Epic Games

The problem is the business is shit (the CEO has said buying exclusives is not sustainable in the long run), the store/client lack modern day features and the CEO hates the people he's marketing to.
Lets say I want to play WWZ, I have no way of knowing how many people are playing that game on EGS but on steam I can see the player count of basically every single game, I can see the reviews for the game right on the store and I can check the forums to see if the game is actively being developed. EGS has none of that.

My biggest problem comes down the Epic being an explicitly anti-PC company in the past who has only returned because PC is a lucrative market once again but Epic has no respect for the customers.

I bought games on Steam two times in my life. I couldn't care less to be honest, familia.

See the second paragraph of .

People don't like exclusivity. For some people, first-party exclusives (e.g. Valve's Half-Life 2 being exclusive to Steam and EA's Dead Space 3 being exclusive to Origin) are an exception, although there are some people who will complain about those too. Epic's entire business model at this point consists of buying third-party exclusives; meanwhile, they've made very little effort to do better than Steam when it comes to their store, their client, or their service in general. Epic came into the digital distribution scene proclaiming that they would provide the competition needed to break the Steam monopoly, but they're not providing the kind of competition which benefits consumers (i.e. their exclusivity deals result in consumers having fewer options), and Steam was never a monopoly in the first place.

Epic's strategy is set up to literally become a monopoly worse than anything steam has done. EGS refuses to sell some games that don't opt for exclusivity, like Darq. If you want to release your game on EGS AND Steam EGS will not accept your game.

1. Simply take the free shit they offer, while staying on Steam
2. ???
3. PROFIT

>compitition between corporations can only be good for the consumers
Explain how "you can only buy this game from Epic now" is better for consumers than "you can buy this game on Steam, GOG, Humble, etc.".

I forgot my pic, it's the dev's comment about exclusivity

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I only remember Epic exists when threads pop up

I think epic gives the publisher of the game money Everytime someone takes a free copy. I would rather pirate desu

> supporting folk while paying nothing is bad

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People aren't even really aware that the Epic Games Store exists.

theheroes7.wordpress.com/2019/06/28/epic-games-store-becomes-first-ghost-store/

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tencent only own 40%

legally they have no control or ability over Epic, sweeney owns over 51% meaning he has 100% control over the company, thats how ownership works

also every major publisher which is publicly listed is also primarily owned by foreign groups, just not in a majority, because of the magic of the ETFs revolution

every time you bring up china or tencent you just point out you're a moron, point out actual problems with the store like the fact it has dodgy sales, none of the features of steam like even the ability to preload and barely any games to start with

you're all retarded

This is the result of "Free Market" that retards shout. Epic has every right to do it, but we feel entitled. I am not saying we are wrong since in a capitalist society the demand is what is supposed to shape the market but a glaring issue is Steam became so large no other store front could emerge without being fat out the gate. In a perfect world once the Epic Store gains enough traction to be a lasting force they will stop buying up exclusives.

But let's not pretend Steam didn't do exclusives ever. Both are shit but everyone dog piles of Epic because le bugman meme. 9 out of 10 games I use Steam but I am taking advantage of the wads of cash Epic is throwing to get free games every 2 weeks. I mean for fucks sake there are already a shit ton of Platforms like steam before Epic, look at Bethesda and Ubisoft. Just move on, or boycott, either way nothing will change.

I really dont care. If a game I want comes to Epic ill buy that game. If that money goes to support a Chinese company, again, I dont care. I just want to play video games. Anything beyond that doesnt matter to me.

I just wish Epic doing its thing would convince Valve to actually better their own shit as opposed to doing mostly nothing.

Why is Epic bad competition?

Steams exclusives are games created by valve or games published on steam because publishers are too lazy to make non-steam versions. At no point has valve ever paid publishers or devs to not release their games anywhere else, it blows my mind how people misconstrue the issue and it makes me think I need to move on from gaming because gamers have no critical thinking skills.

>But let's not pretend Steam didn't do exclusives ever.
I don't remember Valve ever buying third-party exclusives or otherwise paying other publishers not to do business with other stores.

who cares. at this point i want that fat faggot gaben to go under. valve and steam have ruined all the good will they accumulated. if you think valve doesn't pander to china then you're delusional. gabe sucks china's cock like it's no one's business. he only cares about shitty assfaggots dota and all the money china brings to it. he even abandons the usa dota scene and effectively kills it because he refuses to keep the peruvian subhumans out of usa servers. if you say anything negative about china on steam it's an instant ban as well. fuck gaben, but fuck egs too

I'm not him but see

The client lacks features that every other store has
Regional pricing is fucked or missing for some regions
Payment processor fees are passed on to the user rather than paid for by epic unlike what basically every other company does
EGS barely has any good games because their primary goal is selling exclusives rather than selling games in general

This isn't an exhaustive list either, it gets worse but I can't be fucked

>Have to pay people to do exclusives

The exclusives were on Steam because no other market existed. And now that other people are doing the same thing people are bitching about it. Yes Epic buying exclusives is scummy but maybe Valve should be offering something better than nothing. Valve has been going to shit for years now being lazy and essentially a Monopoly. But Shill for Valve, I am just going to buy games I want to play regardless of the store front. DRM is the real issue I have.

Giving money to tencent, hence the Chinese communist party, is not in my list of things to do. Probably also why they've been found out for using egs and spying on people's computers and scanning them.

Are you serious? How new are you to PC gaming? Physical media was still a big thing up until the early 2010s (back when you would actually get the game on the disc and not a code to download the game) and we had GFWL as well, which fucking sucked because when GFWL died a lot of games died with it and it was up to the publisher to honor your purchase on steam.

Valve has never had a monopoly on PC gaming ever.

Not defending but what features does steam have that EGS needs? A shitty community, porn games, tons of abandon ware, trading cards, hats, etc.

As shitty as everyone claims EGS is let's not give steam a free pass on their fucked up shit. If this would have happened 10 years ago like it did with EA origin I would be pissed, which I was at EA with them taking battlefield and making it origin exclusive. I have purchased an ea product since. Steams current state is making it easy for me to purchase from EGS without really being worried about it. Also I haven't purchased anything on EGS but I will get BL3

Are you serious? Physical based media started dying because of Steam. Thus they became a fucking Monopoly. I didn't say they were one in the 2000's but since 2010's they sure as shit were one. That is when they started going to shit as I stated originally. They became lazy. No competition does that. If you think Steam was never a monopoly on Digital gaming you are delusional. Monopolies are bad because it becomes nearly impossible to enter the market. Look at Standard Oil during the early 1900's.

>it never had a monopoly, the competition just couldn't enter the market.

Bruh, steam has been a virtual monopoly forever.

I can't have this conversation with you zoomers because you are unironically too young and too stupid to understand how monopolies work and the state of PC gaming in the 2000s.
You will never know what it's like to walk into a store like gamestop and see a tiny fucking shelf with a handful of PC games while they dedicate half the store to stupid nintendo merch and I guarantee you're too young to remember when microsoft wanted you to pay for GFWL.

You're just going to have to get fucked in the ass by 2020s market conditions because you're too stupid to see it coming, enjoy your subscriptions to EA/ubisoft/google because you asked for this.

>what features does steam have that EGS needs
>proper VR support
>proper multiplayer server support
>Linux support
Let me put it in this way-when EGS exclusives NEED steam to work properly, you know EGS is just utterly fucked up
>wanting to shell out 100$ for boredomlands
You should have a bit more respect for yourself and your money, bro

PC gaming is on the way out. That's all there is to it.

Don't like the PC gaming policies? Stop supporting PC gaming.

Guarantee I am older than you buddy. But keep up your Ad Hominem up so you don't have to admit your wrong.

They actively paid third parties to tie their games with steam instead of being physical-based DRM. Surely it was more than 10 years ago, but it's still true.

I get not liking steam but why do people so vehemently defend EGS?
These people have literally no reason to defend it outside of being contrarian or actual shills.

Just because Epic aka 'Steam 10 years ago!' is paying to get people on its shitty platform doesnt mean steam actually did it 10 years ago
>inb4 Darwinia post
I fucking dare you. Go ahead, Im ready to btfo you at any time

>Let me put it in this way-when EGS exclusives NEED steam to work properly, you know EGS is just utterly fucked up

What a fucking moron jesus christ. Steam is also fucked because there are games that use unreal engine on it right?

>Gets called out
>I...I... Zoomers!

Where in anyone's argument did they say there never was physical medium? Where do you say why physical media existing in the 2000's negates Steam pushing for digital? Just admit you are wrong about Steam never being a monopoly when they clearly were.

because all the threads for it are "LOL TIANAMEN, FUCKING GOOKS LOL".

Plus it's not like Steam users don't also use Origin, GOG, Uplay, or etc to play certain games they like. Why is Epic games any different, because a Chinese company has some STOCK in it? What would Communist China care about non-Chinese players as long as they get money for things bought from Epic? In terms of potential spying, what would they get from random old me, a fatass nerd who works at Walgreens?

arguing about which drm client is better lmaoooo

You're stupid period.

>You will never know what it's like to walk into a store like gamestop and see a tiny fucking shelf with a handful of PC games while they dedicate half the store to stupid nintendo merch

That's more like a stupid American thing

Valve doesn't see them as a threat, and for good reason. The Steam platform is known as a store for games. The Epic platform is known as a launcher for Fortnite.

Timmy can throw all the fucking money he wants at exclusivity deals, but outside of relatively major titles like Borderlands 3 and Metro Exodus, the average person doesn't gives a flying fuck about the games available on the Epic Store.

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Darwina was exclusive and there are proof about it, are you going to go back in time to change that?

No EGS games need Steam to work. I assume you're talking about Vive/SteamVR which is Valve-created hardware running on Valve-created software, none of which is required to run any games.

Plenty of steamcels care. There's at least one EGS bait thread at all times.

>Steam games
>built on unreal engine
So you're telling me that the engine a game is made with, that has fuck all to do with the store itself is the same as
>VR game cant run on EGS because their client doesnt support it
>Linux cant run egs games because their client doesnt support it
>No community servers in multiplayer because the client cant support it
What the everloving fuck user, does it take you all your brainpower to breathe?

regional pricing is bad.
see but none of the games that make of these are going EGS exclusive so it is really an unfair comparison.

Yes it was but valve didn't pay for exclusivity

Oh yes, you could flawlessly run Teteris VR because EGS cou-oh wait
Nah, I'll just post the dev interview where he said outright that it was hard to get into steam, steam never asked for exclusivity, and never paid them to join up

>Unironically bringing out the Linux point
Look at Linux support on Steam, there are like what, 10 games? Most of those being games Valve themselves ported over like CSGO and TF2.

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if Steam did ask for exclusivity then you would look like a retard right now
just stop

> regional pricing is bad

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this. steam doesn't own the platform like consoles and mobile and it was only a matter of time before someone succeeded with an alternative store that takes less of a cut. them going balls to the walls with publishing deals only accelerated the process

Yeah, proton totally doesnt exist. Its not like valve had anything to do with it
Also how many EGS games run on linux? oh, what's that? Zero?
Also, nice work moving the goalpost away from lacking client features to linux ports. Subtle. Almost like you chinks are learning

>no source
yikes

There were lots of physical sales in Europe and suddenly all of the boxes started to have steam codes inside despite them still being physically distributed sales. Are you trying to tell me publishers gave the 30% of their money to gaben for free?? The've already paid for physical distribution of those boxes anyway, so why lose additional 30%?

Awww, what's the matter, baby? scared you'll look like a complete retard?
If steam did ask for exclusivity, prove it. Go on, post that Darwinia screencap. I'm ready to btfo you

>The client lacks features that every other store has
>no shopping cart
>BL3 is gonna have it's 101 DLC options again
>people are gonna have to buy these one by one

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I have no fucking clue what you are talking about when you mention "proton". I'm assuming it's some project by Linux autists to get games running on the platform. Now lets reiterate, A third party effort to get games running on Linux DOES NOT MEAN THAT IT IS OFFICIALLY PORTED TO LINUX. If Valve was the one working on it then things would be different. But they're not and you can't chalk this up as a benefit that Steam has over EGS.

steam is garbage. only porn games and indie shit now

>hating porn games

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good bait m8

I'm being serious dickhead.

Oh no no no

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if I wanted to support devs I would just buy the game on steam

>Acts like a complete retard
>continues moving the goalpost away from the main discussion
Too clumsy, chang. And I actually thought you had improved. What a waste
But to answer your question, yes, Proton is a program released by valve to work with steam to enable games on linux
>If Valve was the one working on it then things would be different
>protondb.com
Dont feel so smart now, do you?

>Look at Linux support on Steam, there are like what, 10 games?
Try around 13000: store.steampowered.com/search?os=linux

Meanwhile, even among the games without native Linux support, a shitload of them will run on Linux using Proton, some requiring very minor tweaks like additional launch options but many running out of the box with no effort at all.

See protondb.com/

>fuck you gwelio

cheaper games? we've staryed seeing AAA games for 30 bucks. lifes p good rn

>trying to siphon users from Steam
who gives a shit about this retarded narrative.
exclusivity is cancer and when they finally let other stores sell keys they can't even discount them. epic store sales are fucking awful and they offer zero fucking consumer incentives. get mad about your diminished buying power not this stupid "war."

>free games
>actual competition for lazy Valve who dont even offer phone support or chat support for their shitty store
>best game is free to play
>gives devs guaranteed money instead of it disappearing into steam’s algorithm
>no shitty review bombing community

You zoomers werent around when Steam was literally raping people and telling them too bad when your account got hacked because they didnt have 2FA.

>but i dont want another launcher!
Boo fucking hoo.

Use GOG

Why do they only make indies commit to exclusivity? Why do they pay for exclusivity deals when the game is already done instead of doing what everyone else does, fund the game from the start?

>there are like what, 10 games?
this is your brain on memes and your entire worldview warped by them because you're too lazy and stupid to fact check anything.

>calls others zoomers
>refuses to read the thread or accept any argument that egs may just be shit
Just like an underage, close your eyes and ears, and scream your lungs out
Go do your homework now, jimmy

>no shitty review bombing community
because no reviews

What if i don't give a fuck about supporting anyone, but simply roll with whatever is most convenient?

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I'll just stick with GOG and Steam, thanks. Calling me a whiny bitch isn't motivating me to use EGS, sorry.

correct. I am not an EGS shill. But they give me games cheaper than steam here but I am supposed to pretend that is a bad thing cause I am supposed to pay extra to subsidize third worlders?

>gives devs guaranteed money instead of it disappearing into steam’s algorithm
>he unironically wants launchers paying devs for exclusivity to be the standard

The cut doesn't matter, or itch.io would be the richest bitches on the planet.
All that matters is the renmenbi epic throws to buy the exclusivity.

>I am not an EGS shill
>lies told by user

also the free games have been getting better.

Because theyre looking for upcoming games people want and quickly moving it to there stores for the guaranteed purchases. They aren't interested in being better than steam there interested in replacing it and having a shell company with which to better influence the games marketplace on behalf of there funders.

>other stores can't discount epic games
>sales so bad game publishers pull out of them
>constantly pushes MUH CUT MUH CUT narrative but still has to bribe publishers to come to their store
>tim before tencent: "nobody should force themselves as the middleman"
>tim after tencent: "buy here or else"
really makes you think

Gog or steam, epic can suck a dick since their only thing about them is
>muh devs
>muh lower cut

>implying 40% just stays quiet and give no feedback at all to Sweeney.
The tencent members of the board might as well not exist at all, what a nice investment.
You're the moron

you did not address my post at all. I would defend steam bringing a $50 USD before all taxes and fees universal standard as well.

>steam never asked for exclusivity, and never paid them to join up

So why did he go exclusive? Your fucking article is from 2010, and exclusivity thing was in 2005. Steam was much different back then. They were bribing people, Rage doll kung developer got 10 000$ for selling his game on steam. You think darwina did it for free, also exclusively? Nice try shill

So torrenting?

Sweeney himself used to hype them up as being invaluable to him.
He's a lot quieter about their contribution to the company now.

>So why did he go exclusive?
You seem to think there were other launchers besides steam in 2010

Who cares?

Because their store is still shit, and they have no good games. Despite the chinks shilling here nonstop, Gaben hasn't needed to lift a finger.
If nothing else it works as a good indicator of what devs/publishers are not worth buying from so I see no reason to try and force them out.

>Rage doll kung developer got 10 000$ for selling his game on steam
where is the source

>other stores can't discount epic games

Bullshit
fanatical.com/en/game/borderlands-3-deluxe-edition

>>sales so bad game publishers pull out of them
Sales so good publishers take them out to not lose money on them
>>constantly pushes MUH CUT MUH CUT narrative but still has to bribe publishers to come to their store
Well yes, valve did so as well when they were starting

>"In June 2012, Tencent made a minority investment in Epic Games, purchasing approximately 48.4 percent of outstanding shares of Epic stock, equating to 40 percent of total Epic capital inclusive of both stock and employee stock options," Sweeney said in an emailed statement. "As part of the investment, two Tencent representatives joined Epic's board of directors, in addition to the three directors and two observers appointed by Epic. We're thrilled to have a world-leading partner in Tencent, who gives Epic unique access to the Chinese market as we head into the next chapter of our 21-year history as a leading independent developer."

>Waaaah waaaah waaaaaahhh! THEY WERE BRIBING DEVS! THEY DIDNT OFFER BETTER SERVICES OR COVER PRODUCTION AND DISTRIBUTION COSTS THAT WAS ENTIRELY ON THE DEVS NO! THEY PAID THE DEVS FOR EXCLUSIVITY WHEN THERE WAS LITERALLY NO OTHER LAUNCHER AT THE TIME! THEY PAID FOR EXCLUSIVITY AND THE DEV'S WORDS MEAN NOTHING!!!!
Kek seeing you fags break down is always fun
Do try to prove any of your pathetic whining please

The word you want is digital stores.
There have been launchers for decades you child.

Here
youtu.be/5ETzoaXUgmI?t=455

Because that's how capitalism works.

>WHEN THERE WAS LITERALLY NO OTHER LAUNCHER

You can't be that fucking stupid, can you drone? You really think steam was the first pc storefront?

this. Also Tencent has their hands in too many pies (including their own launcher) to micromanage every little investment even if they could. they are primarily a holdings company. While it is true their claim to fame is basically tailoring/adapting tech to meet draconian PRC requirements, doing this for a store that does not operate in the PRC, Will never operate in the PRC, and they don't want to operate in the PRC is nonsense. if anything they would strictly want access to technology, patents, and exclusives foe their own launcher.

>what are GFWL, D2D, GOG, GG?

>everygame
where can you find player stats for games thats not on the top 100? i can only find those stats on 3rd party sites.
reviews and forums are non issue. i'm not sure why are you dependent on steam to give you that when you have google or even Yea Forums to give their opinion on said game about it.

Would you like to name some?

I don't use EGS myself but there's nothing inherently wrong with what they're doing. Just capitalism at work.
The devs who took their deal however are scummy as fuck when a Steam store page for their games already exists. I see no such outrage from games that were announced EGS exclusive from the get go.
I would've respected Tim more if he just outright admits that he just wants a large slice of the PC pie instead of trying to be some sort of moral arbiter trying to combat Steam's monopoly and 30% cut.

No, I think at the time, Steam was the only EFFECTIVE pc storefront, hence why people wanted to be on it
But please, keep trying to push that 'STEAM PAID FOR EXCLUSIVITY!' narrative

Stardock

Literally is posted on Yea Forums every day. So pretty sure a lot of people care.
They just don't care enough to make the government to take action cause they don't want to admit that the freemarket has failed them.

Yes, it was very affective in bribing developers and forcing their own customers into it. I never claimed otherwise

Y’all getting mad at tencent realize you’re on a chinese board, right?

You realize Valve has money from China as well?

Or is the racism only for your point?

Give me one reason why I should buy games from EGS instead of pirating them. Infact, the same argument could be used against any filthy DRM client. Piracy is a service issue, and it's your job to convince me NOT to pirate.

>memey faggoty soiboi youtuber
>he doesnt cite his sources either
No surprise

There is not a single reason to not pirate games from any storefront. That include GoG

>Yes, it was very affective in bribing developers and forcing their own customers into it
Still no proof of this, chang. Like it was said earlier, just because your launcher is doing it doesnt mean steam did it 10 years ago

>Yea Forums
>Chinese
This is a Korean basketweaving forum you fucking newfag.

Neat little bit of missed history there. The fact that it lasted for years after 2003 and yet no ones heard of it though...

GOG at least guarantees bitcoin miner-free downloads.

He was interviewing the guy you fucking moron

I am so sick and tired of people who don't know what monopoly means.

Doubt it.

>ching chong ding dong
What's will you chinks always claiming everything is yours?

FYI unless Steam is preventing Epic from existing, it is no a monopoly. FYI a monopoly employs anti-competitive measures to assume power. Ergo, Steam is not a monopoly.

Because monopolies don't fucking exist in the PC environment.

You fucking.
Idiots.

You still need proper citation. Brainlet.

Buying games with 75-90% discounts is pretty convenient for all the perks you get comparing to the ol' good piracy

Oh there are many proofs you fucking zoomer
Everyone fucking hated steam
idlethumbs.net/forums/topic/246-reasons-why-steam-is-useless-and-bad/
neogaf.com/threads/why-is-steam-so-slow.33000/

Neck yourself already

you cant trust a program tainted with chink presence

At that time, there was almost no other competition to begin with.
Only one that existed in 2005 for was D2D

This is like people talking about making money in California vs Texas.

>pay 10% less tax
>pay 50% less
>make 70% less money
>end up with 30% less money after all expenses
>have less social services
>"California BTFO!"

this. Steam v.s. EGS is moronic as I already have both installed.

That's not because of Epic. Tim has no control over how our culture has made it acceptable to price games at $60 since we will pay for it. The cost will never be saved on the consumer end even if he saves publishers 20 million dollars. Indies might lower the cost but for games anyone cares about it's not happening.

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are you saying you can't trust Yea Forums now that we have Hiro?

If it happens, it happens
probably won't though and I'm definitely not helping

When it's drm free you can check the hash to see if the files been edited or not. With a game that needs a crack, this is not the case.

And yet they had to bribe developers, really makes you think. Almost as if people didn't want to use steam

Reminder that if you don't buy on EGS you aren't supporting the devs and their families.

the cut, the extra low cut for unreal engine games, the publishing deals, the curation, the userbase from fortnite and people signing up for free games, the increase in PC gaming... its all adding up to a perfect storm that steam was not prepared for... their still sticking to their strategy of stonewalling about the cut and letting assetflips and other low quality trash take up shelf space. The people shitflinging the most about this are exactly the sort of toxic gamers devs don't want playing their games anyway.

good thing Yea Forums isnt an exe that runs in admin

>And yet they had to bribe developers
>Things that never happened
I saw the whole video too, faggot. At no point did they make any mention of steam bribing them for exclusivity

>How does this help me?
>It helps other people
Ok, but how does it help me, Tim?

Check your task manager right now user.

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tonnes of woupd be $60 games launched at $60 though. But I think the illusion of "games are $60" died years and years ago. Games, especially from the AAAs are priced perfectly along the demand curve these days. Whether the store price is $20-40-$60.
$60 is not the standard price of a game. I can not remember the last game that launched as a single set $60, with no premium editions, no dlc or microtransactions, no xpacs, no sale price, no price drop, no basic edition, etc. Ubisoft are the kings of this.
Siege had like 5 different versions between like $20-$80 at one point, and has season passes, microtransactions free weekends and regular sales. I think a better developer cut gives more room on the low end. But probably not much will change on the top end.

>svchost.exe
AHHHHHHHHHHH!

>still going on about the cut
A cut that's the market standard, you do realise that right?

On its own, its basically Origin and Uplay.
But if you take into account the exclusivity contracts, its more like another competing console for the PC market. No different from a PS4 or switch or xbone exclusive, in an age where even big publishers are coming around to the conclusion that more platforms is better than exclusive games.

Also afaik, you cant release on EGS while on Steam. You have to make the exclusivity contract regardless, they just sweeten the deal with a cash incentive. I've also heard that the indies are getting low-balled, if you're a publisher you get even more money.

>tonnes of woupd be $60 games launched at $60 though.
**$50

Are you fucking joking? People bitch about this shit all the time.

>At no point did they make any mention of steam bribing them for exclusivity
It's hilarious because exclusivity implied there were any strong competitors in 2005

quality meaningless buzzwords.

Kill la kill IF just came out last month at $60 with nothing except some free dlc that launches later

>NOOO THEY DIDN'T BRIBE HIM INTO EXCLUSIVITY, THEY JUST GIVE HIM MONEY
>NOOO DARWINA GO EXCLUSIVE FOR FREE

Just admit that you're a fucking retard. People were not talking much about this back then, they fucking guy admitted valve bribed him 13 years later.

Unless you're a AAA title, and that's because they couldn't afford the exclusivity fee for it. Fucking Borderlands could only get 6 months, that should tell you something.

so like all epic shillposts

A cut that Tim confirmed is infeasible long term and would be upped once EGS got it's footing.

He later came up with the "Pass the savings on" line because he offers nothing else except some petty attempt at a benefit

its a standard cut when the store owner controls the platform and is the exclusive digital store. otherwise the cut is more like 85-95%

It's hilarious because you are implying anyone wanted steam back then

Can you link to the timestamp this happens at?

Except they did. Your own video, where the dev admitted to seeking out Gabe and pitching his game for sale on steam is proof of that

Its failing. That's why. They're bring shit most PC players stay away from consoles for. Exclusive shit. Sure you can bring up the fact that exclusives exist on PC but the way they went about it, forcing their way through bought out exclusives doesn't sit right with me. Leave that shit for the console niggers.

interesting. But I still imagine there is meticulously planned sales and pricecuts. maybe a certain amount of keys to be given to GMG or Fanatical with a 15% cut coupon code then a 20% off sale etc etc. I doubt it will be $60 for every long. But yeah some of the smaller jap companies are hold outs on the model.

stop being fat.

So can an EGS shill explain why I should want higher cuts for the devs? What have they done to justify an 88% cut as opposed to the 30% cut? Look at Borderlands 3. They got free upfront money and guaranteed sales, and what have they done?

>denuvo to punish legitimate customers
>60 dollars for the base game
>season passes
>microtransactions
>DLC
>Randy still calls gamers evil and entitled, despite him literally getting more money out of the deal

If you ask me, they don't deserve that cut. They're assholes who should starve.

Where the fuck are you pulling these numbers from? Before digital, publishers only got like 30% of a games price, with the rest going to shipping, box and manual, the disc and a chunk going to the retailer selling it. Even 70% with digital to the publisher was fucking enormous.

The guy had no fucking clue what gaben or steam is. If he wanted to sell his game there, why the bribe?

Timestamp is in the link already

Why should a company want to make more money?

You are fucking retarded and have 0 (zero) experience in the matter if you think 40% shares of a company gets you 0 clout just because it's lower than 50.

It's not even stopping Steam from being a competitor. Epic won't accept games that are also on Steam, causing people to still go to Steam for certain games. If Epic wanted a monopoly, they would accept all games and make a better store.

>if I plug my ears and close my eyes, it means I'm right

So its 2 years unless you can buy out the fee to reduce it to 6 months? Did i get that right?
Pitchford must be fuming at having to sign that contract.

why are you quoting yourself

Controlling shareholder is the one that has the final say or anything. 40% means that you can advise and get 40% of the profit. Nothing more, nothing less

Arc system works prices all their games at $60. More importantly many of these companies selling 5 versions of a game like Ubisoft and WB will shoot the price of the game down a month after launch even if it's successful, so they get more players to participate in their in game purchases system.

>So can an EGS shill explain why I should want higher cuts for the devs?
you shouldn't. Tim just knows most people don't care. steamfags need to learn the world does not revolve around them. Tim isn't doing anything for you because he doesn't need to. Steam is just a basic chromium storefront. What makes it so great is the library of games. What Tim wants/needs is a library of games. And do you know how you get a library of games? I'll give you a hint, the value proposition isn't meant for you.

A bigger cut of a smaller revenue stream is not how you make more profits.
No dev or publisher is getting this for long term revenue from the cut, they're only in it for the short term cash up front.

Borderlands got 6 months because T2 will miss key profits if they did a year. 6 months is the point when devs don't get anything back whatsoever.

Please enlighten us with your definition of Monopoly. What every source I have read says is the sole control of a supply or trade of goods. Steam for a long time was the sole source of a digital storefront. GoG came later after Steam had controlled the market for years and we all know how well GoG is doing even though it is extremely consumer friendly.

But What do you consider a Monopoly? The literal definition of a sole provider? Because that is not what the American Government considers it to be.

You don't have direct control and can't force anyone to do anything, but "hey we think you're not being aggressive enough and it's hindering growth so do as we say or we sell causing your stock price to plummet" goes a long way

Thanks to fortnite kids that are the majority of future customers it's more like long term investment. People may not yet realize, but steam already lost

This does sound kind of different. Like Valve offered him $10,000 to work on the game, in exchange for being on Steam. The video says shortly after he went from making it for fun to and actual job. This is way different than Epic paying for an already finished game.

So how is this store good for me, the customer, if none of the benefits apply to me and are solely for corporations?

It's not goy

Oh boy another Epic thread. Totally not the same shitposter trying another angle since his previous ones got deleted.

How?

>stock price
Epic is a private company. you played yourself

>Every Steam user who made an Epic account still has a fucking Steam account. You can use two stores at once.
Agreed. Having to go to Epic Games Store for certain games is a hassle, but it's not the end of the world like everybody is bitching about.

No, Tim is just paying devs while I pirate.

Game was finished when he was talking with gaben.

>why the bribe?
A bribe implies they had something to gain, user.
>Dev goes to Gabe and pitches his game, at the time, incomplete
>Gabe offers advance payment to the dev to finish the game and sell it through steam
>dev releases game on steam
>Sales cover his advance in one day
Compare with EGS
>Game is nearly complete
>Release dates and platforms announced
>Offers huge advance payment
>Offers guaranteed sales
>But only if they refuse to sell their game anywhere else, so no steam sales, no gog sales, no independent sales for a time period
Valve paid dev of incomplete game to finish the job, EGS paid devs of finished projects to ditch everybody else. Big difference

Oh its me Decided to give you what the American Government considers the definition of Monopoly just to hammer it in.

>Monopoly is a control or advantage obtained by one entity over the commercial market in a specific area. Monopolization is an offense under federal anti trust law. The two elements of monopolization are (1) the power to fix prices and exclude competitors within the relevant market. (2) the willful acquisition or maintenance of that power as distinguished from growth or development as a consequence of a superior product, business acumen or historical accident.

I have a feeling monopoly means more than you think it does.

I really wish that Epic would improve their game store if they want to succeed.

Again, niche nip stuff tends to be a bit slower at adopting this I acknowledge. But the game is already $54 on Fanatical.
>will shoot the price down a month after launch.
Exactly. the goal is to sell the game for $100 to the guy willing to spend $100, while still getting money off the guy only willing to spend $20. Pricing along the demand curve. The key is not screwing yourself by accidentally pricing it so everyone waits for the $20 version and then is satisfied with that.

Scrub.

He said it himself he finished the game after he took the offer

No it wasnt, idiot. He was showcasing a demo. This is mentioned in the video

same way steam, Origin, Battlenet, Uplay, and the windows store are good for you... They sell you games you want. personally none of the exclusives have sold me yet but I have been enjoying the free shit. I mean i don't care if you like EGS or not, but it is a bit like going to gamestop and saying "excuse me sir, what do you do for me" nothing, if everything you want is at Bestbuy go to bestbuy.
They want to win over developers so they have the games you want so you shop there. it isn't rocket science and it has nothing to do with sucking your dick or giving you shit.

this. EGS is a store, steam is a social media platform. to each their own.

Those sites always sell shit low. Their keys come from other countries. GMG was selling W3 at launch for $39.99 and CDPR got butthurt. Until the publisher lowers the cost throughout all of retail it's still a $60 title.

>same way steam, Origin, Battlenet, Uplay, and the windows store are good for you..
They're not good for me. They're retards trying to push me to download third party malware. And you have the IQ of a foot fungus if you just want me to shut up and accept it.

>"If I ignore the store and focus on one other part of the platform, it must be true!"

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oh I don't care, I said I found it funny. I was just explaining reality to you. go play FOSS games or ask to speak to Tim's manager of you wamt
the stores are more or less the same. I am just acknowledging a large reason for the fighting is cause steam is also a social media platform.

Steam offers nothing other than games, epic does not offer nothing other than games. Why should i care? Because much china?

wow. you must be fun at parties.

>buy full-price game on Epic
>play for a little bit
>realize I gained nothing over pirating it
>ask for refund
>get my refund
>game is still in my library, and I still play it

Buffoons.

'exclude competitors within the relevant market'
u know having a shit store with less features isnt an excuse to be excluded right?

fucking kek

Yes, epic does not have any sort of build in drm like steam does. It's almost as good as GoG

You play video games what the fuck is wrong with you?

What are you talking about. I am saying Steam was a monopoly. They had a stranglehold on the market simply by being the only one for so long. This caused them to become a Monopoly since any other digital storefront would be doomed to fail. Epic sought to fight this by throwing money, while scummy in practice it is smart. When people attack Epic and shill for valve they are supporting Monopolies and a closed market. I too hate having a fuckton of launchers but I am not going to excuse valve for their shit just to have one launcher. The real issue is Valve is doing fuckall to fight against Epic and is relying on you sheep that listen to Jim Sterling to do the fighting for them so they don't have to spend a dime.

> steam was a monopoly
stop using words that you do not understand

nope, GMG and Fanatical are actually both 100% legitimate and get their keys directly from publishers keeping with all regional guidelines. The reason they do this is because they can control the quantity sold at the price, don't have to pay steam cuts and have better foot traffic on steam. Basically they know most people are just gonna buy it on steam, the kind who doesn't care about $6. While the penny pinching couponers can be won over. TW3 issue was because Bandai Namco was the publisher of TW3 in certain regions but there were no region restrictions so GMG essentially worked out a better deal with them. regardless, Fanatical doesn't do that.
>if a game is for sale for $54 from a legitimate retailer who got their keys from the publisher the game is $60.
K.

Holy fuck what is your definition since I gave you the Government's and it proves that Steam is a monopoly. Are you autistic or something.

>Steam
>monopoly
Nah.

GOG existed before Epic made a store.
>b-but I don't like GOG
It still makes Steam not a monopoly.

Humble sells games that aren't Steam copies as well.

Good point. In my opinion epic will come out on top just for giving creators a bigger slice of the pie. They hit valve where it hurts

micrsoft store is 85-95% , mac app store is 30%, and unsuprisingly, most devs don't release there. And if they do they sell it directly from their website as well. You want to see what a shitty digital store looks like? look no farther than iOS where everyone realized that Apple had no interest in curating the store for high quality games so its filled with microtransaction ad filled trashed

But they were never the only one at all. There has always been other storefronts while Steam's been running.

>Yes, epic does not have any sort of build in drm like steam does
So I can download the game without the launcher? Forcing me to download software kinda defeats the point of it being "drm free".

Fucking look at this You guys are all getting the definition of monopoly wrong and assuming everyone else is. A monopoly isn't necessaryily the sole or only provider. It is a powerful provider that throws its weight around to maintain control. It is an entity that willingly does nothing to make the market open and fair. But keep touting words you don't understand. I told you all to look up Standard Oil and the shit they did. They weren't the only oil company but they sure as shit were a monopoly to the point the Sherman act busted them up. read this too.

>Humble sells games that aren't Steam copies as well.
Yeah, but they don't make too much efforts to get DRM-free builds. Hell, most of their published games are just Steam keys in their own store.

chinese spyware

>lol this sucks i don't want it
>refund it
>here's your refund, and you can keep the game
>lol buffoons got 'emmm gonna keep playing :^)
brainlet

>imagine being able to sell ur game keys to literally any other game stores but allow it to be playable on steam because it supports the game functionally better without steam getting a cut
SEETHING

>If there are 1000 walmarts and one small grocery shop in single country, that one grocer shop proves that walmart is not a problem.

I guess anti-trust law are useless, because pure monopoly is not possible withouth government assistance.

What? I don't know what your point is. Can you make it a coherent thought please? So because storefronts can sell steam keys, steam is not a monopoly? Man go take a law class please. You clearly don't understand what a monopoly is, if that is what you are saying.

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what if I told you guys that there is a whole range of possibilities between a monopoly and perfect competition, and that like 1% of markets actual fit either definition?

A Section 1 violation has three elements:[15]
(1) an agreement;
(2) which unreasonably restrains competition; and
(3) which affects interstate commerce.

A Section 2 monopolization violation has two elements:[16]
(1) the possession of monopoly power in the relevant market; and
(2) the willful acquisition or maintenance of that power as distinguished from growth or development as a consequence of a superior product, business acumen, or historic accident.

Section 2 also bans attempted monopolization, which has the following elements:
(1) qualifying exclusionary or anticompetitive acts designed to establish a monopoly
(2) specific intent to monopolize; and
(3) dangerous probability of success (actual monopolization).

Please explain which one of those Valve did. In detail.

>Yeah valve cut is big, but they allow to sell keys for free so it's not that bad!

We don't deserve him bros

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Yes they were. Nothing competed with Steam. Not gog, not EA, not Blizzard, not Ubi, not Beth
Gog is an old game repository. That's what it is
The others are just a place for their own games in order to bypass the 30% split

Why do you insistently make threads about epic games store all fucking day? Do you do it for free? Sage and ignore

>Monopolization is an offense under federal anti trust law.
Hmm, I wonder why Valve hasn't been prosecuted. They're far less rich and powerful than most other corporations which have been accused of being monopolies.
>The two elements of monopolization are (1) the power to fix prices and exclude competitors within the relevant market.
Valve has not fixed prices, and has not excluded GOG, Humble Bundle, itch.io, etc. from the market.
>(2) the willful acquisition or maintenance of that power as distinguished from growth or development as a consequence of a superior product, business acumen or historical accident.
Being the first on the digital distribution scene is almost certainly what is meant by "historical accident" in this definition. Also, Steam does offer a superior product compared to Epic and many other mediocre platforms. If its "power" in the market is due to these things, then it doesn't meet the second criterion in this definition of monopoly. You would have to show that Valve willfully tried to create a monopoly for this definition to support your argument.

Then you're fucking retarded, asswipe.

SO WHY ARE YOU TAKING AWAY GAMES FROM GOG? ANSWER THAT SMOOTHBRAIN

>The others are just a place for their own games in order to bypass the 30% split

To be fair, based on gog operating revenue gog also exsist only to get a higher cut on cdpr games

>Being the first on the digital distribution scene is almost certainly what is meant by "historical accident" in this definition.
Pretty much, you don't see Steam trying to suppress GOG

Section 2 both points. Also the 3rd point. Steam was in possesion of a monopoly power, whether you like it or not. This wasn't their fault but it existed none the less. Then they continued this by going to devs and having them dual release with steam keys. Instead of letting the market be they interfered in order to make money. Their product isn't superior but they would lower their prices in order to combat other stores like GoG. That is why they started sales, because they had the money at the time to lower prices, just like Standard fucking Oil which I told you to look into. After a while by keeping prices low they became the only threat in the market and then stopped lowering prices hence the shitty sales.

I get you can copy and paste stuff but can you comprehend it and use critical thinking and past laws aka precedent to understand how it works?

They have by lowering their game prices to compete with these new emerging markets. They can afford to eat losses that other companies cannot.

>lowering their game prices to compete with these new emerging markets
Individual publishers control their games' prices on Steam.

>Steam forced sales on publishers
They aren't Epic.

You stupid fucking retard. This is what happens when you take definitions from the internet and don't bother to even think.

>monopoly
How many again?

Attached: 1548898689353.jpg (500x372, 55K)

They don't have to, GoG is barely alive thanks to steam market share

Just play on console instead

>Steam was in possesion of a monopoly power, whether you like it or not.
If. They. Did. Nothing. To. Prevent. Competition. It. Is. Not. A. M.O.N.O.P.O.L.Y.

And yet being popular is not the definition of monopoly.

This is literally "I'm being oppressed by someone being bigger than me just standing there" in econspeak

Hang on, are you saying Chad's have a monopoly on vag and I can just sue for a free waifu?

it's Epic that's preventing games from being released on GOG, not Steam. Any games that Epic grab for their exclusives are going to hurt GOG a lot more than Steam ever did.

>Section 2 both points.
>This wasn't their fault but it existed none the less.
You're contradicting yourself. Section 2 line 2 specifically states that it must be a willful acquisition or maintenance of power. If you're saying it "wasn't their fault" then you know it fails that test.

>This is from the earlier 2009 Stardock report:
“Another trend we have seen in the past year has been Valve’s successful work with getting Steamworks licensed as a DRM solution by major publishers. Once a game requires Steamworks, it is effectively cut off from us, which limits our content. Examples of this include THQ’s Dawn of War II, SEGA’s Empire: Total War, and more recently Activision’s Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare 2. The problem is that it is not practical for us to install a game that in turn requires the installation of a competitor’s store and platform in order to play.”

Yeah, they did nothing.

>Using gamestop as an example
People literally asked "what is this store doing for me as a consumer?" and decided to go elsewhere offering better prices/service.

You know that most Epic Games Store exclusives wouldn't even made it to GOG.

Nobody forced publishers to sell a Steam'd version everywhere.

Remind me again, who is buying up games and not allowing them to release on GOG?

Except several specifically promised a GOG version.

...

>"The problem is that it is not practical for us to install a game that in turn requires the installation of a competitor’s store and platform in order to play."
That's interesting because this perfectly describes the state of many Ubisoft games sold on Steam. They require Uplay.

Man you are a retard, Steam definitely hampered the market with their DRM. Keep on being dumb.
4 of them at least.

Well, valve did by abusing their monopoly power. They made it unsustainable to release on more platforms if a game had DRM. Which is the only reason GoG is alive to this day, barely.

Some more just for you.
>Direct2Drive (D2D) was an early rival of Steam that came out in 2004 and was somewhat competitive… at first. Created by IGN, it held massive backing from one of the largest gaming networks around and over the next few years, hundreds of publishers. As time passed, however, Steam continued to grow and the DRM mess that plagued PC gaming had begun to pay off in their favor; compared to everything else, Steamworks was great. The stores were competitive but the DRM was not and Valve’s focus of keeping both paid dividends in 2009 when Activision’s Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 required Steam as its method was Steamworks. Unwilling to compromise, a declaration of boycott was made along with claiming Steam to be a trojan horse, in spite of their own store selling games that were using DRM such as SecuROM and Starforce. Impulse and GamersGate soon joined and together you had all three stores banding together with a stand against Steam. If not this game then for others.
It didn’t work.

>4 of them
>can't name them nor can you describe in detail how it applies to Steam
Amazing argument bro.

Why do Tim and Game journalists keep saying epic store is good for game devs? I care about me the consumer. I don't care about how much money a games company is making. They never say any way that epic store benefits the consumer.

Most epic exclusives are the type of AA/indie games that would absolutely be on GOG.

Valve offering a DRM solution, and publishers deciding to use it, isn't really an attempt at preventing competition. It's literally just Valve offering a product. I can understand the perceived problem here but I don't think it brings Steam any closer to qualifying as a monopoly in the legal sense.

holy fucking shit ur actually just reading these at face value
>hurrr durr theyre breaking the monopoly law
>WHY ARENT THEY GETTING ARRESTED
>I AM SILLY
theres a fucking reason why they havent broken anything but fucking literal children acting as pseudo soveriegn citizens think copy and pasting is a valid argument

Ubisoft main thing is not being a storefront. It's making and selling their games.

Except Steam never forced publishers to use their DRM

Most devs and "journalists" hate gamers.

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...

Okay...? And yet Uplay is a storefront.

>Steam doesn't have monopoly
Explain this image then Steamfats

Attached: Monopoly.png (733x405, 120K)

>AA
>GOG at launch

>SMBF
>in GOG at all

1. EGS threads everyday, fuck off.
2. Because nobody in the world thinks EGS will actually succeed and pull it off. EG is the kind of company that makes a community like ‘Shenmue’ hate their most anticipated game before it’s out.

'Ebic's main thing is not being a storefront. It's making and selling fortnite'
Ok retard

Risk is the better game

That's Monopoly Plus idiot

And I hate them too. But at the end of the day its consumers who are buying things from the store so why dont they even try to have some benefit for using it over steam

>needs uplay to play it
irony

What does Activision deciding to use Steamworks, because it's convenient, have to do with Valve "pushing their weight around"? Activision was putting COD games on steam even after launching the new Battle.net until Black Ops 4. You're proving everyone else's point. Steam is convenient now, for publishers and for users, that's why it's on top.

Abusing their market share to create a tool that makes other storefronts unsustainable is not preventing competition? The fuck is then, assassination of your competitors?
Steam DRM killed physical copies, it was a no brainer to use it at a time for major players. Offer only retards wouldn't take

Why bother you are just going to move goal posts and rationalize them away.

You are so in defense of an industry that you are willing to fuck yourself in the ass to protect them. Neither EGS or Steam are good. I just don't want to sit in this thread of steam wanking.

Ill name em though.
1. Price Maker: Often prices are compared to Steam before buying a product since they often offer low prices. This is only in the digital storefront realm and is no longer the case but was until about 6 years ago.
2.Barriers to Entry: DRM makes you have to use Steam until other publishers got sick of it.
3. Downward Sloping Demand Curve: People were bitching about steam for years but once EGS came along they stopped because Tenecent is cancer. Also how often do you see people lamenting the death of digital which Steam pushed for first.
4. Kinda iffy but arguable for No Close Substitutes.

Do you come into every one of these threads to make this dad joke?

dad jokes are better than these threads

If steam even is a monopoly, Epic's way of fighting it is one of the most retarded ways I have seen

>Abusing their market share to create a tool
i.e., creating a tool while existing
>that makes other storefronts unsustainable
Using Steamworks was the publishers' choice.
>is not preventing competition? The fuck is then
Oh, I don't know, maybe paying publishers not to do business with other stores. Of course, even non-monopoly companies can pull that off, e.g. Epic.

I agree. I was commending your dedication.

>it was a no brainer to use it at a time for major players. Offer only retards wouldn't take
Hm, sounds like Steam created a superior product, an act which is explicitly noted as NOT being part of the definition of monopoly according to and .

Hi dedication, I'm Dad.

>1. Price Maker: Often prices are compared to Steam before buying a product since they often offer low prices. This is only in the digital storefront realm and is no longer the case but was until about 6 years ago.
This is digital in general. It's why people started buying from iTunes instead of getting CDs. It's why paying for an online streaming service became more viable than cable. Holy shit you're retarded.
>2.Barriers to Entry: DRM makes you have to use Steam until other publishers got sick of it.
Optional DRM entirely on the back of publishers. And by that logic, SecuROM was a fucking monopoly since it got forced on us at the time.
>3. Downward Sloping Demand Curve: People were bitching about steam for years but once EGS came along they stopped because Tenecent is cancer. Also how often do you see people lamenting the death of digital which Steam pushed for first.
Based on your example, you don't actually know what this means.

>Activision was putting COD games on steam even after launching the new Battle.net
The retail versions were Steam-free until MW2.

oh you

as it turns out, why bother to put effort into online when steamworks helps you with that

>the most effective way that is proving to work against all odds is retarded

>most effective
>in order to fight monopoly we have to become the monopoly

Man you are the retard. And did exactly what I said you would.

1. I was talking about the digital store front gaming realm. Itunes is not part of the same market.

2. I am not going to argue this train of logic all over again about how steam uses their DRM to lock you into their storefront.

3. It is pretty easy to understand since it is econ 101. A trend of consumers not demanding the product being sold. AKA digital games. People are freaking the fuck out saying they don't own their games anymore. But they have no choice but to buy it digital. Hell most PC's no longer have cd ports and this was started by Valve pushing the digital market when no one asked for it or wanted it.

Please don't be blinded by your own ideologies that you can't see that Steam was a monopoly until 6ish years ago, but by that time they had acquired enough power to become a hegemony which has monopoly like powers without being one. Maybe my arguments aren't being clear since it is hard for me to type out my thought process, I am more of an orator. I can see your points about Steam not being a monopoly in many regards but the original argument started because an user said they never were one even back in the late 2000's.

>superior product
Tool specifically targeted to not allow anyone else to compete is a superior product? Well okay then,i guess you will just deflect anything at this point. Waste of my time.

But answer me this, if valve is so pro-competitive then why design their shitty drm in a way that does not allow others to sell it without using their own client? Why epic could desing a storefront withouth that shit?

Let me answer it for you, valve is not charity and like any fucking company in the entire world they hate their competitors. Epic is not doing that because they couldn't afford enough money to cover the lose of steam customers.

To clarify my number 3 I don't mean literally demanding, but wanting to buy the product. Again I am showing it is hard for me to type my thoughts in a mannerly way.

>Full Control of Supply
>Barriers to Entry
>No Close Substitutes
>Price Maker
Oh god, it turns out Epic_ is a monopoly.

They started using Steam and Steamworks because it was cheaper and easier than putting out boxed copies. Valve didn't force anything on them. Why do you think Acti has now moved COD to Battle.net? It's easier, cheaper and they can use it to push their own store.

So now you see the dilemma

You have no fucking idea of what a downward demand curve is don't you

>Tool specifically targeted to not allow anyone else to compete is a superior product?
Yes, because many publishers chose to use it.

>Muh free games
Most of the free games they give out fucking suck
>Muh exclusives
The same can be said of a lot of their exclusives. I'll pay for a console if I wanna play those games.
>Muh launcher is crap, but Steam was for 15 years!
Not an argument. Steam was crap when there weren't industry standards in place. There are still crappy things about the service but overall it is good, where EGS is trying to compete with a bare-bones storefront and money.
>Muhnopoly! Competition!
Not an argument. There have been many services competing with Steam in the past and the present, but people conveniently forget about itch and GOG for the sake of the argument
>Valve is greedy! They don't even make games anymore!
Most of the money goes into maintaining their 66 data centers that store about 200 or so physical machines that are utilized from across the globe constantly. They also go into developing the Steam software (whose networking api is getting more frequently used by upcoming games) and software that is free to use and capitalize on by anyone. They aren't making games but they're laying the foundation for other game developers to act upon.

Also, I don't trust Valve to be able to make a good game these days.

I think that pretty much sums up these threads

Because it's just a bunch of loud-mouthed saber rattling?

EPIC is literally a meme that's going to come and go once they can't pay back the investments Tencent has showered them in.

Besides, I'm usually too busy gaming on Steam to see these retarded threads.

>price maker
Those are literally set by the publishers not Valve itself
>barriers to entry
Thar applies to competitors creating their own platform in a market and considering how every publisher keeps making their own clearly this does not apply.
>downward sloping demand curve
You pretty much don't understand what this means so I'll spell it out for you. As demand goes up price goes down. A monopolist cannot remain at a constant price as it's output goes up. Valve does not control who makes games nor the time in which they create said games.
>no close substitutes
Valve is not the only supplier of video games on the market. The fact you don't understand what this means either means you show an extremely lack of intelligence when it comes to understanding what an actual monopoly is.

I do I just can't explain it in a way that makes sense I guess. It has to do with not wanting to pay a price thus shifting the demand. If that is what you are referring to. We are having two different uses of downward demand slope. I was talking about people not wanting to pay for digital at all. If you are referring to only pricing and the literal slope you are being too narrow.. But continue to put me on the defensive.

>Downward Sloping Demand Curve: People were bitching about steam for years but once EGS came along they stopped because Tenecent is cancer. Also how often do you see people lamenting the death of digital which Steam pushed for first.
Are you fucking retarded? Have you ever actually taken economics?

>GoG
exsist only becuse it's not affected by steamworks. Barely alive, hardly a competition.
>itch
If you know anything about it, it's more like a charity than a store. exsist only becuse it's not affected by steamworks either.

I'm just annoyed that I have to install yet another fucking launcher to play all my games.

>exsist only becuse it's not affected by steamworks.
What does this even mean? And how is it supposed to support your argument?

Would they use it if not for steam market share? Obviously no, then it's not a superior product. It's just abusing monopoly power

>If you know anything about it, it's more like a charity than a store
And yet, they still act as a platform to sell games that provides more than EGS' shitty storefront
>Provide examples of competing services
>U-UH... THOSE DON'T COUNT! MUHNOPOLY! COMPETITION!

>I just can't explain it in a way that makes sense
What? One of the easiest curves to explain in economics and you can't explain that? So you end up making up an explanation for something you don't know?
It's even more stupid because a downward demand curve is the standard for most goods, so someone who has a passing knowledge in econs should be able to explain this easily. Yet you gave us a fucking stupid explanation.

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In order to abuse monopoly power, Steam would have to be a monopoly first, and when you guys tried to use the definition of monopoly to argue that it's a monopoly (, etc.) you got systematically btfo.

retard, read the thread.
If a game use stemworks, it's not profitable to sell it not on steam.

>Shenmue
Will be irrelevant in 6 months

this 100x this. i personally hate having to NEED multiple applications that provide "stores" just to play a game. i don't mind there being 100,000 different ones. but i personally like and enjoy steam. i'd like to be able to get it on the store front i prefer. already hard enough needing battle.net, steam, origin, and bethesda launcher. and oh, ubisoft launcher that steam launches to play farcry 5 along with epic launcher just to play other games. i shouldn't need a billion. let people use the ones they like. there are battle.net fans, fans of epic, and such. just let people use what they want rather than forcing people to have a billion.

>game gets put on epic
>nobody buys it
they'll learn eventually

>If a game use stemworks, it's not profitable to sell it not on steam.
... And?

You were dismissing GOG and itch.io as competitors because they're "not affected by Steamworks" and you still haven't explained how that makes any sense.

Why are these threads always cancer with on side defending EGS and the other saying that Valve is the good guy? Both are cancer. If you defend either you are the problem

>retard, read the thread.
I'm reading it and a lot of it is you making flimsy arguments as to why they don't count. Why the hell shouldn't GOG be counted as competition? Why is it that a service that sends the majority of their profits directly to charity and developers is able to make a better storefront than a monolithic company? There's no excuses for either of these things.

>If a game use stemworks, it's not profitable to sell it not on steam.
What are you even talking about? Be verbose instead of tossing out vague statements like this.

Maybe he means that GOG and itch.io don't count as competitors because they don't fit the narrative about Steamworks being anti-competitive.

No
>A pure monopoly is defined as a single supplier. While there only a few cases of pure monopoly, monopoly ‘power’ is much more widespread, and can exist even when there is more than one supplier – such in markets with only two firms, called a duopoly, and a few firms, an oligopoly.

According to the 1998 Competition Act, abuse of dominant power means that a firm can 'behave independently of competitive pressures'. See Competition Act.

If you have no knowledge why do you even bother posting here? unironically educte yourself on the topic and come back, and don't act like you know shit. Becuse i see that you don't

That's opposite tho, a product with multiple sellers drive the prices low (if X sell game at 30 and Y at 20, people will buy from Y, X knows that and will lower its price if it wants to compete), exclusivity however drive the prices up like crazy because the company owning the product have full control and will look for its best interest (X sells a game at 60 bucks when other sellers would have sold it for 10 at best? Well too bad, it's either that or nothing)

Okay, provide me 5 games with steamwork that are sold on other storefronts. Good luck

Yeah, steamworks is very competitive. which is why it killed it's competition that didn't want to sell only drm free games.

>not knowing steam acts as a support for the game such as techinical support, item marketplace and mod support
shhh kid

Don't deflect, stupid motherfucker. You're not even explaining what you mean, to what extent that Steamworks covers. Do you just mean their Achievement API? Workshops? Peer-to-peer networking? Be verbose, I know that might be hard for you since you're programmed to reply in a specific manner but it is important for the discussion.

Good thing that steam killed it's competitors with steamworks before any of this was added.
Oh fuck off you fucking retard, steamworks is primarly DRM. Read the thread
>>Direct2Drive (D2D) was an early rival of Steam that came out in 2004 and was somewhat competitive… at first. Created by IGN, it held massive backing from one of the largest gaming networks around and over the next few years, hundreds of publishers. As time passed, however, Steam continued to grow and the DRM mess that plagued PC gaming had begun to pay off in their favor; compared to everything else, Steamworks was great. The stores were competitive but the DRM was not and Valve’s focus of keeping both paid dividends in 2009 when Activision’s Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 required Steam as its method was Steamworks. Unwilling to compromise, a declaration of boycott was made along with claiming Steam to be a trojan horse, in spite of their own store selling games that were using DRM such as SecuROM and Starforce. Impulse and GamersGate soon joined and together you had all three stores banding together with a stand against Steam. If not this game then for others. It didn’t work.

So your argument, unironically, is that GOG and Itch.io don't count as competitors because acknowledging them as competitors goes against your narrative about Steamworks preventing competition.

Overcooked 2
Broforce
Darkwood
Slime Rancher
Stardew Valley
Divinity
Dying Light
Etc.
>inb4 d-doesn't count

Don't reply to me ever again

And that sounds like an excerpt from an article written by people with an axe to grind. It's pointed out one specific instance of Steamworks being a problem but no others.

Also, do you not know how easy it is to simply disable Steamworks in place of something else these days? Gamedev engines are a godsend in that regard, since you can literally just swap the modules out if your project is structured properly. I wouldn't expect a wikipedia brown such as yourself to actually have knowledge on the subject, however.

lmao

>get btfo
>can't argue back
Kek

>>lol this sucks i don't want it
The game doesnt suck I just didnt need to buy it, I like the game.

They are buffoons because they are so bad they cant manage a refund system lol

Does Epic have a marketing team? At which point did they thought pissing off the customers from other platforms (mostly Steam) was considered a good move?

>implying the can hire a PR team
Nigga they can't hire someone to code in a shopping cart.

theyre spending fortnite profits like daddy's money to see how far they can get. its not to make a profit, its to send a message

>Implying it was me, not a falseflagger.
Soon i will respond

It's what happens when you're a retard, he never replied to

My lmao didn't imply anything except that it was funny

lmao

Competition always starts off choppy. It doesn't matter to them how they start but how they are 2-3 years from now. Aside from here and Jim Sterling the outrage is lessening already. People have short term attentions, look at Bnet launcher and any other platform out now. As soon as the next big controversy in the market happens people will hop off.

Personally I'm not boycotting shit since I play games I want to play not fall into political B.S. But I am secretly rooting for GoG

Even in a vacuum, the higher cut can make a worse service for customers. A store front with a smaller cut means they couldn't afford the burden of major sales or be as feature complete as steam.

What, need to to organize you notes from epic, Zhang

Epic games is not getting my money because they hate sexy anime styled girls.

>says a higher cut makes it worse for customers
>explains why a smaller cut does it

All of these games were sold on GoG years after steam release. Obviously, they had to remove drm to sell them elsewhere. If anything, it proves that steamworks truly prevent competition as long as it there.

Hey stream drones just kys :) time is ticking your steam profiles getting purged soon

Reading comprehension
>a higher cut (for developers)
>a store front with a smaller cut (meaning EGS gets the smaller cut)

>siphon users from steam
That's just called capitalism and competition. Are you 12? You realize you can just use both if different games are on either?

No, had to do a research because retard from here provide nothing more than names on some shitty small indies, and dying light.

Samefag btw

>4channel is one guy

GOG is based for being DRM-free.
Steam, as much as I understand the hate, is based as fuck for what it has done for Linux gaming.
Epic, meanwhile... has done lots of giveaways, I guess... but constantly having free giveaways certainly isn't going to make me buy games from them. Anything I buy might be the next free game. Why risk that?

WHO IS THIS 4-CHANNEL?!

>vr support
For what? Chat rooms
>multiplayer support
What games do they sell that require it
>linux support
I feel like this is a niche request
>$100 for BL3
Why do you assume I'm going to spend $100. I am getting the $60 version, also I spend more money on golf and fast food so I don't really care about $100.

>Anything I buy might be the next free game. Why risk that?
Don't most games get added precisely when the giveaway begins?

>provide nothing more than names
You asked, he answered.

Games that go free are not available to buy on epic before going free. I wouldn't buy shit on steam because they may end up being free on epic

>buying BL3
Shut up Randy

>ask for games
>provide games
>OH NO NO WHAT DO YOU MEAN I'M SUPPOSED TO RESEARCH

To be honest I don't know.

Good to know. Thanks. There's something to be said for games being devalued in general though. I guess the devs of these games weren't getting any sales anymore so they had nothing to lose.

If you want free games, just go out on public wifi and pirate them. Most of the games Epig gives out for free fucking suck, and the ones that don't are old goldies that were already bought on Steam by a lot of people or

I was answering why i need some time to answer you moron. I feel like you are all a bunch of kids. Oh wait, yes you are

>I wouldn't buy shit on steam because they may end up being free on epic
But you're not buying games from Epic either.
Isn't selling something at a loss illegal in America? Then again considering it's giving stuff away so it might not be considered selling. But the result is the same.

I'll never use Epic.

You're the only one arguing for monopoly at this point

Not really, i was arguing that steamworks was designed specifically to harm competitors. And it was possible due to the fact that steam has monopoly power, not pure monopoly. But whatever, i'm done. I tried to inform younger people how valve was fucking with pc gaming industry, but it's quite clear that steamdrones will just ignore everything because
>Valve good

>the same
It is basically the extreme of loss leading

Look how he stop responding. lol
Another shill get rekt out of their instructions.

I like borderlands and there is nothing you can do about it. Naner naner boo boo!

Yes, every f2p game is illegal in america.

He truly did get BTFO harder than most. I actually wonder if he wasn't just baiting.

>loss leading where you sell products at a loss to attract customers to the store to buy other stuff is the same as f2p games with majority of profits coming from microtransactions and subscriptions

But isn't this illegal by the fact that eventually they'll try to sell said games?

>Yes, every f2p game is illegal in america.
I mean giving away a game you intend to sell later, specially in the case of exclusives where other platforms will also be able to sell it after a certain time.

The problem isn't them trying to take users from Steam and creating exclusives, the problem is that the launcher is proprietary software that's more malicious than Steam.

Questionable analogies aside, I don't think it's illegal in any case. Why the fuck would it be illegal? Promotional giveaways are not uncommon.

Yes

It's a loophole. A very scummy lopphole that basically invalidates the law, but a loophole it is.

A loophole in what law? Why would promotional giveaways be illegal? You guys are weird as fuck thinking there's anything illegal about it.

Not to revive a dead horse, but people have been incorrectly assuming a monopoly must have 100 percent of the market. The government of the U.S has stated that 50-80 percent of the market is enough to qualify as a Monopoly. And Steam has used it's DRM as a barrier of entry. Steam may not be a literal monopoly but it was sure as shit on its way before EGS, with Origin really being the only major standout.

I am not saying I support EGS because fuck Epic, but I am saying the few anons that were arguing had a case and everyone else was using a too literal and outdated definition. Laws have been added to the original definition that was being used. No need to start another argument this was more food for thought for the future.

pcgamesn.com/steam-revenue-2017
18%, still not a monopoly.

Earlier ITT people literally quoted legal definitions of monopoly but then failed to argue successfully that they applied to Steam. But okay.

I'll just say that if Steam qualifies as a monopoly then it's a miracle nothing is done about it, because it's not as if they're big enough to tell the government to fuck off if Uncle Sam comes at them with thr antitrust shit.

Yep. Add that Steam is pro player while EGS is pro publisher.

Interesting if accurate

Many businesses fly under the radar. The government isn't perfect and it takes a lot of money to argue against Valve these days. I am not saying they are a monopoly but there would be a case if someone wanted to argue it. If you are curious about how monopolies are defined based on the U.S Department of Justice I will link it to you. It is much longer and has more detail than what the other anons were linking or pasting. justice.gov/atr/competition-and-monopoly-single-firm-conduct-under-section-2-sherman-act-chapter-2 The TLDR is at the bottom with the conclusion but I learned a lot by reading it.

It's from Epic's kingshill himself. So Timmy hired an utter retard if so.

>Steam has used it's DRM as a barrier of entry
I'm not sure what you mean. Other companies couldn't enter the digital distribution market because of Steam's DRM? I guess you're saying publishers only wanted to sell on stores with built-in DRM and the cost of other stores offering their own DRM solution was too high...? Or something?

I think the other user did not understand what a DRM is and was just parroting.

I just wanted to share an interesting read. I honestly don't give a fuck about the store front wars going on. I am more interested in the laws and interpretation. If I had to chose between the two I reluctantly chose Steam
The DRM issue is that Steam offered it for essentially free but you have to use it on their client. Making it a deal to good to resist, but locking in games that use it. It is not black and white but it is interesting thread to start looking into. An article I was reading stated that the argument for a monopoly is not as a store but as a DRM. I can link the article but I should mention I am researching into the validity of what is being said since it is written by a literal who. I just find the argument fascinating. I have no horse in the race so to speak.

>Tencent
This meme again. They're not a majority shareholder.

Besides, what's one platform holder vs another? When was the last time Valve has done something good for the pc community?

Coke isn't a monopoly just because almost no one prefers Pepsi. GOG, uplay, origin and Bethesda's shitty little launcher all manage to exist without being kikes.

>When was the last time Valve has done something good for the pc community?
As a Linux user, I have to mention Proton. It's a big deal for gamers who don't want Microsoft's microdick in their asses for all eternity. Gaming on Linux isn't perfect yet but Valve made it better.

Steam also has several other features that most platforms lack. (In-home streaming, family sharing, cloud saves, etc.)

Tencen has what? 48% of shares, do you think anyone can just tell them "no"

Physical based media on pc killed itself with an abysmal botnet security. Denuvo is not even close to the shittiness of the starforce which could literally kill your windows.

Winnie the Pooh
Xi Win Pooh
Hong Kong Massacre 2019

vocaroo.com/i/s04OvwnDHFxq

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Fuck Tencent
Fuck China
Fuck Jannies and Mods for not removing any Ebin threads on sight
And Fuck Niggers

yea, if you want to disrupt a market that has a monopoly and you're 10 years too late to the table, then you need a game changer and a few free games isn't it. valve got god damned lucky just committing with a digital distribution platform and letting it grown. i bet it costs pennies to run steam compared to the margins they make. It's like trying to beat microsoft by making "total not windows, but has everything windows has"

They give you free games. When was the last time Steam gave you something free that was actually GOOD, and wasn't them trying to say sorry for their numerous fuck ups?

maybe it was before they had a shopping cart and basic user functionality

jesus fuck, i work for a public company and they appointed 3 board members from a consulting firm that bought ~3 of our stock. and they are already making budget recommendations. Yea, epic is RICED.

>48%
why are you steam drones ill in the head, subhuman drone this bullshit gets exposed in every thread but you keep talking bullshit, its actually 40%, that is the reason why steam will die, drones are in full suicide watch and damaging steam even more with their subhuman behavior

>an actual on point reply
I'm not a Linux user but I'm a fan of whatever support the platform gets.

That being said all those other features are just nice-to-have not must-have imo. At the end of the day it comes down to the games and if Epic has exclusives (such as phoenix point) I'll have no problem using it.

It feels to me like Valve has been dragging its ass for years and if it takes Epic store or GOG Galaxy 2 to provide a kick in the ass or a superior choice respectively, then I'm all for it

Friendly reminder that Devs who accept bribe from EGS don't care about gamers anyway

GoG is superior store and so fuck all epic shills cus they are stupid because if they really hate Steam monopoly, they should support GoG what actually is a superior store

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>that pic
What the fuck am I looking at?

According to the event and what DARQ dev said, big companies have a choice on the exclusivity.
CDPR and Paradox have managed to put Cyberpunk and VtMB:2 on all stores including EGS without any kind of exclusivity. They are big companies who have products with high demand. It's not easy for Tim to say no to them, if they will want to sell the game on multiple stores, because they might refuse to sell the game on EGS, and that's a lost opportunity for Timmy Tencent. The only decision left is up to big boys whether to take the vbuck wad of cash and fuck over consumer by selling the game only on EGS for 6 months or 1 year, or to sell on every store out there taking every opportunity to make the money and to have some good will.
However it is easy for Tim to say no to some small/indie dev, because he's literally who. There were only two developers so far who decided to share a peek at what happens with the whole process.

>There were only two developers so far who decided to share a peek at what happens with the whole process.
Based SamSho guys telling Tim Tam to eat a dick