Post games you know are mediocre or even straight up bad, but you can't help but enjoy anyway

>generic as fuck fantasy game missing huge chunks because deadlines
>Greatest

>but Mask of the Betrayer is GOAT
>Planescape Torment 2: Akachi's Boogaloo
>GOAT
At least it's not needlessly drawn out like P:T and tries to fix a few core issues with the OG(Not like it matters since the game plays itself even more at epic levels.), but it's still mediocre.
SoZ is passable though, still suffers from being NWN2 at the end of the day but much better than the rest of the campaigns, at least you can progress at your own leisure in that one.

not even in the top 5 d&d games

Name five better ones.

>dude you have to stop the KANG OF SHADOWS
>literally see him for the first time in the very final room of the game

fucking shit

>It's a generic shadow reaver model
>But with a cape and a bunch of lazily modeled pieces of bone armor

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If you enjoy it then it's not bad

The story is dumb. The level designs are bland. The pacing is laborious. The characters are poorly-sketched. The AI is horrendous. The voice acting is miserable. The D&D 3.5 ruleset is unnecessarily complex, and attempting to make a turn-based ruleset like that work in a real-time context is, was, and always will be ill-advised.

I can only come up with two things to say about this game that aren't negatives. The spell-effect animations are decent and the musical score is, actually, exceptionally well done. It's unfortunate that it was wasted on this effort.

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This and Blood on the Sand

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It didn't age as good as BG2

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BG2 aged incredibly poorly
honestly the only reason it got popular at all back then was because it had things like halfway decent voice acting, which nowadays every game has and romance options, which every rpg also has

>The D&D 3.5 ruleset is unnecessarily complex
If only.
NWN2 is all about slapping all your buffs and then autobattling shit, maybe manually cast a Fireball or Isaac's Missile Storm once in a while if you're actively playing as a pure mage, really no different from the rest of the RTwP games, which means it's pretty miserable.

This is the biggest sin of this game. That and the fact that the first two chapters were shitty hallway combat simulators with no interactable items and hardly any chests.

The third act is mostly linear too, outside of the first half being essentially a bunch of sidequests you can do in any order, once you complete the main quest is even worse than hallway since it teleports you to a bunch of corridors with more helpless mooks to mow down until you finally reach Garius, who at least had the decency of using a barrier gimmick this time to not die in 10 seconds, but in more or less 40 depending on how cheap you feel.
Imagine spending 50 bucks for this fucking game, in 2006, I recently replayed through it to give it one more chance, but goddamn it was way uglier and jankier than I remembered

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the 3.5 ruleset is a combination of needlessly complex and simplistic in execution
add onto that a helpful load of completely unbalanced mechanics and classes and you end up with the worst possible system for rpg's that gained any form of popularity

it's actually damn difficult to think of an computer rpg with a worse system than the d&d based games

worst part is that several used modules make it clear that the game CAN do proper non-linearity, obsidian just chose to make it linear

Imagine spending money on ANY Obsidian game.

What exactly is good about SoZ?

3.5 is not really that bad, on tabletop, it's actually fairly decent once you dip a bit in the various modules available.
The problem is that D&D is inherently fucking awful for videogames, it's a system that is so dependent on its P&P environment it's impossible to make a good videogame out of that, ToEE was the best attempt at it so far and 3.5 so far and it's still a largely tedious experience, for a lot of reasons, some of which not being D&D's faults either to be honest.

It's a fairly open campaign with no Obsidian NPCs shoved down your throat, that's about it.
It's not good, but at least it's not actively bad.

3.5 only works in tabletop if you ignore RaW every time it becomes retarded
which is about once every 10 minutes

Wow... imagine being this much of a gay.

But some obsidian npc's were great
all of MotB's companions were good and from the OC both the Jerro's were good characters and some others had good moments

Are there any good, well written adult mods that allow me to use my imagination to fill in the visuals as if I were actually playing an AO D&D?
I know NWN1 had a bunch.

t. Sawyer

no, NWN2 never had that much adult mods

Find a flaw.

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NWN2 is meh, but the addons are fucking great

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I unironically think that dnd is better suited for computers rather than throwing dices dozen of times just to kill a single goblin.

>But some obsidian npc's were great
No
>all of MotB's companions were good
The only decent companions in MoTB were Okku, if you disregard how anal he gets from you eating anything (seriously, you get mad at me for freeing zombies from eternal torment, Okku?), and Gann, if you disregard how erratic his behaviour is and how he's only there to let you enter Akachi's memories and little else.
Surely better than the rest though, Safiya and that Aasimar chick were even more annoying and horribly written that the party members in the OC, while that other One of Many "thing" was one of the most pathetic attempts avellone made to make a nonhuman character, coupled with the usual tired gimmick about character growth tied to moral choices he already pulled in Torment.

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Darksiders 3. There's pretty much no momentum to the story and the combat is the same button mashing with a little more reaction time required. But it's fun and I want more chill games that are just a X hour adventure with cool characters

Bg2 aged incredibly well and I played it for the first time 3 years ago
you're just retarded

NW2 was full of game breaking bugs, that were never fixed. However modders have made improvements to many aspects of the game.
Like finishing romance paths, finishing character paths, etc.
I enjoyed NW2 however obsidian is a bad studio that everyone gives protection to.
>Muh Obsidian is gud not a cheap knock off brand.

Yeah, guilty as charged of that one as well. I replay it every once in a while, OC and MotB. It was one of my very first actual crpgs, so it's very nostalgic for me.

>you get mad at me for freeing zombies from eternal torment, Okku?
There's a skill you unlock through MotB that's called Eternal Rest. THAT's the "let me relieve you of your misery" skill. Just eating them is making them suffer even more.

>obsidian is a bad studio
*blocks your path*

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>Almost unplayable at release
>Massively gimped character creation with several missing spells, feats and races
>Basically no content
>Low level campaign
>Atrociously slow walking speed
>Clunky general interface
>Tedious as fuck before level 3, piss easy after level 3
>Severely dependant on multiple mods to be enjoyable
I still consider it the best D&D vidya ever made though.

>>literally see him for the first time in the very final room of the game
You see him in the intro fighting Ammon Jerro.

>There's a skill you unlock through MotB that's called Eternal Rest. THAT's the "let me relieve you of your misery" skill.
Thanks Einstein, Okku still complains.
Not like it matter much since you can manipulate his affection score easily in Thaymount either way, but it's still annoying, the whole spirit eater mechanic was annoying really.

Mad Max the game

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>this faggot did not even do an evil playthrough with one of many, th emost versatile companion in the game since it can switch between thief, barbarian, and even magic user if you know what to do

Ah I see the shit eaters are still out there.
>SEGA never again
Top b8 m8

>No argument
Just as I expected. Alpha Protocol is unironically the best game ever made.

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>th emost versatile companion in the game
As if that matters when NWN2 offers zero resistance.
The only good thing about One of Many was being able to let him eat Myrkul.

Lulz u can't be serious.
U made me laugh pretty hard son, thanks for that.

Postal 2 is objectively a work of art

I just let that one faggot take over the trial. At least I got some shits and giggles out of it.

I don't have a picture but the whole Shadowrun Returns series. Mediocre at best, but damn it if I don't love cyberpunk and shadowrun. Stay novahot, Chummer.

Haaaaaa, it hurts, that game deserved soo much more

>I never played 2
You didn't miss out on much. 2 is worse than 1 in almost every way.

>The story is dumb. The level designs are bland. The pacing is laborious. The characters are poorly-sketched. The AI is horrendous.
But enough about KOTOR 2.

RTWP is such a godawful system, but for some reason, the vast majority of WRPGs insist on using it. I've been looking around for some good turn-based WRPGs and haven't had much luck. So far the only good ones I've found are the new Shadowruns.

divinity games are great
also a bit more obscure, but one of my all time favorites, is underrail

>the vast majority of WRPGs insist on using it.
Patently wrong.

NWN2 never had many mods of any type.

>Obscure
>Has 20 threads a day

Then post a list of good turn-based ones.

>RTWP is such a godawful system, but for some reason, the vast majority of WRPGs insist on using it.

>what is Blackguards 1
>what is Blackguards 2
>what is Divinity: original sin 1
>what is divinity: original sin 2
>what is shadowrun returns
>what is shadowrun: dragonfall
>what is shadowrun: hongkong
>what is expeditions: conquistador
>what is expedions: vikings

And those are just some wrpgs from the past few years.

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...

Yea Forums's practically the only place that talks about the game

>RTWP is such a godawful system
Baldur's Gate 2 has better combat than the vast majority of RPGs ever made.

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>divinity games are great
I'm working my way through those. My problem is that I have major OCD that won't let me play later games in a series without playing the older ones, which means I need to start all the way back at Divine Divinity, which is single-character and real-time.

>also a bit more obscure, but one of my all time favorites, is underrail
Post-apoc isn't really my thing.

>atrocious cover-based shooter with superficial RPG elements
???

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>Baldur's Gate II
>Better combat than Jagged Alliance 2

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"Most" does not mean "all".

I win.

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>Blackguards 1
>Blackguards 2
The battle system was pretty good, but both games are really light on roleplaying. You don't get anywhere near as many dialogue options as you do in a good NWN module.

>what is shadowrun returns
>what is shadowrun: dragonfall
>what is shadowrun: hongkong
Played all of those already. I mentioned them in the post you're quoting.

>what is expeditions: conquistador
>what is expedions: vikings
Set in the real world, with no fantasy elements. Not interested. The Wikipedia article for Conquistador says that the player character doesn't even participate in combat.

>what is Divinity: original sin 1
>what is divinity: original sin 2
I'll give you those; they do look like what I'm searching for.

>Set in the real world, with no fantasy elements.
And that's bad because...?

It's boring as hell.

Feel free to show me where I said that was a bad thing.

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And I don't like RPGs where I can't be a mage.

*ahem*

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>good NWN module.
I thought you hated RTWP?

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This is about as close as one can get to an objectively bad game.

Dragon Age 2 is worse.

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I do, but I put up with it in NWN because of the mods.

Two Worlds is just janky tho. It's not a garbage fire like most consider DA2 to be.

Divinity isn't a series, it's a setting. You don't need to play divine divinity to understand original sin for example, because they are completely different games.

The voice acting is definitely a garbage fire.

>I do, but I put up with it in NWN because of the mods.

I can see why.

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>Divinity isn't a series, it's a setting.
Rivellon is barely even a setting. It's about as shallow a backdrop as the setting for Megaman games, and they retcon it from game to game anyway.

>they retcon it from game to game anyway.
[citation needed]

It's on purpose. The entire story is ultra generic and entire part of it are a throwback to what modders did, like the orc caves part (where casavir joins you) where every room is just massive battles group for quick xp.

Bishop is the edgy atheist badass character everyone did.

Khelgar is the ultimate dwarf clichee.

Grobnar is the "quirky random fun character" everyone try to insert while being supremely useless and completely non relevant (even his death is stupid)

etc etc etc

could going on for hours. It's ultraobvious.

come for the porn, stay for the surprisingly detailed rogue simulator

>Baldur's Gate 2 has better combat than the vast majority of RPGs ever made.
No.
But given who you are it's already fair to disregard your posts.

>[citation needed]

forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=636829

also lets not forget the game literally ends with "rocks fall everyone dies"

ironically acting like a retard still means you're acting like a retard.

>It's on purpose.
>JOKES ON YOU, WE WERE ONLY PRETENDING TO BE RETARDED
No, you don't get to play that card with me, Obsidiot, the characters are genuinely fucking awful.

>even his death is stupid
He died doing what he loved:
Being dumb.

>Baldur's Gate 2 has better combat than the vast majority of RPGs ever made.

What RPGs have more varied encounter design?

Of course it doesn't have the most challenging combat.

"It's bad on purpose" has never been a good argument.

Don't forget the part where you can call out Elanee on the fact that she stalked you since childhood, and it becomes this incredibly awkward scene.

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I beat conquistador few weeks ago, there were some mystical elements though.
Also game is kino.

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How can I do it, do I need to pass influence check?

>while that other One of Many "thing" was one of the most pathetic attempts avellone made to make a nonhuman character, coupled with the usual tired gimmick about character growth tied to moral choices he already pulled in Torment.
He didn't write One of Many, you retard.

Also, if you think the characters are so shit, what RPgs do you think have better written companions?

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Final Fantasy VII

It's combat is neither challenging, nor well designed nor interesting
there's no encounter design what so ever in BG2, if you want to see what REAL encounter design is look at something like say the divinity games

heh I like it better than Cisquisition, at least the party felt like family and friends rather than some random people I dont care

This one is one hell of a mediocre party game.
And I fucking love it.

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Me too, but I don't enjoy Inquisition at all so it doesn't fit the thread. I don't give a damn if it's schlock, sarcastic Hawke will never not be my nigga.

>what RPgs do you think have better written companions?
Arcanum, Planescape: Torment, Wizardy 8, New Vegas

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Shut the fuck up retard, all you can manage to do is make long winded reddit posts about "MUH FEATURES" of a bunch of crap that barely even works when put together and when people come up with answers you don't like or make your shitposts fall apart you say they don't count.
I don't give two shits about your supposed "encounter" variety when the enemy design is pants on head retarded and you can just blast through anything by spamming buffs and autobattle, BG games and the rest of the IE games have fucking garbage, braindead combat like all RTwP games.
Even Larian, in their drug induced stupor managed to do passable encounter design in the D:OS games that at the very least isn't entirely solved by just prebuffing and watching a movie, I'd rather play a fucking dragon quest game than any IE pile of trash.

I wouldn't say it's bad. I mean, it's subjective here. Just that this collection of clichees and sometime annoying (the orc cave) was done on purpose and not because they were fucking dumb. The description of the bartender being annoyed that every fucking adventurers come to ask him intel while he doesn't know anything and how he look like every other bartender, to the point that the game also question if all bartenders are brothers or are born bartenders show that the game is very self aware of what it try to does.

Sometime, he stick close to the clichees, somtime, it subvert them. Khelgar is the typical fantasy-dwarf and the entire game show how fucking atrocious and awful being a hot-blooded agressive greedy guy is, and how elanee (stalker is love) comportment is ultra creepy.

I don't know how to explain it but i found this classiceness, even when subverted.... "comfy". Hard to put words on, but i'm sure you can understand what i tried to mean here.

I thought it was a pretty competent mario party clone, what's that bad about it in your opinion?

Sarcastic Hawke is the best part of DA2, i could play 10 shitty game like two worlds if it had sarcastic hawke as the main character

>How can I do it, do I need to pass influence check?
It's a normal dialogue option that comes up during the druid scene

Starting from the 2;40 minute mark

youtube.com/watch?v=B55SxVY-Cx0

>what RPgs do you think have better written companions?
Any non obsidian RPG, and especially not the dullest RPG of all time. Each attempt Obsidian makes to create their own universe rather than simply deconstruct a setting made by others, has been more disastrous than the last. Aside from the outdated gameplay and lifeless cities, Pillars of Eternity's only consistency has been its lack of excitement and ineffective use of combat mechanics, all to make magic unmagical, to make action seem inert.

Perhaps the die was cast when Sawyer vetoed the idea of making anything at all innovative or original; he made sure the game would never be mistaken for a work of art that meant anything to anybody, just ridiculously profitable nostalgia pandering to ageing Baldur's Gate fans. Pillars of Eternity might be anti-casual(or not), but it’s certainly the anti-Divinity series in its refusal of spontaneity, fun and excitement.

>a-at least the writing was good though

"No!"

The writing is dreadful; the narrative was terrible. As I played, I noticed that every time I engaged in dialogue with an NPC the game presented me with a Wiki-page style infodump instead of anything resembling actual human conversation.

I began marking on the back of an envelope every time this was repeated. I stopped only after I had marked the envelope several dozen times. I was incredulous. Sawyer's mind is so governed by obsession with pointless minutiae of the lore that he has no other style of writing.

Later I read a lavish, loving review of Pillars of Eternity by the same David Gaider. He wrote something to the effect of, "If these kiddies are playing Obsidian games at 17 or 18, then when they get older they will go on to enjoy Dragon Age II." And he was quite right. He was not being ironic. When you play "Pillars of Eternity" you are, in fact, trained to shill for Bioware.

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Atom RPG, Lords of Xulima, Age of Decadence, maybe even some lower-tier stuff like Eschalon, Tales of Maj'Eyal, or Spiderweb Software's titles (Avadon, Avernum, Geneforge) if you don't mind the janky early-00s graphics.
Oh, and Underrail, as mentioned previously.

Based and Brosnanpilled.

>Final Fantasy VII

>simplistic menu-based combat, with not even a fraction of the magic variety of BG2 (or even BG1)
>more varied encounter design

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Good lad, I had a great time wiith NWN2

I'd say Larian actually managed encounter design pretty well
a lot of their encounters had fairly creative use of environmental factors, and they get props for having all encounters in the game be hand placed rather than random

Neverwinter Nights 2
Empire Earth 1

And Fire Warrior, most of all. It's very crappy but I absolutely love this game, one of my favourites by far. Just the atmosphere alone captures it for me, sense of dread throughout.

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dissappointed the characters from the base game doesn't get much of a role to play in MOTB. I can understand they would want to distance themselves from a somewhat mediocre base game, but shit like replacing Bishop's VA, relegating the mad lad magus to a hospital bed and making him a silent background lore-spewing automaton is an annoying end to characters that defined the base game.

Also my chaotic evil dumbfuck wurld of STR orc ended up traveling the everchanging chaotic planes alongside the bald waifu somehow

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>lmao duuuude what if we lit the entire oilfield ON FIIRE xDDDD
kys

Frogs.

>with not even a fraction of the magic variety of BG2 (or even BG1)
FF is utter garbage, but most of the magic in BG (and any D&D videogames really) is completely useless, and the core tools are always inevitably buffs/debuffs and damage spells with some graphical window dressing, in that sense Wizardry games are far more competent at keeping all the relevant spells in a short list while trimming the useless fat, and conflating buffs into one or two layers instead of having 10 different spells that all amount to the same thing.
Not like it matters since all you can do is mechanically deny anything that doesn't suit you, don't you have some JRPG thread to infest? We don't want you here, go back to plebbit or codex or whatever shithole spawned you.

Yeah, same. I actually liked playing Hawke by having him start good and slowly shifting into aggresive but still well intentioned, with some sarcastic remarks here and there. Makes it seem like he just can't fucking believe all the bullshit that's going on around him and how fucking stupid people are in general.

And yeah, for all their defects I vastly prefered the party in 2 than in Inquisition. In 2 it felt like you were all growing together as people and that you learned to put your differences aside for the sake of friendship and family. In Inquisition everyone seems like a stranger that is hanging out at your base for at best shoddy reasons.

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fuck you that was a fantastic moment, seeing that oil rig go up in flames entirely through planned game mechanics and having you naturally shift from thinking the humanoid enemies are the main threat to the blob monsters was excellent encounter design

>The D&D 3.5 ruleset is unnecessarily complex
t.brainlet

Are Morrowind and Dark Messiah the only games that did magic right?

>First time I played NWN2.
>See that option.
>Wait what.
>Surely it's a translation mistake or something, and it actually says "Set his lute on fire".
>Nope, you actually fucking set the dude on fire and send him running towards the lake.

Holy shit.

>I'd say Larian actually managed encounter design pretty well
Sure, if only their combat system couldn't be monstrously abused and their entire elemental puddles not being either horribly overpowered and manipulable on the player's side or self-sabotaged by necrofire.
Larian drives me mad because unlike Obsidian they actually come up with some very nice ideas, and they do try to make their own systems, concise even, with not a lot of conflicting or superfluous tools, the problem is they absolutely fuck anything up, they're the complete opposite of Sawyer in that they don't even try to balance BASIC aspects of their battle systems.

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DA2 was my favourite of the three.

DA1 had the best mage but DA2's Warrior was actually fun and Rogue was great. The DLCs actually had some really fun encounters, you could tell they were playing with them in anticipation of making boss fights for SWtOR and they turned out really good for RPG fights.

at the very least their games are, unbalanced they may be, fun to play

>Shut the fuck up retard
Oh, it's the XB2 retard. Still seething over the last time you were BTFO?

I dfon't even like RTWP that much, but BG2 does a number of things quite well: For example, contingencies and spell sequencers: enemies will use these to buff themselves with a variety of spells as soon as they spot you. Enemies dont shy away from using spells like Imprisonment and Time Stop. There is tons of variety in loot, with weapons and armor having distinctive abilities, with none of the generic Diablo loot syndrome that plagues so many modern RPGs.

And that's just the vanilla game. SCS takes it to a whole new level

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I could address this in depth, but I'll just use a simple example to show why the BG games are a billion times more engaging to play than FF7:

>petrify in FF7
>it just functions like a generic stun spell

>petrify in BG 1/2
>it turns the character in a statue
>they are removed from the party and left behind as a statue
>if they are hit by anything, they shatter and they are pemernantly dead, with no possibility for resurrection

Needless to say, the latter game actually forces you to drastically change up your tactics if a character ever becomes petrified.

>Xenoblade 2's combat is utter shi-

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based and hawkepilled
not as good as mask of the betrayer tho

>half of the screen obscured by UI
sorry can't see anything

XB is basically offline WOW for weebs
do you dislike WOW also?

>change up your tactics
like what, cast stone to flesh and continue on exactly as you were?

Shit taste user

>Are Morrowind and Dark Messiah the only games that did magic right?
Arx Fatalis and Baldur's Gate 1 and 2 also do magic quite well.

Shout out to Magic & Mayhem, which is an obscure game, but which does magic possibly better than anything else in the genre. It's not quite an RPG though, more like an RTS with some RPG elements.

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Someone need to mod sarcastic hawke in MOTB

I wouldn't say morrowind did magic right, but at least it was far more interesting in its hilarity than most games.
Dark Messiah is a bit of a different case since being more an action/immersive sim game even something so basic as a telekynesis spell has many more uses and nuances than the average RPG.

>like what, cast stone to flesh and continue on exactly as you were?

>if you have it memorized
>if the character who has it memorized isn't the one who is petrified
>if you can cast it before the petrified character is hit
That's a lot of ifs.

28 minigames divided in 7 playstyles ends up becoming repetitive (I love Crate Crush, Polar Push, Pogo Pandemonium and Tank Wars; but I hate half of the minigames in Medieval Mayhem and I don't like Ballstix).
Also, the story mode is a blast (in coop is even better), but once you play the crystal challenges you feel like "man, I wish I could play this mode in multiplayer with my pals", and that is my problem, the game ends up becoming underwhelming, there's so much stuff on the story part of the game, but as a party game it lacks, as a child I believed that the multiplayer part of the game could have been so much more.
Also, I don't feel it like a Mario Party clone, it is its own thing.
Also, wonky controls and some shitty interactions.

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>Dark Messiah is a bit of a different case since being more an action/immersive sim game
How is Dark Mesisah not an RPG? You can fully customize your character as a fighter, mage, thief or archer, or a hybrid of all those.

>blowdown!
>twang!
>ice!
>twang!
lmao

I really liked this shit. Problem?

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Why yes, that does look like utter shit.

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Good call with Arx Fatalis, I forgot about that one.

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>Oh, it's the XB2 retard.
Who? I don't like a single Xeno game.
>contingencies and spell sequencers: enemies will use these to buff themselves with a variety of spells as soon as they spot you
Big fucking deal when you're already prebuffed to absurd levels, even without considering sneaking or just throwing some AoE from a distance.
>Enemies dont shy away from using spells like Imprisonment and Time Stop.
None of this fucking matters since you can destroy them before they even try to pull off that shit, even basic bitch RPGs like Final Fantasy have this shit, why the fuck would you even think this is something supposedly so incredible?
Do you even fucking play videogames outside of choking on BG and BioWare's rancid cock?

you carry around a scroll of stone to flesh with you, which is sold in constant restock in BG2

>most of the magic in BG (and any D&D videogames really) is completely useless, and the core tools are always inevitably buffs/debuffs and damage spells with some graphical window dressing
Have you even played these games? 95% of the spells in BG1/2 don't even deal damage. Instead, they have some non-direct effect like turning you invisible, creating illusions, summoning creatures or creating long-lasting environmental hazards (Stinking Cloud, Grease, etc.) And what few damaging spells there are, generally aren't particularly effective.

In jrpgs on the other hand, most spells are either elementally themed damage spells (Fire1/Fire2/Fire3/Fire4, Ice1/Ice2/Ice3/Ice4, Bolt1/Bolt2/Bolt3/Bolt4) or buffs/debuffs (giving yourself +20% attack power or lowering the enemy's attack power by 20%). There are status effects, but they are generally not effective as damaging spells and bosses are usually outright immune. And the aforementioned wrpg spells like summoning creatures or creating environmental hazards tend to be non-existent in jrpgs.

I would assume this difference boils down to wrpgs taking influence from tabletop games whereas jrpgs don't, but still, I don't understand why, with so many experimental jrpgs, they tend to adhere to such a basic template when it comes to magic.

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I did too
IOI never made a bad game

Towns is actually very fun. It's like a watered down version of Dorf Fort or Gnomoria. I like it because I hate having to build like 20 crafting stations just to make a single goddamn sword.
Everyone and their mother downvoted it because they made a blog post where they admitted they wouldn't finish adding all the features they promised. It went from 85% to 20% on Steam in a day.
They later relented and continued working on it, but it didn't matter. The damage was already done.

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>but as a party game it lacks, as a child I believed that the multiplayer part of the game could have been so much more.
I don't know about that, but I used to have a tight circle of friends to play with, I kind of understand you issues with it though, some of the minigames are also pretty boring.
>I don't feel it like a Mario Party clone, it is its own thing.
Some of those minigames like the ice slide one are straight up ripped off from Mario Party dude, as much as like it a lot more than that game you can hardly deny they didn't take a lot of "inspiration"

>even basic bitch RPGs like Final Fantasy have this shit
No, they don't. 'Time Stop' in Final Fantasy is just a stun spell, it sure as hell doesn't stop the flow of time itself like it does in BG.

And Final Fantasy sure as hell doesn't have stuff like Imprisonment that can permanently a character from the party.

Stop lying.

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>I don't understand why, with so many experimental jrpgs, they tend to adhere to such a basic template
Because it's fucking easy to implement.

Meant to say:
>can permanently remove a character from the party

>95% of the spells in BG1/2 don't even deal damage.
Because they're buffs/debuffs.
>hey have some non-direct effect like turning you invisible, creating illusions, summoning creatures or creating long-lasting environmental hazards (Stinking Cloud, Grease, etc.
All of those are run of the mill buffs/debuffs with some fancy graphics and AoE applied to them, do not ever try again to pretend something like Grease isn't just a generic CC.
>And what few damaging spells there are, generally aren't particularly effective.
Wrong, and D&D offensive spells don't work around burst damage to begin with so this is a moot point.
>In jrpgs on the other hand,
Stopped reading there because you've been proved multiple times you don't play those games, not gonna bother with some bitter codexer whining about japs.

>Magic & Mayhem
You, sir, are an user of most esteemed status and rarefied tastes.

quite frankly I'd dare to argue that Pokemon has a more complex combat system than BG2

>'Time Stop' in Final Fantasy is just a stun spell, it sure as hell doesn't stop the flow of time itself like it does in BG.
Except it literally does?
>And Final Fantasy sure as hell doesn't have stuff like Imprisonment
And that matters to...what exactly? A generic instakill spell among various other clones means something outside of having less saves? How?

>quite frankly I'd dare to argue that Pokemon has a more complex combat system than BG2

>series specifically created to be winnable by 4-year olds
>most encounters only involve 2 combatants
>"complex"

Also:
>hit Pokemon with whatever they're weak to!~
>it;s super effective!

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>Responding to the most obvious of bait
You're slipping, Beepzorz.

Dragon's Dogma has the most impressive looking spells by far. And if you have more than one sorcerer in your party, you can cast big spells in unison or join them to finish the cast much faster:
youtube.com/watch?v=S8G2qhOKQmk

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>Except it literally does?

>Stop halts the time counter for the afflicted target, preventing their ATB gauge from filling, but also halting time based effects such as Barrier or Regen.

How the fuck does that count as stopping the flow of time? In BG2, if a mage casts time stop, the entire game world and everyone in it is frozen, except for the mage who cast it. In FF7 it's just a generic paralyze spell.

>And that matters to...what exactly? A generic instakill spell among various other clones means something outside of having less saves? How?
Of course it matters. Baldur's Gate has permadeath, so if you win a battle with party members dead, well...there's no coming back from that. Wheras party members in FF7 can't die, so winning an encounter with multiple party members dead makes no difference whatsoever.

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>merely pretending

just because the ingame encounters don't properly utilize it's combat system doesn't mean it's not more complex than BG2's
if you truly think that super effectiveness is all that matters I suggest you try out this theory in pvp and see how far it gets you

I'm not even the one who posted it, but the fact that you unironically responded to it says volumes.

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>In BG2, if a mage casts time stop, the entire game world and everyone in it is frozen, except for the mage who cast it.
Yes, because that's how BG2 works, battles do not take place on a separate plane, and yet it's functionally still the same exact thing in both games, a generic paralyze spell that blocks all actors outside of the caster.
Maybe it's a bit too much for a redditor to process, but you can't compare two wildly different systems by using one of those as the end of all, functionally, they achieve the same exact result.
>Of course it matters. Baldur's Gate has permadeath
And quicksaves and reload, big fucking deal LMFAO.

>I suggest you try out this theory in pvp and see how far it gets you

>being this retarded
The only reason why Pokemon has a thriving pvp scene is because it's the most popular RPG franchise in existence, selling billions of copies. It sells so much precisely because it's so shallow and easy that even 4-year olds can master it.

If you think Pokemon's super simplistic combat can even remotely compare to other RPGs where factors like line of sight, friendly fire, range, distance, the possibility of spells fizzling or backfiring and thousands of other considerations play a role, then you are genuinely retarded.

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pitiful damage control

Is he this guy?
reddit.com/user/Beepzorz

>Yes, because that's how BG2 works, battles do not take place on a separate plane, and yet it's functionally still the same exact thing in both games, a generic paralyze spell that blocks all actors outside of the caster.
No it isn't, you retard. Time Stop stops everything, including spells cast by the caster while the Time Stop is in effect. Those spells only take effect once the Time Stop effect ends.

Again, time stop STOPS everything, including your own party members, any neutral NPCs, etc.

The time stop effct in ff7 only stops a single target. It's precisely a generic paralysis spell.

Stop embarassing yourself

Are you a troll? Is this the best weebs have to offer?

>friendly fire
pokemon has friendly fire
>spells fizzling or backfiring
pokemon has that to
it also has, by virtue of being turn based and not having setup-time a significantly higher opportunity cost to every move whereas in BG2 you can prebuff to trivialize any encounter at zero opportunity cost because enemies can't respond to prebuffing and easy rest means spell limits are pointless

face it: BG2 is less complex than Pokemon, it's combat system is THAT shitty

>Time Stop stops everything, including spells cast by the caster while the Time Stop is in effect. Those spells only take effect once the Time Stop effect ends.
Same as FF then.
>The time stop effct in ff7 only stops a single target.
That's not Time Stop though, that's only FFVII's own version of Stop, and I don't see how that's a bad thing either given the game's context.
In other FF games Time Stop blocks everyone but the caster for a single turn.
Maybe play those games before opening your mouth.

*dabs on Baldur's Gate*

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>pokemon has friendly fire
It does? Point me to some source describing that becuase I can't rcall a singl instance of it.

>pokemon has that to
It does? Again, point me to a source.

And I can't help but notice you didn't address the numerous other factors I raised.

>it also has, by virtue of being turn based and not having setup-time a significantly higher opportunity cost to every move
And real-time games don't have an opportunity cost? you do realize enemies get to act while you act, don't you?

>whereas in BG2 you can prebuff to trivialize any encounter at zero opportunity cost because enemies can't respond to prebuffin
Enemies can prebuff themselves with spell sequencers and contingencies. Enemies can also remove your buffs with dispel spells.

>Same as FF then.
No. Again, stop embarassing yourself. You have no idea of what you;'re talking about.

>Finally found out who WRPG-Kun is
>Even has a handy set of readily available contacts
Hmmm, I'm gonna have some real fun with this one, turns out you truly were a redditor all along, and an incredibly stupid one too.

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Ah, Time Stop. Nothing like placing it in the first slot of a chain contingency or greater sequencer.
Even better if you're a wild mage and follow it up with a couple nahal's reckless dweomers WITHOUT improved chaos shield. After all, what's the worst that could happen?

Yeah, you're right, maybe the lack of the board mechanics and stuff made me put it apart from Mario Party.

The voice acting and story in NwN 2 are just abysmal - but its still a fun DnD game. I cheated so I could have all 6 party members from the beginning - no more of this onesie-twosie shit.

Ah, I'm only in chapter 2.

>Point me to some source describing that becuase I can't rcall a singl instance of it.
Earthquake hits all active pokemon in double battles including your team mate, several other moves also do this
>Again, point me to a source.
Well there is obviously miss chance
And natural immunities
But there's also the move protect which invalidates the next move
Taunt which prevents non-offensive moves
Follow me which redirects moves
Evasion and accuracy modifying statuses
and many more

Enemies don't get to act while you are prebuffing, like I said there's no opportunity cost to it
Enemies need to rely on sequencers and contingencies which cannot match true prebuffing in scope and if they have to dispel, that is still a victory for you as they have to use up an in-combat spell to deny you your out of combat spell

Pokemon also has more non-standard effects and modifiers than BG2 which further increase complexity AND it has a way more complex set of character building

Mad Max did exactly what I wanted it to do. My only issue is you didnt get his Interceptor until the game was beat.

Max without his interceptor is bullshit.

Buggy as fuck. Shitty optimization. Unbalanced. Awful starting city full of meaningless walking back and forth. Lots of cut/unfinished content. Lame story.

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Are there any good modules for NWN2?

The game was broken as absolute fuck on release, but I'll be damned if I don't love every moment of it.

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lynch's voice is godtier in both

>Earthquake hits all active pokemon in double battles including your team mate, several other moves also do this
So maybe 1 or 2 abilities, ouf of thousands of abilities there are in Pokemon. How is that meaningful?

You do realize that in other RPGs, EVERY action is potentially subject to friendly fire?

>Well there is obviously miss chance
Okay, so you're lying out of your ass. Again, EVERY RPG has missing/dodging/whatever.

I was specifically talking about the mechanic wherein spells, if cast by someone inexperienced, can fizzle or even backfire on the party. Obviously, not many RPGs have this, but it's just an example of how plenty of RPGs have much more interesting mchanics than Pokemon.

You really are deluded,

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I liked Path of Evil, it's a full 1 to 20 campaign in an open world

The Interceptor and the actual Road Warrior costume unlocking only AFTER you beat the game were bullshit, the car I can understand but the fucking costume at the very least should be unlocked upon reaching top rank

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If you don't have enough gym badges and try to command a pokemon with a high level it can and will disobey you using the move IT wants to use, not you

Also there's over 100 moves that can deal friendly fire and what you said is blatantly not true: the most basic spell, magic missile, is not subject to friendly fire

there is a thing about that game. play the one that came out first, idk when it got changed but, i know some cutscenes got censored down. he cusses his wife out at the start in the trailer and later on its all cut, and censored a bunch. find an old first copy of it.
> i had one dont know which copy is that one though now. or if i did copy it.

i started to play it, didnt get very far.
you can craft armor and weapons..
wtf? where would i figure that out at

You get a full tutorial for it in the keep on the way to Highcliff. Unless you just walk past the master craftsman without even talking.

literally the only thing they would have to change to make nwn2 a 9/10 game is the camera and control scheme.
if it were like nwn 1 or divinity: OS. it would be much better.
the clunky control scheme and the fucking camera is retarded in nwn2.

>you can craft armor and weapons..
You don't need to, ever.
The game showers you with overpowered gear that vastly outclasses what you can craft.
Even in MoTB where you can craft absurdly OP gear you won't ever need it because you're already monstruously overpowered even when you're underleveled.
Just completely forget about crafting unless you're playing SoZ, and even there it's arguable whether it does give you some kind of upper hand.

>Not crafting in MotB
By the end of the game I had a bastard sword that was
>+8
>6d6 fire damage
>6d6 cold damage
>5d6 electricity damage
>Keen
>Dispelled on hit
And I'm not sure if it didn't also have some sort of regen enchantment or if it was already overloaded with magic. I could have been running around with no feats for it and still killed every motherfucker. The best gear you can get in NWN2 is what you craft, don't think otherwise. Gear you just find is good and definitely capable enough to go through the whole game, but the amount of shit you can throw into anything far outclasses anything you'll find.

It doesn't fucking matter since nothing can even remotely challenge you, especially in the shitshow that is MoTB, I steamrolled the entire Woodman quest with a monk4/Wizard 18/shadowdancer3 character and Okku by punching things to death with a pair of dragon gauntlet I got in the OC, Mordenkainen's Sword and the occasional maximized spell, the game is absurdly fucking easy, my WIZARD character was killing waves after waves of ice giants with his fucking hands.

Hahahah no.

no what user?

I SAID NO

beat SoZ, twice, kept loosing to that bs mechanic in mask of the betrayer, something i'm missing?

Falwed as fuck but there is nothing like it so its best in what its trying to be.

i think at some point you just want a better system, FF tried the whole AI is as smart as the player and it was boring as ffffuuu-, but there has to be something quicker than turns and more precise than rtwp.

Don't you have only 3(4 in motb) slots for enchanting?

I think I had the Ultimate Craftsman mod installed, which gives you one or two extra slots if you use very good materials and craft a masterwork.

Are those tabletop rules?

that is what ruined it for me,
>crafting
i have played the crafting game before. its boring after so many times. i dont care how many rewards they put behidn it. it doesnet belogn in a rpg, at least randomnly which seems like what your saying. is there a top level? when can you reach it?

the goal of the game being random just fuck that. thats why i dont pick up half the games now or even try them.
give me the instruction book or get that outta here.

>the goal of the game being random
What the fuck are you talking about?

Use your spirit eater powers

click a button for a random stat point with some high rare chance to get it to be some fuckign version. that would be the goal as my goal is to beat the game the best, fastest way how.

what was your goal spend all your money at the poker table?
gambling and real fucking games are different. ones for adults, with that sort of thign. the other can be adults but not fucking poker.

A neverwinter nights 2 thread on my Yea Forums?
I'm so proud.
I love the game, even the OC.

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Drakengard 3

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Do not remember on which difficulty I was playing but kick was overpowered as hell

Temple of Elemental Evil
Pool of Radiance
Baldur's Gate
Icewind Dale
Dark Sun Shattered Lands

>NWN2
>Monkey Grip
Its so useless, but i love it.

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nwn1 or 2 Yea Forums server when?

I'd be down for that.

Where can i download the Enchanced Edition modules for 1? I can't find them anywhere and i refuse to be jewed by beamdog once again.

Are there even Large weapons in NWN2?

Two-handers/polearms? Or being a manlet race even?

Greatsword, battleaxe and probably a polearm or two. Almost certain that there are scythes and two-handed hammers too. Heavy flail didn't cut it but has references in 2DA files IIRC.

Saints Row 3
I played through it a few times and have about 300 hours clocked into it. sr2 is better but I like fighting the gangs in sr3.

>he fell for EE meme

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Off the top of my head, greatsword, greataxe, warmace, spear, halberd, scythe.

Oh and falchion, which was basically to greatswords what scimitars were to longswords.

I didn't get the fucking "DLC" I got it off G2A so they don't get any money, i'm just looking for the free modules they're trying to charge money for.

Large as in for a larger size category. Like, Kingmaker has oversized bastard swords, though there are no large size characters
Though I can't recall if all weapon types have different sizings like in pathfinder, or if two-handed weapons are one size larger than one-handed ones

>Ywn start your own secretive evil cult with the Yea Forumsros on some roleplay server
>Even if you did you'd get BTFO by the admin circlejerk anyway

You can get modules for free on nvnvault, but I'm not sure if they will be compatible with EE.

As far as I recall it's the latter in D&D. Thus all two-handers are large. IIRC halfling and gnome race descriptions in both NWN games even mention them being unable to wield two-handers.

>neverwintervault.org/project/nwn1/module/bioware-premium-modules
Found them.They're supposed to be backward compatible. NVN is downloading right now. Thanks user

I tried playing that a while ago. It was decently fun, but I had this weird bug where the late-game SMG fired a lot slower than it was supposed to. I never did find a fix for it.

Is there any way to prevent enemies from dispel your buffs? Also what are bread and butter buffs? I'm playing as a cleric.

God those buff graphics are terrible.

Can I skip the NWN1 campaign and go straight to SoU and HotU?

Right?
I love it.

Yes. Just read about Aribeth on wiki before starting hotu.

Yes. SoU expects you to start with a new character and HotU is the continuation of that journey.

Yes. Your character in SoU/HotU isn't the same person as the protagonist of the NWN1 OC.

Neat. Thanks bros.

I'd say that's the recommended way to go, in fact.

Balders gate 1/2
Neverwinter nights
Planetescape: Tournament
Icewind dale 1/2

>it got popular bc of voice acting and romnce onions

YO YOU GOTTA CHECK OUT THIS NEW GAME!!! THE VOICE ACTING IS OFF THE HOOOOOK!!!!

DONT EVEN GET ME STSRTED ON THE ROMANCE OPTIONS -- AND YOU CAN EVEN ROMANCE ANOTHER DUDE

What was it even about anyway?

That game could have been so great, so much cool stuff in it.