Cyberpunk 2077 features no cyberpunk elements despite having Cyberpunk in it's name

based

Synthwave trannies spotted
Make it 100%

Literally all of that is in the game though lol.

I never said it wasn't, that guy just asked "What I thought the themes were" so I answered.

I think it's important to emphasize that cyberpunk is usually more inspired in noir than in sci-fi though.

I don't give fuck about cyberpunk but OP is simply giving his outlook on the themes that the genre should be tackling more. I legitimately despise anti-discussion fags like you who dismiss any perspective they disagree with as "it's just ur opinion bro" instead of considering or discussing it in a board that was specifically made with that purpose.

>Cyberpunk 2077 features no cyberpunk elements
Elaborate?

Cyberpunk is noir, typically detective stories, and high-tech/low-life. They're are often elements of corporate or government dystopias, but it is not consistent.
That's it. You don't need a thousand word essay.

Meant to this faggot

Aesthetically and stylistically, yes, but the philosophy springs from a rejection of utopian sci-fi, which is best realized in the grim and gritty world of noir.

>high-tech/low-life.
We’re getting there

>I don't like these games, so they are not cyberpunk because I have my personal, very specific understanding of the genre and any deviation from my understanding is NOT cyberpunk
>I legitimately despise anti-discussion fags like you who dismiss any perspective they disagree with
Dilate

OP is more anti-discussion actually, stating that people miss the stated themes of cyberpunk.

The poster you disagree with is actually more open minded, insinuating that there is more flexibility with regards to what cyberpunk can be.

>defunded corpo projects abandoned to lowlifes
>street gangs dealing military grade technology
>franchise of soldier-like paramedics who will gladly shoot their way through any hostiles to treat their paying customer
Seriously? No cyberpunk elements at all?

woah its like settings can vary from author to author.

this is cyberpunk
not gta with neon collars

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>sun rays in the back
Not cyberpunk.

What the fuck user. That is the most RETARDED thing I've ever heard someone say. Seriously, kill yourself but unironically.
>But
No, you fuckded up, and crossed a line you shouldn't have. I can't even

Ultra brainlet take right here. Literally too stupid to know what cyberpunk is.

the sun is 90% blocked, that's acceptable

Nah dude everything has to be set to a rigid and unchanged list of rules for it to be cyberpunk

I know exactly what it is and I don't give a shit, the literary themes of cyberpunk are totally irrelevant in 2019, the aesthetic is the only thing that matters anymore so you better get that right

This is rather accurate...

>Cyberpunk as a "setting" is incorrect. It's a literary style that is nebulous in form.
What. Cyberpunk has, at minimum, a world where cyberspace exists, which is literally its defining feature. It's set in not just any future corporate dystopia, but one in which corporations more so than governments wield the full might that cyberspace has over the physical world, and one where the power of cyberspace and technology is also utilized by hackers and others on the edge of society.

files.catbox.moe/1v2kph.webm
files.catbox.moe/f66ly0.webm

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Shut up you dumb nigger. Just because your a dumb nigger that's never read a book and doesn't know any better doesn't mean I am.

>Cyberpunk is noir
Nigger you WHAT. You looked at the name Cyber and punk and you got noir? Goddamn are you people actually trannies? You're disturbed mentally

/thread

Akira doesn't have Cyberspace. I mean, first sentence and you're wrong and I didn't bother reading the rest.

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>Star wars is cyberpunk

>transhumanism is the next step

>we'll never get a good GiTS/Appleseed game

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>He doesn't know.
Lol.

I read books before you were even alive

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/thread

>that pic
god I want to play something like this
maybe one day

No you haven't. You literally just look at pictures and say, "Yep. That's cyberpunk!"

If we’re talking the expanded universe, Coruscant under the top layer is nothing but cyber punk slums and corrupt officials with little to no sunlight coming in

Dont see how those two points are correlated

Does Blade Runner have cyberspace?

?
They're directly correlated.

Blade Runner isn't cyberpunk.

A slum existing in the future != Cyberpunk.

for all your book reading you still can't read a one-line Yea Forums post apparently

i dont get why these shit posters bitch about cyberpunk the game but not the source material.
dont tell v this isnt cyberpunk tell mike pondsmith his cyberpunk games arent cyberpunk , get him to change his source material and voila games fixed. cause again the games based of the source material not off of what cdpr thinks it is. the guy you want is mike pondsmith. but your shitposts wont get enough attention there will it? hey mods this is a shitposting thread learn to recognize.

>defending being aggressively stupid
That's Yea Forums alright.

based

Feel free to backpedal. Go on.

cyberpunk is not communist

But they have internet, aka, cyberspace, you slimo

>2077 has no cyberpunk themes

How so?

This is the level of brainlet contrarianism we're at. Literally none of you niggers are going to do anything with your lives.

It isn't "noir", some cyberpunk stories are or share elements with noir, but there's nothing that says the two have to be connected

It's just a coincidence all of its most celebrated and prolific authors are left wingers.

You fucks really need to read "Petra" by Greg Bear. It's one of the most important, and most influential cyberpunk works of all time, and a perfect "manifesto" of the genre.
You can find it in famous cyberpunk story compilation called "Mirrorshades: Cyberpunk Anthology" edited by Bruce Sterling, and released in 1986.

If you read that story, and if you can figure out why this story (that contains with NO computers, no electronics, no implants, no cyberspace, in fact NO SCI-FI elements what so ever, and where the protagonist is an offspring of a nun raped by a literal stone gargoyle and plays cards with JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF has been included in Cyberpunk antology:
Then we can start discussing what is and isn't Cyberpunk.

As it stands, most of you are absolute illiterate retards that have nothing to actually say about the subject.

First of all stop with the long ass greentexts, if you cannot get your idea across in a few words then just write normally.

Again, OP is simply giving his outlook on what the genre should be. You claim that he's pretending to be an authority imposing his own definitions, but that's what the entire division between genres is about. When you accept that anything" can be cyberpunk, or any deviation is acceptable, the genre loses its identity. And this also goes to you .
It's not a lack of open-mindness, it's simply an attempt to delineate what separates one particular genre from others. His argument is that anything can be "cool", but it's the underlying philosophical themes that make a game specifically cyberpunk. He's setting a difference between futuristic coolness and cyberpunk.

It's to be expected that you either agree with OP or counter his point of view with your own understanding of what the genre is, instead of accepting all definitions as equally possible, which leads nowhere.

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Criticizing capitalism doesn't make you inherently communist you dumb mutt.

Actually, there is a lot of works that correctly explain how the two are directly related. Jesus you people: what in the world posesses you to talk about shit you know nothing about?

It is one of the most common conventions in the style since it was mostly based off pulp noir detective stories and the deconstruction of sci-fi.

>cyberpunk
>contains no cyber
really makes u think

it is whenever the criticisms are actually just fragile commie talking points. 99% of you losers are simply upset that people lack self control and spend above their means. Thats freedom.

How the fuck? Point to a source you trog. A genre can't be a genre if it literally relies on another genre to function. Cyberpunk stories have been told without being noir, and they will continue to do so.

Oh boy another thread shitting on a game because it is popular

>what in the world posesses you to talk about shit you know nothing about?
Where do you think we are?

>A genre can't be a genre if it literally relies on another genre to function.
Historical fiction

It's an ad hoc cheap way to write cyberpunk, to simply copy the tone of something like Johnny Neumonic.

it kind of does actually
they were defined in opposition to each other

There's no need to even do that. Look at the founder's of the genre and the consensus they developed amongst themselves when they laid out a shared framework. Why should obese american corporate cock suckers be allowed to override that?

Nope. Plenty of right-wing economists wrote books about how to save or preserve the "best possible" capitalism.

that doesn't contradict what I said

Cyberpunk isn't a genre, it's a style you mongolian. And it's based off of tech noir or neo noir. Literally spoonfeed yourself you dumb nigger. Are you 17?

>Why should obese american corporate cock suckers be allowed to override that?
$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Not him, but the effects and crashes of capitalism have been well documented and studied by people who believe in the system. Every anti trust, social benefit and welfare, etc. are the duct tape that hold the system together because of the way capitalism encourages major unjustified wealth disparity. You don’t have to be a “”””commie”””” or even anywhere near socialism to understanding this.

You've never read a book in your fucking life, I can tell.

WOW!! COOL THREAD!!

I've read most cyberpunk books. It's not a genre, it's a very specific style of book. You don't know anything.

2077 has LITERALLY every single element listed on your pic you absolute brainlet

Assuming you're being serious there's a reason why americans are seen as soulless golems all across the world and your post is a perfect example

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>Cyberpunk is noir

You can't even get through one line before fucking up.

>it's a very specific style of book
a genre, one might say

Lol this is 1000% doublethink. The other systems are a reaction to capitalism but they’re not it’s “enemy.” That was a politicized phenomenon since the Cold War. Capitalism needs to be criticized to be realized into a more self sustaining system - and to still remain capitalism. You sound like you’d oppose anti trust laws breaking up monopolies like AT&T, and I know this gets thrown a lot, but you sound like a bona fide bootlicker.

Does either of you actually even know what the word "cyber" MEANS?

Because that would be a good fucking start, don't you think? Maybe looking into where the term came from, who first used it in the context that we used it today? Maybe reading also some actual cyberpunk fiction and essays of promient people while you are at it.

All I did was tell the truth, they’re allowed because they have the money.

>Every anti trust, social benefit and welfare, etc. are the duct tape that hold the system together because of the way capitalism encourages major unjustified wealth disparity.

This is the most retarded drivel I think I've ever read, it's completely void of reality. In every first world country, virtually every single social welfare recipient is locked into being poor and worthless, even going so far as to waste their subsidies. Red tape and regulation is what destroys prosperity in this modern time

You're inferring an awful lot from a very small post

computers
neon lights
hacking
darkness
robots

Literally look it up you dumb nigger. The visual style of cyberpunk is tech noir and the writing is usually noir detective shit.

>You don’t have to be a “”””commie”””” or even anywhere near socialism to understanding this.
>capitalism encourages major unjustified wealth disparity.
You can say "unjustified wealth disparity" ONLY if you buy into communist theory of value. You have to be a commie and buy into their economic theories to call current state of wealth disparity "unjust".

WTF I LOVE SLUMS AND CHILD SLAVERY NOW!?

dont blame him, hes just a little kid that doesn't know how the world works. He'll turn on tv and see some retarded nigger that borrowed $200k for a marketing degree at a state school, or another retarded nigger that took out a 30 year mortgage on a $300k house despite making 22 thousand a year and then will blame capitalism.

You can't buy authorial intent you soulless bugman

>that people lack self control and spend above their means

And you talk about fragile talking points. You have a lot of reading to make if you think this is the problem.

You can be in favor of moderate, meritocratic capitalism but against completely unregulated neo-liberal capitalism that allows infinite expansion of corporations to a point where they're more powerful than entire countries. Which is where we're going. Free-market sounds very good as long as you assume everyone is in the same level playing field. Adam Smith would be fucking horrified of what current capitalism has become.

Dont forget augmentations, onions based food, and government conspiracies

Yeah, this is kinda what I expected. Why do you fucking insist on arguing shit if you have NOTHING to say about it, not know anything about it, and can't put even the SLIGHTEST amount of effort into your posts?
What is the fucking POINT of all this? What is there to fucking gain from this shit? What. Is. Wrong with you people?

Everyone has a price user. Even you.

One of anything can be classified as a genre if you're autistic enough, but if you go to an agent or publisher and say, "I'm writting a cyberpunk book," they will 100% follow up by asking you if it's sci-fi or dystopian—you know, actual genres.

redpilled

Literally all we want is Deus Ex with better graphics

what is there to gain by being extremely mad that you've read cyberpunk books and other people haven't?

>You have a lot of reading to make if you think this is the problem.

What like some cry baby commie faggot that doesnt want to wake up on monday so all private property should be abolished?

cyberpunk is a genre that is both sci-fi and dystopian
are you mentally challenged

We will get it once they make a good Appleseed anime

Who the fuck reads books here? We play video games

>Adam Smith would be fucking horrified of what current capitalism has become.
Except mainstream economic science completely dumped Smith into a garbage bin and moved on from his retarded ideas. Nobody cares about Adam Smith.

Being mad at something that is utterly and profoundly fucked up and not unavoidable is natural human reaction.
You don't have to be retards. It's not a matter of fucking IQ, there is nothing in the world that forces you to be fucking idiots: YOU CHOSE TO DO THAT.
Not being angry at that would make me fucking insane.

Why THE FUCK do you people chose to be idiots and act like retards?
Again: what is the fucking point of you and the shit you do here? I'm fucking trying to to at least either make single one of you to stop acting like a moron, and maybe educate yourself: Or if nothing else at least to learn myself about what the fucking fuck is going on with you idiots.
WHAT IS YOUR FUCKING POINT HERE?

Wrong. Not all Cyberpunk is dystopian; it has dystopian elements. Sci-fi ≠ dystopian. Shit like Shadowrun is first and foremost Urban Fantasy, but it's still cyberpunk.

>Why THE FUCK do you people chose to be idiots and act like retards?
To get you to keep replying. Which you obviously haven’t figured out yet

Not reading a book doesn't make you an idiot
On the contrary, reading a book and then calling others stupid because they haven't makes YOU an idiot

this. I like when cyberpunk fantasy mixes with history from earlier centuries. Like flying pirate ships and shit like that

>Not all Cyberpunk is dystopian; it has dystopian elements
are you fucking dumb
if it has dystopian elements it's dystopian
how many levels of mental gymnastics are you on?

Then it becomes steampunk

oh right, whatever

no that's piratepunk

>piratepunk
Badass

Oh fuck you've really done it now.

>hurr durr books are stupid we play video games
Nobody can tell you how to spend your free time, but we can all enjoy pointing and laughing at a brainlet who doesn’t see the entertainment value of reading books

Oh you never actually took a class on economics have you? Efficiency vs equality aren't religions in a constant struggle for the mortal soul, they are both mechanisms to manipulate limited resources. Fiscal responsibility doesn't mean going full ancap oil baron mode.

>He keeps replying

Dystopian = about dystopias. Dystopic elements doesn't mean it's a dystopian book you stupid fuck. Do you even know what the fuck your talking about? And plenty of cyberpunk doesn't have dystopias.

>"Cyber"
>interconnected information technology, transhuman augmentation and cutting edge machines
>"Punk"
>anti-establishment, anti-corporate, anti-consumerism, pro-individualist, pro-freedom ethos
Where the fuck does the "neo noir" cliche even factor into the equation, lads?

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Deus Ex

People can enjoy cyberpunk as they wish but shouldnt you try to expand their u derstanding? Sure people can enjoy trap music but couldnt you teach them how theres much more to music than just repetitive beats and “yuhs” & “aye”

No I’m a different poster

>And plenty of cyberpunk doesn't have dystopias.
like what?

>Fiscal responsibility doesn't mean going full ancap oil baron mode.
That's pretty cyberpunk. Would play.

It sorta was, solos are basically pinkertons.

I really don't get it. Why do people act like corporations have all the power when the power literally comes from consumers buying shit? If consumers were cohesive the market would stabilize overnight

>The last great cyberpunk game was Deus Ex
Deus Ex was about the evils of authoritarian government, from the perspective of a 90s libertarian conspiracy theorist. Thematically it had nothing in common with cyberpunk except they're both (different) dystopias.

The ones I made up on the spot of course

Youre right its not at all like megacorporations enslave people, exploit wars for profit and use literal planets as junkyards or technological progress changes things for the worse inside the star wars universe its not cyberpunk at all

Like anything by PKD and Gibson is light on the dystopian elements and is more plot driven.

>Not reading a book doesn't make you an idiot
Not reading a book and then going into a discussion of the content of said book and then not even fucking looking up basic info about the game and not even FUCKING ASKING WHEN YOU SEE SOMEONE WHO DID READ THE BOOK makes you an idiot.

It's OK to not know.
It's not OK to fucking sperg about shit you don't know on the internet.

What the fuck are you gaining from your "participation" on this discussion? You clearly aren't interested in learning something about what is Cyberpunk. And you just as clearly have NOTHING TO SAY about Cyberpunk because you don't know ANYTHING ABOUT IT.

So once again: What the FUCK are you doing here?

>Thematically it had nothing in common with cyberpunk except they're both (different) dystopias.

>light on the dystopian elements
that's not what i asked

Seething

>if you belive in something you must be willing to betray it
So literally every economist that pointed out issues is a commie now?

>Don't read book.
>Try to discuss the style of the books and turn out to not know anything.
lol

Not that guy, but second-wave cyberpunk written by ancaps like Stephenson isn't dystopian.

nobody is talking about books except you you drooling autist

Sure if you ignore the fact that case is literally enslaved by a corporation.
Arguably ghost in the shell

>To get you to keep replying. Which you obviously haven’t figured out yet
No. My question is: what the fuck do you gain from that?

>appeal to authority fallacy

Just admit you're barely out of high school and have no idea wtf youre even talking about

>He’s still doing it
Absolute autist

I gain a laugh from your inability to stop yourself from being made a fool on the internet.

The diamond age and snow crash were pretty dystopian

Sure:
The Diamond Age, Mirrorshades, and Count Zero. Also GITS isn't dystopic either.

To be honest, trans-humanism in fiction tend to be garbage.
You get what ?
>The enhanced-super-soldier that doesn't even Spice Murine level.
>People with augmented limb that punch a little harder.
>One guy with augmented brain who can just read wikipedia without his hand.
Meanwhile actual transhumanism is a lot about immunity to disease, aging, more efficient metabolism - and the true main goal is increased intellect.

Fiction TH is normal humans with robot part they found in a junkyard.
Actual TH is people living easily to 150+ years, and average IQ bumped to at least 120 - both having massive ramifications on how society work (notably on politics, way harder to bullshit people with propaganda and slogan).

It's hilarious watching you get absolutely mad about something so trivial and irrelevant

He did it to himself however, because he's an idiot.

>way harder to bullshit people with propaganda and slogan).
Fucking lol. Even the smartest people can still fail a speech check,

Ghost in the Shell.
Minority Report.
Anything that portray cops as the good guys.

yyyeah good point, what I wanted to say is that there are a lot of different ways to interpret and execute capitalism (not unlike communism) and just because you criticize the current system doesn't mean you're not a capitalist.

red line did a good job of depicting cyber punk racing as just futuristic indy car

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Why are you insulting him? He's telling you why these things happen you retard.

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Well in cyberpunk fiction they have all the power because you need punk in cyber punk and when there is no nation state a corporate pseudo state fills the gap.

In the real world though a totally cohesive
consumer market doesn't exist outside of I dunno, wehrmacht germany? Equilibrium is nice but growth is more important and you need some freedom to do that. And elasticity is a thing, without some government oversight there are just some markets where producers can fuck over consumers.

>nobody is talking about books except you you drooling autist
Are you literally brain-damaged? Or medically diagnosed autist? Is the fact that "the book" in this discussion clearly stands as a metafor for knowledge of certain subject really lost on you?
I did not start with this metaphor in the first place?

You literally act like an absolute retard on the internet: and you laugh at people who call you out on it?
Are you sane? Do you not realize that it's you who acts like a fucking fool? And for what?

What do you laugh about exactly? You still have not explained what is it that you crave so badly that you act out this shitshow.

Not being a fucking piece of shit is not what I would call trivial and irrelevant.

You might not like the worlds they took place in, but they weren't written to be dystopian.

>Are you sane?
Yup.
>Do you not realize that it's you who acts like a fucking fool?
Says the guy going batshit over literal pixels on his computer/phone screen. Get a grip

>Is the fact that "the book" in this discussion clearly stands as a metafor for knowledge of certain subject really lost on you?
oh really i thought you were talking about The Bible

The age-without-going-senile is actually the part that play the biggest role in that.
Learning experience of voting for guys who do the opposite of what they promised - or actual do it and then you realize the result you expected from your ideology isn't at all what you get in reality.
Make it way easier to spot the biggest bullshitter when you have already been bullshitted a lot.

But anyway, doesn't change the fact that TH in fiction and TH as it's currently been worked on have nothing in common.
Pretty much on the same level than space combat or AI.

>actual TH

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>Not being a fucking piece of shit
I dunno, being needlessly elitist about the most trivial shit imaginable sounds kind of like you're a piece of shit

>When are we going to get a proper cyberpunk game that explores the core ideas of the setting?
Fuck that, I just want a game with a good nighttime-and-neon-lights aesthetics to it and a decent story. I don't really care if Cyberpunk 2077 turns out to be a good cyberpunk game, so long as it is a good game.

>Equilibrium is nice but growth is more important and you need some freedom to do that.

A cohesive or unified consumer bases wouldn't stifle growth though, it would only oversee it. I mean there used to be a time where American car companies liked the fact that they sold cool cars to Americans, and auto-workers liked the idea that they were building cool cars for Americans. Then unionism became organized crime and despite all the corners being cut, you still have fucktards paying $8k more for a pick up with a bumper sticker chastising those who buy foreign.

snoy and coombrain get filtered, twitter screencaps, ecelebs, wojacks and pepe still allowed. mods are truly the worst kind of faggot scum

You don't even want Cyberpunk. You want tech noir lol

eventually this thread will get deleted for being "not on topic" because we are also discussing books and economics as well as video games.

A literal who twitch streams an heros? Stickied.

>sticky for e-celeb suicide
>sticky for e-celeb dying of cancer
>mods are truly the worst kind of faggot scum
You don't say.

>we should stop hedonism
Great then when are we stopping the entire entertainment industry as well as the recreational mind altering chemical industry including alcohol? And the cosmetic surgery industry too.

the sun rays are also only on the spot where the wealthy and elite live, seems spot on. the rich get to live under the sun with green grass and trees, everyone else eats shit. This is more often shown with a literal upper and lower lay or being above a cloud/smog barrier.

Nah, more like that :
interestingengineering.com/crispr-might-have-made-chinas-designer-babies-smarter
technologyreview.com/s/608350/first-human-embryos-edited-in-us/
(((Ethic))) committee are trying real hard to shut down all of this in Western society, so it's mostly gooks working openly on it (with all the trust problems that come with it).
I think Japan also started their own program, realizing that letting China get the technological lead on that would be a very bad idea.

>A bunch of right wing propaganda is ignored
Sounds good to me. Cool Future is all I really want.

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If that was the case japan wouldn't have been sidewinding since the 90s. If everyone is always buying what is most efficient with no other factor you'll keep creating impenetrable markets.

Im a 5th semester major in economics you absolute mongrel also you dont even understand what a fallacy is since you wrongly pointed one out.

>Says the guy going batshit over literal pixels on his computer/phone screen. Get a grip
Since when is a genre of fiction "pixels on the screen"?
I have no idea what made you deluded into thinking that you are sane. You clearly have lost track of the fact that the subject of this discussion (and this thread) is the criteria and qualities that define the fiction genre called "Cyberpunk".
Don't tell me you are a healthy person if you can't fucking keep track of this. So I ask again: What is wrong with you?

Having the fucking human decency to either educate yourself on a subject of debate, ask others to educate you, or at least not fucking imposing yourself on the debate if you have no knowledge of the subject or interest or capacity to learn about it:
THAT IS NOT A TRIVIAL HUMAN QUALITY: that is one of the most essential fucking things I'd expect from any adult human being.

Do you disagree with me? Do you seriously believe it's a right thing to do to screech endlessly about a subject you know nothing about and have no interest to learn about?

Do you think belief that such thing is wrong makes me "elitist"?

youtube.com/watch?v=pMqOMFW3Gt8

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>Having the fucking human decency to either educate yourself on a subject of debate, ask others to educate you, or at least not fucking imposing yourself on the debate if you have no knowledge of the subject or interest or capacity to learn about it:
Why are you assuming I'm not educated, and what is the debate? You are literally raging at your imagination

wermacht germany was fucking doing gangbuster. If you ignore all the military expansionism and racism nazi economics works pretty damn well.

cyberpunk is overrated. hopefully it just dies.

Yeah steampunk is much better

Unfortunately, the manchildren who see it as a medium for their fringe political views are the loudest right now, so it will be with us for a while.

Ad hominem.
Critisising is not betraying. You should learn from critisism, not plug your ears and scream hater.

>You are literally raging at your imagination
Autism in a nutshell

>"fuck the man and fuck the megacorporations": the sci-fi subgenre
>right wing propaganda
You retarded or something?

don't you know? being right-wing is being anti-authoritarian and trolling the libs

The class disparity in cyberpunk is usually to absurd levels. That's why there is so many hired cyborg killers and keyboard jockeys, technology be it weapons technology or cyber warfare is the great equalizer in these universes.

>Cyberpunk 2077 features no cyberpunk elements despite having Cyberpunk in it's name
>Astral Chain is not even close to cyberpunk, it's just "near future but anime"
>When are we going to get a proper cyberpunk game that explores the core ideas of the setting? The last great cyberpunk game was Deus Ex and it was released almost 20 years ago
I've been saying this all year and I knew it would be garbage since witcher 3 got over rated asf

>nazi economics works pretty damn well
Unless you are an international banker used to be able to siphon 50-70% of a country's economy with legalized banking scams.
I mean, there is a reason why anti-Nazi propaganda is still so strong while anti-commie dwindled down despite having tortured and genocided way more people.
There is a lot of *extremely* rich people that would lose a shitton of money if people where starting to look at *how* nazi managed to create an economy healthy enough to fight alone against most of the world without crumbling on the first week.

Nazis bad. Nothing else to see here. Get back to work.

>There is a lot of *extremely* rich people that would lose a shitton of money if people where starting to look at *how* nazi managed to create an economy healthy enough to fight alone against most of the world without crumbling on the first week.
by having a great industrial base and plundering other countries you fucking moron

Criticizing is going against and therefor a lesser form of betrayal just like tough live is still love. The point still remaind that your tribalism is retarded and just bc someone criticizes something doesnt mean they associate in any way with the antagonist of said thing

>nazi economics works pretty damn well
You are aware they had the same breadlines that commies did, right? Socialism, whether it's national or international, doesn't work.

>Why are you assuming I'm not educated, and what is the debate?
The debate was: What defines the genre of cyberpunk. It's right there, in the fist fucking post. Did you enter this discussion not knowing WHAT SO EVER what is the subject? And if you did: again: WHY?

I asked you what the word "cyber" means and where does it come from. You could not answer. Hence I assumed that you are completely illiterate on the subject.

Then I asked what are you doing in this thread if you are illiterate on the subject, and show absolutely no interest in educating yourself or letting others educate you.

You have not answered that either.
In fact, I asked you about five different questions, and you refused to answer every single one.
So: You are not here to ask any questions yourself (since you haven't asked any one so far), and you are unwilling to answer any questions leveled at you.

In a debate.
You willing entered a space specifically made for people to exchange views: yet you are neither willing to provide your views, nor interested in views of others.

So for the last time:
WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING HERE THEN?

>burger education

This game is just another aspect of cyberpunk. While it deals with the themes of the all powerful corporations and how even though technology is rapidly advancing, society norms lag and it ends up being a tumor. You on the other hand are a nobody solo who is just trying to make it to the big leagues. You cannot save society, the only person you can save is yourself. It's why despite your best friend dying, you getting shot in the head and being haunted by a dead rockstar, you keep going. It's the most real story you can get out of this game. Someone just looking out for himself.

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You're pathological at this point.

You bet your ass I'm going to be looking after Silverhand if it means getting me some of that sweet, sweet "upload your soul to the net" immortality.

Why does this meme always crack me the fuck up?

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Still I think the nazi economic model is inherently German. You had that prussian uniformity that held everything together, I'm not sure you could implement that model into the united states and have it work. The people have to want to be willing to embrace a visible authoritarianism and HET hedonism.

Kind of ignoring the part where military expansionism (and racism) were integral to the Nazi's long-term economy viability (and also why it was doomed to fail).

Investing heavily in remilitarization as an economic jumpstart runs out of gas real quick unless you have an enemy to fight to acquire additional land, labor, and resources, which in turn feeds further militarism since you need to recoup your losses (don't wanna get conquered while you're weak), with racism to justify why you're not the bad guys here, just taking what's yours.

Nazism was doomed to fail. If they weren't conquered, they'd run out of enemies and be forced to change systems or collapse.

And yet again you are literally too much of a coward to answer my question.
Are you this deluded? If even basic consideration of your own most basic motivation just... too much to ask of you? Are you really that far gone?

Do you really not even know why are you doing what you are doing? Is that how much you lack any semblance of self-awareness?

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Might be.
Might also be everyone having trauma from Weimar's economy, where unemployment and debt where so high across the board that prostitution to rich tourists was pretty much the entire economy of some cities.
Make it way easier to have everyone line up happily for some honest real work, regardless of nationalism/uniformity whatever.

you're a moron if you think Hitler pulled any economic miracles. Germany had a weaker army than France right up until it was too late. They won the early stages of the war because France and Britian were too reluctant to fight and the Soviets were still building up

Your posts are art, esl-kun.

From the very first post the only thing I did was make fun of you for being a tremendous blowhard
I haven't debated you on anything

>Hitler has frozen wages so you were wagecucking for literally what Hitler decides would be the wage you deserve
>You had to ask the government permission to change jobs, and if you tried to do it w/o the permission, you were going to jail
>people who worked in agriculture were prohibited from moving anywhere or changing occupation, so you were a literal slave to the NSDAP
>you were forced to pay into a collective fund to fund Henry Ford's cars production by the NSDAP and were promised to get a car "sometime later"(that "sometime" never arrived btw)
W-worked fine, guys

Ok, but why? How much of class desparity is normal?

>Why yes, I don't know what Tech Noir is, how did you know?

That was the Weimar republic, once the nazis got a hold of the economy and put people to work possibly at gunpoint shit boomed hard. Nazi germany could have been an economic super power during the cold war if hitler personally wasn't eager to prove he could have won the great war.

Because, contrary to what you have read, all men are not created equal.

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>"Right wing conservatism is the new punk rock!"
>it's a bunch of NEETsocs that all aspire to be straight edge, clean-cut wagies with nuclear families
Where did it all do wrong?

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These:
Are literally all me.
Dumb presumptuous nigger.

Cavemanpunk when?

It's called dinopunk
and I think something akin to it probably exists in bad 90s kids cartoons

this

>Oh, no, there's another test for lesbianism.

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>I know I'm wrong so it's okay when I pretend to be retarded

German remilitarization was key to their development and would've necessitated war at some point. There is no "Peaceful" Nazi economic power, or any other fascist nation.

>more burger education
Quick, you gonna be late for your mandatory Holocaust courses.

Cyberpunk is much more individual to the author then that. It's usually a deconstruction and critique. Authors are usually more centrist.

From literally nothing that's pretty impressive to pull off in a few years. Granted it was a mistake to waste all that military leverage in an unwinnable war but there was serious growth and industry when the nazis took over. Could have lasted decades maybe even have gotten to computers and bombs first if they toned down the xenophobia just a bit.

>gamer get filtered
let's test that

>bad 90s cartoons
You mean everything awesome about the 80s and 90s.
youtube.com/watch?v=HZ_shWT3Kc8

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I know what tech noir is. You literally just bandwagoned my remarks and pretended to know what the fuck you were talking about.

>just bc someone criticizes something doesnt mean they associate in any way with the antagonist of said thing
This is what i and other user said.

This would be considered pure Reddit by today's standards

>Cyberpunk 2077 features no cyberpunk elements
Bro, let me borrow your time machine.

>From literally nothing
It wasn't "from literally nothing". Germany was the most developed nation in Europe along with France and the UK and had the biggest industrial base. All Hitler needed to do was stop paying war reperations, and he could go into debt then pay it off with Austrian gold and whatever else he plundered from the rest of Europe

I had not read a single one of those posts. Are you upset that someone else knows what tech noir is besides you, who just googled it today?

Am I weird if I love tech noir but hate cyberpunk?

High tech low life is the defining feature of cyberpunk, not just some nebulous cyberspace

>sony is filtered
what?

>Would have necessitated war at some point
After how fucked europe was there was no "need" for a conflict to match the scale of the first world war. Would nazi germany have to fight a war at some point with someone? Sure but did it need to be total war? Absolutely not.

> if they toned down the xenophobia just a bit.
England wanted war at any pretense (well, Churchill did more specifically), no matter what Germany did.
Hitler literally begged them for peace repeatedly, and even purposely told his generals to not press for a slaughter at Dunkirk, hoping England would be grateful and drop the whole war thing.

Any war in Europe would have developed into a total war and fascism doesn't exist without an enemy and the inevitability of fighting them

is this what stormfags really believe

matrix destroyed that oldschool type cyber punk and made it a fucking stupid action genre for casuals, whereas ghost in the shell which the matrix directors aped was pretty royal to it.

otherwise many japanese games set in a future world are pretty much cyberpunk but you westacucks wont ever understand it since you dont even watch lain or sac.

you are the type of person that only reads capeshit comics and only want old capeshit cliches. you get old. just keep screeching.

Plebbit is as big as facebook and it's where all the young kids with the pumped up kicks hang out, anything you can think of has fans on plebbit. It is what it is. All the cool kids have hopped on the /pol/ boogeyman train anyway.

Yes.
Everyone not believing that Nazis where actually like the Satan-bogeymen depicted in Hollywood movies is a Stormfag.

>Hitler made a strategic blunder because he was really just a nice guy and wanted peace

>ghost in the shell which the matrix directors aped
They shamelessly aped Neruomancer, just like most cyberpunk does.

Venezuela has a huge industrial base as well. But where is their capital? And that's not even saying that much after all of europe crippled itself to fight the first world war. And come on, austrian gold? Plundering Europe? When there is so much in the middle east yet to be carved up that the french and British can't get to? And would be years before the soviets would?

No. I'm upset when dumb niggers pretend to know something but don't because they've never read a book.

>no counter arguments
Go back to your cult.
That dosen't mean that people of lower classes don't deserve a livable and comfortable conditions.
Yeah, nazis would be cool if they were not nazis.

You shouldn't be so hard on yourself like that.

totally different from neuromancer. dont pretend to know it. also i said ghost in the shell tried to be royal to the genre. is that a bad thing? also oshii isnt really a fan of cyberpunk.

i mean, what do you want.

I'm talking about you user. Please read a book.

Correct, but the scale doesn't matter. The military-industrial complex is innately predatory. War is good for business, so long as you win, and when war makes up a sizable chunk of your business, you have an incentive (later a requirement) to go to war. Nazi Germany was always going to need to fight someone to maintain their economic development, and they were always going to need to fight. Just because it's not total war doesn't make them a peaceful nation.

In any case, a lot of Fascism's key aspects as a political philosophy revolve around the existence of existential threats that must be pruned, defeated, or held off in perpetuity. You can only trust you and yours and all others are suspect, an idea which would've been attractive to a post-WWI Germany that felt betrayed and unfairly punished by pretty much everyone. This philosophy combined with militarism (which itself is also part and parcel of it) means fascist nations can only ever temporarily play nice with other countries, even if those countries are also fascist. The other is forever seen as a threat and must be purged, both within and without. You can't leave other groups alone because all groups are predatory in keeping with their own self-interest, and strife is inevitable. You'd be a fool not to strike first, if you truly believed such a philosophy.

>Venezuela has a huge industrial base as well.
Not in the 1930s it didn't
>And that's not even saying that much after all of europe crippled itself to fight the first world war
Germany got off relatively well, Germany itself wasn't invaded
>And come on, austrian gold? Plundering Europe? When there is so much in the middle east yet to be carved up that the french and British can't get to?
What do you think is easier for Germany, invading and holding the Middle East when you have no navy or annexing Austria without a war?

>made a strategic blunder
Two actually.
First one was desperately trying to get peace out of Churchill.
Second was making France pay hard for Alsace/Lorraine despite Petain literally wanting to join the axis (with reasonable support from the French population at that time, who wanted Anglo blood after the Dunkirk debacle completely fucked everything). Instead of accepting the second biggest army & industry of the continent as ally, he decided it was the right time to be petty, grabbed half of France and instated a semi-slavery system, instantly turning France into self-sabotage and resistance mode.
Hitler lost the war due to two massive consecutive brain farts.

They pulled their fictional elements straight from Neurmancer without even changing the names. It's not like it was subtle man.

2077 has most of that shit though

Can you please recommend the book you read on the differences between tech noir and cyberpunk, or how tech noir inspired cyberpunk? You definitely didn't get any of that from google or wikipedia, right? There's a paperback out there somewhere, after all, you've read it.

Is the tech noir guy also the book guy? Is his autism that powerful?

Book guy specifically refers to cyberpunk as a genre, it can't be him.

Don't fight in europe then. Take shit from the chinese, focus on the east ottomans sell surplus. Hell the united states made the whole proxy war thing work. Hitting france made no economic sense.
Yeah and how the fuck would england invade germany? What was churchill gonna say "Jolly good chaps, jerry needs a good spanking and we got the dreadnaughts to do it! Right after I got most of your old beloved ships sunk last go around. Pip pip into the straights we go!" Not happening. Not when uboats can just pour from the kiel not when Kattegot would be a disaster to go through and not when the rest of europe is saying "god please no not again what the fuck churchill"

Who said anything about England invading Germany?

Hitler would have a hard time convincing Germans to hate the Chinese

"snoy" never got filtered, it's still spammed a million times per day. nintrannies' victim complex sure is something.

Ahhhh... okay...

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Imagine being such a psudo-intellectual tool that the first thing you think when you see something cyberpunk is "wow, nobody understands this except me."

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you dont understand what cybernetics is. stop mentioning cyberpunk if you have zero knowledge of it. neuromancer isnt really that original. gibson just sorted the elements out back then and made a clear storytelling with them.

also i dont understand what you want or you must think matrix is cyberpunk or something lol
matrix is fucking casualised "cyber action" garbage akin to shitty aaa games set in some futuristic world. these actions dont depict a life style or a cultural background. just do shitty action.

snow clash was the shit that was loyal to the genuine cyberpunk. youd call it a rip off again though.

If only they had read the literature...

he's still at it

Awesome tech, shitty lifes

What did get filtered at one point was sony ggers.

>we are living in stage 0 of a corporate controlled cyberpunk nightmare
>not relevant
Hahahahahah i cant wait till ronald mcdonald and burger king are campaigning for presidency, then maybe youll understand

Sure but say your economic dominance will keep threats in europe in check and keep that alliance with italy to send shit into turkey hit literally anywhere else on the map. Hell the soviets were gonna hit poland if germany didn't, why not actually cut a deal with western europe and fight a winnable war on just one front?

That's exactly why it isn't relevant
Cyberpunk isn't the future anymore, it's the present, except it isn't really like cyberpunk predicted it would be

Have book.

You sound like you have a serious case of autism, you might want to get diagnosed

Publish.

Ok austria annex makes sense but hitting poland was just stupid. And they had Italian ports to work with they were already hitting the Mediterranean just do it MORE.

>NO YOU DONT UNDERSTAND ONLY UNDERSTAND YOU ARE JUST GETTING IT WRONG YOU CANT EVEN DEBATE RIGHT HERE ILL GIVE HALF EXAMPLE OF WHAT I MEAN BUT NOT REALLY PLEASE UNDERSTAND MY CRYPTIC PAPER TRAIL BUT YOU ARE PROBABLY TOO STUPID I COULD BE EXACT AND SPECIFIC BUT IM JUST NOT BRAVE ENOUGH TO GET CALLED OUT

>itt : trannies mad that people enjoy videogames for fun and not because they push some sort of agenda

It's like you think WW2 is a video game and not real life where people don't make rational decisions
Germany could have not started a World War aswell, but they did

That would've been a smarter move, but still feeds into a perpetual cycle of violence by necessity, and likely would've collapsed into a power scramble in Europe anyway as Germany became more and power powerful.

The initial post at the start of this chain claimed " If you ignore all the military expansionism and racism nazi economics works pretty damn well." My point was that Nazi economics relied on military expansionism, so you can't divorce that from their (exceedingly temporary) prosperity as a nation-state. You can't say "Sure, Hitler was a war hound, BUT he saved the Germany economy," because he saved the German economy BY being a war hound, and then hastened their destruction with terrible strategic decisions.

You can't divorce fascist economics from fascist militarism. They are interlinked on the most basic level, and a "Fascist" country that did not indulge in militarism would be virtually unrecognizable from anything we could actually consider fascist, though not so with authoritarianism (which a lot of idiots use interchangeably with fascism when it's actually a squares vs rectangles situation).

>Blade Runner isn't cyberpunk because it's neo/tech-noir

Jesus Christ. This idiot is still at it.

Not him, but I'm publishing my first cyberpunk book. I have an agent and we're querying publishers.

Did your publishers ask you if it was sci-fi or dystopian?

No. They read it and told me it was a thriller.

With this argument I always wondered where the disconnect from GTA starts?
Modern buildings and "undesirables" in the street? Deus ex is noted for it's extremely grounded world, so much that it takes place in 2070 and has architecture that looks like it would be klish in the 90's.
I don't get it.

I hate to be cliche but having it be sunny is not very cyberpunk
and cyberpunk tends be super-urbanized, gothic architecture ie. not fucking california

I don't get this. Most of Akira is in the day and is more biopunk than cyberpunk, but people consider it cyberpunk.

Hitler literaly got his peace, and then attacked. Why do you think Churchil became PM?

Why not, burgerpunk?

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yeah but akira takes place in super-urbanized and industrial environments
suburbs aren't cyberpunk, even if you attach neon signs to them

dumb matrix fan

im just saying, if you or op really want "new cyberpunk" yet a not so casual one, snowcrash or some anime is just that and should be adopted instead of that internet meme guy kianu. polack and western devs are too casual to find it out tho and desperate to ape hollywood cgi junks like matrix.

the cyberpunk that op is asking for doesnt exist otherwise. the genre is dead. many of you would hate a protag like the one from snowcrash whos a mixed race person of black and japanese/korean using a katana and call him anime or weebshit, and ofc youd hate every anime. enjoy your fucking shitty matrix junk. its the only option youve got.

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>once Mc-cops start banging at your door

Yawn, already happening in Burgestan

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It's certainly an interesting experiment on where you can take the series. And the fact that it is says a lot about how serialized the series is.
I wonder if the night day cycle is gonna cause far too much of a thematic shift for people.

Still happens in the day and is still more biopunk than cyberpunk.

why is that cop actually wearing a mcdonalds logo?
Are the police poor now? Do they need to put sponsors on themselves to get bullets?

I dont think the sun would be so bad if it actually took place in a futuristic super-developed city not just LA with neon signs and body mods

Burgerpunk is real...

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Is that why things have been shitty for the last hundred years or so?

Looks like comfy early-00s.

>Shit boomed.

Lol no it didn't. The economy was running on fumes and was insanely inefficient. Furthermore huge parts of Germany's issues, access to oil and food, could have been solved just by allowing external trade which Hitler essentially banned thinking it would weaken Germany as he adhered to the socialist idea of shrinking markets.

Burgerpunk would just be American Truck Simulator

Again I think it favors in the design style of deus ex, where it's an extremely grounded type of cyberpunk.
Less cybermancy and more beleivable, near future stuff.
I know it may frustrate some because really, we are currently living in a cyberpunk shithole future, we've been in one for years now. But I think its a solid spiritual sequel to the original deus ex.

this is cyberpunk
not gta with neon collars

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It's now. This shit isn't comfy, it's a burgerpunk nightmare.

Read some cyberpunk faggot.

I hope you're not saying Cyberpunk 2077 is a spiritual sequel to Deus Ex

>Astral Chain is not even close to cyberpunk
Was it ever touted as such? It looks just like regular old Sci-fi.

Literally real life with a blue lighting tint

This is accurate. OP is a fag and a retard.

It's like, what else do you believe, that all games have political agendas? That themes that emerge from storytelling should all be taken seriously? The fuck, am I in an undergraduate literature class? It's like you take the pro-environmental "messages" you can glean of a bunch of The Simpsons episode seriously when the guy is behind them, John Swartzwelder, is a based hardcore libertarian and anti-environmentalists.

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You're right user! I should be allowed to make a 100% scientifically accurate depiction of the future, but I should just call it fantasy! Why should these subhumans call me a shit just because I deviated a little bit from their swords and sorcery malarky? Those shitlords don't OWN the genre anyways!

fuck off

It was so face to the table annoying when wokers got trigger at the tranny ad in game. No shit it seemed exploitative what the fuck do you think cyberpunk is about?

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ITT : people that have never read cyberpunk saying what it isn't

>German remilitarization was key to their development and would've necessitated war at some point. There is no "Peaceful" Nazi economic power, or any other fascist nation.

No you prog, fascism is a interesting system of government and its strange you bring up National Socialism since that is not "fascism", Italian fascism, that emerged from the Syndicalist movement and it can be very peaceful. Unlike communism. Communists REQUIRES Imperialism to survive. Without imperialism, communists states would just decay and the genetically superior men would just murder whoever is in power and transform it into their own will.

This is why "libs get owned", not because its part of "right wing ideology", but because left wingers are so fucking retarded and have clear genetic mental illness that they expose their stupidity when they speak about anything. Everyone sane can see it. I mean, lets take "fascism", we all know that the only reason left wingers hate "fascism" because its a appealing alternative to socialism AND its more appealing to the working class. Don't even deny it. The Soviet definition of "fascism" litreally means "anything that opposes communism". So think twice before you say "fascism" like its a bad thing.

Furthermore, during the 1930s, communists, who were alive when actual National Socialists lived and thrived, classified Sweden social democracy as a form of "fascism" because it too opposed communism. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_fascism

So even by your own definition, are you implying that the Sweden nation is not peaceful? You probably do.

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>it can be very peaceful.
you're a fucking retard, or misinformed, probably both

>Cyberpunk 2077 features no cyberpunk elements

This is based on your assumption that "cyberpunk" means "vaporwave", which it actually has nothing to do with.

yeah we all know cyberpunk is synthwave

How does the cum of Walmart middle management taste

That you are an ignorant cretin of that there is no doubt

Tranny freaks trying to dictate what "cyberpunk" means is the worst fucking meme. It's not about scrupulously woke leftism you retards, it never was. The only criteria are paranoia about technology, pessimism about the near future and suspicion of large corporations. National-socialist cyberpunk would be more honest and authentic than what these people want.

Because it isn't cyberpunk, it's dystopian sci-fi.
See above. It is THE precursor to cyberpunk, sure, but cyberpunk started with Neuromancer. Similar to how RUR/Metropolis isn't cyberpunk but sci-fi, even if it inspired PKD and Blade Runner immensely.

not as ignorant as the person who thinks theres fascism without violence

Any honest cyberpunk made in 2019 should be pro trans genocide. If you see teenagers ordering illegal hormones on the internet and think "this will turn out well" you're incapable of understanding cyberpunk.

Cyberspace is not, and never was "the internet". Not as you know it. There was never meant to be any sort of unifying HTTP-like protocol, your average person never used the "internet". There might be a subscription-based wikipedia-like service, and you could certainly buy software tools, but it was always meant to be more like usenet. Deckers/netrunners/whatever weren't "using the internet" any more than running nmap against something is "using the internet", and on top of that, they got to hallucinate the entire thing in 3d.

In fact, we're actually moving towards that model. Imagine if your computer was a walled garden just like your phone. You don't browse websites, you install apps, and then you use those apps to access services - facebook, spotify, snapchat, reddit, youtube, whatever normie shit. All of the websites you use regularly also turn into services - from Wikipedia to WebMD. Search engines sort of cease to be a thing, you just look for the relevant app and install it. Everyone's using their own protocols, their own backends. And it's not just consumers - your corporate workers are doing the exact same thing at work, it's just that they're only using business and productivity apps instead of YouSnapTwitFaceChat.

Remember all the articles a few years ago about how computers were dead and tablets/mobile were the future? They're not wrong (with the exception of enterprise), and Windows 10 pretty much confirms that. In 15 years, nobody but absolute dweebs will touch a web browser. And the rising use of cloud services (and thus a return to mainframe-terminal infrastructure) is the cherry on top - it's actually IS happening.

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people literally called the internet "cyberspace" in the 2000s

Funny, because it seems to deal with many of the themes listed in the picture (You) posted

You are all retarded.

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Dystopian and sci-fi are literally two exclusive genres.

>Dystopian and sci-fi are literally two exclusive genres.
retard

How to look for relevant apps without a search engine? hmmmmmmmm

And people literally call you a fag, so I guess you're a confirmed cum guzzling cock fiend.

>herself

Literally screencapped from Wikipedia. It's also the same in every publishing house. Stay free.

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Not that guy, but you're retarded. Nowhere does it say that the two genres are mutually exclusive as you claimed. Are you implying an overlap between any of the genres listed in that article is impossible? Again, you are retarded.

Where does it say they're exclusive?
You know you can have a sci-fi romance right
or no I guess it has to be one or the other
This thread is an autism magnet

>Thinking that every form of media has some type of political message (especially ones you agree with) makes you smart

>"high technology, low life."
>Cyberpunk is noir
That's technoir, and its what bladerunner falls under. Cyberpunk is a specific set of themes being tackled in a sci-fi setting that is bleak to a point of near-horror.

This, but unironically. Too many babbyrunners thinking cyberpunk is about getting a waifu and being autistic

Akira isn't actually dystopia, but it is cyberpunk ironically. When someone doesn't even know the naming conventions, it's hard to take them seriously. You should know how to classify shit.

Real life with a blue lighting tint. Almost 40 years after the term cyberpunk came into existence. In a world where:
>people hack security cameras and turn them into botnets, then DDOS corporations and ransom them
>238 cities spent more than a year lobbying Amazon, one of two $1 trillion corporations in existence, for the privilege of hosting their new office
>you can 3d print guns at home for under $500
>you can 3d print your own prosthetics for even less
>Pepsi is planning on putting a giant billboard in space
>China has implemented a social credit system that works by tracking literally everything you do, in meatspace and online
>people use their nudes to get lines of credit
>video evidence has been made utterly irrelevant thanks to deepfakes and similar technology
>social media sites performed behavioral manipulation on their userbases then tracked their mood changes as an experiment
>rich people keep teenagers around solely to transfuse their blood to try and extend their lifespans

Of course cities at night in 2077 look like cities at night IRL. You're already living cyberpunk. We just don't have all the cool biotech yet, everything is well-lit, and the megacorps have names like Disney and Facebook and Amazon instead of Maas-Neotek, Jinteki, and TriOptimum.

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You are in fact a tremendous faggot retard and the reason so much art is terrible these days. Imagine boiling all those games down to a bullet-point liberal message as if they're no different from some hyper-polemical modern young adult book.

>what is an app store

Marketers called it cyberspace, because they thought NORPs would think it sounded cool. They didn't, and we got the dotcom bubble.

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>app stores don't use search engines

Oh, I see, you're retarded.

dont forget "surfing the web" and "information superhighway"

Right, it's actually about how it's awesome when environmental toxins and social decay cause teenagers to not even know their own gender. Cyberpunk is definitely all about how being a transgender communist is good.

>I can't tell the difference between the search functionality in an app store and a full-blown search engine like google

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>average IQ bumped to at least 120
>way harder to bullshit people with propaganda and slogan
READ ELLUL

everything still uses TCP though

Aside from the middle left, Deus Ex has literally none of those, and it's the greatest Cyberpunk game ever made

And? Transport layer is irrelevant. We're talking about OSI layer 7. The underlying tech doesn't matter as much.

also

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Absolutely this holy shit.

>what is there to gain by being extremely mad that you've read cyberpunk books and other people haven't?
Because if I don't get mad at them, they'll slowly argue away the public perception of what they are, until we get shit where people are making "cyberpunk" stories that look identical to Star Trek except someone teleports into the slums in a 4 second-scene, and everyone nods their heads and says "Yeah sure, cyberpunk".

Not user you're referring to and I dislike both of those terms but it isn't. It was hugely influential but cyberpunk started with Neuromancer, period. This doesn't make Blade Runner any less amazing, it's great dystopian sci-fi and visually and thematically unrivaled as a movie. But Blade Runner doesn't have cyberspace, even if it has megacorporations.

You can keep arguing this pointless shit as long as you want, but Gibson literally coined the term so when you're referring to cyberpunk you're referring to something that started with Neuromancer. Why did he call it cyberpunk? Because he also coined the term CYBERSPACE, so that's what the CYBER part is referring to, and despite the internet at the time being mostly a network of university computers linked together as well as financial institutions and banks using it to gather data on customers to manage risks of lending Gibson envisioned its ubiquity and how it would eventually evolve into an entirely alternate reality (we're not even halfway there yet).

Cyberpunk 2077 will be cyberpunk, and Blade Runner will forever not be cyberpunk however great it is, and idiots and shitposters will continue complaining it doesn't look enough like BR 100% of the time because they never read a book in their life and it's just an aesthetic of rainy neon skylines and nothing more. But when you get down to it, the shitposter argument falls apart in seconds.

Here's an unironic 'you'.

If I'm living in cyberpunk where are my augmentations? Why can't I give myself a body better than my own? Why can't I physically transport myself in cyberspace?

The term "cyberpunk" was actually coined by Bruce Bethke in 1980. It was the title of a short story that's actually really fucking excellent and laid a lot of groundwork for the genre. You can read it here: infinityplus.co.uk/stories/cpunk.htm
>The invention of the c-word was a conscious and deliberate act of creation on my part. I wrote the story in the early spring of 1980, and from the very first draft, it was titled "Cyberpunk." In calling it that, I was actively trying to invent a new term that grokked the juxtaposition of punk attitudes and high technology. My reasons for doing so were purely selfish and market-driven: I wanted to give my story a snappy, one-word title that editors would remember.

Gibson was the one to coin "cyberspace", interpret it as an electronic hallucination, and apply it to early concepts of "the internet", although even then it was a far cry from what we recognize the internet as now. Neuromancer was excellently written and Gibson has fantastic prose, so it was the first cyberpunk work to really make it big - and right on the heels of Blade Runner, to boot. There were earlier works, and you can find a lot of them in the Mirrorshades anthology, but some of them will be frankly unrecognizable as what we now consider cyberpunk. I mean, shit, The Gernsback Continuum is probably the least traditionally cyberpunk story in Burning Chrome, and yet both BC and Mirrorshades are considered classic cyberpunk anthologies. Give this a read - it's got plenty of punk, but the cyber isn't really that recognizable: marclaidlaw.com/online-fiction/400-boys/

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>Franco Spain wasn't real fascism
ok retard

The answer to pretty much all of those is that you're poor and/or not crippled, and you don't own a VR headset.

is2.Yea Forums.org/wsg/1567448992565.webm
i.4cdn.org/wsg/1567449054089.webm

Based. Nincels are just too obsessed with us.

tranny...

>Marketers called it cyberspace, because they thought NORPs would think it sounded cool. They didn't, and we got the dotcom bubble.
I'm not a marketer and I did and still sometimes call it cyberspace, because it is. It's not the cyberspace as envisioned by Gibson, because when we use the term cyberspace rather than internet it's usually in some form of semi-futuristic sense of what the internet is and is becoming, which you (or another user) rightly point out here . But to pretend cyberspace as a term, which was coined by Gibson, wasn't (incredibly) widely used in the 90s, and not just in ads for ISPs or computers, and used to refer to both the current and the future internet, is blatantly false. In fact, it's useful today to refer to the internet specifically when you're contrasting it with "reality" or the physical world (or meatspace if you're a character in a Gibson novel).

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IQ and wisdom are two different things. Most humans will be foolish and no amount of enhancement can force that change.

sonygroids still works

>cool biotech yet
we will never have 'cool biotech'. This fantasy delusional optimism for the future is so god damn stupid, and yet we have retards running around IRL saying shit like "it's just a matter of time before everything is automated" and talking hopefully that we will discover the immortality juice and build space elevators like they are perpetual children that don't understand how technology works. "oh its just a matter if time until we discover FTL" fuck off, it's impossible and will never be possible. You can't just make the argument that because we can launch a rocket into space we can colonize mars. Discovering penicillin doesn't mean we're any closer to finding the fountain of youth. Honestly I don't know what kind of fucked up environment we have that has created such delusional people but there is way too many of them.

>technology outside of the technology I know will never exist
>why are people hopeful for the future, fuck them
b o o m e r

see

(you)
I mean it's really like they treat real life like a videogame with a hidden tech tree or something and we just have to find out how to unlock it and suddenly we will have magical flying cars and teleportation. It's frankly disturbing because I see people using this type of logic in politics as well, even people in real life government doing this shit.

>humanity is incapable of discovering new things and then using them
We could have flying cars, they'd just be stupidly expensive and way too dangerous.

Huh, I always distrusted that interpretation due to the whole publisher crap which always sounded a bit off, but thanks for the links, I'll be sure to check out Bethke's short stories after I read the Laidlaw story tonight. But I think it's fair to say that Neuromancer was and is the most influential cyberpunk work and that by extension we can safely call cyberspace one of its (the genre's) core elements.

I'll still maintain 2077 will be more cyberpunk than Blade Runner, or rather that it'll be cyberpunk while BR isn't (however great and seminal a dystopian sci-fi movie it is and however influential on all later fiction including cyberpunk). At least if everything we've seen and read and heard is any indication.

>You know those fancy bionic arms that are supposed to be amazing, using magical tech to attach directly to a 'neuron interface'? Yeah they are just touch sensors interfacing with the muscles and making movements that are precoded into the software. Oh also they only have battery charge for like 15 minutes of use. To the unsuspecting normie this would look like some great feat in allowing disabled people to function normally but in reality it's just a hedge fund scheme to finance other irrelevant projects.

Cringe

>all technological progress is fake, it's all a financial scam, global warming isn't real, green technology is a ploy by china to make us invest into dumb things like renewable energy!
Boomer bile here!

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Neuromancer was absolutely the most influential, and cyberspace is absolutely a core element, it's just worth noting that many of these things were floating around beforehand - sometimes even before a name had been coined for them. This is entirely because around 1980, there was this kickback in scifi against the Asimov-type far-flung futures, and the samey utopians, and the constant space operas. A bunch of younger, edgier writers looked at Reagan and went "I bet the future is going to be really fucked-up", and you ended up with cyberpunk as a genre.

Another bit from the intro to Bethke's Cyberpunk:
>IMPORTANT POINT! I never claimed to have invented cyberpunk fiction! That honor belongs primarily to William Gibson, whose 1984 novel, Neuromancer, was the real defining work of "The Movement." (At the time, Mike Swanwick argued that the movement writers should properly be termed neuromantics, since so much of what they were doing was clearly Imitation Neuromancer.)
>Then again, Gibson shouldn't get sole credit either. Pat Cadigan ("Pretty Boy Crossover"), Rudy Rucker (Software), W.T. Quick (Dreams of Flesh and Sand), Greg Bear (Blood Music), Walter Jon Williams (Hardwired), Michael Swanwick (Vacuum Flowers)...the list of early '80s writers who made important contributions towards defining the trope defies my ability to remember their names. Nor was it an immaculate conception: John Brunner (Shockwave Rider), Anthony Burgess (A Clockwork Orange), and perhaps even Alfred Bester (The Stars My Destination) all were important antecedents of the thing that became known as cyberpunk fiction.
>Me? I've been told that my main contribution was inventing the stereotype of the punk hacker with a mohawk. That, and I named the beast, of course.

So I literally cannot do any of cyberpunk stuff. meaning we aren't living in a cyberpunk world.

Why is this the image Twitter trannies love using to dunk on those incel gamer chuds?

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2077 got sun in it

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this but unironically

>trannies in dystopian future: beep boop gotta laser my cyberdong off

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>I'm poor, incompetent, and at best completely average in every single way
>because I'm all of these things and can't access cutting-edge medical tech, the world isn't cyberpunk
ok kid.

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>we were never meant to have the power of creation
>made by gang prim
clarify both of these things before I decide this image is the dumbest thing posted itt

delete this

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Ok, to put it as concisely as possible:
LOL, as if I give a fuck about what you think, faggot.

>this is the author of "I have over 100 body modifications" pasta
>0 actual body modifications, just tattoos and piercing
So his lack of personality causes the autism fits on twitter?

You have failed, and win the award of dumbest thing posted ITT

When are you going to mail it?

You wouldn’t if you were in a fictional cyberpunk world either. You’d have to steal the equipment, or blackmail, or whatever. This still is for the elite in those stories, which it is here as well. There’s trickle down availability, which happens here too. The point is, we are there, at the beginning. Things will only get worse, or as you see them because you are stupid, better.

Well, when you put it like that, cyberpunk sounds like the gayest thing ever.

I don't know your mom's address.

What a cancerous picture. Let me guess, ResetEra made it?

But I've won it, should you mail it to me?

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Well he chopped his dick off too.

Ok, 99 to go then.

In a way, I guess everyone seems too satisfied with the shithole night city is suposed to be. Nobody should be happy, but it looks like an upbeat, cool badass, YOLO kind of people.

cyberpunk is blade runner which is science noir, if it doesn't look and/or sound like bladerunner it isnt cyberpunk

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Noir is a key element here. This game doesn't look noir at all.

Trick question, the idea of captcha itself is cyberpunk

I mean cyberpunk as a genre/concept not 2077

iRobot doesn't qualify. The only low life portions I can remember are Will Smith getting his gasoline motorcycle out of a garage to avoid getting his vehicle hacked, and the robots being decommissioned in a scrap yard that looked pretty shit. Everyone had a fairly high standard of living with robot servants for basically free iirc.

Please tell me that's a full fledged work and not just someone's throw-away gag.

>Shadowrun
>Transmetrrooplitan
And that's about it. That's the only actual Cyberpunk entries I see here. Unless the Nu-Deus Ex one is supposed to referr to all of the Deus Ex games.

I mostly made it as a dumb meme because every one of those was listed as cyberpunk by dummies in the first threads where people were bitching about 2077 not looking cyberpunk enough

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>Megacorps literally becoming like nations and forcing people to use their own script
>Unrestrained capitalism
Are nations that too?

Fair enough, I don't understand anons that would unironically qualify most of these as Cyberpunk, I see what you mean though, I saw a lot of these anons complain about the game solely from an aesthetical point of view and comparing it to sci-fi movies/games rather than actual Cyberpunk media, especially since half of them are just transhumanists dystopias/fiction. Either way, I am gonna save this so I can use it against redditors that have no idea how Cyberpunk works.

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cyberpunk is based in the fallacy that corporations would choosingly waste billions on politics and lobbying instead of being forced to by the government

Cyberpunk 2077 covers all of those themes

I find the debate about what constitutes "true" cyberpunk exceedingly uninteresting. I like cyberpunk and cyberpunk-adjacent works in the broadest sense and I see no benefit to narrowing it down to a very specific list of criteria. Trying to conform to a genre for the sake of conforming stifles creativity and leads to stagnation.

>and I see no benefit to narrowing it down to a very specific list of criteria.
Then butt the fuck out of the conversation for the people who do give a fuck, because you're making it harder for them to find what they want because you don't care.

based

"I don't give a fuck and neither should you" is a valid position to take in any argument.

It's not. Its basically you screaming "LOOK HOW NEUTROLL I AM!" and adding nothing to the conversation.

calm down centrist some people actually have principles

The debate is silly and you're wasting your time discussing something that fundamentally has no real answer. You're potentially ignoring good vidya because of an arbitrary line you drew. It's asinine.

They're all cyberpunk except iRobot. iRobots is just sci-fi where shit hits the fan. The rest are about futuristic societies with a lot of lo-life elements.

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Cyberpunk IS cool future. Anybody looking for more than that can dilate til the heat death

Judge Dredd is not cyberpunk

>The debate is silly
Then

Wtf the basedjack spammer is right for once unbelievable.

Pathetic. Punk is about DIY ethic, self reliance and mutual skillshare to cut out big business and authoritarians.
Fat dyed hair spastics do nothing for themselves, stand for nothing substantial and have nothing to teach anybody.

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No, I will not, because you people are shitting up vidya discussion with this bullshit no one should care about. It's like if I go into a Smash thread and everyone is talking about what constitutes a "true" fighting game all the time and no one is actually talking about playing the damn game, and yet they insist that they're having a very important discussion about the game and see no reason why anyone who is interested in the game would want to talk about anything else.

I will bet you any amount of money this sewer creature cannot code.

How? It's about a high tech society that is drowning in poverty and violent crime.

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Because just saying ''HIGH TECH/LOW LiFE LOL" doesn't make everything that has those things cyberpunk.

Read the OP retard this is about 2077 being cyperpunk or not and we're saying its not cyperpunk. Sorry you can't confront reality and are scared about objective definitions.

>Falangists grumbled when Franco came into Power.
>Both Mussolini and Hitler toyed with the idea of kicking Franco out to put a proper Fascist in Power, with the help of the above hardliners.
>Literally implemented policies that were wanted by the people seeking to testore Spain to the 1730s
>"Lol Franco was a Fascist".

And Economy that works on War plundering other countries isn't an efficient economy period.

Layers of irony are the exact reason for why this Place Is non-fumctional.

>because you people are shitting up vidya discussion with this bullshit no one should care about.
Right, and you're the overlord who gets to decide what people do and do not care about despite stating several times you have no stake in the race and more than likely have no insight or research on the topic, least of all to match the people who care. I don't mind if you don't have an opinion on a topic, but scum like you who try to force other people to stop caring about things they care about are lower than shit.

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Ain't very cyber and shits on punk.

Okay. Why don't you provide a definition instead of trying to get people to guess what your special snowflake criteria is?

>ain't very cyber
You haven't read Dredd.

>shits on punk
The main character being a punk is not a requirement for something to be cyberpunk. Dredd is a police officer in a cyberpunk universe.

>This Cyberpunk universe is different from the one I liiiike!!!!

Jesus Christ you fuckers are obnoxious retards who are only focusing on aesthetic

And the aesthetic is still good. God fuck yourself

There is no objective definition.
>Right, and you're the overlord who gets to decide what people do and do not care about
Just like all of you are trying to be the overlord of what is and is not cyberpunk?
>despite stating several times you have no stake in the race
I just told you my stake. I'd prefer more fruitful discussion than this endless arguing in circles about opinions.
>and more than likely have no insight or research on the topic
Probably more than half you shitters ignorantly but confidently proclaiming this or that is "true" cyberpunk.

Now stop trying to force me to stop caring about a game because it fails to meet someone's arbitrary and subjective definition.

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Yeah, I'm not playing that game. Judge Dredd is just dystopian sci-fi, not cyberpunk.

HL2 is dystopian sci-fi. Dredd is cyberpunk.

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>high tech society that is drowning in poverty and violent crime.
>futuristic societies with a lot of lo-life elements.
I love the cyberpunk movie Guardians of the Galaxy

excuse me guys i now well my cyberpunk and in my opinion dredd is cyberpunk and half life is not, too little neon if you ask me to be honest

>Just like all of you are trying to be the overlord of what is and is not cyberpunk?
>Group of people come together and decide on a bunch of elements they like together and coin a term so that they can easily reference it and find more of what they like
>F-F-F-FUCK YOU GUYS! AS AN OUTSIDER, I SHOULD JUST SAY WHATEVER I LIKE IS CYBERPUNK AND YOU GUYS ARE NERDS WHO CARE TOO MUCH!
This is you and this is why you're disgusting as a human. Just get out of here.

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Yeah, nah. Judge Dredd is the same. Sometimes pre but mostly post-apocalyptic dystopian sci-fi.

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>leftist takes on cyberpunk
the GitS anime seasons, which is the best the genre has produced, had no real anti-capitalist subtext.

>There is no objective definition.
In the same way as literally every word is just made up by humans, yea. We have dictionaries tho.
Dictionaries even support the idea of Cyberpunk being cyberpunk, so i have no idea why you went with this retarded argument.

>Group of people come together and decide on a bunch of elements they like together and coin a term so that they can easily reference it and find more of what they like
No, see, this is the sort of thing I'm all for. But you're not doing that. You're all coming together and trying to come up with an approved list of things to like and telling people with different lists that they are wrong to like the stuff on their list that doesn't appear in your list. If you like cyberpunk, of course you'll like Blade Runner, and Judge Dredd, and whatever else people are trying to exclude here. Because it ticks a lot of the boxes. But oh, it's not "true" cyberpunk so we better endlessly debate that instead of talking about the things we like.

Genres aren't black and white. Things can be cyberpunk in different ways and to varying degrees. It doesn't make them "not cyberpunk".

Why do you leftist shill have to shit up these threads?
>cyberpunk is about socialism, limiting birthrates and carbon taxes
kys

>Dictionaries even support the idea of Cyberpunk being cyberpunk, so i have no idea why you went with this retarded argument.
Probably because you're an idiot who's trying to put words in my mouth.

>No, see, this is the sort of thing I'm all for. But you're not doing that.
I'm not doing that because we as humanity already came together and did that in the 1980s when the genre was invented, you mongoloid.

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any game properly reflecting the cyberpunk dystopia would be REEEEEEED out of the room because of "muh politics in muh videogames"
/pol/cels were a mistake, they're nothing but trash

Imagine being this stupid. Cyberpunk isn't about shilling for a nanny state.

So "cyberpunk" means "Neuromancer rip-off". Got it.

Which parts do they absolutely have to rip off though and which ones can they change?

yes user, corporations are cool
where's my cyberwaifu? XD

I even quoted the exact words there and you are still in denial.

based reply. OP BTFO

God, you're a fucking moron.

What do you think I am trying to argue here?

So what games can we all agree are cyberpunk?

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This.

gits explicitly deals with things in that image, government corruption and politics are a huge focus of the series

very few people would say that. It'd only be an issue if they forced modern politics into it by having shit like
>orange man
>not-steam and their evil 33% cut
>transhumanism is centered entirely on gender and barely mentions the implications of replacing your brain with a machine

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What there's no definition and there's no point in having arguments? But there is and there is.

>black and white thinking
You have a simple mind. Anyway, in cyberpunk, corporations are what made the wondrous tech possible. They're never all bad. And I don't remember any class warfare subtext from stuff like deus ex and gits. I have no idea where what kind of cybershit you're reading.

Season 1 of GiTs was about corporations suppressing the cure for a deadly disease in order to profit from just treating the symptoms.

>government corruption and politics are a huge focus of the series
How is that anti-capitalist, you brainlet? Almost all the bad guys in that series take advantage of the immense government power. It's anti-socialist, more than anything.

The word "cyber" in the term "cyberpunk" comes from the field of cyberneticks, a relatively new discipline most importantly defined by Von Neumann. It comes from greek, "cybernḗtēs", which means (competent) governer or leadership (also steersman), but what it ACTUALLY means in the modern notion of cybernetics is SELF-GOVERNMENT or SELF REGULATION.
Cybernetics is the study of self-regulated systems. It studies recursive mathematics (which are the core of modern IT technologies), complex feedback loops, efficient, internally imposed organization and regulation.
While all of these subjects are at the core of modern IT technologies, it's not what cybernetics are and ever were about. They are about studying how systems can be made adaptative and reactive due to their internal organization.

The genre of cyberpunk builds on this notion: self-regulation and self-determination. Transcendence and transhumanism are what makes cyberpunk cyberpunk: the idea that humans, by gaining tools (usually, but not necessarily technology) to outgrow the physical limitations imposed by their physiology and "nature", are becoming finally self-determining and self-regulating. It speculates what such freedom could do to us, and whenever we are ready for it.

The second most influential inspiration aside from Cybernetics to Cyberpunk is Nietsche, and most notably his idea of death of God and birth of Ubermensch: the idea that we have outgrown externally imposed morality and now have to take FULL responsibility over who will we become. And much like Nietsche, Cyberpunk generally does not tend to be convinced such freedom is something we are capable of having.

THAT is what Cyberpunk is about. About transcending limitations externally imposed on humanity (by "nature") and about ramifications that such freedom and responsibility may have for us.

There. Now you all know. You have no excuse for being dumb anymore. You can all go home.

Okay, tell me the dictionary definition of cyberpunk.

>corporations were the bad guys in the first season
No, the biotech company that produced the nano-bot vaccine were forced to play their part due to government influence. Watch it again.

>I don't remember any class warfare subtext from stuff like deus ex
It's literally about the 1% secretly controlling everyone's lives through backstabbing and deceit. What, everyone remembers "do you have a single fact to back that up" but not the reply to it?

lol user

Number one: That's terror

>What, everyone remembers "do you have a single fact to back that up" but not the reply to it?
Did this make sense in your head?
>evil 1%
Like I've said, the main villains in both season are government officials. That's anti-socialism.

>class warfare subtext from stuff like deus ex and gits
Only people that were deemed "vital to social order" were given Ambrosia in Deus Ex
>oh the corporations were only willingly complacent to the evil they were a part of so they were really good guys

>How is that anti-capitalist?
>first story arc of gits:sac is literally about discovering an inexpensive cure to a rampant disease that's being hidden by corporate interests
wow cool future

That's cool but it's bullshit unfortunately

>non-argument
Yes, you're an idiot that can't remember the most basic aspects of plots.
>corporations were complicit
That's a very dishonest take. They were blackmailed.

merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cyberpunk
It's easy to understand and says all you need to know.

>Did this make sense in your head?
Did you play the game? Or do you just know the memes?
>Like I've said, the main villains in both season are government officials. That's anti-socialism.
God damn retarded Americans

>They were blackmailed.
Yes, blackmailed with all that money they were making.

>to a rampant disease that's being hidden by corporate interests
Do you commies never stop lying? The company never gained anything. They were forced to participate. It was all government.

Of course it's not an argument, I'm laughing at you.

>So "cyberpunk" means "Neuromancer rip-off". Got it.
I mean, you said this to be dismissive and sarcastic, but you're actually not that wrong unironically. This is why cyberpunk is a niche sub-genre of a sub-genre of it's overarching genre of scifi and not something like a science-fantasy like Star Wars is in its own little pocket genre.

>Which parts do they absolutely have to rip off though and which ones can they change?
britannica.com/art/cyberpunk
whatis.techtarget.com/definition/cyberpunk

Short answer:
>Cultural themes relating to anti-government, anti-corporation, and possibly anti-capitalism, aka the "punk" movement
>Transhumanism and the loss of humanity in general
>Cyberspace or cybernetics playing a large role

Why do all leftshits think they have 40 extra iq? You're wrong, you retard.
>incredibly wrong
>someone points that out
>haha i'm so cool
No matter what your gender studies teacher told you, you don't have a brain.

What is this?

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>The company never gained anything.
Except for the money they gained by doing it, of course.

user, I'm not here to "debate" you or anything, sometimes people on the internet are just there to call you an idiot and move on. No need to dwell on it or respond.

>science fiction dealing with future urban societies dominated by computer technology
Damn son, that's really specific. Do you think someone who has never heard of cyberpunk before would have an accurate understanding of the genre just by reading this definition? It's not wrong. It just barely tells you anything. And yet, anything more specific than this would surely run afoul of the self-appointed guardians of the genre for excluding or including this or that when it shouldn't.

They were never willing participants, and gained nothing by switching to an inferior product. Watch it again. They were not the villains of the story. You're deluded idiots.

Besides your high school teachers, who managed to convince you that you have a brain? Your mom? They sure did a good job. 80 iq commies like you really are cancer.

As if you know how to argue any other way than calling people dumb commies like a true American.

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Go back to resetera. noone wants you here.

They literally had a profit motive, that's why they only sold the vaccine CEOs and celebrities.

Again, they already had a superior product. They gained nothing by the switch to nano-bots.

>They were never willing participants, and gained nothing by switching to an inferior product.
Except all the money from not curing the disease by selling more of the micromachine cure. This is a central plot you dummy, that's why he kidnapped the company owner and not just a government official. How do you not understand a central plot of this?

Nobody here has played Deus Ex. Why play it when you can endlessly repost memes about it instead?

Dog of Dracula 2

>They gained nothing by the switch to nano-bots.
They sold it for more money user, that's what they gained. More money.

>Except all the money from not curing the disease by selling more of the micromachine cure.
They already had a vaccine that worked. How many times do I have to say this? Damn. You're dumb. The nano-bots approach wasn't mature science yet, and they never would have switched to it without outside involvement.
> that's why he kidnapped the company owner and not just a government official
The company owner had no real power: He was wholly in the hands of the goverment, under hourse arrest, to keept secrets.

Masamune even did an interview where he said unrestrainted capitalism was bad and it needed to be controlled. I dunno why this guy's obsessed with thinking GiTS is some pro-capitalist work instead of actual cyberpunk.

>Interviewer: Do you think mankind will be able to cope with all the new technologies in the future?

>Shirow: I hope so. We all need to try to make sure that happens. If we do want technology to be useful for all mankind in the future, though, we'll need to do something about the growing gap between the rich and the poor. We'll probably need to create some sort of compassionate capitalism that has more social guarantees built into it, or else the worst part of capitalism-- where the strong always triumph over the weak and the income gap widens-- will just get worse.

Any proof of that claim? You can literally look up the history of cybernetics online.
As for influences of Nietsche, go read interviews with Sterling, or just read Petra that I've recommended earlier.

Do you have any more substantial counter-arguments than "that is bullshit, durrr"?

The PSX GitS game is excellent