The bad guy was actually the good guy all along

It was more like suicide and you were his rope

Except that if you understand the metaphysics as presented in the games lore, all the souls that exist now are merely shards of the original race, the Ascians, and when all the shards of existence are rejoined and the world made whole again, so too will the souls be remade into what they were. All Emet-selch is attempting to do is to return things to their original, pure form before existence was shattered by Hydaelyn. If restoring things to their original, complete whole requires destroying the mockery that's been put into its place, why would you even have a moments hesitation in doing it? As presented Emet-selch is objectively right.

Joining Emet means bringing back a world that is currently broken and making it whole again. Ascians control creation magic and would be able to re-create a world of peace, prosperity, and perfection. There is literally no downside in joining Emet, as the Warrior of Light/Darkness themselves would ascend as an Ascian and become literally a God, recreating reality. Not joining him is bumfucking retarded.

Shut up Emet

Amen

Attached: Kael_thas.jpg (702x937, 764K)

Can the world actually be recreated? The thirteenth reflection is completely fucked and was made useless. Isn't that piece kinda missing in that case?

How is it fucked? It's just merged back into the Source. As more and more worlds get taken over, they merge back with the Source and then at last the whole world will be complete once again.

Thirteenth is Void. No rejoining made for it, as it's completely useless now.

13th shard is World of darkness, it didnt get merged

It is impossible to justify siding against Emet-selch logically. Thus your pathetic response. Imagine a world where suddenly everyone had half the current lifespan, half their current physical and mental capacity, and this had happened due to metaphysical interference from an entity that your people had created and was now blindly and unknowingly worshiped as a creator deity by the wretched things not even knowing what they had lost, or what they once were.

And of course it's actually much worse than that, since what was lost was not merely half the physical capacity, lifespan (Ascians were virtually immortal) and mental capacity, it was more like 80-90%. What a disgusting mockery of life that would be, an outright lie and an insult, to anyone who had seen what had gone before and what had been lost. Emet-selch is honestly a hero, as written.

Yes. The other six worlds actually DID rejoin the Source (which means, also, that the lifespans and magical abilities were probably even more of a joke than they are now compared to the Ascians). The 13th was the Ascians first attempt and they didn't balance it out right so the world was lost. The other six worlds they successfully rejoined to the Source.

You're completely ignoring the genocide part. Yea, shit happened and now the original is fractured. But on those fractures new life began. That new life doesn't want to die. Emet's view that anything that isn't the original is not life is a very flawed and narrow view of life.

Good point. I don't know, it sounds like a plot hole to me

user. If you had realized life in Eorzea if you're not a demigod is fucking horrible. Look what happened to Eda for example.

Classic is actually going to kill xiv. That's fucking depressing.

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No, just a black hole.

every WoW expansion except Cata has at least one raid where the villains are in the right
also Far Cry 4 if you don't count the joke ending that locks you out of actually doing the story

>genocide
Imagine being an immortal entity whose lifespan is literally infinite and has lived for thousands of millennia. Then imagine looking at these insects that literally appear on the world and then die again in less time it takes you to snap your finger (scale-wise). It's not genocide per se, it's bringing back immortality as the status quo for life in the universe. Those who survive the merging become new immortal gods, those who don't would've died anyway due to old age, and new life will be created in their stead as immortal beings.

There's literally no downside, all life is bound to die anyway, who cares if they die now or in a few years?

>joining Emet means the story just fucking ends
Just unsubscribe for the same effect then

It's not flawed at all, it's correct. Again, try to imagine a world where this happened, and people had crippled mental abilities, physical capacity, and massively shortened lifespans compared to what had gone before. And this didn't naturally happen, it was the violent actions of a powerful being your people had created which had caused this to happen. Do you really think you would just shrug your shoulders and accept this absolute abomination and travesty as "new life"?

It's not "new life" it's a warped shattering of the true life that went before it, and all the Ascians are trying to do is put the pieces back together. Furthermore, all of the people that are going to die in the rejoining, are going to die anyway at some point. At least in this way their death actually allows their souls to merge back into their true forms and regain a real existence, a real life, rather than the shallow mockery of it that Hydaelyn has inflicted on existence.

Fable 3

Except that's false. Anyone with the ECHO are fractured souls of the original Ascian people. The people without the echo are new souls who were born from the lifestream after the Ascian's sacrificed 75% of their population to save the planet from their calamity. The original plan before a contingent of Ascians rebelled were to basically harvest up the new souls and use them as more fuel for Zodiark to return the old souls.

So if you were to work with Emet and let him win, sure. You the Warrior of Light would be fine, because you are an original soul. But anyone from any of the shards, and all your cool echo-less scion friends are fucked.

Remember, if the remaining 25% of the Ascians that survived the calamity were able to just fucking chill and move on then Hydaelyn would have never been summoned in the first place. They would have continued to live on as stewards of the planet watching over the new souls and trying to make sure whatever terminus shit doesn't happen again.
It's cool to like Emet and find him sympathetic, but he's not right in any capacity.

Wow villains are almost all laughabley 1 dimensional.

and? That has nothing to do with what I said

It's only logical for someone who lacks empathy.
As you said, it's gone and lost. As
said, a complete rejoining is impossible anyways.
Yes and all those people that you saved in the first are now horrified that they have to keep on living. Shit can suck but that doesn't mean you just stop living, no different in real life (for most people anyways).
For an immortal being he sure died like a mortal insect. I understand his perspective, you just discard the opposing perspective entirely.

Don't get me wrong, from a story writing perspective, I'd love the rejoining to happen, a catastrophe even worse than the one that resulted in ARR, have the WoL and friends face despair and actually fucking FAIL for once. The stories that follow, coming back from decisive defeat, would be amazing.

>all powerful race
>representatives job repeatedly to catgirls in bikinis
I don't think so, Tim.
Also the whole "dude they are so much cooler and better than us" chant suspiciously has the same tune as weeaboos gushing over something they will never be a part of. Pretty cringy really.

You still aren't addressing why it's better to have what is a complete mockery and abomination of the existence the Ascians had. Yes, those people will die, so what? They're going to die anyway, since they all have such short lifespans, pretty quickly in fact. What's wrong with ending their existence to secure a much better existence, especially since it is the original, true existence before the warped parody Hydaelyn created was put into place?

There's only a few Ascians left and they still managed to merge six worlds back into the Source. The only reason you can destroy them is because you are being empowered by the demon goddess that destroyed reality to begin with.

He didn't die though, he got trapped in the crystal thingy. Very different.

It's unsurprising that sociopathic social rejects usually playing MMOs would find Hades' argument compelling.

good fuck xiv trannies they'll kill themselves before the game is finished anyway

for a month than xiv will add content nobodies played while classic struggles to keep a 10k playerbase when all the content is dry

Because you don't just kill people. You said it yourself, you're ending the existence of the others, literally killing them, so they wouldn't even get that "better existence".
In your opinion is it ok to kill someone with a terminal illness, because he'll die anyways, even though he doesn't want to?

>Yea Forums actually discussing morality in a game
meanwhile in /vg/

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youtube.com/watch?v=ruYc5s4RwX4

Vayne was right the entire game, and the game doesn't even deny this. His goal was literally the same as the protagonists.

they don't call it tranny fantasy for no reason user

/vg/ is tranny haven
just ugly men whoring out ugly ocs

Because Emet isn't trying to do that. Emet is trying to bring back his dead people, his dead people who willingly died in order to save the planet. This "mockery" didnt happen right after Zodiark removed the Terminus. This sundering happened because part of the remaining Ascians wanted to deny the new souls being born in the still unsundered world their right to inherit the earth so they could bring back their dead people. Those new souls being born who would have been soul cattle to fuel Zodiark even more weren't the sundered souls they are now, they were also unsundered people who were just as deserving to inherit the earth as the Ascians were.

You can't ignore the undeniable fact that the reason the world got sundered in the first place because the Ascian's could no agree on what is the right and ethical thing to do following their calamity. Your entire argument that it's ok to genocide them NOW because they are sundered falls apart when you remember the fact that the only reason they are sundered was because Zodiark was trying to will the Ascians into murdering them even before they were sundered to begin with.

If killing said person, or even millions of said persons, would guarantee an existence of immortality, without death, sickness, and indeed the very illness that's killing the person in your hypothetical example, for all future generations, yes, in a heartbeat. I can't understand why you think this is a hard issue, death is a part of life, if a certain death serves the better interests of the whole, then you should actively seek to institute it.

>Because you don't just kill people.
>In your opinion is it ok to kill someone with a terminal illness, because he'll die anyways, even though he doesn't want to?
You see, you're using a logical fallacy here. You're applying real life morality to a fictional universe where magic and immortality (literally) exists.
In our world, I wouldn't say that it'd be fair to kill someone with a terminal illness because "he's gonna die anyway" (spoiler: we all have terminal illnesses, user). However, even in real life if ending someone's life early would signify lengthening a lot of other people's lives, it would be a better question to put up to debate.
Now, in FFXIV's universe, it's even more poignant because you're trading the short life of some people with eternal life of some other people(and re-creation of a perfect universe, don't forget that).
It's a *much* different question than how you phrased it.

Real life morality, that also applies to the game.
If it didn't apply to the game, by your logic, people wouldn't fight the ascians.
But people fight the ascians.

>that also applies to the game
No, it does not. This is literally why we are debating this.
>If it didn't apply to the game, by your logic, people wouldn't fight the ascians.
>But people fight the ascians.
That's because people don't want to die and/or they have incomplete information about what is going on. From *their* point of view, they don't want to die, obviously. From our point of view, we can obviously see the overarching theme and can have a much more complete moral perspective.

It was fine to genocide them then, too. Are you not understanding that? There is nothing wrong with sacrificing people for a greater cause or greater goal. The entire reason the sundering happened is because of selfish Ascians who were unwilling to honor the sacrifice of the people who were the only reason they were still alive. And in so doing they summoned another Primal who seized control of all of creation and turned mortal existence into a mockery of what it had once been.

If I am part of some sacrifice then it's undeniably wrong sweaty

Alright Elibidus that's enough. Don't make me get the katanas.

Emet's logic falls apart the minute an entire cabal of them lose consistently to literally 1(One) half of a real person.

>Paps thread
Why do you like these ugly ass male characters, you brain damaged faggot.

two halves

>However, even in real life if ending someone's life early would signify lengthening a lot of other people's lives, it would be a better question to put up to debate.
I'm sure many people would agree that killing a mass murderer, who will never stop killing unless killed himself, is acceptable but killing a random guy who is just going about his life because it would somehow save two people, is not.
I agree that technically existence before the fracture was qualitatively better. However, the sacrifice necessary to return to that is too great to go through with. Even half of the remaining ascians thought so, which is how Hydaelyn happened.

*ahem*
FUCK SUNDERED SHARDS
FUCK FRAGMENTED SOULS
FUCK HYDAELYN
BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY, FUCK CATBOIS

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That has already been addressed. The only reason the protagonist can win is because he is empowered by the very Primal that rent reality asunder to begin with.

One living half, one dead half.

>I'm sure many people would agree that killing a mass murderer, who will never stop killing unless killed himself, is acceptable but killing a random guy who is just going about his life because it would somehow save two people, is not.
Which is why I said it's up to debate, not that it's right or wrong objectively.
>Even half of the remaining ascians thought so, which is how Hydaelyn happened.
That is not what happened

>Have the stronger primal
>Still lose
Ascians are jobbers

>Emet-Selch literally named for the angel of truth
>Implying he ever tells a single lie

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I seriously liked Emet but fuck did he feel like an afterthought and a shoved in FFXIV version of Ardyn. Like, Yoshi thought "damn, I like Ardyn, lets make our own Ardyn right now".

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>stronger primal
Retard, Zodiark was summoned with the wish to fix the laws of reality and save the universe. Hydingdong was summoned with the sole purpose of fucking Zodiark up. Regardless of their overall strength, one is literally designed as a weapon to destroy the other.

My memory might be fuzzy but I remember that after Zodiark saved the planet, the ascians wanted to sacrifice whatever non ascian life was left, to bring back the ascians who sacrificed themselves to create Zodiark. Some ascians thought that there was enough sacrifice already and life should just go on and created Hydaelyn to oppose that plan.

>Ascians were solely responsible for the destruction of their world and their entire race
>"B-But muh Ascian master race!!"

Emet Selch was a great villain but you'd be stupid to think he wasn't heavily biased and not as benevolent and righteous as he implies he is.

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Except that you're using a fallacious argument. A better example would be, is it wrong in war, if you have to send millions of men to their deaths (and kill millions of the enemy) to achieve victory? You can only really answer that question if you know what the war is being fought over, and if death on that scale is worth the better world you are fighting to preserve, or create. In Emets case he is fighting to restore a much, much better existence and repair the damage wrought to reality by Hydaelyn. Given that scale, it is absolutely correct for him to be willing to sacrifice as many lives as it takes to win.

They were also responsible for the creation of the world so your point is kinda moot

>three tanks
>2 tanks of the same class
>1 caster, 1 ranged physical DPS, 1 healer
Pfft, these faggots can't into PT comps. I wish I had friends like them ;_;

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Which is honestly one of the big points against them. How noble of them to consign their better members, the ones who actually HAD sacrificed their lives to save everyone, as unworthy of saving in return. Disgusting.

It's implied in the Class quest line that the Ascian's wanted to utilize the Flood of light in The First to restore balance to the Thirteenth so that they all can be properly rejoined.
That's why Emet helping the WoDs prevent The First being consumed was in his best interest.

That being said there's no telling that Emet's grand scheme would actually work guaranteed, nor can anyone know if this magnificent perfect world he wants to restore wouldn't destroy itself like it already did.

There's a reason as to why some anons prefer to discuss the game on Yea Forums rather than /vg/

dhaos is literally the only character that I can think of that embodies this.

I haven't played FFXV, are you telling me this hobo with designer clothes is interesting? I might pick it up then

No because there IS no ideal master race world that Emet Selch is supposedly striving for if they're retarded enough to blow up the planet.
He just wants to bring his people back, it's not as noble as it looks on the surface.

He's incredibly based, a keikakuman and did nothing wrong.

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>tfw you just finished all the role quests
Cylva a cute

I think he's pretty great but quite a few think he's pretty shit

At least Emet didn’t wear a fedora

I feel the opposite.

Ardyn was flawed because all of the cut content made trying to make him sympathetic seem forced. He was a good villain but that's all he amounted to in vanilla FFXV. The game was also forced to revolve around him which worked to an extent but meant the Nilfheim and other aspects of the plot ended up an afterthought to avoid diluting the focus on him.

Emet was actually well balanced and while he does fuck you over, it's just because you didn't meet his expectations rather than any mustache twirling. He also saves Ysh'tola without it really benefiting him and while you aren't supposed to agree with his cause, he's just doing what you would do in his position and the whole Amaurot sequence does a really good job of showing that (plus it's pretty damn kino). He isn't too overbearing either like Ardyn was either and the whole suicide by WOL was less hamfisted.

FFXV is a terrible terrible terrible trainwreck of a game. Please don't give Square any more sales, don't play that garbage. Trust me.

>Aizen
I love keikakumans, I'll get it on the next steam sale

>Creation magic is obviously a fucking stupid idea since they can't keep their subconscious from messing with it
>Keep doing it anyway and base your entire civilization around it
The ascians deserved everything they got.

>He also saves Ysh'tola without it really benefiting him
Pretty sure it's just for good boy points with the scions

It's pretty good

>we think that these things are lesser than us: that means it's okay if we kill them all!

That's their exact logic, and luckily about half of them disagreed.

You have to play through the entire storyline, including the garbage that is ARR and Stormblood, dozens upon dozens of hours of trash, to get to him. Just youtube the storyline and save yourself the pain.

This
the Ascians had their shot at living and they were the only reason they went borderline extinct

The ascians mostly acknowledge this though and it's why even the less fanatical ones like Emet want Zodiark back as well as their world.

>reading comprehension
I was asking about XV, not XIV. ARR is slow but serviceable and Stormblood's main flaws are not being as good as Heavensward and Lyse being a retard.

The idea is good, the actual game is not. The narrative doesn't hold, it's literally incomplete as a story, there's missing content that you need to watch the movie + anime + read the books (lmao) to understand, there's recycled scenes (from the trailer) put at random in just because "they look cool", there's missing DLC that got canned because the game itself was a trainwreck, there's shitty assassin's creed and other "limited time event" bullshit, collect-a-thon boring gameplay, sidequests that are just there to waste your time, latter half of the story is absolutely pointless.
There is a reason why Tabata was fired because of it and Square itself decided it was a failure of a game. There's absolutely zero ways anyone could ever defend that game aside maybe for the graphics that are kinda okay

No, their logic was that half of their people nobly sacrificed themselves to save all life on the planet, so let's take these lesser creatures (who wouldn't even be alive to begin with without that sacrifice) and use them to bring them back to life. Because they earned it. And then the selfish cunts who summoned Hydaelyn came along and said no, it's not important to pay back blood debts, what's important is keeping our hands clean, because our feelings are more important than the lives of those who sacrificed themselves to save us.

I think it's more about how the Ascians aren't this infallible "objectively correct" race as some in this thread would imply. Them being a bit selfish is a notable part of their characterization

>ranged dps role quest
>music changes
>friends rush to your aid
pretty goat

JUST ONE MORE BIG CALAMITY, WARRIOR OF LIGHT, AND WE ALL GO BACK TO AMAUROTAHITI. WE ARE SO CLOSE TO BEING WHOLE AGAIN. I HAVE PLAN, JUST HAVE FAITH.

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ARR is pretty clunky and bad. Stormblood is outright trash, what part of any of it was good? Every story thread in the entire expansion was garbage, except arguably the Omega/Alpha raid section. The main story in particular was trash, Lyse is super fucking annoying, yeah, but Hien and the rest of the Domans are just dull and boring. And their storyline plus Lyse is pretty much the entire main story. Stormblood is absolute trash.

>The narrative doesn't hold, it's literally incomplete as a story
While the rushed pacing is a bit jarring in some parts of the game, the core story definitely still holds and isn't incomplete.
>here's missing content that you need to watch the movie + anime + read the books (lmao) to understand,
Most of these are supplemental and it is genuinely baffling that you'd say you have to watch/read all of these to understand the story.
I get that it was a huge disappointment to a lot of people but please don't hyperbolize if you want to come across as if you're trying to genuinely criticize the game.

>Says he has lived for a million years
>Only got 7 rejoinings
lmaoing @ his life

Zoditards: Our people did the noble thing... now lets just treat that which comes after us like cattle to keep going.

Hydachads: No, we've had our time in the sun; we should let that which follows us live.

For him, yes. But for people to want him to succeed is stupid, which is how this whole thing started.

He would have 8 by now but Igeyorhm fucked up and voided the entire 13th.

So basically the Hydaelyn faction wanted to suicide their whole race, spitting in the face of the sacrifice of their people, and the Zodiark faction wanted to continue to struggle to survive and prevail? Yeah, sounds about right.

>killed themselves and the world 14 times over because of your imagination power
>let's recruit an autist who larps about taking Ultima in the face without a shield and conjured up everything in Eden
What could possibly go wrong

And dont forget the endless cycle of sacrifices to Zodiark

Emmet literally tries killing you and would not have hesitated at any point. why is Yea Forums always siding with people that would wipe the floor with their lardasses? what is this fucking cuck instinct that attracts them to supporting ideals where they’re as good as cattle?
>b-but muh angel of truth muh true life form
he doesnt lie that doesnt mean he wont keep information from you. enjoy having your ascian daddy take a dump steamy dump on your chest when zodiark is back and destroys hydaelin together with you. honestly how fucking naive are you to actually believe any ascian would want hidaelin’s chosen one to live in the new world?

No, what they wanted was for the sacrifices to stop. They recognised that there's more to the world than just them.

If you can't see the futility in constantly throwing lives and aether at every problem hoping it'll eventually go away instead of accepting that your time is over then you're insane. Things happen, life moves on, so must you.

>tfw Cylva puts on her full regalia to try and suicide via WoL
>afterwards she reveals that she’s out of shape and merely wearing armor makes her sore
>tfw you could have also defeated her by pushing her over repeatedly

I never had any doubt that was exactly how it would go down and yet it was still a wonderful moment.

how do I kill titan savage

>the main events of the game happen away from the main characters (literally)
>player couldn't and shouldn't give less fucks about Lunafreya and yet we're supposed to feel bad about her death
>literally huge chunks of the game are hearing stories about what happened in the movie/books/anime because "lol you weren't there,sucks to be you prince"
>absolutely 0 relationship exposure between Noctis and his dad
>party members disappear and leave the party for a while and then come back after having had a grand adventure on their own and "lol buy the DLC if you want to see that ;)"
>all the important boss battles are literally holding down a button for the entire duration of the fight until the boss is dead
I could go on for hours, this game is an absolute catastrophe and will make you hate yourself for playing it

Why? We're outside observers. We have no skin in the game, as it were. From our perspective why wouldn't we want Emet to win? His victory is objectively better when all is said and done, as existence would return to a much better state. It's only logical to support him from an observers perspective. Ultimately, of course, as Emet himself noted, all that really matters is who wins and who loses. Morality fades into insignificance in a real struggle, since all that really matters is who's stronger and who's weaker. Hydaelyn is a perverse abomination and so is the reality she created, but if she and her champion are more powerful than the Ascians attempt at paradise, the perverse abomination is the existence you're going to get.

Parts of the game are really cool tho. I just replayed it and it made me realize how good the game could have been. Its just that fundamental parts of the game suck so much that its barely salvagable and no patch or even addon can save it. It literally starts with the entire overworld and ends with the clusterfuck of a story you already mentioned.

The cast was pretty likable though, parts of the soundtrack where good, the summons look fucking great, the battlesystem may be simple but its fun as fuck to teleport around and go full anime with the armiger mode. Also Insomnia had potential of a really fucking cool town and we never got to explore it while it was still intact, which is a fucking shame. Instead we got literal shitholes like Lestallum and tons of fucking gas stations. Its such a shame so much potential was wasted.

Attached: Insomnia-Sunrise-FFXV.png (1920x1080, 2.42M)

Giving in to the death of your people isn't moving on, it's giving up and killing yourself. That's not enlightened it's suicidal.

>tfw you'll never massage her after a day's work

Fuck you, I liked it.

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What do you do in this current event? Is there anything interesting?

>hey 3/4ts of us sacrificed themselves to get the world stable and there's like 1/4 of us left now, but we can keep going on as the custodians of the star
>MORE SACRIFICES, WE JUST HAVE TO WAIT UNTIL THERE'S ENOUGH LIFE THEN DO IT AGAIN!
>...

Wymyn I swear, even if they're a superior they can't do jack shit. No wonder men becomes trannies, as an insult. Men can be a better women. That said I'm okay with her having more screentime, but alas.

>I liked it
>posts a webm of something that is not FFXV
Yeah I can see you liked the multiplayer DLC, that was somewhat enjoyable also because the got FFXIV devs to work on it, but it's not FFXV.

>Eden can bring life to a desolate world by just running some simulations
>Zodiark needs 6 gorrillion souls no refunds and no indication that he wont temper the remaining ascians
Really makes me think

Carefully.

Shoot it until it dies.

You are completely missing the point. The whole reason the Ascians wanted to sacrifice others wasn't to regain control, they still were in power. They wanted to sacrifice others so they could bring back the Ascians who had given their lives to keep existence intact, since they felt they owed it to them. And then the other Ascians decided to pay back this grand sacrifice of their fellows by smashing reality asunder because they didn't want to feel bad about doing what needed to be done for that to happen. They honestly put their feelings above repaying a blood debt, and proceeded to shatter the entirety of reality by doing so.

Fuck you again, I liked the base game as well.

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Yeah I completely agree. As I said in , the premise/idea of it all was great. Too bad it turned out very very very poorly executed and flat out gimped.

I might even have enjoyed the game if they had put a way to skip all the bullshit content and forced cutscene/"comfy" dialogues constantly on repeat/made the whole thing much smoother. But unfortunately the didn't, and now I have to sit through thousands of hours of pointless loading screens, slow animations, locked-in sequences, unskippable content, etc.

Why the fuck do I have to have a ~1 minute long chat with Ignis letting me know there's monsters outside and it's dangerous to drive in the night every time I want to use the Regalia at dusk? Why the fuck every time it's about to turn to night BOTH Prompto AND Ignis have to interrupt me in TWO COMPLETELY SEPARATE UNSKIPPABLE CUTSCENES to tell me that it's getting dark and we should head to camp? Who thought any of this was okay?

It is comfy and feels natural the first couple of times, sure, but it gets old REALLY quickly, especially with all the recycled content and backtracking for sidequests that is required of you throughout the whole game.

It's a piss-easy jumping puzzle that'll give you some Japanese clothes. You can redo it, fish or give a dish to get more clothes. I made a glamour plate for my crafting jobs, looks better than low-level armor.

You assume zodiark is a really nice guy that would just give their aether/soul back when 1) hes a primal and thats already a roullete to what kind of entity he is 2)we dont k ow shit about zodiark other than that he was willing to save the world in exchange for a little snack

then why don't most people have the kill

youtube.com/watch?v=iR-K2rUP86M

He was a good boy, deep down. Fuck Azura and fuck the Tribunal.

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The Last of Us

Fuck Joel for dooming humanity

True

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Do you think literally every Ascian that was sacrificed would say "yes, please sacrifice that life which we just sacrificed ourselves to allow to flourish to bring us back"?

Or do you think it's more likely that they, as we are informed that they're selfless, would have said "No, don't do that. Just let the world go on." Why do you think that people so selfless would suddenly start thinking in terms like this? maybe, it has something to do with the big Z.

>but killing a random guy who is just going about his life because it would somehow save two people, is not.
Why ? 2>1, no ?

>Ascians
>selfless

I guess the question for them was whether it was very custodian-like of them to grow non-Ascian life for the sole purpose of resurrecting their fellows.

There is also the fact that the council and some other Ascians were tempered by Zodiark. That might introduce some bias into their decision making.

Hey, that was Emet's own words, he proclaimed they did it selflessly. Which means they probably wouldn't be in favour of wacky sacrificed induced schemes to try and bring them back, potentially at the cost of what they died to achieve.

Because most people do not know how to do enough damage to it.

I didn't want him to succeed so to say, but I understood his side and empathized with his true motive: to end his own suffering.

Emet knew from the beginning that one of two things was going to happen. Either he'd succeed in engulfing the First with light so the Rejoining could be completed, thus allowing him to go back to living his old lifestyle with old friends/family. Or he'd (finally) die trying. Either way he'd no longer have to live with the guilt of failing his people and no longer be left to live thousand lifetimes alone.

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do you

"game"

>Literally, LITERALLY fucked everything up in multiple dimensions, worlds AND timelines
>His one "crowning moment" has him massively break continuity for his character and condemn another for actions he had been constantly committing prior to that, and would continue to do afterward
>Only reason he became warchief was pure nepotism, his last position was a complete failure on all counts, and the position he held before that was even worse and ended with him abandoning his home and his people for a life of relative luxury in stolen lands
Seriously how the fuck does anyone even remotely like this guy? Is it just exclusively people who started playing after WotLK? Are you dumb fucks just pretending?

Haven't played since midway through Stormblood, but was Zenos only so powerful because he was descended from Emet and thus part Ascian?

>Spend an entire campaign hinting that he's going to fall to the corruption of fel magics
>Falls to the corruption of fel magics
>"WOOOOW WTF BLIZZZ!?!?"
Holy fuck dude.

Yep.

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He was powerful because of genetic fuckery to give him a fake echo.

The whole "half the planet sacrificed themselves simultaneously from their own will" seems very suspicious to begin with.
How would that even be organised in the midst of a world that was in chaos like Amaurot showed? Presumably it was part of some sort of summoning ritual - did precisely half the planet put their hands up in the air on the spot, spirit bomb style?
I could honestly see a twist that it was actually the ruling council sacrificing them which puts a whole different spin on what happened afterwards.

He was shaping up to be a Warchief that was pretty savage and warlike in Cataclysm, but also showed signs that he took some lessons from Saurfang and others to heart and could develop into a solid Warchief in his own right. Vastly different than Thrall but potentially great.

But Blizzard’s writing team had other ideas.

can i see the log

>Zenos
>was

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Nor does it matter, the Ascian's goal isn't to remake the first, it's to remake Zodiark and sacrifice the life on the first to it so they can revive their fallen brethren.

Having the 13th would make their plans easier but it's not a hard requirement.

True, but for the moment I'm engaging with it purely on their terms... because even doing that what the Zodiark gang wanted to do was dumb.

In the Akademia Anders dungeon, the final boss is summoned by a researcher sacrificing himself to give form to a powerful creature in an attempt to restore order to the facility and kill the rampaging monsters. It seems like it’s something that a sufficiently skilled Ancient would be able to do solo, and probably could direct other Ancients to do the same.

This argument never seems to acknowledge the fact that the entirety of reality is in the control of another Primal (Hydaelyn) who is somehow supposed to not be just as fucked up as every other Primal? Then again, this series is a JRPG, perhaps the final end game boss will be Zodiark, and then Hydaelyn as well. Killing gods is a thing in FF anyway.

Sure, hope it helps.
fflogs.com/reports/XcGVqMaL6n9kwHDv#fight=6&type=damage-done

That's some Danzo tier shit

Dude, did you not pay any fucking attention to anything prior to Cata? The dude was a fucking imbecile of untold proportions who was constantly kept afloat by his peers and his Cata incarnation was no different, he gets Cairne killed because he's a god damn moron, gets into a pointless war because he's a god damn moron. It's not even an exaggeration to say that everything he did ended in the worst kind of failures, from his disastrous 'leadership' of the Mag'har to the complete mismanagement of his position in Northrend, where his actions almost led to the complete defeat of both Horde and Alliance all because he's a warmongering retard.

Why do you think they sacrificed themselves for "the world" rather than the much more logical conclusion that they sacrificed themselves for their people?

Because the central tenant that the Ascians held was their role as CUSTODIANS OF THE STAR.

So I'll get to fight that fucker again? Good. Planning on getting back into the game in a few weeks.

You do realize that the WoL is tempered by Hydaelyn, right? The entire reason the other Primals in the game can't temper you is because you are already tempered. Ifrit and Titan even say as much when they encounter you. If we're going to argue that being tempered warps someones judgment, that applies just as well to the WoL as it does Emet.

The entire wolfenstein franchise

It's hardly "half the world" it was half the survivors, and Amaurot was probably one of, if not the last place to fall.

you the war?

But the ancients weren't the ascians, the ascians were ancients.

Hydaelyn was specifically created to fuck with that though. Hydaelyn probably weakens herself to the point of not being capable of fucking with you. Also consider Midgardsomr was able to cut you off and you didn't change drastically.

GW2's Kralkatorrik wasn't too bad a guy, just besieged and maddened by consuming so much magic. Even an elder dragon cannot bear it. Felt bad for him in the final instance.

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Except we also learn from Zenos that there is more to resisting tempering than being tempered yourself, and the canon explanation is that the echo protects you, which is also apparently a side effect from being a sundered ancient.

While it's by no means impossible that Hydaelyn tempered us, it's exceedingly unlikely that this would have a noticeable effect, see Ramuh and the Sylphs for context on what tempering does (it's not just following the will of the primal, as Ramuh doesn't want to temper the Sylphs and doesn't want to be summoned, but the sylphs are driven to summon him due to being tempered)

Yep

They liked him because Garrosh only cared about his people, and fuck everyone else. It was a real breath of fresh air from Thrall, who was trying to save everyone, everywhere, all the time. Garrosh didn't care about anyone or anything but the Orcs, which is a really appealing quality in a leader, he didn't care about doing what was "right" in a moral sense, he only cared about doing what was right for his people. If he had to fuck everyone else over to make that happen, he'd do it in a heartbeat. That is why he was liked, despite the atrociously incompetent characterization and writing given to him by Blizzard, which, to be fair, was par for the course with EVERY character they write.

>I haven't played FFXV, are you telling me this hobo with designer clothes is interesting? I might pick it up then

He was an interesting badguy but then his DLC and novels retconned him from being a bad guy to a "did nothing wrong" character in the most ass backwards fashion

Shit, Dhaos deserved better.

So basically they like him because he's a fascist? Neat.

Minfillia did seem full Hydaelyn tempered though.

Zenos is a super saiyan. No, really, he's evil Goku. That's his character. He is a really powerful guy that only cares about fighting, and will fuck up anything and everything so he can get a cool fight. It's absolute trash but the Japs love that kind of character so he'll be a mainstay until the series fucking ends.

did the mch get both the weapon and the chest?

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He did everything wrong, he fails in both timelines.

Because the star was the planet on which their people lived. Are you really so dumb as to think the Ascians committed mass suicide to save everyone ELSE? They weren't Jesus.

MCH? If you mean regarding the second clear yeah the MCH had the weapon for that run.

Except that's LITERALLY WHAT EMET SAID THEY WERE.

His entire spiel was that "you" wouldn't be willing to sacrifice yourself to protect the star. As such he couldn't leave it in your care.

What job should I main? i just want to help and contribute.

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Play a WHM, the current expansion fucked up the healers kinda hard except the WHM so you'll get plenty of easy queues due to a lack of other healers and you'll alwasy be appreciated. Also WHM is my favorite job, it's actually fun.

Dude was going to Thanos half the planet to get his buddies back. Which probably wouldn't have worked in the first place.

i figured he got the weapon because in the 2nd run he was the only purple
sam did worse somehow(?)

Healer.

He was going to Thanos the whole planet, not half.

playing a DPS class is generally a low responsibility way to contribute to the group. If you’re decent with your rotation and can avoid standing in the fire, you will make runs faster for everyone.

>you'll always be appreciated
I assure you that I do not always appreciate my WHMs, after maining healers for so long.

Point still stands. I get where he's coming from, but that's still pretty villain.

>FFXV is a terrible terrible terrible trainwreck of a game
100% this
Its crazy defenders still exist

SAM died twice that run, but with the DRG weapon and MCH the dps check was easy so it didn't matter.

Is healing parse for dps just a lot easier than dps parsing for dps? Almost every time I see someone who is 3/4 or 4/4 orange on savage it's a healer.

Based on what? And he simply cut you off from her blessing, tempering is permanent and so far irreversible in the lore. And from the start of the game to the current part in the story, you are Hydaelyns bitch. Everything you do is in her name, at her whim, and for her goals and purposes. You never question it or go against her. But sure, you're totally not tempered and are doing everything she wants you to without question all of your own volition. Yeah.

drg got the weapon? but he did way worse what's going on

Can Yea Forums explain to the general public why Urianger is the best 'Elf' type character in a game?

Its probably because the vast majority of healers can't DPS so if you do DPS its easy to get high percentiles.

Damage down and a death, plus we kinda meme'd on that pull so he wasn't going 100%

Please actually play Frozen Throne before posting stupid shit, thanks.

It's certainly the shallowest of the only 3 MMOs still worth playing, but it's far from a trainwreck.

>plays WoW

Unlikely, her actions in no way revolved around summoning/maintaining/empowering Hydaelyn, which is the primary trait of the tempered. She also comments that she has a lot in common with the Ascians in that her spirit ends up possessing a new body rather than re-entering the lifestream (though presumably that's over now since she yielded her essence to Ryne, which is another strong argument against the idea that she's tempered)

Another thing is that not all primals end up tempering, assuming Ekindou is legit.

He said XV not XIV

Yeah. It was great, it really gave contrast to the story and was starting to put some real meat on the bone to the faction conflict. Blizzard writers are so incompetent, though, that they didn't realize this and just killed him off in ham handed fashion, and are now trying to recreate the same effect he had with what they're doing with Sylvanas, except she's not what Garrosh was, and it's failing spectacularly.

I wanna put my ponos
In Suzaku's vajoo

Which means HE cares about it, and everything else is your own imaginings.

Shiva/Ysayle never tempered anyone. All her followers were sympathetic to the dragons.

Oh shit, my bad user. XV is indeed a fucking trainwreck, just pure disappointment overall.

Hydaelyn was made with specific purpose, it's clear that there was some degree of design in what happened. The magic space dragon is the only lore character we've seen that can do shit like that and he's had no interest in doing it for other people. And he'd probably have said something by now if we were totally her bitch.

I'm taking the word of the only account we have. Anything else is conjecture.

You're dumb as a sack of bricks. Emet straight up said that the current people would not sacrifice half of themselves to save the other half. As his people had done. In other words, his people were willing to sacrifice themselves for each other, because they were better people in a moral sense, whereas the people who now inhabit existence are nowhere near what they were and would not do the same, not for ANOTHER PEOPLE, but for EACH OTHER. Which is one of the reasons he felt it was fine to kill them all in order to bring back his own people, since it was another failing, another inferiority, another flaw.

>wowlet reading comprehension

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Because as an outside observer, I'd prefer the characters I like alive rather than dead.
Not to mention I don't like the idea of killing billions to bring back old dusty corpses that never asked to be brought back.

lmao, the paladin literally be in level 60 gear

But who's to say Midgardsormr isn't Hydaelyns bitch, too? He does tell you that he sacrificed his existence to her in order to secure his childrens life on the Source. And yes, Hydaelyn was made with a specific purpose, EVERY primal is made with a specific purpose. And in order to fulfill that purpose they mind rape people into being their servants. Why would Hydaelyn be an exception? She was created to destroy Zodiark and, in so doing, shatter reality, and in order to keep Zodiark destroyed and reality shattered, she wouldn't have the ability to temper people, why?

God I want to suckle on Ryne's budding breasts

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Please play Warcraft 1 and 2 first buddy, also pay more attention to The Frozen Throne, they were dropping so many fucking hints that Kael'Thas would turn it's actually incredibly that anyone could be dumb enough to be surprised. I mean are you fucking kidding me?
>My people are desperate and incredibly addicted, also completely cut off from our source of magic
>I know, lets take this massively corrupting demon magic and use that to feed our addiction WHAT COULD POSSIBLY GO WRONG!
>But wait, there's more! This is all being spearheaded by the posterboy of how fel magic would totally NEVER be corruptive, ILLIDAN STORMRAGE, A LITERAL FUCKING DEMON AT THAT POINT AND KIL'JAEDEN'S BITCH

Seriously mate, get yourself checked, you are fucking retarded.

IIRC, the devs confirmed that Tempering is largely voluntary. Primals can temper and untemper people at will. Though residual aether left behind by dead Primals can be gathered and concentrated to temper people, though the success rate is lower.

Of course, there is also the fact that Hydaelyn and Zodiark are Primals that we’re summoned by people who practiced life synthesis much as one might practice a sport or vocation. It’s likely that they’re way more complex than the likes of Bahamut or Ifrit, and their tempering might be different.

What if the ascians just decided to move on and make their own society instead of bring one back from hundreds of years ago?

You could argue she wasn't a true primal, but rather a primal infusion (more akin to what summoners do) You could also argue her followers totally did get tempered, but I seem to recall they all ended up dead either way.

You can look under her top if you position the camera right at the start of any trust run. There's not much though, only a bit more clevage.

90% of XIV r34 is fucking OG stuff. When theres an entire list of NPC ladies to be used. Fuckers.

They did ask to be brought back, though. The entire plan was to sacrifice those people then resurrect them after reality had been saved. Also, if you don't like Emet-selch more than every single Scion combined (sans Urianger), your taste is absolute shit and you should kill yourself.

>I'm taking the word of the only account we have. Anything else is conjecture.
Which is dumb as hell because he's a canonically unreliable source of information, as well as a biased narrator. EVERYTHING, not just "everything else" is conjecture.

That's becaus trannies like to self insert themselves as actual "women" in their degenerate fantasies.

You keep saying abominations, perverse and the likes, parroting emet, but you don't know what the alternative actually looks like. You only have the word of a mass murdering maniac who lives in the past.
Besides, when looking at the characters and their stories in the game, I doubt you see perverse abominations, or wouldn't have started playing this game.

No, I did imply that you are a wowlet that is trying to shittalk FFXIV, while WoW is arguably in a significantly worse spot right now.

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>liking Urianger
The only Scion that is not an unlikable mess is Y'shtola

He literally says "you cannot be entrusted with our legacy" and "If the world faced total annihilation" and "For eons I have found you wanting, to weak and feeble-minded to serve as stewards of ANY star"

He, and the Ascians were all about their role.

There's also plenty of evidence that tempering isn't/wasn't absolute, the fact that the Allagans could contain Bahamut as they did certainly suggests they had some way to avoid being tempered.

The Ascians have the echo too though, and they are tempered by Zodiark. Emet in particular constantly sucks his dick, and his temperance is likely a big factor in why he wants to sacrifice to empower Zodiark. We perhaps don’t realize the effects of being tempered by Hydaelyn because we are always seeing the story from our perspective, and since Hydaelyn was created to be the will of the star everything she has us do is “for the greater good”. However, I fully expect this to change in a future xpac, where we are probably going to try to resist Hydaelyn and potentially even kill both her and Zodiark.

>THE good guy
>implying that shadowbringers isn't a good vs good story
The entire vibe I got was that both sides had valid concerns.

The Ascians were right to summon Zodiark because they had tried literally everything else and nothing worked. They did the only thing that could work to save their world.

The Ascians who summoned Hydaelyn were right because having an unchecked supreme overgod lord it over an entire race of nigh omnipotent creators is a disaster waiting to happen, Zodiark really does need a check.

Emet-Selch is right because everyone really is a broken fragment of what they once were, and by all accounts things were best when they were complete.

The Scions are right because what Emet-Selch is doing really is massive amounts of genocide for the sake of a people whose time is come and gone and the new races have the right to reach that perfection on their own terms.

>that is trying to shittalk FFXIV
How fucking dumb are you to not even realize that is not talking about FFXIV?
Now you look even dumber thanks to that shitty cringe smug reaction post
Don't post in one of my threads ever again kiddo

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Urianger being the only one of the Scions actually willing to sacrifice anything or make hard decisions rather than being a completely idealistic fuckwit automatically propels him past every other member of the group. The only reason the First is even there for you to save to begin with is because of him.

I think "tempered by hydaelyn" is gonna be a red herring. I think that she was made to be self defeating or something like that, which is why she's constantly weakening.

thanks for the (You)

True, but I just can't fucking stand the chuuni as fuck way he talks

Except this might just as well be him talking about being stewards to Zodiark, if we are to believe he is as tempered as he claimed.

Specifically the line about "our legacy" strongly implies this, at least.

So you're agreeing with me then? The Ascians were a great and amazing people far more deserving of life than the warped perversions Hydaelyn put into place after she broke reality apart.

Having access to wondrous remote controlled war machines probably helped.

Also having Emet-Selch at the helm to plan around primal influence probably helped too.

They stopped being in control once their planet started squeaking and their thoughts were about to blow up the planet.

Those same people decided that splitting the world was a better alternative than Zodiark.

The american perception is so fucked that if a man isn't 500 pounds, they look like a woman

So I just finished the SHB storyline and the game mentioned something about job-specific quests being unlocked now...? Where can I find these?

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>The Ascians have the echo too though
Not to my understanding they don't. Not the unsundered ancients at least, the sundered Ascians would likely have the echo of course, and this could be considered an implication that Hydealyn's sundering is a kind of tempering (or simply that sundered souls cannot be dominated)

>noteth appreciatingeth the wayeth a sorcerereth of oldeth dispenseseth verbiage

Do you not play with English voices on? Uriangers English VA blows everyone else out of the water.

Same place as you always get them, from the original job trainers.

It's nothing special though, it ends some storylines but others are a big fuckload of nothing, especially if you're SMN.

>Do you not play with English voices on?
No, I'm already triggered enough by the shitty localization of the English text not matching the Japanese dialogues and the English version missing out on lots of nuances. I'd rather play the game in Japanese but it uses way too many complex kanji for me to understand yet unfortunately, but I can follow most of the audio at least.

I'd rather have Y'shtola mature c@ t@s

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"Thou doth not appreciate mine antediluvous rapport my identity hiding compatriot?"

Urianger wins by sheer virtue of having Death of the Seventh Dawn.

No, that was a small rebellious faction of terrorists that caused untold devastation and shattered reality all because of their insane ideology. The majority of Ascians wanted to repay those who had sacrificed everything to save their people.

I forgot where my RDM trainer is, since it's been so long since I did a job quest. Am I fucked?

Kael'Thas in Frozen Throne was a desperate but good man. He even took precious time aiding the Night Elves when the situation was dire for him and his people. Sure, feeding of demonic energies is a terrible thing to do, but that's the kind of difficult decisions that make a good character.
Kael in Burning Crusade ? An evil loot pinata. No nuances, and no explanation. And you, retard that you are, are trying to defend that stupid transition. You're only proving your abysmal tastes in character writing, or alternatively, that you cannot read.

Even fucking Blizzard themsleves said they were not happy with how Kael was portrayed during BC. You're defending shitty writing that even Blizzard, who are pretty adept at this, won't dare to defend. They even tried to fix it recently with Chronicle 3, but that's a little too late.

Isn't Y'shtola getting dicked nightly by that one hrothgar dude?

delet this

In Stormblood after Papalymo dies, you can see Lyse's neck tatoo fade. Was that ever expanded upon? Is there some link the scions have between eachother?

user no you'll summon him

Revenants Toll for RDM.

She literally explains that one for you.

cheers, sis

Damn time to watch those cutscenes again I suppose

Ah, speedreader-kun. Lyses tattoos were given to her by Papalymo, when he died the magic empowering them faded.

Potato magik.

>can't read the kanji
>feels like he can judge if nuance is lost

It was half of the remainder. Apparently including one of the wisest of them all. And apparently this tiny faction was able to make a Primal that btfo Zodiark. Remember that this was LIFE ON THE UNIFIED WORLD. It wasn't sharded, not incomplete. This justification only comes after Hydaelyn is made to stop the madness.

DONT SAY IT

Oh thank you I didn't catch that part

Hey user I found this recorded conversation of yours.

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Yeah believe it or not but i've been living here in Japan for quite a while now and I'm somewhat fluent enough with spoken Japanese, but I've been neglecting my reading. I can read most everyday Japanese, hence I have kinda stopped challenging myself, but the Japanese used in FFXIV is a bit more complicated (writing-wise) and too kanji-heavy for me, sadly.

This is a Japanese game. That means every single female is a pure virgin unless she's married with kids. You'll note that Thancred, Alphinaud, and Urianger have points where their many sexual conquests are noted, but you'll never see anything past mild flirting with any female in the game.

yikes

>Kael'Thas in Frozen Throne was a desperate but good man.
Which means literally complete fuck all, given the issue here is demonic corruption. It's like saying "hurrr durrr Arthas was a good man how could he have become a Death Knight hurrr durrr" The fact that he was desperate is the very thing that leads to him cavorting with demons.

>Sure, feeding of demonic energies is a terrible thing to do, but that's the kind of difficult decisions that make a good character.
Yes, he was a good character, and he was still a good character in Burning Crusade because it followed a logical course based on everything we know about the setting; Fel energies are extremely corrupting and will twist even the purest soul. You can see the effects throughout Warcraft III, especially in the Orc campaign but also with Felwood in the Night Elf campaign. No one has any right to be surprised that Kael'thas turned.

>Kael in Burning Crusade ? An evil loot pinata. No nuances, and no explanation. And you, retard that you are, are trying to defend that stupid transition. You're only proving your abysmal tastes in character writing, or alternatively, that you cannot read.
Which again, was literally inevitable given EVERYTHING that was established prior. All you're bitching about here is that the writing dared be consistent and not do an asspull to somehow give your fanfuck favorite character a better fate.

>Even Blizzard
Nothing Blizzard has said since BC has any credibility to it, and you should be fucking ashamed for even bringing it up.

Hydaleyn IS madness. She is chaos. She destroyed order and unity and split reality into multiple fragments. The only people who could possibly support such actions are obviously tempered slaves of the demon goddess.

He's right though. They butchered Kael'thas just like they butchered every character from the RTS lore. If they had actually done a progression from where you leave off with Kael in TFT, and shown how he fell into complete madness, that would be fine. But none of that is shown, and Kael simply goes insane because, well, we need a raid boss and he's an iconic character. Anyone defending ANY writing in WoW should kill themselves, it's all garbage that only survived off cannibalizing and ruining the lore from the RTS games.

More like she's balance, and she was created to maintain a balance the existence of Zodiark would have shattered, even just going off of the most basic interpretation of astral and umbral energies.

The Ancients clearly fucked something up spectacularly, and were getting erased as a consequence, they summoned Zodiark to maintain their erroneous ways and partly succeeded, but everything about that and their consequent plans where madness.

Runar? What's wrong with him.

XIV has the NieR raid coming up. You're right in that 90% of people who play Classic will quit after a month though.

Spoken like a true SLAVE of the wretched hellspawn that destroyed all of reality and shattered it into a shivering wreck of what it once was. It sure is BALANCED to destroy all of creation and remake it into a warped, twisted reflection of what it once was and strip the mortals of their lifespans, powers, and shatter their souls into thirteen pieces. Balance. Yeah, no.

>They butchered Kael'thas just like they butchered every character from the RTS lore.
You're just restating someone else's premise here while ignoring all the contrary evidence presented. Why even bother posting? His character is literally what it could only ever have been unless they massively retconned the effects of demonic corruption or somehow asspulled a way that he could have escaped it.
>If they had actually done a progression from where you leave off with Kael in TFT, and shown how he fell into complete madness, that would be fine. But none of that is shown, and Kael simply goes insane
Yea, I take it you either never played BC, didn't actually do the quests or forgot/skipped the dialogue, it's explained fairly well why he turned and what leads to him being as he is. He's also by no means insane until after you "kill" him the first time, after which he sustains himself with a demonic heart or some shit.

You've come up with absolutely nothing, and your only argument has been your own ignorance.

I really hope the nier raid will have a boss that fucks with retards like thunder god.

Remember kids,
this is why you don't roleplay.

This is totally how one tempered by Zodiark would think, nice RP man!

Yoko Taro is helping design the encounters. Even 200 IQ people will probably have their senses fucked with.

>Coming up
You mean in like 2 months?

Had me confused a bit but I think you mean "fucks with retards the same way thunder god did"?

>Retard wants to kill all cat and lizard girls and go back to being 12 foot tall weirdos

My only regret is that his death wasn't slower and more painful

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Yeah, just in time to scoop classic quitters right back up.

>It's like saying "hurrr durrr Arthas was a good man how could he have become a Death Knight hurrr durrr"
It's not, because they actually showed Arthas corruption progress. They explained it. Something they absolutely did not for Kael.

>Fel energies are extremely corrupting and will twist even the purest soul. You can see the effects throughout Warcraft III, especially in the Orc campaign but also with Felwood in the Night Elf campaign. No one has any right to be surprised that Kael'thas turned
But you're wrong. There are plenty of characters who used dark or corrupted energies and magics and who didn't become comics vilains overnight. Illidan is an exemple. And, by your logic, every single Blood Elf should have joined the Legion, since they all consumed fel energies.

>Which again, was literally inevitable given EVERYTHING that was established prior.
Like I've just proven, it was not inevitable. You're only making excuse for Blizzard laziness. I hope they pay you, at least.

>All you're bitching about here is that the writing dared be consistent and not do an asspull to somehow give your fanfuck favorite character a better fate.
No. I would have been happy if they only SHOWED the corruption happening and why and how it happened. But, again, that didn't happen. He was put as a raid boss because Blizzard needed a raid boss.

>Nothing Blizzard has said since BC has any credibility to it, and you should be fucking ashamed for even bringing it up.
And knowing that, you should be ashamed of bringing yourself lower than them.

Is it just nothing for 2 months until its out though? Didn't they also have some shit planned like rebuilding Ishgard and some gardening nonsense?

Guess the 4 bosses for the first wing.

>Fool of an user...

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I'm just kinda baffled that you can't read it, but you think you can analyse the linguistic implications. Especially considering you must know that there is no such thing as a perfect translation.

>I think you mean
What was written was a perfectly correct simile

What? Yes they do. All Ascians have the echo. Lahabrea confirmed it.

I want her to murder me bros...

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GW2 ain't canon

You guys said pvp sucks, it’s fun and great when you don’t have retards on ya team.

He trusted Elidibus. Even if he managed to destroy the first Elidibus completely failed from using black rose and got his ass handed to him by Zenos.

>It's not, because they actually showed Arthas corruption progress. They explained it. Something they absolutely did not for Kael.
Okay you can stop pretending to be retarded now. They literally show him marching off into a wasteland after killing Malgannis and the next time you see him he's an evil corrupt death knight hell bent on the destruction of all life.

>But you're wrong. There are plenty of characters who used dark or corrupted energies and magics and who didn't become comics vilains overnight.
Name some. It's also several years between TFT and BC, so it's hardly "overnight".
>Illidan is an exemple
He really isn't, he's an example of my argument, not yours. A wretched creature who turned to butchering his own people and destroying the world at the bidding of Kil'Jaeden is a really poor example of someone escaping demonic corruption.
>And, by your logic, every single Blood Elf should have joined the Legion, since they all consumed fel energies.
But they did, all of the bloodelves who followed Kaelthas through the portal are corrupted, the ones that follow from Silvermoon much later had not taken any fel magics and retained their sanity. This is also highlighted in the game because Kaelthas provided his people with the Naaru as a means of obtaining magic.

>Like I've just proven
You've basically just claimed "I win you lose" here, as you've proven nothing and the conversation is still ongoing. If anything you've managed to provide more evidence against your own claims, rather than prove them.

>No. I would have been happy if they only SHOWED the corruption happening and why and how it happened
Except they did, repeatedly, from early on in Hellfire peninsula through interactions with Blood Elf pilgrims, to dialogue and conference detailing his actions between TFT and BC. Siding with demons offered him a chance to conquer tempest keep, whereas sticking with Illidan who was locking himself away at BT would mean he couldn't help Silvermoon.

Which, if true, means Emet was lying about being tempered.

Elidibus failed to use Black Rose because Emet Selch failed.
They're both inherently tied together by fate since the calamity took the shape of Black Rose.Therefore if the rejoining is prevented, Black Rose won't be unleashed.
That's how I interpreted it at least, it's probably highly up for debate.

I like Emet. As a plot device and villain. His story and motivations are sad and relatable. But it takes more than a sad story to make me want to support genocide on an interdimensional scale.

I remember watching the ending video of the original game but I'm pretty sure a lot of the characters died. I assume they went to the Source and they were all alive again because of that, right? Or did some survive that? I don't really understand because they still talk about the great calamity as if they survived it.

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In the original timeline everything went the way the Ascians want, so, no. You know, actually, if you think about it, the entire reality of the game now is actually an alternate reality. It's just a split off the actual reality, in which the WoL is killed by Black Rose and the First merges with the Source. So in the true reality, Emet-selch wins.

Black rose without the flood of light is just that biological weapon from the sidequest at the start of stormblood. It needs the flow of aether to turn it into a HUGE outbreak that spreads wildly.

It's not really genocide when the people that are being killed were never truly alive to begin with.

No. Everything in the game so far has established there is no such thing as separate timelines or split realities. Remember Alexander.

What happened was G'raha Tia turned back time while isolating himself from the effects, there is no future timeline running parallel to ours.

The people he intended to kill first WERE "truly alive" and I dunno about you, but most people seem just as alive as Emet Selch did.

No? He was definitely tempered, and he has zero reason to lie about this. What are you talking about?

>it takes more than a sad story to make me want to support
It's sad that that's all it takes for some people.
>Oh no what a sad story, let's help him get his friends back while completely ignoring that everything we ever loved dies.

You do realize he himself already lampshades this claim by dismissing it as mere moral relativism right?

The lore in that game is so fucked. It's like they hired part-time writers to pick and produce one episode at a time. Also trying too hard with the leylines and magic shit. After retconning things explained in GW1 manual to about the origin of magic.

>Okay you can stop pretending to be retarded now. They literally show him marching off into a wasteland after killing Malgannis and the next time you see him he's an evil corrupt death knight hell bent on the destruction of all life.
What is Stratholme? What is killing Muradin to get Frostmourne? What is burning your own ships to prevent your men from going home?

>But they did, all of the bloodelves who followed Kaelthas through the portal are corrupted, the ones that follow from Silvermoon much later had not taken any fel magics and retained their sanity. This is also highlighted in the game because Kaelthas provided his people with the Naaru as a means of obtaining magic.
user I'm really starting to think you didn't play either Warcraft 3 or BC. Why do you think Blood Elves have fucking FEL eyes, even those who stayed in Azeroth? Rommath was sent by Kael to teach them how to feed themselve from fel energies. And the Naaru was only used by Blood Knight to keep using Holy Magic, precisely despite their corruption and lack of faith in the Light. It's the basic lore of the race, for fuck's sake.

>Except they did, repeatedly, from early on in Hellfire peninsula through interactions with Blood Elf pilgrims, to dialogue and conference detailing his actions between TFT and BC
Blood Elves pilgrims in the Peninsula aren't hostile to Kael. In face, they are trying to join him. It's only when you encounter the Scryers, traitors to Kael, in Shattrath that you learn that Kael has turned mad.

You should at least go take a look a Wowpedia. That way you'll stop to embarassing yourself.

You weren't alive before either, what kinda logic is that?

>Ascians get wiped out by themselves because of their own incompetence
>new "inferior" race requires a huge scheme by the Ascians that results in mass genocide to wipe them out
Ascian m-master race

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So how was he, an Ascian, tempered when he has the echo, which we know for a fact protects against tempering?
>Why would he lie
Why would he not? You asked him a dumb question and he gave a theatrical answer, which is consequently never brought up again and in many cases never even mentioned if you don't select the dialogue that leads to it. To suggest such a throwaway line is definite proof that everything we know about the echo is false is just cherrypicking what you want to believe.

Did they actually have that with Alphinaud?

Not that user but they do mention how Alphinaud would be trying to impress the ladies back when he was in school

>Hey guys, I'm totally tempered since I was present at the original summoning of zodiark and my life's driving purpose is to keep summoning zodiark now..
>Hey guys let's sacrifice half of what little is left of the world to summon zodiark again.
>Hey, here's an idea. Let's seed the world's with life for a bit so we can get enough fuel to summon zodiark by sacrificing it all to him again.
>I am totally and perfectly logical and sane, my thinking cannot be compromised. This is totally for the best, and not just a tempered zealots plot to keep feeding zodiark. Trust me
>oh fuck, hydalin has split the star apart, and now it's impossible to get enough fuel to resummon zodiark since the souls aren't heavy anymore
>Let's just rejoin the stars, kill all the inhabitants in the process, and resummon zodiark
>New souls? Fuck the new souls. They weren't as bright as us, they are less than 1/7 of our guys. And their morality is shit. They don't want to sacrifice themselves to zodiark so I have no respect for them.
Y'all just like emet because it upsets people when you say he was right, he had a decent English va, and he acted quirky.

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So I started playing like three weeks ago and I thought the main story was kind of boring (Up until near the end of the level 50 quests.) and I have to now legitimately ask.. Does the story actually get good in 3.0? I'm at the point of 2.4 and have like 41 quests left until I open the first expansion and I'm so fucking bored I have half a mind to drop the game if the rest of it is going to be like this. I mean, holy shit. Who seriously thought telling the same story over and over was a good idea? "Oh nooo they got crystals and they're summoning a primal (For like the 9th time), oh noooo..."
Oh, and don't fucking forget that it really is basically the story from 1.0 with an ultimate big bad, they just changed the name to Omega. For fucks sake..

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It protects against being tempered by other primals. Zodiark tempered can't be tempered by Hydaelyn and vice versa.

Do you know what the echo is? Also, do you realize how much more powerful is Zodiark compared to the likes of ifrit and whatnot which are the ones that gave us the idea that echo is invincible?

You're at the point where it starts ramping up and from then on its consistently good until you hit stormblood which is just very dull.

You’re right, it does call into question everything that we know about the echo up until this point, but what was the WHOLE POINT of Shadowbringers; our trip to the first showed us just how little we truly knew about the world we lived in. The source has umbral and astral backwards compared to the first. Hydaelyn and Zodiark are not Gods in the traditional sense, but superpowered primals made manifest by an ancient civilization. The people in the world were not the original beings, but merely shards of a people long gone. Emet dropped some serious lore bombs, and based on the evidence we have, everything he said is true. He had no reason to lie about anything he said.

So knowing that Ascians are tempered by Zodiark, have the echo, and the “echo” is what protects against being tempered, the only logical conclusion is that it’s not the echo that protects from being tempered, but being tempered by another being. In the case of the WoL and co, Hydaelyn.

literally right after the other primal you will get into The Good Shit, don't worry

>What is Stratholme?
A dutiful prince making a hard choice, exactly what you liked about Kaelthas. How are you even bringing this up as some sign that Arthas was turning evil or some shit?
>What is killing Muradin to get Frostmourne?
Except Arthas didn't kill Muradin, and this just proves you have either terrible memory or never played the games you're trying to talk about
>What is burning your own ships to prevent your men from going home?
Clear and obvious desperation, not malice or a desire to end all life on Azeroth, not even remotely.

>Why do you think Blood Elves have fucking FEL eyes, even those who stayed in Azeroth?
They don't though. In fact if you'd have played BC you'd know many of the early quests revolve around the acquisition of mana, none of it through fel means. It actually does deal with some of it though, with the wretched, which are once again an example of my point.
>the Naaru was only used by Blood Knight to keep using Holy Magic
Which is still magic that sustained (some of) the addicted blood elves, not sure what point you're trying to make here, but suffice it to say you've failed.

>Blood Elves pilgrims in the Peninsula aren't hostile to Kael. In face, they are trying to join him. It's only when you encounter the Scryers, traitors to Kael, in Shattrath that you learn that Kael has turned mad.
No, the pilgrims there learned that Outland wasn't the promised land they were told about already, and several conversations and quest dialogue already proves this. There's even a quest to beat up some giants corrupted by one of Kael's officers that deals with some of the background of what's going on.

>You should at least go take a look a Wowpedia. That way you'll stop to embarassing yourself.
>Unironically trying to tell people to go to a wiki, a wow wiki at that
Lmao you can't even cite the shit you think is relevant, shameful fucking display kid.

>Why would he not?
Because he was making a point of not lying, to get the WoL on his side, or at least understand his side.

A handful of Ascians rejoined six worlds and voided a seventh. The only reason they are stopped is because of the interference of Hydaelyn, which is an Ascian creation, and the WoL, who possesses an Ascian soul. So, yes, Ascian master race.

I liked stormblood but I'm still mad about what they did to Yda.

because it's a shitty jrpg and you can't have normal men in those

Alexander just concluded it was better not to interfere and let existence play out on its own. That raid actually confirms there are multiple timelines and virtually infinite possibilities across space-time.

Kind of tired of these posts but yes. Every expansion has been pretty good in both content and story. At least, a lot more so than ARR. The post-ARR quests are dragged out quite a bit too.

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I cannot decipher what you're trying to say here user. "it"? The echo? How does that make sense when you cannot be tempered if you're already tempered, but the echo protects you from being tempered but only if you're already tempered.... That makes no god damn sense to me.

Besides the weird eye, he looks like an average handsome male to me.

>If we blindly believe someone who has no reason to tell us the truth and repeatedly lies, then we need to rethink everything we know!
....

The echo is being tempered by a primal.

Based Emet-selch dabbing on Y'shtolas feeble attempt at moral relativism by throwing it back in her face with force and verve.

>That final scene in SB where she is put in the spotlight as if she did anything noteworthy and everyone gets together to sing

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>I'm just kinda baffled that you can't read it, but you think you can analyse the linguistic implications.
What's so weird about that? There's a huge disconnect in skills in reading and speaking Japanese, it's not like a western language. You can be perfectly fluent in the language and still not be able to read most kanji. It's unlikely if you're a native (because they drill that into you in school) but it's totally reasonable if you're a foreigner. FFXIV, like most fantasy narrative aimed at young adults, uses a lot of uncommon kanji and does not have furigana and very minimal kana usage for most of the words, so really it is hard if you're not used to reading novels or whatnot.

All of this has nothing to do with the actual amount of vocabulary you know. I'd be able to read all of it if it was in kana and common kanji, but it's not. It's not that I don't understand the words, I just can't literally/physically read them. It's like questioning a blind person's ability to understand language because they can't read, the two things are totally orthogonal to each other.

This said, even for a somewhat beginner Japanese learner, there's A LOT of blatant cases in FFXIV translation where the localization team took a lot of liberties in carrying over the content. I'm not the kind of retard that is against localization, but a lot of choices really are just "let's change this for the hell of it" and that's it. FFXIV prose is great to read, both in English and in Japanese, but the English and the Japanese versions are not faithful to each other. If you prefer the English one, more props to you I got nothing against that, but I'd rather have the original Japanese one as intended by the original writers.

There's also the fact that he's named after the Angel Of Truth. Nothing Emet-selch says is a lie.

Emet-Selch didn’t lie. If you want to keep a belief based on outdated, incomplete information then that’s your prerogative, but I’m just telling you the logical reality of the situation. Considering the only way you were able to refute my post is “w-w-w-what if he lied in a conversation he has no reason to lie about!!!”, I feel that’s very telling.

I think the reason so many of these posts are probably being made is the idea that if the story is so below basic up to this point, how could the game studio that wrote it somehow make the next bit of it any better?
You don't just suddenly expect a musical artist to go from creating radio quality pop-sounding garbage to illustrious classical masterworks in just a couple of good hours.
I also don't mean to be another groan in an ocean of others whom seem to also be complaining. I just felt I honestly needed to be re-affirmed to push through the rest of this trash to get the the actual good content.

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Yes. Alisaie comments on how his girlfriend came up and suggested doing lewd things to her, since she had mistaken her for her twin. At which point Alphinaud asks her not to discuss his many sexual conquests in front of of the WoL.

The producer himself acknowledged that something needs to be done about the ARR quests, they're just not sure what to do about it, yet.

Yea, I'm not gonna believe that until you tell me where that happened.

Stormblood was straight up garbage and anyone who thinks it was good is a scum sucking retard.

Yea, a liar telling you he won't lie, so why would he lie?! Golly gee lad do I have an amazing bridge to sell you!

ARR was bland, Heavensward was okay although a lot of people went nuts about it (personally I found it okay but not great), Stormblood was... a bit too spread out let's say (I still liked it personally). Shadowbringers is honestly a top tier storyline that is worthy of a FF mainline title. It is actually miles above all other FFXIV expansions, in my opinion. I have a lot of hope for future content after playing SHB.

>Primary theme of the game is "look to those who walked before to lead those who walked after"
>Literally in the theme tune
>Meet the oldest guy in the game
>He tells you what needs to be done
>Kill him
Amazing!

Kind of. The echo as we know it is a mix of being tempered (which lets you resist being tempered) and being an ancient being (which lets you see into the past).

I thought about how throughout XIV's history, most of the characters either remain the same or improve as they get expanded upon overtime, all except for Lyse. She's the only character in recent memory that actually got worse and SB turned her into such a bore of a character. It's fine if her plucky peppy persona was an act but they couldnt replace it with anything interesting? SB was supposed to be her character development arc but given that she was off with Papalymo most of the time and we only got to know her better at the tail-end of Heavensward where she revealed her secret, I didn't have any close or emotional attachment to her other than her being the 'comedy relief pugilist'. It was the opposite of Alphinaud. We spent several ARR patches with the little shit pushing us around for his own agenda, only for all of it to crumble on top of him - causing him to embark on a pseudo-personal journey that turned him more humble and cooperative, viewing WoL as not only his ally, but one of his closest friends. Lyse was more of "Hey, thanks for helping fight my war. You're a pal."

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>>Primary theme of the game is "look to those who walked before to lead those who walked after"
literally no it's not lmfao it's work together for your own future you dumb fucking cuck

>Emet didn't lie, he wouldn't!
That's just your headcanon though, his whole thing, for centuries, has been lies and manipulation and he's the only source you have for your theories, which even by the most generous assessment is incredibly shaky.

We have plenty of evidence that the Echo prevents tempering, from other scions to Fordola (how, pray tell, was she tempered exactly?) and even Zenos. There is simply no logic to your idea that a few offhand remarks by a serial manipulator refutes everything you've experienced so far, so no, your headcanon bullshit is exactly that.

I don't remember the exact moment when it happens but I believe it's during Heavensward

He was correct. Imagine if you were him there is literally no reason he's not right. Sure catgirl Y'shtola doesn't like it but that's akin to not agreeing with a stunted retard. The Ascians are simply above the shard souls, of course it makes sense for them to bring their improved original world back.

>ending scene in SHB is literally "Look to those who walked before to lead those who walked after" in reference to the original WoD, the current WoD (you) and the future hero wannabes (Gra'ha Tia & co, the kid that you meet right in the final scene, etc)
>n-n-no it's n-n-n-not!
Dumb poster

Not them but it was the during post-HW quests where you meet Krile. She recalls many embarrassing stories about Alphinaud's time in the Sharlayan academy. I don't think it was sexual encounters though. Moreso harmless flirting and maybe kiss or two since the twins are still basically teenagers.

>has been lies and manipulation and he's the only source you have for your theories

Even the scions are like “shit, he’s legit.” It’s the entire crux of the expansion. Name ONE other thing he’s lied about, because since he has this reputation of being a liar, give me another example of him lying. Pro tip: You can’t. You are just assuming he’s lying when not only would it not benefit him, but it would be a pointless lie for the story as a whole.

>Fordola (how, pray tell, was she tempered exactly?)

Gee I wonder how an artificial echo that was designed to mimic the original thing was able to reconstruct the effects of the original thing? Fordola and Zenos aren’t tempered but through the process of being I’m imbued with it likely gained the effects that come with it. We don’t know enough about the artificial echo to use it as a basis for anything.

>"n-no it totally is"
Wow what an overwhelming argument, and your coolguy fluff is totally not hilariously lacking in self-awareness.

I wouldn't even mind if she was a just a bad character with a part in the story. What got me mad was how we were supposed to pretend she did anything notheworthy enough to be crowned as a leader.

>A dutiful prince making a hard choice, exactly what you liked about Kaelthas.
Killing thousands of innocents, even if it's justified, isn't even close to what Kael did in Frozen Throne. Kael spent the entire expansion fighting the Scourge and a Legion Pitlord.
>Except Arthas didn't kill Muradin
Ah, yes, sorry. The ACT of taking the sword killed Muradin. Arthas is truly innocent here.
>Clear and obvious desperation, not malice or a desire to end all life on Azeroth
I know you're playing dumb here and it fits you, but my point was that they showed Arthas's fall step by step, culminating by him taking Frostmourne, and Frostmounre taking his soul. Something that, AGAIN, they didn't do for Kael. And no, some NPCs saying "He was corrupted when you weren't looking. Go kill him." isn't what I would call proper explanations like you seem to do. If only because these happens after the shitty corruption excuse.
>They don't though.
They don't have fel eyes. Nice, now you're denying reality itself.
>In fact if you'd have played BC you'd know many of the early quests revolve around the acquisition of mana, none of it through fel means.
Again, I don't think you played BC.
>Which is still magic that sustained (some of) the addicted blood elves,
The Naaru was a weapon. Nothing more. A not point it is mentionned as a mean of substaining magic thirst. Unsurprisingly, you never did Blood Knights quests.
>No, the pilgrims there learned that Outland wasn't the promised
We'll let's take a look at what the Pilgrims are saying then:
>Martik Tor'seldori says: Brothers and sisters, I have been to the promised land. I have tasted in the sublim energy. I have felt bliss - bliss so engrossing and all encompassing that I was left wondering if I had stumbled upon the dreams of gods.
You're wrong, again. But that's hardly a surprise anymore. I'm reitiring my advice, go read the pedia, because form some reasons you refuse to use the games as sources.

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Pretty sure it's when he draws a picture of Gosetsu and explains he learned how to draw to impress the ladies.

>his whole being is lies
He's the angel of truth. You can be manipulative while telling the truth, see Lucifer.

Why would they put the actual quote in big letters in front of you in one of the most poignant scenes at the end of the expansion, if it was not at the very least relevant to the theme of it? Are you seriously that retarded or are you just shitposting?

She took off the mask and became a completely different person. Yda was awesome but Lyse is absolute trash.

>Literally no downside
Except creation magic being a double edged sword which could cause another apocalypse. The world had to be split apart, the Amaurots were too powerful and had poor control over their godlike magics.

Yea, I remember that. There was nothing sexual about it.

No. That was a different scene. Alisaie discussing being mistaken as Alphinaud by his girlfriend and being invited to do lewd things is later on.

I'm curious, has this title ever been mentioned and assigned to him in XIV? I know about other games but I'm obviously not talking about other games.

So I’m curious, do you think he was lying abou Hydaelyn and Zodiark being primals? Do you think he was lying about Amarout? Where do you think his lies end and his truths begin, considering the plot only works in the first place if he’s telling the truth? Do you have any justification for when he’s lying other than “I say so”?

I don’t think he tells lies but he leaves out stuff.

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How many time did she *clench fist* again?

At least that outfit was cool. Then she put on the shitty folk dress and became an even worse character.

The problem was that Yda was only half a character. She died along with Papalymo.

>Even the scions are like "shit he's legit"
Padding your headcanon with more headcanon, the scions are constantly calling his claims into question.
>Name ONE other thing he’s lied about
Literally the premise of working together with you
>But it would be a pointless lie for the story as a whole.
Oh jesus do you really need me to explain the concept of a red herring to you dude? Are you for real right now? I mean think about it for one god damn second you braindead luddite, why the fuck would Emet honestly tell you he was tempered, knowing the only logical response to this revelation would be to not trust anything he says anymore? The fact is that he doesn't give a damn, which is why he's humoring you in the first place.

>Fordola and Zenos aren’t tempered but through the process of being I’m imbued with it likely gained the effects that come with it.
Never go full headcanon. You're literally just making shit up now to fill in the gaps in your asinine theories. "probably x" "likely y" "we just don't know but this massive holy in my theory probably is filled... somehow!" Fact is, we know enough about the real echo to know your ideas are bullshit, and you failed to even address the one example you decided to cherrypick.

Thankfully, she fucked off to be one of the leading heads in Ala Mhigo (despite lacking any sort of training or proper education on politics). She won't be relevant until Eorzea readies for an all-out assault with Garlemald.

Ifrit literally yells “What, you are owned by another!?” When he tries to temper you. They’ve had this set up for a lot longer than people realize.

>despite lacking any sort of training or proper education on politics
And being just a fucking retard in general.
>"Dude what if we let this ENTHRALLED ananta into our meeting what could go wrong"

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The dress is amazing. They just couldn't be bothered to make it look good ingame.

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I'd still suck those flat tiddys.

>Padding your headcanon with more headcanon, the scions are constantly calling his claims into question.
The scions are rightfully skeptical, but they also admit many times that he's telling the truth.
>Literally the premise of working together with you
He did not lie, he was simply evaluating the WoD and ultimately asking them to join him. Since we refused/failed his expectations, the deal was broken.

Not even gonna bother with the rest of the shit you posted. All the evidence is out there in the game, it's pretty obvious he's not lying (there's no reason, narrative-wise, for him to lie), if you still refuse to believe it then it's all on you.

SWTOR, Malgus did nothing wrong

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>Killing thousands of innocents, even if it's justified, isn't even close to what Kael did in Frozen Throne. Kael spent the entire expansion fighting the Scourge and a Legion Pitlord.
Really? Because I seem to recall Kael had no trouble butchering the native people of Outland to stake his own claim, not to mention slaughtering countless nightelves to free his demonic overlord. Arthas also only gave his people a quick death, since he knew for a fact that they were doomed no matter what, hardly the same as merely "killing thousands of innocents" Kael is already much more evil in this comparison.

>Ah, yes, sorry. The ACT of taking the sword killed Muradin. Arthas is truly innocent here.
Well, yes, he absolutely is, especially given that he had no fucking clue that taking the sword would kill Muradin and he specifically says that HE would pay any price. Why are you spinning this atrocious horse shit? What the fuck do you hope to gain? Surely you aren't actually as retarded as you're pretending to be with this garbage.

>my point was that they showed Arthas's fall step by step
You've failed at every attempt to argue for this, Arthas didn't gradually fall at all, and his actual fall was never shown. How did he go from being desperate enough to want to sacrifice anything for saving his people, to butchering them all and turning them into the undead, starting with his own father? Never shown, and you know this, you're just being intentionally obtuse because you can't deal with the fact that you've been so fucking wrong for more than a decade. Pathetic.

>They don't have fel eyes. Nice, now you're denying reality itself.
Next you'll tell me all night elves are corrupted too because their eyes glow. Hell, look at actual corrupted entities like Satyr. Your little headcanon about all blood elves being corrupted just falls completely flat
>Again, I don't think you played BC.
An empty claim with no substance, a win for me, I think.

ps3 limitations please understand

How anyone can jump to the conclusion that Emet was in the right is beyond me, when we've only heard the Ascian side of the story and not Crystalmom's.

I, for one, still have faith in Crystal mom to explain in patch content or next expac.

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>You're literally just making shit up now to fill in the gaps in your asinine theories
Welcome to storytelling in sci-fi and magic universes
Excrutiating detail on processes not necessary, only functions and outcomes.
They implied nothing more than is reasonable from what is essentially just 'mimicking the echo'

Understandable. I enjoyed ARR for reasons beyond the story though. Every time I have friends that get into it they usually complain it's not their MMO they played when they were teens like OSRS and why is it not playing like their current battle royale or why can't they just skip everything to play with me and the others who tried getting them into it long ago but got turned down. It's just tiring because I feel like most of these people are going to drop it anyways, I might as well not even bother trying to reassure them, as I could enjoy it for reasons they no longer can as they get older and jaded. It does get better and I think it's one of the best experiences I've had with video games in quite some years.

Nah.

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>Martik Tor'seldori
Oh look, an NPC that isn't at the actual location where the blood elf pilgrims reside, which is Falcon's watch. Nice try dude, but now you're actually just lying and deceiving to save your sorry ass from further embarrassment, and failing spectacularly.

Nice to know I'm also arguing with someone who never played the game and is merely reading off of wiki articles without any knowledge of context.

>"my childlike interpretation is absolute!!! believe me bawwww"
No.

Regardless of the history of who is right or wrong Emet just wants his people back

> the scions are constantly calling his claims into question.

But they are unable to disprove anything he says and end up accepting his words.

>Literally the premise of working together with you

Replay the game, he wasn’t lying about this.
>would Emet honestly tell you he was tempered, knowing the only logical response to this revelation would be to not trust anything he says anymore? The fact is that he doesn't give a damn, which is why he's humoring you in the first place.

If he doesn’t give a damn, why would he lie? You’re contradicting yourself here.

>Never go full headcanon.

Bitch don’t even. I literally said “we don’t know enough about this thing” but I tried offering a plausible explanation. Someone said that the artificial echo
makes it so it’s not a result of temperance, which is also headcannon.

I find it strange they made her not titties when they have the power to do it. Just look at that Radlia and how her tits moved as she was talking.

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Remember Mr.Happy?
But seriously, it really feels like some notorious XIV content creators have fallen into borderline obscurity.

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Do people still do Eureka?
I never done it but apparently I need to do some shit over there if I want to be able to dye my artifact gear.

What most people forget is that he lived among the people for centuries, decades, millennial, generation so he did give humanity a chance, but they continue to utterly failed.

And Alphinueld and the gang of the balls to say, "dude we'll.... we'll leeerrrrreeaaannn this time I swear" despite history saying otherwise.

And you know what the definition of insanity is? Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results which is what humanity is doing.

Not necessarily, the terminus monsters happened because the world was ending. They were not the cause of the world ending. The Ascians would be fucked either way.

Not at this time. However, they've said they're going to adjust eureka to be clearable by solo players so just hang tight and wait for updates. I recommend keeping up with Live Letters to know when you'll be able to do it.

It sounds like you want special snowflake cutscenes of your character personally witnessing Kael's descent into bedding demons but in early WoW you didn't get personal love notes from your faction leader telling you about everything going on in the world it just moved on without you.

>Wow someone who says a lot of true things would certainly never lie!
Mate... for real... what the fuck are you doing right now? Are you just pretending or do you actually need me to explain how manipulation works, and that the best lies are hidden in a forest of truth.

There are two options here;
He's telling the truth about being tempered, which means he's likely lying (if not intentionally) about Zodiark as he himself is being manipulated by it.
He's lying about being tempered

Either way, there is simply no argument to be made that he spoke the truth about everything.

I think he's more than likely to tell little lies here and there for his own amusement, but overall his aims where to teach you about the past. This is also why I have my doubts about his claims about being tempered, as this would be much more significant to everything he says if it were true (to the point where not much of what he says could be believed anymore, as he's likely to just be manipulating you) From a narrative design perspective, it makes little sense to have something as significant as Zodiark's tempering of the unsundered be hidden away in one choice of dialogue and never once mentioned again

He was always some obscure nigger. Nobody knows that dude except for Yea Forums and bottom barrel PF players.

Mr Happy was only famous for being a controversial douche. Once MTQCapture gained popularity, he was done.

I took the whole "you're not truly alive" thing a few different ways. One on hand, it maybe exactly how he and the other Ascians feel about everyone who isn't an ancient since everyone is just a piece of a former whole ancient.

On the other hand, it could be because anyone Emet did happen to care about throughout his thousands of lives is dead now too. He mentions that he tried to understand humanity by living a life as a man - Solus. While the chances of then having Emet's character in mind back when writing ARR is slim, I find it interesting that Solus' biography in the Encyclopedia Eorzea specifically mentions how his life was a sad, loney one as he was betrayed by his closest friends and lost his first son at a young age. Who knows how many people throughout time Emet grew to befriend and care for just to watch them die thus leaving him alone again.

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I disagree. Happy is very well know in the community. It's just that everyone hates him, expect those retarded PF kiddos who listen to his shit.

>2 options
>he's lying
>or he's lying
There's always that pesky third alternative, called not lying.

>”How dare you try to call the echo into question!”
>When multiple other things like the origin of Hydaelyn and Zodiark and the existence of the people are also called into question

Funny how you don’t think he’s lying about any of that other shit though huh? Lol you’re a joke

I find it funny how Alphinaud compared his life and friends to Emets and it made him mad as fuck. Almost thought Emet was gonna kill this nigga.

>start ShB
>desert music is peak comfy
>suddenly combat music
cursed

disable combat music

Except Ifrit is not a reliable narrator, for all we know Ifrit doesn't know about the Echo and thinks the only way to resist tempering is by being controlled by another.

>but they also admit many times that he's telling the truth.
Which means what I said is true, and what you said is false, they never asserted he was "legit" but merely that he wasn't lying about everything.
>Not even gonna bother
No, you're running away because you have nothing to say. At least be honest. Coward.

>But they are unable to disprove anything he says and end up accepting his words.
Hah hardly, they question and doubt his every word but accept they cannot disprove them, you're just spinning that into tacit acceptance where there is no such thing.
>Replay the game, he wasn’t lying about this.
His goal from the start was the Crystal Exarch, and he planned to use you as a tool once you succumbed to the light.
>I literally said “we don’t know enough about this thing” but I tried offering a plausible explanation.
Yes, this is also commonly known as "going full headcanon" Jesus dude, what the fuck are you on?

Dude...or...hear me out here...he’s not lying. Just because you are tempered, doesn’t mean you are lying.

But since you seem bent on holding onto info from previous xpacs even though ShB advanced the story and lore a giant magnitude, I’ll let you drool in your corner.

Let the victor write the tale, and the enemy become its retard.

Except again, given the options that is simply not possible. The cat is either alive or it is dead, there is no third option. Either he lies on one thing, or he lies on another, but his words and claims are utterly contradictory to the point where it's simply not possible that everything is true.

Literally nobody knows Mr Happy on Primal except for oldfags. But the vast majority of players know Mizzteq because "its that tank girl that raids on primal" or "that girl with the asmr voice".

Hydalayn and her faction are the bad guys. Think about it. Through out the story of FFXIV they make a big deal about choices, but do you think the Amarounts asked for their souls to be split? That they willingly want to be lesser beings?

>its that tank girl that raids on primal
What? I'm sure there are several players this sentence is describing.

>Funny how I have this amazing strawman that I'm not going to knock down
Epic. Yea no the guy trying to revive Zodiark totally wouldn't lie to make you sympathetic to his cause and make you doubt Hydaelyn, that'd never happen! :^)))

Momodi will tell you that she's not a virgin in casual dialogue. Y'Shtola is generally much more sexual in Shadowbringers, going so far as to offer you spankings and spanking Urianger on the butt. Not to mention the copious amounts of rape both implied and explicit in the game. Like holy shit is there a lot of rape in FFXIV. Like the Arcanist trainer or that girl from little Ala Mhigo or Yotsuyu. Half the femals in the game have been raped.

How many born vagina girls you know main tank in this game instead of healing or playing brd/dnc/rdm

I loved how Emet called Alphinaud's bullshit out how great humanity is when Emet asked if the people of Eorzea would willingly sacrifice themselves for the greater good.

Hey guys! I just queued to the alliance raid roulette naked.

>I have no proof for my claims I just think he would do x so I will take x as fact

Nice talk

I wish someone would have called out the Crystal Exarch for being the same as Emet-Selch. He's deleting an entire world in order to save the WoL, a decision that was come to by a fraction of the people in the Source.

>Dude...or...hear me out here...he’s not lying. Just because you are tempered, doesn’t mean you are lying.
Why pretend to be retarded just to have an excuse to reply? You know what I said, which is not what you attempted to refute here.

>"Bawwww bohooo I can't win the argument so I'll just pretend I win and you're a doodie-head"
Just run away you pathetic wretch, keep the tattered remains of your dignity in tact if this what you're stooping to.

What world is being destroyed to save the WoL? Do you mean by denying the rejoining from happening, denying the ascians the chance to save their people?

The tempered are thralls to their will
And you're right, he has no fucking clue about the echo. Only tempering. His claim is you being tempered by another.
The echo doesn't stop tempering, it's the result of Hyd's tempering. Think of it like cattle branding

You can manipulate people without lying.
Point out just one singular self-contradiction he makes.

emet wasn't a good guy, he was sympathetic as hell though

>Which means what I said is true
No, it does not mean that.
It means that the scions were aware of the multitude of true things that Emet was talking about. Was it all true? From the Scion's point of view they cannot know. From our (narrative) point of view, we have a pretty clear idea after the ending of SHB that everything Emet Selch said was true. We have the advantage of being an outside observer, we can gauge it without being part of the story itself.
>and what you said is false, they never asserted he was "legit" but merely that he wasn't lying about everything.
Not the same person you were talking to.
>No, you're running away because you have nothing to say. At least be honest. Coward.
I'm literally just here to point out the logical fallacies and obvious flaws in the points you're trying to make. I don't particularly care one way or another. I'm not the same person you were talking with, I just don't like when people blatantly fall into logical traps and try to further their point based on such fallacies.

>My proof is a serial manipulator telling me he's not lying, and then making a bunch of shit up based off of the implications thereof, because it simply MUST change everything!!
Nice talk indeed.

But the exarch isn't deleting anything?

Tell me I get to kill that fucking traitor knifeears.

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>traitor knifeears.
Who?

Emet was a bitch and none of what happened to ascii bel air would've happened if his master race was as superior as they said they were

Everyone is calling you out as a retard for good reason. The Echo is almost always called a blessing of Hydaelyn in the game, even in Shadowbringers, by unreliable NPCs who don't know its true nature and we have plenty of evidence of the Echo being seperate from Hydaelyn in game. Your entire argument hinges on what we know of the Echo to be the same as the false information that NPCs believe.

You can manipulate people without lying. You seem to be under the false assumption that they mean the same thing.

literally everyone outside of the Ironworks descendants and the enclave led by them are dead or dying as far as they know, and the world is quite literally doomed from the perspective of any sundered being. calling that a false equivalence is an understatement.

>The echo doesn't stop tempering, it's the result of Hyd's tempering. Think of it like cattle branding
Except again, we have plenty of evidence of characters with the Echo whom have never met Hydaelyn or even had the chance to. Hell, even a major point in this expansion is relevant here, as the "warriors of darkness" never once interacted with Hydaelyn until after you defeated them while they had and used the echo against you.

Honestly mate, there are literally dozens of angles by which to dismiss this horseshit theory, and I tire of the increasingly desperate excuses used.

The future he came from dummies. From what we know from Alexander, split timelines isn't really a thing. Those people no longer exists, an entire world sacrificed to save people who were already long dead. Even if you want to accept that the timeline carried on, they still fucked that world over by removing the Crystal Tower and any hopes they had of making life better.

The irony dripping off this post has almost crystallized, holy fuck.

No. I did the quest as a Dark Knight and was excepting to Dark Knight the shit out of her but there was no option to. It actually soured my opinion on an otherwise perfect story. Its a fucking stain on the game.

>they still fucked that world over by removing the Crystal Tower and any hopes they had of making life better.
the point is there is literally no hope for life being better, as long as the rejoining comes to pass the Black Rose is permanent and will turn the entire planet into a blasted hellscape like the Empty within a couple of decades.

Nobody really knows about Horseface either. It's just a vocal minority of horny nerds with no taste.

>That girl with the asmr voice
People really think that?
I find her voice annoying as hell.

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name more based character

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Biggs' grandson even says in his last message to CE that he doubts Future!Source is going to last much longer. CE was right to do what he did.

you can hear how she lost all genuine fun over the years

Cid

gaius

>butchering the native people of Outland to stake his own claim
By butchering you mean helping Akama and his Broken against the Fel Orcs, I suppose
>slaughtering countless nightelves
And by countless you mean the little expedition that followed Maiev.
>Kael is already much more evil in this comparison.
Like I'v proven once more, he's not.
>he had no fucking clue that taking the sword would kill Muradin
>"Damn the men! Nothing shall prevent me from having my revenge, old friend. Not even you."
Oh yes, he had no idea, the poor boy
>How did he go from being desperate enough to want to sacrifice anything for saving his people, to butchering them all and turning them into the undead, starting with his own father? Never shown
Him taking Frostmourne in his hand was shown, as was every step leading to it. Nothing of the sort for Kael.
>Your little headcanon about all blood elves being corrupted just falls completely flat
My little headcanon, yes. And Blizzard's too, anecdotally. Besides, I don't know why you're so adamant about blood elves. Your point was that anyone using fel magic would become an evil clown like Kael, something rendered invalid by the simpel fact that players can play Warlock. And by countless others classes and races using dark and corrupting magics, like Demon Hunter, Shadow Priest, Void Elves.

All in all, yes, that was a win for you. Because I lost quite a bit of time arguing with someone who have absolutely no clue of what's he talking about. Which is surely why you dropped more and more of my points in your pathetic excuses of responses.

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>literally everyone outside of the Ironworks descendants and the enclave led by them are dead or dying as far as they know
No, watch the cutscenes again. Life carried on, its just extremely shitty. G'Raha even tells you about how people around the world speak your name. Or are you saying the people in Ilsabard and Hingashi are also Ironworks decendants?

>and the world is quite literally doomed from the perspective of any sundered being. calling that a false equivalence is an understatement.
No its not. The 8th Calamity wasn't even as bad as the massive flood or the ice age that wiped people out before and life still carried on after Ampador was washed beneath the waves.

>If someone is manipulative they MUST be lying and I don’t want the lore to change AT ALL so I refuse to take new information into account

Lol

>dark knight
>actually being able to punish the wicked in this game
it took a prolonged rant and Rielle saying "she's beyond saving" for Sidurgu to kill a genocidal batshit insane woman who's partially responsible for the death of his best friend and caused him nothing but unrelenting pain. going by the story dark knights are big softies.

Huh. I wonder if Elidibus is going to get his “Warriors of Light” from a place closer to home than we might think?

Just hope it isn’t a retreading if the post-HW Warriors of Darkness story.

mizzteq guides have vastly more views than mr happy now. mr happy is all washed up.

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>Hell, even a major point in this expansion is relevant here, as the "warriors of darkness" never once interacted with Hydaelyn until after you defeated them while they had and used the echo against you.
Actually wrong though. Do the role quests and especially the final one. They received their crystals and became Warriors of Light after Hydaelyn found them worthy. I agree that the echo and Hydaelyn are seperate but your supporting argument is flat out wrong.

exactly, there was no way to get rid of the black rose once it was unleashed en masse, the world is already dead and they, knowing it, willingly gave up their lives to save others. it's closer to the actions of the amaurotians who sacrificed themselves than emet, let's not forget g'raha fully expected to die as well.

>not 10 minutes
b-b-b-but muh ad revenue

Cyla the barkeeper was Ardbert's 5th companion and the Shadowkeeper

>I can't win the argument so I'll resort to calling on others that similarly couldn't win the argument, more people being wrong means we win!
Eugh. Cringe.
>The Echo is almost always called a blessing of Hydaelyn in the game
This is some of the most desperate grasping I've seen yet. How shameless. I haven't seen reaching for straws this bad since that one faggot insisted FFXIV just copied every other FF game because errrr Eorzeans and the scions are rebels (they're not) "BUT THE GARLEANS CALL THEM REBELS SO THEY ARE" Humorous, but pathetic.
>Your entire argument hinges on what we know of the Echo to be the same as the false information that NPCs believe.
No, that's just your limited understanding of my argument, which is rather odd since I've given several clear examples already that make this claim nothing but a farce. There are dozens of examples of the echo, of the things it does and how it works, and the only trait it has in common with tempering is that it allows the wielder to resist tempering, nothing else, no other connections to tempering either.

>You can manipulate people without lying. You seem to be under the false assumption that they mean the same thing.
You can, technically, but this does not refute the point I raise, and that Emet has no reason to be honest with us out of some moral obligation or otherwise, he has no reason not to lie, and plenty of reasons to do so, so to blindly believe his every word is absolute folly.

>Or are you saying the people in Ilsabard and Hingashi are also Ironworks decendants?
I'm saying they're dead or uncontactable.

>No its not. The 8th Calamity wasn't even as bad as the massive flood or the ice age that wiped people out before and life still carried on after Ampador was washed beneath the waves.
It's the last rejoining the Ascians needed to bring about the return of Zodiark. Even if they by some miracle managed to halt the aetherflow destroying magic wind the Ascians of that timeline could initiate the Rejoining anyway and then they all get their fucking souls eaten.

The original DRK was a noble knight who was tired of clergy and other nobles getting away with malicious crimes due to their wealth and connections. I’d say they’re less the edgy punisher type that most make them out to be and more akin to Batman or Green Arrow or something along those lines.

And those with the Echo are also resistant to tempering by another.
The echo we know and have is nothing more than the result of being tempered by Hyd. How many scions and friends of scions had it without ever meeting Hyd?
Who said the WoD weren't chosen of Hyd and never met?
The Ascians have their Echo from being tempered by Zodiark.
Functionally similar due to their natural opposition.
Sharingan is the odd one out but we probably just don't know enough one way or the other for that.

I'd put money on there being a lesser version of the Echo at work with standard Primals and their tempering.

Oh, that. I haven't leveled enough for that quest, yet.

thank fuck someone else knows.
As soon as there were 20 foot ayys who could literally do god's work I felt like none of my abilities or past work as the WoL meant nothing.

perhaps, but Rielle's mother was clearly beyond saving. hesitation at all is out of character.

Did you not see how Amarout looked? It looked amazing and the people there were civil and polite.

You'd have a point if what Emet wanted humanity to return to was a shithole but Amarout was far from a shithole. Now compare Amarout to the other places such as Ul'dah full of nothing but kikes and poorfags, Gridania full of pussies, Limsa full of slave trader, pirates, and rapist, Ishgard full of more poorfags and anti religion, Doma full of rapist, cowards and pirates, Ala Mhigo full of lazy faggots and dindu nuffins.

You'd have to be insane to not want to live in Amarout.

who needs ad revenue when you got beta orbiters donating

What happened with Mizzteq anyway? I saw something about her final time streaming or something. Is she not playing FFXIV any more?

>They received their crystals and became Warriors of Light after Hydaelyn found them worthy.
Which is not the same thing at all, in fact if you actually do the final role quest and pay attention you'd know that this entire sequence of events was carefully orchestrated, ensuring that these people became warriors of light, as if there was a process of requirement to be met. That doesn't match up with tempering at all, unless you want to try and argue that Hydaelyn for some reason only reaches out to temper very specific individuals and does so by throwing crystals at them. You'd also know we receive the faded, cracked crystals at the end of every role quest, and there is much more to them that just some source of tempering, in case you wanted to try that angle.

Fact is, if Hydaelyn had tempered the warriors of darkness, we would never have been fighting them as we did, it makes little sense for the tempered champions of Hydaelyn to fight among themselves, no?

OH DEAR GOD PLEASE SAUCE

So Mr.Happy with a vagina. Already forgotten by the random viewers, soon to be ignored by her minority e-fans as well.

She did spam YT's search engine with tons of videos on the promo event though.

she was streaming the game on thursday but ran into PC issues

But the Warrior of Light wouldn't live in Amaurot. They'd get sacrificed to Zodiark. Emet was omitting part of his truth, as usual, when he said you had nothing to lose if the Rejoining happened. The WoL's "soul" would perhaps still be there, but it'd be reformed into a completely different person, as with anyone else who's a fragment of an Amaurotian. It's perfectly rational for both sides to do what they did, it just so happened Emet lost because of factors he couldn't predict and his own personality faults.

She's better just for the fact that she didn't make a 20 minute response video about if you should go north or south with the tethers for Titty EX.

>Woman
>Ignored

Alexander established time is a closed loop

>dub
"no"

I never said that they were tempered. They were blessed by Hydaelyn and found to be worthy of her blessing. The blessing and the echo and tempering are all separate things.

Why they didn't use Black Rose on Limsa Aetheryte Plaza?

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IM dying

>turn on Jap voice
>can hear absolutely different script
i hate it

It was the capital city of the Ancients, though. Capitals tend to be a pretty snazzy place in comparison to other cities. We don’t really know if that was the norm for all Ancients’ way of life, or if Hades was just painting a picture through rose-colored glasses and glossing over societal ills (aside from their near-extinction event).

>kill all the marketboard jews, bots and ERPers at once
paradise

I’ve been monitoring this conversation and everybody said everything there is to say and you refuse to listen, so all I’m going to say is this.

When it’s revealed in 7.0 or whatever expansion it is that the WoL and others with the echo are tempered by Hydaelyn, I want you to remember this thread. Remember this thread, and remember how wrong you were. And maybe be more open minded and logical in the future. Then post a thread here live-streaming your suicide, since you won’t be able to live with the shame of getting eternally BTFO by anons who told you the story years before it happened.

she also doesn't sound like a neckbeard that's running out of breath

>we would never have been fighting them as we did
Literally because Ascians in their ears, like they tried to be in ours. A plan that has worked a lot for them.
It's not like Hyd has ever forcefully exerted her will, these people still have their own agency and all the trappings that comes with.

Stormblood was a mess but I wouldn't call it terrible, just a mess. The Doman 3.2-3.3 storyline was good, if quite predictable (if you've played more than 3 JRPGs you instantly knew Asahi was evil)

When you take something that isn't yours? What is that called?

Theft.

But the person who rightfully owned it and wants it back is the bad guy?

Rly?

We don't have any reason to doubt Emet. He told us the truth and had no reason to hide anything.

Anything involving not-mongolia. I was half asleep through main Stormblood but the Nadaam was pure kino, especially considering the massive clusterfuck the battle turn into with all the factions involved. Then the little sun battles...

Gaius was right. Zenos was right. In a paradoxical way, Emet was right. Emet had a chance, the Warrior of Light killed him, let the victor become the hero of this story and the vanquished the villain.

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Horse are not women, silly.

Iirc there's a twitch channel that pretends to be Mizzteq and tries to bait you into clicking a link. I don't know what come after, but that's what you probably saw.

It was also where the world ended
Since Shadowbringers, Ascians are the biggest dindus in the game.

Emet is essentially a militant (metaphysical) platonic idealist. The only difference is that it is exclusively material. Also seems to owe a lot to the devolutionary views of history pushed by the actual right politically.

>Lyse confronts Fordola.
>Japanese: *arguing about morality and other bullshit*
>English: Murder! Butcher! Traitor!

>you cannot join them because it's not what your character would do
japanese "role" playing games

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That's why I hate Japanese RPG.

>Literally, LITERALLY fucked everything up in multiple dimensions, worlds AND timelines
You've got that backwards, it's literally most other timelines that he's the best warchief that the horde ever has and the 'main' one that he's shit.

TRAITOR!
KINSLAYER!

>He told us the truth and had no reason to hide anything.

I think he told us as much as he thought was true. But he’s as vulnerable to bias or tunnel vision as any other person. His recreation of Hythlodaeus seemed to be too self aware in comparison to the rest of the phantoms in Amaurot. In addition, the Akademia Anders is a bit too realistic in comparison to the rest, seeing as how it can actually create independent life that can escape from Amaurot and wreak havoc on the surrounding environment (IE Archaeotania).

Someone actually got triggered by this because Yugiri's tits were too big.

What is Eden again? I mean I played the story and raids of course, but trying to remember if it's a super primal or something for clarification.

Also is Oracle of Shadow a qt? Is she proof voided star isn't dead so much as it's a coked up crackwhore with no shame.

The Amaurotines talked as if the other cities were comparible. The conversation in the debate hall implied that the other cities were at least equal enough not to be looked at as some poor backwater dump and one of the ones that offers you a tour implies that while Amaurot is the most grand city, you shouldn't be too shocked to see it if you aren't a native. We also see the planet lit up in lights so its safe to assume that the Ancient society across the world was fairly advanced.

>Not posting the best SB girls instead

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In other news, water is wet.

>Alphinaud sees Zenos trying to cut himself.
>Japanese: Is he trying to take his own life?
>English: COWARD!

t. little goose

This. Emet outright tells you in Quitana Ravel that everything he says is the truth from his perspective and that you'll get a different story if you ask Hydaelyn. The guy who keeps insisting that Emet lied is retarded but you also have to take everything he says with a grain of salt.

>>Wow someone who says a lot of true things would certainly never lie!

Do yoga acknowledge that he spoke a lot of truths yet you retain that he lied about that one specific thing because you say so. That makes no sense. You have just as much cause to believe everything else he said was a lie yet you single out the tempered thing because you look like a retard if he was telling the truth there.

same thing happens in western "role" playing games.

>you cannot join them because then you'd be dead and the story would end

>I can't win at all but I'll totally win someday!
Jesus, pretending to be a cartoon villain now are you? Calling it "refusing to listen" when I've been refuting claims with evidence and argumentation is just laughable, get the fuck out of here you clown.

I'd say this is more of a cultural thing.
>>Japanese: Is he trying to take his own life?
This is a very Japanese thing and would easily make people think "no shit", the English localization is more fitting in the context of what they were going for.

>sadu is a gyaru slut
ofc

Can't you join the big bad boss at the end of Neverwinter Nights 2?

>tfw you can’t 100 speech Emet-Selch into a peaceful resolution

At least there isn’t a chance to fuck it up royally. Pic related.

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The fact that you were able to take down one of those godlike ayyyys at full power speaks volumes to how ridiculous the WoL is getting though.

Well, not sure why you joined the conversation on that end then, as it's literally been me arguing the echo, tempering and the blessing are separate things vs a bunch of fools arguing they're all one and the same.

>
user... come the fuck on now, you're better than this. TEMPERING IS NOT JUST OVERCOME BY SOMEONE WHISPERING IN YOUR FUCKING EAR YOU LEMMING. There's also clear evidence that will doesn't need to forcefully be exerted, unless you want to argue Ramuh was lying.

user, you're the one suggesting he couldn't possibly have lied because he also told the truth a lot, as if telling the truth a bunch means you cannot also lie.

Get the fuck out of here you low tier troll.

The WoL didn’t do it alone though. There were 7 other powerful nonspecific “champions of the rift” to help out, and even they had to lean heavily on the Blessing of Light to avoid getting ganked by Hades’ power.

The Scions also helped deliver the coup-de-grace too.