Imagine the rage this bracket would have caused if something like this happened now

>Whatcuckture "Why does Vince hate WCW wrestlers" think piece

Stop being contrarian for the sake of it. Who the fuck would rather watch a Val Venis or Rikishi match over a Benoit or Guerrero match?

I don’t really have a problem with it.
Eddie pre 2002 wasn’t anything special and Rikishi beating Benoit is more than believable.

fair enough, for at least in wwf. starting with Jericho vs Kurt is pretty dumb

Not everything is about having the best workrate. Geez.

I actually rewatched that whole show a couple of months ago. It was a really nice time when workrate wasn't the main focus. Don't get me wrong I like all those guys like Eddie and Jericho and I enjoy wrestling outside of WWE for the wrestling itself, but the short matches and story telling is such a nice change from watching a bunch of 20 minute plus matches all the time.

What does Venis or Rikishi offer that is so unique? That Benoit and Guerrero didn't have?

Maybe they were saving matches? You can't put all your matches on one show. They fumbled the tournament a bit though

characters
gimmicks

Character. Atleast more than Benoit.

RIkishi had size and was ridiculously over with Too Cool.
Venis had worked hard for several years and was deserving of a push, which he got with the IC title that year.
Benoit headlined the PPV the month after this fucking show so he wasn't be wasted exactly, and Eddie was doing great things with the Latino Heat gimmick with Chyna.
It all worked out in 2000.

I mean booking wise it didn't really matter considering Benoit headlined the next ppv for the belt but Rikishi was surprisingly over around that time and got a really great babyface reaction for his character every single night. It was a simple story. Benoit beats the everliving shit out of Rikishi after the match and makes it through to the end just for Angle to pick up a cheap ass win, building him up heat wise for when he'd win the belt later in the year. That part was the right move.

Although Eddie was fairly over at that point too and the shit he did with Chyna was pretty entertaining. He should have went over Venis. Although in the weird backwards universe that was WWF 2000, Rikishi actually got bigger reactions than Eddie during that time believe it or not.

I agree years later that Benoit and Eddie are superior in every way but in terms of the time they were in and the stories they were trying to tell, they had people with better character work that fit the rolls better.

Wasn't Eddie hurt at this point in 2000? I remember he had the huge elbow protector on during the year

Val Venis and Rikishi had a fucking BASED match in 2000 though, the one where Rikishi jumped off the cage. This is one of those "you had to be there" things, Benoit and Jericho were still pushed pretty hard in general that year, just not on this night.

based and 2000WWFpilled

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Fully Loaded 2000
What a great show.

You guys all know that Rikishi and Val were very good wrestlers, were very over, and had charisma, right? That was one of the great things about 2000, they had an incredible variety of talent and new stars.

Pretty Vince sticking it wcw guys again

Honestly. Newer fans give the attitude era a lot of shit for the lack of workrate but it was genuinely an amazing time for wrestling. I got sick of WWE's current shit so I went back and watched a bunch of Raws and PPV's from then and it's crazy. I'm usually a workrate mark too enjoying NJPW and NXT on the regular but WWF in 2000 is something completely unique and awesome with characters that will never be replicated. There's a lot more to wrestling than just wrestling.

When did you become a wrestling fan?

Because they drew dimes while ratings plummeted during Benoit and Guerrero's world title runs.

Hulk Hogan drew dimes too would you rather watch a Hogan match? You're not a promoter what do you care who draws dimes? Don't you want to watch good wrestling?

There is more to wrestling. Hogan brought a lot of things that many wrestlers couldn't. Many wrestlers are better than the Rock but how many could create an atmosphere like him?

Tens of thousands paid to see Andre vs Hogan. So that isnt good wrestling according to whom?

I'd rather watch good characters that get the crowd popping and create an exciting environment rather than watch manlets do gymnastics and pretend that what they're doing is "badass."

This always sends contrarian anti-smarks into a seethe.
Their programming doesn't let them think in terms of what's actually good to watch. They just run the numbers and decide whether to like something.
A truly pitiful existence.

I agree there is a lot more to wrestling however shit that draws isn't inherently good.

>So that isnt good wrestling according to whom?
Most wrestling fans I think. Hogan V Andre is iconic and I respect it for that but as far as in wrong work goes it's pretty bad.

When I was a really little kid. I was like 2 or 3 when all of this happened during the attitude era but my family recorded a lot of Raw's, Smackdown's, a little bit of WCW, and PPV's on VHS from the so I grew up with it. I remember bits and pieces so going back over it now is pretty nostalgic. I stopped watching around 2004 I want to say and started again in 2010, started watching non WWE companies (Not named TNA) around 2014. I mostly wanted to go back and watch it all over again to see if things were as good as I remember and if things were truly better back then than now and sure enough it is.

This.

The ONLY thing that matters in wrestling are STARS

But people were invested in the broken friendship of Hogan and Andre, Andre ripping off Hogans cross etc. Then Hulkster slamming Andre down. Isnt that was wrestling is all about, evoking emotions? Rather than have two athletic dudes just exchanging crips wrestling maneuvers without no backstory or compelling character traits.

>Isnt that was wrestling is all about, evoking emotions?
Build up and getting the fans invested is without a doubt important but I think the actual quality of the wrestling is pretty important too no? I hate flippy shit vanilla midgets as much as the next guy but there is a balance between being a charismatic star and a quality in ring worker that every wrestler should strive for. I think The Rock was the total package in this regard

>have Michaels and Undertaker
>end with Mabel vs Savio

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Rock isn't really a great 'worker' in the sense that modern smart marks think. He can do a few things but he's an exceptional performer. He's basically a good athlete and mediocre wrestler, and yet he has a long list of classic matches.

True. But you got to have variation which we barely have at all these days. Superkicks and suicide dives every other match and everything looks so coreographed. Agreed, Rock vs Triple H for example is great match with it still looking like a fight between to larger than life stars. But then you can also have certain matches built like a spectacle such as mentioned Andre vs Hogan which is not neccessarily about the moves and "work" so to speak.

Much of todays wrestling might be technically sound but it lacks that emotional investment, thats not what a lot of people try to sell as the focal point anymore which is wrong IMO.

1995 Undertaker was not much better than Mabel, and he was worse than Savio.

>mediocre wrestle
This is a meme among smarks Rock was an exceptional worker especially for a star of his caliber

That's because most modern wrestlers are geeks and the WWE presents them like geeks. They're all 'living their childhood dream.' No one cares to watch average people being cogs in the machine.

Smarks don't know what a good worker is. They think Seth Rollins is good. They're clueless.

I can agree with this to a point. The Rock was my favorite wrestler growing up. I feel like a great character has to have at least a decent amount of in ring work to get to the top. Another example being Stone Cold. People forget how great in the ring he was Pre-WWF and before he broke his neck. I mean shit he was still good after he broke his neck, but he had a character that everybody loved to elevate him with it. Also the key word here is decent at least. There were plenty of guys who had awesome characters who were only "Okay." But as long as they had enough to get by, they were entertaining. Kinda like Rikishi and Val Venis to a certain extent.

Then on the flip side, you had the amazing in ring workers, but having only an "Okay" character didn't really work. Per example it wasnt until 4 years after all this that Benoit and Eddie hit their individual peaks career wise because it was then when people fully got invested in their characters as much as their in ring work.

Yeah it fucking sucks. They used to dictate to the audience and had them in the palm of their hands, now the audience is trying to control the product and often they pander to them.

My main issue is that wrestlers don't look like wrestlers anymore. If you saw Johnny Reddit in the street would you even look twice at him? Now Hogan, Batista, Headbanger Mosh that's what a real wrestler is supposed to look like

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They don't look like wrestlers, don't act like wrestlers, don't talk like wrestlers, and don't have the presence of wrestlers. It's all a joke.

And mind boggling thing is that Triple H is the loudest supporter for these types of guys. When he himself was jacked to the gills.

I remember when the smarks used to be in the stands brother now they're in the ring

Modern wrestlers grew up idolizing Shawn Michaels and Eddie Guerrero but don't realize that it wasn't their moves that made them who they were or why their matches were good.

I don't understand this. He grew up a huge Flair mark and yet he pushes the blandest shit that wrestling has ever seen.

This makes a lot of sense when you think about it. I do enjoy my fair share of flippy bullshit but Eddie and Shawn had actual personality that went beyond their ring work that the current guys severely lack.

Also Michaels fucking sold like a true GOAT

I don't really watch modern wrestling too much anymore but as I understand Triple H's projects seem to get diluted once they get to the main roster am I correct? Or are most of them bland vanilla midgets even in NXT?

What do you think?

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The business is dead brother

I really want to see Billy Corgan succeed in a long run with his NWA project. He has been vocal about wanting especially his main event stars to look like wrestlers and his lack of interest for flippyshit.

It's pretty much this. With NXT being taped I feel like there's a lot more time to build up their characters. Like they'll introduce them as a hotshot from an indy or Japan or whatever and then give them promo time and let them build a personality along with the great match quality.

But then they get to the main roster and its "Hey it's this guy from NXT and they wrestle really good, We know none of you casuals know who this guy is so we're gonna have them wrestle 10 minutes a night every Raw and not build their character until every NXT guy has the same character of NXT guy who wrestles good."

based

I'm fine with that. I'll just watch old stuff

Just goes to show how much fans have changed. Rikishi was on the cusp of main event status in 2000 compared to the vanilla midgets