Why are they all bad fighters?

>everyone wants K Rool and Ridley
>they dont even play them
so this is the power of the bandwagon...

This. I wanted all three and I play all three regularly. Fuck metafags, fuck tierlists, and fuck OP.

well said. I've wanted K Rool ever since melee and I main that boy and love the sit out of him.

Banjo is a grey area though. He is nowhere near low tier and I feel like it will take a bit for his item play to evolve. At the moment he is at least high mid-tier.

I play Ridley and I was a diehard for any other Metroid rep. I was ecstatic to get two.

but I don't play online. I'm pretty casual with Smash and only really play with friends.

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Tiers are for queers

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Banjo and had a blast with K. Rool when the game came out. (Sadly Ridley didn't really click with me.) I'm just sad for what could have been.

>Ridley can literally drag people across the entire stage and is a Xenomorph tier horror
>Banjo is literally fucking perfect in every way
I honestly couldn't ask for me.

My most wanted in 4 was Palutena, so with her and these two I now have literally all I ever wanted and they're all amazing.

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What could have been? They're in the game and have cool movesets.

You're literally sad because they're not considered theoretically as viable as other characters at a competitive level that you don't even play at.

This. I have a hell of a lot more fun with these three than several higher tier characters. And I'm convinced people are going to crack Banjo and find a way to be fucking stupid good with him. Wonderwing alone has so much potential.

Bruh, every time I remember Ridley, Banjo, and Kazooie are in the game, I still crack a smile at the fact that they actually got in after almost two decades of waiting. I'm only sad that some guys who wanted these three died before ever getting to see them on the grandest stage of them all.

>Banjo
>bad
lmao what. banjo has grenades, a limited blaster, high tier recovery, and a move so good they had to limit it to 5 uses per stock that ALSO true combos with dthrow to kill at like 70%

Nice falseflag OP
Also no one here plays in big tournaments

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>implying that tier lists matter at all in elite smash
>Implying that tier lists matter at all outside of major tournaments
Unless you're a professional player tier lists don't make a damn, you can get your shit rocked by a sheik if the person's better than you are.

Exactly, it's early Banjo days yet. Everyone slept on Joker when he came out, and then everyone got up in arms about Hero when he's mediocre outside of RNG.
Then again DLC characters aren't allowed to be good, because people will never shut up about "muh $5.99 p2w"

We still won

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That is an excellent screencap thank you for posting that.

I think its too early too say how good Banjo is or not.
But holy shit he is not fun to play at all, I'm super disappointed I was really excited for him.

Couldn’t disagree more, I’ve already played him more than Joker and Hero. He’s straightforward but he’s a damn fun straightforward

I find him fun to play but awful to play against. Fucking side-B.

They're bad until you git gud, retard.

Are they not fun? Why do you even play video games?

Ridley looks like he's seething with barely restrained homicidal rage.

Ridley and Banjo are far from bad. K. Rool however, is legitimately shit.

>force sakurai to put characters you want
>sakurai tries his best to make these characters work
>not top tier but still can be enjoyed in casual matches
>URRR WHY BANJO NOT TOP TIER SAKURAI SUCK

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Fix that image. That Banjo looks retarded.

I can attest to that sadly. I'm glad Ridley is decent because he was my most wanted, but Rool was my second and it was pretty soul crushing when everyone figured out how he doesn't have a single non-committal move in his entire kit. I still play him for fun every now and then though

>he took the bait seriously
oh sweetie...

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1. Banjo is at least mid-tier
2. Mid-tier doesn't mean bad.
3. All of them are decently playable and the tier lists only matter at super high level play against shit like Pikachu/Lucina/Palutena

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Even then, there have been Little Macs and Piranha Plants as of recent who beat top tiers. The balance in this game is pretty impressive.

If fazbear is confirmed,would make another triforce.

banjo is good

his toolkit is so fun and diverse though. even if you're bad at smash you can do the auto eggs with neutral b which seems fun.

I couldn't disagree more, he has good mobility options, really diverse approach options and all of his moves serve a different purpose other than maybe dtilt and sidetilt being pretty similair fundamentally as a poke tool.

The fact they made it in at all means we win forever.
Also, stop using that shitty Smashified Banjo render. We've had pic related for almost 3 months.

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Banjo feels pretty solid to me so far. Definitely some bad moves but decent overall and certainly fun.
Ridley is pretty awful but also fun to play against bad people.
K Rool is retarded

Banjo is exactly where I wanted him tierwise. I don’t want shitters ruining the character cause he gives them free wins. Just look at kid Goku. Banjo is fine.

I hate utilt so much. It has like 2px front hitbox.

Banjo and Hero are how DLC should be done, not how Joker was. Joker is still digusting to this day, too. Someone must really like Gaysona 5 on the team.

Terry is going to be absolutely fucking busted. Just you wait.

use it as antiair, the hitbox is way above him

Yeah, Sakurai himself. He said it. And that’s why I’m saying Get ready for your new Bayo tier.

List to me the positives of Banjo's playstyle without the use of "fun" because he feels like a mixed bag of shit

>Fair is alright, disappointing that it's not a spike
>Suicidal Dair, lame and can be easily punished if the first hit is shielded by a short hop dair
>Bair is fast multi hit, mixed on this because its good but can also be whiffed easily if attempting to use while fast falling
>Extremely Short and Heavy Jump Height, i think Little Mac is even better
>Fast as fuck, I'll give Kazooie that
>Neutral B is absolute shit
>Down B has Snake Recovery Tier Potential
>Side B is good

I'm not feeling it, and the only people i see that are feeling him are the people that the basedjaks make fun of

>Joker is still disgusting to this day
>Literally 1 actually good Joker player

banjo is a zoner faggot who does well by spamming shit and avoiding confrontation. I absolutely hate that playstyle so I don't use him.

that doesn't change the fact that he is literally the best character in the game.

Only K Rool is mediocre the other two are perfectly fine.

Both Salem and JTails think the character is really good. M2K thinks he’s mid high.

Armada thinks he’s weak, but isn’t sure (Armada likes the Rushdown style the most).

And Leffen is being a contrarian for attention as usual. Don’t be like Leffen, he’s a faggot.

tweek also thinks he's good

Do you really want people whining and begging for your favorite characters to be nerfed?

>Just look at kid Goku
You mean the character with ZERO tournament results since release? At least use Joker for your example.

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I wonder what ESAM and Hbox think? I haven’t checked out their breakdowns yet.

Nip players think gestures good too btw.

kid goku literally won evo you dumb faggot. he is the best character in fighterz.

What the fuck are you talking about? Kid Goku was in 5/8 teams at EVO, and on the winning team, and since then as only gotten more saturated. Pretty much every team runs Kid Goku and Bardock and people are calling for a character ban due to how OP he is due to his post Spirit Bomb settup.

BK and Ridley are definitely at least mid-tier. Shame about K. Rool though.

Yeah, it's kinda bullshit how the balancing team seems to have neglected all three of them in lieu of anime swordsmen. The meta looks more and more like Smash 4's with every patch and that's a damn shame.

Still play as Ridley though. Feels so good stomping on scrubs with him.

>Both K.Rool and Banjo is fun to play.
Cry more tier-whore.

Sword characters have always been strong in Smash. Fast Disjoints are just inherently good in fighting games.

>Literally
Nigga, PLEASE
Peach, Megaman, Lucina, Pokemon Master, ZS Samus and Snake have defeated hard Leo's Joker.
Yeah, Joker had a ton of good mechanics, but the deal is that abusing these open a lot of paths to counter his ass, you just gotta adapt like Leo usually does (and why he always came back from heavy loses)

Banjo needs a buff on his downthrow to make it viable for combos and his Neutral B needs more power in my opinion. Kill a couple frames here and there on some of his landing lag and I think he makes for a really viable option. People will come out of the wood work too like Zaki with Dedede and that Duck Hunt mainer from Japan haha

So many people were rooting for him tho - he's a win in my books.

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Also he should have a hit box with Kazooie's beak as he shoots upward with Up Special but I digress not much to be had for that now.

I hate how swordies have those. I'd be fine if they had good frame data but it fucking pisses me off that they can outrange me as Ridley. It just feels so wrong.

And never mind even them, Fox and ZSS are top/high tier AGAIN when we had enough of them in the Smash 4 days and even before then, in Melee and Brawl/PM.

Banjo is probably the least shit.
Banjo > Ridley > Solo Ice Climber > K. Rool

Smash 4 Fox and ZSS are totally different from Ultimate Fox ZSS.
>Smash 4 Fox was just dragdown fair footstool
>Smash 4 ZSS was dthrow uair uair uair up B

>Ultimate Fox is the true pure rushdown character
>Ultimate ZSS is an evasive glass cannon

The only crime in Ultimate meta is that Marth, Lucina, Roy Chrom and Ike are all high tier and are equally braindead, meaning low to mid level tournies are filled to the brim with FE swordies.

It’s like this for a lot of Low/Mid characters though. Just a few tweaks from being really good.

Look at Zelda for example. Add more leniency to Edge Cancelling so it’s useful again. Make DTilt combo into stuff again. Make Down Throw setups true combo at certain damage. Make increase her grab range and speed just a bit. And boom, she’s high tier. Improve hitboxes and dragdown hitboxes on Dair and Nair.

I mean that's basically his character so sounds about right.

But that’s the case for any fighting game. Characters with good disjoints have always been really strong.

pikachu, snake, and palutena are better

Uh, you know people were talking about banning Kid Goku because there's literally no reason not to have him on your team right? DBFZ Meta right now is Kid Goku, Bardock and one open slot, using anything else means you're dumb.

I don't care. I'm sick of the same characters being high/top tier in every game. I want more variety, god fucking dammit.

I suppose that's true.

Ridley is fine. He's mid-tier at best, but I still like him. Tierwhore faggot.

no, they're not. you could argue peach is better than him, but thats it.

Ridley ftilt and dtilt outrange every swordie except maybe Ike. Aeriala are a different story though

I mean, they shouldn’t ban him, that’s stupid. But he defo needs a nerf to his Spirit Bomb. Irony is, this wouldn’t have happened if he had been just regular Kid Goku instead of GT Goku. It’s the SB that breaks him.

I wish they'd do this instead of barely buffing characters or even nerfing some of the mid/low tiers some more. Or barely nerfing high/top tiers or even giving them a slight buff.

I also think the top tiers also all deserve hard nerfs as well. Fuck Snake, Wolf, Link, Y. Link, Joker, Hero, etc.

Swordies practically play themselves. Press a direction, press a button, the sword swings in that direction. They don't have to line up back kicks or anything. Accidentally did a fair instead of a bair? For much of the roster, this could lead to a major punish. For swordies? No big deal, you still swung a giant ass hitbox in that direction that knocks them back.

The smash team is absolute balls at balancing.

I've seen people suggesting a temp ban until he gets nerfs, DBFZ doesn't exactly get monthly balance patches and people don't want to deal with a stagnant meta for the next several months, I forget how long it is till the next patch.

Ridley ftilt feels like it gets beaten out by plenty of swordie moves, including Marth/Lucina ftilt and Joker ftilt.

You're right though, his aerials don't have as much range as you'd think. I'm glad they nerfed Mii Swordfighter's fair so that it no longer outranges Ridley's fair. That ways always bullshit.

>Joker is broken; Sakurai loves Persona 5
>Hero is amazing at start but the RNG brings him down, and is ultimately mid/high tier; Sakurai just respects DQ but otherwise has no special feelings towards it
>Banjo is average at best; Sakurai barely knows anything about the games and only put it in because of the fanbase

>Terry is literally only in the game because Sakurai has a massive boner for him from his youth in arcades, since Terry is neither a huge draw with the fanbase or a particularly iconic character
He's gonna be broken as shit due to favoritism, isn't he?

I'm genuinely surprised (and happy) that Ridley got the buffs that he did. I was afraid that they'd nerf him some more. I love that all of his kill moves feel like they kill around when they should now, though I think he could still get some more buffs.

Hero is definitely not Top tier. Hell, he’s not even high tier. He needs a nerf to some of his Down B Spells, but it’s actually good he’s an RNG hard counter to a lot of the rushdown cast. Some Low tiers like Zelda actually do really well against him. He’s actually really healthy for the meta.

Could also just be the timing, since Ridley ftilt comes out pretty slow, definitely slower than the swordie equivalents. I have been able to punish whiffed swordie ftilts with Ridley's before
Idk about joker though

god i hope his team wakes up and finally nerfs joker. they really raped Ivysaur, but left Joker alone, I don't understand.

>Terry
>not a particularly iconic character
Kill yourself, underage.

That’s stupid. Old games didn’t have balance patches and people just adapted. It’s a 3v3 fighting game, meaning there’s less incentive to ban, ad he’s nowhere near as busted as Storm or Sentinel in MvC2.

>Ridley
>Wisdom
no

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Dthrow to side B works, it's like Inkling all over again

I mean, when you put him up against the likes of Bano and Rool...

>since Terry is neither a huge draw with the fanbase or a particularly iconic character

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Yep, and I can’t wait. Guarantee he gets Max Mode. It’s basically PM Turbo Mode, but on a timer. Meaning Terry has like 2-3 seconds to go apeshit with a combo, multiple times per match.

>favoritism argument
>Kirby exists

>play a rushdown character
>get outranged hard by swordies unless I spam my one (1) disjointed move
>study swordie frame data, go to the Marcina Discord for MU experience, watch high level Lucina play to understand how the character works
>only very recently got a grasp on how to deal with the MU and can do well against swordies now after a lot of work
>try Roy just to see how hard it would be to get and keep Elite with him
>can faceroll my controller and do well
>Side B is frame 7 and kills people at the ledge at like 70%
>huge airspeed makes his recovery way better than you would think
>don't get punished for anything except unga fsmashes
>exact same deal with Chrom, except you can spike people at 0% for trying to edgeguard you
>and Ike
>and Marth
I'll never respect anyone who mains a swordie, the work required to effectively defeat a swordie is hugely disproportional to the amount of work it takes to use a swordie.

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I don't think Joker needs as much done as people thought. They're not going to nerf him into the ground just because one player happens to be stupidly good with him. Shrink the Tetrakarn hitbox a bit and make grappling hook a bit slower and you're good.

He needs a nerf to up air and back air more than anything.

I run a pocket Lucina for that reason alone. Don’t even have to bother learning the characters, it’s free wins. Meaning I can dedicate my time to my main, and bust out a Lucina if I just can’t win.

>If you don't consider Terry to be an absolute icon on the level of Mario or Sonic you are underaged
Nice defense mechanism. Let's be real here, KoF has always been SF's less popular cousin. Even in SNK Mai is probably more well-known than Terry. But since she has tits she can't be in modern Smash.

Kirby was busted in 64. And Meta Knight in Brawl.

Arsene up air, maybe. I think bair is fine.

>K. Rool
>Bad
Ridley and banjo are fun as fuck too

>wanted Pac-Man
>fun as fuck character, became my secondary instantly
>wanted King K. Rool
>fun as fuck character, but never clicked with me that much, still play with him in casual games / Elite on occassion
>wanted Banjo
>fun as fuck character, easily one of my new mains
Who /got who they wanted and fine them fun/ here

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Wasn't there crybabies already wanting to ban Banjo? What a crazy world

Mai is more popular than Terry, but that doesn’t mean Terry isn’t iconic.

There have been multiple instances at locals where I beat someone game 1 and they switch to either Ike or Lucina game 2, always specifically Ike or Lucina. It's ridiculous how we're this deep in the meta and yet no one seems to have an issue with this.

>Mai is more popular than Terry
Never even heard of this slut.

Mixing up neutral b neutral and down b to edge guard is nice because you have multiple options.

any other banjo fans disappointed with his moveset? so many of his moves just involve him thrusting kazooie out. why couldn't tehy have incorporated the other eggs into the firing neutral b? or at least give it better range, as it stands now, it sucks. and his down tilt and up air are so useless (former is slow, latter has no knockback or damage). i just feel like everyone plays him the same way, which is th eboring, grendade egg down throw jab neutral air way.

Why do people care about what either Armada or Leffen thinks? Neither really have anything to show as far as results in Ultimate, even if they're great in Melee.

I dunno. While I'm happy they gave him some attention, I'd say Ridley buffs were a bit of a mixed bag overall
>Up special's startup got 3 frames shaved off and the move travels faster and farther; undoubtedly a great buff, but since the farther distance aspect of it was unintended I'm sure it will be reverted next patch, and it's still so easy to intercept that you're pretty much always going to have to recover low to use it, and if your opponent has a counter you're pretty much dead at 0%
>side special kills around 20% earlier, again undoubtedly a solid buff...but the startup is still very reactable, and if you whiff the move's endlag is horrific, will always leave you open for a hard punish
>uair sweetspot has more priority, this is probably his best buff of all
>bair...does more damage? When it was already strong enough before
>dair no longer does the weird gravity thing. Not really a buff, just a glitch fix they applied to all characters

It feels like the dev team is too afraid to buff a character's weaknesses, so they instead buff elements that were already solid before. Most of these buffs only serve to improve Ridley's already good advantage state, and don't really do much of anything to alleviate his atrocious disadvantage.

I'm hoping the next patch brings a couple framedata buffs, at the very least. They've made it pretty clear that they don't intend to buff his weight, which I also don't have too much of a problem with. What I do have a problem with is how shitty Ridley's airdrift/speed is, if it were better then he wouldn't have nearly as much trouble against projectiles as he does now.

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She's more known than he is unless you're a homo, which seems to make up a large portion of Terryfags.

Nice dollar store retarded Banjo.

>Ridley is shit
You're shit. Get dab'd on.

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>U WHUN DURAGUN? U WHUN CRUC? U WHUN BUD AN BARE?
>I SPIT ON U PIGGU AMERICANS

What's with Hero's "Ishkabibble!" shit
Like, who the fuck named those spells? His moveset reads like something from Banjo-Kazooie. You'd think those would be spells Grunty knows.

>That smile
fucking precious

I think this user thought you guys were making a joke on Hero looking like a DBZ character
I could be wrong

I have literally not stopped playing K Rool or Ridley since the release.

He should have said Gohan.

I'm only frustrated insofar that Ridley is easy gimpfood.

Banjo was my #2 never ever and I’ve used him exclusively since he was released. The feeling of nostalgia along with him just being a fun character is perfect for me. He plays like he’s been in since day one. Like he belongs.

I hope you're wrong about up-B, but otherwise, I disagree, for the most part. Side-B's start up is still way too slow and and whiffing is basically telling the opponent to punish you, but at least it fucking kills at around 115%-120% instead of struggling at 140%.

And bair is beastly. I can kill characters at 90% now, provided they're near the ledge and it feels fucking amazing. If they're around 120% or so, even from center stage and I land it, it's basically a a guaranteed kill.

I do agree about the bit about the devs afraid to buff a character's weakness. I'd be fine if they made him heavier to compensate for him having the largest hitbox in the game, because against certain characters like Ness, Pichu, Snake, or Joker, it's like I may as well have lost the match already before it began, because I'm not doing shit against them when they can be all over me and I have nothing really I can do about it.

And yes, give me frame data buffs. Maybe make drag down fair into f-smash a thing or jab lock fsmash too.

>I JUST ATE THE CAT'S POOP!!! HOW DOES THAT MAKE U FEEL, DUMB DONNIE?!

I actually disagree with that. Just mix up your recovery and you should be fine. Take advantage of the fact that he has 3 jumps and side-B doesn't put him in free fall. Recover high if you have to. Remember that Ridley's up-B has such a huge hitbox that it may as well have priority over anything trying to challenge it.

I've used it to spike a Ness during PK Thunder 2 for chrissake.

>Blue Banjo Red Kazooie alt
>Took me 2 days to realize they were based off the series logo colors
Besides Grunty, I don’t know what the other alts are based off. I know people think pink is Mumbo.

Why does it matter what tourneyfags think? Anyone can beat anyone with any character if they’re good enough.

Yeah a character like Ness feels like the person playing him can just press buttons and win against a character like Ridley
And drag down fair into fsmash sounds a little too nutty, I dunno if I want the character I play to have dumb stuff like that
Really Ridley needs better oos options too. I think his best one is nair? A move that starts on frame 11, jab is frame 4 but you have to go out of your way to drop shield in order to do it which adds a shit ton more frames
Also needs a better way to escape being juggled, you can only use your jumps to mix up your landing so many times, it feels like. Against very good players who know how to apply pressure effectively, a lot of the time it feels like Ridley can't do anything other than retreat to ledge or something

My brother.

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Reminder that tournament results =/= viability

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Banjo could be decent. Krool and Ridley are hot garbage.

I don't remember the colors at all but I'd bet some are based on Tooie's multiplayer alt colors

>Smash zoomer hasn't played Dragon Quest

I REALLY want to pick up a swordie just so I can learn more about how they work and about the MU because this shit right here convinces me that I'm certainly not alone in thinking they're absolute bullshit to deal with.

>Idk about joker though
Nah, Joker's f-tilt and range in general is bonkers and it's ridiculous considering the damage, knockback, and framedata he has as well. It's like they designed the entire character around only having the weakness of his recovery with Arsene being kinda-sorta punishable (if you've got the right character at that).

>Yeah a character like Ness feels like the person playing him can just press buttons and win against a character like Ridley
It's ridiculous how he can put me in hitstun while applying damage for so fucking long with PK Fire, then take a stock with f-Smash or something. Like Christ.
>And drag down fair into fsmash sounds a little too nutty, I dunno if I want the character I play to have dumb stuff like that
Yeah, that sounds pretty stupid, sure.
>Really Ridley needs better oos options too. I think his best one is nair? A move that starts on frame 11, jab is frame 4 but you have to go out of your way to drop shield in order to do it which adds a shit ton more frames
Yeah, against swordies, it feels like I have to rely on my opponents not being very good because it feels like i get away with Nair OoS way too often. He really doesn't have a good reversal and he probably should.
>Also needs a better way to escape being juggled, you can only use your jumps to mix up your landing so many times, it feels like. Against very good players who know how to apply pressure effectively, a lot of the time it feels like Ridley can't do anything other than retreat to ledge or something
Damn, you just made me realize that this is what I do to escape juggles most of the time.

put sans in there

i repeat, if freddy is confirmed ,we will make another triforce.

>WAAAAA MY CHARACTER ISNT COMPETETIVELY VIABLE IN A CHILDRENS PARTY GAME WAAAAA

who's the third in the zoomer triforce? steve? fortnite default skin?

black one is either captian blubber or bottles

I thought you were talking about Freddy Krueger, now I'm really worried of the possibility of THAT getting in

old games also didn't have the developers adding whatever the fuck they wanted on a whim with patches.

I'd honestly be okay with Terry being OP because at least judging from Ryu or Ken, he wouldn't be brain dead to play and would require actual skill, more so than the vast majority of the cast at least. And plus he'd be unique to play, with command inputs like Ryu and Ken, along with probably Max Mode too.

Ryu was top tier in 4 but he was too much for Smashies at the time so nobody used him. I feel like the same will happen to Terry

>Ryu was top tier in 4 but he was too much for Smashies at the time so nobody used him.
?

Ryu was actually fairly popular from what I remember. What actually happened was that he was actually pretty good at the start of Ultimate, but there was no point in using him when you could just use literally any top tier and have an easier time beating opponents while playing a better character at the same time. The buffs helped him out a LOT but you still don't see him as much as Ken because the latter is considered the flat out better character. Sadly, since even though I haven't used Ryu much since Ultimate, I prefer his playstyle and hate how Ken has actual 50/50's.

Didn't help that the mechanics changes in Ultimate kinda hurt his playstyle over all (jablocking and footstool jumping no longer holding the opponent in place), and they made him harder to play.

Steve, Sans, and Freddy.

Getting better with Ridley by the day. Almost got to Grand finals at a weekly with him a while ago

i wreck people as Ridley and King K in elite smash, stop being a tier queer

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i'd rather have them in and """bad""" than have them not in

How the fuck do you miss the absolute most obvious one with the Polar Bear.

Monkey's Paw

You think you do...but you don't

i dont give a single shit about banjo as a character but hes honestly really fun to play
>meaty as fuck fair that feels almost exactly like ganons
>fast pokes in ftilt and dtilt
>deadly tech chase potential with side b
>great recovery
>great edgetraps
>snake grenade tier 10/10 down b that you can stall with AND have an infinite recovery if needed

That’s likely exactly right.

Boggy? Then what’s Kazooie supposed to be?

a penguin

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Honestly, he has a pretty good chance.
I want my horror rep dammit

>I want my horror rep dammit
RE rep in second Fighter's Pass

If it looks scary in a bright environment it PROBABLY won't be in, Freddy's whole thing is that he's entertainment for children during the day, it's at night when he becomes scary.

Ridley is pretty good and fun

Banjo is okay but there are other characters that can do his job more efficiently

Ridley used to be really bad (and he's still low-tier) but actually making his side-B worth watching out for was a good idea. He'll kill basically anything with it if they go past 70%, which he can do to you easily.

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K. Rool made a robot out of his wife's pots and pans and while Ridley is very cunning he represents raw power really well.
But caring about which triangle of the triforce represents what is too autistic even for me.

The alt were banjo has a more red fur and a yellow backpack and blue shorts could be a reference to conker

Banjo and ridley are fine though, but k.rool i can understand the complaints.

Not having any weaknesses > strong but with major weaknesses

Banjo is a much more well rounded than hero, who is just a pubstomper.

This.

Only extreme tier differences effect casual and intermediate level play. Like, I think literally anyone picking little mac versus Palutena or some shit is in for a rough ride, but besides those very, very far apart cases, there's literally no difference.

What matters is uniqueness, and fun, and all three deliver on that. All three of them have incredibly unique playstyles, and all three of those playstyles are fun.

Banjo is a low-mid tier with one top tier toy. Where he ends up is ultimately going to come down to how much optimization Wonderwing sees

Why do people pretend there's some huge skill gap between "pro" play and elite smash or lobbies?

Hero is more fun to play with than Banjo to me.

Just waitin' on Terry, here. BAAAAN KNACKU is gonna be fun in a Smash setting.

if i ever actually get a switch and ultimate, dark samus is easily going to be my main

>Hated banjofags as a kid
>Continued to hate banjofags as an adult
>Keep calling Banjo a gay badger
>Keep telling my friend who's a banjofag that banjo is just Duck Hunt Dog with a backpack and was a pointless inclusion
>Banjo releases
>He's actually really fun to play

FUUUUUUUUCK Terry better be more fun so I don't have to main this gay fucking furry badger fuck.

>First local since Banjo came out
>Everyone is shitting on Banjo, says he's bad
>Banjo player ends up winning the whole thing
Nah, Banjo is solid mid. People are overreacting, because they're used to DLC being Pay2Win bullshit like Joker, Cloud, and Bayonetta, or full of stupid annoying shit like Corrin, Ryu, and Hero. Banjo is perfectly fine as is, and other than having Forward B lose to Shine, doesn't need any changes.

I fucking miss the hell out of Ryu's footstool combos. Ryu was one of those characters whose footstool jablock combos were so reliable you'd actually see them come out in high level matches rather than just be mere twitter/pubstomp combos. I main Ken now but I'm really hoping to love Terry because Ultimate Ken is a far cry from Sm4sh Ryu and it's a real shame to not have a main that feels as "right" to me as Ryu did in the last game.

or he imagined a different moveset for ridley, and his current playstyle doesn't feel right for him

>tfw game and watch main

End my suffering

>K Rool
casual king
>Ridley
my main, i've easily beaten my friends with him more times than i can count
>Banjo
dragdowns and confirms out the ass, he's viable

user there's already an official poll done by SNK themselves, Nakoruru even beat Mai.

I know that feel. Megaman and Little Mac were my most wanted characters since 64 and I hate using both of them. All of my best characters are from games I've never even played, aside from Shulk.

Rosalina was one of my most wanted for Smash 4 but I ended up hating the way she plays.

I'm so glad I ended up loving Ridley's moveset. I just wish his dair wasn't so shit and that he had the classic pogo tail.

All I want for Ridley is for his fucking Up-b to work like the spacies and for him to not have a useless down-b or have it be the tail pogo in midair, that's all

As it stands he's pretty fucking great but it feels like they just made him janky for the sake of it

lmao tier lists don't matter unless you're like a top 20 player. you can do well with those 3 if you play smart enough..

and as said.
if that's what matter to you then you're not enjoying the fucking game

Shit you can do well with all three if you're dedicated, it just takes a bit more work since you aren't playing on easy mode and have to get hard reads/punishes more often

This was Trela back when Ultimate was still fresh as fuck, Ridley is a viable character even figured out, you just need to know how to play around his abysmal disadvantage state

youtube.com/watch?v=-oPkQfLPAm8

You don't think there's a significant difference between people who play the game at a professional level for money and people sitting in an online lobby making a semi-random matchmaking number rise based off how often they can make their winning streaks slightly eclipse their losing streaks?

FOOTDIVE

>I can only like characters the stinkies tell me are good for tourneys!
Christ, think for yourself for once.

Ridley is fun as fuck. Banjo is very faithful to his games, same as Rool. They're honest no gimmick characters. No comeback mechanics, no rng, just characters. Even if they're not top tierthey're still fun and can do fine. Ridley has the most trouble due to easily being juggled but his most recent buffs from before helped. A few more things or some kind of help when being juggled and he'll be perfect. If you're some falseflagging antifag or angry Stevie. If you are then get bent.

Speaking of my main what are Ridleys options when being juggled? And why do I get punished for landing or blocking attacks? Like I feel regardless of what I do at times it's wrong.

>this place sucks
>fat albert over there won't stop using my scale smoother cream
>the mammal has fleas
>his bird never shuts the fuck up
>I wanna be back on Zebes eating Samus' parents

i like zoners, i havent played much banjo but personally i prefer the belmonts, ROB and Mii Gunner for zoning

banjo's eggs dont feel that good

Attached: simon and richter.png (1703x1277, 2.05M)

>why won't Sakurai make characters solely on what the 1% elitist stinky crows demands?!
Christ you people make me ashamed to be a human.

this is why you become a furry instead

Of course you haven't poopsie, you don't need to pretend to be an ignorant contrarian to keep your points up here.

I'm not that desperate.

Well, jack off to the porn at least. Some good stuff there. Just ignore literally everything else about the fandom.

The Japanese ones make some fucking incredible porn, I won't lie

Up tilt could use a bit more range too.

There actually is.
It's the difference of knowing which moves lead to what at what percent.
The fundamentals aren't much different between elite smash and competitive, it's knowledge of frame data and follow ups, both yours and your opponents, that changes, and that's where tier differences matter.
Characters with either limited, or non-completely oppressive options suffer, because they are easier to predict, and rely on more specific things.
This is why top tier characters are almost always faster characters. It's because they are less reliant on any one combo or string than a character that has one starter, and only two different ways to play off of it.

I'm pretty sure that one is actually based on the Split Up pads

Attached: Split-up_Pads.png (550x284, 193K)

Isn't that basically what Terry is? It says a lot that there was far more excitement for a mii fighter costume than for him.

This. I'm so goddamn tired of seeing it.

Attached: that fucking render.png (466x242, 6K)

I'd be more than fine with Freddy, he really doesn't have anything in the games that could work as his moves, but I'd actually buy a Mii Fighter if they made one in Smash 6 or something.

>no one complains about Cloud anymore
Feels weird fading into obscurity after being called tierwhore (understandably) for forever in 4.

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>children and Smash players who only know of characters through Smash go more apeshit over Undertale than Fatal Fury
Stop the presses. You know damn well it doesn't matter who Fighter 4 was, they'd have been overshadowed by Sans.

What should I be doing as a K. Rool main to minimize my losses? My win rate is 50% and I can't tell if that's because I suck or he sucks. I've seen the video with the hyperfixation on having him cancel out of his crown toss animation, and that didn't help.

The secret to doing well with K. Rool is to pick Bowser, just like to do well with Sheik you pick Joker.

Bowser was my old main and I didn't wait 11 years for K. Rool to just go back. I'd rather never win another match.

Going from K. Rool's recovery to Bowser's guarantees you'll never win again.

Posters like this are such a joke. Of course tiers matter. You think playing a character like Ike, Lucina or Joker vs. a character like Luigi or Icies isn't going to make a huge difference at every possible level of play? You don't think these characters are so highly regarded because, maybe, their toolsets are supremely powerful with even a basic grasp of them?

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I honestly think banjo is high tier and I actually do go to tournaments irl and have been for years. That being said I admittedly haven't seen another person as optimistic about him being a great character as me but, there's no fucking way he is below mid-mid tier.

Also, ridleyfags shouldn't complain anymore after that nice batch of buffs he got, he's a perfectly playable character now and having a kill confirm off of his up tilt around 80% is really deadly. Also I'm sick of people memeing about Ridley's weight, 107 is still pretty heavy.

Cloud's still very good actually, he's just no longer broken like he was in 4.

Not him but I think K. Rool's recovery is just about the only thing he's got over Bowser. Like holy shit.

I should pick up both actually, especially Bowser. They seem fun.

>70
Do you exclusively play on warioware?

Not him and while he's definitely wrong, the buffs really did help him a lot and it feels good knowing that the enemy is around kill-percent range when they're at 90% instead of like 120% before the buffs. And if you're playing against lightweights, it's nice knowing they can die as early as 40% if you hit them with the right move.

It's genuinely kind of strange that Banjo comes out and is a honest ass smash bros character with no major gimmicks like any DLC before him, and because of that he's auto assigned low-tier by casuals.

Like if he had a meter for some big attack and nothing else changed would people flip on him and say he was broken? Hero is perfectly average but casuals cry because he has more than 4 moves.

He's a balanced character in a game where the best characters have single-digit frame aerials that do tons of damage and reach as far as a telephone pole. No shit he's going to be low-tier. Sakurai is not good at game design and hasn't been for his entire career. Smash niggers are the most repugnant ass-kissing drones in human history.

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If I gave a shit about tiers I wouldnt be chuckling when someone dies to bowsers one two jab combo

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>and having a kill confirm off of his up tilt around 80% is really deadly
I'm pretty sure he always had that kill confirm, it's just much better now that he kills earlier and they gave up-air the buffs that they did. I need to use that move and that combo more.

>Also I'm sick of people memeing about Ridley's weight, 107 is still pretty heavy.
The problem is that he's lighter than just about every other heavyweight while also having the biggest hurtbox in the game, so he's basically combo food and has a really tough time against any zoner or any character with actual combos. I suspect we don't see Ridley as often as we did around the launch period among the higher-level players is because it really feels like, even though he's not bad by any means, all the top-tiers and a lot of the high-tiers are pretty much hard counters for him.

One thing people are looking at is how shit his specials are for most of the part. The neutral is fairly useless and feels underpowered even compared to others, the down takes more effort to use than it should and the side, while powerful, has a limit on it for no apparent reason. Compare to others who get equally powerful moves that don't have such limitations

you sound upset, maybe try not getting mad at video games?

>and the side, while powerful, has a limit on it for no apparent reason
user it's literal fucking full, on demand invincibility outside of grabs. Even with it being grabable I can't recall any other time a character has gotten full invincibility (not super armor mind you, INVINCIBILTY) to non-grab attacks in a fighting game on a REGULAR MOVE

>Here's a list of potent, good buffs that actually matter and actually help my character
>Now let me explain why I feel each one of them arbitrarily doesn't count

Come on man, I know Ridley could still get some more buffs without breaking the game but, he is certainly fine and viable now.

But it is grabable, and very easily too. And that ease makes it difficult to use against anyone with a degree of competence.

The Egg is still a very useful neutral tool and comes out about as fast as Mario's Fireball.
Down Special is a bit finnicky, but it enable his infinite recovery ala Snake and is a vital combo and ledge-trap tool
Wonderwing is fucking absurd. The reason Sakurai showed Samus grabbing him out of it is because most characters will eat shit for even having the thought of doing so. It's pretty much a guaranteed kill if hit fresh at 120% on most characters, and it covers nearly every ledge option, INCLUDING hang. It being limited to 5 per stock is perfectly fine

>he is certainly fine and viable now

No, he isnt. He will forever be low-tier because he has no killing power, is the biggest hurtbox in the game and isn't heavy enough to justify it.

it's only easy if you have a tether grab or a command grab, and even then that's only if they are using it randomly from half the stage like a moron
going for a grab with a regular one is risky as fuck on a move that kills you at 100% mid stage

I know her from mugen porn stuff. I have her get raped all the time in it.

>no killing power
dumb ass
>biggest hurtbox in the game and isn't heavy enough to justify it.
His weight isn't a problem. Not that it wouldn't be nice to have more, but the big hitbox means he's going to be eating combos, and weight would just make the difference between 10 ad 120, which is very small with his garbage disadvantage taken into account. What he needs is much more air speed and better OOS for escape options

>Down Special is a bit finnicky, but it enable his infinite recovery ala Snake and is a vital combo and ledge-trap tool
It also functions as a great mixup tool ala Inkling's Splat Bomb and can be used to make certain things safe, like you're ledge get up option, etc.

>because he has no killing power,
You're not wrong about his hurtbox or his weight but Ridley is actually a beast who has plenty of killing power (although honestly, I wouldn't mind if they went full Ganon and gave his attacks even more power if they kept his weight so low, maybe making him into a proper heavyweight glass cannon). I don't think you realize how much earlier bair, sweetspotted up-air, up-Smash, and side-b kill now. Not to mention shit like f-Smash always deleted opponents.

*Couldn't make it in the first 5
There's going to be more.

Shut up Melvin

I also forgot to mention it could be B-reversed in my first post, so its even an amazing recovery option since it explodes on contact.
Grenade Egg is probably one of the most underrated tools in his kit

>No kill power

Lol dude if you play the game casually why do you even post in these threads?

Yeah, Ridley has legitimate and fair weaknesses to balance out his strengths, the way a good character should feel. I'll give you that Ridley is a particularly polarizing character though, his disadvantage state is absolutely terrible but his advantage state is also very brutal.

ZackRay has been an absolute beast with it and has been showing a lot of the applications and uses it has. It's a pretty ridiculous move actually, almost like an even better Snake grenade.

already pokemon

All the people bitching about Ridleys side B need to understand what it's like to be hit by that move as a character with bad recovery. If you're Roy, Cloud, Incineroar etc Ridley just needs to side b you and then fair you once and you're dead. It's the only move in the game that can just gaurentee you an instant off stage edgeguarding situation by itself from anywhere on stage. It's just one more way Ridley is made to be very polarizing with fantastic strengths and legit weaknesses.

If Ridley's Side-B had super armor on start up, or had better frame data, it'd probably be the best command grab in the entire game. It probably is already, or is at least up there. Fuck, I love that move so much.

Listen you certified dick-smoking & anal plug wearing dancing queen, if a character gets 2-stocked in under a minute at tournament level play in the hands of an expert, he's fucking bad. He is low-tier. He is not worth playing, and he probably never will be because of severe fundamental flaws, chief among them being his massive hitbox. Now would you kindly stop being a textbook example of why stupid people weren't give the right to voice their opinion in olden days and were just summarily killed?

Dude, Samsora got 3-0 3-stocked each game in a set at Smash & Splash by MkLeo and each match was less than 3 minutes at most, does that mean Peach is a bad character?
I assume you're talking about Plup vs. Fatality at SmashCon, in which I'd like to say that Pulp doesn't really take the game that seriously, and Falcon is probably the worst matchup for nearly every big-body character in the game
Get the dilation station out of your not-pussy tranny, I was just expressing an opinion

You know with the amount of people in this scene playing hundreds of tournaments all over the world for years on end every character has gotten two or three stocked in under a minute in a tournament by someone right?

>does that mean Peach is a bad character?
Yes.

Same on the online. Only played the 200 quickplay matches to finish off the online challenge page and haven't touched it since.

>does that mean Peach is a bad character?

Peach is nowhere close to top tier anymore

>Not him but I think K. Rool's recovery is just about the only thing he's got over Bowser. Like holy shit.
>I should pick up both actually, especially Bowser. They seem fun.
They actually do complement eachother very well. Their basic fundamentals kinda translate well to using the other, and K.Rool's zoning patches up a few really bad matchups Bowser has.

But, really, it's much harder to play K.Rool after Bowser than Bowser after K.Rool.
K.Rool to Bowser feels like you just took a fucking training vest off.
Like, jesus, people do not realize how fast Bowser is. He can cover ground so goddamn fast, the Dair momentum fix means you can be back on the stage almost instantly after getting popped up, and you can punish essentially anything with Up B. And just *nope*ing through wifi Hero's Magic Burst is the most satisfying thing in the world.

It honestly IS the best command grab in the game. Excluding Kirby for some specific matchups when that copy ability is a gamechanger.
Ironically applies to Kirby/Ridley.
Look at Dedede's or Wario's. It's basically indistinguishable from a normal hit, besides the usual shield bypassing properties.
Incineroar's is basically the same, but with more options, and it kills.
Look at Gannondorfs. It puts you into essentially a tech chase for free.

Then look at fucking Ridley.
Tech chase? You stupid, optimistic bastard.
You just gained control over the entire stage. You probably did just as much damage as Incineroar's, and it probably kills at around the same, regardless of where you hit it.
But that's not all.
Throw this tech chase shit out, you are not only immediately edge-guarding, but edgeguarding at an angle Ridley is very, very good at taking advantage of.

Ganondorf cannot KO an opponent from 0 off of one Flame Choke. It can start a 0 to death, but that is reliant on repeated reads.
Ridley can KO between a third and half the roster outright off of that one move landing, at 0, if he makes that edgeguard. The remaining half still actually have a chance of losing their stock, but otherwise are still in a terrible, terrible position.
Plus Ridleycide, except you don't always die from it.

Please take this idiot's advice so I can kill more Ridleys online who actually try to use side-B

>Old games didn’t have balance patches and people just adapted.
What, like MvC2? People adapted by shunning more than 70% of the goddamn cast because the balancing was awful.

>some sperg brags how good he is at fighting games, loves Ryu and says he's a veteran
>fight him and just keep throwing him off the stage as Ridley

people underestimate these three.

Nesses tend to get overconfident in their air approaches. bait an aerial whiff than retaliate. IF you practice the matchup a lot you can probably mess up Ness's recovery too.

>He actually sees Ridley online
Fake and gay

you think you do but you don't

Nigger, I main Isabelle. They're S-tier compared to her. I still can't believe she still generates so much salt though

She generates salt by being one of the most boring fucking characters to fight in the entire game. The last time I fought an Isabel she would just camp on the ledge with the lloyd rocket to cover her and spam fairs and shit.

I lost the first match because I was playing her game and approaching, but in game 2 and 3 I won by getting a stock lead and just sitting on the other side of the stage and refusing to approach. That's seriously the stupid bullshit I was forced to do when it came to "playing to win".

And that's why I main her. I camp when people are expecting me to be aggressive and play aggressive when people expect me to camp. I always get one or two ragequits on online when I play.

Fuck off with that gay shit.
Retro retro reps are the most bro reps.