Social Democracies and Democratic Socialism are also mutually exclusive
>Bernie says he is a Democratic socialist
>but that's because he is retarded, and doesn't know the proper name of his political movement
>or really anything about economics, at all
>AOC is a true Democratic socialist
>and completely retarded, in every way
>she is the far-left version of Trump
>without any redeeming factors

So yeah, you are retarded. If you have an actual rebuttal to anything I just typed, go for it. If it's just "Hur, Dur, you stoopid" then you'll just prove my point to everyone in this thread. Which might be the point, since you're likely a far-right troll trying to make the far-left look more retarded than it actually is.

Too bad that's your job to prove kiddo.

So why is it "tax the most wealthy" ?

Jews make up 1.4% of the total population but roughly half the billionaires in america. And no one seems to care. 'Oh well I guess they deserve it because nazis n stuff.'

You lazy fuck

>So then let them leave. If they're here taking all our money while giving nothing back then they are a parasite draining funds from our country.

Yeah, I hate niggers too.

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>low cost products
>cheap garbage
>wages to citizens
>chronically underpaid citizens who haven't seen wages keep up with inflation since the 1970ies

Oh yeah, I'm sure those corps are really the lifeblood of the American economy.

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Yeah no. Death and Taxes. You ain't getting out of either.

bernie owns three houses

chief warren owns only 1 house worth 5 mil

michael moore owns 9 houses

>fallacy
It’s a fallacy that it’s a fallacy.

The threat that “the rich will leave” is empty.
That’s not how supply/demand works.
If there is demand, then there will be people trying to supply for a profit.
If google doesn’t want to pay its taxes of the current market place and leaves , then a different search engine, one that does pay its taxes and can operate in the the current market place.
Google will then stop making money, and those taxes it never paid will be meaningless because now they are making zero profit as they are not operating within the market.

It’s America’s collective will to allow rich individuals off the hook for tax because the rich make the rules ( or at least , pay off the people who make the rules)
All it takes is the political will to try something different.

It’s weird that Americans are more able to imagine themselves in a post societal post-apocalypse MAD MAX future, than they are able to imagine themselves existing under a ‘slightly different” economic model.

The rich have you guys thoroughly cucked and infantilised, thinking you cannot exist without them. The opposite is true, they cannot exist with out your complicity

>fake
>and
>gay

thats like saying 'I bet you're going to say I an google to see if the WORLD IS ROUND' and then someone says 'yeah, actually you can.'

CALLED IT.

Except that's not how it works. Yeah in theory maybe it is (or should be) but the reality is somewhat different and money earned in one country doesn't necessarily stay in that country to be taxed.

Just remember all politicians (even the democratic socialists) are out for themselves and through either greed, malice or just plain incompetence will fuck over the average joe.

Nothing to prove, sport.
Just a fact to ponder says the picture.
Nobody is arguing that rich people do or dont have things rich people have.

Yeah that money is capable of being hidden so effectively because we've let the ultra-rich have an undue influence upon the works of government. Drag them from power and make it harder for them to hide all those billions of dollars.

Because the "most wealthy" are guys like Jeff Bezos. Who are sitting on billions and billions of dollars.

Its your argument shithead. I'm not gonna make it for you.

no, retard. even though I disagree on the 90% thing, they're talking about 90% once it's over an amount of money your dumb ass has never and will never sniff. Even filthy rich people will stay filthy rich, and if the filthy rich would play by the fucking rules and not stash their money off shores that they earn here, no one would be talking about rates that high to begin with.

True but the problem isn't capitalism, it's corruption. Too many people want to talk about pure communism, when that would spectacularly fail. The key is just the 'right' amount of regulation, but it's a precarious balance and it's hard to both find the answer and implement it. Especially when the powers that be have no reason to change anything. All politicians run on lies.

sooource

They continue to pay taxes like expats are required to.

This guy is claiming Michael Moore is poor. Just L O fucking L.

So you don't shop at walmart or any of the stores that pay minimum wage?

>doesn't necessarily stay in that country to be taxed.
So then we change that and make it harder for these fucks to shuttle their money around in some global shell game. It can be done.

>fact
Prove it.

So.
Does their own personal circumstance change the content of their argument?
>no it doesn’t
And all you are left with is you autosticly screeching “hypocrite” .

So what?
I was the crux of their argument that “they’re not hypocrites?” No. So them being hypocrite is not relevant to their argument.
Because protip - literally everyone is a hypocrite

We're not, no. But if people are talking about big changes and moving to democratic socialism why not talk about making a change that would actually be good for the average person? Abolish taxes, thereby curtailing government power and the people will benefit. After all governments are largely responsible for the worlds biggest problems and looking to those same governments to then fix those problems is insanity.

no he actually is doing pretty well

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...

success doesn't disqualify you from trying to help the less fortunate.

But that's his money already, so it cant be taxed as revenue.

Google does pay taxes. Like every business in america they can make deductions. But if you actually think that corporations or individuals can get away with paying no tax because they are rich then youre a huge moron. If their tax ends up being zero its because they had deductions, the same deductions some mom and pop business could use. Fuck, its literally painfull to watch some stupid fucking libtard spout off about something they havent got a fucking clue about. Dont let facts get in the way of your opinion, retard.

Whoever said anything about communism? I don't give a fuck about "isms". That's a bunch of semantic bullshit that I do not have time for. The facts are these. The 1% wealthiest have more wealth than the bottom 50%, and pay next to nothing in taxes. The tax burden is already pushed off onto the ever shrinking middle class. There is no reason not to tax them. We don't need to cater to them, we don't need to be worried about scaring them away. We need to break their power by enforcing the rule of law over fuckers who think they can get away with anything.

>claiming
Oh did I now? I don't suppose you can source that argument either can you?

Retarded.

The issue is we have a global economy with no global government.
we need MORE government , operating globally, so that there is no safe haven for the robber Barron billionaires

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Would military and police protection be voluntary too? Your right to vote is now for pay? Fuck off

No. As a matter of fact I do NOT shop at Walmart. Though occasionally I do buy McDonalds. And if you say McD's is going to abandon ship in the US because of high taxes, well it will just really make my night.

Prove socialism works and I'll prove anything you want.

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Good for you. I do, because it's cheap and I am good with my money.

How are google not going to be able to operate? Unless you're suggesting massive government over reach with regards to regulating and controlling the internet which is a path we really don't want to go down. As it stands now google already operates in tonnes of countries where it pays little to no taxes.

The rich, and companies, can and will leave. Its happened already in other cases and isn't some empty fear.

Also if you're saying the rich have the US cucked just now then all that is being proposed is that it would be the democratic socialists in government who would then be doing the cucking - they aren't going to make things better for the average person.

Jordan peterson already explained that.

Kek

>it’s der same as mom n pop

Wow, you’re fucking retarded.
Are mom n pop shuffling billions between overseas headquarters specifically to avoid paying tax within their operating countries?

Do mom n pop have business headquarters registered to a drawer in the Cayman Islands ?

No, you fucking retardation . It’s loopholes they are exploiting , and paying off politicians to keep the loop holes active ...the rich writing the rules for the rich.
Mom n Pop can’t afford it

I love it when brainlet faggots assume they know something and mouth off, while showing what an ignoramous they are..
Max Kek my retarded chumlet

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If you had to give away 90% of every dollar you made after 50,000 when would you stop working for the year?

By that same argument, Humans are responsible for wholly 100% of all of the world biggest problems so its insanity to believe that any group of humans would be capable of fixing those problems. That's not an acceptable excuse. The crippling problems of the average person are not caused by taxes, it just feels that way because you see it printed on every paycheck how much the government has collected. The problem is that these mega-corps that everyone is so eager to kiss the ass of, do not pay their employees a decent wage, drag their heels and kick and scream whenever anything is done to try and make them. If the top 1% actually paid their taxes then you probably COULD eliminate many of the taxes on the bottom 50% that people deal with.

By giving more power to corrupt politicians? No thanks. And yes AOC and Bernie are part of that group of corrupt politicans. They are not on your side.

And where did he get that money?

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Are mom n pop shops employing hundreds of thousands of people?

Are socialists immune to corruption?

What the fuck are you on about?

>same deductions

BULLSHIT

where is this retarded 90% coming from? No country has anywhere near that income tax rate

I never said it did. You're the one making claims about houses and incomes. Prove it.

Doesnt matter
Income tax is a tax on income.

You're advocating for more government and yet somehow I'm the retard? Governments are the ones who have waged war, committed genocide and caused mass starvation events but somehow more government is the answer.

Yeah sure you are. All the people who are really good with their money shop at Walmart.

You think government should be voluntary right?

Refer to the post that post was referring to.

>Corrupt politicians
Who said they get more power? Their power is defined by the constitution. There doesn't need to be big changes to the Consitution to enforce higher taxes on the ultra-rich.

Nobody is going to do your google search for you chief.
Open a new tab and search for "how many houses does michael Moore own"

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Yeah, an Income that came from the US.

>they (government) aren't going to make things better for the average person.
Again , utterly retarded.
You think that redirecting the stolen wealth of billionaires into public works and infrastructure won’t make peoples lives better?

Like I said , cuck, go suck an old rich guys cock - he’ll stiff you out of paying for it, and then declare himself legally dead for tax purposes while living in the Bahamas .

Billionaire literally siphon off the hard labour profits of countries within which they exist. A cleaning lady is more beneficial to the economy than a billionaire - the cleaning lady doesn’t periodically crash the economy due to their fuck-aboutery.

But , oh yeah, the rich have you blaming the governments for the crashes and not them... because, like I said, you’re a total cuck

United stasts Mr. Smartypants!

What the fuck do you mean "voluntary"

People who are good with their money tend to spend less on things when they can. That's what makes them good with their money.

But the difference is I'm not looking to those corporations to solve my problems. The democratic socialist collective is looking to the government to take over and "fix" everything.

Why should I make your argument for you? I'm having a grand time not doing what you say and calling you a liar and an Idiot. Feel free to prove me wrong, by showing me just how right you are.

Post her brown spic titties or I vote Trump in 2020.

>employing hundreds of thousands
So hundreds of thousands of people are having their hard work stolen by individual capitalists rather than the profit being ploughed back into society and public works.

>are socialists immune to corruption
No. But neither are capitalists.

And I'm sure its shopping at walmart that got guys like Bezos billions of dollars.

Too young.

>came
As in, in the past.
Already happened, and is therefore no longer income, and is not going to be taxed as part of income tax.

>But I do know what I'm talking about:
You sound like a huge fagot. Socialism is a placeholder and normalizer for communism, which is global jewish hegemonic rule over everyone and everything. You can pretend to know what you're talking about all you like. I'm sure you are constantly patting yourself on the back for how smart you feel you are. But at the end of the day, you're a mouth-breathing retard who is advocating the end of humanity because of "muh feelz".

Good job, fagot. Now go pretend to be smart among your little fagot echo chamber.

You are glowing, agent Fischer

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It's easy being generous with other people's money.

>having their hard work stolen

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If we raise taxes the government has more money to spend right? More money = more power for those deciding how its allocated. Universal and government ran healthcare also results in more power for those in government.

With great power comes great responsibility, since money is power and the rich are not responsible for anything they say or do - well... yeah the government is corrupt. shocker!

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>fix everything
Yes actually I would like the Government working towards the betterment of its peoples. Nobody expects the gov. to just wave its dick in the air and magically everything will be ok. That doesn't mean they shouldn't be working constantly to the betterment of its citizens. The most successful governments are the ones that actually succeed in taking care of their people. Ours doesn't even try to take care of anyone but the ultra rich.

You need to be at least 35 to be president you soy guzzling cum gurgling communist hippy faggot

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God bless President Alexandria Nigger-Cortez.

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Right. Your argument was that rich people are bribing corrupt politicians. And you admit that won't change, so that argument is gone.

People voluntarily work for walmart. Nothing is stolen, they can quit when they want.

>Governments are the ones who have waged war, committed genocide and caused mass starvation events
Reductive to the point of actual retardation.
They’ve also brokered peace, alleviated the plight of refugees , and helped feed the starving.

There’s nothing inherently evil about government. It’s the people operating within that government that shape it.

Iraq was a democracy
Iran was a democracy
Libya was a democracy
Russia is a democracy
Zimbabwe is a democracy

Yeah and he will make MORE in the future. From the US. As he's making that money, the Government takes its toll. When you get paid, its right there on your paycheck. The company takes some of the money they were going to send you, and sends it to the Feds. There's no reason that process can't be enforced on Bezos, if his money is being made here in the US. Which, a significant portion of it will be.

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Nope, but spending 50 at walmart for something that would have cost me 80 at a smaller place, over and over, is what bought me my car.

>all governments are the same
In that case, let’s have a socialist government

Obama taking credit for soaring US oil production when he was President is just as retarded if not more so.

The issue isn't Republican v Democrat its politicians versus Us.

"The rich will leave" is exactly what's happening in Sweden at the moment. Taxes are skyrocketing due to socialist policies, the currency is falling rapidly and big corporations and rich individuals are putting their assets/headquarters in other countries to avoid the shitshow.

Yeah, and we elect congressmen who will use that increased power in the ways we choose because they are our elected officials. If they do not they will get voted out of office. Their power has not increased individually, the power of the nation as a whole has grown.

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And by limiting your spending in other ways you can still have afforded that car. Walmart didn't buy you that car. If Walmart fucked off to Saudi Arabia, you could still afford a car.

>She actually looks good.
Every damn pic I see of her, she looks like a stupid horse.

That would never happen because that one guy didnt prove that rich people were rich to that other guy, so you're wrong because free college

If you had a reasonable argument you'd make it instead of resorting to calling me a cuck.

Also, how many people is that cleaning lady employing and supporting? The billionaire likely has thousands of employees that are earning a living and supporting their family as a result of being gainfully employed by said billionaire.

>No you can't eat at the table, you'll get the scraps off the floor and you'll fucking like it.

Unless everything I bought cost more.
Theres a term for that, it's called cost of living. If cost of living goes down, I get to buy more shit. If cost of living goes up, I can't buy as much shit.

>rich people are bribing corrupt politicians

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Governments don't work towards the betterment of the people though. Government is entirely self serving and politicians only seek to increase their power. Sure AOC and Bernie pay lip service to making things better and helping the average person but its not going to happen

Yeah, and the wages in this country have been adjusted for the cost of living in fucking years. Because the ultra-rich want to buy a new super yacht.

It’s always the economically illiterate that are the most vocal in these arguments.

Let’s break it down .

Profit is theft.
Capitalism works by profit. A capitalist (the owner of capital) employs workers to perform a task which adds value, and then sells on the fruit of that labour at a profit. They have therefore underpaid their workforce for that labour, as otherwise, they would not be able to charge a profit.
So the worker is underpaid for their work, and the consumer is over charged for the product - all so that the capitalist can siphon a profit from both.

In a functioning tax system, there would be no such thing as a billionaire.

You all have a fundamental misunderstanding of exactly how much money a billion dollars is.
There is no conceivable task which could be performed by a single person that would be worth a billion dollars.

Eat the rich

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waste of trips

So the ultra rich keep wages low?
Didnt walmart push for $15 minimum wage?
They did, because it would destroy small businesses who couldn't afford to pay it

That is why the public needs to hold the assholes in government accountable for their actions. The government doesn't work towards the betterment of the people because of the apathy and disinterest of the public. If they don't do their fucking jobs they get fired.

Trump 2020

And there you are being so vocal
Profit is gain, not theft.
In a free market transaction both parties profit, therefore your premise is wrong and your argument is garbage.

Eww.

It will happen 100%

>economically illiterate
>Profit is theft
You do know that everyone just stopped reading right there, right? Go to any economist and say those words, and see what their opinion is.

The government might have helped in some cases but those issues you highlight were almost undoubtedly caused by another (or in some cases the same) government.

Governments are inherently problematic as humans are inherently flawed and as you say its the people within government that shape it. The solution then is too limit government power as much as possible.

What's your point with the countries you list as democracies? (And many of them aren't / weren't real democracies and just have/had held sham elections).

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"they can quit when they want", yeah retard, because it's always that easy in real life
>sick of walmart's shit
>decide to quit
>whoops, looks like the walmart supercenter is the only employer in my town because they came in with incredibly low prices and outcompeted all of the stores in my small town and now they're all that's left
>guess I better ask for my job back

So fucking 11th grade.

All governments are shitty so instead of having one with massive power and over reach (like would happen with democratic socialism) why not have a government with as little power as possible?

She’s actually one of us on the low key. She’s for ever down with the clown.

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> 2028
Beat me to it.
She'll be out of the senate way before that. She caught a complacent incumbent off-guard, but is still very much subject to being primaried herself.

Except we've been electing our own congressmen for years and years and that hasn't happened. Why should it suddenly change just because they are rebranding as democratic socialists.

You're retarded as shit.

Because they get bought by pharma, insurance, and other bif business and you amerifats get bankrupted every time you go to the doctor or want to get a shitty degree

Amazon has $15 minimum wage and is also pushing for that federally.

What do you mean?

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Oh oh oh! And where does the magical 'gain' come from?

You are deluded thinking that the current U.S. economy is anywhere near "free-market". The ultra-wealthy have their businesses subsidized by the government via taxation.

And guess what? If we were to move to a "free market" system tomorrow, guess who would be on top and in control of everything?

Your premise is equally garbage, and doesn't stop to consider that the inequality has shifted so far that there is not a possibility for free market equilibrium for several generations. The rich will dominate, and the working man will be wrung out for all he is worth- its only the lucky few that break the cycle (as economic mobility has been down trending).

People are apathetic because shit doesn't change no matter who they vote for. Yes politicians should be held accountable but Id rather we just limit their power and have the people stop worshipping at the altar of statism.

>In a free market
It’s not a free market.
Protectionism and managed economies, tarrifs and taxes - the economy is carefully curated to benefit the few at the expense of the many

sure is boomer in here

>why not let immoral robber barrons who have no social conscience rule everything
Derp

But if they have no (or less) power there is no (or at least less) power to be bought and sold by big pharma et al.

Her slogan would be read my lips, No more cow farts.

The curation is necessary because purely free markets tend towards outcomes that are even worse for the many. People are not perfect theoretical economic agents. They're assholes. And in the absence of any regulation, assholes win.
Of course, when you regulate, that moves things to a meta-market of competing interests in the regulation system. But it does make it harder to subvert the market itself, when the system is designed and implemented properly.

>being so retarded that you think economics is a zero sum game

I'll try to put this in terms even you should understand:
>I make a MacGuffin
>it costs me one-days worth of ore from a miner
>and one day of labor, to make
>so is it only fair to charge/trade other people two-days worth of goods for it?
>no.
>if my MacGuffin has the effect of making Joe Schmo 500% more productive
>e.g. he now produces 5 widgets on one day, instead of 1 Widget per day
>I am increasing the value of his labor considerably
>in effect, making him inherently more wealthy
>so it would be fair if I charged more for my MacGuffins
>and every other market adjusts--
>MacGuffins are worth more than 2 days of labor
>and there is more demand for Ore
>so everyone along the chain gets more wealthy
>wealth is produced and distributed
>not stolen
>the ones that take the biggest risks end up with more
>but everyone wins

This is a simplified version of capitalism. And it works-- we all have smart phones, more food than we can eat, and a thousand other things that were unthinkable 100 years ago. Everyone is more wealthy, at every class level. While there are evils in capitalism (that can mostly be solved through regulation and welfare), those evils are nowhere near those produced in socialism.

that doesn't make any sense, explain your stupid logic?

>Are mom n pop shops employing hundreds of thousands of people
They would be - hundreds of thousands of mom and pops.
Only all the profit would be distributed amongst them to grow their own business and improve their own lives (ie facilitate the exchange of goods and services - money’s primary use) , rather than being stolen by 1 rich dude with more money than it is possible to spend in a lifetime to put into his offshore account

Only if she lets me fuck her feet

>There is no conceivable task which could be performed by a single person that would be worth a billion dollars.
This is a basic misconception by assuming economics is a zero sum game. A billion dollars today is like a million a couple hundred years ago. Part of that is inflation, but most of that is the immense increase in general wealth and the rise of the middle class.

By the time she's old enough to run she's gonna be ugly as fuck, spics age like milk.

>economically illiterate
>profit is theft
angry NEET wannabe hippie detected

Your mom used to say that too, but her lips were near her waist.

If you have a fixed monetary supply then yeah it's a zero sum game.
It gets more complicated when your realize that the increase in monetary supply to deal with the created value has to come from somewhere. The government isn't the primary driver here.

>guarentee what people need to survive, the rest is up to the market
That's a welfare state, not democratic socialism. Go take a basic civics class and econ 101, retard.

That shop is shitty as fuck

i'm voting for bernie or warren in 2020, if AOC ever runs for anything i can vote for in the next 40 years, i'll vote for her

You must be a special kind of retard if you think what I wrote was in support of socialism.

She pretty much is the left-wing Trump at this point with all the pearl-clutching outrage over everything she does, regardless of what it is. I think at one point a publication even tried to discredit her by saying she danced in the past. Both sides really need to take a step back and think about the retarded shit they complain about with Trump/AOC

Seriously, why? She's a bit of a mess of a politician. A few good ideas, largely borrowed from others, but generally... a mess.

tell you what if you can name a single politician who doesn't make my skin crawl, i'll reply to your next post

>regulation and welfare
what do you think she's trying to do, uproot all price levels so that everything is of equal value and price?

I've never heard anything to make me think she doesn't understand that capitalism DOES work, but as you said, there are evils that can be handled which she seems to understand very well.

fuckin hated hillary but id probably vote for her

Do they have to be a current, american politician?

yes, someone who i can vote for soon or sometime in the future

Okay, given I'm a foreigner this'll take a minute :)

What happens in the event of an economic collapse?

Rand Paul. You likely won't agree with his views most but he seems principled at least which is a rarity on both sides of the aisle. (He'll vote against republican proposals he disagrees with just as easily as Democrat proposals).

Or how about Tulsi Gabbard?

well too bad, except for Illhan Omar I don't see anyone else on the horizon who would make me excited

Congress is full of them.

...is a phrase that will never be uttered.

But AOC is suggesting a wealth tax. Wealth dries up.

Ilhan Omar makes you excited? She's a complete POS.

mods need to stop using trips to start their gay ass bait threads. anyway, this really made me laugh. she's fucking retarded. she's nothing but an irritating parrot of anti-establishment garbage.

So you're of the radical progressive persuasion huh?
I gravitate more towards the traditional left. Rather anti-environmental and anti-identitarian.

>fixed monetary supply
It doesn't matter, either way. Money is a representation of something else-- ultimately it is a placeholder for goods and labor-- wealth, in other words. So the number assigned to it is irrelevant to the total amount of wealth.

We have exponentially more food, knowledge, goods, safety, etc. than any generation before us. Per capita. The majority of the world is out of poverty for the first time ever. The middle class is rising in every part of the world, other than the West (due to poor policies). All while the wealth divide is becoming wider than ever. These are not things that happen if wealth is a zero sum game.

Wealth can be created. A smartphone generates wealth for its maker, and productivity for its user. The maker sells it for more than it cost them to produce, and the user gains more value from it than they spent. Both sides profit, or one side would refuse to participate.

Americunts and their obsession for ugly goblinas instead of real hotties. Pic very relates.

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Rand Paul sold out a long time ago, he supported the same kind of imperialism that Obama was into and refused to audit the fed.

Tulsi Gabbard might have the same kind of positions as Bernie and Warren but she's too new on the scene. Tulsi should go into the house or senate so I can have her as president later. we can have presidents Bernie, Warren, Gabbard and Ocasio-Cortez all in due time

nice ad hom

God dammit can we please just see the nude leaks already? The real ones from college, not the fake bullshit.

trad left candidates like... stalin and lenin?

>I've never heard anything to make me think she doesn't understand that capitalism DOES work
Well then, here's a quote:
>"Capitalism is an ideology of capital — the most important thing is the concentration of capital and to seek and maximize profit. To me, capitalism is irredeemable."

To be fair, she really doesn't understand what she's saying. She contradicts herself constantly. Basically, she's fucking retarded and in over her head. If you want to elect an ignorant retard, go ahead. I mean, she took economics in college and was either too dense to understand or just ignored all of it. But I would actively vote against her, almost regardless of who was running.

Tulsi is in the house. But if the likes ok Bernie or Warren get in before her then we're frankly too far fucked at that point that even some reasonable like Gabbard isn't going to be able to repair the damage.

>trad left candidates like... stalin and lenin?
Hah no.
I am a big fan of what Gough Whitlam and Don Dunstan did, locally here in AU. The US never really had the same kind of leftism that I can tell, the civil Rights era and then neoliberalism fucked things over.
I spose Carter had some of that in him but didn't really have the charisma and political clout to make it work.

Warren and Bernie are not unreasonable. In fact Bernie and Warren are compromise candidates. Fox news might call them marxist communists but what theyr'e advocating for are more like Adam Smith era economics.

In fact most nations in the world have the basic safety net they're advocating for. Do you really think America is incapable of accomplishing single payer healthcare?

Go to bed spanky it's way past your bed time.

They are hypocrites though, that's the big issue and what they are advocating is nothing like Adam Smith economics or even "Classic Liberalism".

And yes, I do have zero faith that the US gov't could implement a single payer system. Governments are inherently inefficient at best and outright corrupt at worst. They should not be given any more power. Honestly, think for a minute about most of the interactions you are forced to have with the government (any branch or service) and then tell me that those are the same people you want providing your healthcare.

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no they aren't hypocrites

sounds like your brain is full of garbage from conservative news

most nations in the world have single payer, have lower healthcare costs and have a longer life expectation than the USA

these facts dont care about our feelings

They are also taxed out their asses

Can I see your tax returns?

Fake and gay
>audi
>supercar
Pick one

people dying from lack of healthcare don't care about that. Only a handful of conservative donors do

is that guy president? no? who cares

Amerifags consider basic human empathy to be “loony leftism”

Morally bankrupt nation full of arseholes, who’ll be the first up against the wall when the revolution comes

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>taxed out of our asses
We pay less and receive a better quality healthcare.
We consider it a bargain and removed the profit motive from healthcare providers

>removed the profit motive from healthcare providers

this is the real genius of the single payer system. healthcare is an inelastic commodity (see: basic economics)

it makes more sense to socialize inelastic commodities like Water, Food and Healthcare

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Most nations on the earth are not like the US. Trying to implement a sustainable system for Denmark is completely different from trying to implement a sustainable system for the entirety of the EU AND everybody who comes flowing into it.
Also this "high life expectancy is due to socialized healthcare" is a fucking meme ignoring all the actual factors that contribute to longer lifespans and have since long before any of these systems were established.
Outside of injuries, it's babies and the elderly who go to the doctor constantly, when you are old/have cancer/heart issues they may be able to keep you going a few extra shitty years. Your health is dependent on your lifestyle.

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I'd pay to see Big Hoss fuck AOC

Meanwhile Singapore is a multicultural nation, it instituted single payer healthcare long after nations like Denmark did, yet it still achieves a better quality of life than the USA does while having a higher density population.

Frankly there is no argument for why the USA is incapable of achieving such a thing. Either you don't have faith in America and you should get out or you are preying on Americans with your private healthcare system and you should get out.

It wouldn't be a debate.

probably because the guy on the right doesn't run for office and the US Representative from New York, Alexandia Ocasio-Cortez doesn't have to debate anyone who isn't running for US Representative in Her District ;^)

When the only people at the table are rich and they're making decision that affect the poor, there's something wrong.

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>republic
>of the people
>by the people
>for the people

actually i've never thought that the people are all the necessary to the functioning of a republic and also democracy is bad and furthermore *farts*

Huh, I thought the poor could vote. My bad.

Also, what's wrong with successful people being in charge? Seems smarter to have them versus pot smoking losers.

piranha teeth

I'm a different user, but you're being an idiot. I have no idea if those numbers are accurate, but the point is all 3 of them are rich, which not only should be blindingly obvious, its trivial to verify.

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This is a real xray

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if inheriting wealth wasn't a thing sure, why not, but as it stands when you let people inherit infinite money you get people like trump and his retarded faggots

kek

wait bill clinton had sex?? this is very disconcerting ._.

Oh summerfag, you know not what you say. Nigger fuck

No, that's pretty much exactly wrong. Thomas Sowell knows his shit, and has a lot of experience speaking in public. AOC is mostly known for being the lefty version of Donald Trump, who keeps saying stupid things.

We're not talking about voting, we're talking about people setting policy, making decisions, and being given a platform to voice their views.

1 in every 7 $ spent on US healthcare, goes straight into the offshore fund of one man, who controls the health insurance industry.

In a just world , he’s be burned at the stake

It's okay, Billy Clinton only banged fuglies

the government isnt omnipotent, how can they guarantee any of that? i thought the world was going to end in 12 years, how about the omnipotent government take care of that shit before they start trying to be my fucking nanny.

Shows what a 3rd world America is.
In any civilised nation these precepts are the absolute bare minimum .
I’m amerifag , basics like food/shelter/life are considered luxuries

well why isnt thomas sowell president then

sounds like the tommy guy is a loser

no, food/shelter/life comes under the idea of being a "grown up" and "personal responsibility".

mommy gave you those things when you were a kid, by now you should have a "job" and provide these things for yourself.

It’s why there’s armies of homeless begging for change in every city,
Why their bankruptcy rates are so high, because people can’t afford To become sick.
They have some of the worst teeth in the developed world , because they can’t afford dentistry.

Their solution to these problems ?
Ignore them.
Problem solved

See ?

Utterly morally bankrupt

Nah, all out shit troll. Don't even mind biting. By the time she's able to run for president, she'll be a used up hag. She's in the democrat party, she's a worked over whore, she's just good at making it look like she's not. In a few years, it will have no choice but to show through. These skags have short shelf lives.

if gubment handed you everything you wanted, why should anyone do anything to better themselves?

see

morally bankrupt.

And the sick, the disabled?
Sacrificed to the alter of profit.

USA USA USA

At the cost of freedom, and everything you will ever be in life. Only the elite will ever actually have any of the things that make life worthwhile, while the rest slave away for food (if it's available), healthcare, and a dump to call home.

... you and your moving goalpost "everyone" turns into "sick or disabled"

you aint worth my time.

If billionaires are already rich , why do they keep working ?

Make up your own mind
youtube.com/watch?v=bOMksnSaAJ4

Guarantees it's citizens safety nets by stealing from other citizens. Democrat Socialism just uses currency to undermine capitalism as a way to implement communism. It's no different.

Good luck not selling your products to the biggest consuming nation in the history of human civilization. If you want to shrink your consumer base and make less money, go for it. You'll still have to pay relative taxes wherever you go.

My first comment, faggot
Admit you are losing the argument

Because they want to get richer. Even if you have money, more is powerful motivator.

Why pick one when they work so well together in almost every civilized industrial nation in the world?

Oh,
To quote you
“More money is a powerful motivator”

Is an axiom for billionaires but not ordinary people?
Protip - billionaires are ordinary people who , through luck and privilege, have a bigger bank account

i dunno, as a white person i'm not sure i should be listening to a nigger

can't i just hit him and make him pick cotton?

>work well
At the expense of poorer nations.
We need someone to grow the cocoa, sugar, coffee etc and pay then basically nothing for it so that a profit can be made on those commodities in the west

>Is an axiom for billionaires but not ordinary people?
Why would you think that?

And while there is an element of luck and privilege in wealth, those are hardly the only elements.

Yeah, funny how giving your average joe a basic income means he’ll stop working , but give billionaires more money than they can physically spend in a single lifetime and all of a sudden “more money is a powerful motivator”

I think you're a man born out of your time.

Jump forward in time about 30 years, and see if you fit in better..

>hose are hardly the only elements.
The biggest determining factor in whether you are a billionaire or not is “were your parents billionaires?”

Yeah , fuck off with your “hard work and smarts”

When you are rich enough , you literally cannot fail

5 individual families control more wealth than 50% of America combined

Doesn’t matter if he’s president or not.

The problem isn’t that we can’t afford these social programs, the problem is that the wealth to pay for it is concentrated into the hands of a few individuals.

In a functional tax system , this would never have been allowed to happen

You don't have any idea what you're talking about.

>In 1984, less than half the people on The Forbes 400 were self-made; in 2018, 67% of the 400 created their own fortunes.
forbes.com/sites/luisakroll/2018/10/03/the-forbes-400-self-made-score-from-silver-spooners-to-bootstrappers

Eat the rich

It's actually just 3 individuals now.
The 3 Richest Americans Hold More Wealth Than Bottom 50% Of The Country

Mainstream Media believing retarded faggot

>self made billionaires
No such thing