What is the superior Guilty Gear gameplay-wise and why?

+R

>Much better pacing due to lack of flash/freeze on RC
>Ability to convert from midrange and air hits is generally more limited (with a few big exceptions). High midrange reward kinda goes against the GG core and helps making it more of a single player game
>I feel like the new characters were designed to be strong in mid/long range in Rev 2 (Sin, Elph, Raven, even Leo has some insane mid range reward for someone who's meant to be played up close), plus Johnny being massively buffed.
>Harder to execute oki, very difficult to do perfectly safe/inescapable setups consistently, also making it less of a single player game
>Hellfire and danger time are weird mechanics that don't really need to be there
>Blitz promotes high/lows and fucks over characters that usually depend on left/right mixups
>I'd rather fight Testament and Zappa than Rev 2 Johnny, but not by much.
>GGPO

I love both games, but I love +R the most

I like the XX series, Xrd & Strive.

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Dust Strikers

strive

+R by far, Xrd has so many scrubby mechanics

>I'd rather fight Testament and Zappa than Rev 2 Johnny, but not by much.
Which character do you play

the newest one because new > old, always.

See me in plusR

based enjoyer

Guilty Gear 2

I prefer +R because I'll take FRCs over Xrd YRCs any day, and I think Force Breaks are overall more interesting and fun than the mechanics Xrd introduced. I also can't find a character I love in Xrd while the roster has several characters that are just not enjoyable to fight unless you learn the matchup inside and out, while the +R roster is a lot more fun to play around with and its most powerful characters can still be fun to fight around unless it's a particularly awful matchup. I honestly like Strive more than Xrd as well, for having a MUCH better RC system and some characters I actually like to play as with less annoying characters than Xrd (so far).

+R > Strive > Rev2, personally. #Reload is pretty good too, and Sign is pretty poor but it was the first iteration of Xrd so that makes sense.

This is the based and correct answer however.

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what character do you play

Xrd feels the best to play. +r never manages to get perfectly comfy to control, doesn't have a character I really love, and it's full of shit that I really hate dealing with, even moreso than Xrd. I'd rather deal with fireball YRC than like 80% of force breaks.
Strive is too limited, I hate the gatlings and how weak the defensive options have to be because of the limited options on offence, and it feels bad to move in even as the fastest characters.
Xrd has its problems but the pace of the game is basically exactly how I like, the skill floor is low enough you can have a real gameplan without too much grinding while still being high enough that no amount of grinding is too much, and almost all of the characters feel complex and well rounded while still being extremely unique and rely on their whole kit.
It really needed another big update and is nowhere near perfect, but if it had better netcode I'd probably never bother with the other GGs.

The duality of man.

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+R is mechanically deeper but with a lot more robbery and fraud ludo at high levels of play, it's also harder to get into due to no input buffer, faster pace and some divisive mechanics like FRCs.
Xrd is easier to get into but it's also simplified in many respects and certain universal mechanics are extremely questionable in general, the robbery is also still there but it's not as entertaining as +R, which embraces the kuso.

In the end you have to pick your poison, me, I stick to +R because I don't like what they did to my mains in Xrd and hate YRCs with a passion, though I'd rather play Xrd than current Strive.

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+R has justice
any other argument is invalid

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This but Kliff.
2S is love, 6H is life.

>he plays dogshit nerd games instead of Strive

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>but with a lot more robbery and fraud
cope

Strive is a tranny game

Strive's gonna be pretty crazy at the ends of it's life, I feel it.

Strive is a based game where normal people like myself can actually play it. Thus, it is based.

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lol, 6 hit combos with drift RC that kill

Boring, gay, and lame compared to the shit you can do in +R. Strive will never be as deep or interesting and that's by design. You'll never have Kesuke and Maruken combos in Strive.

I don't play fighting games for the combos. I hate high execution games with long combos and character-specific weight-specific bullshit.

I like Xrd and +R for different reasons. The top 3 in both are about as cancerous but with +R you're less likely to run into them then Xrd. Core mechanics wise i prefer Xrd but i sort of wish YRC was attached to specials only. Its really lame how it evolved into a way for people to basic pause the game for air throw/punish situations. Sometimes just to throw off the timing and make a scramble from the input eating.

+Rs mechanics might be alittle better but i don't think FRC should ever have been so strict. Its one of those old fighting game things like 2k2UM dash buffers and 1-2f link conversions on already hard as fuck max combos to the point in sets you might not see them as much outside of maybe Kyo2/Nameless who have really good max starters. I don't feel like FRCs needs to be that tight. Also +R has a very small input buffer which also has aged kind of poorly compared to games that have added more buffers with no loss to anything but bragging rights for BnBs. I want to say Xrd but its mainly because i played it more but i still have around 2-3k games in +R and plan to add more as my friends get Steam/PCs soon. Both are good games. Strive is okay..

>it's also harder to get into due to no input buffer
The game has a pretty lenient input buffer actually, even more so with the rollback update that gave us an even more lenient input option.
The thing that's not lenient are the links which are notorious when you have to link a ground string into a jump cancel hit with any character, most notably Slayers has like 1F links on some of his air combos.

You're right, it's not going to going to be +R. Which is fine, because I have +R to play when I feel like +R. The series was going to die if Strive sold similar to the rest of the series.

The one with hand drawn sprites

I agree with this despite liking Xrd more. But i feel like listing danger time will always be pointless. I've had entire back and forth sets where it appears one time at most. It has like a 5-10% chance on a clash. Hellfire was kind of dumb though. But i don't think oki being hard is a good point. If it functions the way it does all the same execution is just a grind if you can do it works the same.

I feel like the worst thing about +R i could honestly list is probably just how much life characters can feel like they have in the last 5% of their life bar. It can be a bit tiresome to finish shit off or drop a combo that is being reduced to nothing giving someone one more chance.

Strive still has character weights and any game where characters vary in size will have character-specific stuff regardless of weights. There's just going to be pickups/confirms/extensions that will only work on big fuckers like Pot/Faust/Goldlewis because their hurtboxes are naturally larger.

>Xrd has so many scrubby mechanics
Besides Hellfire i don't know if id say scrubby. DT is hardly a common "mechanic" and YRC has tons of nuances uses. I wouldn't call them scrubby uses but they are annoying and bog the game down when they happen. Its annoying as fuck when people use YRC as a way to stall approaches. All they had to do was create a input buffer during the slowdown so the situations where your inputs are eaten don't exist.

Lack of input buffer is what makes the links hard. +r legit doesn't have one, 0f input buffer. You're probably thinking of the input reader which they tweaked to make half circles more lenient. Otherwise, since it's a chain based game you don't miss the buffer much since you're just cancelling everything into everything, but because of the lack of buffer a 1f link is a true 16ms window.

>much life characters can feel like they have in the last 5% of their life bar.
Health was universally buffed from 420 to 460 from vanilla AC to +R.

If the game actually had no input buffer you wouldn't be able to mash supers or DPs on wakeup or even buffer a special motion during a blockstring so it can come out next.
Try to play something like SFII to see what it actuallly feels like.

Its been awhile i thought the input leniency was only applied to hcbf and half circles in general. Or did they just make it apply to alot of things? Dps in +R always feel like i have to hold the 1/3 input really hard at the end not to get a qcf/b when a character has another move.

I have no problem with bigbody-exclusive combos. Every fighting game has that.

What I have a problem with is the sheer inconsistency and lack of universal combos that makes the game more about memorizing textbooks of knowledge instead of fucking playing. Look at Baiken's Strive bnbs vs +R. I'm sure there are plenty of people who love this shit and that's where they derive their fun, but not me.

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The game has a buffer for everything but links, those are the problematic ones that they fixed in Xrd.

Reminder that +r was a late final version that added a bunch of random bullshit and that practically nobody played for any serious length of time and absolutely no one took seriously.

I wish Xrd had rollback. I like Xrd and +R. I hope i can grind +R with friends on PC soon once i got one up and running. Same with BBCF. Even Strive is okay. Its a shame the only Xrd/+R threads nowadays are ones bound for divisive "conversation" But +R has died down heavily albeit still with great netplay and Xrd has a lack of great netplay and requires 1-2f delay if you can find it with discord setups.

Super glad 2k2UM got GGPO too i hope they keep supporting it with updates but after lobbies/spectating not sure whats left.

>The series was going to die if Strive sold similar to the rest of the series.
I'd rather something have a small enthusiast community than have a bigger following in a bastardized and less skillful form

>lack of universal combos that makes the game more about memorizing textbooks of knowledge
Unless you play Millia there's literally no need for character specific combos, you can totally get away with a somewhat basic "unirversal" bnb and play at high level.

Do you turn it on somewhere in the steam menus?

lol, just wait until you see the neutral jump j.H tatami loops in the corner for +R Baiken

It's in the in-game control options, it's called "lenient inputs" or something like that.

Why doesn't Strive feel like GG at all?

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It's fun and has players

Would it help friends i have who probably would struggle with out it? Or is it just a small difference? Man its been awhile since i ran some +R Faust. 2HS is such a fucking godlike normal and he can reverse beat that shit.

But it doesn't feel like I'm playing GG, it can have a billion players but what's the point if I'm basically playing a different game with a lazy GG paint on top of its shitty mechanics?

I like Xrd more overall, when it comes to universal stuff it's harder to decide which I prefer, but I prefer Xrd overall for its roster. +R has a great roster, but it has so many characters that are just such a pain in the ass to fight that it brings the game down overall for me. There's a handful of characters in Xrd that would make me wish I was fighting somebody else, but in +R it's more than a handful that make me feel that way and the ones that do make me feel that way are worse than their Xrd counterparts. In particular, I can't stand Justice, Dizzy, Zappa and Baiken. A lot of people will think of Testament as the most annoying, but in my opinion it's a testament to how annoying those four I mentioned are that Testament doesn't seem so bad in comparison.

It basically tricks the game's input buffer into reading the controls as if you were playing at 120FPS so it's much more lenient, but the links are still gonna be hard cuz those aren't tied to any input buffer.

It kind of does. But all the characters are more centered around their core ideas instead of the core being smaller but built around if that makes sense? Instead of a sun surrounded by a solar system its more like a planet with a few moons.

Faust for example still feels like Faust but hes largely all about creating item chaos and controlling space with normals. His command throw/fuzzy mixups are okay but more difficult to get to and sometimes not worth going into off maintaining chaos/control of the MU. Where as in Xrd/+R if Faust players could get in they'd take that shit to mix people up with 2K plus frames and FDC j2K jK shit. It still feels like GG its just one portion of it is stronger then others and sometimes overly focused.

This makes dealing with unga bunga a bit more annoying and all the top tiers feel like retard characters.

Unironically go outside. The +R/Xrd community is going anywhere because of Strive. If anything, they only serve to expand those games from a bit of trickle down from Strive. I'd know, because I'm playing +R right now and started with Strive.

After playing both for about 400hrs each I think they're different enough that you can't really compare. ACPR definitely offers the more consumate roster with generally deeper, more fleshed out characters and great mechanics like FRC. Xrd on the other hand plays more methodically and a bit more toned down, but I think if there ever was a "Rev3" you'd (hopefully) see a lot of lacking characters brought up. I would give the sizable nod to +R but I still love Xrd. They're far and away my two favorite fighting games.

>But all the characters are more centered around their core ideas instead of the core being smaller but built around if that makes sense?
Uhmm no? I was playing against Testament and instead of fighting the trap character I know I was just fighting some big button zoning tranny who spams 6P to get a counter hit wallbreak combo like literally every other character in the game.

Xrd is just an unfinished game, imagine if the XX series ended on #Reload, that's what Rev2 is.

It's a re-work of GG, but it still has GG DNA, I feel, at least in the universal mechanics. The approach to the characters is probably the thing about it that feels the least like GG to me, past games went so far to make characters feel different that you'd even get those little differences that nobody liked like variable wake up times, but Strive's cast feels much more homogenous. I do like Strive, but that's definitely the thing about it that's disappointed me most. There's still some characters that feel unique like Happy Chaos and Goldlewis, but in general I've not been thrilled with that part of the game.

Strive is going to look like Rev 3 at the ends of it's life. Mark my words.

Its hard for me to call the bottom tier in Rev2 lacking honestly. We saw alot of mid tier success in the latter of the games life. Potemkin has a pretty viable moveset its just some MUs fuck him up and if he were to be able to get past them he'd likely be a issue cast wide. Zato-1 also got weakened in ways i guess you could unnerf but even if you brought him back to Rev1 strength he'd still suck ass against Leo Raven Elphelt JackO Chipp and alot of buffed/characters that by pass his defense super easily. But he still has solid pressure and alot of mixups/good strings at mid screen etc.

nah, if arcsys doesn't shake things up with the next patch then forget about it, they're going full sellout and SFV gameplay is what sells now.

Usually you'd refer to that as a reversal window, not an input buffer, even if it works similarly.

The last frame of your wakeup animation just duplicates any button inputs you made on the previous frame. It doesn't quite buffer the inputs, though the distinction very rarely matters, but if you do something like 5H on the second last frame and then hold backwards on the last frame/first actionable frame you get reversal throw even though you never actually input 4H. It also means you can't buffer gold burst since if you try to do it during the "buffer" window it just gives you blue burst.
It's also only on wakeup as far as I know, I don't /think/ it applies to blockstun. I definitely might be wrong about that though.

Strive might find depth in its own way, but it's never going to be like what Rev 3 would have been. Strive isn't Xrd, it's not supposed to be, and however it builds on what it has it's going to do it by building on the things that mek Strive unique, not backtracking to be more like Xrd. Even if it did backtrack to be like Xrd it still would have a totally different combo and RC system and wallbreaks that would keep it from ever really feeling like Xrd.

I can tell you as Faust i don't get 6P CH anywhere on the screen or even much of anything off it without burning bar for some scaled shit combo. At best i take the double item unless the 236S would kill. Same with Ky you gotta spend meter to get some weaker wall break combo otherwise its a single hit followup.

I don't have the season pass because i didn't like the game much. But the characters i do like feel like the used to just not as varied. It still feels like GG just not as good.

>I can tell you as Faust i don't get 6P CH anywhere on the screen or even much of anything off it without burning bar for some scaled shit combo
That''s because Faust is fucking shit tier in Strive thanks to the Potnigger Katano