Thoughts?

Thoughts?

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soulless chart

none, sorry

before someone throws an autistic tantrum, soul is the level of originality and ambition you can tell that a passion project has. Usually iterative sequels that polish all rough edges to the point of being generic along the lines of other contemporary design trenda greatly lack soul.
There are games that aren't objectively great that are full of soul, like Fragile Dreams, and games that are pretty good but don't have much soul, like The Last of Us

it looks like you thought up random numbers

Soulless post

Soulless website.

>breath of the wild
>8.5
ahahahhahahahhahahahaha
>soul
>7
you dont know what soul is, mister AI

These aren't all the 3-D Zelda games since Ocarina of Time, right? Can't be. There must be more than that.

OoT better than MM? Nigga please

TP has a dungeon where you make soup for a yeti, it bleeds soul.

>Nigga please

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OoT is at least 9/10 soul, but closer to a 10

tp was more soul than game. other than that, pretty damn accurate not bad

OFC TLOU don't have souls. Which zombies does have one?

god TP was so fucking BORING

>Twilight Princess
>2 Soul
You never played TP.

I feel like the only argument for OoT not having soul is that it's very similar in structure to A Link to the Past. Other than that I think it's a pretty soulful game

None of the Zelda games are really particularly good. Once you've played one (hopefully one of the better ones) you safely never need to play another in its genre ever again. All you need is a 3D Zelda and a 2D one, from there you graduate from Zelda and start playing better games.

retarded thread please dont make any more

no, that's all of them.

All 3d Zeldas lack soul.

Zelda "fans" are so fucking retarded, half this thread should be sterilized

>477141434
>damn bro this guy froze his shit and put it back in his ass
>damn that's original and SOUL

>OoT
>soul 6
Incorrect. OoT is soul 8.

>MM
>soul 9
Correct.

>WW
>soul 10
Also correct.

>TP
>soul 2
Absolutely correct. TP's objective quality should be around 7 though.

>SS
>soul 8
Literally how? SS is soul 4 at best.

>BotW
>soul 7
Soul 8 sounds more accurate but I can see why you'd give it a 7.

can i punch you in the face? how soulful would that be?

>can i punch you in the face?
No.
>how soulful would that be?
You'd have to have a soul for it to be soulful. Which is absolutely impossible for someone who thinks OOT has more soul than MM.

Fixed.

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Fixed this one too.

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literal retard

>OOT 8.5/7
>MM 9/8.5
>WW 9.5/10
>TP 7/3.5
>SS 8/7
>BOTW 8.5/10

BOTW gets a 10 in soul if going by by any other definition it would probably be 8.
Sure it was empty at times, but it had a lot of Zelda personality AND i'd say it was the most ambitious Zelda game out there. If they learn from their mistakes BOTW2 will definitely be the best Zelda game, even more so if it mirrors OOT to MM and gets a darker and creepier atmosphere.

>wind waker
5 Quality, 0 soul. Generic Hello Kitty mascot bobbleheads are anti-soul.

Well it's a good thing that's not what Wind Waker is.
Wind Waker is the epitome of soul. When you look up soul in a dictionary, WW should be the pic accompanied.

>botw ost is terrible
>youtube.com/watch?v=hsE5HIUCsLM
what you smoking faggot?

The instruments don't mesh well with one another at all, let alone the melody and harmony they're trying to create and it's true in the video you posted too.
This is an actually good example of how to make an effective song with multiple instruments.
youtube.com/watch?v=e4VBFkhpQv8

Real objectivity would mean scoring based on things that directly affect gameplay. Ocarina of time, while good for its time, suffers from control issues, I can't count the times I stood on a ledge and fell off because I tried looking in another direction.
So, based on your image, it would be something like this:
>OoT 7 9
>MM 7 10
>WW 9 7
>TP 9 6
>SS 6 7
>BotW 9 8

TP had no soul, it tried to appeal to Western audiences so much that it was hollow.

>SS
>Soul
>Specifically made to pander to timelinefags and Ootfags
No.

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>I can't count the times I stood on a ledge and fell off because I tried looking in another direction.
How?

why do you want to compartmentalize everything
whatever happened to just enjoying something

Wind waker is to "artstyle" what the inception trailer was to movies.

In small raised ledges and you had to jump to the right into another little pillar, you would have to very lightly turn or used first person view to turn, since a normal flick to the left would send Link jumping off.

put TP to 6 and BotW to 3

I really don't know what you're talking about. Give an example.

BotW is the best Zelda game.
Don't @ me

Man wasn't OoT one of the most soulless game I've played. It's literally Korean MMO tier.

>it tried to appeal to Western audiences so much that it was hollow.
So does every other Zelda my nigga.

>best exploration in the series
>not a tired retelling of the same story
>art syle with charm and personality
>utilize touch screen to write memos or even draw maps in certain area giving you the feeling of explorong new places
Heh nothing personal everyone.

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old game good

new game bad

fucking idiot

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it's not only the worst 3D zelda besides skward sword, it's the emptiest world i've ever played ina video game. so much gameplay is just running and climbing. it ceasees to be fun and becomes a fucking choer just travelling this gargantuan overworld with nothing in it. you'd think they'd have learned their lesson from wind waker.
and before some chucklefuck mentions the shrines or korok seeds, no they don't count. they're copypasted bullshit filler fuck you

'soul' is a retarded concept.

TP goes even farther changing the tone to make it more dark and edgy and more casual and streamlined

dosent help its a basic bitch zelda game with a boring wolf transformation

your fucking retard if you think its fucking acceptable to have a world map the same size as TP in fucking 2019. The formula was getting stale with TP and it really showed with SS

how are shrines copy and paste each shrine has a different challenge not to mention survival challenges. BOTW has more content then any zelda before it

Not that user but the shrines and Divine Beasts all share the same aesthetics without much variety. Sometimes I offer to help people with certain shrines since I've done them all twice, and I can't really recall the puzzles in most of them because they sort of blend together for me

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Nice selfie.

>8.8
Heh.

Low key shit on Botw thread huh? Nice bait faggot.

I know it's bait, but OoT, MM, and WW are all 10/10 soul. BotW is a 7-10, SS is an 8-10, and TP is like a 3-5.
As for actual quality, none of them are a 10. MM and WW are probably the closest ones to 10, but MM is held back by repetitive, sometimes grindy gameplay as well as bugs and its awful dungeons and WW is held back by that damned tree quest and the triumph forks, as well as sailing times in general. OoT and BotW both have tons of love poured into the tiny details and interactions both games allow, with BotW's physics shining in this regard and OoT being a case of the developers just thinking every little thing through and planning for the player to try whacky shit. BotW however is held back by its lack of connection to the world it builds (you can interact with everything in it, but there's little in the way of NPCs, sidequests, subplots to advance, or variation in encounters), while OoT is held back by tons of little things like its gui, pause menu (FUCK the iron boots), Gaebora Kaepora, the Water Temple (the temple itself is not bad, and is in fact still better than any majora's mask dungeon save for Stone Tower, but again - FUCK the PAUSE MENU and FUCK the IRON BOOTS), its silky-smooth 14 fps, and so on. I'm done writing a blog, so forget TP and I've never played SS

>puzzles in most of them because they sort of blend together for me
how can you honestly tell me they are any worse then any other zelda game

>how can you honestly tell me they are any worse then any other zelda game
They're not. Quite the contrary, the puzzles are pretty good in most of the shrines and I love that most of them have multiple solutions, it's just that most of the puzzles didn't really stick in my memory because all I remember is the aesthetics of each one being the exact same Sheikah technology shit

Skyward Sword is one of the most soulless games. They tried to have an art style but it's all over the place, there's nothing about it that is cohesive. It deserves maybe a 2.

>8.8

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>MM has the couple's and gibdo masks sidequests
>WW has the grandma sidequest
>TP has you carrying Midna
>OOT and SS have?

The Dodongo Cavern comes to mind. When you would get the Bombs and had to jump from pillar to pillar. I fell from there by accident a couple of things when trying to turn.

TP is a soulless piece of trash

SS had the childhood friend dynamic between Link and Zelda I guess, and if that doesn't count, then I guess there's Groose's arc or the part where Zelda finds out the old lady that was staying in the sealed temple was Impa.
Can't think of any for OOT either though

every zelda game is shit and you only like them because you played them as a kid. OoT is one of the most soulless and boring games ever made

>the part where Zelda finds out the old lady that was staying in the sealed temple was Impa.
That counts, the rest is bad.

there is no such thing as 'objective quality'

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You mean the part with the eye switch and the fire ring? How could you fall when that was a straight shot?

>how are shrines copy and paste each shrine has a different challenge not to mention survival challenges
Unique ones are few and far between, most are fetch quests, easy as fuck "riddles", or reused assets.

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you literally didn't play the game, did you sweaty

b8 chart

Games are crafted, and as such, there are objective measures of quality. It's why SOUL is such a shitty meme, it's literally "my fee fees" when translated. I'm really disappointed that it got spammed here often enough for so many of you retards to latch on to it as if it was anything other than shitposting.

Yea Forums only views BotW at a surface level. The world is empty because shrines are all the same. Shrines are all the same because they all look the same. No number of examples of unique and fun experiences is going to change Yea Forums's mind on this game. It's already been memed to death.

(You). Try harder or this is the only one you'll get.

holy shit this is the worst hyrule field ever
probably the worst Zelda song I've heard
disgraceful

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Why do people say TP has no soul? It has soul in the most obtuse places.

>the seasons change in the fishing hole
>minigames like chicking gliding, kayaking down a river, and motherfucking Rollgoal are things
>can play fetch with a dog
>can pick up cats
>can terrorize townspeople as a wolf
>arrows will bounce off the Hylian Shield even if you aren't holding it
>dungeon gimmicks that include building monkey ropes, defying gravity through magnetism, making soup for a yeti's sick wife, and being Spiderman in the sky
>setpiece moments like the western showdown in the hidden village, snowboarding against a yeti and fighting a group in a massive field on horseback
>that fucking sheathing animation
>can run and swing your sword at the same time
>characters like Malo, Telma and Agitha exist

Seriously, did people just not play TP or something?

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Quantify soul

Oh, and I forgot that you can become a fucking cucco in TP.

>level of originality and ambition you can tell that a passion project has
OoT was more ambitious than MM by a large margin, but MM was much more original in ways the devs ultimately didn't want but worked well. I'm not sure how you could possibly think WW beats OoT or MM in their respective categories desu. It's a shitty definition even by the standards of the chart. Dropped the series with TP so I can't speak to anything after that.

>OoT has less soul than fucking skyward sword
Okay bro, time to stop posting.

ratio of development decisions made from passion instead of a paycheck + amount of effort put into making those decisions a reality

I'm surprised by how many people say TP has soul
>entire game is a semi-obvious remake of Ocarina
>shit art style is a direct 360 on the previous game and an obvious response to fan complaints
>fake deep "dark" cutscenes and edginess
>muh Ganon again for no fucking reason
>trash wolf mechanics

>hasn't even seen a clip of BOTW at all
It only plays when you're riding your horse, for your information.

It fits the game because the game is a lonely and mostly destroyed world but everyone alive is still upbeat and happy. If you don't think listening to that piano on your horse while riding through ruins isn't kino, you're crazy.

Each and every day I can feel this board making me more and more cynical so I'll say this as nicely as possible. If you want to shill your opinions, at least be honest about it.

The visual aesthetic kills it by going for realism with low quality textures. It'd probably look good if they tried again now though instead of obsessing over MUH CEL SHADING.

>soul means I happen to like it

fpbp

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souuullll ssssssssoul
soouuuul
ssss
s-souul
seouuul

Passion
Heart

>the last of us is a good game

kill yourself or go back to netflix

It's opinionated by definition, but you're genuinely retarded if you can't take 2 seconds to google the definition and use context clues from there.

True, but at the same time the world design in general was top class. That amphitheater overlooking the majestic Lake Hylia right outside Castle Town, that Snow Manor dungeon, the vacated ruins on the other side of Castle Town all of Zora's Domain, Old West Kakariko, that fucking Desert.
TP had it's problems, but world design was not one of them.

Wrong, OoT had a lot of soul, and it's not a fucking 10.

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i like Minish Cap

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>Fragile Dreams
Please don't make me think about that game, I'm still traumatized by the story.

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This retard obviously never played any.

>SS has more soul than TP
U wot?

>sonic
>soul

This.

To appreciate soulful games, you first need a soul of your own, nigger.

>cartoony lazy bulshit is charm and personality
Fuck off.

TP doesn't even have a realistic art style. Look at pretty much all of their character designs outside of the Triforce crew. As for the overworld, it only looked low-res because it was a Gamecube game that was released in 2006. It looks fine for its native hardware.

>best exploration in the series
>others are the same story

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Objective quality:
BotW > TP > WW > OoT > MM > SS
Soul:
WW > MM > BotW > TP > Oot > SS

Yea Forums's autistic dedication to contrarianism aside, BotW clearly accomplishes its goal as a game (giving the player freedom to explore an expansive world) better than any other Zelda accomplishes its own goals today. It's objectively the best.
Wind Waker wins best soul though. Its elegantly simple artstyle looks as good now as it did when it released, and the expressive characters have just as much charm.
Skyward Sword is still the worst in both regards.

This is all true, but TP's soul lies in its awesome soundtrack and unique, memorable dungeons. I guess you could say that's only like half the game, but still, it's not like it's just a carbon copy of OoT.

WW is an even more blatant remake of OoT and only gets away with it because of pretty visuals, some water and a boat. Somehow, that one has soul for days while TP doesn't. I even like WW's story as a standalone, it's one of the best in the series, but it doesn't get called out where it deserves to get called out enough. Hell, it didn't even utilize the sea proper for much of interest, treasure charts and big octos were probably the best things going for it. Otherwise, that shit was basically OoT on water.

As for TP, as far as faux dark shit goes it has the cutscene after Lakebed Temple and...pretty much nothing else that "doesn't fit" in a Zelda game. And Ganon's in because it's a direct answer to what happens after he gets imprisoned (lol) after Link is sent back to his time at the very end of OoT, which is to say the sages fucked up in imprisoning him. TP establishes this halfway through the game. The wolf is indeed mediocre as a top billing new mechanic, that much I'll give you. Wouldn't call it trash so much as underwhelming, it has its place and time like any other item, it just doesn't feel particularly special for it.

Not him but if you played one you played all of them

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Most Zeldas do follow the ALttP formula for the most part but I would say Zelda 1, Zelda II, Skyward Sword, Breath of the Wild, and to a lesser extent even Link Between Worlds break that mold.

TP was a reactionary game because everyone bitched about WW's art style and overall tone. They played it as safe as they could making it OoT 2. There's no soul in TP and its gameplay is mediocre with the only thing they did right was the sword arts and even that didn't reach its potential because none of the enemies were designed around it.

It does without a doubt. Not 100% without inspiration of course, but it's clear that's what they were striving for.
>As for the overworld, it only looked low-res because it was a Gamecube game that was released in 2006. It looks fine for its native hardware.
Nah, it hit the uncanny valley too fucking hard in too many areas.

>OOT soul 6
>WW soul 10

Shit chart

Can you recommend the better games? I love Zelda but my favorite types aren't made anymore, LA and the Oracle games had the best overworld and dungeon designs

The 3D Zeldas before BotW may all keep the core gameplay the same, but they have very different approaches to visuals, world design, and story presentation. They're no more similar than games in any other series.

>BotW clearly accomplishes its goal as a game (giving the player freedom to explore an expansive world) better than any other Zelda accomplishes its own goals today.
Fuck no, I'll give you that it gets a lot closer to accomplishng its goals than a lot of them but that's it. The exploration gets dull as fuck once it sets in that everything you'll find is the exact same bullshit. By the time you're 10-15 hours in, you've seen it all.
If anything, MM is the closest to accomplishing its goals since they were to build a good world with strong characters and theming.

I dunno man, I look at TP's character design and it's so inconsistent that I'm hard presses to say it religiously strove for any one direction on that front alone, and Zelda is inherently too fantastical of a series to be seriously steeped in realism anyways. I always saw it as sufficiently stylized, yet still updating the look of OoT/MM to a newer generation of consoles.

You'd probably like A Link to the Past and Minish Cap but no, they don't really make 'em like that anymore. Maybe A Link Between Worlds if you're really starved.

I liked Minish Cap but mainly, I liked the overworld and the dungeon with the mole mitts. aLBW was really fun, the overworld felt amazing because accessing parts of it felt like a good puzzle especially since the game never tells you where to go, just feels like exploring. aLttP I haven't played in forever but I always thought dungeons above average with a boring overworld. Also I was hoping for non Zelda considering I've played almost all of them already

if you don't want to lick prince ralis' butthole clean, then you are the most useless of faggots

>By the time you're 10-15 hours in, you've been through the volcano region, the desert, the Lost Woods, the rainy Lanayru area, the thunderstorm-prone jungle, and the icy mountains, experienced every combat encounter, seen every puzzle the shrines and divine beasts have to offer, met all the races of Hyrule, solved every Kass song, found every memory, and finished every sidequest you were interested in
Fuck no. You'd have to be doing some kind of 100% speedrun to have "seen it all" by that time.

Agreed 90%
Oot should be 10, 7 and TP 8, 5

>soul is the level of originality and ambition you can tell that a passion project has
So why is OoT a 6 and not a 10 in SOUL? It's the first 3D Zelda game, you can't tell me it has less ambition then it's sequel and Windwaker. It certainly wasn't following much from Non-nintendo 3D games before it's time, at least not any more than all that came after, so it should score perfectly on originality as well.

>you've been through the volcano region, the desert, the Lost Woods, the rainy Lanayru area, the thunderstorm-prone jungle, and the icy mountains
It's just visual differences and some one note gimmicks.
>experienced every combat encounter
You've experienced most by then.
>seen every puzzle the shrines and divine beasts have to offer
You have a general idea of how they work since they're based on the same or similar ideas because of runes/design choices.
>met all the races of Hyrule
Shallow as fuck, the different characters of BotW were all one dimensional save for Zelda.
>solved every Kass song
Most, if not all of them are easily decipherable instructions and nothing more, especially when the geography around it is obtuse as fuck.
>found every memory
All the memories do is flesh out Zelda a bit, and her character still comes across as a weak, whiny bitch all the way through until the plot decides to make her a Mary Sue.
>and finished every sidequest you were interested in
There aren't many sidequests worth being interested in when most are similar fetch quests.

Oh, my bad. I'm not that user but one I liked recently was Brandish the Dark Revenant. That series in general is like a weird mix of dungeon crawler and action RPG that's a bit infamous for its janky camera manipulation in its 2D heyday, but Dark Revenant is a 3D remake for PSP that (somehow) got localized in 2015 so the camera work is FAR less jarring. I'd recommend it if you like Zelda dungeons. It's perhaps easier to see how it works in video form. Gameplay proper starts around the 5:30 mark.

youtube.com/watch?v=KsaE-nF7Np0

I also think Xanadu Next is pretty neat, and that one's closer to a whole package Zelda deal in action RPG form. Less emphasis on tight puzzle design and more basic dungeon crawling, plus getting a handle on the controls can be a bit odd at first, but like Brandish might fit the bill for people looking for more of a challenge out of a Zelda-like.

youtube.com/watch?v=i9o3_XafTW0

When people say "better Zelda" though, they typically mean a more challenging one. The thing with Zelda is that they are generally designed with children in mind, but in terms of polish and presentation are absolutely the top of the class for the action adventure genre. Many of the games that try to push the envelope a bit more end up not feeling as "AAA" as a Zelda game generally does, but if you're in it for the gameplay then it all might still be worth a look. I've heard good things about Alundra as well but I haven't played it myself so I can't comment.

OoT/MM were way more fantastical in art style while TP is much more grounded. That said, I can still see where you're coming from at least.

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Excuse me? Oot and MM should both have 10/10 soul.

>Objectivity in art
Why is this meme so popular on this board?

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Idiots enjoy stroking their own egos acting like their opinions are 100% fact.

you can't quantify Soul, that's what makes it Soul. also its Soul which is objective and quality thats the subjective score

This is Yea Forums user you cannot say anything negative about ocarina of Time, no matter how generic and soulless it was.
You're just not allowed to do it.
Breath of the wild deserves at least a 9 for soul user at least for first playthrough.

BotW should be quality 9 and soul 4 at best.

>no soundtrack
>no plot whatsoever
>dub
>open world meme
>no dungeons
>no hookshot or items that make you progress

It's not even a zelda game.

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Gameplay mechanics and dungeon/world design are more science than art.

Not that user but I'd say it's a mix. I do think there is some semblance of artistic craft to mechanical harmony and gameplay flow. Case in point, Resident Evil 6. Excellent mechanics, but absolute shit tier harmony and flow so it controls very well by a quantifiable standard but the game design is so incoherent, so lacking in a more artistic sense of tact and taste, that it sucks despite that.

I think I would hate you in real life

well hes right
it may be vastly overrated and flawed in many areas but its still ‘good’

You're retarded

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>SS having the third highest story rank and over LA
Trash

>Zelda 2
>exploration: 2
>combat: 4
>creativity: 3
>TP
>exploration: 8
>WW
>combat: 9
>story: 7
My point just keeps getting proven, how you rate AoL is a pretty good indicator of how good your taste is.

The first time I heard this music was when I was riding a Stalhorse, and I thought it was kino that they'd put such a fitting piece of music for riding the spooky skeleton horse.

Then I rode an actual horse, heard it, and had so many questions about what this music was intending to make me feel.

If your first interaction with a song is that it sounds like it fits well to riding an undead horror, when you intended it to be more generic, you have a problem.

>Skyward Sword
>Creativity: 10
I guess motion-controlled sword combat counts as creative, but then there's the entire rest of the game...

How the fuck is Adventure of Link's combat so low
How the fuck does wind waker have anything other than an 8+ for story
How the fuck is Wind Waker's combat better than TP's
REEEE

Also, creativity seems like "soul"
Remove that category entirely, as it has no effect on how the game is played and enjoyed

>WW combat
>literal QTE counter-to-win
>9

Yikes

That's what the chart says and why I'm saying it's shit taste.

Soleless Shoe

>Link's Awakening
>Puzzles 10
Why, yes, throwing pots at doors when said pots give you bombs, or needing to break a random crackless wall with bombs surely is peak puzzle design.
And linear as shit game after the extremely open ALttP surely is worth a 7 in exploration.

>A Link between Worlds gets a 2 in creativity for being a copypaste over an existing zelda game
>BoTW and Adventure of Link get a 2 in creativity for being absolutely unlike any other zelda to exist before, and definately since in the case of AoL
>Oracle of Seasons has higher creativity than Oracle of Ages, despite Oracle of Seasons being the faceroll combat challange game

Something tells me "Creativity" is bullshit and really means "my bias", since there's zero internal logic to it.

OoT had the most boring hyrule field to me, followed by TP and BotW.
Hyrule field in general is a boring as fuck place.

How the hell does a soothing yet slightly depressing piano instill horror in you? Good one if you're baiting though. It's supposed to make you feel like you're riding through a world that got destroyed 100 years ago, full of ruins and the buried corpses of millions, but that there's still hope for a future because you can save the princess.

No it's shit kill yourself retard

>OoT 6 at soul
>SS 8
6/10 Made me reply

What does this shit EVEN MEAN?