Misunderstood masterpiece or genuine atrocity that forever killed any remaining good will that the series had left?

>reddit heroes
its dogshit and if you like it, then you have to go back

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Pretty well-designed levels that had to be stretched out, slowed down with helmeted hammers then multiplied by 4 with slip and slide gameplay that ruins any good will the game has

Damn this is almost exactly what I was going to say.
Yes, this too. I remember it was the first 3D Sonic game I got to play after SA2B, and I thought “what’s wrong with this game? why does it feel so much worse to play than my other Sonic game on GameCube?”. So despite still enjoying it as a kid (I was 8 when it released), I knew something was off, and I knew it wasn’t as good as SA2B. It’s most definitely not a masterpiece, misunderstood or otherwise.

Not him, but yes

It’s a good start but we need more

Ruined Shadow's story from SA2

Yeah, I replayed the game the other day for the first time in well over a decade, and despite how much I I really wanted it to be (mostly for nostalgia’s sake), the game just isn’t fun.

>made by the SA2 team
>last console Sonic game before the Sega-Sammy merger and before Hisao Oguchi took over for a while (he didn't care much about quality)
>Iizuka still had some energy as a director left
it's decent

>Go fast as Sonic
>turn stick slightly to the left
>crash into wall or fall of the track

If that’s the case why is it such a slog to play through? I feel like if you implemented the physics from SA2 into Heroes and changed nothing else, it would still be an instantly better game. I honestly don’t know what they were thinking.

>The development of Sonic Heroes took its toll on director Takashi Iizuka, who is also the head of Sonic Team. Iizuka spoke to Game Informer this month about how difficult it was to create, even labeling it as the most stressful project of his career.

>Iizuka was located in the United States as Sonic Heroes was being created. Meanwhile, the rest of the team was based in Japan. Mismanagement was also a major issue.

>Iizuka talked about a story in which Sonic Heroes’ level design was worked on by just one other person other than himself. After that developer became sick, he had to handle things himself. That ultimately caused Iizuka to work constantly. He never slept, and ended up losing 22 pounds.

>Iizuka’s full comments:

>“The level design for Sonic Heroes was made by two people: me and one other person. As we got to the later stages of development, this other person got pretty sick and didn’t show up to work, so level design was made by one person! So for those very last stages of the game, I didn’t sleep at all and I was constantly working. I lost about [22 pounds] because I was just cranking away and it was just work, work, work. I didn’t sleep because I had to finish the game on my own. Almost dying!”

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That’s very admirable of him, but it’s a shame that the Sonic series wasn’t/isn’t helmed by a director with actual talent.

no wonder Shadow and Nights 2 reek of being made by an exhausted/indifferent director

Nights, 3D Blast Saturn special stages, Adventure saga and Heroes are proof that Iizuka was talented at some point. He lost his mojo with the Shadow game

Even when I was a dumb kid with no taste I could tell it was the worst 3d sonic game. Once the novelty of smashing things to bits with power mode wore off it was just worse than SA1/2 in every way. When a game makes SA2 feel like it controls well, and a 12 year old can pick up on this, you've got a problem.

I remember going so fast in this part that I crashed into the fucking trolleys ahead of me and died.

kek you can even see the guy playing getting jittery when he jumps off a rail cause of how unreliable the controls are

Iizuka has talent.

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Probably doesn't help they went from making games that came out every couple of years to having to port the Adventure games to GameCube WHILE making Sonic Heros AND making it multiplat.

I know porting a game isn't as hard as making one, but splitting resources to port a game at the same time while making a new game is rough, no less a game that has gone on the record saying that it was difficult for them to make because it was going to be on every console definitely adds up. SADX game out extremely close to Heros too so there probably wasn't a point where those people jumped back on the project and unfortunately Heros turned out mediocre when it could have at least been a bit better than that.

I liked Heros as a kid but it's impossible to go back to as an adult. It must have sucked being a cynical kid and not being able to enjoy anything but perfect masterpieces in 2003

I still played through the whole thing and enjoyed it as a kid, but I could still tell it was jank.

>grassy checkerboard hills, beaches with orcas, whale shaped island, giant turtles carrying platforms, ancient ruins, futuristic metropolis, factory, power plant, casino area, pinball tables, bingo, Eggman base on red canyon, armoured trains stations, cannons, jungle with giant frogs, swamp with alligator, skycraped sized mushrooms, castle exterior, haunted mansion, airship fleet (shaped like sea creatures)
i love Heroes's environments

Maybe so, but at least you agree he lost it a long while ago, so I still think he should have stepped down like 10+ years ago to let someone fresh take over
Can’t watch webms because I’m at work rn and my phone is old and shitty, but the thumbnail looks like sky rail from SA2? So idk if you’re being facetious, but honestly Sonic 4 is all the proof I need to know that Iizuka is a washed up hack.

SA2/SA2B/Heroes team wasn't involved with Gamecube port of SA1

I'd consider it more of a misstep that the series could have recovered from. It's all the shit that came after it that killed the remaining good will the series had left.

Best final level in a Sonic game purely from an aesthetic standpoint.

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Yeah they’re kino, but I prefer seeing them in Generations and Sonic & Allstars Racing Transformed rather than in Heroes itself. Such wasted potential.

Ehh

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>You have to repeat the game 4 times to get to the last boss
It's an abomination

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Agreed. Heroes on its own wouldn’t have been such a big deal for the series, but little did we know at the time, it was a portent of things to come.

TRY TO REACH INSIDE OF ME
TRY TO DRAIN MY ENERGY
LET ME SHOW YOU
JUST
WHAT
I'M
MADE
OF

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Heroes lacked this verticallity.

should've been Gamecube exclusive. Xbox version is a decent alternative, but it's awful on PS2 (worse looking graphics, 30fps, downgraded models, controls are more slippery, clipping issues, lower draw distance, missing sound effects, etc)
PC port released a couple of months later is decent too

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>You play through the game four times where stages change depending on the team you picked
Fixed.

>this machine

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100% has excellent moments and stand out stages; solid core
ruined by gimmicks and shoddy designed parts that the gameplay suffers in

leveling up should be a STAPLE in sonic games

Here's a fin fact, because of extra missions, you actually have to beat every level in Sonic Heroes 8 fucking times.
With 14 unique stages, that's 112 levels of Sonic Heroes that you need to get through in order to fully complete the game, with most of them being over 5 minutes long.
Needless to say, Sonic Heroes is the only Sonic game I've never bothered getting 100% on.

Definitely not a masterpiece. Even so, I don't regret playing it. It wasn't as good as the adventure games. But it was still a good game. I do wish the characters had more variety of skills between themselves. Team chaotix was bullshit though.

no no, it has verticality
as in "switch to fly mode to get over this vertical wall bro"
or "switch to power mode to float up using this fan bro"
real first rate gameplay

>go fast
>posts a 15 second long auto-rail segment
I shit you not

agreed, one of Heroes' best aspects, but I still don't like the game.

>Team chaotix was bullshit though.
Filtered

>>You have to repeat the game 4 times to get to the last boss
You retards always complain about this shit but you never complain when you have to do it 6 times in a even shittier game

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Every Sonic game after 3&K is bad. Everyone who simps for Post-3&K Sonic games has fetish-related reason for doing so. Every reply to this post is cope.

>Team Sonic - the regular level
>Team Rose - the regular level but cut in half and piss-easy
>Team Dark - the regular level but slightly harder
>Team Chaotix - the regular level but butchered so they could fit in a wacky objective to do instead of playing the regular level
ah yes, so different....

The gameplay and stories are at least different for the 6 characters in Sonic Adventure.

Home...
youtube.com/watch?v=IIgNq87PbK0

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>every team has different level layout while team chaotix is a completely unique gamemode
What's the problem?

Is this literally the best Sonic level, at least in the art direction department? It's just so beautiful.

Are you forgetting that the Adventure games exists?

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>switch to power mode to float up using this fan
i liked those parts. Egg Fleet has a very fun one in the middle

I assure you, I'm very aware Adventure exists. Now why don't you admit in this thread how many times you've coomed to Sonic media?

This applies to Heroes too.

Different doesn't mean better when everyone that isn't sonic plays like dogshit. Their stories aren't anything to write home about either and the cutscenes look like shit, thankfully you can skip them in DX

How long before we start saying Sonic 06 was good actually?

>Just homing attack this enemy 50 times until its HP goes to 0, bro

See Each team has the exact same abilities too.

I'll give you that Big sucks and Tails' gameplay isn't much different from Sonic aside from flying, but I found Knuckles, Amy, and E-102 enjoyable.

What is leveling up or changing to Knuckles?

Is story even a thing in Heroes? For Teams Sonic and Rose it's just chase the guy. Eggman for Sonic and Sonic, Froggy, and Chocola in Rose. Team Dark vaguely has a story on whether Shadow is actually a robot or not and Team Chaotix is the only story that's actually relevant to Heroes. Which is that was never the one who set the Egg Fleet loose and that it was Metal this whole time.

>What's up you fucking faggots? Lemme just get my two bros real quick

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>he doesn't pick up power ups or switch to power characters or use the instant kill ult

>i liked those parts
literally not gameplay
they are so fucking lame, the epitome of Heroes' braindead "mechanic" of forcing you to switch at certain times because of an extremely simple obstacle that nonetheless only one formation can pass.

Sonic's story in Sonic Adventure is 10 unique levels in total
Tails gets 5
Knuckles gets 5
Amy gets 3
Big gets 4
Gamma gets 5
In total, you have to "repeat" 22 stages in SA1 once you're done with Sonic's story, discounting the fact that some stages are unique to the other characters like Hot Shelter and that they have a completely different gameplay style.
Team Sonic's story in Sonic Heroes has 14 levels.
Team Dark has 14
Team Rose has 15
Team Chaotix has 14
In total, you have to repeat 43 levels in Sonic Heroes with characters that play exactly the same and in the exact same order and with no unique stages with the exception of Team Rose doing the tutorial at the start.
In short, kys.

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There's a leveling mechanic, at LVL3 your Flight and Power characters should be able to decimate most enemies

i just thought the feeling when you use them is satisfying, even more so if you land in a rail or dash panel

I'd also like to note that Hot Shelter only appears for Amy, Big, and E-102. So there's actually 11 unique levels.

>In short, kys.
>knows this much about -SONIC THE HEDGEHOG LORE-
>tells someone ELSE to kys
Kys massive retard.

I like 3D Sonic, but Heroes was complete garbage

NTA but thats not what lore means you retard.

Heroes PS2 also has this split second graphical glitch in the emblem screen. Shoddy port

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Knuckles and Gammas gameplay are ok but the thing is, I'm not trying to treasure hunt or shoot em up in a sonic game
The classics had different characters with unique things about them but the goal was always the same

>Masterpiece
No
>Atrocity
No

It's an okay game, a good one if you play just Sonic's campaign. But Amy's campaign is just Sonic's campaign but shorter and a little easier, Shadow's campaign is just Sonic's campaign but longer and a little harder, and Chaotix's campaign is a tedious nightmare. Having to beat all four nearly identical campaigns AND get all the chaos emeralds from the bonus stages just to see the true final boss is ridiculous.

>guy who knows this much about sonic adventure's proper way of clearing the game
>HURR HE PROBABLY DOESN'T KNOW THE LORE
What a dumb idiot you are.

The misunderstanding here is the part where people thought Sonic was ever good.

I'm also not trying to play a mediocre beat 'em up for every 5 seconds of proper Sonic gameplay, yet that's exactly what Heroes asks of you.

It's flawed but I fucking love it's charm
Some stages are legit kinrhm4o to

I skip the cutscenes.

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The Sonic Heroes experience...

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I'd like to see an actual remake of Heroes that keeps the core game in tact but fixes all of the glaring gameplay issues and does more to differentiate the four teams' gameplay from one another.

>1996 : Mario 64, Crash 1, Sonic 3D Blast
>1997 : Croc, Crash 2
>1998 : Banjo-Kazooie, Spyro 1, Crash 3, Gex 2, Glover, Sonic Adventure
>1999 : Donkey Kong 64, Spyro 2, Rayman 2, Ape Escape, Pacman World, Rocket : Robot on Wheels, Tonic Trouble, Croc 2, Gex 3
>2000 : Banjo-Tooie, Spyro 3
>2001 : Conker's Bad Fur Day, Sonic Adventure 2, Crash Wrath of Cortex, Jak 1
>2002 : Mario Sunshine, Sly 1, Ratchet 1, Blinx 1, Ty 1, Ape Escape 2, Pacman World 2, Spyro Enter the Dragonfly
>2003 : Rayman 3, Jak 2, Ratchet 2, Billy Hatcher, Voodoo Vince, Wario World, Megaman X7, Vexx, Whiplash, Sonic Heroes
just a guide of the early non licensed 3D platformers. Heroes was neither the best nor the worst of 2003

Soul

Love this game.

This one's funny but there's also the final boss against Eggman where you just get to max height as a Flying character and spam Thunder Shoot until it dies.