2020 is a few months away, yet fighting games still insist on having unnecesary barriers of entry built into the basic controls.
There's no reason to keep antiquated relics like charge inputs, Z-motions or double half circles around.
What gives?
2020 is a few months away...
Angel Adams
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Noah Walker
Sirlin pls
Landon Nelson
its a relic from arcade machines where developers needed a way to have similar movements that all could be done by average players, learning the moveset is often seen as a barrier but also an intrigue to the FGC.
What else are they gonna do? just put QTE and whoever mashes better wins?
its skill, timing, practice, and devotion.
Git Gud m8
William Hill
Zoomers were still fuming with anger and rage quitting when getting stomped in games like Rising Thunder which tried the whole super simplified controls thing. The fact of the matter is that people who don't want to learn how perform a dragon punch will never stick with any fighting game, no matter how simple or difficult it is.
Jayden Myers
>What else are they gonna do
Use intuitive and non-retarded inputs. Like improving on the MvC simple control scheme, or changing the buttons layout to include 1 or 2 special attack buttons instead.
This blind devotion to traditional inputs needs to go away.
Dominic Bailey
kill yourself
Christopher Brooks
To keep shits like you out. Play smash if you want smash, jesus.
Thomas Rodriguez
bait thread.
Cooper Bennett
defend this
Jose Young
what do you mean what gives, it dictates the style of fighting
they don't want every character to be a "press-button to instantly kick/punch"
charge inputs actually make the character feel like a different fighter with a different fighting style
Isaac Hill
They're used for balance.
Brody Allen
>down back, hcb, down forward
Truly a technique only mastered by the most galaxy brain niggas. Why can't I just press r2 like in dark souls (im very good at dark souls pvp btw which is harder than fighting games)
Lucas Bennett
Imagine being bad at videogames
Luke Johnson
MVC simple control scheme is still literally mashing and having the combo happen by itself. you might as well watch a movie.
also, input specific games when pulled away from their required inputs become more focused on other things, try samurai showdown, much more tactical, footsie based and less execution heavy than the games your talking about
also the further you move away from inputs the more you move away from the traditional 2d fighter feel and aesthetic. smash brothers was specifically made for players that didnt want to deal learning the new combos, thus having an action button and a secondary button.
theres nothing wrong with this, but you cant have the desired traditional 2d fighter and then complain that the inputs are old. the inputs and execution required are necessary to have an honorable duel, otherwise the game becomes too different.
Asher Diaz
its fun to do the motions and it's especially fun to do them to lil fag shitters that can't
I get it, you never played and will never play these games so you won't understand
Elijah Gutierrez
>dark souls pvp btw which is harder than fighting games
It is, because your rivals aren't encumbered by literal artificial difficulty of doing 720 motions to stab, everybody is on equal footing and thus the only way to win is by outplaying your opponent.
Alexander Williams
KOFXIII is infamously high-execution and full of combo wank; almost every other SNK game has much shorter and simpler combos. KOFXIV's best combos are mostly pressing Max Cancel after a button lands in neutral, cancelling a normal into a special, maybe doing one quick juggle, and then dropping a super, MAYBE doing a Dream Cancel if you're on your last character with full meter and that's just doing another super motion during the animation of the first.
There are already fighting games that map specials/EX/supers to buttons or simple macros, and they aren't games that give you a "Simple" option, but games built around them. Go play Blade Strangers or Ultra Fight Da! Kyanta 2 if you care that much.
Charles Gonzalez
I can only complain about stuff like full circles or 3/4 circles which capcom insists on using, skullgirls is also an offender in that regard.
Cooper Reed
Are people's thumbs really so crippled they can't do SRKs?
Daniel White
Play Divekick and see for how long it will last for you.
Liam Jackson
Yea Forums and fighting games is something special
Owen Martinez
Except Divekick is literally constrained by a single button layout, and it's also a proof of concept that fighting games don't need epic fushu-mushu waggling to be good.
A Dualshock 4 has 12 buttons, 2 triggers, motion sensor controls and a touch pad, surely any non-retarded developer can map their special moves into that without resorting to legacy retardation like pretzel + triple punch.
Owen Stewart
>Complains about stupid long combos with dumb inputs
>90% of the time those long combos are not even viable for high level play
>Fighting games are more based on mix ups and reading your opponent
So whats the problem again?
Isaac Barnes
youtube.com
vid related is Rising Thunder gameplay. A game with literally one-button specials. And the guy raging would be you
inputs aren't what's holding you back from enjoying fighting games or getting good at them. Your scrub mentality is what's holding you back
literally get gud
Landon Russell
>inputs don't matter bro
Everytime.
So we are in agreement they're unnecesary, why have them in the game at all?
Dylan Kelly
>There's no reason to keep antiquated relics like charge inputs, Z-motions or double half circles around.
What do you propose instead?
Dylan Davis
I would prefer if charge moves only required a bit less of charge time, full circles are horrible too, other than that the only problem I would have is the pretzel but all of this is mostly because I prefer to use d-pad for fighting games and 4 face buttons if possible.
Joshua Hall
You'd have to increase the startup frames or something for charge characters in that case, because once somebody gets good at charging those characters are nuts. Guile for instance, throws fireballs faster and covers the air better than Ryu ever could
Carter Fisher
What kind of a weak pussy are you? Just play smash Bros.
Brayden Kelly
I never said anything about getting good, I'm talking about accesibility.
Anthony Ross
Fair trade.
Asher Sanders
Everyone is on equal footing in fighting games as well. Nobody is born with "the street fighter gene," it's just practice. The only thing in your way is your own stupidity.
Lucas Cruz
This kind of complaint only shows that you will never be anything more than casual trash that can NEVER graduate to competitive status. Execution barriers are just the bouncer to keep worthless scrubs out of the club.
Just keep playing smash, stupid child, not that you can execute the higher level tech in that, either.
Jace Moore
>You see, playing shooters on console actually takes MORE skill than on PC as you aren't encumbered by literal artificial difficulty of aiming.
>Everybody is using auto-aim and thus the only way to win is by outplaying your opponent
this is you
Sebastian Sullivan
THERE
ARE
LITERAL
CANINES
WITH
BETTER
EXECUTION
THAN
Yea Forums
Jack Richardson
b-b-b-b-but aim assist doesn't actually aim for you!
Juan Young
>lmao sorry were you trying to block low?
>actually you were holding the stick at a 70 degree angle instead of an 60 degree angle, there goes 1/3rd of your health
Blake Wood
Because it is a good system to reward those who practice more. Besides, even if the inputs were slightly easier like in Skullgirls you'd still lose because you don't want to learn any neutral or tech. It's just casuals trying to change games they don't play when it doesn't make it easier. It just lowers the skill floor so every scrub plateaus instead of being filtered out from the get go.
Oliver Bell
This shit keeps me away from 90% of fighting games. I want to play against another person, not play 80% of a person while we both fight the horrible controls.
Juan Morales
Gain precision
Practice
Brandon Gonzalez
The execution being difficult for newcomers doesn't mean the control is bad.
Aiden Taylor
this. every time they make an easy mode fighter for retards it dies because they get destroyed by people willing to put the work in and then drop the game regardless. it's always been a mentality issue never an execution issue
Christopher Parker
>just because a third of the game is spent about learning the controls doesn't mean the controls are bad
Josiah Turner
For the memes.
You think id want to get rid of a move where a character literally stabs himself with his own sword but also would one hit KO your opponent if he was stupid enough to get caught in that crazy attack? No way
Brayden Williams
If the game is nothing but playing against the opponent with the many control options that just means its extensive and hence requires skill. Besides, most fighting games are barely about controls because it is pretty much all neutral. The controls are really just you becoming accustomed to the many options and what you can do with them in regards to neutral.
Asher Gomez
>There's no reason to keep antiquated relics like charge inputs, Z-motions or double half circles around.
I feel like this is just something you say if you don't understand fighting games or have a hard time doing these inputs and don't want to get good. There's no reason to remove them either. They've already become way more than core movements in fighting games, they're THE movements. Taking them out to please people would be petty, and frankly retarded. I'm sure you identify with that well.
Hudson Roberts
Reminder that inputs are not arbitrary and they hold an extremely integral role in the balancing of moves like SPD's, Sonic Booms and Shoryukens
Reminder that Evo Moment 37, -the most iconic moment in the history of fighitng games- literally wouldn't have happened if Chun-Li's super didn't require a double quarter circle input
Charles Lee
>Know a low high is coming because It's all the guy uses
>point the stick down and to the left
>lmao you're actually blocking high now get rekt
>guy tries to special
>whiffs the input and does a totally different move from the one he intended
>"punish" him
Neither of the situations are satisfying for either party. We didn't outwit the opponent or use the strengths of our character against their weaknesses. We fought the controls and the controls won.
If i aim at a 65 degree angle in an FPS i aim at a 65 degree angle, not a 45 degree angle.
Chase Butler
Always with this crying yet everytime a dev puts in a simple mode or such it's almost completely ignored at least on top level.
Just wait for Riot to put out that fighting game they're working on. They can actually push this cooldown-based-simple-inputs stuff. They have the money.
"we shud definitely mage dis more ez"
-user that doesn't play fighting games
Bentley Torres
Hit the button right then. You solve both your problems by doing the input correctly. I might understand what you're saying if it was some esoteric combo with tight links but it's not. Even if it was it would just be one of the many combos you can do. You would be rewarded for doing a more difficult combl.
Samuel Scott
>If i aim at a 65 degree angle in an FPS i aim at a 65 degree angle, not a 45 degree angle.
what the fuck are you talking about
Charles Williams
Couldn't say it any better myself. All of these games that go for no-motion specials/supers don't magically blow up; they don't get recognition because they're not in an established fighting game series (the ones these people turn away from due to motions and other inputs) and turn away most people who say that's the answer because the fundamentals of fighting games are still there. DBFZ had people thinking it was super simple with its autocombos and simple motions but it became a very aggressive pressure-heavy game that rewards good combo routes to squeeze maximum damage out of your hits; SamSho has almost zero execution requirements but in turn rewards great spacing, neutral, reactions, and hard reads. Rising Thunder, Fantasy Strike, Blade Strangers, Kyanta 2, and likely even Granblue Vs; these games all have no execution barrier to perform your moves but all the same fundamentals of neutral, defense, pressure, and combo structure still apply. Even fucking FOOTSIES, a game with one button and 5 moves total, would probably go over the heads of these people because it breaks down neutral, hitconfirms, and punishes to their most basic level.
The reason why Smash and its clones are so popular (besides brand recognition of its cast) isn't that it has simple inputs; it's that it has an entirely different set of fundamentals from fighting games with only slight overlap due to the completely free movement. The funny part is that top-level Smash still requires execution, mostly in its movement and positioning to make sure that attacks land just right. Ryu & Ken are in Smash now and are as faithful as they possibly can be with motion specials, proximity normals, auto-turning to face the opponent, etc. and yet playing them is almost alien to their Street Fighter selves because of how different the systems are. They ended up being two of the most technical characters in Ultimate despite being two of the simplest characters in their home series.
Brody Rivera
>simplified fighters are flushing down the toilet while the most popular fighter right now doesn't even have a tutorial
explain this one executionlets
Kevin Jenkins
Tekken doesn't have motions, which is what scare people. What keeps people in is the aesthetic; for some reason Tekken & Soul Calibur's looks keep in more low-mid players longer. Of course the game has Akuma/Eliza/Geese now but they're exceptions.
Something about 3D games is more intuitive to the average person I guess. Meanwhile I have no clue how to feel out a combo route in Tekken without a guide when I can spend hours in a 2D game coming up with different routes on my own.
Luis James
2D fighters suck
John Bailey
git gud, scrub
Nolan Jones
If you're getting fucked on inputs, you weren't trying hard enough to begin with. Execution is literally the first barrier. If you can't pass it, then either gut gud or fucking quit. Simple.
Jacob Murphy
>Tekken doesn't have motions
you need consistitent quarter circle execution to be able to even move around
Grayson Ortiz
> Playing on analog instead of superior dpad
> Not just holding back or down and back as you need to.
Jej