The real victim of warcraft: Arthas

They used the shittiest looking sword to destroy frostmourne

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He lied to his men and betrayed the mercenaries who fought fof him

It could have been way worse, the scourge could have spread across the country if he hadn't purge the city.

He should have forgotten that business and led his men home

There was no undead anymore after the purge. Play the fucking game.
Also it's not a matter of saving Stratholme sherlock, it's a matter of saving the whole kingdom.

You mean like they did anyway?

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you know what they say, winners write the history.

that is a zoomer sword.

But it wasn't because of Stratholme at least.

>If Arthas didn't purge Stratholme you end up with a whole city of undead

well no, they don't need to be plagued to be risen as undead. The cult of the damned just came in afterwards and raised them all anyways.

The only way to acutely have solved things was for the king to issue a state of emergency and asked for full support of the allied nations to entire lorderon and help stop the cult.

Things turned out bad because both arthus and the king thought they could solve this issue internally.

Never liked it too, it looks like a toy.

This is why we have customs offices.

>It happened anyway
>But it didn’t happen because of this
user please.

He delayed it and if he wasn't fucked up in the head because of his all revenge thing he could have actually save Lordaeron

Not him but you are a retard. We are talking about the Stratholme situation and you move the goal.
Yes indeed the undead eventually took over. What does it have to do with the fact that purging Stratholme was the right thing to do?

>Things turned out bad because both arthus and the king thought they could solve this issue internally.
That is quite literally the plot to every game or movie about zombies period.

You mean, exactly like how Lordaeron turned out?

Sorry again, but, what? Have you ever been to Stratholme post-arthas taking frostmourne? The city is burning, full of undeads and nerubians with only a small pocket of resistance by scarlet crusade humans who are themselves manipulated by the demons engineering the plague in the first place

He shanked his own pops mate, that's fucked up.

>What does it have to do with the fact that purging Stratholme was the right thing to do?
Because his dumbass fell for the bait not only once, not only twice, but three times afterwards. And he continued to fall for the bait until his ass went pale in Northrend and he came right back to slap the plague all throughout Lordaeron.

WoW story was always shit anyway. But at the end of the mission in warcraft 3, the city is purged, period. You even see Uther and Jaina walking through the streets with citizens helping to clean it.
Probably the undead took it again after the second invasion.

>There was no undead anymore after the purge. Play the fucking game
but I did

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>If Arthas wasn’t Arthas this whole thing wouldn’t have happened
Woah....

see

Goddamn that city has been on fire longer than it hasn’t.

the real victim of WoW are the humans who join the scarlet crusade and are treated as bad guys
>be part of an alliance, and one of the 7 kingdoms of men
>literal undead horrors, the kind of shit that would give you nightmares forever start rampaging through your villages, murdering, torturing and experimenting on people
>go to your leaders and ask for help with this obvious crisis
>Get told to go fuck yourself
>join a militia to defend yourself and your lands
>branded traitors and heretics for doing what must be done when your leaders (who took your fucking taxes) dont defend you

>muh bait
Doesn't change the fact that it was the right thing to do. If he wasn't betrayed by his fiancee, mentor, father, etc. he probably wouldn't have became crazy.

Yea, you wonder how the building are still standing, and how can people still breath.
WoW is so stupid.

>Uther, I saw how the plague work and it's not a regular disease.
>oh, that suck but I'll trust you.
>nah don't pursue that dude alone that's a bad idea, he might not even be there
Tenk u Uther u ar me best fren

ITT: wow babbies who got baited by OP to show their ignorance

>Right thing to do
Yeah because going alone instead of telling your father shit’s fucked is the right thing to do. Never mind Uther and Jaina they don’t hold any authority like Terenas did.

Here's a question: did Arthas ever actually die? The last time you see him before he's a death knight is in a cutscene after killing malganis. You see him walking in a snow storm with a caption akin to something like "consumed by madness and voices, Arthas wanders into the frozen wastes" now it's very probable that he died from the cold/hunger/scourge or whatever but it's never mentioned or implied. Death knight Arthas could be a living but corrupted(tm) human.

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>nananana l don't hear you, the story from WoW which is totally canon doesn't count

His father would have sent him to jail for purging the second city of the kingdom and fail to catch the dude responsable for this.
He didn't even want to quarantine them.

At the very least the fire should have gone out by now

>treat anybody who isnt with you as if they were scourge, even living people.
>torture for no good reason prisoners.

Dey good kids dey dindu muffins

You seem to think I’m talking about after the purge started and not when Arthas discovered the grain was poisoned. He could have gone right to his dad after Andorhal was attacked and raised the alarm

But no.

WoW retcons everything and has the worst "story". It's not even consistent on its own.
Tell me how a city can burn during 15 years, with buildings still intact and people walking in the streets?

This, Arthas fell right in Kel Thuzad and Mal'ganis' trap

chasing mal' ganis wasnt really needed and frosmourne was straight up reckless

>Tell me how a city can burn during 15 years, with buildings still intact and people walking in the streets?
Old Gods

>people completely abandoned by their government and left to fend for themselves whilst facing off one of the most horrific enemies in the world and hated by their own people become desperate

wow shocking

They probably thought it wasn't that bad. And it seems to take a lot of time to reach the capital anyway. This isn't WoW. For exemple Uther going from Stratholme to talk to the King who later send someone to say to Arthas to stop take months.

Demon magic user.Tell me how magical grain can suddenly turn millions of citizens into undead

The fact that you like or not is irrelevant. Its story is canon, and the whole of Lordaeron turns undead territory, which is exactly what the purging of Stratholme was supposed to prevent. So, he failed, and didn't take the right decisions.

Arthas was literally with Jaina who is a mage and can teleport.

Why did you describe the Forsaken?

I don't care about your shit lore. At the end of the mission, the city is purged, no more undeads, that's the whole point fucking dumbass.
Perhaps undead came back later when the REAL invasion happened.

Why didn't Jaina tp Uther to talk to his father immedialty, then tp back right before Arthas took the boats uh?
Perhaps tp only worked on few km.

>G-man abandoned me so I can do whatever I want, even kill people who also were left defenceless against the same horrors i have faced.
>It's PSTD I dont have to explain shit.

Strathome in WoW is half-infested with undead because the whole of Lordaeron later was. Arthas completely purged the city; Uther and Jaina walked through it in the aftermath.
He solved the problem, not the OP but mostly agree that Arthas was right. The undead in Stratholme that came later were part of the Scourge invasion, not the residents who fell to the Cult of The Damned's plagued-grain. It would seem weird if that part of Stratholme was still burning when WoW begins 10 years after the events of W3:Reign of Chaos.
This is where I think Arthas went wrong. His actions in Stratholme were logical and his conflict with Uther and Jaina is down to them not understanding that he had just spent 3 days defending a clean village from an endless swarm of undead after the surrounding villages were all infected. Arthas sent Jaina to get Uther and Uther and his knights took their sweet time coming to reinforce, which is why Arthas made the remark he did when Uther finally gets his ass to the outskirts of Stratholme. In Northrend, his men and Muradin knew the threat as well as he did; Muradin himself had been under-siege for who knows how long but with no hope of rescue before Arthas showed up. He did not have to lie or betray anyone, but it would have meant considering other points of view from others with equal experience of the undead.

Maybe but Jaina literally came from Darnassus right? Which means she could maybe only teleport herself or Darnassus had portals that went wherever Jaina needed to go. Although I remember her just randomy appearing. Or it can be explained Jaina loved Arthas and was blinded by love and Arthas was trying to take the lead on dealing with the scourge

>why did they dump so much water on that wildfire?
>to try to put it out
>yeah, but the fire burned anyway
>sure, but it may have spread much faster and caused more damage otherwise
>but the fire still spread! The firemen should have just stayed home!

He's baiting you or he's actually retarded, regardless I wouldn't bother anymore

>Why didn't Jaina tp Uther to talk to his father immedialty, then tp back right before Arthas took the boats uh?
Because they’re both retarded kids

But i can understand WoWbabs hating Arthas.
In Wotlk he's just a bad scooby doo villain, a coward, one of the most stupid character in WoW.
Too bad you guys missed out good video games.

>Equating necrotic and magically reanimated undead in a video game to a real life event
Take it and go

>Jaina
>Darnassus

I think you mean Dumblaran

>tfw there was no warcraft 4 dealing with the rise of the lich king in northrend and the sundering of the northern eastern kingdoms.

distinct lack of purgeposting

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Yeah fuck my ass i'm an idiot. But she clearly teleported to meet Arthas so idk what her fucking deal is. They should have alerted the King and alerted the full Alliance

Are you guys serious? It's just a location. I haven't played WoW, in my head it's not even canon, but I understand why they would have a perpetually burning location that looks nice rather than saying "OK that's long enough, let's ditch this map"

Doesnt matter. Its canon.

I liked the idea of having the Lich King be everywhere you went in northrend. I seriously wish it didn’t feel like it was played up for laughs though after the fifth time it happened

here's another guy who did nothing wrong

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It’s pretty silly when you think that Stratholme has been on fire for almost 20 years now

>the city is burning
exactly. you think the city has been on fire for years?

But what even is the timeline of warcraft 3 and WoW? Isn't WoW only like a year or two after W3? And you could make the argument that things in WoW aren't really linear (for example, if you do a Strat run it didn't take place far in the future it could have taken place only a year after W3 and another dungeon like BRD could take place 3 years after W3). Also there was tons of Human Kingdoms and the scourge was larger than just the grain plague so Strat could be argued to be full of the scourge and not grain plague victims and the fires could be from subsequent burning of the city.

generic anakin clone

Except even in the expanded WoW lore the city was a destroyed mess, but not under the effects of the plague until later on when the undead returned in force and took over the remnants.

So why didnt he send an evac for Sarah? I always imagined as his second in commens she knew many of his dirty secrets and he wanted to get rid of that loose end before becoming top dog

You’re arguing semantics and that’s retarded.

except ep 2 wasn't even released and that unlike anakin, arthas character was much, much better.

>being this obtuse
kill yourself.

You first faggot

Don't bother replying to him. He's a fucking retard.

I hope this is ironic, I need this to be ironic. Please just fucking stop holy shit.

>takes place before anakins downfall
You mean Anakin is an Arthas clone

No? If the city is purged successfully and then taken over after the soldiers departure that is not a semantic difference from the purge failing. Fuck is english your first language?

Based Muradin dabbing on these zoomers who never played WC3.

Yeah, no shit. He was betrayed by people who were close to him.
Especially Uther. I still don't understand why people consider him heroic. He completely failed and just watches until problems become way worse than they were and he continues to do so even after Arthas' downfall. Stupid asshat should've stood by him but no, just because there is a hard decision to be made, he ditches him and fucks off.

Are you retarded?

>Before becoming a death knight in the servitude of Ner'zhul, Arthas succeeded in destroying all of the sources of the Plague, leaving no way for them to further spread the disease

He canonically dies when putting on the Helm of Domination in the TFT ending cutscene. Before that, he just kinda looks dead. Being corrupted by necromantic power in the Warcraft universe just kinda does that to you, apparently.

Source: a blue post from eons ago that I honestly can't seem to find again.

>If women actually had sex with him, he wouldn't have to shoot up the school later
Is it incel hour alredy?

Uther is a complete Cuck
>Im Paladin, i protect the innocent from the Evil.
>Oh noo theyre all going to die and turn undead!
>I cant do the only thing im expected to do!
And they even dedicate a huge monument to this cuck.
Meanwhile Arthas
>Does the thing nobody wants to do but everybody expects you to do it.
>Gets shamed for doing it anyway
>Doesnt care, literal nazi!
What did Blizzard mean by this?

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Strathome has not been burning in the time between W3:RoC and the start of WoW. The undead in Stratholme in WoW are mostly not the same undead from RoC's Culling mission. Arthas killed everyone in the city because they were all turning. You see afterwards when Uther and Jaina are there, there's no undead, just a few people piling and burning bodies.

Since the Culling of Stratholme in the Human campaign of RoC, the whole of Lordaeron was invaded in the Undead campaign. Between games, Mal'ganis returned because unknown to Arthas- a demon of the Twisting Nether can only be killed permanently in the Twisting Nether. Their essence disperses and reforms, but Dreadlords are very good at it. He manipulated the Scarlet Crusade into making a bastion in Stratholme. Baron Rivendere was sent to get them out of the city as it would hinder future invasion plans. The Scourge and Scarlet Crusade have been fighting over the city since, hence the fires.

'generic' is Blizzards second name

See this makes the most sense to me. Where the fuck can I actually read about canon lore between W3 and WoW, the wikis dont seem to be the best at covering that period.

Really the issue was Arthas not explaining to uther the real threat, and uther being essentially late and retarded.
>we need to burn this city
>what, why?
>fuck you I said burn it in the king
Isn't going to work. If he had actually made it clear what was happening he probably have been able to convince uther, or at least kept him around to help long enough to see for himself.

Thanks
Yes

in WoW you do a questline where you find out when arthas was frozen on the throne he went into the crown, killed nehr'zul's soul, and took his own humanity out of him (his heart). you find it in a pit somewhere when looking for a way to stop him, then arthas finds you and destroys the heart for good so you cant use it against him. "evil" arthas died when we killed him in ICC

I didn't know it was so long.
I don't really understand what side you are on. All of those could be valid explanations for a setting like warcraft, still I think they just liked the map, and it does look good with that hellish atmosphere. In regards for the story's consistency, you can't seriously ask for that level of detail in a game so large.

>blizz keeps killing off major heroes/villains and putting zero effort into writing new ones unless absolutely necessary (like a faction needs a replacement leader)
WoW literally can't have more than one or two expansions left in it. They should have put more thought into their writing before they did stupid shit like having Taylor and Fordring killed off for le epic shock value by nobodies

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>the city was fine, right after he purged it. Jaina and Uther walked through it.

These guy's reasoning is as retarded as saying "the league of nations was right to let hitler have poland so he'd leave them alone". Yeah. It worked. He left them alone for a few months before attacking again.
Sure. Right after he killed everyone, the city was "safe". It still failed in the end because this ruthlesness when he was a paladin set him on the very path that would lead him to take frostmourne, kill his father, and lead the invasion that would take the whole of Lordaeron AND the very city he was supposed to have saved. God, warcraft lore isn't very subtle, so you guys must be special kinds of retards to have missed how pivotal the purging of the city was in making Arthas the very harbinger of what he sought to avoid at any cost.

>I don't really understand what side you are on
I don't know either lol. I'm kind of just trying to understand what happened to Strat between Arthas purging it and the events of WoW. I'm also trying to understand why a powerful as fuck wizard was such a retard

That's a retarded train of thought.
>he didn't properly foresee months into the future about effects he couldn't possible understand what would happen as a result of his actions now

>building is on fire
>put out the fire
>5 years later a hurricane knocks the building over and it kills someone
>fuck if we had just let it burned this would never have happened

Iirc that's Tirion who destroys the heart so Arthas gets incapacitated.
It's another one of these "scooby doo" moments.

How can you not see the issue with slaughtering tens of thousands of citizens even if they are infected?

Oh so it was just a great misunderstanding i see!
Arthas
>Uther theyre all going to die and turn undead we must kill them all!
Uther
>What is it? More work? No one else available... You're the king? Well, I didn't vote for you.

retard

you understand that everything was manipulated so that arthas can kill his dad, destabilize the whole kingdom, get the ashes, wipe the high elves, wipe some orcs, and OPEN THE fUCKing PORTAL to BEGIN THE DEMON INVASION.

if he never pulled out frostmourne, but rather tactically retreated from northrend, mal ganis would have attacked again and just lost.

Archimonde would never succesfully get summoned while the whole kingdom lies in ruins.

arthas "did" kill mal ganis, but became a powerful servant that ultimately started the invasion himself.

He must have assumed Jaina had explained it: she was there when they both discovered the Cult of The Damned's plan to spread the plague with contaminated grain. It's a shame that this issue never really gets re-visited later, we never find out how Jaina explained the situation to Uther. What's Jaina's excuse for turning away when Arthas made the decision? She didn't offer any alternative and she's meant to be a prodigy.
Unfortunately, the games themselves are the best source. The Frozen Throne expansion is a superb fore-shadowing of the bigger over-arching story of WoW with the Old Golds and Void Lords(which WoW really should have stuck to rather than burning everything in the dumpster fire of perpetual raid content). Books are also dotted around WoW, giving contextual details to events that happened, but more recent expansions had less of them and contributed towards me losing interest in staying subbed.

>there's zero psychological effect to killing an entire fucking city
Based INTJ user, human emotions dont exist

>let 10s of thousands of infected people roam the countryside at will
>not a far larger problem
The lore is clear. The purge worked. Yes it set him on the path to become the Lich king and make it far worse, but that could not have possibly been foreseen, nor could the immediate requirement to do something about the plague be ignored. It's not that Arthas decisions were wrong, it's that he was a pawn and what he did didn't really matter because the moves had been set in place without his knowledge long before he showed up.

He didnt die when he pulled Frostmourne but when put the lich king cap on Ner'zhul sucked hes soul and they combined their souls together and technically the Artha's body died at process. The body only served a purpose to carry the crown which connected the souls together.
Artha's spirit was freed from the Crown after he fell but Ner'zhul is still out there with Bolvar

>what is character development?
Arthas was a paladin. You know, light, and justice, and healing and chastising what is evil? He purged an entire city, probably killing some non-infested people in the process. It's not about foreseeing everything. It's about him turning more and more away from compassion or some shit for what he thinks is the good of the realm, when him losing his humanity little by little is precisely what will take him to become the Lich King and finishing off Lordaeron.

The story was bound to lose consistency. Their universe is too large. It was rather easy in the RTS games because they could focus on a few specific storylines, you don't have to explain everything. But suddenly you have an entire world, how the hell do you manage to make every important event impactfull everywhere? It's impossible!

I think you're right but also wrong. Like what Arthas did was clearly the right choice in terms of purging the city but mentally and emotionally it was an awful decision. It was also the beginning of the end for the kingdom. But further if it wasn't for Arthas it would have been someone else or the kingdom would have collapsed anyways. I think the end goal of the plague would have been fulfilled no matter what.

That's not really what happened
>there's a very unbelievable problem and here's the horrifying solution
>what? that's unbelievable and horrifying
>I'm ordering you to do it based on an authority I don't even have
Yeah, hardly top tier leadership principles.

Obviously it fucked him in his head, which is why Malganis plan is so good. However you can't predict that.
But at the moment there was no other solution. If you don't purge it's game over.
Tdlr, it was Arthas destiny.

>the wikis dont seem to be the best at covering that period
Shit like this annoys me, because there's actually some interesting things that takes place in the period.
Few people know that the Forsaken tried to establish peaceful contact with the Southern Kingdoms, but it fell through when the envoys (unsurprisingly) either didn't return, or were forcefully turned away.
Hell, Stormwind rising to be the most powerful human kingdom is in this time period, and we barely know anything about the Kingdom in those years.

Give me a WoW Prequel expansion for Warcraft 3 Reforged. Wasn't Stormwind small fish before the events of WoW? Seriously all this shit just happens in quest text or passing.

>Few people know that the Forsaken tried to establish peaceful contact with the Southern Kingdoms, but it fell through when the envoys (unsurprisingly) either didn't return, or were forcefully turned away.
is that some chronicles nu nu lore?

It's all Jaina's fault. Deep down she knows this too. We see it in her dreams and the vision her Mother witnesses. If she'd stayed, she could have prevented it all from happening.

Now she's a 50 year old wine aunt with no boyfriend, no children, no city and no apprentice. Stupid, stupid bitch.

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Well no shit, but that doesn't change that saying he is essentially to blame for doing what was effective at the time because of unforeseeable events far later on is ridiculous

>if you don't purge, it's over
Like, for example, evacuating villages around stratholme, setting a perimeter around the city...?

Compassion wouldnt save those people who were infected, bunch of virtuesignaling cucks. Paladins were trained to do the things nobody else could, theyre literally trained superhumans and Uther turning his back when he was needed was the ultimate cuck move.
Whats a good paladin if in the worst moments of evil you just turn your tail and curse the people actually willing to help at whatever the cost to their dignity.

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I remember reading it back when TBC was a thing, but I think it was referenced again in chronicles.
It was basically Blizzards explanation for why the Forsaken had joined the Horde, since trying to join their old allies would have made more sense.

>he did what he had to do
I think you're trying to hard to be edgy. If you don't see what's wrong with a knight-priest killing off citizens who are still humans at the time of their killing, I dunno what to say.

We don't know, but i assume that if Arthas came to that conclusion, it's that there was no other choice. Malganis is inside also.
It's the second city of the Kingdom, Arthas and Uther barely managed to defend a tiny city just before.

Well yes, either way it was all fucked. But that's not really an Arthas problem so much as he was just outplayed without even knowing the rules. I mean hindsight is 20/20 but really, if uther had stayed, done the best he could to mitigate the damage, and kept by Arthas side he and Jaina at the very least could probably have stopped him from taking frostmourne.

It's in vanilla and I recall it being in the manual or some quest text. The Forsaken tried to find a place in the Southern Kingdoms but SW (understandably) was not willing to ally up with a bunch of undead after Lorderan's fall. The only envoys that got accepted were in Thrall's court (they were almost killed) and Thrall only accepted the Forsaken because Theramore and Eastwatch were on Kalimdor and he wanted a deterant kingdom across the sea.

It's why undead start at neutral rep with the other horde factions.

You can argue all day whether Arthas was too blunt or not but it doesnt change the fact that Uther cucked and Arthas didnt.

majority of undead become evil which is why that one in the argent dawn in vanilla had to prove himself to grudgingly be accepted. it was the tauren who petitioned for them to join the horde thinking they could cure their corruption

Stormwind had been rebuild relatively recently by the time of WC3, so it was slowly growing again, and the fall of Lordaeron basically just handed them the title, when a bunch of people had fled from the north, and joined them.

Careful with that edge, son. Yeah, I'm sure you'll get all the respect your father and other people never gave you irl on /v for supporting a fictionnal character who "never did anything wrong"

It also helps that literally every other human kingdom in the Eastern Kingdoms was either destroyed, plagued, or closed off. Vanilla was a time when Kul Tiras, Stormwind, and Theramoore were the only human powers left.

I dont actually follow Nu-wow lore
what does Jaina see in her dreams and "her mothers visions"?

Whats happenimg to Arthas?

He literally viewed it as a mercy to be executed while still human than to be turned into a vicious monster and I can't say I disagree. In the situation they were in the choice was between the death of thousands from you action (who were all dead anyways) or the potential destruction of all life from inaction. Imagine a doctor willing to let you die from gangrene because he's too peaceful to amputate a limb. He may be more compassionate, but far less useful.

He returned the balde, completed the circle and released him from that prison

m.youtube.com/watch?v=ds1TX-jEh20

I dont know if you knew this but the point was to save their afterlife by not cursing them to be walking undead and possibly killing / infecting their families too.

I don't know if you're joking,a parameter? You do realize that completely closing off an enormous city with military force during an extreme food shortage is a pretty bad idea,right?

Gotta love how Thrall bragging about peace, invades Ashenvale and wants to expend the Horde back to the EK.
So much for the destiny of the Horde in Kalimdor.

Name a more kino part of WoW than the DK starting zone
God reading those scourge books made me wish for a permanent scourge faction

The Culling of Stratholme was not the pivotal moment in Arthas' turn towards evil. What happened in Andorhal just before it was far more compelling: his situation was hopeless and he protected it for 3 days, waiting for Uther to arrive with his knights. Arthas and Jaina had arrived from Tirisfal in less time than that and they were busy investigating the plague and weren't making a bee-line straight for Andorhal: Uther fucked up. Days without sleep or food, with waves of monsters coming from neighbouring villages. If you did the optional objective, then he even managed to stop the plague wagons directly infecting even more of them. Uther must have been sniffing flowers on the way and ignoring Jaina telling him about the zombie hordes she saw and infected food. That was the first choice he made: he chose to save Andorhal rather than go with Jaina, saving himself and his men. By contrast, based on his experience which was superior to Uther's and Uther apparently had been misinformed or just didn't listen to Jaina(we never find out which), he had no choice in the Culling of Stratholme. He had just fought a handful of villages turned into undead, imagine a whole city of them; they needed to be destroyed before they fully-changed. Arthas then can't be blamed for ignoring the warnings of Medievh; everyone else had dismissed him as a lunatic. Was anyone else suggesting Lordaeron be evacuated and they sail to Kalimdor? Medievh was clear that nothing else would work, so everyone at this point is just as wrong as Arthas about everything.

The second pivotal moment was Arthas' decision to cut-off the only escape from Northrend by burning the ships, lying to his men and betraying the mercenaries. This was a true decision, unlike the Culling.

It's not about amputating, here. We're talking about, for example, smashing children with a paladin hammer without even making sure whether they're infected or not. Look at this any way you want, it's incredibly harsh and it changed him.

Oh I know how they were let into the Horde.
I was more talking about why they would join the Horde over the Alliance, and it wasn't for a lack of trying.
I don't blame the Alliance though. At that point no one even knew that undead could be of the not-scourge kind, so if a group of undead approached my village/city, I would shoot on sight too.
I wonder if the envoys to the Horde worked, simply because they hadn't dealt with the scourge yet.

It took me a long time to realize that Arthas's story was just upside down King Arthur. Arthas is evil King Arthur, Frostmourne is evil Excalibur, Lich King is evil Merlin, and so on and so on.

Sylvanas betrays the last remains of the alliance in wc3, so it would be completely dumb for the alliance to accept them and suffer the same fate.
However WoW turns the forsaken into dindus so i'm not even sure if that moment is ever brought again.

Just a vision filled with Jaina's uncertainties and guilt. People were getting hyped because they all saw the Arthas model and thought he'd be showing up. She agonizes over leaving Arthas and betraying her Dad, then her Mom absolves her of the guilt and tells her she did nothing wrong.

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>he didnt find timmy and get frost revenants from him
>he didnt find the penguin king
>he didnt possess all the unique units
m.youtube.com/watch?v=536KpLoLBKg

Once again, ONCE A FUCKING GAIN. Purging Stratholme wouldn't have worked, didn't work, and you can see the fucking results in real fucking time both in WC3 and in WoW. All he did was destroy morale and chase off the strongest, most trustworthy paladin on the fucking planet. No one was saved, nothing good came from it. This shit was not organic it was designed to sow distrust and hatred because that's what dreadlords DO. You people are fucking retards.

>OP discovers that a character designed to be tragic and sympathetic is tragic and sympathetic
besides, he let his pride get to his head and that was his ultimate downfall

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God Jaina could have been such a decent character, but they've written her as such a mary sue fuck up. One thing after another after another. And she'll never have to actually answer for the shit she's done.

Alliance are the actual bad guys in vanilla. Kul Tiras and Eastwatch (an alliance military base set in Horde Heartlands) both start military actions against the Horde before vanilla starts.

>all those supplies and preparation
>they're still sitting on the floor
???

Uther and Jaina are both complete fuckwads who get way overhyped for how little they actual did/have done. Uther refused to listen Arthas, his protege from a young age who was proposing something horrible. He clearly wouldn't even suggest this if he didn't understand that it was the only possible solution. Also the faggot thought he had the power to strip people of the light like he was a god or something and even attempted to do so with Tirion. Yet he's regarded as one of the biggest heroes of the Alliance. Jaina was literally Athas' lover and again failed him by turning her back on him when she knows he wouldn't do this without just cause. Then she goes off to blow green dick and off her loving father for it only to be blown up into stonk women who is the most powerful mage ever when she was literally just a normal Dalaran student

>characters are presented with 2 options
one of them is a potential solution to the problem (or atleast let the doomed souls rest without being turned into monsters)
second one is to cuck out and run away/do nothing (theres go to be another way Arthas)(but theres no time left)
Which one should they choose to build their characters in the universe?

Didn't know that Kul Tiras was in WoW vanilla (or you are talking about the last soldiers of Daelin that Thrall didn't kill). KT wasn't part of the nu Alliance btw.
Doesn't matter : Thrall is a big hypocrite who invades Ashenvale. I think that's the only reason why the Nelves joined the Alliance.

Leave it, they're retard edgelords.

You got to see a bit of that in BC too with the Belf starting zone. The Belfs are reeling from having 90% of their population wiped out, and many that were left turned into withered. And then you have the Nelfs trying to sabotage their sanctums, and Dwarves trying to infiltrate. Fucked up.

You aren't very bright.
Yea congrat, you saw the futur unlike the characters from the game.
It doesn't change the fact that it was the good decision given the context. It's logic.

> turns the forsaken into dindus

Garithos was going to betray the forsaken and exterminate them. Slyvanas knew this and played him first since the Forsaken rather liked being awake in the real world again and everything around them was still their kingdom.

Vanilla Forsaken are legit evil and bitter though.

That's because the chinkz wanted a pretty race in Horde, so they came up with a shitty quest line to explain why Belves had to go Horde.
And as a side note, i love how despite being genocided, the Blood Elves are able to take back their kingdom on their own.

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Because it's tens of thousands and Arthas had just spent 3 days fighting mere hundreds before Uther pulled his finger out his ass.
I partially disagree with this: the Culling was inevitable. The alternative was asking Uther and Jaina to suggest a different plan, before they take so long to realise there isn't one that now enough people have turned to wipe them out. The Kirin Tor had requested that King Terenas allow them to institute quarantines when reports first came in about a plague and he had forbidden it. According to Medivh(who King Teranas dismissed in the same campaign intro), Lordaeron was already doomed. He had the power of prophecy, as did Ner'zhul, who was the mastermind of the plan being put into action to destroy the nation and take Arthas as his champion. I don't think Arthas had a choice in the Culling. He did have a choice in Andorhal and he chose right(defend the village rather than leave with Jaina), then later in Northrend where he chose wrong. You can't beat an opponent though if you don't know who they are and they can see the outcome of everything.

The Horde be raciss. He dindu nuffin. He a good boy, going to Strathlome erryday

Every decision Arthas made can be summarized thusly: He thinks it's the only way.
Is it? You don't know. What if a quarantine of Stratholme and guidance from Uther would've resulted in a war against the Scourge and not the slaughter of the, still human, city? What if the united forces of Lordaeron could've beaten back the Scourge? What if Arthas' and Muradin's presence in the Dragonblight Battle would've turned the tide and enabled them to kill Malganis? You don't know, and there is no way to know. Arthas never stopped to consider another option because he felt that there was simply no time to deliberate and that decisions had to be made, and they had to be made now. No matter who suffers because of it.
Arthas was neither right nor wrong in anything he did.

Honestly, I unironically agree. Every one of his choices was desperate, but defensible. Road to hell I guess.

Ultimately, Uther just stood there and complained, Arthas did something.

youtu.be/0Jwb73Wx8og?t=4m49s
youtu.be/OqTw97Y1rXY?t=4m51s

But according to the game manual, you learn that his people is the thing that he loves the most. Either he's a retard, either he really considered all of the other options.

Shut the fuck up, literally nobody played horde before TBC and every server was heavily skewed towards Alliance, simple fact of the matter is that not just chinks, but most of fucking allicucks couldn't handle playing non-pretty races, so they released belves to balance the factions.

The last expansion may have been mostly ass but Jaina realizing that had the two people Arthas loved the most not fucking abandoned him in his literal darkest hour he may have been able to be saved, was good.

Kul Tiras has a military base that's wiped out in Cata and are strictly there to kill travelers and waylay caravans.

Eastwatch is part of the alliance and is a much larger base that was conducting expansion operations.

Ashenvale is gray because night elves don't want to even entertain talks and the only source of large scale lumber in Kalimdor is either too far from Durotar or controlled by night elves. Any reasonable civilization would open trade, but the night elves weren't ever going to forgive Thrall because Grom chimped out and found elves that nobody knew existed.

Dwarves and Night Elves are also the only reasons the Blood Elves join Horde. Their quests in TBC actually has them swaying to Alliance before the sabotages. I still think night elves sailing across the sea to attack blood elves was fucking retarded

This was confirmed by a dev. According to a poll, asians would only play Horde if it had a pretty race.

Lordaeron is his people, not just Stratholme, not just the Northrend Expedition. If they have to die to give Lordaeron a chance to survive, then so be it. Because if the Scourge was allowed to live and fester, it sure as fuck wouldn't.

Lol, no. This was only true in Asia.

> non-pretty races

I mean that's an understatement. Every horde race had forward head posture and hunchbacks and most of them didn't have working shoes.

I read somewhere it was revenge against her because of some lore backstory thingy

You lost your mind OP

Oh yeah what if Blizzard wrote the story the way i want it and there actually was another way! This means Arthas bad! Clearly he was just impatient, if he just let Jaina out of the Woman cage she was chained in she could have saved everyone. She could have Flooded Stratholme with her magik powers and flushed the undeadd away!
Why are so many people here obsessed with things that they could have done when the characters were presented with only 1 option in the beginning anyway? Blizzard didnt care to give more information so more information was not necessary to drive the point home.

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Trolls were one of the coolest races WoW had and everyone can fuck right off if they say otherwise.

There's no justification for Orcs still being in Ashenvale. And Nelves would never let them take their trees at any cost.
Yes Night Elf hating Blood Elves, especially after TFT is dumb.

What? Fordring is based and thanks to his vanilla questline is possibly the only character they developed properly throughout the entirety of WoW.

>it's not thrall's fault! the night elves should have just given the orcs whatever they wanted! the orcs had no choice but to invade! really, the night elves were the bad guys for holding out on their land
nice to see the Horde is STILL the dindu nuffin facrion

He's cringe. The way he yells at Arthas like he knows him, and "you gonna pay for da crimes".
Like bitch what are you talking about? Where were you during the fucking scourge invasion to talk in the first place?

It did work. The population of Stratholme after Arthas was done was 0 living and 0 undead, who were not coming back. What you see in WoW are undead brought to the city by Baron Rivendere to push out the Scarlet Crusade who were under the control of Mal'ganis. Arthas was not being played by Mal'ganis: Mal'ganis was being played by Ner'zhul. He did not expect Arthas to strike him, but Arthas did because Ner'zhul told him to through the sword. Ner'zhul needed Mal'ganis specifically out of the way so he could condition Arthas without interference over the months he wandered aimlessly around Northrend, knowing Mal'ganis would be replaced by Tichondrius. I agree that in the long-run Lordaeron was doomed(as Medivh had warned), but hindsight is 20/20 and can't informed Arthas' decision at the time, which was flawless despite him having days without sleep. The only characters in the story who can see into the future are Medivh and Ner'zhul; one is dismissed as a fraud, the other is unknown to the main characters at this point.

night elves didn't want to trade and had a super-monopoly on a resource they stated they'd die defending.

sometimes you just got to do what's right for your people.

based green nigger

You literally don't get it.
The point is that, yes, there could've been other ways, Arthas simply chose to not waste time to look for better solutions. He took the best thing he had at the moment a problem presented itself. It doesn't matter in the slightest whether or not there was a better way or what information Blizzard gave us. I mean, we KNOW that Arthas was right in saying that the city had to be purged, that there was no other way to save anyone. The plague has absolutely no cure whatsoever. Except for those dumbass fucking quests in WoW where it does, inexplicably. Yeah, I bet some random ass moron can cure plagues that Alexstrasza and the fucking Naaru can't. Sure.

Hes got a questline and a kill x mobs here bring me food etc in Vanilla then TBC nothing and WTLK hes suddenly a major character. Hes literally a nobody untill blizzard decides they need a major paladin character for all the larpers to fap to but "Oh Uther is dead so we need someone else"

>like he knows him

They were both knights of the silver hand. Arthas dismantled them, killed his former brothers, destroyed his once-beloved people, and took away most of what Fordring loved most. He killed his faith in the light and Fordring was one of the last of the former silver hand left when you find him.

He absolutely would have a big beef with Arthas.

He was right on Stratheholme but wrong on going to Northrend. Going to Northrend directly resulted in Archimonde being summoned.

And use nelf womb as a resource while you are at it since Orc males had really rough times (not that Tyrande would complain).

Except his soldiers turned to scourge soldiers immediately after he killed Mal'Ganis, if he had just listened to his father or excercised common sense and stayed to resolve the political situation between him and Uther, then Lordaeron likely would have been far more prepared for undead and demon shenanigans. The best argument you use to justify Arthas is that his joining of Ner'zhul furthered the LK's plans to escape from demon prison which weakens the presence of the burning legion in Azeroth, but other than the mission where Arthas drops a dime to Illidan about the location of the skull of Gul'dan, I'm not sure that it matters much to the races that don't want to be undead slaves.

This is the only correct opinion. Orcs need lumber for everything from cooking food to building homes and ships for trade and the only source of it required aggressive actions.

He was hiding like the faggot he is during the whole invasion while Arthas was fighting on the front line to repel the Scourge.
Where was this pussy when DK Arthas came back and destroyed the paladin order? Oh, yea, hiding again.
He was not part of the story.
This guy stole the vengeance of the Forsaken/Blood Elves also.

They did. Arthas took the army to northrend

>Oh god please help, I'm suddenly Warchief and my predecessor decided to settle in a barren fucking wasteland while we have semi-fertile land nearby-ish, please, we need lumber and resources.
>lol nah
>My people are literally fucking starving, you can't do this to us, and I can't let the Horde die out like this, no matter what.
>Oh yeah, what are you gonna do? Invade our woods and take our lumber by force?

The Nightelves are to blame for Hellscream becoming a cunt.

And then what? The people would still turn and then you have a literal army of undead in a city... solid plan bro?

To be fair, no one in Stormwind would have known about that, since she killed all the witnesses too.
I think the moment have been brought up a few times, mostly by Sylvanas herself, or by people speaking to her.
I think that Garithos had no right to turn the Forsaken ways from the city, since they were as much people of Lordaeon as he was. But Sylvanas still back stabbed him, and his other men, who we don't even know if they agreed with him, and that is a shitty act, that sadly isn't brought up enough.

>Vanilla Forsaken are legit evil and bitter though.
Everyone thinks you're monsters, even your former, and current allies. I don't blame most of them, feeling like.
Though there being more decent to good people as part of the Forsaken is one of the only things Cataclysm improved upon, compared to Vanilla.

tough shit, orcs were literally alien invaders. tough shit they lacked the resources to build a civilization in the ugly land they specifically settled on because it reminded them of home, on a planet they had no claim to or right to be on, where they are in the first place because they fucked up their old world. that's not an argument for starting a war with a civilization that revolves around the forests that specifically exist because they nurture them

literal dindu nuffin race

>What do you mean we can just pack up and go back home to Nagrand, where I completely fucking abandoned my people to live here in luxury??? FUCK YOU GIBS ME DATS OR DIE!!
Truly a sympathetic character.

Not really, there were plenty of trees in the barrens.

ITT. bunch of faggots who never completed the campaign on insane difficulty

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weird flex but ok

>Species who was manipulated by demonic forces but recently changed its ways and attempted to go a new path refused vital supplies by species who was manipulated by demonic forces and changed its ways a long time ago because fuck you you were manipulated by demonic forces and deserve to die

Tree Niggers deserve what they get.

sitting on the floor is max comfy, dude

im a 30 year old man and i sit on the floor to use my computer

There wasn't, and that was a major plot point.

Based and trollpilled

The King alerts the troops by sending an emissary. Why not use someone who can tp, so he can reach arthas troops before the even leave for Northrend?

> I mean, we KNOW that Arthas was right in saying that the city had to be purged, that there was no other way to save anyone
> The plague has absolutely no cure whatsoever.
Yes regardless if it worked or not my argument is that Uther is a cuck and disgraced himself that day simply because "muh feels"
But also that Arthas knew he wasnt curing them (who the fuck thinks otherwise? just spam cleanse lol) he was giving them a swift death and a normal(ish) death instead of becoming undead. Uther was giving them death and eternal torment as undead.

>there were plenty of trees in the barrens
It's literally named "The BARRENS", beside the three oasis, and the odd tree here and there, it's open grassland.

>abandoned my people to live here in luxury?
Durotar was a fucking shit hole. Thrall always intended it to be a fucking shit hole. It's literal purpose was to be a fucking shit hole. When Garrosh took over, he saw his people living in squalor and thought "No, fuck this, we are done suffering for penance, we deserve a decent life". And then he made Orgrimmar great. Besides, just because your character can go willy-nilly from Azeroth to Outland doesn't mean that's possible in lore. Travel between the two worlds was stated to be increasingly difficult after the end of Burning Crusade. Exceptions could be made and portals opened for high-profile heroes like you, but to take FUCKING ORGRIMMAR and move it to Outland is ludicrous. Besides, you really think that the entirety of the Orcish Horde would be able to settle in Nagrand? Where, may I remind you, the single friendly settlement they have is ONE village and everything else has been wiped clean from the map? On a dying world that is LITERALLY breaking apart?

The Nightelves had a chance to change the entire relationship with the Horde after Thrall stepped down and a new Warchief took the throne, who ACTIVELY reached out to them for help. The Elves can harvest lumber without harming the trees, so they would've literally lost nothing but time from this. They declined out of nothing but pettiness and their shortsightedness soured the relations between Alliance and Horde, making it increasingly easy for the Twilight's Hammer to incite another war. Fuck Nelves. They deserve everything that has happened to them.

At the end of his vanilla questline he specifically states he's going to refound the Silver Hand to stop the infighting and unite all the anti-scourge factions under one banner, which explains his prominence in fighting them later on.

I agree giving him Ashbringer and having the Silver Hand absorbed by the Argent Dawn right at the start of WotLK was a little too convenient, but whatever.

arthas had no choice in his role in becoming the lich king
hes literally wows version of judas

Do worgen have knots?

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yes

furfag take your (you) and get out

There is no insane difficulty

No it wasn't, there were trees, you literally build a base with them in thralls part of the campaign.

Wtf is your problem? Nelves aren't responsable for your genocial invaders personal issues.
>Fuck Nelves.
Oh don't worry, they love it.

>What if a quarantine?
King Teranas had forbidden this just days earlier, in the introduction to the Alliance campaign. He had requested proof of the claims from the Kirin Tor about the plague, a task that Archmage Antondias assigned to Jaina. The King appointed Arthas as her escort. The Cult of The Damned were already delivering plague-grain when they began, possibly rushing their plans ahead of a rumoured quanrantine. It makes sense to quarantine villages though. What would have happened if Stratholme had been quarantined though? I'm talking about this from the perspective of the characters who were there and had to make their respective decisions: they don't know about Mal'ganis, who would then proceed to collect undead and teleport them out of the city(possibly anticipating a qurantine). Well, from their point of view: everyone in Stratholme dies by either turning undead or being killed by undead. The result is the same, except now everyone in Lordaeron's largest city is undead, inside of a giant Kirin Tor bubble. The decision would eventually have to be made to incinerate everything inside the bubble, because the whole time there would be the risk of just a single necro-organism escaping and infecting the outside. That possibility is avoided by Arthas using his experience at Andorhal to eliminate the risk first.

Actually, no, the purge was incomplete in WC3 and they were not brought to the city. It's why much of what you fight in WoW are literal fucking citizens of Stratholme with names and titles and everything. Your whole post is far more after-the-fact than mine, you are making shit up to justify your ridiculous edgelord belief that the culling was justified when it obviously wasn't. Mal'ganis was definitely playing Arthas, that was the whole fucking point. Yes, he was also betrayed by Ner'zhul, but not by that point. He was doing his job as a dreadlord which was to fuck shit up and divide people.

Fact: Arthas destroyed morale, killed a ton of uninfected people, destroyed Stratholme, and lost the support of Uther the fucking Lightbringer. Arthas knew all of these things were happening and either let them happen or was the direct cause. He could have, at any point before the Northrend campaign, stopped. Instead, he fucking ruined everything. This isn't hindsight, the game beats you over the head with the fact that Arthas is constantly making bad decisions. You people are still fucking retards.

Because they don't know where they are? Duh

Orcs are niggers,even without demonic manipulation,look at WoD

>defending a clean village
Not entirely clean.

youtu.be/eJ81o9fs8cI?t=1247

All these niggas trying to look cool saying Arthas did the right thing when they dont realize it's supposed to mirror Sargeras shattering a world-soul because it was infected by the old gods, thinking it was the "harsh but necessary solution" before being judged by other titans who wanted at least to try and save the world-soul before killing it.

He didn't fall for a trap. It was his unavoidable destiny to end up on the throne. Its like you retards never paid attention. Any choices arthas made were inconsequential to him becoming the lich king

Mal'ganis would show himself to Arthas to incite him to come in and fight. His purpose was to piss off Arthas enough so that he would come to Northrend and take Frostmourne, after all.

Only in wow dumpass

>to mirror Sargeras shattering a world-soul
WoW lore isn't relevant here
>thinking it was the "harsh but necessary solution"
Until Illidan happened, and suddenly it's cool to do bad stuff in order of saving da world.

It's not wow lore, it's just lore.

>Arthas is constantly making bad decisions

He stops making bad decisions at the start of the undead campaign.

One base, and Thrall was asking for a capital city.

> killed a ton of uninfected people
well you dont have confirmation for this, the game pretty much states theyre all infected so i guess its (you) who are making shit up, theres nothing edgelord in saying that Arthas did when Uther cucked out. Its not up to the Paladin to just cry in a fetal position while your people are diseased and about to die a horrible death and resurrect as the undead. Leave that to the women characters(or Uther lmao)

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>At least try to save plague infected people before putting them out of their misery and avoiding them becoming zombies
do go on, you're really on to something here

It is wow lore because it happens in wow

Thrall asks for a settlement lol, not a capital

Options
>Let all these people suffer and watch their loved ones suffer and kill them as they turn into Undead monstrosities only to be all killed later on. Only to find there is no cure.
Option 2
>Barricade the city and kill any citizen as swiftly and humanely as possible before they can infect other cities and destroy an entire kingdom but be judged harshly for having to make a hard decision that possibly slowed down a terrible plague and potentially saved the entirety of Eastern Kingdom(Not just Lordaeron)

Truly a hard choice here.

Garrosh would've been a good boy if the Nelves simply acted friendly and supported him. It's their dickish behavior that made him think "fuck the Alliance, orcs is best" because they're the ones who really made him feel that he and the orcs were alone and that no one would ever willingly help them on Azeroth. He states in a book that he'd be downright proud of it if he orchestrated the massacre in Ashenvale. Doesn't sound like the same person that requested help to save his starving people before.

>In a book
Haha

>all these niggas
its niggers user, you can say the "hard" R here dont worry theres no downvoting here!

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do you have any more rare chads?

>invade a planet
>intentionally set up camp in a shithole
>wtf this place sucks please give us your land instead
>"what? no"
>okay we're going to slaughter you all now and tear your forest down, this is your fault, you made us do this
>hordelets find nothing wrong with this

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ok retard

.....for fucks sake

Yes, Blizzard storytelling is fucking abysmal and they can never be assed to actually present incredibly relevant events IN THE FUCKING GAMES, but they're canon.
Man, priest players are going to be so fucking pissed in 8.2.5 when Calia is suddenly dead and a massively titted blinged out whore instead of the calm, humble priestess she was in Legion.

Oh, is this a "Characters that did nothing wrong" thread?

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>Besides, just because your character can go willy-nilly from Azeroth to Outland doesn't mean that's possible in lore.
Except there is literal horde bases in Outland, and several characters in-lore travel between Outland and Azeroth "willy-nilly"

Why even try this excuse when it's so incredibly obviously untrue? How retarded are you buddy?

>Durotar was a fucking shit hole.
Way to dance around the actual issue; The fucker abandoned his people after failing them for years, and he never once turns it around, he doesn't give a fuck about his own people and then drags his "horde" into a losing conflict over luxury resources he wants to steal.

>The Nightelves should have just given them lumber!
Yea people who have been stealing from you and killing your kind for about a decade come around and now ask for the shit they have been taking from you, how dare those dastardly night elves not just give it to them!

Again, how retarded are you to even entertain this line of logic?

What a fucking cuck. If a Hospital had Patient Zero with a disease that could spread a fucking pandemic, and it begins to spread inside the Hospital it should be destroyed. With the people inside to save mankind. A couple hundred people dying to save millions is the best option.

>give us your land
no
>trade some lumber and resources with us so we don't die like fucking dogs in the streets
yes

I play alliance, but the world really belongs to the trolls and old gods.

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>Horde fuck up Draenor, fuck up Azeroth, move to Azeroth, fuck up Kalimdor, screw over dozens of indigenous tribes and races for their own greed and bloodlust (fuck the quillboar especially)
>"BAWWW WHY WONT PEOPLE GIVE US MORE SHIT WTF GUUUUIIIIISE"
Imagine unironically sympathizing with the Horde, lmao.

oh they only wanted the night elves' resources, not the land itself. well that makes it all better!

the mind of a hordebabby lol

Haha no, old gods maybe, but not the trolls, Vrykul -> humans have a more legit ancestry.

Honestly by that logic hand it all over to the Silithid instead.

>I like bad demon guy hes a good guy but does bad thing for good reason!
>Fuck Arthas hes a bad guy because he does a bad thing for good reason!

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you mean those sacred tree's they were sworn to protect? yeah i agree what a bunch of assholes

>Except there is literal horde bases in Outland
Base. One.
Only Thralmar remains as a lightly manned scouting post for Legion activity, and it hasn't been mentioned since Legion, every other base has been dismantled. Or do you seriously believe that your Garrison and the Ashran bases on Draenor were still settled and used after the death of Archimonde? Gamelore disagrees with you.

>he doesn't give a fuck about his own people
He took as many with him as wanted to come. What else is he to do, force em to leave their ancestral home? The older orcs refused to leave.

>just given them lumber!
Trade. And, yes, unironically, they SHOULD have traded lumber with the savages who have been stealing from them, killing their kind for about a decade and now ask for the shit they have been taking from you after you just endured a massive, joint war campaign to end one of the biggest threats to the planet and their leadership just has changed. I absolutely agree, how dare those dastardly night elves not just trade it to them. Fucking retards. Biggest diplomatic opportunity they had since joining the Alliance and they spit in its face.

>amerilards with nigger cum flowing through their veins see no problem with invading others and looting, murdering, and destroying civilizations for their own personal gain, after all its an act of aggression to defend their sovereignty
no way bro didn't see that coming

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The world belongs to the fucking elementals!
They were there before anyone, even the Old gods.

As far as I remember, the trolls were servants of the old gods. Vrykul are still titan constructs, invaders that came along much later.

the point is that there was no other option. arthas had no idea at the time if what he was doing was going to work but it was a last ditch effort to do something because uther and everyone else was being completely useless and refused to do anything about it. uther and jaina literally just walked away from the problem without a solution. what would have happened if arthas did the same? they found purging the city to be morally abhorrent but letting everyone inside wither and die without doing anything at all is the alternative? how is that more morally just than what arthas did?

sure we know NOW after the fact that strat was fucked either way, but you can't use that knowledge to criticize arthas for not being able to predict the future.

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Why did you post a character who is literally responsible for all the wrongs in the world because he lusted after his brother's wife and is too pathetic to get over it?

He is the most pathetic character in the story by an absurd margin, a laughably pathetic cartoon villain who cannot do anything right and comically fails at everything he aspires to do.

Nothing wrong with using fire to fight fire, also, I never said Arthas did anything wrong. His only mistake was picking up that fucking sword.

I see you there, Aszhara.

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i agree user im just shitposting

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>Base. One.
>What is Zangarmarsh
I mean there are literally Horde bases all over Outland nigger, what the fuck are you smoking? Why are you pretending to be retarded?

You clearly don't have a fucking clue about the world or the lore, and nobody should be taking your bullshit seriously, you yourself should be fucking ashamed of the bullshit you're peddling, go back and actually learn what the fuck you're talking about before you open your retarded mouth on the matter.

>He took as many with him as wanted to come. What else is he to do, force em to leave their ancestral home? The older orcs refused to leave.
How about not leaving? Oh wait no that actually sounds somewhat reasonable, and we cannot have a retard like Garrosh do anything reasonable.

>Trade.
Uhuh, someone who has been stealing from you and murdering your people offers you trade, you should just accept lmao :^)

Or you know, don't trust the murderous savages that make unreasonable demands because they fucked up their own homes AGAIN.

Why yes, I do appreciate characters that are fallible and make mistakes rather than being 100 percent mary sues that only make the best decisions in all situations. How could you tell?

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All Jaina had to do was not abandon her fucking boyfriend during the most difficult decision of his life. Same for Uther. Arthas is like Anakin in Ep 3, his two primary emotional anchors just fuck off and then are surprised when he turns into a bad guy.

How many dicks has jaina took at this point and how many of those dicks ended up killable?

>be teenager arthas and sexually frustrated
>trying to impress vajaina
>if i defeat scourge i'll get her powsy yes!
>show how manly I am by being bossy around Uther the fagbringer
>muradin is a manlet
>(((he))) tells him to slay incel Mal'ganis and his army

The Sporeali sided with the Horde?

>The caution urged by the Shadow Council fell on deaf ears when the clan chieftains learned of how seemingly weak the native humans of the area were. Bloodlust soon overcame the Horde, and they launched a preemptive strike against the most powerful establishment of humans in the area, the Kingdom of Stormwind. Lead by Cho'gall of the Twilight's Hammer Clan and Kilrogg Deadeye of the Bleeding Hollow Clan, this attack ended in a humiliating defeat for the Horde. Each chieftain blamed the other for this failure, and the Horde split into two factions. The Shadow Council attempted to reunite the Horde, but could not act directly, and so they chose an avatar to act as their puppet ruler: Blackhand the Destroyer was named Warchief of all the Horde once again.

Why are Orcs like this? The second they heard that the Humans that lived on Azeroth were weak(They hadn't yet seen them) they immediately decided to kill them all without even stepping foot on Azeroth yet.

You are literally so stupid that you can't grasp the concept of time moving on after an expansion has ended. You think that the Naaru are still sieging the Black Temple to depose Illidan and that Kil'jaeden is about to rise from the Sunwell.
You think Arthas, the Lich King, has active armies in Northrend and is about to unleash the Scourge on the world.
You believe that Deathwing is flying around Azeroth, burning random areas and that Ragnaros is currently trying to burn down Hyjal.
You believe that Thrall, Garrosh, Vol'jin and Sylvanas are all currently the warchief of the Horde and are all currently trying to invade Pandaria for the Horde.
You think that the Legion is currently invading world wide and Argus is closer to Azeroth than the fucking moon.

th-the humans should have just given them whatever they wanted, its their fault for resisting

If orcs died like dogs in the street that would be moving up in the world for them

>Yeah. It worked. He left them alone for a few months before attacking again.
England and France declared war while Germany showed no sign of aggression towards them. If you tell me you're going to kill me and then I beat your ass I'm not the bad guy.

Why wouldn't Jaina abandon the guy who just went mental?

>the crown prince doesn't have authority

>yielding to a demon tainted race that takes pleasure in murder
yeah lol

It really is funny because the Horde defenders don't even try to defend what actually happened.

The Orcs didn't want ANYTHING!
They literally just wanted to kill the Humans just because they could lmao.
The same with how they did the Gronn, Saberon, Arrakoa, Botani, Draenei, Ogres, etc

I mean we're talking about completely different people here. Why defend it when it is
A) True
B) Doesn't contradict anything I say or believe.
The old Horde was fucked up, and fun. I wish we had them back.

Because user, originally the Orcs were supposed to be a cartoon villain bad guy faction with no redeeming good guy qualities. But then Warcraft 3 happened and people like todays zoomers wouldnt have liked to play the bad guys (imagine zoomers playing as the nazis in Call of Duty 25 you cant have that its literally Shoah) so they had to make Orcs into a more likeable good guy faction.

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I think the bigger crime is that all that food is going to be cold by the time anyone settles in. No one's even in there yet. Unless that's the point, I just noticed the cake is a birthday cake.

Why doesn't Sylvanas suck Illidan's dick and thank him for everything he did for her daily?

Illidan literally staged an attack on the Lich King in Icecrown Citadel which weakened Arthas' hold on the Undead that became the Forsaken including Sylvanas.
Without Illidan the Forsaken would still be bound to the Lich King forever.

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dude's obviously got money, people are going to be there whether or not they actually like him

Kel'thuzad matters more to summoning Archimonde. Remember the entire plan was concocted by Ner'zhul, who can see future outcomes and Kel'thuzad warned Arthas that his death 'would mean little' right before Arthas killed him. Medivh is Ner'zhul's only opponent who can also see into the future and Medivh's determination is that Lordaeron is already doomed. The fact he even tries warning Arthas means that Medivh has determined Arthas isn't actually necessary in regards the Burning Legion invasion. Medievh unfortunately is focused on the Legion and doesn't realise Ner'zhul's interest in Arthas is about his own survival(though the Dreadlords start to get suspicious). Once the Undead campaign is finished, Arthas does not appear in Warcraft 3's story again until near the end and he's acting against the Burning Legion secretly. This leads to Illidan killing Tichondrius(on the mortal plane), absorbing the power from the skull of Gul'dan to become a demon and weakening the control that the Dreadlords had over the Scourge, which increases Ner'zhul's control over them. Realising they've been betrayed, Kil'Jadeen appears to Illidan and bargains with him to kill Ner'zhul for him. This is where the hows and whys of Ner'zhul's plan for Arthas are revealed in The Frozen Throne expansion for Warcraft 3.

You're right until your frostmourne point which is absolutely retarded. The frostmourne part is what makes it compelling because it's a genuine mistake by arthas. He doesn't believe in himself, but he's also afraid for the fate of the expedition and his kingdom because the outcome of the battle is uncertain. He's also fixated on revenge at this point, it's not just entirely about protecting his lands. Arthas is almost completely right in every decision. Almost. If he was then it would be boring.

Also you're forgetting the fact that pulling the sword out doomed his men and his entire fucking kingdom so that sort of throws your whole point out the window.

>illidan is the reason we're stuck with the worst faction/leader in the entire series
fucking elf nigger

The city was literally infected. Arthas wasn't mental, he was right. Did you even play the game? You see the villagers eating the plague grain. Jaina abandons him because it's mean and scary to kill people who are going to turn into ravenous mindless zombies and ravage the countryside.

The only argument anyone has against purging Stratholme is that "do nothing" is a good strategy.

God what a shit character. Imagine actually liking this gay loser lmao.

Wow, that image explains why he used magic in a duel.

Is there a video or something somewhere that has all the lore bits (in-game cinematics, cutscenes, hell even youtuber explaining it) about the clusterfuck that took place since WC3?
I'm partially asking this because I came thousands of loads to that slut but have no idea what actually happened to her in the mmo.

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Whaddya mean you don't like stupid bitch whose only motivation is she doesn't want to die and becomes the leader of the horde just because?

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One of the best written. You may want to quit warcraft.

Sylvanas' entire current character arc and motivation is literally "Just you all wait, she's not really evil, you will all be ashamed of your words and deeds."

I find it funny that Horde players defend her as a good person that loves the Horde when she herself says things like "You will all serve me in Undeath" and kills Horde troops before she kills Alliance ones.

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Who builds all these scary castles? Like who built BT. It couldn't have been slaves, the architecture is too professional.

Imagine thinking this is a person who actually cares about the Horde.

Literally one of the Horde campaign quests she threatens all the leaders of the Horde that she will kill each and every one of them if they ever step out of line.

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>best written

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>he was correct in pursuing mal'ganis and not letting the king stop the fight
How so? It was his downfall. He was playing right into the hands of his enemy. He got trolled and it worked.

>she's not really evil
i mean yeah we know blizzard's not going to kill her and she's going to end up having some secret knowledge that explains her actions after all but she's still a fucking evil person regardless, there is no justifying everything she's done to the world and its people

The temple itself was an old Draenei temple and Orcish warlocks simply used Fel-Magic to erect and corrupt it further. Why would they do that? I don't fucking know. Maybe they thought it was cool.

>You are literally so stupid that you can't grasp the concept of time moving on after an expansion has ended.
Oh, so now "time has passed so clearly this means travel to outland has randomly become impossible even though nothing to that effect is remotely present in the game".... Again, why are you pretending to be retarded? I just don't understand what you hope to gain by acting like you're the result of several generations of inbreeding.

I also appreciate how in your last post you were pretending like overcoming the undead was some kind of joint effort, and somehow didn't involve the Horde being massive dickwads, starting a three-pronged war and Garrosh being a major proponent in pushing the Horde into it... nah man they just overcame the undead! the night elves should be grateful! :^)))))

Maybe she's trying to build an army to fight the Void Lords and Old Gods but can't openly reveal her intentions

You want me to repeat that?
Out of the shitstorm that is warcraft, am I wrong?
Name 3

>but can't openly reveal her intentions
because....?
and there's no need to raise people into undeath to do this

Semi-neutral party in Vanilla and Burning Crusade.
Theramore prospered and enjoys a somewhat friendly stance with Thunderbluff.
In Wrath of the Lich King, she refuses to believe that Arthas is truly gone. A confrontation with the Lich King leads her to believe that nothing of him is left in that creature. When players bring her the locket that she gave to Arthas, with her picture still inside, she breaks down crying. Arthas never forgot. Despite everything that happened in the Scourge, Arthas never forgot Jaina and kept this memento close to his most important personal effects.
In Cataclysm, Jaina largely stayed out of the newly started war of Alliance v Horde. Her mistake, though, was allowing Theramore to serve as a neutral port for Alliance vessels seeking to enter Kalimdor. Garrosh didn't like that.
Before Mists of Pandaria, Garrosh launches a massive invasion of Theramore. At the back of the assault, a terrifying WMD introduced in Burning Crusade, a modified, improved manabomb. Theramore is not just wiped from the fucking map, but the bomb threatens to annihilate the souls of everyone caught in the blast. Rhonin, leader of the Kirin Tor and a Raptor army, sacrifices himself to contain the blast, save everyone else in the city, and transfers leadership of Dalaran to her. This traumatic event caused her hair to go white. She forgave the Horde though. These actions were Garrosh's, not the Hordes.
In MoP, Garrosh seeks to steal a powerful, evil artifact from Darnassus. He manages to do so, but not without forcing the Sunreavers, the Horde aligned faction of mages in Dalaran, to open portals for him and allow him to transport the artifact through their portion of Dalaran.
This is where she fucking snaps. She goes on a rampage, puts Dalaran in martial law and personally executes or imprisons every Blood Elf in Dalaran she can find. Dalaran is declared fully aligned with the Alliance.

Because she doesn't want to clue in the Void Lords to her plans. That or she could be a tool of the Void Lords

It's for children.

You are forgetting the most important bit. Had Arthas not picked up Frostmourne, became a death knight and raised an undead army and then subsequently stabbed the Burning Legion in the back by setting Illidan on Tichnodrius, depriving the invading demons of one of their best and most cunning strategists, the ambush at the World Tree would not have succeeded as he would have definitely advised Archimonde to remain cautious and hold back until all of the united races were killed off. The Scourge was the straw that broke the camel's back.

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>Her mistake, though, was allowing Theramore to serve as a neutral port for Alliance vessels seeking to enter Kalimdor. Garrosh didn't like that.
I mean can you imagine the Alliance nuking Booty Bay and Ratchet... The Horde sympathizers are always so laughable on this point.

Remember the Last Jedi

MAYBE SHES GOT A BIG EPIC PLAN TO DEFEAT THE FIRST ORDER OR...
>HYPERJUMPS THROUGH THEIR ENTIRE FLEET WHICH SHE COULD'VE DONE AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MOVIE
OH WELL lmao

I can honestly see Sylvanas does something like that. She has Xalatah, Val'kyr, Helya, Alternate Dimensional traveling Orcs, Magic using Night Elves and literally Troll gods on her sides, and fucking giant ass Minotaurs

All the Alliance has is
>Spaceships, A Goddess that doesn't want to do anything really, Night Elves empowered by said Goddess, Space Goats and a bunch of Werewolves.

Sylvanas will win

I don't see what could Sylvanas do against repeated orbital bombardments.

She takes Lei Shen, the ancient Thunder King's, power for herself and is stated to be capable of drowning Orgrimmar in a massive tidal wave by herself. Her new boyfriend, Kalecgos, who is a blue dragon, stops her from doing so. Confrontations with Lor'themar Theron, leader of the Blood Elves, and Taran Zhu, leader of the Pandaren military, mellow her out. During the Siege of Orgrimmar to depose Garrosh, she joins the fight as a very passive-aggressive bitch, but she lets the revolutionaries be. After Garrosh is knocked out, she demands that Varian takes the chance and dismantles the Horde. When he doesn't, she is disappointed. Then a lot of bookshit happens that helps to mellow her out and make her think "Man, I was kind of a bitch".
In WoD, she is not mentioned once outside of an Arcane Sentry reminding Khadgar at one point that Jaina has forbidden any mage of Dalaran, even him, from working with the Horde. He doesn't care.
In Legion, Khadgar convinces the rest of the Council of Six that they have to work with the Horde in order to fight the Legion. Jaina throws a massive fucking hissy-fit, which makes no real sense considering the books after MoP, and straight up leaves them. Despite her boyfriend still being in Dalaran and on the council of six. During the entire time that the Burning Legion and Sargeras are threatening to outright annihilate the entire planet, Jaina doesn't show up or lift a finger.
In BfA, Jaina makes her return and is forced to confront every single mistake she has made. She blames herself for the death of her father, Arthas going off the deep-end, Garrosh nuking her city, every single betrayal. Before she learns to let go of the past and do what is necessary. She essentially forgives not the Horde, but herself. In addition, she is now MOMMY MILKY tier.

are horde players this delusional or am i being trolled? not even the horde is supporting sylvanas anymore, she's completely on her own, just her and the rest of her ugly faction

>Oh, so now "time has passed so clearly this means travel to outland has randomly become impossible even though nothing to that effect is remotely present in the game"
Yep. Precisely. Because the game, the books and the lore have stated it to be so. Exactly how you stated it, as well. Time has passed, the bases are dismantled, travelling there has become increasingly difficult and NONE of it is represented in the actual game.

Also, that response took you 17 minutes and you ended it with
>:^)))))
In summary, stay mad nerd. You're objectively wrong.

Lor'themar literally just said in the the war campaign that she has the full 100% support of the entire Horde and the people are all in love with her and that his own people would turn on him in favor of her.

Go somewhere else with your headcanon

imagine failing to pay attention this badly

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>The books and lore have stated it to be so
So after literally hours of sweating, moving the goalposts and further retarded drivel, the best you could come up with is "the books mention it's more difficult now and this totally excuses the fact that the Horde didn't mass-migrate right after BC or made any effort whatsoever to stop being like a plague of locust on Azeroth" Yea BTW the Night Elves are to blame! :^)))

>Also, that response took you 17 minutes
Hilarious, I can only imagine how retarded you must be to post this, given it's been 17 minutes since the post you replied to. So what's your excuse? Why did it take you so long and why do you not realize that whatever excuse you might have also applies to the other party? Oh... right. Literally several generations of inbreeding in addition to being dropped on your head as a child, I imagine.

slippery slimy sethrak schlong

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>the books mention it's more difficult now and this totally excuses the fact that the Horde didn't mass-migrate right after BC or made any effort whatsoever to stop being like a plague of locust on Azeroth
Yes. That's literally how canon story works. And yes, this is also said in the game, stop skipping quest text. What you proposed is retarded and objectively wrong in every sense imaginable. They can't travel there and they have no point to do so either.

You are so mad. So very mad.

The shizzle about Sargeras and his motivations only get revealed in WoW. You're only told that Sargeras is the ultimate creator of the Burning Legion in W3:TFT and he's corrupted by realising his monumental task to preserve the Titans ordered universe is pointless because demons exist and there's no end to them. No matter how well you tidy your house, if you want to keep making your house bigger, the messy outside is always going to out-size it and the bigger the inside of the house, the harder it is to keep it tidy. The inherent contradiction was obvious to Sargeras. Then WoW ret-conned out that philosophically-interesting aspect. Sargeras was fighting an idea with another idea, now he's fighting baddies from the ladder-rung above him, eventually to be used in the raid treadmill.

>Yes. That's literally how canon story works. And yes, this is also said in the game, stop skipping quest text. What you proposed is retarded and objectively wrong in every sense imaginable. They can't travel there and they have no point to do so either.
That's nice dear, but maybe you should try actually reading what I wrote instead of just regurgitating your own drivel and making a joke of yourself yet again.

>y-you m-mad b-bro
Oh right, I should have realized you surrendered, carry on then lad.

>but maybe you should try actually reading what I wrote
The rest is just you going through your entire, shallow, vocabulary of Yea Forums insults and insinuating that canon stories aren't canon. There's literally nothing else and you can't even point it out.
>The game and every piece of fiction supporting it says you're wrong
>no I'm not

:^)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

I like the Arakkoa!

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>Correct in purging Stratholme
Yes but he was a massive faggot about it which is nothing to write home about
>If Arthas didnt Frostmourne his soldiers were dead
He already stranded his own soldiers on the island and fucking ruined his mercenaries in order to false flag his soldiers, so appealing to his men doesn't work. He fucked half his men to false flag the other half. Faggot move. A real chad would have been able to reason with his men and if he were worth a shit as a leader they would have chosen to follow him like men do.
>Did his best and sacrificed everything
by the time he was in Northredn he was sacrificing shit he never had to in order to fix problems he himself caused
>Absolute victim
this is as retarded as it is literarily inept. Arthas is tragic because tragedy is a complex amalgam of having your hands tied in some instances, and making the wrong choices for failing to realize that your hands are not ALWAYS tied. Arthas was a faggot who fell from grace, but could have been a true Chad like Uther if he hadn't been such a teenager about it.

There's a penis hidden by the crop isn't there. Nobody who draws tongues like that doesn't also draw weird penises.

>If Arthas didn't purge Stratholme you end up with a whole city of undead you'll have to kill anyway but you might not be able to.

Simply false. You're saying the only way to treat a plague is to burn everything down which has been proven false historically. Compound that by the fact this is a world where fucking magic exists. Arthas also knew it was spread by grain shipments.

They could have easily implemented an effort to destroy the shipments and isolate the towns people believed to be infected.

>the quest texts, books and short stories that explain how you CAN'T easily travel to Outland and how there is no reason to do so, especially on a large scale, is no justification for how you suddenly can't easily travel to Outland and how there would be no reason to, especially on a large scale
Jesus christ, dude, just stop. Every fucking post of yours just has you present and detail your own fucking counter arguments. I don't even get why anyone would bother trying to refute you, you do it yourself perfectly well.

Mengsk was so great in the first game.

>The rest is just you going through your entire, shallow, vocabulary of Yea Forums insults and insinuating that canon stories aren't canon. There's literally nothing else and you can't even point it out.

Imagine actually being this retarded, holy fuck. Again, how the fuck does your garbage excuse the fact that the Horde could have literally packed up and left Azeroth at any point in time during of after BC? All you have is "b-but they can't do it now because.... urrrr... they dismantled the bases and it's more difficult now!!" Like holy fuck that's such a pathetic excuse I cannot imagine why you'd even post it, let alone insist on it for several posts in all, but then to ignore all criticism of your ridiculous position and persist on it anyway.... holy shit dude, you are so fucking dumb.

Also
>Be so retarded you literally invent a narrative that's nothing like what you're actually told and is only as ridiculous as you yourself, then pretend it's the other person that brought it up and is insisting on it
I mean really, I struggle to see how you could stoop any lower than that, but at the same time I'm sure you'll manage.

>draws tongues like that
like what?

>Bring up something that was never stated or suggested
>Pretend it was stated or suggested and the other party is dumb for doing so
Imagine being so retarded you actually try this, now imagine being so retarded you actually try this on an anonymous image board where attacking someone's image or character doesn't even make any god damn sense.

read a book, nigger

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>we saved the city by burning it down and killing everyone
Arthas cucks are retarded

>Shit I lost, better pretend I somehow win by pointing to something that totally proves me right despite me not being able to utilize it in an argument!
Wew lad.

BUT THEY DID THEY DESTROY THE ENTIRE NATION OF LORDERON

god i wanna give her the sympathy dick

Plug your ears and go lalala all you want, stated official lore says you're wrong on every account. No namecalling will change that. Shit, I better be careful, or else you're gonna call me a retard.

You have failed as a game developer if you have to relegate all key details of your story to a fucking book instead of being able to show the events in game.

I absolutely agree. Storytelling in this franchise is utterly fucked. The books contain more important events than half the game does and it's never even properly referenced. The entirety of the Before the Storm novel has gotten nothing but a visual cameo in Arathi.

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is this kingdom hearts?

Which only happened because Uther decided to not only abandon Arthas, but actively sabotage him.

Imagine if Uther actually wasn't retarded, trusted the person he sent to investigate the plague to have some idea of what he's talking about and realize that the massive battle they JUST fucking fought would be a mere prelude to the catastrophe a converted Stratholme would be. Imagine if Uther helped Arthas purge Stratholme, followed him to Northrend and just BTFO Malgannis without ever needing to resort to Frostmourne?

>Humans BTFO the undead forever, Lich King dies in the Frozen Throne because his power is leaking out of the void left by Frostmourne
>Orcs travel to Kalimdor, get butchered/BTFO by the Night Elves because they don't have demon juice to suck
>Peace on Azeroth for decades to come
Fuck Uther "Lightbringer"

I might be wrong here, but I think that didn't truly happen until TFT. Lordaeron city was massacred after the human campaign, but then the Scourge and the Cult of the Damned almost entirely vanished until Arthas reappeared months(?) later. Then, they worked more towards small skirmishes and moving to Quel'thalas than really purging the countryside. Once Arthas settled down in Lordaeron following the end of the Third War was when he really started slaughtering every single living being, which was completed by Kel'thuzad and Sylvanas.

Plug my ears against what? You've not said anything worth considering other than "there's this thing here that totally proves I'm right, but I can't quote it or explain how, you just have to trust me or read a novel :^)"

And that STILL doesn't change anything about what I said before; the Horde had every opportunity during BC to pack of and leave, they decided not to. Hell, your entire position is already made into a joke by the very existence of Warlords of Draenor, where Garrosh not only moves an army of people from Draenor to Azeroth, but does so across a completely different timeline at that, who knew that it was totally fucking possible if only they put some actual effort into it!
>B-but b-but reasons and excuses!!!
No. The fact will always remain that the Horde could have left if they had put in work to do so, they choose to stay, they chose to murder the indigenous people out Kalimdor, they chose to rob and murder the Night Elves, the Horde are fucking cartoon villains and you're retarded enough to try and defend them.

thats because the game devs are shit awful storytellers who just half ass their way through everything, and then right before the game launches Blizzard pays half a dozen starving authors, sends them a two page memo that describes where the book starts, and where it should leave off, and they let shitty fan-fiction tier genre authors fill in all the gaps for them

and people wonder why classic is so fucking hot. It was a passion project for a small team of devs for the ENTIRE DURATION of its mainstay up until Burning Crusade when the lore started sliding down the shitter with everything else

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Stratholme was already infected. It's Lordaeron's largest city. Arthas had the authority to order quarantine, which is probably why his father chose him to help Jaina with the investigation(he had insisted the Kirin Tor prove the plague existed before he would allow them to quarantine), but the result of qurantine on Stratholme would be inevitable: everybody inside dies. The goal had been to check if the plague was real, then quarantine any location it was found in so it didn't spread. The problem they discovered in Adorhal was it already had and had done so from Adorhal because it was where all grain distribution for the Northlands(before they were Plaguelands) happened, including Stratholme. Andorhal itself wasn't infected because it was where the Cult were sending the grain out from and they weren't going to infect their own food.

When Arthas had left for Northrend, the Cult went dormant and his purge had solved the plague problem. No undead would appear in Lordaeron again until Arthas returned from Northrend with Frostmourne.

Books are for reading, not referencing, so I reject the notion of page citations so you can read it for yourself.

Classic is also full of interesting stories, whereas that all goes to shit after BC. It's completely impossible to take anything after "durrr must alweys bie a liks kang" seriously.

brainlet af

>Books are for reading, not referencing.
So why even bring it up at all? Oh... right, retardation.

So how do we know the plague wasn't curable and Arthas wasn't used as a tool to destroy Lordaeron

wow you sure told him

Smaller scale stories tend to be more interesting. The more things escalate, the harder it is to actually write them well. World ending threat after world ending threat just starts blending together. The story of a small ghost girl in a dead town is far more compelling than Yet Another Death God Wants To Kill The World.

>actual canon wrong
>my head canon right

You're parents didnt beat you enough.

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>wow you sure told me

FTFY

You arent kidding anyone moron, you are dying alone on this faggot hill of yours kek

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>So how do we know the plague wasn't curable
That's not even a relevant question, even if there was a method (and as far as anyone knows, there isn't one) there was no time. You're suggesting they not only find a cure, but apply it to a city full of people who were turning undead that very night (and Arthas knew for certain they would, given what happened just the mission before that)

But to answer your question; WE know it wasn't curable as you only engineer a cure for the plague sometime during Burning Crusade.

>Cannon wrong
Except nothing I said is remotely refuted in your shitty novel lad, again, WoD exists. This whole "hurrr cannon wrong durrr" is literally just you having a strawman.

>Pot calling the Kettle black
Amusing, you know you're alone so you can only imagine everyone else must be. Adorable.

Game can't decide whether or not it wants the plague cured. There are multiple instances during Wrath where you have some random faggot get freshly infected only to cure themselves after a fetch quest with literally whatever is lying around at the time. Meanwhile, Koltira Deathweaver has you turn plague cauldrons into acid cauldrons because getting dissolved by acid is better for the Alliance/Horde soldiers than even getting touched by the plague.

>this dumb faggot is arguing against multiple people thinking its just one

First week on Yea Forums huh little guy? Looks like your sheltered upbringing didnt accustom you to disagreements with your peers. Im not even the faggot you are arguing with, im just calling you a dumb faggot cause you are one.

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Confirming, I'm the one you've originally argued with. Stopped responding literally hours ago.

snakeboys best

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Too bad the next allied race is grey humans with glowing eyes and I can't believe it's not gnomes.

>"No You" the post, the movie, the sequel

Oof, swing and miss

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>You're arguing against multiple people
>Multiple people arguing against me cannot exist though!
Jesus dude, I said earlier that I was sure you'd find a way to be more pathetic, and you've fucking delivered.

>"I'm being retarded and calling you dumb!"
Wow, my fragile ego is absolutely devastated by your scathing commentary boy! You tell em champ!

>N-no you cannot say that! How dare you call me out!
L M A O imagine literally arguing against a century old saying.

>full blown denial
>theres NO way, NOOOOO WAAAAY more than one person thinks im a stupid faggot

This is what pure virgin rage looks like.

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That isn't the decision that faced Arthas in the story. You can't ask 'what ifs' with the benefit of hindsight, but do so selectively. If could just as easily ask why anyone did anything, seeing as Mal'ganis could teleport the victims away somewhere whether there was a quarantine or not. Whilst it was de facto the case, it was not the challenge Arthas, Uther and Jaina were faced with before the Culling began.

Absolutely seething lmao

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>Full blown denial
user, sincerely, go back to or finish middle school, pick up some basic reading comprehension skills. If you read that post and think there is "denial" anywhere involved then you have some serious issues.

user you've been arguing with dozens of people over the course of hours thinking its just one dude. Actually seek help or just off yourself.

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>Get BTFO
>"Y-you m-mad b-bro"
A classic, how nostalgic. Appreciate your surrender though.

Actually it's been like 6 by my count. But yeah, your point still stands.

>denial of his denial

This goes deep

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>N-no I didn't misunderstand at all and you ARE in denial!
Wowbabs, everyone.

newfag, lurk more

>Getting so BTFO even though you have multiple faggots join you that you double down on doubling down on debating your own imagination
No mate, this is about as shallow as a puddle.

ITT: One newfag user get super asspained after learning everyone thinks hes a stupid retard

You referred to several people as the one who posted or brought up the book, which I posted, you fucking muppet.

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Do death knights get boners? There's a bunch of autistic lorefags in here duking out so one of you should know if my DK can canonically get a stiffy

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>L-lurk more
Back at you buddy, if you've spent any amount of time on here you'd know by now people only start screeching HEEEEY ARE YOOOU MAD BRUUUHUHHHH after they got BTFO. Every time.

fuck off back to resetera trannie cuck

Undead can't sex.

Yeah bruh it's just magically controlled rigor mortis.

>You referred to several people as the one who brought up the book
Except I didn't. Nice try though, but you really need to learn when the jig is up.

canonically their hearts don't work, so not naturally, but they can manipulate blood so they can also make you get a stiffy.

the fact that you havent realized everything here operates under 20 layers of irony proves you are new as fuck, probably a summer fag

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>Gets BTFO
>Immediately starts thinking about trannies
That's pretty fucking gay my dude.

I admire you user. You're an actual imbecile, probably aware of it, and yet you continue fighting on. Its truly motivating.

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>Everything operates under 20 layers of irony
>Not you though, because that'd mean I totally got schooled
Kek.

>trannies are gay

NEW
AS
FUCK

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Blood DKs can, depending on the condition of the body. Certain dks were rezzed fairly recently after their death, so the dangly parts would all be intact. Blood manipulation does the rest.

read

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Woah a random faggot on the internet called me names, my fucking reality is crumbling!

I appreciate the clownish antics buddy but it's a bit redundant at this point.

87 people now agree you're a fucking cretin. How does it feel?

I love how you keep putting your foot in your mouth and then walking it back like you knew it all along.

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calling it

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Frostmourne ate his soul the moment he picked it up, so even if he wasn't dead he's also not quite alive. If you want to take wow lore into account he later literally carved his own heart out because the light was bothering him or something, and from that point there's no way he was anything but dead.

Considering you are still here for us to laugh and shitpost at, your fragile ego must have been considerably fucked. Just be glad you arent back on reddit newfag, you would have been downboated a gorrilion times for being a humongous retard. Atleast here you just get called a humongous retard, and you get to go to the next thread pretending it never happened. Welcome to Yea Forums fag, not get out.

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His heart was apparently his weak point. When he fought Illidan, he realized that striking the heart would inflict massive damage that other attacks wouldn't.
Yet annihilating the heart with the Ashbringer doesn't kill him because ??????????????

Okay.

First:
>"cannon wrong"
Directly references the book mentioned before, as this is the very article that supposedly makes me "cannon wrong" despite not being remotely relevant to my actual argument. Hence me saying "your shitty book". Nice try, but a complete failure at proving your claim.

Second:
Literally a general claim, note the use of the English language here (I'll explain since you might be ESL or American educated) where I specifically didn't say "So why did you even bring it up at all? Oh... right, you're retarded" and instead opted to indirectly call out the person who initially brought up the book. So not only did you fail to prove your claim, you managed to disprove it and prove you're retarded in the process. Wow. Amazing.

What do you have to say for yourself buddy? I'd love to hear what excuses you come up with.

>You're still here laughing at us, therefor your ego must be fucked!
>Not us though, nuh-uh!!
Was it autism? Imagine being so lacking in self-awareness that you cannot even tell you're being ridiculed.

Let me remind you that the actual argument ended with you getting so BTFO you started trying to attack me personally instead, you've completely given up on trying to argue the point and you're pretending you're not the joke in the room? Hilarious!

Is there really some nu-wow faggot whose never read a quest in his life actually arguing whats canon or not?

Have you even played the game wtf?

>Was it autism? Imagine being so lacking in self-awareness that you cannot even tell you're being ridiculed.

The irony.

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Disappointing, you've completely retreated into your own head again.

>retard cant tell the difference between blatant one off sentence shitposting and posts that genuinely have skin in this topic

Ill say it again.

NEW
FAG

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Why did they cut down all those trees?
To stop the wildfire
But the fire spread anyway
Yeah but I slowed it down
No, you left all the trees where they fell, the fire just spend over them anyway
Dammit Uther, as your future king I order you to chop down this tree metaphor!

>N-no you!!
That doesn't even make sense buddy, but nice try regardless, I expect that's about as good as you can manage.

So, who do you think that person is that you just responded to? Link me their posts, I'm curious, because you said again.

I literally just stepped into this thread.

You are. The ending of the first fucking campaign is Arthas walking into Lordaeron and pretty much taking the city for the undead

Daily reminder that all Canon in World of Warcraft or Warcraft isn't set in stone and will change if the creator's deem it so.

There is no lore outside of major events but the minor details surrounding the major events can and will be changed as Blizzard sees fit.

The city, not the country. First undead mission shows that the outlying villages are outright confused because the undead threat vanished entirely.

How much self awareness do you have to lack to not realize almost every reply post you have made can be summed up in "no u"

>inb4 I was just pretending to be retarded

You are making my night user, wew lad.

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Sarah murdered his father

user, in case you weren't paying attention (and I know you weren't) the conversation ended something like an hour ago with the hordelet getting completely BTFO, and I've been having a blast laughing at the widdle twolls trying their epic memes ever since.

But hey, I'm amused, show me what posts genuinely have skin in this topic, which ones are you referring to little buddy?

you cant BTFO anyone when your argument is "my head canon right, actual canon wrong"

Its actually laughably stupid.

>Unironically doubling down on the "no-you" after getting called out
Damn dude, I know we're on Yea Forums but there's some lows you just don't stoop to, jesus.

>hes actually pretending to be retarded

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"The hordelet" stopped responding before that epic dang post though, and literally no one but you agrees with your headcanon.
And, repeating, I'm genuinely curious.

Oh, and over a 90 people think you're a fucking cretin now.

>Can't answer the question at all, replies anyway
Posts like these always make me chuckle.

Let's try this again, just for laughs; What "headcanon" of mine are you referring to here buddy?

>hes still invested in this argument
>against a shitposter

SEEETHING

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Give me a link to whatever list you're copying these random replies off user, should make for some fun times.

>hes taking this seriously

How fucking dumb are you, you seriously cant tell everyone is laughing and fucking with you? How deep on the spectrum are you dude?

>should make for some fun times.

Cant be more fun than this thread historically documenting your fragile ego shattering to literal strangers over the course of a few hours.

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that's just bullshit reason made up by the writer

>I was merely pretending
Uhuh, and I'm totally seriously bro, really!

All Horde bases totally still exist on Outland, personnel hasn't been relocated to new war fronts and efforts. Large scale transportation has not been made any harder after the deactivation of the Dark Portal, the only thing that made travel to Outland easy, let alone for more than one person at a time. Nagrand is a flourishing haven that the Horde can settle down in and should be happy to. Outland is a sustainable country. Orgrimmar pre-Shattering was luxurious. Garrosh single-handedly abandoned the Mag'har orcs and left them all to rot on Outland. Garrosh demanded that Darnassus give them their land and all their resources.

It's allegedly been shattering for years now, quite durable for a fragile ego don't you think?

I'll take the compliment though.

I asked for my headcanon user, not your headcanon about my headcanon.

You actually wasted time on this. Lmao.

>I didn't say that
lmao

I mean whatever, but at least the other posters are funny, you have a greasy fat guy vibe going on where you HAVE to have the final word. It’s pretty funny how you cannot just walk away from this.

Haha guys im just shitposting too haha see i fit it, but let me reply to this shitpost seriously for a second
>"ill t-take the c-c-compliment t-though
>haha guys see im a shitposter just like you fellow 4channers

Cringe

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>I'll greentext the truth so that I can pretend it's not
Yea that's never been tried before, how original.

It would be better if It was a dagger like It was suposed to be in the first place
Also
Vanilla ashbringer>wotc toybringer

>Constantly make multiple people make complete idiots out of themselves and have them post clowny shit for hours on end
>"Hurrrr durrr y dun u walk away from this?!"
Seriously bro?

>Haha bro everyone is a shit poster
>You couldn't possibly be shitposting though what?!
OK buddy.

What you didn't realize is that I have a book here, that states that what I posted is the official Warcraft canon on what your dumb headcanon is. It's what all 92 posters in this thread are using to laugh at you.
So now, I can add that "This isn't my headcanon." to the list of things that are your headcanon. You have OFFICIALLY, LITERALLY lost this game.
Checkmate.

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> It’s pretty funny how you cannot just walk away from this.

The euros are waking up soon and if they get a whiff of this faggot before the thread is pruned hes gonna be here all night knee deep in shitposts he cant help but argue against. Its autism, without a doubt.

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Damn son, that's quite the onion, how many layers are you on?

>argues against every shitpost
>haha guys im a 4channer shitpost pro like you, see?

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OUT
FUCKING
SKILLED

>Constantly make myself look like a complete idiot
>hurr durr y dun i walk away from this

FTFY

Seriously, why dont you?

You realize Nelves hold mega-grudges right? Orcniggers literally killed one of their demigod. Why on earth do you think they'd forgive that and be like 'lol okay have some of our wood.'?

Imagine having such a fragile ego that you actually cannot cope and have to be in complete denial.

>new people entering the thread arent even discussing OP's topic anymore, instead opting to join in on the absolute assrape of one retarded user

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>Why don't you do things you have no reason to?!?!?
Yea... I wonder.

>Yea Forums, Yea Forums, there place here no shitposter would ever engage with other shitposters
Are we pretending to be newfags now? We've already been over this buddy, the conversation ended over two hours ago, what the fuck do you think has been happening since? That you were actually taken seriously?

Don't forget she was supposed to be trapped in Thros, an afterlife we had to get the aid of the last living drust to even reach, but after the pep talk Jaina just teleports away, meaning she could have done so at any time.

You had to think hard for that one huh bud.

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Hey, that's actually a good point.
The only thing I can even say to that is that I don't like the answer to
>Why didn't they make the sensible and logical decision
being
>Because they aren't sensible or logical in this regard.
Still, some diplomacy wouldn't have fucking killed them.

>mary-sue
>fuckup
These things are not compatible.

>the conversation ended over two hours ago,

Obviously hasnt since you still went at it not even a half hour ago you pathetic faggot. Not to mention you still arguing against blatant shitposts. If you arent a newfag, you're just a glutton for punishment, you are literally the laughing stock of this anonymous thread.

Yea, much thought went into it, really had me scratching my head.

You are saying this after the current expansion made her face every single one of those fuck ups. The only issue is that the entire world goes "I forgive you" and elevates her into godhood because she learned to love herself.

>Still, some diplomacy wouldn't have fucking killed them.
No, but Orcs will. The Night Elves have no reason to let them into their forests, and every time they got in they killed innocent people and raped the landscape.

>You still went at it
You do realize that you're just making yourself look hilariously insecure here, right?
>"N-no y-you lie!, that can't possibly be true!"
Lmao, you're actually taking this seriously, aren't you?

>user pretends he was shitposting all along despite arguing here for hours

Even if you were shitposting, thats some autistic dedication, hope you arent too much of a drain on your poor family.

Because stratholme fires are magical and made by the Scourge, it was Mal'ganis biggest fuck you to the city and arthas as the testament of his failure to protect his kingdom and its people.

Arthas Broke
All of the Silver hand was so blind by proud and ego that they didn't saw the darkness looming arounnd them, it was uther's pride and stubbornness that doomed Lordaeron, Followed by Terenas own.

also why he and Antonidas didn't recognized Medivh is a complete mistery.

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user its ok to be laughed at by dozens of people on an anonymous board. Its actually good way to learn how to not be such a moron in the future. Also lurk more.

Imagine thinking laughing at anonymous morons chimping out means you're a "glutton for punishment"

Nigger you couldn't even insult a fucking suicidal tween, you actually think anyone would take you seriously?

>hes STILL pretending to be retarded

No one ever fell for this ruse, just give it up kek.

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Yeah, that stance really helped them to stop getting slaughtered in their woods by orcs.
Incidentally, my bbqs this summer have been really amazing, these teldrassil coals are a miracle, I swear.

>he said nigger

Woah there redditor you havent been here long enough to use that word.
Also way to fall for yet another blatant shitpost.

>i totally wasnt serious guys, im shitposting just like the rest of you

Oof

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I mean sure, but the orcs would have chimped out over something and start killing elves, even IF they'd been allowed in to take some wood. Ashenvale for some reason or another causes even the most controlled of orcs to chimp out and attack elves.

>It's fine when we do it for hours
>But you? man that's weird bro!
Huh. I guess I am autistic since I really cannot tell how this isn't just another case of pot calling the kettle black.

>user its ok to be laughed at by dozens of people on an anonymous board.
Are we still pretending that Yea Forumsirgins who take themselves too seriously "laughing" at you is a big deal? I'm jaw is actually starting to ache from laughing here.

>retard responds to shitpost points
>keeps trying to convince people hes totally not falling for it

>He literally got triggered over the word "nigger" as if it's actually a big deal
How to spot an actual newfag.

>Ashenvale for some reason or another causes even the most controlled of orcs to chimp out and attack elves.
Fucking old gods, I swear.

>falling for the most obvious shitpost that could have been spotted miles away

This is too precious.

>"L-let me try this one again, it worked so well last time!"
Imagine still trying to argue against the person you're failing to ridicule for still arguing, lmao.

>falling for 10 year old Yea Forums nigger bait memes

This is actually how you spot a newfag.

Man, nothing I like more when I am amused than autistically respond to every single post that responds to me and insist that I am, in fact, laughing while insulting them with everything I know. My fellow brother, we are of one mind.

We've been over this user, try something original, this is boring.

Irony.

Imagine still thinking its one person arguing with you

based retard

>My fellow brother, we are of one mind.
Considering you're still here, we must be. Where would I be now if I had no one to respond to?

>We've been over this user, try something original, this is boring.

Now THIS is nostalgic. If ive never seen an older intenr

>If ive never seen an older intenr
user are you ok

How buttblasted are you to stay here for mutliple hours arguing against the one other loser whose still here, and the countless shitposters passing by? Sounds like someone is desperate as fuck for attention?

That one is a little too far-fetched, even for me buddy.

your bullshit caused him to have a stroke, rip shitposting user, you will be remembered

Vengence was too important to him

>Sounds like someone is desperate as fuck for attention
Where the fuck do you think you are?

Could be leftover demon taint too.

Was about to ask if you knew where you were, enjoy your 15 minutes of retardation, after that you go back to being alone and ignored kek.

>Christie Golden
:

hes a big dipshit, it would not surprise me if the next thread thats get shit up with a "hurr i was only pretending" kind of trash it would be him again

Arthas was a raging incel

>It would not surprise me
It would, because apparently it surprised you this time.

You're not a newfag are you?

Why are we still here? Just to suffer? Every night, I can feel my leg… and my arm… even my fingers. The body I’ve lost… the comrades I’ve lost… won’t stop hurting… It’s like they’re all still there. You feel it, too, don’t you?

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Nah I bet he was doing it for those sweet sweet exp gains. Aoe farming a city. I'd walk around with my dick consecrated and just swinging

He was hardly AoE farming. He was leveling houses with just his sword and killing uninfected people two to three at a time.

Except instead of a neutral port it's an alliance port used for troops and seige weapon transport.

Its my first year here, just came into this thread to talk about some comfy wow lore and see you here shitting it up being a bigger nigger faggot than the average daily user. You're new as fuck dude.

>He was hardly AoE farming
Not a surprise, the only mage of the party was scared off by his fucking edgelord rp.

Er unturned. Not uninfected.

Haha okay freshie, enjoy your time here and try to avoid sperging out over shitposting.

>walk right into an obvious trap instead of trying to help those people and ending up having to kill a bunch of mook undead at worst
Arthas was an idiot and he was written to be almost as retarded as anakin in the prequels, in fact I wonder if they didn't model anakin off arthas they are so similar in their idiotic spergouts that play right into their enemy's hands

If by orbital bombardment you mean the vindicaar, that thing has like a fifty foot range max

That's his one big failing, letting himself get baited by Malgannis. At the same time though he was just completely dismissed by his mentor who knew sweet fuck all about the threat and would continue to be in fervent denial about the plague, so he didn't exactly have many options.

Realistically, what would have happened if Arthas had not followed Malgannis?

There was no known way to stop the Plague. His mistake wasn't genociding a city but going to Northrend in pursuit of a guy who was obviously luring him into a trap.

Ah. Concentration camps then. Stuff them in boxes until they turn and then walk in naked and glowing until they melt for easy level ups. Fuck white hitting plebs.