So since the release of Smash Ultimate (and since Hero's release especially), I've heard a lot of complaints about the music choices and how they were handled in Ultimate. For those reasons, I decided to compile the problems I saw. I didn't include any music listed in the "Other" category. They will be in the posts below
The Music Problems of Smash Ultimate
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Mario series:
>Ground theme for the original used six times, and is part of the Super Mario Bros. Medley
>Super Mario Bros. Lost Levels Medley does not ever use songs original to Lost Levels. Ought to be renamed
>Ground theme for Super Mario Bros USA used three times
>Between the first three Mario games, they make up twenty songs, or over a fifth of the Mario soundtrack. While iconic songs, they should not make this much up of the percentage
>Between the two Galaxies, there are twelve (thirteen if you count Plucky Pass Beginnings, which technically debuted in Galaxy as Captain Toad’s theme) tracks, about twice as much as the first two 3D Marios put together
>Songs from the Mario and Luigi RPG subseries is all over the place. Paper Jam has three while Partners in Time has one and Superstar Saga only has one from the Minions portion of the remake
>Paper Mario music is also off with only two songs, one only from Color Splash, and the other only including a portion from Thousand Year Door
>Outside of perhaps a few too many Mario Kart 8 themes, the tracks for the Mario Kart games are fine
>Mario Party songs ignore everything pre-Mario Party 9
Donkey Kong series:
>Donkey Kong Country Returns has no remixes and two are the same song with one just having monkey noises
>25m is used in four different songs
>Donkey Kong Country 1 makes up the vast majority of the tracks, fourteen tracks and about half. Granted most are remixes >and are entirely different songs, but still
>Donkey Kong Country 3 has no music
>DK64’s only song is an incomplete Donkey Kong Rap
>Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze only has one song in the game
The Legend of Zelda series:
>The “Main Theme” is part of 13 songs
>Zelda II’s only song is “Temple” twice
>Termina has only one song: Termina Field twice, AKA the Main Theme of Zelda
>There is no remix of Kakariko Village, despite the theme’s constant appearance in the series, only version of the track is Four Sword Adventures’ Village of the Blue Maiden theme
>Despite being a full on stage, Spirit Tracks has only one song
>Skyward Sword has only two tracks: the Ballad of the Goddess twice, which is Zelda’s Lullaby backwards
>A good half of the Zelda series has no music, such as Minish Cap, Phantom Hourglass, the original Four Swords, and the Oracle games
>Some of the more “obscure” Zeldas like Link’s Awakening and Four Swords Adventures do have music, but are only songs that they themselves remixed from earlier Zelda’s that already have music, rather than songs original to their titles
>New remixes of Great Sea, Molgera, and Midna’s Lament replaced older versions, which creates problems for those that like the original tracks (especially in the case of Midna’s Lament where the remix loses a lot of the emotional feeling of the original track)
>Despite being stages, Skyloft and Great Bay do not have their location themes part of Smash
>Spin-offs such as the Tingle games and Hyrule Warriors are totally ignored. Might not be an issue depending on your view point
Metroid series:
>Nine of the songs come from the original Metroid, or about a third
>Five songs are from Brinstar (to be fair, Brinstar and Brinstar Depths are different songs, so it is really not an issue anyway)
>Metroid Prime 2: Echoes’ only theme comes from the multiplayer
>Metroid Prime 3: Corruption has no music, as well as the original Metroid II: Return of Samus (Metroid: Samus Returns >music is in the game)
>Despite Dark Samus being a fighter, none of Dark Samus’ boss themes are in the game, ripped or remixed. She is forced to use Brinstar Depths as a theme for herself, a song she has no connection to
Yoshi series:
>Yoshi Story theme three of the tracks
>Although not really its fault, no Yoshi’s Crafted World music
>A few minor spin-offs here and there like Yoshi’s Cookie have no music
>Other than having perhaps too few music, Yoshi’s issues are minor
Kirby series:
>Green Greens part of four songs
>Despite being a spin-off, Kirby’s Air Ride has five songs, more than most main series games
>Kirby’s Return to Dreamland, now claiming five songs, still has no remixes
>Kirby’s Dreamland 2 and 3 have no music
Star Fox series:
>Despite Krystal now being an assist, there remains no Star Fox Adventures music
>Star Fox 2 and Star Fox Guard remain without tracks as well
>Although no one song is remixed too many times, many of the songs are “duplicates” or similar versions of the song. Removing these “duplicates”, Star Fox now actually has ten songs total
>Star Fox also received no new remixes into Ultimate, and all new songs came from Star Fox Zero
>Starlink: The Battle for Atlas, despite having remixes of Star Fox music, brings no music
Pokemon series:
>Only one song from the second generation of Pokemon AKA Pokemon Gold/Silver/Crystal
>Generations six and seven make up about half the music in Smash, with Generation 1 taking about another sixth. Generations 2-5 make up the remaining 11 tracks, exactly one third of the music
>No Pokemon spin-offs have any music whatsoever. There is Pokemon Colosseum music, no Pokemon Snap music, no Pokemon Mystery Dungeon music, nothing
F-Zero series:
>The original F-Zero game makes up 19 of the 26 songs, about 4/5ths
>F-Zero X and GX each have three songs only, none of them remixes
>F-Zero Maximum Velocity, GP: Legend, and Climax each have no music
>Similar problem with Star Fox, a lot of songs are “duplicates”. Actual number is actually 17 songs.
>Port Town’s stage is from F-Zero GX. Despite this, the GX version of the music is not in Smash, nor has Port Town ever even been remixed. Only version of the song is the SNES original
Mother (Earthbound) series:
>Mother is all remixes in Smash, no original tracks
>The tracks are not balanced, with Mother 1 (despite having no fighter and only one stage) having six songs (shy of half), Mother 3 having four, and Ness’ (despite being in from Smash 64) Earthbound only having four songs (two of them Fourside even)
>No battle tracks (outside of a little bit in a few songs) are in the game
>Despite a Magicant stage (that although being primarily based on Mother 1, has Earthbound elements), the Earthbound version of Magicant is not in Smash (the Mother 1 version is an entirely different song and is in via two remixes)
>Mother 3 remains with no new tracks since Lucas’ debut in Brawl
>None of the officially licensed vocal remixes of the Mother 1 songs are in (probably due to Sony publishing those remixes originally and probably holding some rights to them, but still)
>Despite being the victory theme for the series’ characters, Mother 1’s Eight Melodies is not listed in the soundtrack (it is part of Bein’ Friends and Magicant from Wii U/3DS, but the tracks do not list it as part of it).
Fire Emblem series:
>Fire Emblem Fates has only one song remixed four freaking times
>Not exactly an issue, but weird spinoffs like Codename S.T.E.A.M. has music from that game in Smash
>It appears that some Fire Emblem games have no music, but I’m not sure on that. Outside of Fire Emblem Fates, music for fighters’ games seem to be fine and accounted for
>Fire Emblem repeats a few tracks, but it isn’t bad
Game and Watch series:
>Issues here are very minor
>Only two songs, most recent from Brawl
>None of the Game and Watch Gallery tracks are in
Kid Icarus series:
>Believe it or not, Kid Icarus lost music in the transition into Ultimate. The original versions of Wrath of the Reset Bomb and Dark Pit are gone, reducing Kid Icarus’ music count by two
>Kid Icarus: Of Myth and Monsters has no music
>The original Kid Icarus has only four songs (one of which is a remix of the other three)
WarioWare series:
>While it is called WarioWare, it should be noted that the Wario Land games arguably should count under this series. Only Wario Land: Shake It! has music, with all other Wario Lands and Wario World having no music
>Several WarioWare games seem to be without music, especially WarioWare Gold, which happened just before Ultimate
>Several songs are “duplicates”, without these, WarioWare actually has seven songs total instead of the eleven it claims
Pikmin series:
>Environmental Noises is not in fact a song from Pikmin
>Pikmin 2 has only two tracks, both of them the world map
>Hey! Pikmin has four tracks, more than either Pikmin 2 or 3 for some reason
>Other than Forest of Hope and Garden of Hope, there are no location songs. Nearly all of the songs come from cinematics or menus
>If you exclude Environmental Noises for not being an actual Pikmin track, Hey! Pikmin even ties Pikmin 1 for the amount of music in the game
>The vocal songs Ai no Uta and Tane no Uta are missing
Animal Crossing series:
>Happy Home Designer ties original Animal Crossing
>Animal Crossing: City Folk has no music of its own, it shares a remix of Wild World, which has five others of its own
>Games like Amiibo Festival are ignored (debatably an issue, I put it down because Happy Home Designer had two songs)
>Portable Animal Crossing is overwhelmingly the focus of the soundtrack for some reason
Wii Fit series:
>Seemingly no issues from this series from this music. If you do have an issue, please share
Punch-Out!! series:
>Punch-Out for NES makes up all but one of the songs
>Outside of the NES and Wii games, all versions of Punch-Out are ignored
>Punch-Out Wii has no remixes
Xenoblade series:
>No Xenoblade Chronicles X music
>No remixes from Xenoblade Chronicles 2
>Xenoblade Chronices 1 makes up all but three of the songs
Splatoon series:
>Only four songs from the single player modes, three from Splatoon 1 (two of which are from the final boss fight) and one from Splatoon 2
>No Octo Expansion music
>No real issue otherwise
Metal Gear series:
>Despite being called Metal Gear series, all but two of the songs come from the Metal Gear Solid subseries.
>Metal Gear Solid 5 has no music
>Most of the songs are from Metal Gear Solid 1 and 3
>Minor issues otherwise
Sonic the Hedgehog series:
>Sonic CD only uses the American version of Sonic Boom. Most other series have both versions of the track if they differ in regions
>Angel Island Zone is the only Sonic remix
>The version of His World is not actually in Sonic ‘06.
>Essentially opposite problem of the Mother series. A lot of original versions, almost no remixes
>Some Sonic spin-offs are ignored
>The only Sonic Unleashed song is Rooftop Run, but it uses the Sonic Generations Modern remix
Mega Man series:
>Despite being an assist last game and being the only Mega Man 1 Robot Master without a song in Ultimate, there is no version of the Elec Man theme
>Mega Mans 7, 8, 10, and 11 each have no music
>No Mega Man X’s beyond X1 and X5 have music
>All other Mega Mans (except Star Force and Zero with one each) have no music
>That said, Mega Man just has a ton of games and it already received more new remixes than any other series in Ultimate with 17
PAC-MAN series:
>Only three songs actually come from PAC-MAN games.
>A lot of the series is totally ignored in terms of music
>Granted, PAC-MAN fixes issues with bringing tons of other retro tracks instead
Street Fighter series:
>All the songs come from some version of Street Fighter II, ignoring the rest of the series
>There are a lot of songs, but most of them are just “Type A and B” versions of the same song
Final Fantasy series:
>Do I need to say anything? Only two songs, neither of them remixes, both from Final Fantasy VII, ignoring the rest of the storied series
Bayonetta series:
>Outside of not a lot of Bayonetta 2 songs compared to the first game, the music selection appears to be totally fine
Castlevania series:
>Seems to have very minor, if any, issues. There isn’t any games I am aware of that they missed, at the very least none of the notable ones were. The representation of games seem to be balanced in reference to their importance to the franchise and whether they have a fighter. There seems to be a good balance of originals and remixes. May be issues, but I don’t see them
Persona series:
>Big problem here is the ignoring of Persona 1 and 2. Granted, the rest of the Smash representation ignores it too, it just seems odd to miss out. Other than that, Persona seems to be fine, other than ignoring Shin Megami Tensei music, which it started as a spin-off from, but that isn’t really an issue per se.
Dragon Quest series:
>Only 8 tracks from four games, missing well over half the franchise
>All of the tracks are MIDI and sound relatively bad compared to the rest of the Smash soundtrack
>Though credited to their respective games, all of the non-Dragon Quest 11 songs are actually straight ripped from Theatrhythm Dragon Quest
>The Dragon Quest 11 songs are from the original version, not the DE that the credit claims (probably to shill the DE)
>No original versions of the tracks exist in Smash
With all that said, do you think that the music selection is OK? Do you think it could be better/worse? Which series do you think was the worst off with the least reasoning?
Holy shit
Dilate
man who gives a fuck, everyone only plays on like 5 stages anyway
Holy shit indeed. You wouldn't believe how long it took to compile this. I don't think the music selection is bad. We just had way better options
Man, I am the king of random stage select
This is what happens when composers have free reign. They need to be sat the fuck down and make music like it or nit
Im just mad about not having orchestral dq music, let alone no remixes. Fuck that rape supporting wizardnip
The absence of music is not a valid complaint. You can't possibly expect them to include every popular song for every franchise in the fucking game. The game has 1000 tracks of music as is, talk about nitpicking.
I would agree, most of my list is nitpicking. I just think Zelda in particular got cucked really hard
WHERES MY FUCKING FF MUSIC OR MEGAMAN BUBBLEMAN STAGE SMASH REMIX
>Donkey Kong Country Returns has no remixes and two are the same song with one just having monkey noises
hahaha
Yeah, the new Donkey Kongs got fucked hard
street fighter's music selection is abysmal. everybody knows third strike has the best soundtrack, but only sf2 has any songs.
persona 1 and 2 getting absolutely nothing (unless you count the velvet room music) is ridiculous. no music, no mii costumes, no stage colors.
sakurai needs to stop favoring only the kirby games he made.
Street Fighter exists beyond the second title
Poor Persona
Can we pour one out for the Mother fans? They got cucked so hard just before their anniversary
Sakurai does not choose what music gets included in the game or remixed. He tells his composers they can do anything they want, which is why there are some remixes of the same song.
It's really weird that there's no Upper Brinstar in the game. Metroid Prime 2 multiplayer is close but still not really it.
I agree that the composers should have more or less free rein, but after you've made the 9th version of the Zelda Main Theme, it's time to fucking stop and give us something else
What do you mean "poor persona". Joker being from persona 5 means you were lucky to get any music from the previous games at all. And you get 12 music tracks, which is great for a third party DLC.
Do you expect them to insert the entire soundtrack of Banjo Kazooie when he gets released? Get over yourselves and be grateful.
It's fine for the most part, except--
>Which series do you think was the worst off with the least reasoning?
Why even ask when there's an objective answer you even mentioned yourself?
>>>Do I need to say anything? Only two songs, neither of them remixes, both from Final Fantasy VII, ignoring the rest of the storied series
Frankly, I would have liked an extra Miitopia track in there, but just having the two we got is pretty swell as is.
I more or less just wanted one song from every title. I don't want like 20 songs. Just one from each title.
Yeah, Final Fantasy got it really rough...
What we really needed was a Dark Samus theme
>Complaining about ignoring P1 and P2
>Not mentioning P3 only has two tracks even though P4 has 3
>Not mentioning they couldn't find a way to censor Mass Destruction without making it sound off once you notice it
>No Heartful Cry even thought P4 gets P4G Music
>No Wiping All Out even though P4 gets P4G music
>Persona spin-offs are ignored, no Light the Fire Up in the Night KAGEJIKAN, no Nothing is Promised
>Despite Life Will Change being used in Joker's reveal trailer, it's not in the game at all
>No Blooming Villain, no I'll Face Myself (Battle)
>None of the remixed Persona tracks are battle music
I don't know much about Persona, so I apologize for forgetting about those issues
sup teochard
TEO MY MAN
TEO IS THAT YOU BRO
Well, yes, but I am not sure who you are
>My never ever track was Darkest Lord
>We fucking got Darkest Lord
You bet I set that shit to MAX on every Other stage
ok OP i only readed a few
gimme a quick resume
shut the fuck up. honestly. who cares. the game has over 800 tracks. you’re just bitching to bitch.
Basically, a lot of songs are in the music list twice or MUCH MORE, a lot of titles in series have no music, and a lot of series don't have healthy mixes of remixes and original versions
I absolutely agree the song list is very good overall. I just think shit like 13 versions of the Zelda Main Theme was kind of bad
seethe whilst also coping
I have made it clear that the music selection is fine overall. I just feel we could have had much better
I don't even know what the last post was
at least p3 and p4 have anything in the game at all.
>Gives Castlevania 34 fucking songs
>Metal Gear Solid only gets a Snake Eater remix, nothing from MGS5 or Metal Gear Rising.
P1 has the Velvet Room, and that's all it needs. What would P2 get, Knights of the Holy Lance?
Persona is 3 to 5 because 3 is when the Persona games start actually being good.
Yeah, I really think the Metal Gear fans kind of got fucked a little
>No Sins of the Father
>No Rules of Nature
>No It Has To Be This Way
why did castlevania get a hardass blowjob from Nintendo?
I guess because Castlevania had some of its best games on Nintendo and Metal Gear didn't?
I just don't like the amount of remixes, especially since Brawl still has the best ones.
Having the original version of the song alongside the remix would be better.
Yeah, especially when you're Midna's Lament and the remix loses what made you good
Japanese are really stingy with their music.
People say Snake Eater was the best in the franchise, and that's on the 3DS. The first game was also on GameCube.
I've heard that, but most people just know Metal Gear Solid
this
i was fully expecting all the music to be from 5 and then was completely surprised when there was 3 and 4 music, albeit only 2 or 3
albeit only 2 or 3 tracks*
Honestly, the Persona fans made out alright, and I'm happy for them
Do you think your most wanted newcomer would get treated fairly music-wise or would they get shafted like Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest?
I think my most wanted newcomer would make out extremely well
Well, who are they, dude?
Ninten from Mother 1 and Rayman
>>Despite Krystal now being an assist, there remains no Star Fox Adventures music
None of the music in that game fits the vibe of the Star Fox stages in Smash, that's why
Outside of the Meteos rendition, I guess
>Super Mario Bros. Lost Levels Medley does not ever use songs original to Lost Levels.
The second part of the ending theme is original to Lost Levels. I'm sure this is the sole reason it's called a Lost Levels medley.
>Sonic CD only uses the American version of Sonic Boom
Well yeah. JP and PAL use different songs entirely. That said they should be in over Sonic Boom.
Sonic needs better music in general in Smash
Technically the MIDI are in DQXIS too so it isn't wrong.
That is true, but it's misleading
I hate how they took out the lyrics of Snake Eater. I much prefer the original version. I know lyrics might distract players but its too good to cut
And lots of other songs still had their lyrics
take a shower
Make a better comment
>Persona
They missed out big time on PQ1 and PQ2, especially the latter. PQ2's soundtrack is great. Yet despite both games being Nintendo exclusive, they do not have music in Smash Bros.
Yeah, I found that odd
>almost all of the DK music is either remixes of Jungle Hijinx or the original cuts of songs that are similar to Hijinx in style and tone
>only exceptions are Gangplank Galleon, Crocodile Cacophony, and Rattle Battle
And the funny/sad thing is how much Sakurai cried about needing appropriate music for fighting yet leaving out all sorts of battle-suitable music from the series.
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Capcom's been alright so far, so I don't see why not.
>Despite Dark Samus being a fighter, none of Dark Samus’ boss themes are in the game, ripped or remixed. She is forced to use Brinstar Depths as a theme for herself, a song she has no connection to
This pissed me off more than anything. Chrom got his personal theme in, why couldn't Sakurai get Dark Samus's boss theme?
the smash soundtrack is shit
sure there are a fuckton of themes but less than 1% of them are suitable to fight to
They'd probably go all Castlevania on it, knowing the popularity of the music and the series in Japan. Plus, pretty much all of the music loops already, so it'd be effortless to put the originals in.
Imagine remixes for every single Pursuit theme. Including spinoffs.
>Master Chief
A lot of remixes most likely. Base Halo music probably wouldn't fit smash too well.
Quality over quantity
Poor Dark Samus
Yeah, I can agree with that, Smash could have done better
>Pikmin's music selection is all the soft cutesy happy music
>not a single boss or battle theme from any of the three games, especially the awesome theme from Pikmin 2
I'd post a link but the video with the entirety of it seems to have disappeared.
I'm not even a Pikmin fan and even I knew the music selection was garbage
The Nintendo ninjas. But technically, there is battle music, but it's battle music from Hey! Pikmin and not the main series
>all but two of the songs come from the Metal Gear Solid subseries
If anything, Metal Gear is the subseries at this point. Nobody cares about MG1 and 2 anymore
Literally nobody cares about Persona 1 and 2 either. And unlike MG1 and 2, P1 and P2 aren't even good
There's a bunch of videos of the Pikmin 2 boss theme, but they're all missing the frantic horn that plays when something dynamic happens such as when a Snagret emerges from underground. I've got it on ym computer but I'm not gonna load it up to Youtube just to link it here.
tfw no clock town track
you're a moron
why
Yeah, because apparently Termina Field is the only good song from Majora's Mask
Metroid got done so dirty. Either as remixes or the originals, we could have had:
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And ESPECIALLY
Metroid truly deserved better
It wouldn't be that bad if they stopped using the same base song over and over. Did we really need 10 or more versions of DKC's first stage theme or SMB 1-1?
Plus they kept the truncated versions of the Melee/Brawl themes they hacked up for Smash 4 to fit Sakurai's retarded "3 minute limit" for timed matches instead of restoring the original songs.
They would use the crappy PSP Persona OST instead of the original PS1 version if they did that anyway.
Yeah, I really hate the repeats and shortened versions
One of the biggest issues I have is that the Yoshi's Island (Melee) stage is considered a Yoshi stage despite it being from Super Mario World, so I can't actually put any music from Super Mario World on it
persona 1 and 2 are good
That decision was just so baffling. You would think somebody would have caught that unless they just didn't care.
Thanks, I knew I forgo-
>Chykka
Ah a true connoisseur of good YouTubers
This is what happens when Yoshi is inexplicably considered a different franchise
>Donkey Kong Country Returns has no remixes and two are the same song with one just having monkey noises
I don't know is your definition of remix is "new remix to Smash Ultimate" but Gear Getaway is a returning remix from Smash 4.
I'm just glad that none of the new remixes are fucking Jungle Hijinxs again. All the new DK remixes are based.
>the best Yoshi music ever made never got into Smash
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You had ONE job, Sakurai.
Shit, that was the second-best one, Here's the best one.
Well maybe I was just wrong
I think it's mostly fine, but one thing I would like to bring up that you ignored is Fire Emblem, specifically Fire Emblem Fates.
There are 4 different versions of Lost in Thoughts All Alone, which most players of Fates despise due to how often it plays in said game. That is the only song from the entire game that is in Smash, when Fates is well known for having an absolutely phenomenal soundtrack otherwise.
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Hell, they didn't even include End of All, which is a remix of Lost in Thoughts All Alone.
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IIRC ElecMan is one of those MM themes that's weirdly similar to mainstream music (another one being Neon Tiger from X3, for example), it would make sense to skip that one for legal reasons
>ywn play a Smash match with "My Michelle" playing
>MegaMan and Castlevania get more remixes by themselves than any other franchise despite tracks being stuck on a single stage
>Hey Pikmin gets tracks when games like WarioWare Gold or Xenoblade X get nothing
>the constant rearrangements of the same fucking tracks
>Codename STEAM is used as a trojan horse to sneak 4 more FE tracks in and the only original Steam track is a remix by the original composer (ie if he didn't choose to rearrange his own track the game would have jack shit)
the music team really has bizarre fucking biases