Why do people like this series again besides nostalgia...

Each world was a treat to explore and slowly comb over, getting puzzles, challenges, and a charming cast with good jokes as you did it. Controls were snappy, and the different abilities were fun and made you look forward to getting more.

Tooie is bigger and better, with more intricate world design that can be hard to digest at times, but let them go fucking wild with some of the shit in that game.

Nuts & Bolts was alright, though the mission design most of the time was recycled boring shit. Exploring the town and fucking around with the vehicle creator was fun enough.

Didn’t play the gba games.

agree, but that's the only thing SM64 really has going for it. Level design, graphics, soundtrack, and dialogue is better in BK

3D collectathons are trash.

Level design in Banjo is worse. Mario 64 is a much better game.

This, banjo is such a fucking slog to go back to

hard disagree, most SM64 levels are just toyblock shapes floating around with no coherent theme

big green witch tiddies

Hi paddypoop. Still upset about Steve not getting in, huh? Don't worry, he'll make a great mii costume

It’s gonna come down to how much you let window dressing affect you. If not much you’ll more likely prefer Mario 64.

They do have a consistent theme, but the point is the play a lot better. In Mario 64 you can see a ledge and a normal jump doesn't make it. What can you do? Oh, wall kick off a nearby wall. Sideflip onto the platform. Time a triple jump if you have enough distance. What are your options in Banjo Kazooie? Back flip. If that's not high enough? The devs put a spring jump nearby. It's so shallow it's pathetic and the level design is crippled by the over-simplicity.

The level design is way worse lol

Spyro and Crash we're far more shallow in terms of gameplay. I can hardly enjoy Spyro going back to it now.

>ITT: zoomers that never played a banjo game

camera controls in SM64 are ass though, plus most of the moves available to you are utterly pointless. Yes, BK has fewer moves available to you, but the worlds are designed around that and imo the world design is far better and far more memorable than anything in SM64.

Oops replied to the wrong thing. Meant it all to the second one I guess

>An Ubisoft game
Found the faggot who pronounces it as oo-bee-soft

camera is fine in mario, you don't have to change it very much.
>plus most of the moves available to you are utterly pointless.
all the moves available to you are ways to improve your navigation. You don't need the side flip at any point, but doing it gives you height in a confined space, allows you to engage in the mechanical sandbox in far more elaborate ways, and this ultimately makes the game more fun than crouch -> backflip.

>before ubisoft existed

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oh please nobody ever uses the kick, few people even know it exists. Many other moves, such as the sideflip you mention, are absurdly situational and rarely used by anybody.

Yes i am normal user what about it?

Not him, but the kick is used a ton in speedruns/abusing the game physics. Sideflip is a pretty common move too since it goes higher than a normal jump

Everyone uses it, everyone makes regular use of all the skills. Just because you never figured out anything besides triple jumping doesn't mean no one else did. I was doing it at age 7 when the game came out.

This is what makes the game better than Banjo Kazooie.

>speedrunning and exploits
hard pass

Not really an exploit, just a way to get up steep hills quick. Hold jump, repeatedly kick and move, get up hill.

user that is the definition of an exploit, it was not intended by the developers.

If it wasn't intended it would be removed, it was intentional and works great.

Then I guess that makes going over huge gaps in Mario Odyssey using the hat bounces rather than platforms or captures is an exploit too? It's just taking advantage of game mechanics

>If it wasn't intended it would be removed
so being able to glitch yourself into parallel universes is also intended behaviour, right?
The kick was intended to be an attack move only
Odyssey is mostly designed around hat-jumping (with coins hidden in areas you can only reach via careful hat jumps as proof the devs knew you could reach it) although there are areas where you can use it to skip sections unintentionally, so yes that can be considered an exploit to.

Yes and no. Deal with it with your slowpaced, shallow platformer.

BK is a collectathon, not really a platformer, and I'm fine with that.

>Donkey Kong 64 starts with rap from all of the main characters
>Banjo Kazooie doesn't
what did rare mean by this?

>t. only had mario
everyone who had both prefers banjo

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Collectathon isn't a genre, it's a 3D platformer.

this

>Collectathon isn't a genre
it is if enough people use the term

It's not. just like metroidvania. You sure are wrong about a lot today.

>ubisoft
Is this like comparing someone mean to Hitler now or something? Like, do you think if you say something is like Ubisoft people won't realize you're just pulling shit out of your ass and that your statement means nothing?

metroidvania is also a genre for the same reason lad

It's not, the correct term is exploration platformer. Sorry, you've been lied to and are now spreading false information.

actual vidya devs and publishers use the term, it's completely valid.

They're unfortunately wrong, it's not helping your case perpetuating a bad name for a genre that doesn't really fit any definition or use understandable language.

>(do busy work)
That's something called "gameplay."

I like collecting stuff

Moving banjo around is fun and it rewards exploration very well. Everything is cute/funny and because of it's art style the graphics still hold up today. It's almost like if you just have good controls and good level design the game doesn't have to be that complicated. Sprinkle in some cute/funny shit and you're golden.

why are banjo fans so sensitive, the games were good but far from master pieces like mario

who's right then? who's the overlord deciding what genres are valid and what aren't?
I'm pretty sure language, and the definition of game genres by extension, are decided purely by how often people use the terms and under what context, although I don't really want to get into a whole debate on prescriptivism vs descriptivism.

>before Ubisoft existed
You must be 18 years or older to post on Yea Forums

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If you wanted to talk about BK then you should have just made a normal thread.

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Is there a single game Ubisoft has put out that can compare to Banjo? Even Rayman doesn't come close in terms of gameplay

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I prefer Banjo Kazooie over Mario 64 desu

We had both the n64 library was not really that big

>DK64 for the boss battles
>Mario 64 for the movement and jumping mechanics
>Banjo Kazooie for ??????

Literally any recent game, leave the rock buddy

A collectathon is a type of 3D platformer. Easy solution. Like how rock is a broad music genre, and there's different types of it

>Before Ubisoft existed

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>Banjo Kazooie for walking

>who's right then?
what sounds more easily understandable?
3D Platformer vs Romp'n'jump collect 'em up
Exploration Platformer vs Metroidywoidy nintendy mcSymphony of the Nightathon (TL Note: Also known as Akumajou Densetsu in Japan, but it's not like the first 8, it's like the 9th game, so Dracula X)

Presentation. It's fine for one playthough for the novelty/charm but not much past that because of how simple the movement is and how barebones the platforming. It's less a platformer and more like an adventure game without puzzles.

IT TRUE MY GUY

Banjo Kazooie for BREEEE

now you're just being retarded on purpose

Gonna have to go with level design for that. I love that Tooie added DK64-like boss battles but the level design would've been better off being more simplistic with less backtracking.

user, I'm here to let you know that you are objectively correct.

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I guess we should stop using the term arena shooter, since it might confuse people that have never touched a FPS before and might get confused at the distinction between Quake and Call of Duty.

there are puzzles in the form of grounding some switches and tedious fetch quests

you can have collectathons that involve no platforming whatsoever, so I'm not sure about that user.

Rayman 2 is just as good as either Banjo game, and I say that as the biggest Banjofag on earth

Fucking thank you. The game felt so sterile to me at quite a few points.
Plus, people have to remember BK is not primarily a platformer like Mario.
It's much (buzzword alert) comfier for me to go back to, even if Mario is more mechanically sound.

Just making a point, but I'm glad you see how dumb you're being. You gotta think for yourself. It's important.

It describes itself very well, metroidvania however is useless in comparison to exploration platformer. Collectathon's are basically all 3D platformers, aren't they? Even Mario 64 is called one. They're 3D platformers.

>I'm glad you see how dumb you're being
ironic statement

Banjo on average has better levels than Mario 64, but there is also 6 more levels and you only have to get 70 stars. If there's a world you don't like in Banjo it's tough shit because you need to do at least a little bit in all of them.

Hey, I use the phrase exploration platformer, not Metroidywoidy nintendy mcSymphony of the Nightathon (TL Note: Also known as Akumajou Densetsu in Japan, but it's not like the first 8, it's like the 9th game, so Dracula X.)

Brevity is the soul of wit.

b-b-but it has wacky talking animals, SOUL COMFY ZOOM ZOOM AAAAAAAHHH!

Platforming is very prevalent in Mario 64, but there's no real collection elements outside of the red coins, of which there are only 8 per world and all used for 1 star. Stars are basically equivalent to a flag pole that you touch to end the stage. Meanwhile, Banjo and Spyro consist of scouring the levels for objects. There is less emphasis on tight platformnig because the characters can't do the wide variety of acrobatics that Mario can.

>I use the phrase exploration platformer
which I'm fairly sure is a term few people use, in fact collectathon is a more commonly-accepted term than that.

this is your argument

Crash Bandicoot 2 alone aged better than the entire Banjo franchise.

it literally is not my argument as I never said that

Based

crash is dated by the sidescroller sections

only zoomer here is OP for that ubisoft comment

It literally is buckaroo

Who the fuck can't afford 2 games

Also tooie was shit and much closer to the empty ubisoft sandbox

finally played this once banjo got announced for smash and it was fun until clanker's cavern, stopped playing at the haunted mansion level

HELP HELP. this part of the game made me quit. it just so damn lame. i did the glitch to get the piece between the propeller but just dont feel like playing anymore. what do?

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Oh no, exploration platformer is completely accepted. Everyone knows what it means, it's used in Japan mostly.

Hot take, the term 'collectathon' doesn't have a set definition and it really only serves to justify platforming games having restricted movement abilities.
That being said, while Banjo and Mario are both platformers, they are platformers in different ways. Both good just different.
Mario 64 focuses on the actual traversal of its levels. That's why it's levels are often filled with random floating platforms. They're not badly designed because they compliment the style of platforming.
Banjo focuses on what the player is actually traversing. You aren't rewarded for actual platforming skill very often, instead you're rewarded for puzzle solving and mini games.
That's why, unlike Mario 64, the levels are much more filled with character. The worlds are the actual focus.
To answer OP, people like it because it's fun to traverse the environment and get rewards for tasks. You don't necessarily need a surplus of movement options to make that enjoyable.
Also please can we stop using the word "collectathon?" Banjo is a puzzle platformer.

It's the point where Banjo Kazooty hits peak tedium. The game shows its hand, showing how weak the level designs are and how shallow the mechanics are.

It's a fine game Bob shut up

Maybe stop playing? You don't owe anything to a game user.

well I hear metroidvania far more than I hear "exploration platformer", the latter is ironically even more vague of a term.

You can skip it by going to other worlds. I sure did. Fuck that stage.

I never had that much trouble in RBB even as a kid and was honestly surprised when I checked on the internet a few years later to find people screeching about this level.

Flynn?

You will hear it a lot more, you're on a Western board.
>the latter is ironically even more vague of a term.
genres shouldn't be named after the works it features, it's recursive and contradictory. It should describe the content of it. We don't call Horror games Afraid-of-the-dark sweet homers, we call the horror.

>genres shouldn't be named after the works it features
says who?
Like I explained before, genres evolve and depend on how people describe them, there isn't just some committee that decides what constitutes as a valid genre. If enough people recognize "metroidvania" as a term, then it may be considered a valid genre description.

>says who?
me, people who know what they're talking about.
>genres evolve and depend on how people describe them
there's too many problems with the phrase metroidvania to justify using it. Most people do not recognize it and the term itself is contradictory.

>Most people do not recognize it
I'm pretty confident most people in the west recognize the term, not sure whether nips use it though. Shit, even nintendo has used the term a few times before.
>the term itself is contradictory.
in what way?

>I'm pretty confident most people in the west recognize the term
Some people play games do. Unfortunately it's not accurate enough of a phrase that more people recognize it. It has no meaning to them and looks like a jumble of words.
>not sure whether nips use it though
they say exploration platformer.
>even nintendo has used the term a few times before.
a big mistake.
>in what way?
early castlevania games, later metroid games do not follow the formula.

if most people that play games understand what is meant then I see no problem with using that label

Most people who play games do not understand unfortunately, making it useless.