Pirate a game, enjoy it

If you go out of business as a company developing games then it's your business sense, advertising, and production that is the problem not piracy. If that comic were true at all companies like Bethesda wouldn't exist because literally everybody and their mom has pirated a copy of Skyrim by now.

>charge $60 for a game
>make it Epic exclusive
>wait 6 months for steam release
>don't provide a demo
>don't have any free weekends
>wonder why nobody pays for your game

>>trying to justify piracy is the kind of thing a brainless savage does
>proceeds to justify himself

>”Hey, I’d like to try out this old game. It may be outdated, but I’d like to see how games from this era play”
>Either need to spend $30 to $10,000 for the fucking game, even if it were available or resold, which isn’t always the case
>Or you can spend $0 and almost always find it

The non-music radio industry did until about '95 music industry did until about '05 and film studios were worse about it until about '15. By about '25 it'll get a lot better because by then the majority of games in existence will only be available through torrents.

In the end, it all comes down. Data is so cheap now and Internet speeds so good where torrenting is practical for most people. Even in countries with completely locked down intranets, piracy still happens. It cannot be stopped at this point. The same applies to bitcoin faggots who shit everything up with their cancer, but I digress.

>pic unrelated

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Be careful user, or Todd may go bankrupt because of you.

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No he didn’t, he just said he steals because he’s a thief. Simple as.

I pirate games if they're not for sale or if the pirated version is less annoying to play.

all media should be free.
without the advent of the internet i mean

DON'T ASK QUESTIONS

>I steal from them because I can and they deserve it
>I steal from them because I can and I like to not pay for things
Simple or not, in the end, telling someone why you pirate is justifying it.

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Piracy also makes eventual paying customers out of people who would've never touched the game/franchise in question otherwise, be it because of their financial situation or just a lack of interest. Plenty of people from third world countries are like this, buying a game is not an option when it costs half of your pay for the month.

every other industry has product quality standards. not entertainment software. also, the entertainment software industry has zero barrier to entry: anyone can download an SDK and start making software.
it's no wonder some people don't value entertainment software very highly. 99% of it is pure shit.

>Is what all millions of piraters whispered to themselves

I used to pay for games when they sold a finished product that was thoroughly bug tested and included all originally planned content in one purchase.

fuck off ESL monkey

Eh I try to avoid pirating new games but I think once it reaches about 10 years it’s a free game to me especially if I can’t find a cheap price for it (

Seethe harder.

Why do indie devs always assume their game sold poorly because of pirates?

You are beyond retarded. AN explanation isn't a justification, learn to fucking read.
The only correct response. If you're a pirate, you should accept what you are doing is wrong (HURR NO MORALITY DOESNT EXIST) because it's theft. It makes you a nigger, but if you just want free things, that's your choice. Just stop with the mental gymnastics trying to blame the dev or the government or whatever.
>but it isnt theft its a copy!
retard, buy a disk that's blank and then buy a new video game. the price difference is the information on the disk, meaning any copy is worth the money involved

>pirate game, enjoy it
>buy it to support devs
>pirate game, don't enjoy it
>shit company goes out of business
>company cries about muh piracy instead of accepting that their games were shit

>make a shit game
>force it to be exclusive to one platform
>add drm
>force shitty day 1 patches because your dev team can't follow schedules corporate forced them, or because of incompetence on both sides
>installing
>oh, heres a forced 30gb patch that you must install or else no game for you
>oh you modded it? banned
>oh you want the rest of the game? That'll be $40 plus tip
>WHY ARE SO MANY PEOPLE PIRATING THIS GAME?

oh and
>caving to chinks

My buying decision is pretty simple.

> Check if there's a well seeded torrent of it. If yes then download.
>If I think the game is worth money, buy it on Steam. Otherwise stop playing.
>Exception are the smaller indie games that are under 10 quid. Sometimes I'll just pick them up.because I like the Store Page and it has decent Steam reviews.
>
>If you charge 30+ for your game then unless I've seen a ton of reviews, previews, etc from normal anons then I'm not buying the game. They could make Pong 3: The RePongening and I still wouldn't automatically buy a 30+ game.

i wouldnt shop anywhere that a guy wearing a beret is working

Call the cops, I don't give a fuck. The only hesitation I ever have is how much do I trust the .exe that I just downloaded.

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lol i hope mangarock doesn't think this will make me suddenly buy manga; i just switched to another app.

No one has to know I pirated it. I wasn't going to buy it anyway since I'm broke. Your line of reasoning is flawed.

>Dev doesn't agree with me politically
That's fine, if the game is good I don't mind.
>Devs go and virtue signal about said politics online
YAAARRGH

Keep your opinions to yourself or I'll pirate your game no matter how good it is.

how many companies have gone out of business because of piracy?

Games have become so fucking shitty I don't even pirate them anymore.

Games as a service is the way to go theyve discovered.. You can't pirate fortnite cosmetics or an Overwatch Battlenet account. Inhate multiplayer but its true.

if I had the power to sink companies by pirating I'd pirate every game EA makes.

This is retarded IQ but I'm not sure if OP is actually aware of the retardedness as bait.
>Specific arrangements of information has a fiscal value
>I know this because it has a fiscal value, therefore proving it has a fiscal value.
>Instead of understanding the basic nature of supply and demand, I ignore market forces and believe that products or services have an inherent wealth tied into them by their existence.
>No I dont know why air is free.
Never forget that the average user here is an edgy teenager full of angst and hormones trying to act smart rather than somebody who actually knows things.

Blaming others is easier than improving yourself.
>you should accept what you are doing is wrong because it's theft
See >Just stop with the mental gymnastics trying to blame the dev or the government or whatever
Why is it mental gymnastics? Everyone has a reason (explanation or justification, I'll let your autism decide) to pirate or not to pirate, let people discuss, there's always one of you raging because of these threads.

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Thankfully GaaS games are shit, so it's not an issue.

>studies show piracy doesn't hurt the industry
>meanwhile the industry is using more and more scummy business practices and will continue to do so if people keep buying games

I don't pirate but anti-pirate fags are retarded
Give me one example of piracy hurting a developer

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cool bait
look at this picture

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>Data is cheap
>Even remotely regarding a restricted internet access as the norm.

You sicken me.

Beautiful Desolation

>Beautiful Desolation
who?

if the game never got translated, it got delisted, or the devs and publishers went under 20 years ago, it’s fair game

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If I could push a button and erase all video-games from existence I would. They are an awful drug in the hands of children and have costed me my youth, along with television.

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>I know this because it has a fiscal value, therefore proving it has a fiscal value.
Yes, you fucking moron.
>
>Instead of understanding the basic nature of supply and demand, I ignore market forces

Hurr hurr market prices hurr are you actually a fucking retard? I study economics. You don't fucking factor in theft when dealing with supply and demand theory. Now you're just spouting off nonsense to pretend you have an argument.
> and believe that products or services have an inherent wealth tied into them by their existence
When did I say this? Oh yeah, never. The analogy was about copies vs actual objects I.E. the stolen candy bar argument of piracy. If a candy bar theft is wrong, then so is a digital download. Just because the object of consumption isn't physical doesn't mean it doesn't have value, you're actually trying to rewrite fucking economic books just to justify piracy. Holy fuck that's some dedication.

Is it really that important to you to feel good about yourself? Why are NPC brainlets unable to accept fault? They can't admit they do anything wrong, it's always justified or handwaved or something else's fault.

if you play bad games pirated or not you're a fucking dumbass and your opinion holds no merit

But that isn't the care for most pirates and you know it damn well. Sure, some of them will enjoy something and pay the devs back, but most won't. Come the fuck on. No one can be that naiive. So if you pirate a game, play it, and don't send any money for the effort of playing it at the given market cost (pitching in $5 for the delux edition and all DLC doesn't count) you stole.

It really is not that fucking big of a deal, but it astounds me how much you have to spin your arguments like a hamster on wheel to desperately tell yourself it's okay.

maybe stop blaming everything else and start fixing the actual problem, tipper.

This is one of the big reasons why i chose not to become a game dev for now, the job is just too fucking unstable. Only games i work on are mobile games in small dev groups in my freetime atm because i can be sure that i get paid

>YOU NEED TO BLINDLY FOLLOW THE LAW PIRACY IS WRONG
>Ok, law says piracy isn't theft though
>NOOOOO PIRACY IS THEFT YOU'RE A THIEF
There has never, EVER been ANY empiracle data proving piracy lowers profit. Radio, music, film, television, software, and now video games, all garganutaiton billion dollar industries with unlimited power and resources, and all the incentive in the world to objectively prove how piracy hurts their bottom line. Every single one to date still fails to do so, and instead resorts to blaming pirates for doing their utmost to fuck their legitmate customers instead. There IS however proof that piracy DOESN'T hurt sales, proof that they refused to publish, because what they wanted the opposite. These industries have no interest in the truth, or a mutually beneficial relationship with their customer base. Their only obligation is to their investors and bottom line, and thus my only obligation is to my self interest and bottom line til they learn the meaning of the word compromise. Keep fucking me over on the price, censorship, propaganda in video games, and post purchase monetization, and I'll keep contributing to the piracy.

I don't justify my piracy. I buy the game when I can and I fully admit I'm doing something wrong when I pirate games like the Sims 4 but that price is bullshit.

The only justifiable piracy is something you can't even buy anymore.

source please, I want to laugh at author

>the price difference is the information on the disk, meaning any copy is worth the money involved
If everyone suddenly stopped playing video games, it wouldn't be worth the garbage it was lying in. The only value you could reasonably apply to a video game is the labour cost, however as you are creating a product of your own volition and not by commission, the risk of not being compensated for your labour is entirely on you. That is why many underperforming games result in the closure of studios. Games are only valuable to people who want to play them. If you spend 10,000 man hours on making a piece of shit that nobody wants to play, then that is too bad. You are NOT entitled to success or payment just because you made something. If I spend a hundred hours gathering, freezing and linking together dog shit necklaces, I can't cry just because no one is interested in buying them. It might be a product, it might have cost me labour to make, but it's value is based on demand. Shitty game = shitty sales. It is completely possible for a product or service to be of such low quality, or so trivial that it doesn't justify payment of any measure. You should be paying people to PLAY your shitty indie title, not the other way around.

>not good enough to make me want to pay
That's not the same as bad. Not to mention I like to play a game before deciding if it's really bad or not.
>But that isn't the care for most pirates and you know it damn well.
Why would that be relevant? The "I will pay if the good is game" argument is not me trying to defend piracy but rather me explaining why "I" (the individual) partake in piracy.
>It really is not that fucking big of a deal
You sure make it sound like it is. I just said why I do it.

>industry has zero barrier to entry: anyone can download an SDK and start making software
You say that as if people would mostly pirate shit 3rd country games

mangarock.com

>make a game that isn't worth keeping
>wonder why people don't keep it
not hard

>pirate game
>industry dies
Piratechads are the true heroes.

Blow it out your ass

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I'm not complaining about my current addiction though the responsibility isn't fully mine. I'm explicitly complaining about an industry that gets its bucks hooking literal toddlers.

Yeah just shit on everybody else because you alone cant handle it

Gacha, loot boxes, paid subscriptions, etc is the result of piracy.

You only have yourselves to blame.

Isn't it funny that the bigger, and more profitable these industries get, the louder the cries about piracy get? Regardless of their growth speed, or any other factor, they continue claiming lost profits that account for more fucking money than there is on earth. The video gaming industry went from children's toys tier in the 80s, to eclipsing Hollywood in size and profits, and yet there's no end to their greed and wild claims of lost profits, and the constant push for more and more and more. These industries aren't motivated by logic, or facts of any sort, they operate entirely on the whims and greed of investors that flock to them the more successful they become. Of course this strictly applies to the big boys, who don't come here to cry. The bitching and whining we get here is from failed indies who missed the indie gold rush and blame their failures on pirates, so they and their journo and tranny buddies are on an eternal GAMERS ARE DEAD crusade for not getting the millions that they believe they're owed for making a bad bootleg of 20 and 30 year old games and genres.

>Gacha, loot boxes, paid subscriptions, etc is the result of lack of regulations
There, fixed. Surprise mechanics.

Disnt crysis loose a shitton of sales due to piracy?

Piracy has been scientifically proven to have no significant effect on the gaming industry. I still buy games if I really like the devs but in order to find out whether I do or not I have to pirate and play before anything else. Same shit with literally everything else I enjoy in media: I bought CDs of bands I enjoy and blu-rays of shows / anime as well as manga. All of this shit would have been overlooked were they not initially free without restraints for me.

I buy games I want to buy, I don't even bother pirating games anymore because 9 times out of 10 they're not even worth the bandwidth. They stopped caring about games long before piracy was an "issue". Crysis and spore were two of the most pirated games of all time because of the hype, and they were still massive successes.

if you werent going to buy it anyway from the start they arent getting money either

>Pirated Rpg Maker VXA
>Really enjoyed it
>"Holy shit, I can do so many new things!"
>"...holy shit, I fucking stole something I really enjoy."
>"I should get a legit copy so if I make a game that can sell, I won't get nailed."
>"...oh dear God. I'm an asshole."
>Buy legit copy.

>The industry that didn't need those things to reach its current size (which is over a 100 times the size where it was 30 years ago) now needs those greedy tactics to stay afloat
How does this many fucking sense you absolute imbecil? It's THE FASTEST GROWING ENTERTAINMENT INDUSTRY IN THE HISTORY OF OUR FUCKING SPECIES. Yet, somehow it needs MORE to make up for getting big too fast? What the fuck even goes on in the brain of retards like you to reach conclusions like this? The industry managed to reached its current size with a fraction of the customers and none of those practices, but now that it's bigger than ever, with more customers and investors than ever, with more profits than ever, it NEEDs those practices for some reason to maintain its FORMER, much less profitable, much SMALLER size?

>love and believe in games
But I dont believe in games, at all. It's a failed industry fraught with vice-grip exploitation and mindless consumerism
The games that deserve to be popular don't become big enough, and games that have lived far past their prime and exist solely as a product are bigger than ever and make billions
I only play free shit or buy games that deserve the money

Name 1 game when this happened

prove it

What another app bro?

Stop acting like lawsute, econoRmicus.
You understand that piracy has always been in the gaming industry. Even at the best of times.
If you stop thinking like an ass and open your eyes to the fact that the DLS caused more damage than the damn pirates.
only what i want hear from you, what your opinion on "GaaS"...

>omg free!
>perfect for someone as poor as me!

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>mangarock.com
that's just aggregator.

I have another app but nothing was as convenient and as reliable as MangaRock was. If their new services isn't dog shit I might actually pay for manga which is unfortunate for my wallet.

>Maybe if I shame them they'll buy our game!
Haha.

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the golden age of free (as in freedom) vidya is within our reach all we have to do is pirate everything and the grabblers will go away

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I'm just waiting for the inevitable "not buying my game is as bad as piracy" at this point. You know it's coming, these "people" feel entitled to money and success just for existing.

ey, i made a thread about that weeks ago

If your dick is not good enough to make me want to fuck you, you deserve to be cucked

But eventually that will be every game

If everyone suddenly stopped playing video games, it wouldn't be worth the garbage it was lying in. The only value you could reasonably apply to a video game is the labour cost, however as you are creating a product of your own volition and not by commission, the risk of not being compensated for your labour is entirely on you.
No it isn't. You have to go through a publishing company, which also has a bunch of employees. They have to go to a marketing firm. "Labor" also doesn't include just people coding, it means people in accounting, finance ETC. We are talking specifically about triple A games, obviously, because indie games are very cheap to compensate for their generally lower budget.
>If everyone stopped playing video games
What's your point in bringing this up, other than showing your complete lack of understanding of economics in an armchair attempt at jigsawing an argument as to how theft doesn't affect an industry? Yes, if demand was 0, you could buy it for 0. Demand isn't 0. So you can't buy it for 0, you have to steal it.
>Buy officer, if the demand for this tv was 0--
No, it isn't 0. It costs something. The fact that it has a price and it is bought and sold at that price infers something.
>You are NOT entitled to success or payment just because you made something.
Yep, and you aren't entitled to something for free. By this logic, you should just steal everything and it's completely moral because the market is...wrong?

that's why you do it after it gets a sequel

>$60 game feels worthwhile so some people buy it
>People who don't agree with the price tag pirate it, if they like it they'll buy it
>Game companies are given a reason to competitively priced their games rather than just inflating the price because profits

Piracy is good consumer protection and helps the free market of games to work.

People have been saying that since the rise of F2P games in the early-mid 2000s.
Sorry m8, it's not happening, and if it does, EVERY game will be shit, because GaaS by definition have to aim for the lowest common denominator in order to stay afloat.

bigg piss smell

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Maybe they should stop making it so that games are literally easier to play when pirated. I have to sign on to two different gaming platforms and maintain a constant uninterrupted internet experience to play this singleplayer game? I think I'll do without the hassle thanks, being free is just a bonus.

>the price difference is the information on the disk, meaning any copy is worth the money involved
That's so far from being correct that I have to assume this is some sot of elaborate ruse on your part.

But I buy games I like after pirating. If I didn't like them enough to buy after I finish it then I couldn't give a shit if it gets a sequel.

thank you

Why not just cut out the middleman and heavily regulate the games industry?
If they want to try and fuck us at every turn when, by all accounts, they're extremely lucky to be afforded the many rights they have, why not just bend them over and fuck them with the long dick of the government?

reminder piracy boost sales

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Not really, games as a service is a self solving issue. The product itself is worthless without a player base, unlike good single player games. The biggest titles in this category tend to cannablize the smaller ones, and games with a small playerbase don't attract new players and eventually just bleed out players and die out. A problem that's exclusive to multiplayer only titles. It happened with WoW and MMOs, it happened with LoL, DOTA 2 and mobas, it will happen to all other games of this type. The same applies to gacha and mobile, only the biggest titles make any money. Single player games don't make the big bucks, but they're more stable and secure, and they're the way to go for indies, and low budget studios. Single player games are only not feasible to AAA with their massively inflated marketing and staff budgets. There will ALWAYS be a place for single player games, because there's NOT enough space for every game to be mobile, F2P, and multiplayer only.

>you should be paying people to play your games!
maximum bait

Shut the fuck up ESL.

Sorry user but I just pirate things that I deem overpriced
Sims 4, Sonic Forces, $40+ VNs, seemingly low budget JRPGs that are also $40+ for whatever reason like SAO Fatal Bullet, shit like that

>piracy is bad
>piracy is killing the industry
>2020
>industry is doing better than ever
>piracy is still a thing
get fucked

>Sorry user but I just pirate things that I deem overpriced
So do I. Any game that costs more than $0 is overpriced.

>better than ever
Better than everything*
It's the biggest and most profitable an entertainment industry has ever been in history, PERIOD.

>b-but think of the poor starving billionaire investors! They could be making so much more!
Bootlickers are mentally ill and live vicariously through rich people and authority figures.

>LoL
Huh, I haven't read anything about it, I thought League was still doing well. Is it finally dead?

You misunderstood, LoL and DOTA 2 killed every other moba and left no space for a competitor. That's how GaaS operates, it's feast or famine, there's no room for mid sized games, only 2 or 3 huge ones, and that's it. That's why single player games are going nowhere, they're the working class of video games, they don't make the billions, but they have next to no entry fee, and everyone from 1 man in a garage, to huge studios in Tokyo and LA can make a decent profit from them. Of course this isn't good enough for investors who want infinite profit and growth, which is why they think every company should be GaaS even if 90% of them go under in the process.

piracy for bigname games literally doesnt matter.
piracy can negatively impact niche games though.

>piracy can negatively impact niche games though
Do you have a single fact to back that up?

the extremely easy DS piracy lead to titles like ZX and Ghost Trick underperforming because the target audience was the same people that would just buy a flashcard.
meanwhile normie titles like Pokemon and Animal Crossing flourished.

10k people pirating Pokemon doesnt matter at all. 10k people pirating some smalltime game can make the difference between a sequel and the dissolving of a dev team.

Do feelings and emotion count? I mean, look at all those other indies that made millions. I think my game is just as good, hell, even better than theirs! I'm owed my share damn it!

But how do you know that the people pirating would have otherwise bought the game?

Oh, I see, my bad. And yes, your analysis is pretty much on point.

Don't care lol

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GBATemp right around Pokemon Platinum release.
Game had a new anti piracy measure. People said they would wait it out until its cracked.
Not two days after launch tons caved in and went to the store to pick up a copy.
Its retarded to assume that no available piracy would not result in extra sales.

I myself am living proof of that and enough to prove you wrong, I buy way more multiplayer games that cant be pirated while pirating most of my single player stuff as its easy.

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nice anecdotal evidence

when your claim is binary its all it takes.

actually piracy is a problem, if people keep getting your software through illegal channels and never pay you, thats not on you. its not your fault.

It really doesn't.
Your claim is that piracy matters enough that small studios will go under because of it. You need more than a couple anecdotes to prove that.

ok retard

He's right and you know it. You have proven nothing.
That being said, I have a hunch that it does impact them, but I'm not stupid enough to call my hunch a fact.

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mangarock had put the comic out sometime in september of last year on an announcement that they were no longer allowing piracy, the op comic is an edit that just changed the text to say games.
not sure if they actually stuck to it though, I havent checked since.

no need to samefag desu

>refuses to substantiate any of his claims
>"dude just trust me lol"
>"No"
>"lol ur retarded"
kys

If you want to argue in bad faith, go ahead, but it doesn't make you right.

no? Mobile gaming is the most profitable and grew the most. Other Platforms did not grow that much

is this bikecuck

literally all piracy defenders argue in bad faith making claims like "pirates would not buy games if they couldnt pirate them".

This implies I would have bought the game if I didn't pirate.

>unironically defending piracy
just pirate shit bro who cares
if you feel the need to defend it then you feel guilt for whatever reason and that's your own fuckin problem, don't try and throw the blame onto something else like a fuckin tard

Pokemon IP was the single most profitable IP entertainment prior to any mobile entries.
GTA V
Minecraft
Fortnite
LoL
Almost one of these by itself is bigger and more profitable than the entire industry combined from the 80s and 90s. You're a fucking retard, don't ever reply to me again.

>because it's theft
What has been taken? The dev has literally lost no money from it.

>be pirate my whole life
>go into game development
>still pirate
>company grows suspicious about me when we talk about shipping with drm
>im opposed to it
>explain that drm is a pain in the ass
>meeting over
>its getting late, almost off
>boss calls me in
>asks me if im a pirate, no bullshit
>say yes and i always have been
>dont give a reason
>"you realize youre treading on thin ice right"
>"if being a pirate costs me my job, ill accept it. id rather be transparent and honest"
>my boss is stunned
>"were you expecting to be fired?"
>"yeah?"
>he goes on to say that he called me in because he wanted to understand the mindset of someone that hates drm
>explained how, why, differences in drm for end-user, methods to deal with it without using drm in the common sense
>its well past the time im supposed to leave
>"user ill be honest with you, it disgusts me that youre so open about being a pirate but your knowledge is important to have on hand"
>say my thanks for not firing me and leave
>come in the next day
>my key card isnt working
>the fuck
>call boss
>"wait what"
>he makes a call to the person managing our building security
>apparently everyone in the meeting thought i was fired
>had to get my key card reactivated
>everyone now hates the shit out of me
>boss calls a meeting
>everyone in the development team, no exceptions
>its quiet and im just on the side of the room by the door
>all eyes drawn on me
>boss asks me to leave the room
>what
>outside of the room i can hear incoherent chatter
>hear boss say "listen" but it was very muffled
>standing outside this door for seemingly the same time i was in his office
>it goes silent and he asks me to come back in
>everyone looking away from me
>"the fuck did you say to them?"
>"i played a recording of our discussion last night so they knock it off and understand your perspective. we make games, we're trying to succeed. treating each other like shit wont work"
>mfw
call me a LARPing faggot if you want; i got promoted afterward

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mobile is grew more in recent years than pc or console gaming. The industry will shift towards mobile slowly but surely

>breathing air is wrong. If you feel the need to defend it you just feel guilty

>is grew more
fuck off pajeet

yes you would have, i pirate alot but when my pc broke down and i had only my xbox i started buying games again

being a fucking retard is wrong but i'm not going to expect you to defend your retardation

based
if i ever release my game im going to have payment be optional or upload it to pirate bay

lol nice argument cracker

You got recorded without permission, sue the bastards after they fire you.

We have LITERAL FUCKING OBJECTIVELY METRIC FACTS commissioned by the very same people who want to paint piracy as bad that proves the opposite. FACTS they REFUSED to publish even though they PAID MILLIONS to uncover them, because they didn't fit the narrative they wanted to push. There's no getting through to people like you. You hold your feelings above reality. You were never open to an opposing opinion to begin with, you're merely here to spout your own blindly.

larping faggot

i don't have any money to buy games lol

I know you're using "literally" as hyperbole (at least I hope you do) but even then, that's not true. Look at the thread if you want a few decent examples of sound reasoning.
>if you feel the need to defend it then you feel guilt for whatever reason
What kind of logic is that?
Factorio basically is that. They are pretty cool.

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that law applies to california. elsewhere its not an issue, it just makes you look really shitty
there he is

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>LARP
I've never understood why people use this online. LARP stands for Live-Action Role-Play. Role-playing online by definition is not live-action.

former pirate here, it's fucking true

Gamestop is essentially The Pirate Bay.

They sell brand new games "used" so they get 100% of the profit while the game company gets zero.

Even so, game companies do this all the time, "buy it or we wont make a sequel" well you buy it "we wont make the sequel now enjoy the DLC"

>I have a hunch that gravity makes things fall, but I'm not stupid enough to call my hunch a fact.

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you are too stupid to even understand what is written in the posts here.

>Shmorky is a moralfag
Talk about Yikes!

god here, this guy is wrong

Wow, false equivalence! You really showed me! It's ALMOST as if you weren't retarded!
Here, I can also post reaction images!

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The idea that piracy does not harm creative mediums inherently is false
cnet.com/news/digital-video-piracy-costs-the-movie-and-tv-industry-at-least-29-billion-study-says/

The study you are talking about does not conclusively prove whether piracy helps or hurts gaming. And im pretty sure the study took into account only larger AAA games that are not accessible to pirate for many people.

i dont make the rules user i just enforce them. its not correct but its whats used, accept it like we have to accept that theres no way to stop EA

I'll pirate console and handheld games without a care in the world. The only thing stopping me from pirating PC games is not knowing a trustworthy site because I'm paranoid as hell and don't trust things that'll show up on google to not be filled with malware or some shit.

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I'll gladly pay you Tuesday for the fun games you made today. I can't pay you if I kill myself from boredom desu.

pirating pc games isnt that hard if you know what red flags to look for
piratebay for example - not uploaded by trusted user, very recent upload with massive amount of seeders, comments saying its bad shit, stay away from those cause they probably have malware

Watching videos of games also hurts them, listening to the OST on Hulu or Youtube also hurts them, the medium is composed of so many elements and ingrained within digital media that those who have become used to the manipulation of information or data regarding the subject makes them able to choose otherwise than buying the product itself, and yet the gaming industry proliferates from an ever growing customer base that grants them a higher budget by the year that rivals the cosmetic industry.

This is Yea Forums - Video Games, not Yea Forums - the movie and tv industry.

>larger AAA games that are not accessible to pirate for many people.
You're a special kind of retard, aren't you? AAA games are literally the first on the block to crack and pirate. How the fuck are the biggest, most advertised, and overhyped games not the most pirated you fucking retard? The rest of your post is meaningless conjecture. Indies will claim piracy ruined them no matter what, even though the vast, vast, vast majority of failure in indies stems from lack of sales due to low quality, but they always attribute low sales to piracy with 0 proof, because piracy is the most convenient universal boogeyman since Nazis.

the pc market runs off what are essentially DONATIONS. This is why i think console gaming should be the focus from here on out.

The biggest modern indies make more than the biggest studios ever made on PC from the 90s. You people are beyond ignorant. It's so fucking profitable with so little upkeep, that the fucking stubborn Japs who don't ever use PC for anything other than VNs and porn are porting their shit from decades ago for free money.

>This is Yea Forums - Video Games, not Yea Forums - the movie and tv industry.
The argument still applies. The idea that piracy can't have negative consequences is false. AAA games require good hardware that many people don't have access to. In an ideal world piracy wouldn't exist at all, esp since the pc market runs completely on donations.

>pirate a game
>enjoy it enough to buy it
>company goes out of business anyway

Every time

>buy game
>have to deal with launchers and other 3rd-party DRM bullshit
>pirate game
>just get the game

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like i said, donations. Most people who i know don't pay for games.

>Because it's theft
But it's not theft. It's piracy. Theft and piracy are two similar, but different things. It would be theft if you stole the discs. Piracy is "intellectual property theft", the subversion of effort into a good that, while intangible, still retains value.

>the vast, vast, vast majority of failure in indies stems from lack of sales due to low quality
prove it

Demos need to be commonplace and there's no reason for so many games to have such a huge budget

Game companies spend millions on advertising. Maybe they should start making actually good games instead.

piracy is theft in spirit, still. The intention of a thief and a pirate are the same.

Not him, and obviously not trying to present this as a real argument, but... have you seen the shit they make?

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An industry that handles mostly hardware has a different perspective to that of a medium that rules into their software, though I wouldn't deny the connection since programmers should be able to reach compatibility within the same subjects of code or libraries, I can only hope that the entire world creates a database based on government observation, everything about mathematics is progamable and therefore it is discoverable, not invented, try aplicating the basic logic of an equation in a library that SHOULD have the same syntax for the compiler's module, it is about aplicability, the software industry runs a profit based on it's accesibility while PC parts and their production's value and stocks are tied to the same concepts that run on car parts, metals and other tools or basic materials, speculation and trust bring their value based on an expectation of purpose, software is just added on top of it but its shifted completely off another district because tying it completely is creating another logopoly.

I only pirate money grubbing AAA shit.
Like, The Sims? I like building houses and turning into a modded out porn game.

But I'm not paying for all those expansions.
I pirate them guilt free knowing full well that EA has more than enough money and The Sims will always make plenty off of bored moms and danger haired lesbians that they don't require my support.

>buy gta 4 when it came out on steam
>fast forward to a few months ago
>can't play my legally owned copy because of microshit drm
>proceed to just pirate it

glad to see they finally fixed it recently, even if they had to remove a few songs....

>The intention of a thief and a pirate are the same.
Absolutely, they are very similar. But even then, they are different, and for the sake of understanding should be addressed as such based on their distinct differences.

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NOOOO THINK OF THE BIG PUBLISHERINOS

The number of pirates that would convert to paying customers is not large enough to save any company from bankruptcy, especially badly managed ones that cry about pirates all the time.

This. The biggest enemy of piracy is not DRM or "uncrackable" games. It's some random script kiddy pumping out ransonware and flooding torrents with poison

Piracy negatively affecting obscure and small games is a no brainer, just like you are. There are no special big brain studies required to discern that fact.
You have a $20 game, and 4,900,000 people buy it. That's 98 million dollars. If 100 thousand people pirated it, you only lost 2 million dollars, in other words about 2.04% of your possible profit was lost.
Now, you have a $20 game, but only 40 people have bought it, $800. 10 people have pirated it, leaving you with $200 lost, a whopping 25% of your possible profits gone. Even then, if an AAA company with that margin of sales were to lose an equivalent 25%, the loss of money would still not be nearly as significant as it would be to an indie studio whose profit isn't even past the triple digits.
TLDR: Kill yourself.

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I would direct you to Kickstarter and it's MANY failures, including Mighty Number 9, in Yea Forums people had hope the game wouldn't actually be trash, yet we were discouraged from supporting it because trailers kept showing assets from Capcom's latest side scrollers while holding an engine with questionable visuals and slow paced gameplay when we were promised Megaman Zero or Touhou like movement.

how is that proof for anything?
its not even true because Yea Forums absolutely did support the mighty no9 kickstarter.

>all this buycuck seethery

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Literally only gamer cuckboys have an issue with piracy. I bet a good 3/4th of them pirate music and movies like everyone else.

I pirate because im a poorfag nigger. Cry about it

>Pirate a game, its trash
>Company doesn't go out of business and continues making garbage sequels
>Wtf i voted with my wallet, wheres the freedom?

Equivalence of customer base and the availability to pirate are directly affected by the game's exposure via marketing and if it's tied with an excellent display of game mechanics to even build public interest into piracy, games that went through greenlite and games that hold no quality whatsoever in the biggest selling platforms are often ignored, and it is usually in comercial demand that piracy also sparks due to the same two prior interests, a game bought by 40 people is unlikely to be pirated even if the example still stands for the sake of argument, but we need to discuss how piracy actually happens before we bring the examples, otherwise we would be setting hypotheticals by which people would be incapable to discern what actually affects the industry.

What gets me is people have seemingly no issue with loading up Pokemon on their phones through an emulator but suddenly when you're doing the same thing but on a console or a PC it's a big fuckin deal.

Game shops are just as damaging to the industry if not moreso.
>Buy a week old game off of you for 10$
>Resell it at 55$ for 550% profit
>Refuse to sell people new copies of games and only sell their pre-owned copies
>People continue to fall for it because 5$ discount and it's 'legal'
>Companies make 0$ off of pre-owned sales

Come now user, you don't believe they're not buying another copy and sending tear-stained letters of self recrimination to Nintendo Japan, do you?

Are we talking in it's initial announcement? Trailers? When the goals were being met and when the deadline got there? When the game released the backlash was so immensed that most of it's backers went on a refund spree that was denied by the company? People felt absolutely betrayed by the showcases! But I am sure you aren't aware because you weren't there to study what happened about the late shipments of rewards, how people didn't even get their games despite giving them in unison literal millions.

Wow, you had to oversimplify the matter at hand to be able to argue that "no special big brain studies required to discern that fact". Brilliant. Stop pretending you understand what you're talking about and maybe try to read a little into the subject.
Luckily for me, while I was afk, user here provided a good amount of information on why your example is out of touch with reality.
Also, keep them reaction images coming, they sure show how desperate you are to "win" a fucking internet discussion.

Crysis lost a shit ton of money because it was a tech demo that hardly anybody could run for ages after it came out.

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I was talking to a friend who was emulating Ace Attorney on his phone while we were talking and looked at me like I just robbed a grandma's purse when I told him if he hacked his 3DS he could just play it on there before he said that pirating is immoral and illegal.

user, your friend might just be a stupid person.

Why would I pay for a game when betas like you do so already?

IDK if your LARPing or not, and i dont care. I just want to call you a faggot. You LARPing faggot.

you make me feel complete user

There is no issue with me oversimplifying it. The statistics aren't even the point, it's merely common sense that if you have an abundance of money, you can afford to lose a little bit, while if you don't, then you can't because "a little bit" to you is actually a lot regardless of how small it is.

based economist user

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A sale you never had is not money you lost.

This man will solve the economic crisis!

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That's why in I refer to it as "possible profit" rather than lost profit. I would consider it lost though considering that the person who pirated it in a normal circumstance would have had to pay that money in order to be playing the game, yet they are playing it without paying for it.

>Otherwise the only games that would exist would be current gen ones which would be overall shit.
You can't tell how shit something is if you never played the games before it that were much MUCH better. This is why they feel they must end piracy.

If you're a small dev with no advertising budget, I fucking guarantee you that the guy who pirated the game wouldn't even look in its general direction if he had to pay for it.

>I fucking guarantee you
you cant.

>all games go free to play and make more money than ever
humm doesn't seem like money is the problem

That depends on the game itself. I personally would only pirate it if I was semi-interested in it for whatever reason, if I could not pirate then I might buy it and refund it if I don't like it.

+1

>a small dev with no advertising budget
I will pirate the shit out of it because suddenly they now think they can charge fucking 30 kangaroo buck for their ever so special pixelshit soulslike metroidvania roguelike fps

This. Good or bad, pirate the games. Companies don't deserve our money.

Yeah, plenty of stuff that was once free on the likes of armorgames is now $15-tier on Steam.
Fucking Fancy Pants Adventure is a paid game now.

My right to copy > your paycheck

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When it comes to indy shit I would still throw $5 at most of them and up to $15 at the really good ones but $30 can lick my scrote.

I have never pirated a good game

>implying devs give that much of a fuck about piracy
>using terms like "boss" and "promoted" instead of actual studio terms
>thinking devs have a say if game gets DRM protection or not
cmon lad

Please consider that Valve and Origin have each a service fee system where as a developer, with a short cycle of work for a project that involves making a game, there is a percentage that the platforms takes away from each sale, and remember this, gaming companies are not individual, the very concept of a gaming company entails multiple private entities such as publishers, developers, etc, most of the money that goes onto the budget are mainly directed towards marketing, if people aren't aware of your product, you can't create comercial demand if customers have no awareness of it, this is what impacts indie developers and why only studios such as ComCept, OtherSide Entertainment and Playtonic Games have shown MASSIVE intial support to the point that it doesn't drag their other financial projects, usually indie games that come from an already built following like Undertail also take up sales quite adequatly with a competent team and because unlike other developers who enclose themselves into one sale platform with no contact through other media expecting demand make adequate sales, using the same method as from o.ther foreign projects like in Brazil, Spain, etc (take blasphemous as an example) have their own clique of customers because they engage with a community through game events or online exposure using this very thing, Indie developers who fail to reach to an audience until they have to showcase the full product of their game or via betas that are exnovational in an enclosed space will provide faded profit.

they're starting to notice that the other media industries solved piracy by becoming service based (netflix/spotify) and are slowly moving towards streaming to solve it

You don't have a right to copy, retard. Imm pro piracy, but this is possibly the worst and stupidest argument for it.

You should.

Thats debatable. Copyright is a thoroughly scammy and warped idea with a century of lobbying behind it.

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Name a single company that went under because of game piracy.

lol fuck your gay ass moralizing. i'm going to steal your game so i can save my money, and you can suck my balls if you don't like it.

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I mean moral right not legal right. Why would I argue legality when it's virtually impossible to get caught in the first place.

Your writing is very hard to read but I get what you're saying. I do know that game studios are not individuals, i'm using individual terms for simplification.

But piracy boosts sales of good games.

It's good enough for you to want to play it apparently. Stop trying to justify you being poor.

But you did. Stupid ESL.

By law, piracy is not theft. Lawyers can't call it theft in court either.

The moralizing in this thread is hilarious. Game companies rarely exist as a group of people anymore. Hundreds of contractors are hired for one project and then fired as soon as possible to save money. Then they're re-hired if they're lucky for another project, but with no chance for long-term benefits. Even if piracy didn't exist it wouldn't make management treat their wagie slaves any better.

I usually buy games cause I know what I like. If I'm unsure about a game I might just ignore it completely and buy something else that I'm more sure of. If I'm truly curious I'll pirate to see what's up. If I can't find a torrent I just ignore the game completely. Sometimes if I'm super curious I'll buy, but if it sucks I'll refund. But I only do that with certain distributors (The ones that give me money back instead of store credit)

For games that appear on distribution platforms like say, The Epic Store. I ignore those games completely as if they never existed in the first place. I don't pirate them, and I don't pay attention to any of the shilling or community discussion.

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Underrated.

We, in fact, can.
gamesindustry.biz/articles/2018-12-03-indie-developers-are-unhappy-with-steams-new-revenue-sharing-tiers
This discusses the dissatisfaction of indie developers towards Steam as a platform setting tiers of profit per sale, why do you think there is dissent among the change? Because Indie developers are only offered a chance of higher profit if they reached MILLIONS IN SALES, something that only can profit triple A companies, investing through a sales platform and using your earning on said platforms to further advertise your product by showcasing it at the front of the app store, also influenced by a discounted sales based on the season related to the company, as a big household name you are more likely to be exposed due to buseness practice and take profit, which further incentivizes public interest and sparks interests for piracy, otherwise we wouldn't get games that are one offs from fit-girl who have gone through this level of exposure and suddenly have gotten attention and being pirated, it doesn't answer everything, but you know very well that if people don't know your game exists, and if your game likely has a playerbase in the double digit, that isn't enough to bring the attention of pirates UNLESS the product had built a cult following as a consequence from big name influencers like Ssentenzcech for example or obscure titles that have slowly but surely grown in influence like how Ultima or Deadly Premonition became excentric yet well known titles.

That comic was done better in the past.

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>muh free things
If you pirate vidya and pretend you're not a socialist you're hypocrite.

lol it would still be at the bottom of the chart because more people are pirating the popular games than the indie ones,
so if there was no piracy, every game would go up in sales.

that has literally nothing to do with the original claim and doesnt prove anything.
all you said is "bigger game means more pirates overall" and well no shit.

>game is shit
>people can smell it way before release day
>BAAWWWWW WHY DIDN'T YOU BUY OUR 60USD DIGITAL GAME AS A SERVICE TURD

eat shit

i'm not a socialist, i only support myself stealing from others, not others stealing from me.

>pirate FIFA
>EA dies of bankruptcy
Epic

The act of lobbying is also at fault with the government, the state demanded fine payments by the year through "donations" to the public by financing officials which would help them continue to do their job as a form of service fee, the fact is that the government harassed the private market into involving itself in politics.

I'm far beyond that point. Even socialists hate me.

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>mommy why does nobody want to pay for my shitty shovelware walking sim ripping off an 80s game with politics mixed in
GEE I WONDER FUCKING WHY????
Neck yourself

>game gets made
>95% of consume base doesn't play it because it's dogshit
>5% pirate it
>company goes bankrupt because their game is shit
>WTF FUCKING PIRATES KILLING THE VIDYA INDUSTRY

Then you are admitting that a pirate wouldn't look in the general direction of a game with a small development and no advertising budget, which is the point of the argument, which I sourced with an issue that while frustrates Indie devs, also correlates towards piracy into their products.

no I wouldnt admit that. you follow no logic.
I think you have brain damage.

>Pirate gaem
>Like it so much that I buy it
>Dislike it so much that I don't buy it and spread word around about how shit gaem is
>Don't buy it because I don't care

>Pro-piracy arguments
Logic
Evidence
Studies
Reason

>Anti-piracy arguments
MY FEEFEES

Now there will be no one to ruin the series with terrible sequel.

Based

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>the rejection towards If you're a small dev with no advertising budget, I fucking guarantee you that the guy who pirated the game wouldn't even look in its general direction if he had to pay for it.
>all you said is "bigger game means more pirates overall" and well no shit.
The presence of an industry giant averts the attention from small developers directly influencing opportunity to buy or pirate their games.

woah that means piracy from potential customers literally doesnt happen for small scale games.
now I see the truth....

Alternatively
>Don't buy, pirate or play said game.
>Spread word around about how shit game is anyway.

>98 million dollar profit
>Development, licensing, publishing, and marketing are completely free and happen automatically in this world I guess

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This is the logic of my argument, just because I didn't put commas doesn't mean my message didn't deliver the point There are many people here who are perfectly able to read into what I was counter arguing about because they have read the rest of the thread, lurk more.

Made by the same guy
I just wanted to read Made in Abysm online FUCK

Also consider this post , it is also from me, but I still suggest to lurk more.

I pirated my favorite game and still haven't paid a dime. Sue me

I'm not considering any of that in my example. But even if I were, I could just say that that's the profit before being spent to pay workers etc.

Demand for torrents is directly proportional to demand for sales. If your game isn't selling, not many people will be interested in pirating it either.

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I always buy pirated games if I enjoy them.

Also consider this post (You), it is also from me, but I still suggest to lurk more. I actually confused the number ID, oh well.

The artist is a corporate faggot

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well thanks for admitting that the piracy still happens.

No shit it does. Piracy exists and to this day nobody presented an argument why it needs to be stopped. Not one that isn't emotional trite that falls apart under basic scrutiny.

mangadex.org/title/16482/made-in-abyss

Thanks user

Post one example where this happened.

Would you like a globe with that?

>publishers being scum is ok
>consumers applying scum tactics to publishers is not ok
Millennials and zoomers will be the end of consumer rights

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>abloo abloo you're stealing
>abloo abloo im just seeing if i like the game first
>abloo abloo coporations bad so it okay
>abloo abloo hardly anyone pirates

FAGGOTS
im keeping my money and i'm taking your game and you can't do a fucking thing about it.
i don't care if it does or doesn't hurt you.
i don't care if you do or don't deserve to be taken from.
i'm gonna take your shit, and you'll never get a dime. if you don't like it you can cry about it, you BIG GAY BABY!

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lmao you're a pathetic waste of time.
and I won the argument.

>company goes out of business because they made no money
Name a SINGLE (UNO) time a company went out of business because of piracy.

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>every publisher is scum

>The only correct response. If you're a pirate, you should accept what you are doing is wrong (HURR NO MORALITY DOESNT EXIST) because it's theft. It makes you a nigger, but if you just want free things, that's your choice. Just stop with the mental gymnastics trying to blame the dev or the government or whatever.
>>but it isnt theft its a copy!
>retard, buy a disk that's blank and then buy a new video game. the price difference is the information on the disk, meaning any copy is worth the money involved
You can only really argue the fiscal value of games if you analogize with something like paying for a carnival ride ticket. The payment is for the ticket. The larger difference here is that with a carnival ride you can see what you're actually going to get before you ride, you may not like the experience after the fact but they're not trying to grift you on what the experience is going to be. Game developers often do, many people being burned in the past by terribly stupid and incompetent devs who manage to ruin their games through utter stupidity usually try to pretend their game isn't shit.

Anyone have the virgin vs chad pirate alignment chart?

Admittance took effect upon the realization that the example was unworkable. If you are not able to discuss the mechanics in place for piracy to take place then lurk more.

>the government that incites companies to lobby are also scum

>>industry is doing better than ever
If you haven't noticed the industry shifted focus to microtransactions and online only games

>$60 game (incomplete)
>$9.99 DLC for the true ending
>$6.99 chara skins
>$4.99 extra gold pack
>$14.99 Year 1 season pass
>$14.99 Year 2 season pass
>But piracy is morally wrong you guys, it rips us off n stuff :'(
you made your bed, faggot

+1

>you can’t tell how shit something is without playing the prequels
Yes I can. Prequels have not bearing on whether or not a game is good or bad.

Yes, because MTX is a newly discovered, extremely lucrative market that simply didn't exist before smartphones.
Thinking this has anything to do with pirates is as nonsensical as blaming horse thieves for Henry Ford's success

This.
You have to be literally retarded to pay money for something you can easily get for free. Like, wtf, do you have literal brain problems? Wouldn't you rather spend your money on shit you CANNOT get for free?

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And you're saying piracy didn't exist before that?
If anything all those things exist because companies want to compensate for piracy

Name one (3) current publishers that don't do the following
>games as a service
>microtransactions
>paid mods
>online drm
>day 1 patch
>dlc
>no modding
>limited install copies
>patches that break the playability of the game
>launcher exclusivity

Absolute, utter horseshit. If companies are so desperate to "compensate for losses" why is the global game industry consistently growing year after year?

How does a bunch of dlc that you can also pirate compensate for piracy?

Piracy helps every industry. Jews get fucked over. Your understanding of the game industry is so misguided it would be impossible for you to realize how fucked developers are by the jewish kike publishers.

>pirating from an indie dev =/= pirating from EA
fuck big corporations, I'm not giving activision 5 bucks to play VtMB, they didn't even make the damn thing. I'm also not paying bethesda for hearthfire because there was a mod that did the exact same thing and I only need master file so I can use my lewd mods

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Every year more people get access to technology. How many people has gaming devices 10 years ago compared to now. This is why industry grows. It's not a mystery.
Because paying customers buy them.

why yes when you apply extremely arbitrary goalposts like that it would filter most publishers.
perfect for someone who wants to justify piracy.

>piracy is the reason microtransactions exists

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I remember the first event for awareness of piracy and directly trying to evade it by Bethesda making a DLC for a horse skin that was half the price of the game, tell me how is it that piracy led to the development of late game content in what were considered at the time newly developed games? The reasons for piracy in the past were from games from home consoles that weren't supported outside of their sysmtes without other platform support, and there was a demand for playing them in personal computer systems due to Companies moving on to other projects with higher specs of games and it wasn't until the installation of net cards in consoles and that incident that we got online content in the first place, it was inevitable.

>Every year more people get access to technology.
Which means more sales of the base game, which means more profit, which means no need for nickel-and-diming.
You directly contradict your own case.

>>piracy is the reason microtransactions exists
Capitalism is the reason piracy exists. What you call piracy is just capitalism. Capitalism doesn't mean "makes money legally". Piracy is a capitalist consequence to a capitalist cause. This is what the free market with no regulations actually looks like.

>being able to own and use the product you exchanged currency for is arbitrary

Publishers pay for games tho. I'm not paying twice.

50 people buy a 1 dollar game, 50 people pirate it.
>how anti-pirate fags think it is
If there was no piracy the devs will make 100 dollars
>how it would really be
Devs make 50 dollars from sales, the 50 would be pirates either pirate something else or go back to f2p games

Have been downloading Mario 3 every day for a year already. I can't wait for Nintendo to go under.

>make a bait thread
>300 replies
I hate nu-Yea Forums.

>not downloading it an infinite amount of times every second

That is absolute horse siht. Certain percentage of pirates would buy the game if they couldn't pirate. Some people pirate because they like free shit. For example, I would have bought RE2 if I couldn't pirate it.
You see another user here. He would have probably bought the game he really wanted but couldn't pirate.

But if you acknowledge that the industry is growing then they don't need to compensate. How can you compensate for a non-existant loss? I've also noticed you've been careful to avoid the multiple comments asking for an example where piracy of a good game killed a developer.

>piracy is the reason microtransactions exists
Correct. Devs need to make profit. Selling games doesn't make profit, microtransactions do.

no no I agree with you, a game getting patches and support post release is actually a terrible thing and any publisher who pulls such BULLSHIT should get all their games pirated.

>mash the magnet link for the new fifa
>cost ea millions in lost revenue

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>scan manga
>manually translate manga
>everyone enjoys what the creator never bothered to do
>NO THIS IS BAD, YOU CANT READ THIS
>author never bothers to translate
>loses zero sales

Its even worse when more and more online manga readers replaces the pages with this comic.

>repeatedly pirate a free game
>devs become the richest people on earth

The absolute mad man.

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>would would if may maybe
Tired of all this emotional unsourced shit from anti-piratefags. You argue like women. It's time you wake up in the real world where a 300-page study was forcibly suppressed by big money because it showed no correlation between piracy and profit.

I buy single player games by small devs without publishers after I pirate them to make sure they're good. I only buy multiplayer games from big devs/publishers. I pirate all their single player games.

No need to thank me

Youre missing his point, digital cuck.

As the industry and technology grows so does so does the video game scale. 4 guys in a garage isn't enough to make games anymore.
>multiple comments asking for an example where piracy of a good game killed a developer
Any developer that started doing multiplayer only games. Blizzard with D3, that city builder game, city skylines, I think.

Your theory doesn't hold up to the facts.

Bethesda was very profitable company when Todd had decided to kill gaming industry.
EA has been making shitton of FIFA-bucks before making it gacha game.

How do you know the creator wasn't planning to translate the manga in the future differently than the fans did? Not only you have stolen his profit you have also changed his work to something that is not his message. You are spreading lies about him, he could sue you for libel.

I don't care
If I can get something for free, I will

>not scanning it yourself and releasing a digital version

>Bethesda was very profitable company
What are you, some commie? That's for the business owner to decide if they're making enough profit or not.

lol

>just let them patch your game goy

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And it's for the consumer to decide how to pay, or whether to pay at all

>What are you, some commie?
I'm not. I just debunked "companies need to make DLCs to stay alive" myth.

I pirate lots of games. If I like them I buy them out of respect to the creators because I want them to make more, if I don't I uninstall them and nothing changes.

You keep waving around that one fucking study. ONE. First there has to be multiple studies and then they still don't prove shit. Look at all the nutrition studies. They're all different every year calming different shit. You know why? You can't do an accurate study on something that isn't discrete. Bias will get in a way, always.

This. Literally this is all there is to it. If you dont want me pirating your games, make DRM that's impossible to crack. I dont pirate a thing that cant be pirated

Same reason I used to buy used games at Gamestop and return them on day 6. Full refund, all the entertainment just for letting Gamestop have the privilege of holding my money for awhile.

>Pirate a game
>Don't enjoy it
>Uninstall
I did change it up to;
>Buy game
>Don't enjoy it
>Uninstall
>Refund
But doing that extra step is a nuisance. I'm back to piracy, and the rare times I enjoyed myself, I'd buy it, which statistically is every 25 games or so.

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Sure, the consumer can decide not to consume the product. Not consume and not pay.

You debunked nothing. Companies need to do whatever it takes to stay profitable, and how much they need to stay profitable is their decision not yours.

I would pull 20 more out of the archive if fireden wasn't dead, and you would already know all of them if you weren't new as shit.
But you know what? The one I cited is still far more than your 0% studies and 100% appeal to emotion.

The amount of mental gymnastics piratfags do is astonishing.
Just admit you like free shit and you don't mind stealing.

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I like free shit and don't mind stealing.

guilty

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Well that's where you're wrong because I do just that, regularly. Imagine being such a cuck that you believe corporations are untitled to unlimited profits and price gouging and you should just put up with it lmao. Hyper cuck

I like free shit and don't mind taking free shit

Found the communist

I pirate all the time and I guarantee I've bought more games than you ever will in your lifetime. faggot.

How can millennials or younger not understand how piracy works? Or are they just being duplicitous?

>As the industry and technology grows so does so does the video game scale. 4 guys in a garage isn't enough to make games anymore.
That has absolutely no bearing on ANYTHING I posted. If the industry is growing it is because more profit is being made. You compensate for a loss, not a gain. You cannot grow while also losing. Understand? You cannot compensate for a loss that is not occuring.
>Any developer that started doing multiplayer only games. Blizzard with D3, that city builder game, city skylines, I think.
Listing two developers that are still in business are pretty bad examples of developers that have gone out of business. Especially when both are doing very well.

>I'm a thief
Enjoy the gay rape in jail buddy

>Companies need to do whatever it takes to stay profitable, and how much they need to stay profitable is their decision not yours.
>company being profitable is subjective now
kek

It's not "my" or "their" decision, it's simply a matter of "how much did you spend" vs "how much did you earn".

>company holds IP and wont sell the game
>only available copies of the game go for 100 dollars on ebay
>people that worked on the game no longer make money from the sales
>legal copy of the game prevents modding support, that fixes issues for the game they abandoned
>re-built alpha version of the game is better than the "updated" version they paid some shitty devs to release

>Emulator devs lectures people to buy the game
>mod engines automatically break if they detect pirated copies
>isos for old games get taken down

Seriously fuck all of this. Theyre not only ruining new games theyre systematically preventing me from enjoying the old ones.

You can call me whatever you want, I get free games and you don't.

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There's huge difference between stealing things and pirating things.

Stealing from them is also my decision, and as long as there are no consequences that concern me, I will continue doing so. Your impotent rage and your countless Reddit tier posts about how it’s immoral and big corporations need to be protected so that CEOs can make more money than they could possibly spend in a lifetime won’t stop anyone from pirating.

My boyfriend just had a seizure from your threats. Were calling a lawyer and emailing hiro for your IP!

>It's not "my" or "their" decision
Yes it is, you gonna put caps on how much people can earn? Why do you hate free enterprise and people making money?

I will sweetie ;)

In college I needed a random art credit so I took film appreciation. My professor was a """"""director"""""" who made a few shitty movies and he had a real hateboner for piracy and he almost failed me because I got a little too cute in class one day (though I ended up getting an A)

>We have a chapter as Film as a business/industry
>Section on piracy
>He has a real bug up his ass about piracy and goes on a rant
>Calls it stealing, criminal, vile, evil, everything under the sun
>Raise my hand and say "How is piracy stealing? Its not like the movie is gone if I download it"
>He legitimately gets very angry, goes on a 15 minute rant and tells me that he wants to talk to me after class
>After class he continues to bitch at me for my 'disrespectful' question and says that I have to have a meeting with the dean before I can come back to class
>Have the meeting, just say I am innocent and was asking a real question
>Professor is forced to take me back, no longer calls on me or talks to me, and I just get an A at the end of the semester

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Now you're projecting your fantasies onto me as well as your fucked up self sabotaging morals? Although given the latter, the former is hardly surprising. Anyway I'm not you and you're not me. You keep right on cucking yourself and leave me out of it

Nope! Piracy is theft. You are stealing profit.

>argh people making money grrrrr stop them

Wait a second, this was about mangas, did you edit this picture just to shitpost?

Its funny how relatively recent steam refunds are. I hope more is done to prevent the "games as a service" lie.

>fanmade content hurts the creator

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I like free shit and dont think pirating is theft.

snatcher, ace investigations 2, knuckles chaotix, earthbound, shin megami tensei and live a live come to mind

Hoping that French case about reselling licenses amounts to anything.

Yeah it does
A lot of fan translations deliberately change the content because they don't agree with the creator's political views

At the moment, I have PS3, X360, PS TV, PS4, Switch and, of course PC. Five consoles, and not a single one id modded (and yes, I have that first Switch model). On PC, I always pirate. I download the game and if it sucks, I delete it. If it's good, I buy it on Steam. If not immediately, then I wait for sale.
Some user recently made a thread and gave a link that ''scans'' your Steam profile and ''detects'' how much money did you spend on those games. My acc says it's somewhere between 230 and 500 euros, which isn't much. I definitely spent more money on console games.

What I do, and that's an actually a bad habit, it buy games on sales and then I don't play most of them because I don't have time.
>''Game is only 6 euros? That's... what? 3, 4 beers? Fuck that, I'm buying it!''
>years later and have yet to download it lol

Making a product does not inherently make one entitled to profit, so how can one steal it? If I'm stealing profit then why am I not gaining profit? How can you steal something but never at any point have the thing you stole? If I pirate a 60 game I don't make a single cent of the game's profit.

Except I’m not trying to stop them. I’m not Robin Hood or a crusader, I’m just getting free games with no consequences.

Opposite for me. PC is the only platform where I sometimes buy games. A console only enters my radar after piracy becomes possible.

And?
Paid translations do it too and are much more politically biased.

I love how this threads literally TRIGGER, not the pro-piracy Anons nor the ones who are against it, but the ones who go "STOP JUSTIFYING IT" every single thread. It amuses me.

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And god hand.
With the rise in popularity its going to get even worse.

Official translations are usually worse than fan ones

far as i know piracy actually had a positive net impact gaming.

>whereas the completely overblown reaction to piracy and predatory selling practices have not

Game devs already try to claim you don’t own the game even if you pay for it. They won’t let us resell digital copies, they don’t want us to mod the games in anyway. So why the fuck would I pay them for that?

How long until farming is piracy from grocery stores? Ive heard the seeds from the plants dont actually grow anymore.

>Making a product does not inherently make one entitled to profit
Yes it does. The owner of the product is entitled to sell their product at whatever terms and conditions they demand, you cannot have the product without respecting those demands. Taking the product against the owner's permission is stealing.

>If I'm stealing profit then why am I not gaining profit?
You gained a product without giving away the money required for it, let's say the game is 60$ you have 60$ more than you should have. If you pirate a 60 game you have 60 more than you should have in your account. Pay up, thief.

I bought the game after I clocked over 1k hours into it.
Hearts of Iron 4

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He's entitled to put it on sale, not to get sales.

>tfw I usually pirate games I already own but because I want to play it on a different platform and don't want to pay for it again.
Even then some games are worth buying multiple times. Like Slay the Spire. (Though it irritates me the Switch version isn't getting updated nowhere near as often)

The creator said he's ok with that paid translation, not with yours. You are the one spreading lies about him and his views, not the paid translation.

Unironically happens every single time.

He's entitled to you respecting the terms of the sale to get his product, not violate them and steal.

This
Just because people didn't buy it, doesn't mean 'lost sales'.
It's either a sale or it isn't.

>games are a service
>people copy their service and upload games online
>"NO YOURE STEALING OUR PRODUCT!'
>"NO YOU DONT OWN THAT GAME, ITS A SERVICE!"

Why do they think they can get both?

>meaning any copy is worth the money involved

ok karl marx

>Just because people didn't buy it, doesn't mean 'lost sales'.
When you consume something without paying for it, yes it is a lost sale.

>spoiler
I-is that true? That can't be true, right, user? Holy shit, where is this world going to?

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The creator? You mean the publisher, faggot.

>it's theft
Take a load of this fag lmoa, stopped reading.

Who says I can't be both?

cope retard

Piracy absolutely had a net positive financial impact on the gaming industry. It was basically free samples for the Chinese, South Asian and CIS markets which now make up a massive amount of the profits for large developers/publishers. Without piracy laying tht groundwork in Russia and China gaming would still be in it's infancy there. Instead it was an overnight explosion once the games became easily available

Everyone who agrees with this is an absolute nigger
>sure I played the game for 2k hours but you see there's "x minor issue" so it's not worth it lmao
absolute bottom of the barrel trash

i have a script that autodownloads indie games 500 times a day so these fucks never make a profit

Based and worthypilled

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Honestly that would be a really good setup for a post apocolyptic setting.
>everyone assumes they can rebuild society and farm
>one year later everyone starves

Only if you were actually going to buy it. The whole argument against piracy is that game devs are missing out on sales because people are downloading it for free. I assure you, I was never going to fucking buy Fallout 76. I just wanted to see how shitty it was.

>>every publisher is scum

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Because youre not.

>If everyone suddenly stopped playing video games, it wouldn't be worth the garbage it was lying in.
wew that might be the worst argument I have seen on here in a week
most modern products are worth more than the raw materials involved and if people stopped using said things they wouldn't be worth much what a fucking revelation
this fucking board

Even freak shows have a price of admission

I mean, yeah, except if you aren’t a city fag you’d already know that seeds do grow because literally everyone in the boonies grows tomatoes or some shit.

See pic related.
I have a thing for post apocalyptic settings, you're going to make try Cataclysm: DDA again.

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AAA Devs are already paid during the process of making the game.
All piracy hurts is the publisher's bottom line and return of investment.
I could give a fuck less about lining the shareholder's pockets, and even less about the company CEO sucking their cocks underneath the boardroom table.

And that hurts the creator................................................................................................................how?

Yes, and I don’t go to them. So even if I saw an unauthorized video of said freakshow, I wasn’t planning on buying a ticket to begin with, so they didn’t lose my business over the pirated video.

>you cannot have the product without respecting those demands

yes i can and i regularly do

Yes I am.

My requirements are pretty simple.
>no bullshit exclusivity deal
>DRM cannot be too intrusive
>no online integration bullshit or cash shop
If it fulfills all of those I'll gladly buy it. Piracy is for shitty games with online microtransaction bullshit like what Ubisoft does.

Pirates spend more than the average consumer, they tend to be the most into the hobby.
The problem is developer entitlement is out of control and see every human in the world that doesn't buy their game as a lost sale.

It doesn't, but I'm sure user will find a way to imply the translation gives the creator a bad reputation or something. Let's see.

Because you're a first world tranny loving corp bitch.
>be third world poor eating dried fish
>have decent computer
>no money to buy games
>pirate games to play
>suddenly become valuable because i am "potential" customer
NEVER IN MY THIRD WORLD EIGHT YEAR OLD FUCKING SELF WOULD I EVEN FUCKING BUY A GODDAMN SUBSCRIPTION CARD FOR RAGNAROK BECAUSE IM SO POOR. Dumb bitch. Think about it next time.

They buy those seeds from stores.
From what ive heard the seeds those plants produce are effectively dead

>Only if you were actually going to buy it
No, that's not how it works. The terms of the sale are that you pay to consume. You consume without paying, you violated the terms. It doesn't matter what your intentions were. You chose to consume, now you pay.

>Yes it does
No it doesn't. Having a right to sell a product is not the same as being entitled to make a profit.
>Taking the product against the owner's permission is stealing.
Actually it's piracy. As other previously pointed out the original is not removed, just copied, and you claimed that what was stolen was the profit.
> let's say the game is 60$ you have 60$ more than you should have
No I don't, I have a copy of a game that holds no value.
Lets run this from the top. The thing that's being stolen isn't the game, but the profit. I say that I don't gain any profit and you respond by downloading the game I gain 60$. Now I cannot exchange the game for 60$ therefore the game is the profit. Then why do the publishers need to sell the profit? If the game is 60$ then by developing the game they already HAVE the profit. Your logic is really roundabout.

Also, regional pricing fucks them over.
When you sell a game digitally to one customer for 20% of the price you send the message that that is the price you can make a profit at and many others will wait for sales or buy from other sites at the price.
You fail to understand the concept of devaluing your brand, then complain about it.

Ah, I misunderstood the meaning. It depends on the plant and how much it’s been selectively bred. There are plenty of plants out there which produce seeds that do actually grow just fine.

Ive only pirated DmC, bioshock infinite and LobCorp.
I bought LobCorp after playing it for 50 hours.

I dont regret shit. If i bought the first two games, i would still have them in my library and being unrefundable. Thank fuck for piracy.

B-but piratesan, if everyone pirated, a lot less people would have the ability to spend their time making new video games!

Well thats good to hear. I couldnt have been arsed to read into it, but god damn did it keep me up at night.

It’s elementary math, m8. For a dev to make a sell, they need a person willing to spend money on their product. This is paramount. I, however, am NOT willing to spend money on their product. Thus, whatever happens next does not detract from their profits in any way. With or without pirating, I will literally never give Bethesda another fucking cent.

>consumption
>1. the action of using up a resource.

lol shut the fuck up nigger

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You know what libel is, right? Let's say the creator is a swastika-wearing nazi, hates the jews, thinks the Holocaust was a good thing that was stopped by jew bootlickers too early, mours the death of Hitler everyday. Now you change his work completely and make him look like some pro-Israel, kippa-wearing, jew-loving neocon. You have violated his fundamental principles and made everyone believe he is something he's not, causing him terrible anguish and distress. You think that doesn't hurt him?

Sure are a lot of mental gymnastics in this thread

>pirate a game, it fucking sucks and I uninstall it in less than 5 hours
>company is growing and keeps shitting out "sequels" to the piece of shit game I no longer even bother pirating
>"wtf are people seriously this retarded and keep buying this shit?"
GEE I WONDER WHY PEOPLE PIRATE

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The people that made the game already got paid. Doubly the people that made the game likely got fired to be replaced by cheaper interns after the games release.

Not trying to defend piracy with this, but it only "hurts" the investors

But the terms of sale weren't what was being discussed. Whether or not a sale was lost was the topic. You also cannot consume something without using it up.

This. Its better to see a pirate as a future customer when things become more convenient for them to want to pay for a future product.
If your game is good enough they will want to either pay for it at some point, or tell people about it. People forget that pirates are usually also promoters in a way too. And preservers. There are games out there that, if they were not cracked, would just be unplayable due to DRM.
This piracy helps recover lost media. Especially in the TV industry because early shows were taped and didn't have digital backups and they reused the tapes. Its only because someone recorded and backed up a recording at that time do we ever have that previously lost episode of that show. (These days production crews usually keep backups but even then, they also usually anonymously upload that abandonware-tier episode online somewhere for others to grab so its available to watch)
For music bands don't really talk about piracy often but they do often admit it does help promote their live shows, where they actually make money selling merch because record companies give them so little in album sales royalties.
Look at GOG. GOG sells games that often have scene cracks in place to make them convenient to play. Rockstar infamously had to backpedal to a scene crack for Max Payne because their official solution was awful.
Its too simple to say Piracy is awful. It ruins everything, when really it is a part of the industry its interwoven into its fabric. It ALWAYS does its part. The real issue is does the developer and publisher do their part properly? If they did they wouldn't need to complain about piracy, because piracy would, if anything, help them.

Argument doesn't work that well with indie games

>see this over the top extremely radical example that has nowhere in a hundred years the same relevancy that some fan translation of some shitty comic/videa
user, come the fuck on.

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what if you stopped believing piracy is an issue?

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>>pirate a game, enjoy it
>>company goes out of business because they made no money
Correlation doesn't mean causation

>No we cant make demos because that will hurt our sales
>yes. People wont buy our game when they realize its shit

They really brought piracy on themselves.

>I, however, am NOT willing to spend money on their product.
So don't get the product. Don't violate his rightful conditions. You have no right to steal.

>to utilize as a customer consume goods and services
Leeches should die

>If anything all those things exist because companies want to compensate for piracy
Possibly. But in doing so, I will just simply be pirating more.

You think I'm going to look at season passes, loot boxes and $400 worth of dlc and NOW I suddenly want to pay for your game? HAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAA

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Fan translations have deliberately changed jokes and content to make the product "less offensive" to western retards offending the author in the process.

True but indie games are exponentially helped by word of mouth.
I would never talk about any shitty paid indie game, but ive shown people a lot of free indie games that ive found.

And thats not to say i pirate all my indie games.

I pirate games because I'm poor. Me playing or not playing your game makes no difference because I'm not able to buy your game in the first place.

>indie games are exponentially helped by word of mouth
That doesn't guarantee sales.

>to utilize as a customer the action of using up a resource

tell me what resource is being used up through piracy? and if you try and tell me "the dev's labor" i'm going to call you a commie

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So this hurts literal nazis?

>tell me what resource is being used up through piracy
The dev's time and money spent creating a product you are not entitled to steal

+1

Desu I pirate most every indie game I'm interested in and buy if it's good which is most of them

If you thin having white characters in your game makes you a nazi, sure. But you're a retard if you think that.

We’re having two different conversations here. I’m not arguing law or morals, I’m merely stating that I was never a prospective customer. I’m not disputing that I’m immoral and or breaking the law.

>pirate a game
>they " lose a sale "

>upload gameplay footage with a million views
>...

However. Iirc companies actually tried to take down lets plays a while back though.

This is a shit industry that deserves to die.

Fuck that, pay me before stealing.

Buying developer tools is different from buying games. You can actually get legally hit if you release commercial games made with a pirated engine (though most people won't because nobody will play their games anyway), but nobody cares if you play pirated games.

Did you read his post?

Nah.

Reminder that you literally cannot buy certain games anymore at all and the only way to get them is trough piracy.
See Driver: San Francisco
>Tfw you will never join a chad pirate scene group

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Not being a prospective customer does not entitle you to violate a terms of sale.

video game companies should be paying me for punitive damages

Certain genetically modified crops like golden rice, a rice crop that produces more vit A for countries where large deficiencies cause blindness, have their genetic code modified to make them naturally infertile thus resulting in the need to re-purchase seeds after each harvest.
>Farms that produce little/no profit, in sub saharan Africa.
But remember big pharma needs those shekels and modifying the genetic code further is a violation of their copyright.

I'm well aware, but offending an author is miles different from hurting him. Ok, look, don't get me wrong, I'm going to work as a translator and I value translation fidelity as much as it's posible, but you cannot say "fanmade content hurts the creator". It's a few moral-fags going out of their way to change something without permission, but the thing is, not every fan is that retarded and you cannot rule out fanmade content as a whole as something bad because of that. There are tons of creators who value their fans and what they do. Some have gain a good deal of notoriety thanks to fan made works. I say fuck moral-fags, not fans.

Sure, if you want to legally be forced to refund me.

no

Then enjoy the microtransactions.

name a single game where this is the case

He didn't ask what resource the devs used up. He asked what resource is used up through piracy.

how about they do a fund me type shit like they did to megaman that way if the game sucks you can blame the audience and not the creators and still get paid

Alright, I’m gonna try and set the record straight without even reading this thread.
If you pirate, that doesn’t mean you’re a bad person. It just means you’d rather have your money go towards something else (food, gas, electricity, etc.)
Is it illegal? Speaking purely from a non-biased technical business point of view, yes.
But does that mean you should soap box and scold every ham and egger who does it? No.
You know why? Because we have all fucking done it in one way or another at some point.
And 99% percent of the time, the games being pirated are either: A) old enough to not be profitable anyway, or B) not going to make the company go anywhere near bankrupt from “””lost sales”””.
Nearly every big YouTuber uses emulators for their let’s plays.
I’m getting too fucking tired to write now, so I’ll just conclude with this:
You’re not fucking NEO. You pirating Assassin’s Creed Vietnam is not going to permanently change the course of history, nor is lecturing forum after forum why piracy is literally worse than rape homicide.
It’s not.
It’s literally no worse than not returning a library book or red box video.
Fuck all of you.
Just play fun games, and nevermind where the funny small green paper is going.

It's funny because refunding is worse for everyone involved

I'll pirate those along with your game then.

Your post make me a little sad, more so than this whole thread. Video games are one thing, but jesus fuck, food and health are things that no man should be able to abuse so badly.

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Except the customer.

Complaing about piracy is wasting your time. If people can they will pirate, but there is a lot of people that will pay for the thing anyway if they hear it's good.
It's a risk that you take when you invest your time and effort making a game and hoping it does well.

>pirate game
>advertising interns make $10 an hour
>spend six hours discussing game online and answering questions
>sending ninjas would be unjust

Costs time to refund and you have to click a few times and be below x limits so yes also the customer

>offending an author is miles different from hurting him
No it's not. You have violated the author's fundamental morals, lied about their vision, something extremely personal and immensely important to them, and caused them huge distress. They can sue you for moral and mental damages and prohibit any and all further lies about their vision and their work.

>Pirate a movie
>No one cares

>Pirate music
>No one cares

>Pirate a video game
>ABSOLUTE AUTISM BLAST

OP, I hope you've never once downloaded music off of youtube or you're a fucking hypocrite.

Yes.

No you won't. Can't do that when I sued you homeless.

Why should you care if people pirate games? It's their own choice to make, not yours to demand them to follow your choices.

I don't pirate games at all, ever since there's already bigger risk from pirating them due to unreliable and obscure sources nowadays. But I do find it incredibly stupid to really push your opinions on what is a "morally correct" opinion considering that there's no such as morals nowadays, if any at all. Nearly everyone in here will do their own thing, deciding whatever they feel like doing so depending on the situation. So why do you need to complain someone's situation that is completely unrelated to yours? If they suffer consequences for their actions, then that's fine but you do not need to complain on what they do, because you don't do them at all.

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At no point did I claim it does. I merely pointed out the fallacy in believing that anyone who Pirates MUST have been a prospective customer prior to pirating.

I get free games, you don't.
Seethe, my friend :^)

How can you call yourself a communist and not want to compensate people for their labor? Marx is shamed of you.

Crysis lost sales because no ones computer could run the fucking thing in 2007, no one wamts to spend 60$+tip on a game they can't run.

and yet nearly every time I do enjoy a game enough to buy it it sells like shit and when I pirate a game it always sells well. Explain that.

This doesn't happen
Only official translations do this
You are literally making up a scenario to either
A. bait people
2. attempt to make people feel bad
or thirdly, sew chaos and distrust among people that may or may not take you seriously

>Costs time to refund and you have to click a few times
How is this worse than wasting your money with no possibility of getting it back?
>and be below x limits
Only if you live in a cucked country.

There's no fallacy. The moment you violate the terms, you are in wrong. Anything you say is just bullshit because you chose to consume that thing anyway, so you wanted it, and you have no right to violate the owner's terms.

>You have violated the author's fundamental morals, lied about their vision
Yes, sure.
>something extremely personal and immensely important to them, and caused them huge distress
Ok now that's faggot talk.
>They can sue you for moral and mental damages and prohibit any and all further lies about their vision and their work.
Sure they can, but this does nothing to prove that "fanmade content hurts the creator". If anything it would be "sometimes, people do shitty things to (hopefully) creative and talented people", and that's nothing new.

I thought we were comparing pirating vs buying and refunding if you didn't like

How do you feel about used games and rentals? If Piracy is theft then used games must be too. They both have the same results. If someone loans a used game to a friend that friend didn't agree to the terms of the sale and therefore has stolen profit, as you have put it earlier.

If they were simply selling a video game, it wouldn't really be an issue. You'd even be able to play a demo to judge if you really want it.
But instead nowadays companies do the worst possible kind of shit, including fake gameplay footage and lying about it too, taking in pre-orders while banning any sort of review footage trough embargos, paying for review scores and putting addictive microtransactions in full 60 dollar releases locking away content and making the game unplayable and grindy if you don't give in.
Actually fuck they SHOULD close down, but I haven't bought an EA game since 2010 and they're still around, so obviously they don't need my money in the first place.
Activision/Ubisoft/Bethesda/EA made a massive power grab in the early days and now we're stuck with shit games made under pressure in six months to meet the investment of the Chinese Security Ministry. Maybe if there were GOOD games they'd even be worth pirating, but the reality is they're not even worth that anymore.

>So why do you need to complain someone's situation that is completely unrelated to yours?
I wonder if you'll have the same sentiment when the studio that make games you like goes under due to piracy. Your apathy towards a problem only fuels it.

Good luck with that, lel.

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We’re having two different conversations again, mostly because of your inability to read. I NEVER claimed I was in the right. Not once.

I pirate when it's convenient and I buy when it's more convenient/I want to play it online
like hell I'm buying a second hand ds game off eBay for 70 bucks

>this does nothing to prove that "fanmade content hurts the creator"
Yes it does. You have caused them mental anguish and distress. That is hurting someone, little retard.

I'm saying your whole argument is retarded because there's no fallacy, retard. It doesn't matter what you would have done or not done. All that matters is what you did.

Shut the fuck up you dumb kike lmao

Nah.

No one is making you agree to the service of being provided a digital experience on the grounds you don't copy and share it.

There is no "the author". You are fucking retarded. Games have hundreds of fucking people working on them.

But you still haven't provided an example of a dev going under due to piracy. Why should he be worried about something that you can't prove has ever happened?
If there's no fallacy then why won't you prove it wrong? Why respond with something unrelated to what he posted? If it doesn't matter whether or not profit was lost then why did you ever bring it up? You really go through a lot of mental gymnastics.

>That is hurting someone, little retard.
Calm down, kid, this is just an internet argument.
>Yes it does. You have caused them mental anguish and distress
"Fanmade content hurts the creator" is no the same as "Fanmade content CAN hurt the creator". Anything can hurt them (specially if they are as pathetic as the one you described), but that's not related uniquely to fanmade content.

So when the creator decides your bullshit fan translation has hurt him, what are you gonna do?

user, you are hurting me with your posts, I would like you to stop posting and turn off your internet connection now. Thank you.

So if a developer goes through mental anguish because people didn't like his product then are they just as guilty as pirates? If the problem is hurting the author, and causing mental anguish is hurting them, then we must jail people for not liking a product they purchased. It's the same as theft.

>If there's no fallacy then why won't you prove it wrong?
I did >If it doesn't matter whether or not profit was lost
I never said that. Profit is lost the moment you violate the terms of sale and take something you are not entitled to without the owner's permission. You owe a debt of profit to the owner. That's why all your bullshit excuses mean nothing you have to pay.

You're misrepresenting our arguments and giving us mental anguish, you have a moral right to stop posting your literal brain garbage that you think is good to post

You don't own my posts, and you have hurt me with your suggestion. Please stop posting now and forever, thank you.

You are moving the goalpost now. You argue that "fanmade content hurts creators", this has been proven false, because this is not a quality only fanmade content has. If you want to argue that "SOMETIMES fanmade translations are bad because they are not faithful to the original work", sure, no one is denying that. Take a minute to THINK before engaging in a conversation, user, jesus.

You have responded to my post, which I made, and you have hurt me with your retarded arguments. I think you are the one who ought to stop psoting, my friend.

>this has been proven false
>because this is not a quality only fanmade content has
That doesn't make sense. Other things hurting the creator doesn't mean fanmade content isn't hurting the creator too.

Ok, I give up, you're too stupid. I hope you're only """pretending""" to be retarded.

You are the one that's responding to my posts, and you are hurting me with demented responses. Please stop now.

If emulation is piracy then i guess i am a pirate.
I also pirate anyway

"no"

>knives can be used as a weapon
>OMG KNIFES ARE WEAPONS, THEY KILL PEOPLE, KNIFES ARE BAD AND SHOULD BE BANNED
This is how you sound/look.

>So if a developer goes through mental anguish because people didn't like his product then are they just as guilty as pirates?

No, because people are entitled to choose what they consume, if they don't want to consume a product nobody can force them to. However pirates are not entitled to free consumption of a product that's for sale, they violate the terms of the sale when they pirate, which is why they are in the wrong.

Imagine throwing away a single dollar on video games as an adult lmao
I consoom more media than you and I get it all for free
You blow your whole paycheck on manchild toys while I make smart investments
You're going to die alone surrounded by your useless video games purchases while I make a future on the money I didn't spend on retarded video games lmfao

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But all you said was "There is no fallacy". If saying something make it true all I need to say is "You are wrong" and I have proven you wrong. You can't prove a statement is true or false just saying it is. You have to demonstrate it is so.
> Profit is lost the moment you violate the terms of sale
But that was the fallacy being discussed. If no sale was ever going to take place, then there never could have been profit. If there never could have been profit, then profit could not have been lost. You can't lose something that never could have existed. Therefore what he would or wouldn't have done DOES matter.

You know you can't carry around a knife longer than 3 inches, yes?

>You blow your whole paycheck
Get a better job, user, wtf.
>You're going to die alone surrounded by your useless video games purchases while I make a future on the money I didn't spend on retarded video games lmfao
I prefer to play them with my wife, thank you very much, user.

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So causing mental anguish to the author isn't what matters. Why did you bring it up then? You really need to stop with these mental gymnastics.

>You can't prove a statement is true or false just saying it is
Watch me.

You're wrong.

Lethal enough if you're bread. Are you discriminating bread now, user? You disgust me.

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>But all you said was "There is no fallacy"
No I didn't. Read the whole comment.
>But that was the fallacy being discussed
There's no fallacy. You stole something, that is when the sale is supposed to take place and it didn't because you committed a crime instead. If no sale was ever going to take place, you should not have taken the product. By taking the product illegally, you have created a situation where the sale should be. That's when the profit is lost. It did exist and it does exist, you are the thief that needs to pay. If you wouldn't have done the sale you wouldn't have stolen.

Not gonna lie, if pirating shit would actually hurt the publishers, I'd be leeching so hard 24/7, my router would probably melt

shut up idiot im never buying anything ever again because of you

>So causing mental anguish to the author isn't what matters.
Yes it is. The author is entitled not to have his work and vision violated, and not have mental anguish caused by thieves and liars.

people are lobbying RIGHT NOW to ban edged items in households, including knives
as an endeavour to stop knife murders
man is nothing if not adaptable, and will apply liberal use of blunt force trauma in the absence of edged weaponry
then retards will see the folly of banning things because it can be used to hurt

No u.

>people are lobbying RIGHT NOW to ban edged items in households, including knives
You are joking. Please. Tell me you are jokin. user, I NEED you to tell me you are joking.

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just another day in bongistan
look it up

Can't you autists cut this discussion short and agree that only pussy faggots would feel mental anguish from someone making a fan game based on their works?

Why do you feel entitled to violate someone's fundamental liberty? I swear you people should get gulaged.

>it's true
To think that, years ago, I used to think that literally any country would be better than Chile.
I'm starting to think I'm better off staying here.

copyright is a recent invention and was only intended for use in a relatively short time so the original creator of media can reap the rewards
then the (((mouse))) extends the copyright so they can have the rewards indefinitely

So if mental anguish is what matters then causing mental anguish by not liking the product must be illegal too. You can't say that piracy is illegal because it causes mental anguish and say that causing mental anguish through another means doesn't matter. It makes you a hypocrite.

>copyright is a recent invention
Cervantes was already fighting for copyright in the 1600s because faggots kept stealing and living off his work and changing the story to shit he didn't like.

welcome to communism
no one has any freedom
no one owns anything
especially not your life
but that also means you don't own your own life since you can't defend it

ENOUGH

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>So if mental anguish is what matters then causing mental anguish by not liking the product must be illegal too
I know you're retarded, but people have rights user, and forcing them to buy something they don't want violates their mental anguish. Thus, the law states you are free not to buy something you don't want, you are protected in this case. However, piracy shows you do want something, because you take it by downloading it, and the owner of that something has the right to demand whatever he wants in exchange for his product, and you don't have the right to cause him mental anguish by violating his rights. There's nothing hypocrite about this; you are in the wrong by violating the creator's rights.

> that is when the sale is supposed to take place and it didn't because you committed a crime instead.
But a sale wouldn't have occurred in the first place.
>By taking the product illegally, you have created a situation where the sale should be.
No, just a situation where the publishers wanted a sale to be.
>That's when the profit is lost.
The profit never existed. You can't lose something that doesn't exist
>If you wouldn't have done the sale you wouldn't have stolen.
So if a game's price is set at 1,000,000$ and someone pirates it then you insist that without piracy, they would have purchased the game?

You are missing the point so hard lol
It's not about a customer being forced to buy a game and feeling anguish by being forced to pay for it
It's about a customer buying a game, vocalizing their dislike of the game and the creator feeling bad that people are shitting on his game you fucking pseudo smart ass

if you make shit, expect to be shit on for it
no one wants to buy shit when they expect something that ISN'T shit

>communism
Bongs are cattle to a neo-liberal globalist elite though, not a communist one

I just wanted, before this thread dies, to remind the "but fanmade content hurts creators"-user that """pretending""" to be retarded is just being retarded with extra steps, kill yourself.

>a sale wouldn't have occurred in the first place
If a sale wouldn't have occurred, why do you have the product? You were planning to steal from the start?
>just a situation where the publishers wanted a sale to be
A situation where the owners are entitled to having a sale, fixed that for you. You are not allowed to take their product without paying them.
>The profit never existed
The profit has existed since the moment you took something you may not take without paying.
>if a game's price is set at 1,000,000$ and someone pirates it then you insist that without piracy, they would have purchased the game?
I insist that by pirating they have violated the terms and owe 1,000,000$ to the owner. If you would have not purchased the game, you would not have pirated it either. By pirating, you are in debt to the owner to what they are owed for their game.

but then the creator will be under mental anguish because someone said mean things about him/thier product!! :( we can't have that!!

bongs are fighting everyday to break the leash of their masters
brexit is the beginning

>It's about a customer buying a game, vocalizing their dislike of the game
That also is within their rights, just like it's within the creator's right to verbally fight back or sue this customer for slander if what they are saying is misleading and false. That however has nothing to do with you stealing, and it only reinforces the argument you have no right to lie about an author's work and vision.