So abortion, yea or nah?

So abortion, yea or nah?

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Not my body, not my choice.

yea

Life begins at conception, the zygote which will eventually become a fetus has a unique genetic identity and as such is a unique human being. Therefore abortion should be outlawed as it is no different than murder.

The baby sure doesn't give a shit. Kill it. Yea

it has to still be INSIDE the body to abort. this doesn't look like it is still inside a girls uterus

Yes, but only if between 12 and 18 months AND no witnesses.

War is murder, but I bet you're ok with that one.

it's awwright

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In many states, you can murder any intruder in your home. What is the big difference ?

Of course if that must be

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>implying that shoving the little bastard up its mom's vag would be a problem whatsoever

Good luck to put it back in her uterus, tho.

Beautiful, replying to my argument with a non-argumentative deflection. Death occurs in War, you are correct, however that is completely irrelevant to my position. Provide an argument.
How is my “opinion” incorrect? Provide an argument.
False equivalency. A woman is not a home, furthermore the fetus being introduced is more than likely the result of a voluntary action, ie having sex, ie reproduction. As such, given that the risk was known and is present, the presence of a fetus is consentual. An intruder comes in with a lack of permission, unless its in the case of rape, you effectively give permission by engaging in sex as it is the primary function of the action.

kill

yep pro choice

I'm pointing out your hypocrisy. Death doesn't 'happen' in war- people kill people. Just like abortion. See, I'm agreeing with you about conception, but it's not ok to be cool with one kind of murder and not cool with the other. My argument is that you should iron out your morality or stfu.

mate big words don't make you any more intelligent
"non-argumentative deflection"
fucker he literally makes it as simple as possible; you condone death in one form, but not in another. it's a contradiction

It is not this thread's responsibility to educate you.

Bitches and niggas need to take more responsibility. Abortion is a choice one should be able to make: but how about you don't be a dumb fuck and pullout?

Once again, your argument is predicated on assuming what my position on War is, rather than asking me what it is. You are trying to make the claim that I condone death in war, which i do not. My position/argument was never about War, it was about Abortion. Address that argument.
Read above. I never mentioned War to begin with, it is a deflection.
You are uneducated, had you been educated, you would provide an argument and not a childish opinionated statement.

It depends on the case.

There are two types of people

1. Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data

Here's an argument for you. We're overpopulated. What does anyone do with a deer population that's grown too large? You cull it. It's simple. To think we're anything other than a group of animals is hubris.

> you're only educated if you prove that you're intelligent by debating me on this website for Chinese cartoons
And if anyone is to even willing to *attempt* to argue with you, you whip out your thesaurus and start saying shit like "non argumentative deflection"

Shit wait this should have been my response it was more concise.

Honest abortion should only be an option if:
A: the child will have life threatening disabilities or birth defects that will hinder its ability to mature and develop
B: the mother's life cannot be saved during child virth even with modern medicine
or
C: the pregnancy is the result of rape or illegal incest (such as sexual abuse by a family member)

Forgive my poor spelling and grammar, im a little drunk

Totally different DNA, therefore it is a separate being and NOT the mother’s body. Therefore abortion is murder.

yes

being pro-life is a self-righteous position from a naive sense of morality

life is not sacred. children's futures are the very first things to go with budget cuts, and forcing people to have children when they don't want to is wrong.

of course in an ideal world there would be no abortion, but as of now it's a necessary countermeasure against a lack of fool-proof contraceptive tech. if you say "dOn'T hAvE sEx LoL" i'm going to assume you're a turbo virgin.

The moral shouldn't be "DON'T HAVE SEX" it should be "DON'T KNOCK SOMEONE UP UNLESS YOU HAVE A STABLE JOB DIPSHIT"

A: We all have imperfections. They don't make life not worth living. And just because you would be miserable with (insert birth defect here) doesn't mean people with that birth defect are actually miserable. They may even be happier than you.

B: This never happens. Hasn't happened since abortion as a medical practice started.

C: There's no point in having an incest exception - nobody will use it. Who is going to send their daughter they got pregnant into an abortion clinic to admit they banged their dad and need an abortion? They'd just get arrested. If anything, they'd just say they got raped and don't know by whom. And if the girl wasn't a willing participant in the sex, then it's just rape anyway. Incest is irrelevant here.
So, for rape: Why not just take the plan B contraceptive pills right after the rape? The cops should give them to you when you report the rape. Then no pregnancy unless you also get abducted for more than 72 hours. And then you have to escape before your captor beats you so bad it forces a miscarriage anyway. There's like 0% of cases this actually applies to, so what's the point?

I know people like this. Their mind is usually made up before you even say anything.

He'll grow into that face.

Or don't have sex with somebody you can't handle marrying and raising a kid with.

>inb4 single motherhood is just fine and I turned out alright.
>(good for you. You're in the 1%. Enjoy being shot by one of the other 99% for the change that's rattling around in your pocket)

Are you really saying there have been no deaths related to childbirth in recent times?

I'll have you know i was raised by my mom and my father. And my father is also my birth father.

unfpa.org/maternal-health
>But in spite of these gains, some 830 women still die every day from causes related to pregnancy or childbirth.
who.int/bulletin/volumes/93/3/14-148627/en/
>Between 1990 and 2013, the maternal mortality ratio for the USA more than doubled from an estimated 12 to 28 maternal deaths per 100 000 births

Exactly. It's not worth it.
"Apply to my impossible standards for what does and does not count as a valid argument" is some Shapiro level self- aggrandizing.

>the zygote which will eventually become a fetus has a unique genetic identity and as such is a unique human being.

Lies, DNA variants between two people aren't that complex. Have more than 5 children and you'll see how they all look the same.

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>the only person who can force an incel pregnancy is a father with his daughter, and a father is the only person who can act as a guardian to have that baby aborted
>abuse survivors just need to report ot to the police
> the only reason you can't report it is being beaten too much, which will abort the baby anyway
Are you sixteen years old or just legitimately this ignorant.

Well the litmus test is whether it challenges his position in a way he's not prepared to refute. If he has rebuttals ready, then fire away. If not, then the argument must be a deflection or invalid or whatever bullshit excuse he has for trying to rule out anything that might actually force him to think outside is set position.

When murder becomes legal then yay.

"related" makes that a weird argument. Put it this way: How many deaths "related" to childbirth would have been prevented if the child were killed in the womb and then removed? (Not talking about the child never existed in the first place)

Of course yes, why would I have to pay for a baby with my taxes when not even momma wants it.

You already know the ones I speak of revere Shapiro, Peterson, and Jones.

Go to bed you troll

looks like it's in pain

You're making the case against pregnancy, not for abortion. How many of those deaths were women who couldn't get an abortion? None. That's talking about women who were trying to have a child and were given poor care or the doctors didn't notice something was wrong until it was too late.

lol

>unique = wild variations

idiot.

>never
>said
>any
>of
>that

Haha, exactly. I'm semi-shocked to see someone on Yea Forums who actually understands any of this. Im used to talking to the fifteen year olds for lack of something better to do.

most, if not all you dipshit.

Base it on personhood, not life or dna
>personhood: the ability to experience the world and maintain memories, as a person
>design a scientific test based on brain waves to determine if higher functions are present in the fetus
>if they are, it's a person
>no abortion for you
>if it is not, go see doctor deletus
>he'll annihilate your fetus
>no questions asked, no guilt
>personhood will start around 18-22 weeks in most cases

What about rape/incest?
>there will be no exceptions for rape or incest
>the things that happen to you in your life should not determine the personhood status of anyone else
>including a fetus
>if the fetus experiences the world, as limited as it is able, and has memories
>too late
>see doctor deletus before this happens
>the alternative to this is not a solution
>it is the allowance of murder due to circumstances
>and those circumstances have literally nothing to do with the individual being killed

What about a severely deformed fetus?
>probably has shit-tier or no brain waves
>abort it if that's the case
>if it's not, get the abortion before it is a person
>~20 weeks is enough time to figure this shit out

What if the mom will die?
>default to the more developed person, if that's what she wants

What if the doctor doesn't want to do it?
>forcing a doctor is retarded
>just go to doctor deletus, he's game

What about some adult in a coma, is he a person?
>maybe
>if it's likely they will recover brain function
>and there are memories stored in their brain
>you have to default to keeping them alive
>if they won't recover, they are not a person
>they are a fucking potato
>pull the plug

It’s not an argument, I am bringing attention to a wild claim by asking a rhetorical. But, I see what you mean. “Are you really saying there have been no deaths DURING childbirth in recent times” would have been less ambiguous. Of course ‘deaths’ referring to the mother.

Sure. It's the lifeforce of the baby itself that's killing the mother. Killing it restores her lifeforce. Duh. What was I thinking?

Put it this way. I would hate to be the child that was brought into a world where i was unwanted but was made to love with the parents that were forced to keep me because of a "religious" law made up by a bunch of men that don't understand poverty of the struggles of parent hood. I now have to live my life either going from foster home or adoption agencies. Maybe they're abusive parents that now struggle even more financially due to my birth. Will the state help this poor child? Doubt it. But at least they saved another life, that can struggle on in a world that didn't want it in the first place.
Or hopefully I'm one of the lucky ones.
Fact is, once that child is born. The government doesn't give a Damn anymore. They've denied that woman a right to chose. In their eyes, they've done their job well.

You're right, sorry. You didn't say those things. I used Yea Forums's quote system to misattribute things to you.
It's a behavior people on Yea Forums use to replace what you actually said with what you meant.

Only households that have a stable income and both parents in the picture should be able to breed.

bleh. most cis people that pass along the gift of life are toxic anyway

People that use the term cis are typically fucking retarded so their opinion is irrelevant

>Only households that have a stable income and both parents in the picture should be able to breed.
right. we should offer people short term wealth in exchange for going into clinic and getting sterilized.

it's just a word to get a point across. you know what I mean when i say toxic cis people

I don't know what cis is

"Has a unique genetic identity and as such is a unique human bean"

By this logic, identical twins are okay to kill. Or at least, you can kill one of them. After all, until you do, they are not unique human beans and therefore, not of value. Right?

Lurking is often just fine for me. But every now and then I feel the need to chime in. Glad to give you some reassurance in the collective mentality.

I honestly have no fucking clue what cis means I just know snowflakes and trans retards use it all the time

hard yes cause otherwise I'd be a dad right now. no fucking regrets

must be bait but I will bite.
you seriously think that if a woman has some defects that doesnt allow them to have children safely OR if the baby inside her has some defects that will kill her if not aborted in time, abortion will not save the life of the mother?
also worth mentioning as you said, all those deaths from birth complications happens without the outright ban of abortions, hence they want a child so bad they go through it despite the dangers. with consent.
What you say is: if a woman gets pregnant and if she has a condition that cause her to die during (probably stillbirth) they must just accept their death sentence without the pure CHOICE of aborting the child.

Bring back eugenics. The world is overcrowded and we should not let humans who would have died at birth it left to nature continue to be allowed to live.
What is a chair ridden mental retarded going to give to this world other than a huge cost financially and mentally to it's parents?

How fucking dense are you? Much of the danger is when the baby comes out.

You really know nothing about identical twins because they aren't 100% alike therefore they are unique go to bed or go play fortnite faggot

True identical twins are the closest thing to natural clones. They developed from the same singular genetic material.

There are billions in the world. Why would we force people to have more? Why haven't they banned masturbation yet. Technically sperm are also alive. There's a potential of millions of babies flushed down the toilet.

This: I was born simply because my mom wasn't allowed to abort. Her family pressured her to not give me up for adoption and "helped" her raise me.
The same story with my sister. We were both abused, sexually and otherwise.
Sister and I had a sexual relationship since before we hit puberty and it was normal, natural for us.
We both ended up in foster care.
We were abused in that system until we aged out. Our last foster parents were our only good ones. They let us live with them when we aged out until we could live on our own.
Both of us were not able to form any kind of good relationship except for each other.
We are now living together as a perverse form of husband and wife.
I am in a support group for incest survivors, I am even a sponsor.
My sister is getting therapy for her pedophilic tendencies.
I am for the right to choose. "But you would have never been born if..." SHUT UP! I am grateful for the life I currently have.
If I was aborted, I would have never existed. Neither of us would have. None of the crap we endured would have been needed to be overcome.
My mother would have likely had a better life without growing two unwanted babies inside her and then being pressured into a forced motherhood situation.
The good I do is to help people that was the shitstorm that was my life, many of them had a preventable shitstorm of a life just like me.
Anti-abortion people are not pro-life. They are pro-birth.

Yeah, kids are obnoxious

Fuck off faggot
Pro-life people are not just "pro-birth"

What kind of society will we create if we just allow pregnacies to be thrown away for any reason?
More promiscuous sex, breaking down of the nuclear family, more STDs, a more nihilistic culture in general.

The shitty behavior your mom was engaging in to result in your accidental birth will only be more prevalent in a society that allows abortion.

uninstall virus

Innocence

Not her body either, the fetus is not a body part of her's

kek

>So abortion, yea or nah?
Yeah.
But by now you should be old enough to abort yourself.

Damn, you know you think about these scenarios (like I did above) but you almost forget that there are people out there living them. I'm glad you're able to have used your past to help others get through similar situation but I wish you never had to in the first place. You sound like your a strong willed person, to have come this far. Fact is not many people can cope with all that and may end up taking the possible easy route out. Just a prolonged death sentence with unmentionable suffering in between.

You are so narrow minded it actually makes me sad that there are parents that have birth to people like yourself. It's people like you who eventually cause more deaths and sorrow for people that these pretend lives you're trying to save.

People will have sex, you idiot.
Pro-life people ARE just "pro-birth".
If you want to NOT be just "pro-birth", the very stupidest way to do it is anti-abortion laws. The stupidest.
Also, that goes on the assumption that the political spin is correct... that people wanting abortions are gleefully scraping babies out of their bodies who put no thought into it.
If you take away RESPONSIBLE choices, like abortion, to people who KNOW they are not suited for motherhood, you create an environment that breeds even more bad decisions and a black market for abortion.

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>Fact is not many people can cope with all that and may end up taking the possible easy route out. Just a prolonged death sentence with unmentionable suffering in between.
can say that about all human life...

one thing i will say is mother nature usually gives her best gifts tonew life. i've seen blehhh women produce quality children.

but god damn being aound functional retards brng out some killer instincts in me. round and round we go i suppose

yes if they are black and poor wiff no education
no if its just a spoiled white girl who is just lazy

>cis
>toxic
God I hope all of you fucking leddit cunts kill yourselves soon.

Suicides (easy way out) happens a lot. The thing is, most are not. Most grow up toxic, sure... almost all. Force something to happen against one's hard-thought decision and it's rarely good.
One of the ones I sponsor is really resisting being a form of a vigilante killer. He's a moral absolutist. I'm teaching him grey areas. I also got him into anger management.
Another one I sponsor hates parents ('breeders"), saying they are the source of all evil and lies. She is raising her own father's baby... a baby she gave birth to. My sister and I are pretty much raising that child. We are trying to make her more accepting of being a mom, being such a long-term "babysitter" is taxing on both of us.
As for my being "strong-willed", thanks. I'm not, really. I take things one day at a time and I put my faith in a higher power. Doing things day by day makes things much easier.

World is overpopulated anyway so ye

But birth rate is going down anyway

I believe in abortion for one reason only. It’s mostly democrats and low life scum that get them... I have no problem with this at all.

This.
Prohibition has never worked. People will find a way.
No woman happily goes and gets an abortion. It's a last resort for many.
It's funny how a guy can father hundreds of children and never has to lift a finger or take responsibility but one bad choice for those women and they have to live with the consequences for the rest of their lives.

jesus, the last one must have been able to walk out of that pussy

/b and /pol
>death to all niggers, sandniggers and jews
also /b and /pol
>you can't kill unborn, they're innocent

Um, I think you contradicted yourself there, chief.

Trolling begins at conception too, when the mutant begins.

Faggot

I’m all about other people killing their own children and euthanizing themselves. Get the fuck off my planet

who really cares. for most of the pregnancy they're mindless cell factories.

Newborns aren't sentient, I think babies that are too unhealthy to survive without medical intervention should be allowed to die. Our animal emotions make it hard to give up on our offspring and we suffer grief over their loss, but very early in life and very late in life are the best times to die. Very early you haven't lived or experienced enough to value your life (and your mind isn't developed enough) and very late life becomes unhappy and pointless. Low infant mortality is neither natural nor good for the gene pool. I'm not looking at this as a sociopath, I'm just being logical about unpleasant realities. I think in order for society to be good we need to value human life above all else, but the reality is human lives have finite value and treating everyone as deserving the same chance to live creates problems. People have shitty values though and are illogical (racists on this board are a prime example) so its dangerous to try to formulate policies that cover these issues because some asshole with an agenda will ruin it.

I support abortion, not because of "my body my choice" bullshit (by that logic pregnant women can drink alcohol) but because I don't think there's any harm in killing a fetus, and doing so can prevent a lot of problems.

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Yes, because people who put ear rings on infants should be aborted postnatal.

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All those daughters and only one of them is hot.

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Life begins in my nutsack, are you gonna deny that my sperm are alive? Are gonna demand a law to prevent me from washing millions of lives down the drain every day?

Yeah.

Imagine being distracted from the real issues by dumb shit like this.

She looks exactly like the ones on far left and far right

Did you not see the one with the yellow bow in her hair?

Sex is for reproduction. If you want to have the pleasure of it, use protection. There is still a risk, so if you get pregnant, the father should have a say in his creations fate.