This is just absolutely childish. Banning Hero is one thing but banning ALL future DLC characters?

>ultimate kids already banning because they can't win
See you in smash 6 faggots

>France
Literally who cares? All the big tournaments are in America.

It's just one person making the character look good, basically Ultimate's version of Melee Jigglypuff being carried primarily by one autist.

HERHOES MAD
HERHOES MAD

Attached: herhoes_mad.jpg (668x488, 76K)

>le bans should be based on tier lists
No, seriously, are you retarded?

Being good or not doesn't matter you fucking retard. It's not about his tier placement it's about his literal RNG.

Hero is no different then items

>smash is a fighting game
>but you need to turn off the items
>only one stage
>and you can’t play these characters
yikes!

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I never said tier lists had anything to do with it. He's just outright not that great. Joker is far worse. I almost feel like I could win a tourney with him.

>Banjoke banned from comp play
STEVE

WINS

AGAIN

Attached: Stevesyourwaifu.png (790x1080, 617K)

It's very much different from items because hero can't always use what he wants to and he still has to be fast enough to do it. and the right ability has to come up at the right time, and he can't be interrupted in the meantime.

>he didn't read the article
OH NO NO NO NO NO
Stevecucks are the gift that keep on giving

The French are such pussies.

Rent free

Imagine playing a children's game competitively. Imagine not just getting drunk and turning on casual online play for an hour for fun and then doing something else

>Joker is the only dlc character allowed

I main Joker and even I think that's retarded.

Cry harder for me

>hero can't always use what he wants
You can always reroll though. You can alway brute force access to any spell you need

Plant and Banjo are allowed too, according to the article.

>le bans should be on "RNG bad" principle
>oh but Peach and Game and Watch are fine
NO U

Ganondorf kills at sub-30 percentages, but nobody bitches about that

They should just add a minor cost, like 5 mp, to activate the magic menu.

>then
*than, you illiterate retard.

I would but I don't want them to mistake my napkin for their flag.

>He's just outright not that great
Which isn't relevant. His ban is not based on his actual tier level.

>entertaining mid-tier character is banned
>while forcing us to watch boring joker matches

lol

Hero's not even that good. What the fuck?

not him, but that was cringe

Do they have RNG-based critical hits on their smash attacks? Do they have more than 4 special moves each?

>a single attack that can be anticipated
>a single attack that can be anticipated

You're him

cope

Oh right and in the meantime Joker will just stand and watch.

5 mp when you cancel it

Is he?

Attached: Screen Shot 2019-09-23 at 7.54.40 PM.png (1552x752, 165K)

Hero has a literal fucking "I win" button that works a rock sold 20% of the time

Why would he EVER be allowed into comp play?

Attached: wait.png (120x135, 1K)

COPE
O
P
E

Because it's assumed competitive players can read.

Fuck you, Ganon kills at like 40% all the time, but none of you faggots are calling to ban HIM

You can't just arbitrarily decide which RNG is good and which is bad. Die.

You're not me

That's not RNG

Cause he sucks. Then again so does hero.

>all capped
lol triggered

Are you blind or retarded?

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Why the caps for HIM?

might as well ban gay & watch while you are at it

It's worse than rng.

One guy lost because he couldn't read the move Hero picked due to being foreign

Hey, genius. Queero has RNG built into his very smash attacks.

That's not true though. The Smash community has players from many different countries and a lot of them don't read english.

>one attack that does slightly more damage based on chance
That's nothing. It can be anticipated. Hero's bullshit instakill can't

So fucking what? It's a move you should avoid even if it doesn't land a crit. Just assume it'll land a crit every time it hits.

>lower mid tier gets banned
holy shit tourneys are a joke

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i have every single characters in Elite smash
one day i dropped out of it with Isabelle and it took an entire day to get back.
Today i voluntarily dropped below 3K with Hero and got back up in Elite in the same hour.

He's a litteral Pay2Win and everyone saying otherwise is either retarded or a Hero player (which isn't very far from being retarded).

Just another reason why the Smash competitive scene is absolute trash.

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Nice, real nice. Go ahead and ban a fun character because you can't handle someone who throws some randomness into the mix. God forbid I'm not some sweaty neckbeard that spent 3/4 of his life learning every combo and kill-confirm under the sun. God forbid Sakurai finally gives me a character I can give sweaty neckbeards some payback with by throwing something they can't predict at them

>France

Well there's your problem.

Couldn't you just avoid Hero's shenanigans? You can even interrupt magic burst.

>Don't get hit, bro

>Arbitrarily
>Statement provided with reasoning behind it

my nuts stink and you must smell them

>either retarded or a Hero player (which isn't very far from being retarded)
They're synonymous tbqh

Where's his ban?
He has RNG mechanics too

Attached: 33a7c667bebe6ac4a990a248698c178f.jpg (1000x1100, 54K)

Tbh his rng moves are bad too. It's not like he can link anything into his instant death moves.

Yes, Hero is extremely easy to gimp and only shitters are bothered by him

>You can't use Hero
>You also can't use any DLC going forward, so no Terry, 5th slot or any future slots
>You can use DLC from before Hero, but not after
>Except Banjo, who makes it in because...
>???
Why the fuck are the French like this? It's one thing to say "No DLC because we don't know if they break the game," and it's one thing to say "No Hero because we don't want him," but this is some exceptional ass ruling. No DLC after the day we decide this, and it only is retroactively applied to Hero. Banjo, who was released after, is fine, but Terry won't be because he was also released after?

that's LITERALLY why he's getting banned. Because not everyone CAN read English

>cuck valve by forcing resales on digital games
>now dabbing on smash trannies

For me, France has been skyrocketing in my based compilation as of late.

Attached: jeanne.gif (549x598, 258K)

>>Except Banjo, who makes it in because...
>>???
because he's family

Attached: D3hLY6MX4AEVfPc.png (900x871, 1.14M)

>He has RNG mechanics too
On one tiny short-ranged move that anybody can see coming. Compare that to built-in critical hits (which no other RPG character possesses), two attacks that can kill instantly as low as 0%, and several special attacks that kill absurdly early, including his non-RNG special attacks

good thing France isn't a real country

what colors you run?

And how is this different from characters like Faust and Zappa in Guilty Gear that rely heavily on RNG you dumb nigger? Answer me this! I always bring it up, and none of you chucklefucks ever bother to answer. Even your “Gods” like Armada and Leffen drop spaghetti when it’s pointed out RNG characters are a common thing in other fighting games. Yes, as RNG heavy as Hero, or MORE in the case of Zappa.

Attached: 42F68985-A06A-4B62-AB5E-7BA34FF91631.png (680x451, 453K)

Going by your standard those are all easy to see coming

Careful, they have the biggest flag on the entire planet.

Why can't the rest of the world learn English already so I can Whack them at 0% and feel good about myself?

Attached: 1241927468768.jpg (800x600, 36K)

G&W has a gamble where he can damage himself

Hero has free bullshit bonus damage for absolutely no cost of any kind

>Smashbabbies can't adapt

This is why you will never be fightan.

cute girls

>france
Who cares?

Flatter

BASED NINTENDO!

B-BUT IT'S NOT FAIR

Attached: 1439085837162.jpg (612x612, 91K)

>Faust
literally who
>Zappa
literally who
>Guilty Gear
LITERALLY FUCKING WHO

B-But Hocus Pocus might put me to sleep

>Guilty Gear
>literally who
now you're just being a retarded newfag

Holy shit I haven't seen those turnips in years.

An actual fucking fighting game specifically designed for competitive play.

Faust has a random move button with instakills like Hero. And Zappa literally changes his play style on a dice roll.

No, seriously.

Literally who?

Attached: ohnooo.webm (640x360, 2.59M)

Claire is dead

FAIR

AND

BALANCED

the crits are the only thing that need to be removed, everything else is fine

Spoiler that shit. It's too cute.

Attached: 1323313736697.jpg (400x400, 30K)

>magic I win button is fine

Yea Forums couldn't even beat a tranny at smash

Hero is low-mid at best. Yeah I know being overpowered isn't the reason for banning but in practice his RNG has had a less profound effect on tournament results than Peach's bob-omb, which is why the US and Japan don't give a fuck.

Second-stage Side-B needs a massive nerf as well. MPs overall needs to recharge way slower and not gain anything on shield. Make Neutral B charge as long as Thoron.

(i'm the one who posted the video - i'm a Robin main and my Snake is pretty shit but i can recognize bullshit when i see it)

>die at fucking 28 to an uncharged upsmash.
>inb4 the snake was being a dumbass so that's OK.

You just suck, user

Who fucking keeps making these

That's now how RNG works, newbie

I just explained it to you, you stupid motherfucker:

youtu.be/OFrqyUEtrIM

youtu.be/WnuW2tEnokc

And that’s just one game. RNG characters are a common trope in fighting games, yet all you antiHerofags ALWAYS dodge this point. I know you don’t play real fighting games, but your ignorance isn’t an excuse. RNG isn’t anticompetitive as evidenced by better designed games.

For the record Hero is banned due to the language change, not RNG or shit. "future dlc" being banned is standard practice.

If this were in any other major region making this decision I'd call it bullshit. But Europistan has so many different languages that I can understand this ban (though this is also on Sakurai for not even considering some sort of non-text symbols to convey Spells). Until Sora Ltd implements a way to communicate Spells without text, this is sadly by far the least messy way to handle it.

Cope.

>some generic shovelware game
>look it up on steam
>steam stats say only like 10 people are playing
Again I ask you:

Literally who?

I went to the training room afterwards and tried to reenact it and it works even on Bowser, and even with the Fixed Damages. The knockback alone is enough to kill the heaviest character uncharged at 28% without any need of additional damages or buffs.

>smash ultimate
>combos
Lmao

Hackurai needs to fix this, just put a little icon next to each spell or whatever

wait that/s not a real tail where is that connected to OH NONONONONONOONOONNONNOOOO AAAAAAAAAAA NOOOOOOOO THE COOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM

Except that's literally how it works for most major tourneys like EVO. If there's a patch right before EVO, they use a older version of the game.

Am I supposed to recognize this generic ass looking Naruto game?

He's not going to listen, he only plays smash.

They aren't banning all future dlc forever you retard, just for this one nintendo tourney.

It's no different from hero not being allowed at evo.

This is why no one will ever take smash seriously in the fightan community

at this point i think they're just fucking with you.

or at the very least i hope, otherwise we really do have to worry about the next generation being full of Chernobyl rejects

>FGC faggots always act like Smash isn't part of their community
>Get butthurt when Smash fans don't know their games (games that are famous for selling like shit)
???

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What’s annoying as fuck is that even people like Armada and Leffen blatantly disregard this point, and Leffen competed in Guilty Gear even. It’s also not just GG either. Tons of fighting games do the RNG character, NONE of them have ever been banned.

Until someone can argue that Zappa or Faust in GG should be banned, there is no case for Hero.

i play both Smash and Guilty Gear.
I just think it's heartbreaking to know so many uncultured retards wants to be taken seriously when they can't even name a simple recognizable character like Terry.

Nice selfie by the way.

Fake fighting games that only like 10 black guys play is not relevant to smash.

>Smash isn’t part of the community
>because Smashfags don’t try to integrate, and are not only blatantly ignorant, but disrespectful about our games
Makes sense. Get out.

Smash players are the ones asking to be in the FGC so they can be in EVO and other big tournaments. The FGC doesn't take them seriously because most of them don't compete or play in traditional fighting games.

>terry
>recognizable
Lmao

DQ doesn't have those.

I think we should just start listing off how many fighting games have done the RNG character at this point. I know Skullgirls has, and I believe MvC3 did too.

I'm a smash chad in a smash chad thread. Why don't you go back to your guilty gear thre- OH WAIT LOL

good. fuck dlc it ruined 4 and its currently ruining ult

As evidenced by the fact that they believe RNG characters are “anticompetitive” when they’ve been a recurring trope in the genre for decades now.

>tournaments

Who cares

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there's a case to be made in the fact that RNG elements have always been allowed to coexist with the game in a reasonable fashion (Turnips have extremely low chances of being good; Judge always had a tiny & predictable hitbox, Misfire can easily kill its one user on top of being very rare)

Hero runs on several layers of RNG, added to the fact that even his non-RNG damage input is already crazy good.

people like to bring up his """""slow"""" Framedata but it's bullshit as well - it's very similar to Ganondorf's in many regards; and for a character that can already mess you up in a ton of ways, it's nowhere near fair.

But they've never been. Fake fighting games are not real games

Leffen says Faust is not at all similar to Hero. And I'm more inclined to believe him than some no-name user on an Itallian basketweaving forum, due to him actually competing in the games.

Hero is an example of feature creep in moveset design. Hero's concept makes the HUD interface a fucking ugly mess of visual clutter, and the only way to fix this while keeping all his Spells intact (because no way is Sakurai is removing moves) is to introduce yet more visual clutter.
>either tiny symbols next to the spell names that probably won't be super apparent at a glance
>or a larger symbol outside the menu box, which is yet more outward visual clutter
Hero is a fucking mess of moveset design. Extra HUD elements and meters have become a sloppy crutch to introduce an arbitrary level of "unique" gimmick for a character.

You didn’t address the point I made. Characters with heavy RNG like Faust and Zappa. Hero is the first character in Smash to be heavily RNG-based, but fighting games have been experimenting with luck-based characters for a very long time now.

If Hero isn’t dominant tournaments, then his RNG isn’t busted. It doesn’t matter how much RNG he has, luck is and can be a factor In competition, and the fact that the entire FGC has been totally fine with RNG characters since their conception kills the case for banning Hero based on his luck factor.

I'd like Hero better if he had a set list of commands to choose from every time instead of just a bunch of random ones.

How so? He better give his reasoning, as Faust, like Hero, has a certain special attack that randomly pulls out a move. Like Hero.

I really don't understand that complaint. If you're such an uber tryhard who puts in so much time and effort for the sake of winning, it shouldn't be a big deal.
>inb4 bro just learn 12 languages
Except you're not learning 12 languages you're just associating combinations of letters with images. Also, you're never going to show up to a tourney and be like "Oh fuck, I didn't know all the setups would be in Spanish!" You'd already know beforehand so just don't be a bitch and ADAPT

>people compare single move RNG to a pervasively RNG-based design as if they're the same thing at the exact same extremes
People on the spectrum can't understand spectrums. Funny.

Faust's RNG comes from a "Super".
Think of it as if Hero needed to use 100MPs everytime he uses Down-B.

No it doesn’t. He has the Super version, and the normal version. And Supers in GG build up very fast. You could easily fire 2-3 off per round.

Also, Zappa. His RNG isn’t reliant on supers at all. It’s his entire gimmick.

Why the fuck are people talking about RNG? It’s just because he’s new.

>”slow” frame data

Opinion instantly discarded, imagine thinking a character with zero(0) auto cancel aerials is fast in Smash.

>french "people"

If Leffen seriously said Faust’s RNG is only from a Super then he’s obviously a retard, as it’s not, and he’s always had his random item throw be one of his regular specials.

dustloop.com/wiki/index.php/GGXRD/Faust

See for yourself. I hope he didn’t actually say that.

pretty sure that's why Zappa wasn't back in Xrd. As for Faust i didn't see it ever winning anything on RNG alone (and it does build very fast - if you're taking a beating; Otherwise (like in Hero's case), he doesn't have access to anything like that from the get-go)

Banjo is authorized. While RNG isn't the point of the ban (it's language) ; it's certainly not unwelcomed. Hero needs a fucking nerf in many departments.

Nerfing Hero would be pointless, he’s lower mid tier at best.

it's almost like the entire point of my argument was that he does NOT have a bad aerial game. I just often see that aerial attack excuses being brought up by people who don't want to hear anything bad about their press-a-button-to-win DLC

No he didn't say that, i just based that off the times i played the game myself and the bunch of videos i looked at casually. Faust & Hero arent very alike - Hero's RNG is way more fucked and unforgiving.

Hero does have an awful aerial game though because his aerials don’t auto cancel.

Meter in GG builds on aggression, not defense. Approaching and attacking are what build meter the fastest.

Faust has, and can win on RNG. Some of his best combos rely on a lucky item drop.

RNG for him isn’t limited to supers. His item drop is one of his regular specials as well. At NO COST, unlike Gero who uses MP.

Zappa was mentioned in the story for Rev2 and is the most likely to return soon. His RNG has never been a point of contention. His absence from Xrd was Dev time + story reasons. Like all missing characters. If dev time permits he’ll for sure be showing up in GG2020.

Faust’s RNG is a regular special like Hero, and without a cost. He has moves just as busted as Hero in his RNG kit. Look it up yourself. I posted the dustloop link.

Nerfs are more than just based off tier-lists. It's about overall Gameplay. You would probably agree with me if i said K Rool didn't specifically need nerfs because he wasn't admittedly not "that good" right? But with how shitty the game is at registering inputs, and how the online is botched, they had to makes changes that rewarded too much bad players.

Trust me, Pre-patch Blunderbuss was a fucking hellscape; and KRool isn't really the only character who was specifically cancerous online. You have Zelda, projectile users in general, etc.

that's why we also get nerfs on insignificant things like Final Smashes - the team's very unlikely to look at tier lists to determine what's fucked in the game.

i'm no pro but i can assure you that climbing back from sub 3K to Elite didn't take more than an Hour because of how much i got to abuse the shit out of Hero's priority & RNG.

It also appears to be an official Nintendo tournament, which ironically makes it matter even less.

Never forget the mama mia. Smashniggers don't want to be part of anything, least of all a shower.

In terms of overall gameplay, nerfing K. Rool was simply too early, and it was already clear that K. Rool had serious problems.
Let's be real though, K. Rool would still be shit even if he never got those nerfs. His entire character is total shit due to his massive lag on a lot of his attacks.

No tournament allows dlc released too close to the tournament date, no time for anyone to learn him means he's broken basically by default. By a few months in tournament level players are expected to know the matchup but before then there's just no time.

Are Faust's and Zappa's RNG moves based on a textbox on-screen? Because that's what Hero is getting banned for. You know that, right?

>smash
>fighting game
LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Where in OP's post does it even mention Smash being a fighting game?

>banning anything

git gud

HERHOES MAD
HERHOES MAD

who gives a fuck about baguette shit hole?

Nintendo.
you answered your own question, retard.

All the Queeroshitters who were throwing tantrums in the thread sure did

Stevies truly are the greatest cuckolds in gaming, the only fans that have been more btfo'd than stevies is sonic fans

Attached: a71.png (510x546, 15K)

HERHOES MAD
HERHOES MAD

the problem is that smash tourneyfags have fetishized the removal of RNG to the extent that ANYTHING being even mildly random causes them to have a mental breakdown and start smearing shit on the walls

the next smash game shouldn't have an option to remove items. fuck those assholes.

You know that Peach and G&W are still tournament-legal despite have moves with RNG, right? It's because their entire playstyles don't revolve around RNG that produces critical hits off of basic smash attacks, numerous absurdly damaging/strong attacks or stackable buffs or healing or invincibility or increased size or immunity to projectiles or sleep-inducing projectiles or instant recoveries or gigantic spheres that guarantee edgeguards. Ever think of that?

Keep smearing it, I'm sure it'll magically turn into paint instead of shit.

this is an europe tournament, so yeah you would need to learn french,english,swedish,spanish,portuguese

No argument, huh?

I'm no Smash expert or anything but can someone explain why Hero is banned but someone like Game & Watch isn't? Doesn't the latter also have a OHKO RNG move?

>Pay money for item
>Not allowed to use said item by company that sold you that item
>No refund

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Game & Watch
>OHKO RNG move

Hero
>2 OHKO RNG moves
>Several absurdly damaging or strong projectiles or humongous hitboxes
>Critical hits built into his smash attacks
>Can buff himself, and stack those buffs
>Can heal
>Can turn invisible
>Can turn invincible
>Can make himself larger
>Can make himself immune to projectiles
>Can put enemies to sleep
>Can get a free recovery if sufficiently far offstage
>Can render any attempt at recovery moot by using Magic Burst offstage

because g&w doesn't have a menu that you don't understand if you dont speak the language

Hero has multiple OHKO options and can easily cheese wins out against foreign opponents by using a different language for his spell list to be completely unpredictable in most situations.

>Interestingly, this also applies to every DLC character released after September 23
>characters released too close to the tourney date are banned
>just like every fighting game tournament in existence
So whoever wrote this article and also the faggot OP have no idea how fighting tournaments work. Color me surprised

So fucking what? Nobody bitches when characters like Ganon and Roy get early kills

Those aren't determined by rng.

And why the fuck does it matter?

Don’t forget that Hero has all of that on top of having a wide variety of disjoints to abuse. He’s not busted, but anyone that says that Hero sucks is retarded.

>so assblasted at Hero having unremovable RNG in "MUH SKILL-BASED GAME" they jump the gun and start banning characters that they don't even know exist yet
Smashfags never cease to amaze

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Hero doesn't have fast frame data like Sheik

One is gotten by an input, the other is gotten by a die roll you goalpost moving faglord.

>moving goalposts
I play in Japan, and don’t know the language fully and still do fine.

>Game and Watch side-b is literally an insta-kill 1/9 times bro, it's like items
>Peach has a chance, no matter how small, to LITERALLY pull items bro, it's no different than all items
Yet both of these characters are fine

We get it, you're bad and jump into Fsmash all game

Except consider how much the RNG based playstyle of Hero is all that effective. Here's a hint, it's not effective, and way too gimmicky to actually work out.
His down+b is a huge tell, and rush downs just anally rape the fuck out of Hero like it's no tomorrow.
His normals are just okayish at best, but his frame data is actually pretty crappy all things considered.
He is FAR from a ban-worthy character.

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With proper spacing, that doesn’t matter. Hero has a very serviceable moveset to use alongside his special shenanigans, and it seems pretty disingenuous when people suggest otherwise. He’s a fun character to use with friends, but Hero can feel unfair in a lot of situations.

See . They can't do half the shit that Hero can do, nor do their attacks involve a language barrier.

>His down+b is a huge tell
If you know the language. That's the REASON why Hero's getting banned, user.
>but his frame data is actually pretty crappy all things considered
His aerial frame data is on par with Falcon's and Ganon's, and people still make those characters work. Cope.

>LowTierGod.webm

Just don't get hit, bro.

>RNG in competitive games is BAAAAD!! >:^(
Why hello there!

I love how everyone completely disregarded the Faust and Zappa argument, cause they know they have nothing, and went back to arguing over the same “but Peach and G&W aren’t as bad as Hero” nonsense.

Seriously though, Leffen is a faggot of epic proportions. Fuck him. At least Armada was open to hearing arguments that proved him wrong. I’ll be reminding you all that REAL fighting games have no problem with the RNG character trope while you all throw your temper tantrums, until you come to terms with the fact that you’re all whiny bitches with no spine.

and guess what
>His aerials are slow as shit even for a sword fighter.
>He has pathetic range on some of his attacks, namely up air, and up smash.
>He has awful lag on MANY of his attacks, his forward and back aerials are the worst offenders of this.
>Tall character model meaning it's easy to hit him

He does however have a good neutral B, and Up B. His specials are great, and pretty much the most worthwhile aspects of his character.

>RNG in competitive games is BAAAAD!! >:^(
Why hello there!

I love how everyone completely disregarded the Faust and Zappa argument, cause they know they have nothing, and went back to arguing over the same “but Peach and G&W aren’t as bad as Hero” nonsense.

Seriously though, Leffen is a faggot of epic proportions. Fuck him. At least Armada was open to hearing arguments that proved him wrong. I’ll be reminding you all that REAL fighting games have no problem with the RNG character trope while you all throw your temper tantrums, until you come to terms with the fact that you’re all whiny bitches with no spine.

Fuck all of you. You know you’re wrong but aren’t willing to concede. Instead still here waiting for someone to tell me why these two and other RNG characters are OK, but Hero isn’t.

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Elaborate for us. How dependent are Faust and Zappa on RNG? How much of their playstyles does it encompass?

You don’t need to know the language, you only need to recognize like 16 words. You can literally do that in a day. That’s the price of playing internationally. Deal with it, it’s not hard.

>His aerials are slow as shit even for a sword fighter.
On par with Falcon's and Ganon's, PLUS he has a disjoint.
>He has pathetic range on some of his attacks, namely up air, and up smash.
They still have utility. Up Air happens to be quick, and up smash has can crit. Did you see how early it kills a heavyweight like Snake?
>He has awful lag on MANY of his attacks, his forward and back aerials are the worst offenders of this.
See the first point.
>Tall character model meaning it's easy to hit him
Plenty of characters are tall but don't have half the potent bullshit tools that Hero does

I’ve already done so ITT.

Faust has a special that’s exactly like Hero’s Down B, except it has NO cost, with some moves that are just as busted. Then he has a Super with two levels, that’s just his special on steroids, letting him shoot out multiple random items with better odds.

Faust is heavily dependent on RNG as well, as he’s the silly whacky character of GG. Tierwise, he’s solid mid to high in most games.

Zappa, can be posseses by one of 4 spirits, activation done by a special attack. Each spirit changes his movement and attacks considerably, altering his playstyle, what spirit he gets is totally determined by RNG. And once you’re possessed you gotta wait for the spirit to run out to Summon a new one. You can’t get two of the same one in a row in the same round iirc. One of those spirits is also mega busted, but Super rare to come out.

This is basically an admission that the French language is awful and nobody wants to be bothered learning french words.

Pretty funny for Nintendo of all companies to make such a statement.

If tourneyfags & tierfags were to be listened for nerfs, we would still be having Bayonetta fucking the entire roster off the ceiling, in the hands of a litteral 3yo.

it's been 10+ fucking years and these faggots still argue as if the same guy that keeps winning all tournaments should be allowed or not to camp the shit out of the ledge and bore everybody to death instead of putting a limit.

Since the whole "JUST SDI LOL" Bayo controversy, i just generally assume anyone defending any bullshit from a Smash character comes from the same kind of fart-sniffing retards that wants to keep their lead in the game.

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Yeah, even worse, it is guarranteed.

yeh it's guaranteed if you're a complete troglodyte that can't help but hold the Forward-button when he sees the pretty lights on the giant sword.

Or poison you. Or shrink you. Or reverse your controls.

>it's been 10+ fucking years and these faggots still argue as if the same guy that keeps winning all tournaments should be allowed

A dweeb like you would ruin MvC2.

Ganon could have done the same far easier.

This is Zappa btw.

And here’s their dustloops if you don’t believe me:

dustloop.com/wiki/index.php/GGXRD-R2/Faust

dustloop.com/wiki/index.php/GGACR/Zappa

And that’s just in Guilty Gear, toms of other games have done the RNG character, as it’s a fairly common trope. I’d just have to go looking for them. I know MvC3 had Phoenix, and SG had one too. None have ever been banned, and are openly welcome. In fact, only time characters are banned is when they’re intentionally busted secret boss characters like SF2 Akuma, and so on... no one has any problems with RNG characters, because despite fighting games being intentionally designed for competitive play, we also aren’t tryhards, and welcome silly fun characters.

So the idea that RNG is anticompetitive and Hero should be banned because of it is blatantly wrong, and I’ve yet to see anyone argue against this point.

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But you can just sdi. The problem is that it destroys the rubber in gamecube controller analogue sticks, and still leaves you in a 50/50.

Most people didn't bother to lab it out to begin with.

Same argument to be made by Hero’s nonsense. He’s literally standing still. If you can’t attack him or get out of the way, you just suck.

....i don't think you understand how that game works.

There's not a single character in the entire game except hero, that can kill from the middle of a FD stage with an uncharged smash attack at 28%.

Tell me about Faust's busted specials. What is it about them? Very damaging? Do they inflict an effect on the enemy or Faust himself? And as for Zappa, do his spirits do anything besides altering his movement and attacks? Do each of the 4 separate spirits have consistent effects? (As in A always does this when it appears, B always does this when it appears, etc...)

Yet weaker than both Falcon and Ganon. His aerials are shit, that's why he can't win majors or even make it to top 8 most of the time. Hero is mediocre.

Complete retardation. He's not just "standing here" - there's options to cover both distance and close approach in the bar, and more often than not, both in the same roll. What you're telling me is "If you can't manage to be both away and in front of your opponent, you're bad"

i don't know, faggot, where do you want me to be? on the fucking moon? inside his entrails? are you just speaking out of your ass?

9s, dots and stitchfaces are more common than Hero's better effects.

Other fighting games ban characters and even stages too

And? His smash attacks are shit otherwise. Slow and/or small, and have a 7/8 chance to be far weaker than usual.

You just block. If it is hatchet man, go male a sandwich, come back after a nap, and then move or hit him. If he has psych up and/or oomph on already, be mindful of blocking in his face and space a bit better, you can still just block a majority of what he does and be fine.

Just make english the default language for every hero, how fucking hard is it to learn what "Whack" or "Thwack" is after playing 10 rounds of english hero

Well the Japanese guy who lost to hero doesn't think that the language barrier was a problem. Make all heroes play in japanese, and we'll all still beat their asses, lol.

it's not "far weaker" than usual, it's "twice the damage and knockback". The smash attacks are strong on their own and it just takes one fucking read to take a stock even at 0%. Even Ganon i can let it pass because close-quarters fight is all he has - but Hero has projectiles; tons of them, and they all hit like a fucking truck.

They’re items that mostly hurt the oppenent and activate a secondary effect. Some of them can hurt Faust, another can heal whoever picks up the item, some are unblockable, he can stun, do a hard knockdown, poison, put to sleep, summon meteors that cover the whole screen, and even a silly one where it does nothing but make the character’s voices more high pitched. Some of them are busted, like the 10,000 ton weight that does a fuckton of damage, and knocks you down if you’re touching the ground (even if you block it, yes), it comes put really fast too. It’s basically a free combo for Faust, and the dude has crazy good neutrals as is, unlike Hero. Obviously the better items have lower odds, but it costs nothing to toss one out, so why not. Also, his Super increases the odds of rare items, and sends put a fuckton of them. You can fire off 2-3 supers per round.

He also has a secondary RNG on his other Super, which does more damage if you guess correctly when selecting 1 of 4 cups.

Zappa, the spirits completely alter his playstyle, like dramatically. It’s kinda like Pokemon Trainer, except it’s 5 in 1, rather than 3, and the Pokemon you get is RNG, and must be out for a set time. Also, the strongest spirit, Raph, has him do lethal damage on every hit, but only lasts 15 seconds. Lethal damage is like, imagine if Hero had guaranteed crits on all his attacks for 15 seconds, just cause he got lucky and summoned the right spirit. You can also manipulate the summoning slightly based on the clock timer, which increases your odds of getting the summon you want, but it’s difficult to do. So, even despite his RNG, imagine if Hero had a way of using the timer to correctly guess what load-out he’d get on Down B. That’s Zappa.

It’s not worth the effort, user. You’ve been arguing with shitposters and Hero mains. They have no incentive to concede on any point you make.

>B-but he’s too slow
>B-but he hasn’t won any tournaments
>B-but he’s actually low tier, honest
>B-but my faulty comparisons to Peach, Luigi, and G&W
>B-but I beat my friend who used him
>I-I didn’t care about competitive and tournaments anyways
Cope and seeth No-banfags. Hero was and will be broken as long as he isn’t nerfed, and even then he is the embodiment of items on.
None of your “B-but he’s actually slow! Even though most of his moves are on par with everyone else” and “B-but he hasn’t won any tours, even though Tours mean jackshit when characters like Pirahna Plant can get second place”
Hopefully more tournaments follow suit and ban this uncompetitive character. Would make the tours much more enjoyable and would make Yea Forums a great salt mine.

I have no problems interrupting his Down B, or just avoiding it. I play Banjo and Zelda. ZSS practically shits on him as it’s a free hit, even kill with her down B. Maybe you just suck.

No they are not, since nearly all his moves are better effects.
Magic Burst alone is way better than all those moves combined and its still pretty common

You’ve still to tell my why these two are okay, while Hero isn’t.

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he's just as broken as any rng character in a real fighting, just play actual fighting games instead of being retarded and acting like heros broken because you shitty at the game

Smashers are autistic manchildren.

Well NO SHIT you don't have a problem with it when you have fuckin' Wonderwing to go through it; A reflector with Zelda (who has 8964655 multi-hits and can fight from the other side of the stage) - the only somewhat fair character i see in there would be ZSS that requires at least a tad of skill to use but the rest is just shit.

And i know this Character is bullshit because i played him myself. I racked up wins so fast i felt bad for my opponents and voluntarily SD'd to not make them lose their GSPs.

yeh i'm too naive, i'll just give up.

post hero tournament results :)

Well now I'm just curious. Is there any specific counterplay against Faust? There's got to be something abusable about the character. Same regarding Zappa.

>wah wah, this character is busted he has no counterplay
>but what about these characters?
>they don’t count!!
It’s not just Banjo, Zelda and ZSS. Anyone with a reflector shuts him down hard too. So Fox, Wolf, and Palu have strong match up against him. And Pokemon Trainer cause of Charizard’s Blast Burn. He’s a match up based character. There’s nothing wrong with that. He has some hard counters, some of whom are high to top tier characters. Any Zoner or Zone Breaker can fuck him up too. Though Reflect is Pesky. But characters with Zone Breaking moves like Zelda’s Farore, Bouncing Fish, ZSS Flip Kick, and Meta Knight Down B are really good against him. Zelda possibly being his toughest counter even, which is good, cause she’s low Mid at best. So stop being an unga bunga, THINK, and choose a character with a stronger matchup against him. Roster has 80+ characters, roster is designed so you have more than one main. Hero intentionally favors that. As he counters the dominant style of play, and gets beat out by a lot of low tiers.

If hero is so good and unbeatable and god tier, why aren't you just playing Hero and winning tournaments you slack jawed homos?

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For anyone here who consistently shits all over Heroes whenever you play them, what characters/tactics do you tend to use? Strangely, Falco is my go-to Hero-stomper. I pelt their asses with my blaster whenever they put up their menu, and if they ever get in close, that's my cue to grab or up-tilt into Falco's bread and butter stuff. I also have pretty good reflexes with Falco's reflector, so I can send their Sizzles and Whacks right back at them practically all the time.

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Just be smart and watch the opponent, also, he has some really bad matchups against characters like Venom, Dizzy, and Ram who don’t let him do anything. Zoners in particular can shut him down. Much like Hero.

Faust, idk, I never played XX competitively, but he’s a very difficult character to master, and his RNG can screw you over hard if you don’t know how to deal with it. You also have to learn 5x as many match ups as any other character.

Faust however is very good all around though. He’s in the top 6 in Rev 2, and has always been consistently good. And not cause of his RNG, but the reach of all his attacks, and his general unpredictability, RNG is just to spice up the gameplay even more.

RNG characters are usually good for fighting games cause they spice up the gameplay a lot, and a nice fun element to it, and are typically very matchup dependent. In the case of Hero, he gets beat bad by low tiers like Zelda, like hard hard counters to him. Which is great for a healthy meta.

Does Faust have a near instant nuke sized explosion that also does 90%?
Does Faust have 2 instant kill moves that force you to block?
Does Faust have a move that punishes you for Blocking and leaves you open for any strong attack?
Does Faust have an inherent mechanic of dealing x8 damage on his strong attacks?
Can Faust just increase his stats to be the best for a short period of time?
Can Faust just ignore his bad options by having a pool of options to choose from when using a move?
Can Faust just become invincible randomly with full movement?
>Can Faust use what ever the equal of Zoom is for tradition fighters is?
Can Faust put their opponent to sleep with a huge ass projectile that also is the only way to put air opponents to sleep?
Can Faust choose the best option he has in a pool of RNG?

Hero can do all of the above.
This is why saying “But Peach can pull bombs”, “G&W can hit 9s”, and “Other games have RNG characters” doesn’t work.
Not only can Hero just choose the best move for the scenario (most of the time, its one of the best options among all characters) because of his menu, but he also, at worst, will just have to shuffle around his RNG, which just takes a few frames.
Also Hero’s non-RNG based moves are still pretty good and would be a definite mid tier without the RNG, despite people’s claims of his moves being slow (even though they are on par in Frame Data with other moves)

Why does all that matter if he doesn't get results in high level play. He's good at pubstomping but that's about it.

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>Does Faust have a near instant nuke sized explosion that also does 90%?
Yes. He can summon meteors and also has the 10,000 ton weight which is even worse.
>Does Faust have 2 instant kill moves that force you to block?
All characters in GG have IKs. And Faust is one of the few that can set up into it through lucky RNG.
>Does Faust have a move that punishes you for Blocking and leaves you open for any strong attack?
Absolutely. His large meteor covers the whole screen, hiding his attacks and leaving you open for mixups. Have fun blocking his nonsense when you can’t see.
>Does Faust have an inherent mechanic of dealing x8 damage on
>Can Faust just increase his stats to be the best for a short period of time?
No, but Zappa can.
>Can Faust just ignore his bad options by having a pool of options to choose from when using a move?
What are you talking about exactly here? Hero can’t do this either. He has no answer for characters like Zelda.
>Can Faust just become invincible randomly with full movement?
He can do much much worse than that. He can set up a guaranteed combo in an HP based game.
>Can Faust put their opponent to sleep with a huge ass projectile that also is the only way to put air opponents to sleep?
Yes he can. And he can poison you too. In an HP based game.
>Can Faust choose the best option he has in a pool of RNG?
He can do worse than that. He can throw it all at you at once. If he gets unlucky, you get tons of free chocolate. If he gets lucky however, he can decide the match.

Hero is child’s play compared to Faust. Unlike Faust, Hero has awful normals. Faust insanity doesn’t even end with his RNG. He’s unpredictable even without it, and can easily play to win without ever using it. Hero on the other hand is only good with RNG. Faust’s RNG just makes him even more crazy.

>Tournament Results
>Mattering
Tournament results are a meme at this point.
Tons of low tiers get high results and tons of top tiers barely got any.
Tours also have player skill and what characters people enjoy playing with.

And plus, its much more likely for Hero to just turn a match over with his RNG than the other characters.

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>hold on lemme open and close my spell list 30 times to get the one i want
fag

JUST ADAPT BRO

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>he can’t read kana
What a fucking pleb. Literally takes a week to learn.

and how often does Hero turn a game around with his RNG?
His RNG if anything, it hurts him a lot. Aside from Magic Burst, his other rolls are not particularly great aside rom the ones that power him up or heal. Everything else is extremely situational or relies on the right circumstances to even be remotely effective.

Again, he's far from a ban worthy character and his RNG barely matters when Hero is constantly getting pummelled to death by rushdowns.

>Hero is constantly getting pummelled to death by rushdowns.
And Zoners. He’s a scrub killer at best. Which says a lot about Leffen, who started this whole brigade in the first place.

Can we at least agree that random crits on smash attacks are dumb as hell. I love dragon quest and welcomed the dumb down-b cause it's a really fun mechanic, but there's nothing even remotely skill-based about randomly doing 30% more and possibly getting a kill you wouldn't have off an rng.

Dumb?
Sure

Ban worthy?
Fuck no.

Hero solely deserves to be banned based on the language barrier. RNG is fine, it's cheesy but you can work around it and he's pretty meh without his menu moves.

Also please don't listen to Leffen for opinions on anything he's just an argumentative asshole.

I contest the language barrier aspect. If you want to compete internationally, that’s just something you gotta deal with if it bugs you so much. It’s only like 16 words. You can learn it in a day. Fire up anki, make flashcards for all of Hero’s attacks in the country you’re gonna compete. Run through them like 10 mins every day or whatever.

A smart player just disregards it and plays extra carefully when he’s in Menu, unless you know you got a clean hit.

OH NOOOOO
I CANT MEMORIZE MORE THAN 4 SPECIAL MOVES PER CHARACTER

The moves all have unique MP costs. If you're a tournament player, memorizing the numbers isn't too big a task.