One shot at an atlus rep in smash

all of his tilts, arials, and smash attacks are amazing though, and he has spammable projectiles. He doesn't need gimmicky specials when all of his base attacks are overpowered as fuck, especially with arsene

Down special changes his Persona which makes his side special different:
Arsene: The same
Jack Frost: Frost Breath - similar to Bowser's fire breath only freezes
Pyro Jack: Maragi - three fireballs exploding in turn towards Joker
Archangel: Hamaeon - light circle slowly detonating doing massive damage if it hits
There I fixed your character for you Sakurai.

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Probably time constraints. Joker's moveset was already lifted from a dozen other characters (similarly to the rest of the DLC) and fitting in 3+ demons into a Shulk-style selector each with significant abilities would've taken far too long. And going for 5+ would probably be too much for the Switch.

I wish Joker had more thought for his moves.

Up B, throws an Arcana card. Very low chance people hit by it switch places with Joker. In the air he uses a gun instead.
-Side B uses the main elemental spells at random. Each cast is a different Persona.
-Down B Joker throws Morgana to transform him into a car, runs inside, and drives like Wario's bike. Shorter distance, hyper armor, delay when exiting for balancing.

No Arsene or comeback mechanic. Final smash is Jack Frost or Satannael.

Joker's moveset isn't intended to be representative of SMT, the same way the Pokemons moveset isn't meant to be representative of their mechanics in game. Those are designed to be about the character specifically.

Incineroar's moveset has fuck all to do with what it does in the Pokemon games mechanically. It's designed to be a wrestler that can turn around fights in a big powerful swing of momentum, because that's what it is conceptually and any relation to its actual moves in game are incidental at best. His Up B has no related to how Cross Chop works in game and Alolan Whip doesn't fucking exist. The same goes for Joker. Joker's designed to be a lithe skilled sneak thief that can summon his Persona in a time of need, just like he does in game. When he's losing and needs to accept his Persona, it appears before him, just like Arsene does in Persona 5.

Hero's moveset is representative of the DQ franchise mechanics because they're a far greater part of what defines that character. The DQ heroes have very little going on as characters beyond just being heroes, so of course their mechanics are designed around representing their franchise instead of the concepts behind their character.

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>one shot at an atlus rep in smash
>character from the game less associated with nintendo
Joker is literally the worst addition to smash bros, not because his gameplay is bad but because he has fuck all to do with Nintendo. Every other character has great connections with Nintendo (except for Snake but Kojima is Sakurai's friend) except for Joker. This fucking weeb as motherfucker opened the floodgates for the rosterfags to non-stop talk about character that will never get in but Joker being added gave them a sliver of hope.

Sounds fun, but it would require actual effort something Sakurai never spends on franchises he's not that into. People eat it up anyway so why should he bother? Not like smashbabs ever played a Persona game in their life anyway.
Man, I am glad to even have an Atlus rep, but I honestly can't bring myself to play him. He's just too boring, which I never thought I'd say during those speculative days when he was first announced. He has so much potential for a fighting game character, I can't believe this is what we got.
Hopefully Arcsys will get around to making a new Persona Arena one of these days.

Which makes you wonder why they even bothered. You'd think they had big plans for such a seemingly random character, but no, just Shiek on steroids.

Terry is less nuanced than Joker, though. If we're talking about complexity, Joker was the more difficult character to make and design. If we're talking about being true to the series, then what the fuck are you doing, nigger? Plenty of characters play very dissimilar to how they actually do in their games. Joker is shit design because his tools break parts of the game. Anyone who thinks they are going to put a ton of dev time into designing multiple personas and switching forms, etc is delusional. It's the same as people tugging themselves off thinking about MM link with all of the masks.

Joker's tether recovery is stupidly good because of it's vert. range along with his ability to hold counter, letting him get away from edgeguard pressure nearly for free. He's way easier to 2frame with Arsene, but he also gets a fully invincible start and his counter becomes a fucking kill move that hits below the stage. His recovery is fine, but his down B is stupidly busted garbage.

Imagine being so delusional you think some random Pokemon has as much potential as Joker had. Incineroar was explicitly chosen in order to have a Zangief type character in Smash. Joker was chosen to... have another Shiek I guess? I don't fucking know man.
>Joker's designed to be a lithe skilled sneak thief that can summon his Persona in a time of need, just like he does in game. When he's losing and needs to accept his Persona, it appears before him, just like Arsene does in Persona 5.
You have absolutely no clue what you're talking about don't even pretend.

Yeah, what kind of moron would think a simple persona function for the Persona representative would be a thing? The Nintendo Switch simply doesn't have the power to pull off such a feat, it's never been done.

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I never said the Switch couldn't handle it, I said the dev team would never do it because why the fuck would they go through the effort? They don't care about little user sperging out on a message board. By the way, you posted a character with a single additional asset. At least post PT or something.

It could be worse, you don't know the suffering of us FEfags
>continually shove characters that FE fans don't even really like or care about in the game as advertising
>They basically all play the same
>can't even really complain about it because we get disproportionate representation, already causing people to hate it
It is a fucking joke that fucking Chrom of all people got in

God forbid someone voices discontent with a lazy reused asset character the Smash cult no likey.
To imply that Joker was somehow harder to develop than Terry is absolutely mind-boggling stuff, how do you even have the audacity to say such a thing? Genuinely curious

I'm amazed even now they haven't finished the weapon triangle. Byleth really doesn't count.

joker more stronger than terry

Because Joker literally has more assets tied to him. Even with Terry's unique spotdodge and over 100% stuff, Joker just had more to do. Do I feel that is somehow indicative of quality? No, but I also was responding to a post that said Terry was an "excellent [character] perfectly representative of [his franchise], Joker was just lazy." This is just a false statement on the basis of work required for each character. Joker even has a unique win screen. Face it-- neither character plays actually akin to how they would in their own titles and the argument becomes one about fanservice. This may as well be a thread about who you want in Smash, as it quality of discussion is no better than people jerking off over their fantasy rosters. It isn't actually about criticism for the game in any meaningful context.
>I want X in game
Okay? You want X in game. Congratulations, it didn't happen and your expectation is not in-line with how the series has worked up to this point.

Terry plays exactly like he does in Fatal Fury what you on about? A win screen doesn't make a character well designed either for that matter.

Also, regarding reused animations, this isn't anything new for the series. I'm not going to deny or even defend the choice to take a character and then piecemeal parts of them as the basis for a new character. Joker isn't the only one, and this was stupidly obvious with Bayo in 4 having a ton of ZSS in her. If you look at the hitboxes and framedata on moves, then stuff like dtilt for Joker was clearly not just copy-pasted from Cloud despite the similar animations. I encourage you to look at some of Terry's animations and compare them to Ryu's. Things like his jab, dtilt, and usmash were all clearly lifted and barely modified. But guess what? They were all clearly worked on as moves because the data for them is different.

Shitsona doesn't belong in smash.

He plays as much like Fatal Fury as Ryu plays like SF.

This is what pisses me off the most.

>Hey user you wanted an SMT character since Brawl right?
>HAHA HERES PERSONA

A Persona protag would be the easiest to make representative of SMT as a whole though, not that they did that either, but still.
Demi-Fiend is more his own being, I don't really see his moveset utilizing demons.

No, Jack Frost would be the best SMT rep

Got me there. Hopefully one day.

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Everything in that post applies to all the Pokemon movesets, autism lord, not just Incineroar. Pikachus moves in Smash have fuck all to do with how it plays in Pokemon or how Pokemons mechanics work. Lucario does not have Aura in Pokemon either. Greninja's Water Shuriken don't even throw out multiple like he does in Pokemon.

Joker was chosen because he's a popular character and his moveset was made to represent his character, not his franchise. Try to tell me where that's wrong.

That floodgate was already broken with Cloud. Cloud had fuck all to do with Nintendo, in fact his game was the point in time when Square and Nintendo’s relationship turn hostile.
>inb4 but Cloud reps all of Final Fantasy
No he fucking doesn’t, what little music he brings is all from FF7 and his stage is only FF7.

I'll never understand what this faggot is doing in the game. Why did Nintendo choose him? What have they won with his addition? And no, sales of dlc don't really matter because smashfags eat up anything that hack Sakurai shits at them, over the basis of him overworking and all.
If anything, this only benefits Sony and Atlus/Sega directly. Hell, the shitty Persona 5 Musou game apparently is selling bad in Japan, at least the switch version.
So why the fuck did Nintendo choose him?

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Pikachu actually uses thunder and quick attack, the comeback gauge is completely made up. You'll switch from Arsene within the first hour of gameplay, the entire game is based around constantly switching personas which basically function as your spells. You use them CONSTANTLY not only in your time of need or whatever. I must assume that's some PR talk having brainwashed you or something, since you most certainly haven't even watched a gameplay video.

>Nintendo
>making sensible decisions
If we're to believe Sakurai, these are the same niggers who thought people would be overjoyed to see an eighth fucking Fire Emblem character as DLC.

>So why the fuck did Nintendo choose him?
It strengthens relations with Atlus.

It accumulated enough hype around the fighters pass to fund another one so it must've done something right. Having such a far-fetched character generated excitement and speculation. Also this Don't be such a faggot Ness.

I still think the shit about Nintendo picking all the characters is complete bullshit.
Do you really think they would pick some super niche nobody like Terry? After years of trying to shut down Melee tournaments now they care about courting hardcore fighting game fans? And Sakurai just happens to drool all over him? Sakurai chose all the reps and just damage controlled himself after the Byleth backlash.

>Pikachu actually uses thunder and quick attack, the comeback gauge is completely made up.
Neither Thunder or Quick Attack act like they do in the Pokemon games. The Pokemon also have entirely made up attacks, like Incineroar's Alolan Whip or Pikachu's Thunder Jolt.

Again, the gameplay has nothing to do with movesets for Pokemon and nothing to do with movesets for Joker. The movesets for these characters in Smash are designed for the characters concept, not to be representative of their games. I don't understand how this is hard for you to comprehend or what the fuck it even has to do with "PR talk".

What makes you think Sakurai gives a shit about "fan backlash" after all these years? Not to mention he said that at the beginning of the DLC.

things exist outside your tiny little bubble where Geno is somehow the most iconic JRPG character nintendie
Terry has been around for ages

Literally nobody mentioned Geno. The fact that you have to pull a whataboutism to defend Ken with a hat really says it all.

predictable response. boring.

I'll never understand what this faggot is doing in the game. Why did Nintendo choose him? What have they won with his addition? And no, sales of dlc don't really matter because smashfags eat up anything that hack Sakurai shits at them, over the basis of him overworking and all.
If anything, this only benefits Microshit directly. Hell, the no game is Never selling ever in anywhere ,at least the no version. So why the fuck did Nintendo choose him?

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>I still think the shit about Nintendo picking all the characters is complete bullshit.

>People think only Sakurai gives input on the Roster.
Miyamoto told Sakurai he wanted Pac-Man in Brawl and finally got him in Smash 4.

destructoid.com/miyamoto-wanted-pac-man-in-super-smash-bros-brawl-277541.phtml

but hes the cereal mascot bear from when i was a kid so its ok!!

>old out of touch crusty old fart wants old crusty character
Hmmmmmmm also if pacman was in brawl then who would namco havebin 4

>get hired by company to make game
>supposedly lie about the company being the one making decisions
>don't face consequences
He told us a year ago that Nintendo made the choices. If he was lying back then, he would have faced some kind of consequence by the guys who hired him, or he wouldn't have told us the same thing a year later. Ever think that this hired game developer doesn't have as much power as you thought?

And Nintendo working with Atlus and SNK makes way more sense then them picking 90% of the things smashfags obsess over.

Have you never played fatal fury before? Terry feels ripped straight from it

That little part where you explained the inane reasoning why the comeback gauge exists is straight up Sakurai PR talk.
Either way, I'm arguing for the great potential he had as a character when you started bringing up fucking pokemon so I don't fucking know where you're going with this man.

>character from series Sakurai likes that has no major Nintendo presence
>historic RPG series Sakurai likes from company that sucks absolute balls to work with
>big fan request western character whose series hadn't been relevant in 11 years and who belongs to a hardware semi-competitor
>cult classic company with a low profile that Sakurai happens to have a massive crush on
>the only Nintendo series Sakurai likes that he didn't work on getting yet another character despite the overwhelming majority of fans getting sick of it
The only ones on here that would make sense to possibly genuinely chalk up to Nintendo involvement would be Hero (since Nintendo's been trying for years to get DQ to stick in the west) and Byleth (for obvious reasons).

I absolutely loathe Banjo and his inclusion. The sole fact that Microsoft now shows up algonside nippon giants like Sega or Capcom makes my skin itchy and pisses me off.
Rareware's N64 games weren't even good besides Diddy Kong Racing. They were all shit.

And I mean this. Also yes, samefagging.

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>LEEEEEEEEE ONRY GRORIOUS NIHON ARROWED
Banjo's been considered since fucking 64, so LE EPIC JAPANESE COMPANIES ONLY has never remotely been a real rule. Also why don't K. Rool or Diddy throw you into a triggered shitfit? (let me guess, THESE two Raremade characters are only acceptable to you because they now belong to Nintendo.)

It should be clear SNK is extremely serious about pursuing crossovers with other companies to regain momentum after the company nearly went under. Terry is just one among a series of recent cameos by SNK characters, even if it's going to likely end up being the most prominent of these appearances just due to Smash's wide casual appeal. Beyond SNK's persuasions, Nintendo likely signed off due to the company's strong commitment to the Switch, successful sales from the Arcade Archives ports of Neo Geo titles, and the prominence of SNK in both Latin America and China.

Nah, I fucking hate them too lmao. I didn't even like Dark Samus because not only was it another fucking projectile cunt but also a western rep.
I don't even like Donkey Kong's new design, or the old one for that matter.

not only that but
>only present persona
at least put knight of the holy lance or unbreakable tie

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>and the prominence of SNK in both Latin America and China
Uh yeah dude, that's why they went bankrupt twice and KOF XIV and XIII sold like hot garbage. Definitely popular with the chill beaners who pirated the shit out their games instead of buying them like Americans bought Sonic's games.

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What the fuck did you expect, gringo de mierda? Your country makes a shit ton of money from sending shit from there to other places, countries like Brazil have hugely inflated prices for vidya and anything related.
What else would fellow spics who want to play vidya do?

>user bursts into his brick wall bedroom, bottle of Pocari Sweat in shaking hand
>obviously upset, he rushes towards his bed, hastily and angrily clutching around for his faithful (and crusty) Lucina dakimakura
>he drops one shoulder off of his ill fitting kimono, fruitlessly hoping for empathetic skinship with his beloved
>"OHHHHH, MY BEROVED RUKINA-CHAN" he starts sobbing in his Asian stereotype accent he's inadvertently faded into over time, tears rolling down his sour cream cheeks and glistening in the dim glow of his singular blue LED overhead light, their paths broken up by generous blemishes and drying out in his unkempt facial hair
>"I AM WOUNDED ONCE MORE, MY SWEET, OVER THE PRESENCE OF BAKA GAIJIN CHARACTERS IN MY GRORIOUS DAIRANTOU SMASHU BRUZA"
>user proceeds to cry loudly into his pillow wife for the next ten minutes, thrusting impotently and needily into the cushion to no fruition
>how dare user's own company betray their homeland and his honorary countrymen! This is just like when that white devil, Commodore Perry, befouled Nippon with his seppo imperialism!
>"TODAY IS THE DAY THEY LEARN OF MY PAIN", user tearfully swears, prepared to once and for all finally buy that cheap mass produced kodachi from the shady weapon store he's had bookmarked on his phone for months now
>however, as with every time before, user curls into a ball of totally uncontrollable sobbing for another few minutes before fading to sleep, his purchase continuing to be unfinished once more
>his spectacular seppeku is postponed once again. For now, he will cope by taking to his favorite Mongolian basketweaving forum and denouncing western video game characters.