Is he-- dare I say it? shit?

I like the fact that he has a basic kit, makes him fit right in with the original 64 cast. Solid mid-tier in my opinion.

Wrong, he's already being considered top tier

base banjroly

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u mad

>Side-B is insanely good, killpower and armor make it a guaranteed kill if you're not fishing like a chimp or wasting it
>Neutral-B is just generally good, not outstanding, but it synergizes well with down-B
>Down-B is probably one of the best down-Bs in the game, amazing for ledgetrapping, gives him aerial mixups for landing
>Up-B gives a level of recovery mixups that few characters have due to being able to double-jump after using it

Not him, but whenever I was winning I'm pretty sure it was my down b racking damage, and most of my kills are sadly side b

Yeah why the FUCK doesn't sakurai come to my house and play the game for me

I wish he was more straightforward. The egg grenade makes his gameplay somewhat gimmicky like snake.

i was worried he would be to gimicky like the rest of the dlc fighters. Like how natural his moveset works

Plant isn't top tier, he's still low tier, at best mid tier. I think banjo is mid tier for now but has the tools to become high tier when the meta advances.

you can just grab his side b

ITT: Retards that don't know how to use reverse down b

i love how their parry pose is the one up statue pose

Don't know but this character is underwhelming af.
Why are his ariels so laggy, why is uair so weak, so is his ftilt and most importantly : why does his movement suck so much ?
He's basically B the character and I hate it.
Hope the other banjobros are able to enjoy it.

Yeah, but why the fuck would I risk grabbing that when it could kill my early as hell, and also he shouldn't be putting me in a situation where I can grab him out of it thanks to his projectiles controlling the space around me

In a vacuum like that, every single move is bad
>you can just shield Snake up-tilt
>you can just parry Cloud back-air

Not if you're being punished by it for using literally any attack

He's pretty decent, trying to tier him now is retarded, when Joker came out everybody said he was mid tier, look at those same faggots now, they all want Joker nerfed.

Why are you responding to a faggot that never touched the game ?

His side B is a great recovery mix up, punish option and possibly even good for tech chasing
Speaking of recovery mix ups, his up b, while mediocre on its own, is very hard to pin down thanks his multiple jumps and the egg grenade to refresh it. Overall, his recovery is solid with plenty of options to return to stage.
Down B is excellent, very versatile. Ledgetrapping, edgeguarding, zone breaking, you name it, it does everything a projectile can do. No doubt Banjo's gameplay will revolve around just tossing it out all throughout the match.
Neutral B is ok. A good projectile, has some edgeguarding potential thanks to its trajectory.

The rest of his moves are just standard stuff. Nothing outstanding. Doesn't seem to have any good out of shield options. No big combos outside of grenade stuff. His neutral air could have some undiscovered potential though. Dragging, multihit nairs tend to be really good.

You’ve got good points — it’s just that every character goes through a period of being “god tier” because people don’t know how to beat them effectively. I ain’t downplaying him, I just want to take everything with a side of salt.

I don't care, HE'S IN !!!

I consider myself to be a decent player, I've won tournaments in my somewhat weak region (not Tennessee-weak tho lol)
My opinion of him has only gone up since he came out, and while I don't think he'll get that much better with optimization, he's still at least a solid mid-tier

>secretly be top tier
Nah, he's objectively low tier, Brood is just godlike.

>Ironically pretending to like smash to fit in with rostermemefaggotry
The line for suicide is above
>Ironically pretending a party game is competitive

He’s surprisingly good actually
He’ll settle in high mid tier at very worst once people figure him out

I guess I can’t make too much of an assumption regarding him —there are deadass no tournaments where I live so the only juxtaposition I get is from playing with people I know. Good luck user.

I figured the same

Only in the sense that he's not insanely broken like Hero and Joker, yes

He's pretty good, not top tier. But more importantly, he's fun.

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>Hero
>broken
He's not that great, but to compare him to Joker is insane
Joker is far-and-away the best character in the game

>It's another episode of Yea Forums trying to talk about competitive Smash when they've never topped any tournament ever

how do you guys play smash with any more than 2 people on screen
it gets all zoomed out and there's so much shit flying around and smoke obscuring the screen i can't even tell where i am half the time in the 4p tournament thats on right now

>he
There is two of them faggot.

Yeah all those Jokers filling up the top 8 spots in tourneys haha...

It just comes with playing the game more, my normie friends had the same issue at first.

>Joker is far-and-away the best character in the game
How to tell someone knows very little about competitive Smash

There's one good Joker player winning a lot of tournaments, and he was winning just as many tournaments before Joker came out.

>Yea Forums
>BANJO IS SHIT!
>also Yea Forums
>HERO IS BROKEN!
LMAO

They do. There's two dedicated tips sections. One with video and other with text you can view outside of the loading screen.

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t. Joker mains terrified of their literal who snoy character getting nerfed
Sorry "lads", I'll take the word of actual pros before some randos on Yea Forums.

He has the potential to be really good but is held back by having some technicality to him, why not just play a top tier who is braindead and do half the work just as well if not better

Joker with arsene is broken, joker by himself is just alright

>Insanely good
>Up easily gimped
>Neutral B useless outside of edge guards
>Side B is a death sentence for yourself unless used for guaranteed kill confirm
His moveset revolves around his Down B because it's one of the only reliably good things he has.

Cope

>neutral B useless outside of edge guards
it's literally mario neutral B unless you hold the button down.

Can't say how good he is but it's really fucking disappointing that his gameplay is going to revolve entirely around the grenade. I don't feel like I'm playing Banjo I feel like I have to play some bastardized version of Snake.

Banjo feels like a character that's been around since the start and fell off for being too meh, but got some move changes in Ultimate that made him actually mid-tier instead of bottom of the barrel

Literally no pros are saying Joker is the best character in the game, retard. All of them place characters like Peach, Lucina and Pokemon Trainer above him.

Joker is a phenomenal character he just has a high skill floor that only MKLeo is taking advantage of. Similar to Peach. Swordies fall on the other end where they're all also amazing but braindead. Notice Samsora is one of the only people who get Peach results but everyone still knows Peach is top tier.

this

he feels like he's been there since the beginning and is just fun to play. not every character has to be omfgbbqlvl10000godhax tier

i want to see banjo wave dashing

Lots of fun, but maybe not tournament viable.
>inb4 someone wins EVo with them

>smashbabs

If you're a tether-grab character, maybe.

>Sorry "lads", I'll take the word of actual pros before some randos on Yea Forums.
The same actual pros who lost their minds over Hero's RNG and banned him without even trying to see what kind of results he gets in actual tournaments?

Banjo's waveland is actually pretty good in Ultimate.

>use side b while you’re in the air to catch your landing and beat out literally all your landing options if you’ve burned your air dodge
What now, idiot?

>Up easily gimped
Why would you use it down low when he can act out of it? If you're getting easily gimped using it, you're not mixing up enough.
>Neutral B useless outside of edge guards
Yeah man, Mario fireball is useless
>Side B is a death sentence for yourself unless used for guaranteed kill confirm
Fucking what?
>Moveset relies on down spec
False.

is plant like one of the worst characters?

What people like you don't understand is even if Hero was shit tier the potential for OHKOs and other nonskill bullshittery is something that isn't wanted in competitive play. Hero, regardless of how good the character is, has the potential to completely wreck tournament seeds because of RNG. It would be like turning on the shitty items and saying "Yeah it's RNG but the items aren't top tier items so git gud."

>can't beat peoples day 2 Banjos
I don't understand. I just don't understand how I am so terrible at this game. It's only THIS game, everything else I'm slightly above average but smash just, something is not clinking. Why am I getting sauced by 48 hour Banjo players with characters I've been playing for FUCKING YEARS

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He's actually A LOT better than I expected him to be. Yeah, he will be comfortably in mid-tier and never move form there, but he has good projectiles, his speed is actually good, recovery is good, he has some strong as moves and he can do combos

Honestly he is less than I expected in terms of how "shit" is is or not

Kirbys inhale hard counters it

Side B has ridiculous endless and can be shielding and grabbed. You either need to hard read or hard punish to land it and any player worth their salt isn't going to be throwing out punishable moves in your face when they can see your feathers.

You've also clearly been under a rock if you don't think Banjo's moveset revolves around the grenade. But it's quite clear you don't know what you're talking about when you can't rebut any points with anything else than empty FUCKING WHATS and FALSE

>Brood being godlike with a character that people have no matchup experience with means Plant is top tier
You got it all wrong my dude

Honestly pretty kino because he annoys all my friends when I play him

JOKER is definitely not elite. I keep bumping into jokerfags online and i keep stomping that ass. So yeah No.

Yeah you wont be using side B on neutral

The grenade explodes too early to be as versatile as Snake's or Diddy's banana, it's a gimmick that is useful, but is too limited for it to be the center of Banjo's gameplan.

Oh yes, those RNG mvoes that can be shielded, blocked, reflected, countered, absorbed, and otherwise easily played around and against are just so gamebreaking and evil.

I've watched players like ZeRo and their thoughts and observations are a lot different from your spergings.

Let's be honest on this one.

Pretty much every character in the game is viable.

Except for mac, in a game where plataforming and recovery is essential, being punished for being off the ground is just too much.

Joker without arsene is still much better than sheik.

He'd be a solid mid tier xharacter without the persona

he's balanced
but when the other DLCs are high-tier Joker and might kill you in one hit-tier Hero he looks bad
he is a well designed and fun character that isn't OP or dogshit
with the way Ultimate is I'm sure people will do well with him

Because you haven't learn the matchup. My dude.

Is like fighting a wiifit trainer or DHD they kick your ass because you dont know how to punish anything or what their options are. Even airspeed and jump height factor in.

Just short hop nair, Banjo dn shit.

If you dirty fucks don't go shower right the fuck now.

>tries to time grab
>gets hit
fuck online.

You can catch thrown Pokeballs and shield Bob-ombs too. Doesn't mean they're gonna start being used in competitive play. It only takes one instant Magic Burst to completely blow up a match. It might have been forgiven if it was one move or if things were less common. G&W and Peach both have RNG elements. But the former requires a hard commit that has a higher chance of backfiring and the latter has ridiculously low chances. Hero regularly gets multiple crits per match and WILL get Magic Burst, Kamikaze, Kathwack, etc. every match. That's just too much RNG and too many bs chances to kill at 0 to low percentages. I get not wanting to ban characters because it sucks but it's blatantly easy to see WHY they did it. Hero introduces a random element that people don't like in a way of playing that tries to eliminate any kind of randomness.

Oh Zero? The guy who has been consistently wrong about tiers since the game released and has gotten zero results? That's hardly credible. Why don't you go watch Zackray who's already placing in Japanese tourneys and relying HEAVILY on grenade

Smash online is a different game from smash offline. With everyone using a third world wifi connection there is ALWAYS input lag no matter what, it's just a matter of how severe. Fuck smash online.

I don't like how this fucker has this charge attack that eats every fucking thing and catches me mid attack.

Everytime I think he wouldn't dare use that move, he fucking uses it and I get sent flying. Then when I think he might use it, I get grabbed instead. Can we go back to Hero posting please?

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that fair kinda irks me a bit, it looks like Mario's but behaves like Ganon's ran into so many people trying to spike with it online....the poor fools

I dunno if I like it better by not spiking, what's your take fellas?

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You ain't in the lab

I think Banjo desperately needs a spike. He's extremely limited in kill options and needs something to reliably go for like that. And it would pair really nicely with his Back Throw. Frankly I'm just tired of shit like Dair. If Sakurai isn't a complete retard he knows how bad and useless those movies are yet he's constantly reusing them.

Little Mac apologists are the worst

>Turns out to secretly be top tier
You mean after the latest patch gave him significant buffs? Also plant definitely has not yet gotten consistent enough results to be declared top tier.

banjo has that mario feel to him desu, with some nice projectiles and enough speed to get in there and get it done but he lacks some of the "utility" mario has like a spike, reflect, and the water pushing people
i feel doc might need some buffs to keep up, but they're afraid of buffing doc because that means they'll buff mario too due to the ass backwards way doc is implemented
it's really nice to have a straight-forward fighter in the pass who doesn't rely on some kind of meter or gimmick though

Plant is literally bottom tier. Joker was considered mediocre but turned out top tier.

Ahem. I beat everyone with K rool and Ganondorf, HOW IN THE FUCK ARE THEY NOT TOP TIER?!

>Is like fighting a wiifit trainer
Fuck that fucking soccer ball, it has to be one of the games best projectiles. It's ridiculous the things good Wii Fits can do with it.

When did everyone start hating stall-then-fall Dairs? I thought most of them were really useful because of properties like spiking and pulling opponents with them.

True to the character he always was.

smash is shit and banjo is a toddler game

When would a suicide spike ever be a good thing over just a normal spike?

We heard you the first time.

Can't all the characters with that type of Dair also recover well enough from them?

Tink and Corrin have pretty mediocre recoveries.

Most of them are far too fast to recover. If Banjo has already used his jump he's not coming back for example.

He's actually obnoxious to fight against.
His side special gives you that fear that you could get fucked at any moment, with little to no chance of shielding.
It makes getting close to them dangerous.

based

Fucking this. I hate threads where people get upset that a character dosen't allow you to spam smash attacks like an autist and win.

Dude's got some moves, but 3/4 of his toolkit is weak as fuck and the other is broken as shit
That side-b is a goddamn monster, tons of range and can kill at 70% easily. 50% if he tags you by the side or off the stage with it.
His projectiles are probably the worst in the game but having 'only' a version of Fox's blaster and Snake's grenades with some problems is still strong as fuck. His recovery game is very generous, too.

I think once people get used to playing him he'll mostly be obnoxious. He'll never be bad because he's basically made for the game's current meta, camping and safe fucking moves and no fun whatsoever. A game between him and snake is going to be boring cancer garbage and also 100% mindgames.

Glad I'm not the only one that thinks Banjo feels like a Melee/Brawl character.

Based

>the game's current meta, camping and safe fucking moves and no fun whatsoever
Fuck are you talking about Smash has always been in every game a speed meta and it still is. Top characters are ones like swordies, Joker and the rodents right now

lol Thwak hit Yoshi at the same moment Banjo-Kazooie did.

If you mean speed as in "The character that can get their safest move out the fastest", then sure. Because otherwise Brawl and 4 were very slow and campy games.

No, not even close.

Plant was considered garbage since day 1 and has stayed that way since it came out. Stop pulling info out of your ass.

Looks middle of the road average. Like Simon to Pac-Man tier. So top 30 with all the Banjo fuckers out there.

pirahna plant is not top tier, the character legit did nothing for 8+ months until recently brood started maining the character and got 2nd at a decently sized japan major. But that's literally the only result

Basically tried to pull out wisdom teeth that hadn't grown out just to win matches.

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even if he was i wouldn't care. he's in

is this how Ridleybros felt when everyone was seething and saying how shit he was?

He's honest, which in Ultimate means he's garbage.

I would say he’s high tier.

He has the potential to be high tier. I plan to keep playing him after everyone is done.

Down throw has to be bugged. Why the fuck add a bury property to a move if you can instantly mash out of it. Why wouldn't you give it the same properties as K. Rool and Villager's?

i get good tech chases since i know they're gonna mash out, but i dunno, i feel like they should stay in longer.

>Kirby's inhale
I didn't even think of that. Does Kirby create a doppleganger kazooie?

It's a stuffed Kazooie.

Hes trash, I can stomp these dumb boomer bears with bowser lmao.
The banjos I fought think their side B is something worth fearing

I was disappointed learning that it didn't spike. It looks like it would.

Used in neutral, on flat ground, as an approach or chase, Wonderwing is awful. Easily grabbed or shielded and punished. An open invitation for a big hit and a waste of a feather.

Used as a mixup or a read, ideally from a hop or in the air so it can't be grabbed, or to punish a projectile or attack with enough lag, it is a fantastic kill option. It also adds to the recovery. I've seldom found myself needing more than 5 uses a stock.

Has a non-spiking move ever been turned into a spike after patches?
Also can we hope they patch the upAir not to be as shit?

Online sucks. But you're probably just fundamentally not good enough. You get in your own headand you watch your own character instead of theirs while just throwing out moves and not thinking about what comes next.

i just want his up tilt to hit more often, all the character needs for me, since i play snake.

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When I first started playing, I somehow managed to only get the single weak hit of UAir repeatedly and thought that's all it did. With the two hits it's a solid juggler and damage racker. Reminds me of Meta Knights UAir, though it doesn't chain into itself for ladders like that due to Banjo's lower jump height and air speed.

The game's shit

when are they going to ban him? i don’t feel like learning to fight another character

the biggest Banjofag saying he should've been in the base game like Simon

>Banjoke

Banjo having infinite recovery like Snake is hilarious to me.

It's a breath of fresh air that he's just decent so far and not frustrating to fight.

Tier's only represent highest level of play, but of course smash babies don't understand this.

Has anyone been able to reliably combo anything more lethal than another up air out of itself for banjo?

Only a dumbass would think Joker, a character with great frame data, great speed, decent KO power, combos, good recovery and the bullshit that is arsene would be underwhelming.
Plant is still mediocre.
Hero's problem is not brokenness, it's randomness. Not banworthy, though.
Banjo is decent, probably mid-high.

I think at perfect percents and positioning, you can combo a forward-air/back-air out of it

Perfectly viable but not without weaknesses that stop him from being top tier, which is ideal, really.
Good character overall.

...the character just came out. They wouldn't now the matchup either, dingus. He is getting rekt because he Banjo players obviously have better fundies than him