What is the correct way of teaching new players to play your game?

Jon was wrong. If you figure out controls, you let the other person know so they can actually compete. The challenge should not be cryptic control schemes. Just your mastery of them.

Arin, if he couldn't just fucking grasp that he should try other buttons to land it's his problems and he shouldn't get a handout

incorrect. if jon had previously played the game it would be his responsibility to tell arin the controls to make it fair. however they both had never played it and started the game on the same page. jon learnt the controls on his own volition and arin was too busy complaining that he didn't know what to do instead of just playing

>When describing bad, modern tutorials, makes fun of a button layout, a diagram that literally just tells you what the buttons on the controller do in the game
>"So how do you learn the buttons in Megaman X's genius tutorial?"
>Uh just go to this guy you can jump over, and press random buttons until you figure out which one jumps, then keep pressing random buttons until you find the one that shoots to kill the guy you can't jump over

Arin is and always will be a shithead, but if Jon had just told Arin to "push down to land," that bitching would have ended and he'd still have a comfortable lead. And he wouldn't have strained their friendship either.

And again: For party games, figuring out controls is not supposed to be the challenge. Mastering them is.

No, you're the incorrect one. If we agree to have a game of whatever, and then I say I get to use 2 hands and you have to have one hand tied behind your back, then it isn't a level playing field, so what's the fucking point. If you're handicapped, how do we know who's better. Use your head.

Reminder that no matter how intuitive you design your levels you'll inevitably need to include pop up text messages to tell the player how to do what you want them to do because gamers today are fucking retarded.

part of seeing who's better at a blind challenge is seeing who can figure it out first.

Did Arin ever call out ricepirate for leaking info?

I'd argue that "gamers today" are more skilled than at any point before ever. What's your comparison? Gamer's today are more retarded than players in 1995, when no one had internet and you got video game info 6 months late in a magazine, if you were lucky? When 3D gaming was brand new and no one knew the rules? You're the retarded one.

are you fucking retarded? like i said they literally started with the same knowledge of how it worked (none) and were at a level playing field. arin's only handicap is being too much of a fucking idiot to figure out something simple

drop them into the first level blind. retards deserve to be gatekept

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Throwing the person you're playing against a bone is just common courtesy. Maybe Jon doesn't owe him answers to how to play, but it's a shitty thing to do to leave him high and dry. It's not like money was at stake. If they had bet money on who would win, sure, maybe the importance of figuring out the controls could factor, but it was a "friendly" competition and winning just isn't that important with nothing at stake.

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this all comes down to it being a game in good fun and arin getting really angry at a party game because he wasn't winning. you can see that jon is only messing with him

YOU KNOW HOW TO DO IT

I'd argue it depends on the game. If we just look at Super Mario Bros. and Super Mario 64, both teach the player pretty fucking quickly how to play the game. SMB gives the players a few seconds to figure out that the directional pad goes back and forth, one button jumps, and the other button makes you run. If the player can't figure that out in time, the goomba will kill them. In Mario 64, you have a similar concept but without the stress factor built in. You give the player a relatively large, open area with nothing to direclty interact with but a sign and a door. This gives players both new to Mario and new to 3D games time to mess with every button available to them on the new controller and time to understand how moving Mario works.

Ideally, a game's "tutorial" should fall into either of these sections. It's only forced in the sense that it's part of the game itself - it doesn't force any text boxes upon you, it doesn't stop gameplay entirely, it just gives you time to acclimate yourself before the actual game is given to you.

If you're playing a game and you're at all into it, but the other guy keeps dunking on you and you don't even understand the game, that's kind of angering, dude.

If winning isn't important then why was Arin bitching so much about losing?

Arin isn't bitching about losing, he's bitching about not knowing how to play. Big difference.

perhaps, but we are talking about game grumps here and there was a lot of bants back in the jon era. the vid doesn't really stand out except for arin's reaction

Sounds like a personal problem.

Jon only didn't tell Arin what to do since Arin chimped out

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>that bitching would have ended
And the video would have been far less entertaining.

user, what is even the point of making such a kneejerk, nothing-response like this?

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Fair point. If Jon was doing it purely for entertainment value, he made the right call.

Not knowing how to play the game is entirely his fault.

>The show is literally fucking called Game Grumps
>Arin specifically tries to avoid and apologizes for getting upset at the game when that is the god damn premise
>Arin is like a Subway employee apologizing for putting chicken in your chicken melt.

who cares what arin thinks about game tutorials after naughty bear?

Arin is a nigger

Read the manual, which should come with the game and also be somewhere in the game menu.
If there is no manual or you get more powers later on and don't want to spoil them, have a tutorial area that can be easily bypassed or quickly done for subsequent playthroughs for convenience purposes
If a blind player refuses to do the tutorial or read the manual, it's their own fault if they don't know how to play correctly.
Don't force too many text boxes or time stops unless it's an ability that requires very specific timing like parrying or perfect guarding, that being said it depends on the game.
>Wall signs are great for platformers
>SNK style move showcases are great for beat em ups and fighting games.
>Complicated stuff like civs and management games obviously require info graphics, charts and the like
Straight to the point tool tips and loading screen blurbs always help

This, I fucking hate people who think simple=good. It's ok for the game to verbally explain a complex mechanic to the player to add depth, fuck anyone who thinks "any mechanic that can't be visually explained shouldn't be in the game"

came here to post this, based user

That’s not how friends act you hyper-competitive autistic fag.

Their usual bantz were entertaining. That one was just uncomfortable.

>I'd argue that "gamers today" are more skilled than at any point before ever

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>I'd argue that "gamers today" are more skilled than at any point before ever.
"Gamers today" are dumber than a fucking three year old using Fisher Price's First Shapes and Colors.

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have you seen a single episode of game grumps?

What the fuck is HR, japanese Half-Life?

judging by the stealth games in comparison and the phrase "going from HR to the original", deus ex human revolution

Never played Metroid, what are you supposed to do there? Is it simple?

Both of them. Arin was in the wrong because he sucks at video games and in a competition where both people start on equal footing it's your fault. Jon because it's just a video game and they were having fun, but it was still funny watching Arin seethe.

Uh yeah dude, I get it, they started with the same knowledge, with the understanding they were going to play a game against each other. If you learn the rules of the game and don't tell me, then what's the difference if I just put the controller down and go home, and let you win. Kinda the point in playing all games, no? Can you name another gaming sport where one person knows the rules and the other person doesn't, and then a fair game is played? You're thinking like a literal 12 year old. Maybe you are one, who knows.

this

This

They shouldn't.
Make the player figure out the controls.
Make them figure out all the tricks.
If the game holds your hand then it's made for tranny SJW cuckolds who still can't do it.
Fuck them.
A gamer can adapt quickly and obtain all mechanics in moments.

well definitely don't give them a tutorial because they'll just skip all of that then say your game is bad.

I don't know what this proves, to be honest. I'd think that there were plenty of kids in 1993 playing Super Metroid that couldn't figure that out. Probably more than 6, at least. Your point would have to be "every single person who played Super Metroid when SNES was out knew exactly what to do in the game, at every point, as opposed to this picture here from when Wii was out" That's your point, huh? Great.

you need to go back down to find the morphball bombs.
You can see on the left side that's where you enter from and it's a straight path down with only one door which leads into a hallway, at that point you are supposed to use your missiles to open that door. It even has a lot of enemies which are very likely to drop missiles.

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>gaming sport
they are not playing a "gaming sport" or an e-sport. you don't need a class or a teacher to press a couple buttons on a controller to figure out the response it gives. just like jon did. you say you understand what i am saying and then the next line you show you don't. as you said "Can you name another gaming sport where one person knows the rules and the other person doesn't, and then a fair game is played?" let me explain it to you one more time. they both didn't know the rules beforehand. figuring out the controls and then using the controls is a part of the challenge. they both started on an equal plane.

Arin should've followed his own advice from the MMX video and tried all the buttons.

But what's the difference, if you know how to play the game, and I don't, then why are we even playing? Here, I'll set the controller down and leave. It's the same outcome, and I don't waste my time. Get it? If all you want to do is win, then here, here's your win, I'm gonna go home.

What's with all the Arin Hanson threads?

So which one of you needed that boss health bar notification? Did you put it in there? Because I thought the games developers put it there. But you're telling me the gamers themselves are dumb, so which one put it there?

t. Washed up animator who is stuck playing video games on the internet at a level worse than DSP for a living

I love the part of the video when Arin suggests Jon is a bad person because he won't tell him the controls, and proceeds to point out completely inapplicable situations in which he helped Jon

Nope. I don't agree with Arin on nearly anything. But I won't disagree with him just because I normally do, or it's the popular thing.

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You act like you wouldn't get red assed if you were at a friend's house to play games and they wouldn't tell you how to play. Just because it was caught on video, doesn't mean the exact same situation hasn't happened a million times before, with a million fights between friends because of it. I love how you act like you're above it.

Underrated post

Are you kidding? Arin chimping out was fucking hilarious

This. I'd be fucking pissed if I was playing against someone who kept scoring on me and didn't answer when I specifically ask how he's doing it. I mean, fuck Arin's opinions on most things, but where he's coming from that time is all too real.

Funny how people will think arin is overanalyzing here when even the devs admitted to doing that shit on purpose. it’s literally the reason mets are so common

Kinda mad that Sekiro never explains you can charge attacks and that said chaged attacks have thrustingand not slashing propieties.

If he wanted to know how to play the game they could have just looked at a guide or tutorial beforehand. Arin loves going on about not needing tutorials but when presented with any kind of challenge he immediately gets mad at the game or even worse in this case, at Jon

Doing what shit on purpose again?

I honestly don't know why he thinks the opening the MMX is good, it's really fucking bad for a lot of reasons, no normal stage has 2 identical mini-bosses and a final boss you can't win against, and it doesn't introduce the idea of revisiting stages or hunting for secrets.

How about let them play and figure it out instead of stupid cringe like push L stick to move as if I don't immediately push every button to figure out what it does anyway.

If I started playing at the exact same time with the exact same knowledge with the explicit mindset that I was in a COMPETITION to see who wins at the game I should hope I wouldn't be fucking stupid enough to expect to be told how to play when the competition has been fair in every regard.

because you are supposed to figure out how to do it JUST LIKE HOW JON DID ON HIS OWN VOLITION. i don't know how much more i can explain it

is this peak GGkino?

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I hate to lose while not knowing what to do.
A better sport would have accepted the lost and move on and hopes to learn on the next stage.