I don't remember the original having this much backtracking

Can’t help I was born in 1993, I’m a zoomer but at least I know modern games are shit

>released in 2004
>zoomer game
???

Trying too hard

SNES Chads rise up

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Yup, GameCube is a zoomer console
Trying how? I didn’t grow up in the 90’s I first got my N64 in 1999, I was only 6 I couldn’t experience the 90’s I’m a zoomer

I don't remember backtracking in this game at all, I only remember it getting duller after (starting with) the wrestling ring chapter, but then picking up again for a nice final level/climax.

Nah, zoomer consoles are the PS3/360/Wii.

That's a matter of opinion. Even if you find it tedious, does it really ruin the story, characters, and battle system which are the main draws of the series?

That’s wrong kiddo, the zoomer generation started with the GameCube and GBA

This, FUCK the zoomercube. Nintendo went to shit with the N64.

Real boomers know that the PS2/GCN gen was the last good era for games

Agree to disagree. IMO if you were at least 10 years old before smartphones were a thing, you’re not a zoomer.

there's literally nothing wrong with backtracking in a game without random encounters, small overall areas and a fast movement speed on top of the ability to fast travel between major areas

meanwhile paper mario 2 has gameplay that's actually any fun at all, areas more complicated than literal hallways, and better writing. the n64 is the worst console nintendo ever made and would've killed any other company but nintendo mad way too much money with the nes/snes

Nah kiddo you’re a zoomer
Nope, if you couldn’t experience the 90’s you’re a zoomer, I was born in 93 I couldn’t experience them properly

TTYD was a complete downgrade from 64 in everyway except combat

>10 easy-mode fights in a row with unnecessary filler in-between
>forced-loss battle that ignores all other mechanics and never comes up again
>tiny-ass map
Yeah, no. It's like the train chapter in that it has an interesting premise that gets buried underneath all the mundane, repetitive shit that kills the fun just to drag things out.

It's a game that's best when not replayed, unlike 64.

>2012 everyone loves PM64 and TTYD
>2014 everyone loves PM64 and TTYD
>2016 everyone loves PM64 and says TTYD has some flaws
>2018 everyone fights over PM64 and TTYD
>2020 everyone says TTYD is complete garbage or PM64 is garbage no in betweens

Yea Forums sucks lol

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makes sense, TTYD gets worse with each replay

I've replayed it every year since 2010 and I've actually come to enjoy it much more. Especially once I realized how little backtracking there actually is. Most sections take a couple minutes at the most. The majority of the game is incredibly fun and there's so much customization, having roughly 10 minutes of backtracking spread over a 40+ hour game is fine.

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that's bullshit, the general white alone takes more time than that

It really does. It's hard to get into a story when you keep having to trudge through the same two screens, fighting the same two enemies for the same two star points, over and over again just to get the next little piece of it. The first time you go through an area, there's a sense of exploration as you uncover new things, challenge as you learn how to deal with new enemies, and progress as you become stronger and gain new abilities. The fourth time, it's just boring walking through the same areas, tedious when enemies catch you and force you to sit through the once-charming-now-overly-long animations, and annoying when you gain nothing from the journey.

In fact, it's the dungeon portions of the game, the ones with barely any story, that end up the strongest because they mostly let you progress continuously. The pirate cave is pretty fun, the fifth mandatory journey through the four preceding screens is not and the frustration from having to travel it again hurts the supposedly-urgent quest to grant a dying man his last wish.

Creepy Steeple is fucking garbage, but outside of that it's not too bad.

keyhaul key and creepy steeple have too much backtracking
chapter 4 and 5 form the mediocre midpoint of the game but it gets better afterwards
paper mario 64 certainly maintains a more consistent quality across all of its chapters

No he doesn't. Unless you're also counting the cutscene he's attached to, because the cannon does take a legitimately long time to fire once you do find him. But actually going to where he is, is a breeze. He's next to all the warp pipes.

backtracking is only one of the factors of monotony when it comes to replaying TTYD. The entirety of chapter 3 is boring as fuck on repeat since it's the same scenerio with drawn out battling. Then there's other filler like the delphino mafia fucks or having to go down entire rooms in chapter 2 due to the shitty pikmin rip offs. Also you are severely undermining the backtracking present in TTYD, half of chapter 4 and 6 is mindless backtracking in a game that decided to get rid of the quickspin from 64, chapter 5 and general white have repetition as well.

Contrast this with 64 where the limited amount of backtracking in chapter 4 and 6 can be mitigated by knowing the level layouts in repeat playthroughs

I never felt that way despite replaying the game (and 64) at least once per year. Before you ask, no I'm not but I share the sentiment. There's no way to change someone else's opinion on a matter, but after so much petty Dark Souls 2/3 tribalism I really don't want to argue which of the only true Paper Mario games is better by disparaging the other.

Perhaps, but, it really doesn't bother me or kill the game. Granted I also usually play with a hack that doubles enemy damage and HP, because the game is too easy, but I can say the same about PM64.

Perhaps the biggest thing to me is that PM64 is just so lacking in content comparatively. It's a smaller, shorter game, and you're basically always doing something, but there's very little extra content to do. I love both games, but I've watched the TTYD discussion go on for over a decade, and it's degraded heavily. But I also grew up on Dragon Warrior, so these claims of backtracking ruining the game just kind of make me giggle at times. They're both incredibly good games, 64 is short and sweet, TTYD is long and enjoyable. It has a lot more side content as well. But that's part of why it is longer. Also I care much more about the partners in TTYD. Since they speak more than once.

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I mean I would argue you're making traversing two screens five times into some big ordeal. And I could also say the same about Boggly Woods. The longest "trudge" section in the game is Chapter 3's first 10 fights, which do admittedly feel like padding. The latter 10 are very enjoyable in my opinion, however.

What am I in for?

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Fun

A classic Gamecube title. Built to be way harder than Mario games before and after, perhaps unintentionally. Movement is fluid and satisfying unless you're autistic about there being no long jump. If you play the game without using hover nozzle except where essential it's a lot more fun.

I turned on my cube and my controller keeps moving right whenever I press left. Guess I won't be playing it today :/

f

How are you holding the controller user?

The worst backtracking in any PM game is the start of 64. The tutorial section takes as long as an actual Chapter.

Unplug controller, keep your thumb off the stick, plug it back in. When you boot the system it assigns the current position of the stick as 'neutral' so your character walking right means you were holding the stick left when you booted the game up.

Do you know what backtracking means?

A forced section you have to replay each time you play the game that has no actual bearing or risks involved and merely adds time?

A cozy experience that has some difficulty.

Sure it drags on there's no denying that but there isn't any backtracking in that segment unless you count entering the goomba house twice or walking down from shooting star summit.

I rebooted the console and it works now

Excellent! Have fun, user!

>I could also say the same about Boggly Woods
You could say the same about nearly every level. Chapter 3 would have been a good mix of story content and gameplay challenge if they'd either cut the first 10 fights or put in a way for skilled players to jump ahead more than one fucking slot per battle. I assume a lot of this stuff is to help establish a baseline level for later challenges, but it's just annoying when you're already way overqualified.

I played 64 like 20 years ago. My mindset is so different now that it wouldn't even be fair to compare which one is better. I just remembered it as being a more constant stream of new content and TTYD definitely isn't that. I respect that it tries new things instead of just repeating what 64 did and there are a number of genuinely good bits. The padding just really dragged the experience down for me when I was eager to get to the next new thing and was forced to go through an old one instead. That probably doesn't concern you as much if you know the game by heart and are just in it for the core gameplay, though.

No. It's when you're forced to go through an area you've already gone through. You're going back over your own tracks. It has nothing to do with replays, it's a design concept that lets you lengthen the game without needing to design new assets. Forced tutorials are a completely different thing with a completely different reason for existing.

>It's when you're forced to go through an area you've already gone through

Even though I grew up (and was old enough to play video games) around the time of the N64 my first console was the Gamecube, likewise my first PM game was TTYD and I caught 64 shortly after on the Wii VC. It's impossible to speak from the perspective of someone who played 64 first, and at launch no less. I admit I may be biased towards TTYD because I played it first but I still enjoyed (and continue to enjoy) both games. I also don't mind short backtracking in other well-designed games since I have played enough genuinely bad games to know when those issues can actually ruin the experience, but that's basically the definition of personal taste.

>93
>zoomer

I’ve always preferred PM over TTYD. Both are great though.

TTYD is one of the most overrated games of all time. It ranks only slightly above Sticker Star in my PM rankings.

PM64 > SPM >>>>>>>>>>>>> TTYD > Sticker Shit >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Colour Shit

That’s some pretty spicy opinions my man

>SPM
>Good
LMAO

Is there a chapter in ttyd that has no backtracking of any kind?

Instead of outright disagreeing with your list I'm going to ask you why SPM is up so high. Was it characters? Story? Music?

Wow holy fucking shit he called it the original translated japanese name this guy has to be right

I recently 100%'d TTYD (all stars, tattles, badges, recipes) and the only disgusting backtracking is the Trouble Center Quests which literally just try to inflate completion if you didn't know to pick up certain items beforehand. The most offensive in the main game is having to walk back to Creepy Steeple another time after you reveal Doopliss, but thankfully they warp you back to town. The General White Quest memed the most is nothing, all the warp pipe short-cuts are unlocked and right next to each-other.

wrong. Zoomers cannot appreciate this game because zoomers have 0 tolerance to backtracking

the game is 16 years old, meaning they would have had to play it in the fucking womb

ttyd is a great game, but the original paper mario is still the best in the series
youtube.com/watch?v=CWqxzGDFtUQ

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I'm playing through it on Dolphin with the 4k texture pack. There have been 3 spots in the game where the backtracking has actually been obnoxious
>Chapter 4, going back and forth between Creepy Steeple and the town
>Chapter 5, going back and forth between the camp and the skull rock
>getting Bub-ulber hot dogs
The rest is fine.

1, 3 technically, 6, 7, finale

dude chapter 7 has some of the most egregious backtracking in the entire game

Ironically, three doesn't really have any, despite being one of, if not the, most padded out chapter. The first chapter isn't too bad either, just making a return trip. Every other chapter forces you to do a back-and-forth through the town-to-dungeon part at least once.

stop biting the bait you fucking newfag

7 doesn’t actually start until you land on the moon.

It's a term used exclusively by cancer to shitpost, you shouldn't treat it like it has an established definition.

Pretty sure the title pops up when you go through the pipe.

Maybe it does, actually. Yeah, now that I think about it, you get the stage drop when you first enter the pipe. My mistake.

this