Unironically better than Super Metroid

>Linear handholding:the game

What? This game is only behind Super Metroid in terms of non-linearity. Are you sure you aren't mistaken Zero Mission with Fusion?

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What are you guys talking about? I never played metroid before but considering how much i loved metroid style castlevanias, i ga them a go and finished all of them except for first one. Now is as backtracking, they are linear as fuck with couple rocket/life boosts here and there that you need to backtrack

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It is.

>worse sequence breaking (related to above)
The sequence breaking in ZM is far better than SM; the entirety of SM's sequence breaking hinges on doing an insane walljump sequence up the Red Tower for early power bombs. ZM actually had its layout designed around sequence breaking and actually encouraged it.

>first half
kino, 10/10
>stealth half
fucking awful

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>ZM actually had its layout designed around sequence breaking and actually encouraged it.
Which is exactly why it's worse in ZM, you can barely call it sequence breaking if it's completely intentional.

Holy shit, someone actually created the videogame equivalent of "Tolkion is actually very boring after so many years of fantasy genre development". Based retards.

>the entirety of SM's sequence breaking hinges on doing an insane walljump sequence up the Red Tower for early power bombs

what? you can still just do KPDR instead of that route and do lots of sequence breaking other than that one ice beam skip.

1. Super
2. Fusion
3. Samus Returns
4. Zero Mission
5. Return of Samus
6. Metroid

>Which is exactly why it's worse in ZM, you can barely call it sequence breaking if it's completely intentional.
That's retarded. The developers allowing you to collect the major upgrades/beat the bosses "out of order" is sequence breaking. The fact that ZM encourages it compared to SM, where it's clearly not designed around sequence breaking, makes it a better game.

Again, literally the only way to sequence break in SM without glitches is by doing insane walljumps up the Red Tower, which 99% of players are never going to do on their first playthrough. With ZM there's a good chance a new player could completely deviate from the intended boss order and major item order because it's designed better.

>Again, literally the only way to sequence break in SM without glitches is by doing insane walljumps up the Red Tower
The fact that you think this tells me that you have no clue what you're talking about

Go ahead and list the other non-glitched major sequence breaks in SM. I'll wait.

>the determining factor of a game's quality is based entirely around sequence breaking

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>Samus Returns over Zero Mission
How ?
This game is cool, but it's still clearly the weakest 2D Metroid game so far, except of course for Metroid and Metroid II, because they didn't aged well.

Zero Mission = Super > Fusion > Samus Returns > Metroid > Metroid II

>literally the only way to sequence break in SM without glitches is by doing insane walljumps up the Red Tower
early supers in green brinstar to skip spore spawn
kraid before high jump
booster before grapple beam with a wall jump
moat spark, oceanfly or CWJ to skip grapple beam entirely and do phantoon early
zeb skip to skip like 10 extra missile packs you'd need normally

I mean if you think SM is still the better game that's fine, but saying it has better sequence breaking than ZM is basically outright false.

>>too short
According to what metrics? Speedrunning-wise the records for Any% and 100% are barely a few minutes apart between ZM and Super. The latter has one more boss (10 vs 11), and Zero Mission has one more area (7 vs 6).

>speedrunning records as a metric for game length
I guess Pokemon Yellow is the shortest version because it can be beaten in a couple of minutes.

speedrun time is an awful metric for game length.

I am merely offering what measurements I can think of off the top of my head, if you got a better way to compare the games go ahead.

>early supers in green brinstar to skip spore spawn
Requires Mach Ball which is a glitch.
>kraid before high jump
Skips a incredibly brief visit to Norfair, doesn't change the major item or boss order.
>booster before grapple beam with a wall jump
What are you talking about? Grapple isn't intended to get up to the Speed Booster room at all. youtu.be/qhsSr7ytw-k?t=391
>moat spark, oceanfly or CWJ to skip grapple beam entirely and do phantoon early
True but this is the exact same sequence break that Red Tower leads to and is on the same level of difficulty. i.e. it's inconceivable anyone on their first playthrough would encounter it.
>zeb skip to skip like 10 extra missile packs you'd need normall
Are you retarded? This is a glitch where you literally clip through a fucking wall.

>I guess Pokemon Yellow is the shortest version
That sounds about right. I can't really think of a Pokemon game shorter than Gen 1.

I forgot to mention that even if speedrunning isn't generally a good measurement, both games are pretty evenly matched across the three main categories (Any%, Low% and 100%) which is a pattern that I think is significant and bears consideration when comparing their lengths.

For reference:
speedrun.com/supermetroid#Any
speedrun.com/mzm#Any_Normal

speedrun.com/supermetroid#Low
speedrun.com/mzm#9_Normal

speedrun.com/supermetroid#100
speedrun.com/mzm#100_Normal

>blocks ur path

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Unironically a good game but a pretty poor example of a Metroid game

I liked the part where the dismembered spider was doing somersaults

Shit, you're actually right. I was thinking about your earlier post here where you hadn't yet moved the goalposts to require that the sequence breaks couldn't
1. include glitches
2. be undiscoverable for a brand new player on their first playthrough
3. be a major skip that changes the boss order

howlongtobeat.com/game.php?id=5950
~5 hours

I enjoy the movement and combat more but Super had more interesting ideas. I'd rather replay ZM though

Agreed.

>1. include glitches
>3. be a major skip that changes the boss order
These are completely fair, it's not retarded goalpost moving. How the fuck can you praise the level design for sequence breaking if 90% of them involve completely unintended glitches that the developers had no foresight of? Or inconsequential sequence breaks that skip items you'd be getting 5 minutes later anyway?

>2. be undiscoverable for a brand new player on their first playthrough
This isn't a inherently bad thing and adds to the replayability of SM. My point is since ZM is designed around sequence breaks to the point that a new player could conceivably play the game "out of order" on their first playthrough. This isn't the case in SM due to the difficulty of the skips. Hence ZM is better designed than SM in this aspect.

It's not though, I even like Metroid 1987 more.

Super > Metroid > Metroid II > Fusion > Samus Returns > Zero Mission

Based taste. I'd put II and Fusion above the first game though.

I like the original Metroid's open-endedness, I wasn't that fond of Metroid II's and Fusion's linearness.