How should localizers deal with honorifics?
By preserving them properly instead of being retards doing half-measures.
I dunno but all localized jap games should use japanglish.
P5 was so shit kek.
use them the first time the name is said in a conversation but remove it for the rest unless needed for formalities.
IE i want to visit XXX-kuns house, but XXX can't have anyone over because they have the swine flu.
use japanese words and fill the screen with translator notes
If weebshit filters you you shouldn't be playing weebshit in the first place.
Objectively correct opinion coming through
Honorifics should be kept entirely intact if the game has no voice acting or is voice acted in Japanese. Changing them can lead to small issues with conveyance of the original intent (such as a teacher calling their student Mr. [X] instead of [X]-san; this has happened before). P5 is an example of how NOT to handle this. When English voice acting is present, the honorifics should be removed from both the spoken and written dialogue, with the translation done bearing in mind that the voice acting will reflect it. Honorifics not being in a game with Japanese voice acting is not a dealbreaker in most cases and a lot of localizers will argue that keeping them is bad, but in reality, almost all situations with honorifics are easily understood by someone who has only a tenuous grasp on their meaning, and cases of specific honorifics which are rarely used (such as regionally appropriate ones) are few and far between. Most of the time, just don't touch it. I feel like many localizers get memed into taking them out because everyone else does it without thinking.
kek
shut up
I would have agreed but look at all those fucking words. Fuck you.
>How should localizers deal with honorifics?
by fucking killing themselves for being such failures at life they now spend their hours rewriting other peoples work
just let translators handle it
You will never be a translator.
It really is that. a bunch of writing failures who would prefer to make their own shit but can't because they suck. It's a shame things are never translated by people who love the content they're working on.
You'll never be a woman,
you don't
Either go all in like persona 3 and 4 did or don't bother at all.
I'm an Asian with family who still uses honorifics, but even they don't insist on it in English as much as a weeb. And if you did care about larping as Asians, you wouldn't be so fucking dirty and take off shoes in the house (btw).
Keep them in when the work is set in Japan, remove them when it's not.
You don't fucking translate "monsieur" when translating a work set in France.
I think the degree of localisation depends on the audience. A game/anime/manga that has an English audience made up of full blown weebs can afford to be more literal and borrow lots of words from Japanese. I'm sure weebs will be happy to learn a new Japanese word every once in awhile. There could even be times when a lot of shit isn't even translated.
But if the intended audience is for children, or a more "general" audience then heavy localisation is fine.
The problem is, though... all these companies do want a general audience and they would expand that audience to grandmas that just watch procedural dramas if they could.
IF the characters are saying "we're in japan, we're speaking japanese" then they should keep the honorifics AS-IS even if the script's language is in another language. Same if they're speaking a fantasy language which for whatever reason has japanese's honorifics.
If the characters are in-context speaking english or any other language where honorifics do not exist, they should be transliterated accordingly.
I do take my shoes off in the house, slant
>all in
>like persona 3 and 4 did
>When English voice acting is present, the honorifics should be removed from both the spoken and written dialogue, with the translation done bearing in mind that the voice acting will reflect it.
Good work, now no game has honorifics because they're all translated to accommodate the shitty English dub to begin with.
Cut them. I don't read dialogue in Japanese so when I see shit like senpai or san in English it's read in English and it's retarded, makes it read like characters are weebing it up and I hate it.
I don't care if they leave them in. I don't hate them, or anything. But thinking purely logically, they should be removed. I just remember them being awkwardly implemented in Persona 4.
Why don't you bother learning Nihonggo if you're seething sp much about the English language you filthy gaijin?
You won't find any honorifics in localized Japanese literature or film and that's where the good translators get work.
It only happens in anime and video games since that's where the talentless weeaboos and failed writers end up.
What makes you think I'm not?
That's the appropriate solution to an English dub, yes. Why is that a problem? If you're against English dubs existing, that's fine, I'm not really a fan of them myself, but try convincing a company not to dub their work and increase its sales.
>Why is that a problem?
I already said what the problem was, the English translation gets fucked up to accommodate the dub existing at all.
Not like that, that's for sure. Thinking back it is unbelievable the type of shlock I played through in P3 and P4 where the shitty English VAs literally said "senpai" out loud. I'm cringing at the mere thought.
Are you out of your mind? Any respectable translation will be done first and the dub will be performed on top of it. If the opposite occurs, it's a point of contention, but you're basically just making up problems and assuming they apply to everything you don't like.
Flipping a coin before translating and sticking to the one or the either.
Hey anglos, riddle me this: how are words "mister" and "sir" translated to other languages?
That's right you monolingual fucks, they're not. They're kept as-is.
Remove every sempai, kun, chan San and keeping the others
>Mr. Kamoshida
Makes sense, he's their teacher.
>Suzui-senpai
Senpai has no translation, and the game is set in Japan, so why not keep it?
user, this is literally how it always works, the basic translation is done and then it's rewritten by editors to "sound more natural" for the English dub. The only exception is Yakuza which started providing separate sub and dub tracks, but those only apply to voiced scenes, and even the sub track is still liberal as fuck and arbitrarily localises honorifics.
What?
In piss-yellow color!
Mister, sir, ma'am, miss, mrs and the like - all of these carry the same societal function as honorifics in japanese and they're kept untouched when english works (that are set in english-speaking countries) are translated to other languages.
there is nothing wrong with keeping honorifics if the story is based in japan
in the anime monster, it's a japanese story that takes place in germany, and the main character is a doctor. they don't call him tenma-san or tenma-sensei, they call him fuckin "dokuta tenma" because it's in germany and they want you to get immersed
similarly there is nothing wrong with an english dub actor saying "senpai" out loud
Yes, all Japanese games should have two subtitle options, one for the shitty American dub and one for the Japanese dub. That way everyone is happy except from the translators who want to write fanfiction.
Remove all honorifics, and use the freed up text space to write about incels and make a dated joke about the male gaze. Also replace any and all mentions of japanese foods with hamburgers.
>"sound more natural"
why is this in quotations
is this about to be a strawman equating any usage of informal language or slang whatsoever with nonsquitur "POGGERS SUS NO CAP FRFR" word salad that in no way remotely describes anything Yea Forums routinely complains about
You're giving to much credit to the normal faggot crowd who plays the games. They'll have no idea what shit like Senpai means.
They’re quite literally translated all the time and have analogues in other western languages like French and Spanish. I’ve never seen a translation in Spanish keep sir and miss instead of using señor and señorita.
>why is this in quotations
Because it's the excuse localisers make for rewriting basic dialogue into "POGGERS SUS NO CAP FRFR".
I think anime has become too mainstream for both of us to correctly gauge a normalfag's knowledge of anime/manga. But I'm sure they still think moe is still 'cute girls doing cute things' like the retards they are.
Verbatim as per the original. Your choice if honorifics were not used.
Senpai is someone who you want to notice you
Always funny seeing EOPs whine about this. This bitch is just as annoying in half those Japanese lines.
Shouldn't it be "whom" in this case?
You fucking retard, the Japanese lines and appropriate translations are right there to compare to. And in this particular case the localisation team literally gave a fucking presentation about how they know it wasn't accurate at all and they rewrote her on purpose. And yet dipshits like you will still try to defend it and spout bullshit about how it's actually not a blatant rewrite.
keep the honorifics if the setting takes place in Japan or if the characters are japanese-coded in more ways than just speaking
If the setting is explicitly japanese, keep it. If not, who cares?
If it's dubbed then remove them, if it's not leave them in. Hearing dogshit VA is even worse when I have to hear them butcher japanese words.
>or if the characters are japanese-coded in more ways than just speaking
aka if the characters were written by a Japanese author
Here's the funny thing, you think those are "appropriate" translations. They're not, because they're overly literal and completely ignore how she's actually using those words.
Look, it's very hard to explain this to someone who doesn't even understand what 姫(ruby text:わたし) even means.
Taking a character who is literally painful to read and "rewriting" them into one that's painful to read is just the basics of localisation. You can argue that you don't like the style they went for, but to say it isn't accurate is really fucking funny when it's a far better representation of her character than what you think the "accurate" translation is.
That "raw" translation isn't right, though.
She's annoying because of her neet personality and her first person speech tic, not because she mixes up english and nip like the worst kind of weeb like she does in the localization they basically completely flanderized a character because they couldn't figure out how to translate a pronoun
They literally kept the code for furigana and used it in the English script already because the script is full of that shit, they could've done the exact same thing for her. They did not, because they rewrote her, which they admitted to. You are defending localisers who didn't even defend their own actions because they were that fucking brazen about it.
seems like the only true answer to this is to learn the source language since localization by definition is not a 1:1 translation
the pic you're using doesn't show what you're describing
Include them because it's a big deal when they drop the honorific and it makes no sense otherwise. You'd have to rewrite scenes to remove the reaction if you do remove honorifics.
There is no way to translate formal vs. informal speech on the other hand so you end up with extremely goofy constructions and people suddenly talking in cockney accents
>user uses one example of Osakabehime's furigana gimmick to defend four lines of dialogue where the gimmick is entirely absent
There's no English equivalent for 先輩
>making a game in my native language planning to hire someone to translate
>read this thread
for fucks sake now im paranoid the translation will be botched, i dont feel capable enough to do it myself
yea there is
Don't worry someone would always find fault in anything no matter what you do.
If the game is good it will be played and supported. The noise crap around it only serves to advertise it further. So just focus on making your game good to play.
if the setting is japan, keep them as they were
otherwise, ditch them entirely
For real?
senpai
>n-no you can't do that
tsunami
Amazing, you can hunt for furigana, do you want a medal? Let me guess, next you're going to tell me shit like 非実在系 is something normal people say all the time?
She's annoying because she talks like a fag and her shit is all retarded. Essentially, all you're complaining about is that she talks like a fag in English but not the kind of fag you like.
Translation is all about rewriting, buddy. The languages don't have a lot in common, so preserving intent is more important.
>Translation is all about rewriting, buddy.
And there it is
but user its a vn
>Options >Subtitles >Honorifics?
>Yes
>No
Alternatively
>Options >Subtitles >Weeb?
>Yes
>No
There you go.
>Essentially, all you're complaining about is that she talks like a fag in English but not the kind of fag you like.
Well, yes, that's exactly the problem. They didn't even attempt to have her be annoying to read in the same way (likely due to a lack of vocabulary on the translator's part), they instead rewrote her into an entirely different archetype that's annoying in an entirely different way.
Idgi
Yes, yes, good strawman.
Here's a good one from the end of FFX, which do you prefer?
Yuna (Japanese): Thank you very much.
Yuna (English): I love you.
How important is text in the game? Is there enough imagery to substitute text? Can it be easily changed?
How text heavy is your game?