I've started playing pic related a few days ago and I'm really surprised when it comes to the enemy placement...

Also the Yhar'gul portion that has you fight 3 Hunters at once was ridiculous.

too based

It's embarrassing to see this game fellated because "hurr Miyazaki did it" when it has terrible enemy placement.

>I just parried the Ax dudes
I've never managed to parry them without also getting hit, I just ended up giving up and running them down with the rifle spear R2 cheese. My biggest issue was with the shitty dogs near the axe guys. Have dogs ever been fun to fight in a From game?

Gitgud.

Youre never forced to fight mobs you can still lure them 1 by 1.

Anybody shitting on DS2 is a pc player, known for being shotty at games without cheats. They can't get their hands at Bloodborne, so they can't bitch about enemies placement.

I don't think anyone has ever had a single good think to say about it's enemy placement, pretty sure it's almost consistently been praised for it's story and atmosphere. You know people can like a flawed product, right?

The feral dogs can be a pain because they're never by themselves. They're always accompanied by like 4 other mobs with at least two of them being ranged. Wolves are pretty easy for me and I can take a couple at a time because they're so predictable.

It's not as simple a problem as there being too many enemies.

In Bloodborne the enemies aren't the monster - you are. Between quicksteps that consume next to no stamina, health regain, faster heals, mid-range parries and the speed and mobility of yoir weapons, you are more than adequately equipped to deal with groups.

By contrast, Dark Souls 2 discourages you from anything other than a sedate and methodical playstyle with its stiff attack animations which ( apart from weapons with wide arcs or heavy impact such as curved greats, ultra greats, greataxes and hammers) are woefully ineffective against three or more enemies. The bland, at times quite bare environments don't help, pulling you further out the game, making it obvious that you're just circling mobs of enemies, trying to get a hit in between their ubiquitous three-hit combo, or crushing sackfuls of gems and facetanking everything.

The beast patients in Old Yharnam are more agile and aggressive than most, but they have little health and no hyperarmor, and be mown down in bunches, like wheat to a scythe. Furthermore, if you pay attention, there's a particular item you should have at least one copy of in your arsenal by now that turns 99% of the level from a fight into a massacre.

The hunter enemies are OP because they're AI introduction to PVP.

I felt the same about enemy spawn but everything moves quicker in BB and you get that health recovery window which makes all the difference. I think without having enemies do that it would be way too easy. You can still take advantage of them and lure one out at a time in the vast majority of the game.

...

DaS 2 gets shit on for enemy placement for being as slow as DaS1, and possibly worse early/mid game because of Agility needing to be increased, while BB is fast as fuck and you can heal from hitting enemies. You can also replenish healing items in the field vs Estus charges

That was intentional, it is the way Bloodborne was meant to be played. You are much more equipped for combat with multiple opponents in BB.

This. It's also my biggest vice in this game, I like playing really aggressively and I'm really impatient so sometimes I get too cocky and end up dying stupidly.

Nice.

When are you supposed to start the dlc? Don't want to be overpowered and ruin it for myself.

>Have dogs ever been fun to fight in a From game?

Yeah, this one. shoot them

If you use the monocular and some sense you'll realize that the placement here is quite meticulous, on the contrary.

Yeah I'm far too stingy with my bullets, it's a habit I really need to break.

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Hunter enemies do have unlimited ammo. Stamina not so sure, they jump around a lot but they stop from time to time.

It has the same fucking enemy placement. All the Souls games do. You people are fucking delusional.

BL60-70 with the 18% gem from Yahar'gul at the very least, though you may want to explore the first area earlier than that since there's a lot of weapons to be found just laying about. I'd wager most would suggest BL70-80, +10 weapon and Wetnurse beaten.

>30ft demonic entity with claws bigger than your entire body slashes you with such strength the very ground erupts in a cloud of debris
>lose 40% of your health
>Guy with a sack kicks you
>lose 80% of your health

Inconsistencies like this have existed within every Souls game but this particular instance always struck me as particularly silly.

>the enemies aren't the monster-you are.
This is the most reddit sentence I've seen about this game

It doesn't though. OP is just being a whiny bitch and so are you.

I've lowpro backseated a lot of people and most will either dodge out and vial on hit, or always try to rally - one extreme or the other. As a rule, if an enemy is unfamiliar, if you're gonna rally, get behind them first.

And your vaguely buttflustered post is as Yea Forums as it gets.

Well at least one of us fits in here, then.

Guy with sack is a bad example since he's the opposite of a meatwall, not to mention he's blessed by formless gods

How dare you critize From

More fool they

You're absolutely right with this post. OP needs to go back to drinking cum.

Here's the asshole. Silverbeasts. I hated them, but in retrospect they're probably one of the coolest enemies in the game.

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I never really noticed desu, I think Bloodborne's combat is far better suited to larger groups of enemies anyway
The only DS2 tier enemy placement I can really remember is the spider gank in Nightmare of Mensis

I hated this part until I learned how to kill each spider one by one without being swarmed.

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The very start from the Central Yharnam bonfire with like 2 patrols and a huge bonfire that has like 5 dudes, 2 riflemen and 2 dogs is pretty cancerous especially on the first run. Besides that, the Unseen village part with 3 enemy hunters is beyond fucking stupid.

The approach part of Mensis is unbalanced by design. Everything about it corrals you either to a seemingly pointless lamp, or the fortress doors. Cainhurst's licker-infested grounds are the same story.

itt: why can't I bruteforce everything

The design of the game is mediocre at best once you pass rom
The school is a non-level, nightmare sucks, ya'hgrul is fucking shit with respawning enemies and laser bois

>spamming enemies and having gank squads
The entire series is filled with this kind of shit ds2 does it the most but honestly what did you expect?

>The design of the game is mediocre at best once you pass rom
Isn't this the case with pretty much all of From's stuff? They all have great openings but end up losing steam around the half way point.

Fag

The Hunter is inherently fast and versatile enough to deal with enemy swarms. The Bearer of the Curse is not. Stop parroting arguments you don't understand at a basic level.

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People are really reaching when they say trash like this. Around the Rom part of the game you get the Nightmare of Mensis and the Nightmare Frontier, which introduce a buttload of unique enemies, architecture and design that are fun to fight through and traverse. You also have Castle Cainhurst which you unlock right before Rom, which adds another interesting area with unique enemies, and in Yahar'gul you get the key to the Upper Cathedral Ward. After Rom the game goes all over with its enemies and concepts and is stronger for it, if anything it's better after you beat Rom, people who say otherwise are Dark Souls 1 shitters.

Saw cleaver or saw spear?

>hating on one of the best levels in the game with ambiance you can cut with a knife
>not legging it past blood summons having realizing that they respawn
>not zeroing in on the chimes of their summoners
>not realizing that with the bell maiden dead her summons go into a 3-second "visceral me" state and take double damage
>not incorporating Amy's lasers into the crone fight and laughing madly as they fly sky high screaming
>not chugging lead elixirs, dusting your mercury bullets with bone ash and popping Adella's OP blood to roflstomp on the gank squad

Cringe

This honestly. The game felt way too short and levels like Cainhurst and Byrgenworth felt really underdeveloped.

>gank squads in BB
literally just free souls, if you get hit while whaling on an enemy, you get your health back for whaling on an enemy. whale on all enemies until they die. toddler tier
>gank squads in DS2
lol that one guy hit you for a whole estus charge worth of damage and he has six buddies behind him coming to do the same, hope you have an attack that can hit a few of them at once

>health regain
It doesn't help when you're surrounded by enemies who can damage you while you're hitting the enemy who damaged you to regain health.
>faster heals
Useless if you don't create distance between yourself and the group of enemies, and that's not always possible because of how aggressive they can be.
>Dark Souls 2 discourages you from anything other than a sedate and methodical playstyle
It doesn't do anything different than Bloodborne with its enemy placement other than DS2's gank squads are harder because of tougher enemies that are part of the squads. In essence, though, both in Bloodborne and DS2 it boils down to trying to cheese the gank squad in any possible way since Soulsborne combat encourages 1v1 encounters.
>The bland, at times quite bare environments don't help, pulling you further out the game
Really now? You're talking about the atmosphere and graphics instead of enemy placement now.
>The beast patients in Old Yharnam are more agile and aggressive than most, but they have little health and no hyperarmor, and be mown down in bunches, like wheat to a scythe
Except you forgot the machinegun hunter who is attacking you from the distance throughout a part of the area. I'm specifically talking about the segment of the area near the tower he's shooting you from, where you have 6-7 enemies near each other. And don't get me started on the cathedral in which that one enemy can get 9 other enemies that are near the altar to attack you all at once.
>The hunter enemies are OP because they're AI introduction to PVP.
Irrelevant if someone is doing a singleplayer playthrough, no one is obliged to use the online features. There's no excuse for putting 2-3 hunters next to each other so they can rape your ass with their infinite stamina and bullets.
Your arguments are retarded, stop defending the game's flaws, it's like said.

>Have dogs ever been fun to fight in a From game?
honestly BB was the best one for dogs because the handgun knocks them backwards 10 meters
but in all honesty, no, every time you hit your first dog in a souls game it's just like ugh

Cleaver is cooler.

Spear
+looks wicked
+better ARC scaling when converted
+unfolded dashR1
+the sound of unfolded chargeR2, dashR2 and backstepR2
+serrated in both states
-limpdick unfolded R1 chain

Cleaver
+it's on the cover
+unfolded R2->chargeR2->R2
+unfolded R1 arc
-can't slam it on the ground

It's Spear for me

>with like 2 patrols and a huge bonfire that has like 5 dudes, 2 riflemen and 2 dogs
Yeah, that's definitely one of the perfect examples of shitty enemy placement, but what's even worse is that there was clearly room for a perfect shortcut to be open (the passage next to the big wooden door that is behind the mob), yet that shortcut doesn't exist. It's such a big tease that it's annoying as hell.

Any tips for cleric beast

Hit it until it dies.

>Isn't this the case with pretty much all of From's stuff
Nah, Demon's Souls is pretty consistent all throughout, except that the swamp from 5-2 and parts of 5-1 are pretty much shit, but that's not near the end game since you can tackle most of the levels in any order. The end game consists of basically 1-3 and 1-4, and those are good levels (1-4 less so because it's short, but it has an excellent boss).

Why the fuck do the crows bark?

At least you can throw pebbles and kite enemies in BB. In 2 you hit one enemy and then immediately aggro all the enemies within a mile radius.

Every Soulsborne or copy does this. You're supposed to use items and different weapons for crowds and learn to scout and pull. Yes there are still gotchas and some bad placements.

But fuck, even the "infamously bad DS2" can be neatly dissected with a bow. The problem there is whether or not extended arrow use is fun to you.

dodge towards it. not backwards and hit it from behind, it's one of the easiest bosses in the game and when you face it again on ng+ you'll laugh at how it gave you so much trouble before.

>getting surrounded when quickstep exists
>can't create distance when quickstep and running are an option
>can't keep context in mind when tackling individual issues
> " "
>won't employ cover or common sense
>can't hold their own against a fucking AI

It is you who is retarded, stop defending your likely calcified mental functions

-insert any pretentious made-up explanation by the BBshitters a la "In Bloodborne the enemies aren't the monster - you are" like did-
If the truth is more up your alley, then the reason for crows barking is so that you feel unsettling (and get a jumpscare if you didn't notice one creeping up on you and attacking from behind), but it's an artificial way to create atmosphere as opposed to some other examples in the game which are way better.

I don't really play the game a lot but it's just frustrating to get to where the beast is, die, then start again at the first lamp.

>and learn to scout and pull
That doesn't help in all cases, it's true that if you play slowly and carefully you will be able to deal with most of the encounters, but like you said, there's still gotchas and bad enemy placement. I don't think the whole game is ruined because of this, but people need to acknowledge the facts instead of only shitting on DS2 which gives a false image that somehow the other games in the series don't have those faults.
>But fuck, even the "infamously bad DS2" can be neatly dissected with a bow
This. Shrine of Amana is nowhere near as bad as people say if you use arrows, and even that is only necessary in that one part before you unlock the second bonfire.

To piss you off and make you want to shut them the fuck up ASAP. The crows want you to prioritize them when they're of little threat on their own, but they can lock you into place with their hover attack while more dangerous creatures close in, and they CAN kill you if they hover or peck-flurry while you're in open state

The most important lesson for efficient Soulsborne play and read this at your own risk because you'll never see the games the same way again:

Run past everything until you learn when it leashes.

obsessed

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>expecting non-biased discussion when it comes to the game that is the Jesus of Yea Forums

So you're trying to convince people you played all of Bloodborne without ever learning to dodge in? Did the game not click with you this much? Crowd control is fucking differenti n Bloodborne due to your movement being different, your attacks being faster, and as he said, your ability to regenerate health on hit. If you hit multiple enemies at once you could easily get all your health back a villager takes off you immediately. If you were getting wrecked by multiple villagers hitting you at the same time then you're just spacing yourself badly.

Someone's really upset about not performing like a monster ;^)

>Everyone shits on Dark Souls 2 for spamming enemies and having gank squads
slowing down the already slow souls combat while adding more group encounters wasn't a great idea
>but there are some segments in Bloodborne that are very similar
they would probably suck if the player character was unnecessary slow, which is not the case

>Run past everything until you learn when it leashes
what did he mean by this

>it's a "every boss is a flame lurker copy and you need to roll behind and hit it like crazy until it does" episode
Just play DeS and DaS and don't bother with the rest of the series.

>tfw a single Haxe L2 locks 5 enemies in place _and_ replenishes 3/4 of your HP

Almost every Soulsborne can be speed run by ignoring enemies who often don't have attacks that can keep up with you, can't themselves keep up with you and will lose interest in you and stop chasing you after surprisingly short distances. It kinda ruins the magic of most enemy placement.

He said he hates the boss run. I think by your second character any Bloodborne vet is going to try a full sprint past the mook crowd at the start of the game.

Enemy spam isn't a big deal since you can use rally to leech health on every enemy hit, it's actually OP with some weapons like the axe as you can regen a full life bar of 2-3 enemies.

Hunter enemies are bullshit because of high health, stamina is just seems infinite because it refills super fast for all things, including you.

>If you hit multiple enemies at once you could easily get all your health back
That's in theory. You already spent some of your stamina on your attacks, and when you receive multiple blows (each of the enemy that ganks you hitting you at once), even if you try to recover the lost HP you won't have enough stamina for all the hits that are required, and until the stamina bar refills the window for recovering the lost HP will be gone.
>inb4 just spam that r1 button bro, as soon as your stamina refills for one hit you will execute another hit
Yeah, great idea, then I'll be left with no stamina for rolling and unable to escape I will get hit by the enemies again.

When it comes to game criticism, what's memeable is what becomes the popular opinion. Dark Souls 2 was the new game from a different team so it's bad. Dark Souls 2's DLC is pretty weak, with tons of recycled content and poorly designed encounters, but it's praised as being great because it provides a nice redemption arc.
Dark Souls 1 is a great game, but it's become so popular that you can't say that it's too good, so people started saying that the second half was bad because of the level design, despite there being no real noticeable drop in quality. And over time it's gone from "the second half is weaker" to "the second half is TERRIBLE" because it's been repeated so much and people like to be contrarian.
Bloodborne was made by Miyazaki, who made Dark Souls 1, so it's automatically a good game. Bonus points for it being harder to access, since it's PS4 exclusive, so people need to pretend that it's really really just that good to justify dropping $460 ($540 after a year of paid online and DLC) on one game.

Gonna try not to get mad at dying

i just ran past them

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You forgot Sekiro. It's one of their best works.

You can easily dodge out of villagers attacking you, even multiple ones at the same time. If you're honestly having problems with villagers hitting and stunlocking you while you're trying to attack you're fucking shit. Just dodge and come back at them while they're still swinging like idiots at thin air. With most weapons if you hit two enemies simultaneously any amount of damage you took will be mostly reclaimed on a single hit, you don't need to spam anything or worry about your stamina.

DS2 just favors backstab spam or magic on a lot of ganks, since it's usually slow enemies.
BB has rally and near infinite stamina + large dash range that can run circles around enemies.

Both are fun for different reasons but I find DS2 more tense since you can't just run away easily if things are going to shit, especially when you're out of stamina.

why is every physical version of this game that comes with dlc from the middle east

>$460
More like $150 used and $10 for the game and who the fuck pays for online in a single player game. Even new ps4’s are dirt cheap just wait till black friday

>Dark Souls 2's DLC is pretty weak with tons of recycled content and poorly designed encounters, but it's praised as being great because it provides a nice redemption arc.
Wrong. I understand where you're coming from, thinking that the contrast in quality is what gets the DLCs praised, but that's not true. Sure, the multiplayer areas in all three of the DLCs are extremely bad, but the other areas have excellent level design - for example, the ice area from the third DLC being almost on par with some Bloodborne stuff like Central Yharnam. The tower from the second DLC is also excellent notwithstanding 2-3 gank squads (the rest of them you can pull apart and kill the enemies one by one) and the two areas in the first DLC are superb as well (the first utilizing the mechanic of raising and lowering pillars which makes for great exploraton, the second being like a LoZ dungeon with the exception of the shitty segment near the bottom where you have to make a run for it until you find the corpses of those undead enemies you can't kill unless you kill their corpses).
>despite there being no real noticeable drop in quality
Except there is a noticeable drop in quality. I'm not a fan of DS1's level design in general because the strength of the game lies in the metroidvania connectivity of the world and if you analyze each area on its own almost each one is mediocre (with the exception of the Painted World of Ariamis, The Depths and a few others), but the post-O&S areas have terrible design - there is literally no way to make a good argument for Lost Izalith, The Crystal Caves etc.
This is why DeS is the best in the series because it's the most consistent - there are no drops in quality even if some of the stages and worse than others (2-2, 4-2 and 5-2 come to mind) and each of the areas can stand on their own because there's no metroidvania connectivity. Just compare the exploration in 4-1 to anything in DaS1 with the exception of the Painted World of Ariamis.

I wasn't talking about the villagers, obviously. They are easy to kill.

You just gotta learn some pattern recognition to make the right calls in the heat of the moment:
>ok I got hit once
>is the enemy doing one of those multi hit combo flails or just a single blow?
>are other enemies around that can hit me if I go for it?

If the answer is "no" to both then you go for the attacks rally your HP back. It's especially effective with cleaver transformation attacks (from short version to long) They're as fast as a short cleaver attack but with the range the stagger rate of an extended blow.

Here's a theory - if you spent more time playing and less time griping, you might grasp when to attack-to-rally and when to reposition yourself

Nice strawman. Is it something you've tried personally?

Saying you "fit in" on Yea Forums is the most Reddit thing I've ever seen.

There are some "bad" enemy placements that are unfair, but there are some that are great. The two witches on the way to Paarl are great. One runs left past the doorway to grab your attention while another one waits on the right side to grab you. The witch before Ludwig's boss room who only aggros when you're already way past her and presumably didn't see her so she can rip you out of the fog gate and brush your teeth from behind. There's a lot of ones like that that give me a good chuckle when I get caught out by them.

>corpses of those undead enemies you can't kill unless you kill their corpses

You can kill the spirits, it just takes a magic/lightning infusion on a weapon.
Still does like 20% of normal damage to them so it's tedious, but for the few ones you can't run by easily or the ones you can't trick to fall into a pit, it's doable.

That's all great, but the problem is that when you get surprised by a gank squad you can't analyze all of that properly, especially if you see some enemy for the first and don't know its moveset.
One positive thing about Bloodborne, though, is that the shields are useless so you have to rely on dodging and parrying.

Well said, those are some great examples and when I got killed by the two witches on the way to Paarl I wasn't mad at all.

It's still extremely tedious and it's better to just make a run for it and get to their corpses.

>That's in theory. You already spent some of your stamina on your attacks
Not him but it's not a theory. If you do an R1 with LHB that hits 3 or 4 enemies in one swing you can rally like half of your health back with that one hit. There's no multiple hits or stamina management required, it's one swing of your weapon.

>that hits 3 and 4 enemies
Except they won't always be in such a position that you can get 3-4 of them with one swing.
>like half of your health
There's the thing, if you lose 80% of your HP, getting a half back can help, but you can still get killed easily.

Are you familiar with the term "kiting"?

>*Frenzies you*
Nothin' personnel, hunter.

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Felt so satisfying to kill that bitch

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there a walk in the park when you figure out the parry timing.Also Reiterpallasch firearm mode works the best against them.

Notice how frenzy is always just a distraction from the real threat. Ebrietas frenzies you to distract you from her fucking obnoxious running attack that she's about to do. Winter Lanterns frenzy is just to distract you from their retarded grab attack that can grab you through walls.

>NOOOOOOOOOO BUT MUH ELEVATOR TO LAVA WOLRD DARK SOULS 2 IS A BAD FANTASY GAME REEEEEEEEE

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You can dodge the frenzy health loss by pulling a visceral on them at the right time as you're invulnerable during the animation

they* are*

Its kino when A team does it

cope

I've only pulled the parry-through-frenzy move once or twice. Those fuckers make me choke since it's almost always instant death if you fuck it up, so I'd rather burn through my sedatives.

If you try to regain
i. while in a less-than-advantageous position
ii. with 3 to 4 targets
iii. after taking an 80% hit
then if you die it's on you and your uninformed decision. God knows the game throws more than enough of each enemy type to exhaust their moveset, but if you're tearing single targets to pieces with a Saw before they can do anything, then you can't reasonably expect to keep track of all of a gang's tells.
Nor can you expect to regain all of your health all the time unless you master the game

Lanterns' frenzy is just to make you lose your cool. Ignore, focus and shoot
or use a Kirkhammer, flatten them and take the proc like a champ if you're out of drinks

They're only formidable until you realize that the grab of certain death is the only attack they have. Once you reach "that" bridge you can get enough practice to never die to one again

fuck her

I honestly dont understand what people mean when they say Bloodborne is difficult. I havent played any From game except Bloodborne and a bit of Sekiro, But unless the DS games are ridiculously more difficult... I dont see how they can be considered that hard either. What I mean is the game isnt "hard" you are literally just playing wrong.

>The first time I played Bloodborne i was coming off a 3 month break from playing vidya
>pretty dogshit and died to blood starved like 50 times (only won by cheesing him with flame throwers and molotovs).
>I gave up soon after because I couldn't get gud.
>put the game away for a few months and played shit I was good at (DMC 3 and 4 mostly) and was considerably rusty at those games too.
>beating those games got my reaction speed back so I tried playing BB again...and still sucked.
>Dropped the game completely and felt like you "this game is pretty trash, artificial difficulty etc".
>a year or so later see a friend play BB for like 30 minutes
>he is pretty good and watching him play makes everything click.
>the game teaches you the way to play from the very beginning you just need to pay attention.
>start the game again and basically first try every boss through first play through
>start ng+ and play old hunters
>get fucked by Lud
>get good and figure him out after around 10 deaths

Honestly after that is when I decided Bloodborne was probably my favorite game ever made

The cleaver. It's even on the cover, bro

Hit it from behind, stick to the rear area

World 2 is flatout bad, World 4 is like a tasteless formless mid 00s NPCRPG

The absolute truth

>mid 00s NPCRPG
Is this bait? Also, what does NPCRPG even mean?

Has to be bait, you disagree with it after all

I love Bloodborne, but I’ll straight up admit to just sprinting through some of these segments

レディットに帰れ, プレブ

Did you sprint through them after the first time you explored them or?