Which game genre takes the most skill?

Anything that ISN'T singleplayer. You can always knock your head against the wall to beat a singleplayer game. Sure, it's skilled to do something first try, but that's not exactly a tangible feat as opposed to someone doing it after 100 tries. Computers/RNG/etc can always be manipulated or predicted, and patterns can be recognized. The real thing is trying to predict other players' approached and inputs. So, Shmups and Rhythm are basically entirely out of the equation. I would say RTS and Arena Shooters would be the highest, with movement based fighting games shortly behind. Team based games like CS:GO are also pretty skill dependent, but also heavily tie into strategy and communication

Yes. What about them?

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shmups and rhythm games still have competitive multi-player elements, they're just not real-time.
Id only discount rhythm games entirely because they aren't even video games, they're the equivalent of peeling potatoes really fast or some shit and proclaiming that as your gameplay

funny and cute!

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where do I even get one of these things

>shmups and rhythm games still have competitive multi-player elements
competitive rhythm games are either score attack (which is literally just what the single player is, but with another player doing the same shit) or something stupid like GH3 battle mode
I know there is a competitive shmup out there where you actually effect your opponent's run, but it's still not the most involved thing, hence why I cross them out of the equation. It'd be like saying that bowling and tennis have similar elements of competition

Fumos are not for fug

>fumoshit
Kuso thread check this 5

im not trying to fuck it, I just want it cause it looks nice
what's wrong with fumoshit retard

>im not trying to fuck it, I just want it cause it looks nice
sure you aren't.

don't project your weird fetishes onto me

I'm projecting your fetishes onto yourself. Don't dish out what you can't take.

you forgot arena shooters and milsims
it's made by an indie circle, limited supply, extremely hard to get thanks to e-celebs, memes and scalpers. you can buy them on amiami if you're lucky.

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If you count how heavy p2w is and *skill* to scam people

This is not about Video Games.

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Fighting is the hardest, needs a lot of motor skills and quick thinking.
I've never played realistic type racing games (like with a wheel and everything) so I can't tell you if they are hard.
Rhythm gems are more about getting accustomed to them, they look extremely hard but it's just practice.
SHMUPs are similar to rhythm games but they need more base skill, but again it's just practice.
Strategy games have almost no motor skill component, it's more about studying mechanics and applying your own creativity to use them, they need some intellectual capability I guess but a monkey could learn to play them if you give them a week of studying.

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Well I am wanting to fuck it

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shmup > rhythm > strategy > racing >>> fighting

Strategy games not requiring any motor skill component? Have you never played an RTS game before?

Racing is more knowledge based. If you don't understand the physics of making car go fast, you'll never be able to compete at a high level.
Rhythm is pure mechanical capability and reaction time, the game literally tells you what buttons to push and when.
SHMUP is largely rote memorization of patterns.

It's either fighting or strategy both genres I suck at

Real Time Strategy > Fighting > Racing > Strategy

I don't play Rhythm or Shmup so no comment. I put RTS and Fighting on top cause they not only require a lot of thought but also practiced mechanical skill. You need knowledge as well as execution to play these games skillfully. Non-RTS strategy games are usually single player anyway so the skill requirement for them is way lower

I bought mine online half a decade or so ago from an online store.

fumo onahole

Rote memorization of patterns (not accounting for the variety of random ones in shmups), especially at a high-scoring level is way harder than fighting games or strategy games.

Anything multiplayer with minimal or no random elements.

Confirmed for not having played a single fighting game nor strategy game if you actually believe this. shmups is just pattern recognition and AI abuse against deterministic foes on autoscroll, both fighting and strategy pits you against unpredictable human players.

getting a successful 2-ALL in ketsui is undeniably far harder than anything fighting games and multiplayer strategy games can throw at you, until you get to the professional level. factor in scoring and it's clear which one's far harder.

rhythm has infinite ceiling and there's no luck or alteration involved unlike fighting or strategy or shumps
racing is the same i guess, if you are playing like time attack and not actually with other people on the track with you

>multiplayer with minimal or no random elements.
nigga other people are random elements as it gets

Yeah, and it's still strategy/fighting. ANY singleplayer game is predictable with enough practice. in a shmup you are literally beating the game at the same exact rate every single time on autoscroll, against enemies that will be in the exact same spot every single time. The outcome is practically solved for you.
And score attack isn't a matter of skill, it's just a matter of practice against a predictable game board.
Multiplayer games with human opponents are forever-changing and forcefully require you to adapt on the fly. They introduce unpredictability and force you to think what your opponent would also do.

unpredictability isn't a big deal when the margin of error is still so high against human opponents. you are forgetting that humans make mistakes, shmup AI doesn't. with that in mind, you're going to have to go waaaaay up the ladder in order to find opponents that require the same amount of effort as high level (not even world record level) shmup playing.

Are you fucking kidding me? There essentially is no difference between rhythm "games" and a string of QTEs. They literally tell you what buttons to press and when. They are the furthest thing from skilled gameplay you can get, because it's the furthest from actual thoughtful gameplay that is out there. It's all dull, mechanical, and thoughtless tasks that you can barely even call a game..

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>rhythm has infinite ceiling and there's no luck or alteration involved unlike fighting or strategy or shumps
i'm pretty sure playing shmups for score has a similarly "infinite" ceiling. good luck getting the highest possible score on, say, Cave games with loops.
Rote memorization is a skill, and the hardest skill at that.

The subject is about which genre takes the most skill, not what the average experience will be like against average players. high-level strategy / fightan absolutely BTFO's high level shmup play

Fighting games and strategy games simply don't require enough raw execution at the highest level to compare to something like shooting for the world record in shmups.

We had this thread already

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Sure it's a skill in other genres. But in rhythm """""games""""" It is meaningless, because it amounts to meaningless actions with no freedom of thought whatsoever.
Peeling vegetables is a skill, too, you know.

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Raw execution is raw execution. That very lack of freedom is what reduces the margin of error. There's no two ways about it; you have to perfect your skill.

raw execution input favors muscle memory which is one skill out of many. strategy and fightans require an immense degree of muscle memory and thus raw execution input AND mind games that shmups don't have

Again, what skill? rhythm games LITERALLY spell out to you every single action and move you must take. Like, do you realize how silly this is? I didn't throw out that mention about peeling vegetables randomly, you know.

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Just because they are simple gameplay loop does not mean they aren't video games, that's utterly stupid. Playing them is completely a matter of skill, hitting buttons in the exact instant you are supposed to is a task that requires skill, one with a high ceiling at that.

Yes but shumps often have some bit of random elements in them, and anything with elements of luck is not skill. But yeah, like 99% of shumps is also a matter of skill, and the ceiling is similarly high.
I rarely see random luck elements in rhythm games, in fact I don't think I have ever, which is why I would put it above shumps.

So what do you also think it takes 0 skill to become a master pianist? I don't think you know what skill means.

the fact that you can reduce the execution for fighting and strategy games down to "muscle memory" is a testament to how low the necessary level of execution is compared to shmups. the added mind games still don't make up for the sheer amount of execution required of you in high level scoring.
>rhythm games LITERALLY spell out to you every single action and move you must take.
Yes, and? Taking those actions and moves successfully is still a difficult skill.
>I didn't throw out that mention about peeling vegetables randomly, you know.
I don't really get your point there
Fair enough

Opening and closing your pencil case is the same thing. You open/close in the exact order you are supposed to. Riveting gameplay. So much skill involved.

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>rhythm games LITERALLY spell out to you every single action and move you must take
Rhythm games, Maimai specifically, is the most difficult game ever created because it requries the use of two hands.

okay open and close your pencil case with me calling out to you when to do it several times per minutes and you doing it exactly when I say within a margin or error of milliseconds

open and close eight pencil cases so that it plays out the entirety of vivaldi's four seasons perfectly and then come back to me about how easy it is

The fact that you think rhythm games are the same as being a master pianist really shows how pretentious you are when it comes to a genre that's just glorified QTEs.
>Yes, and? Taking those actions and moves successfully is still a difficult skill.
A skill with no merit or thought behind it- which was what the peeling vegetables analogy was for. Shmups require much more thought & precision and therefore beats rhythm games a hundred-fold.
Whoa, you can open and close your pencil case with the use of TWO hands now!

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Rhythm game's may not require "thought", but they still require similar amounts of precision. I'm not saying they're harder than shmups, but I am saying they're still an extremely high skill ceiling genre.

Name ONE game that NEEDS you to use two hands that isn't Maimai.

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>The fact that you think rhythm games are the same as being a master pianist really shows how pretentious you are when it comes to a genre that's just glorified QTEs.
Explain how playing the piano isn't just glorified QTEs.